From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 02:40:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA12921 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 02:40:04 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA12917 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 02:40:01 -0500 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id BAA28985 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 01:39:56 -0600 (CST) Received: from rc-048.blueridge.net(205.152.121.48) by dfw-ix2.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma028980; Wed Apr 1 01:39:40 1998 Message-ID: <001a01bd5d40$ccee47a0$307998cd@bernie> From: "Bernie Jacobsen" To: Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 02:35:45 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mark, I considered that stuff... looks good, but how do you apply it to the inside? If I can figure that out, I can save $250.00 !! ^Bernie -----Original Message----- From: Mark Romans To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Cc: dzorde@mail.geocities.com Date: Tuesday, March 31, 1998 11:48 PM Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings >Hello All: Before you spend the money to have Jet Hot or some other >company do your headers... Look at >http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/ >I ordered their 2000 deg satin black header coating for $47.00 us from >Summit. A friend gave me this address to check out their products. I have >been told that this is the exact same coating that all the companies like >Jet Hot use. This friend used the ceramachrome on his Hooker Super Comp >headers a year ago and they still look perfect. Just sand blast, clean, >apply and bake, There you go! >DIY >Mark > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Steve Lamb >To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Cc: dzorde@mail.geocities.com >Date: Tuesday, March 31, 1998 8:15 PM >Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? > > >>>Does anyone in Australia have a contact number for anyone dealing in this >>>stuff, currently I have had pricing on ceramic coating and found it bloody >>>expensive, other option is off course wrapping but it doesn't look that >>>nice. Not interested in the performance benefits (if there is one) but >more >>>in stopping everything in the engine bay getting cooked. >> >>JetHot supposedly started up a franchise in Melbourne in the past year or >>so. There's also a company under the name of (something like) High >>Performance Coatings (HPC) somewhere in the outer Eastern suburbs. Don't >>have their numbers, but there are regular adverts in the motorsport mags - >>if I remember I'll check tonight. Don't know about other states (Yellow >>Pages ??). >> >> >>Steve Lamb >>Department of Defence, DSTO >>Aeronautical and Maritime Research Laboratory >>506 Lorimer Street >>Fishermans Bend VIC 3207 Australia >> >>Tel: +61 3 9626 7525 >>Fax: +61 3 9626 7089 >> >>IZCC #180 >> >> > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 04:06:27 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA13609 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 04:06:27 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from crianlarich.indigo-avs.com (crianlarich.indigo-avs.com [194.200.210.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA13605 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 04:06:19 -0500 Received: by crianlarich.indigo-avs.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BD5D55.642D36D0@crianlarich.indigo-avs.com>; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 10:03:17 +0100 Message-ID: From: Robert Humphris To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 10:03:15 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 Encoding: 18 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >I considered that stuff... looks good, but how do you apply it to the >inside? You can spray the stuff down your headers with a touch up gun pressuried at 50psi. If you are really going to go for it, do what the people who import the stuff into the uk do. Sand/Grit blast the item, and spray the CBC coating and bake ( CBC2 for Stainless, CBC3 for other steel ), then buff the headers with wire wool ( some wool on a wire coat hanger down the insides of the pipes ). Then finish off by spaying black satin or blue ice or what ever colour you want ( they do purple ) on top of this... apparently you can put your hand on the header while the engine is running... but don't lick it though will you? Rob Humphris > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 06:10:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA14478 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 06:10:06 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: (from jsg@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA14467 for diy_efi; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 06:10:02 -0500 Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 06:10:02 -0500 From: John S Gwynne Message-Id: <199804011110.GAA14467@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: [admin] List services (automated monthly post) This message is post monthly as a reminder of the available list services. For help: Send "help" to Majordomo@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu. 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WWW site (for diy_efi and efi332): http://efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu/ now mirrored at http://tech.buffalostate.edu/efi Please send information to be added to this posting to jsg@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu. John From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 06:18:50 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA14650 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 06:18:50 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from blackie.cruzers.com (cruzers.com [205.215.232.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA14644 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 06:18:47 -0500 Received: from 205.215.232.54 (surf54.cruzers.com [205.215.232.54]) by blackie.cruzers.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id DAA04291 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 03:19:05 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <35221546.4D4C@cruzers.com> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 02:22:29 -0800 From: Ludis Langens X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Diy_efi Subject: Re: Update on P 101 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > In reference to the post Sat, about TBI using 1-5, and TPI using > 2-10 on the injector timing. Does any one see any fatal flaws > about, building a circuit to convert one from the other. ie: > > Using a TPI computer, and measuring it's pulse (don't ask it to > say aaaah), and then divide by 2, and fire it twice as often. > > Then on a TBI doubling it's pulse lenght, and firing it half as often. It doesn't work that way. In batch PFI/TPI (at least for 1226870), hardware in the ECM divides the distributor reference pulses by 2 (L4), 3 (V6), or 4 (V8). The injector firing is triggered by this divided signal. The result is one firing per cam revolution, aka two firings per intake valve opening. In TBI (1226864 and probably 1227747 et al), the injector(s) are fired once per distributor reference pulse, possibly with a time skew. So, a TBI V8 fires it's injector(s) four times as often as a TPI V8. The TBI method ought to work with TPI, except that at high RPM, the injector pulse rate may be too fast. There's also the 160 Hz async fuel dribling, and the "only every other injector event" stuff that will totally screw up your pulse width measuring. > It seems the Ford guys have no interest to help with this, so unless > things change, I don't see doing that box. The interest for the > foreign crowd haven't said much, so unless there is demand for > doing them, I don't see putting the effort into that either. If they > do have a "want" the above selection still would cover them. Lately, diy_efi seems to be diy_gmefi. unsigned long BinToBCD(unsigned long i) {unsigned long t; Ludis Langens return i ? (t = BinToBCD(i >> 1), (t << 1) + (i & 1) + ludis@cruzers.com (t + 858993459 >> 2 & 572662306) * 3) : 0;} From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 08:54:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA16102 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 08:54:11 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA16097 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 08:54:08 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id IAA09731; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 08:54:02 -0500 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAH00241; Wed, 01 Apr 1998 08:53:09 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 08:53:09 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804011353.IAH00241@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980401085023.007ad100@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 08:50:23 -0800 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Diacom runs and ramblings (longish) Cc: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu In-Reply-To: <19980331.233333.11246.1.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> References: <3520922D.611D57D4@tufts.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >If you want to analyze the data with something more commonly available, >try using Microsoft Access. I think you can use it to pull in a text >file, but I'm not sure. YOu absoltuely can with Access, whether the file is space or comma delimited. Just a FYI :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 09:01:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA16173 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:01:26 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mailgw1a.lmco.com (mailgw1a.lmco.com [192.31.106.7]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA16169 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:01:24 -0500 Received: from emss02g01.ems.lmco.com (emss02g01.ems.lmco.com [198.7.15.39]) by mailgw1a.lmco.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA31863 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 07:01:24 -0700 (MST) Received: from quest ([143.114.72.6]) by lmco.com (PMDF V5.1-10 #20543) with SMTP id <0EQQ00AQUMYBED@lmco.com> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 07:01:23 -0700 (MST) Received: from cliffy.lmtas.lmco.com by quest (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id IAA17212; Wed, 01 Apr 1998 08:01:22 -0600 Received: from lmtas.lmco.com by cliffy.lmtas.lmco.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id IAA13109; Wed, 01 Apr 1998 08:01:20 -0600 Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 08:01:20 -0600 From: Joe Boucher Subject: Re: Mileage with a Motor Home To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <352248B0.EE441E74@lmtas.lmco.com> Organization: Lockheed Martin MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win95; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <000801bd5c60$97b85de0$9d7998cd@bernie> <19980331.233333.11246.0.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu There's a software package called Home Dyno for $40 bucks that does this. Or did you know that. Joe Boucher '70 RS/SS Camaro '81 TBI Suburban > > > I am thinking of using a two-part method. The first part will be easier > if I can find a way to send the speedometer pulses from my cruise control > into the Holley ECU, and have them recorded with the HONDO (on-board data > gathering) program. First, I'll go to a truck weigh station and get the > Jeep weighed. Then, I'll accelerate to 80 or 90, put the transmission in > neutral, and record my speed as the friction slows the vehicle down. If > I make several runs in opposite directions, I'll be able to get a good > curve of friction vs. speed > > The next step is to record acceleration at WOT. I'll do that a few times > in opposite directions. After a few calculations, I'll have a good > torque curve, corrected for transmission/t-case drag and torque converter > slippage and torque multiplication. > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 09:23:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA16413 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:23:11 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from webserver (brpt01-sh2-port73.snet.net [204.60.23.73]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA16408 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:23:06 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA00178 for ; Wed, 01 Apr 1998 09:21:57 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 09:21:57 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804011421.JAA00178@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980401091849.007ad210@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 09:18:49 -0800 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings In-Reply-To: <008801bd5d28$2c723880$a8abaace@MARK> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >headers a year ago and they still look perfect. Just sand blast, clean, >apply and bake, There you go! I've used that product (From Summit) to coat exhaust manifolds (not headers, they wouldn't fit into my oven, and I'd probably have some resistance from certain significant others who like to bake pasta ), and it works very well, even with turbocharged applications. Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 09:23:37 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA16428 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:23:37 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from webserver (brpt01-sh2-port73.snet.net [204.60.23.73]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA16424 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:23:35 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAB00178 for ; Wed, 01 Apr 1998 09:22:06 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 09:22:06 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804011422.JAB00178@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980401092008.007a4570@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 09:20:08 -0800 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings In-Reply-To: <001a01bd5d40$ccee47a0$307998cd@bernie> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >I considered that stuff... looks good, but how do you apply it to the >inside? I sprayed it using a Wagner Power Painter (those A/C house painters). Doing the manifold was easy simply because its not that large, and their are exhaust port holes to allow you to get inside. headers would be more difficult, but certainly doable :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 09:33:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA16661 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:33:34 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from newmail.virgin.net (newmail.virgin.net [194.168.54.44]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA16657 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:33:33 -0500 Received: from tony-s-machine ([194.168.62.124]) by newmail.virgin.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 1-55555U125000L125000S0) with SMTP id AAA16043 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:33:34 +0000 Message-ID: <35224FD1.6B27@virgin.net> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 15:31:45 +0100 From: Tony Cooper X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-VN709-003 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Motorcycle EFI? References: <3.0.5.32.19980331105210.007e1720@unix.sbu.ac.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi all, Been in lurk mode, but back now. re. the 1100 cc Kawasaki efi - try the full setup from the Kawasaki GPZ1100. It is fuel injected, injector per cylinder. It will just bolt on I would think (You probably won;t even have to set anything up - it will probably run straight out of the box - esspecially as your engine is a Z1 engine - same as the GPZ11. TTFN Tony -- Sent By Tony Cooper. email: tony.cooper@virgin.net Allow at least 10 working minutes for reply. ;) From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 09:49:03 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA17078 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:49:03 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from horizon.hit.net (rah@horizon.hit.net [206.252.160.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA17074 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:49:00 -0500 Received: (from rah@localhost) by horizon.hit.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) id JAA04481 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:33:52 -0600 (CST) From: Roger Heflin Message-Id: <199804011533.JAA04481@horizon.hit.net> Subject: Re: Diacom runs and ramblings (longish) To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:33:51 -0600 (CST) In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980401085023.007ad100@xephic.dynip.com> from "Frederic Breitwieser" at Apr 1, 98 08:50:23 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > >If you want to analyze the data with something more commonly available, > >try using Microsoft Access. I think you can use it to pull in a text > >file, but I'm not sure. > > YOu absoltuely can with Access, whether the file is space or comma delimited. > > Just a FYI :) > > I have been outputting the diacom stuff in DBase format, and then reading it in with quickbasic to do analysis. I prefer simple programming languages over spreadsheets, it is alot simpler for complicated things. I have mine calculating various things from the data. The DBase format is fairly easy to reverse engineer. Roger From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 09:57:14 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA17294 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:57:14 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA17290 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:57:10 -0500 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn34-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.193]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA12046 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:54:20 -0500 Message-ID: <35225652.29F0@huron.net> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 09:59:30 -0500 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Mileage with a Motor Home References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Alain Toussaint wrote: > > > I like to cruise at around 80 :) Trouble is, my GW has the aerodynamics > > of a box. Ah, well... there's more to life than gas mileage. Converting > > to run propane or methane would help, especially since it's so easy to > > generate your own methane. > > could you explain,i'd like to make my own,but i have some concern such as > the price of generating methane mostly,i want to be able to have a big > motor and cruise at a fairly high speed without costing much $$$. > > Alain Toussaint (alaint@boisfrancs.qc.ca) Problem with methane is storage density. Best way to store it is disolved in propane, believe it or not. For many years I had, but seem to have misplaced, the details of a methane generator, storage, and conversion system designed and operated by an old friend no longer with us. Purity of the fuel is also a problem - getting the CO2 out of the mixture is a big problem, and CO2 is a product of the same reaction that produces methane. Nitrogen is also produced in quantity. The generation system is not difficult, but you won't do it in an urban setting. On a farm with lots of available biomass, it is not a bad proposition for providing heat, and even running a generator/cogeneration system. For road vehicle use, unless you can produce it from natural gas (and why would you want to) it is not real practical. In the war years, guys ran around with big "bladders" strapped to the roof of their AustinSevens in England to run on methane - mad dogs and Englishmen. -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 10:00:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA17410 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 10:00:34 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA17406 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 10:00:33 -0500 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn34-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.193]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA12207 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:57:43 -0500 Message-ID: <3522571D.1C78@huron.net> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 10:02:53 -0500 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings References: <001a01bd5d40$ccee47a0$307998cd@bernie> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bernie Jacobsen wrote: > > Mark, > > I considered that stuff... looks good, but how do you apply it to the > inside? > > If I can figure that out, I can save $250.00 !! > > ^Bernie > > -----Original Message----- > From: Mark Romans > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Cc: dzorde@mail.geocities.com > Date: Tuesday, March 31, 1998 11:48 PM > Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings > > >Hello All: Before you spend the money to have Jet Hot or some other > >company do your headers... Look at > >http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/ > >I ordered their 2000 deg satin black header coating for $47.00 us from > >Summit. A friend gave me this address to check out their products. I have > >been told that this is the exact same coating that all the companies like > >Jet Hot use. This friend used the ceramachrome on his Hooker Super Comp > >headers a year ago and they still look perfect. Just sand blast, clean, > >apply and bake, There you go! > >DIY > >Mark > > > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Steve Lamb > >To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > >Cc: dzorde@mail.geocities.com > >Date: Tuesday, March 31, 1998 8:15 PM > >Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? > > > > > >>>Does anyone in Australia have a contact number for anyone dealing in this > >>>stuff, currently I have had pricing on ceramic coating and found it > bloody > >>>expensive, other option is off course wrapping but it doesn't look that > >>>nice. Not interested in the performance benefits (if there is one) but > >more > >>>in stopping everything in the engine bay getting cooked. > >> > >>JetHot supposedly started up a franchise in Melbourne in the past year or > >>so. There's also a company under the name of (something like) High > >>Performance Coatings (HPC) somewhere in the outer Eastern suburbs. Don't > >>have their numbers, but there are regular adverts in the motorsport mags - > >>if I remember I'll check tonight. Don't know about other states (Yellow > >>Pages ??). > >> > >> > >>Steve Lamb > >>Department of Defence, DSTO > >>Aeronautical and Maritime Research Laboratory > >>506 Lorimer Street > >>Fishermans Bend VIC 3207 Australia > >> > >>Tel: +61 3 9626 7525 > >>Fax: +61 3 9626 7089 > >> > >>IZCC #180 > >> > >> > > > > How about fogging it in with a sprayer, and rotating the header untill all surfaces are covered either by the spray or the flow of the run-off? A bit like coating the inside of an airframe with linseed oil. A bit messy and time consuming - but it's your $250!!! -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 10:06:12 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA17629 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 10:06:12 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from nottingham.ac.uk (pat.ccc.nottingham.ac.uk [128.243.40.194]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA17618 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 10:06:00 -0500 Received: from ean2.mecheng.nottingham.ac.uk [128.243.169.194] by nottingham.ac.uk with esmtp (Exim 1.82 #1) id 0yKP51-0007c9-00; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 16:05:31 +0100 Received: from EAN2/SpoolDir by ean2.mecheng.nottingham.ac.uk (Mercury 1.32); 1 Apr 98 16:05:33 GMT0BST Received: from SpoolDir by EAN2 (Mercury 1.32); 1 Apr 98 16:05:29 GMT0BST From: "Martin Hill" Organization: Mech Eng, University of Nottingham To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 16:05:25 GMT0BST MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Diacom runs and ramblings (longish) Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail/Windows (v1.22) Message-ID: <22D48A93926@ean2.mecheng.nottingham.ac.uk> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > > > >If you want to analyze the data with something more commonly available, > > >try using Microsoft Access. I think you can use it to pull in a text > > >file, but I'm not sure. > > > > YOu absoltuely can with Access, whether the file is space or comma delimited. > > > > Just a FYI :) > > > > > > I have been outputting the diacom stuff in DBase format, and then reading > it in with quickbasic to do analysis. I prefer simple programming languages > over spreadsheets, it is alot simpler for complicated things. I have mine > calculating various things from the data. The DBase format is fairly easy > to reverse engineer. > > Roger > But access isn't a spreadsheet, it's a database program. Martin From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 10:31:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA18493 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 10:31:38 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from hpnfssvr.mdhc.mdc.com (hpnfssvr.PHX.AZ.BOEING.COM [130.38.244.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA18488 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 10:31:33 -0500 Received: from hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com (tc75918@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com [130.38.233.24]) by hpnfssvr.mdhc.mdc.com with ESMTP (8.7.6/8.7.3) id IAA11690 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 08:31:14 -0700 (MST) Received: (from tc75918@localhost) by hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com (8.7.6/8.7.1) id IAA12707 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 08:31:14 -0700 (MST) From: d houlton x0710 Message-Id: <199804011531.IAA12707@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com> Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 08:31:14 -0700 (MST) In-Reply-To: from "Robert Humphris" at Apr 1, 98 10:03:15 am Organization: McDonnell Douglas Helicopter X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Robert Humphris wrote: > > >I considered that stuff... looks good, but how do you apply it to the > >inside? > > You can spray the stuff down your headers with a touch up gun pressuried > at 50psi. If you are really going to go for it, do what the people who > import the stuff into the uk do. Sand/Grit blast the item, and spray > the CBC coating and bake ( CBC2 for Stainless, CBC3 for other steel ), > then buff the headers with wire wool ( some wool on a wire coat hanger > down the insides of the pipes ). Then finish off by spaying black satin > or blue ice or what ever colour you want ( they do purple ) on top of > this... apparently you can put your hand on the header while the engine > is running... but don't lick it though will you? > Would this stuff work on the turbine housing of a turbo? Seems like it would if it works on headers, but I've seen pictures with the turbine red hot while I've never seen headers glow quite so brightly. What is the temp limit for these coatings? --Dan From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 11:15:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA19349 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:15:42 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail1.i1.net (root@mail1.i1.net [207.230.32.4]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA19343 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:15:38 -0500 From: ktretter@i1.net Received: from x2stl1-71.i1.net (x2stl1-71.i1.net [207.230.58.71]) by mail1.i1.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA11929 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 10:26:07 -0600 (CST) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 10:26:07 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199804011626.KAA11929@mail1.i1.net> X-Sender: ktretter@i1.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: cancel mail X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Dear Sirs; Please take me off of your mailing list. Thanks Ken Tretter ktretter@i1.net ( i as in ida, one) From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 11:19:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA19426 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:19:23 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from uhura.concentric.net (uhura.concentric.net [206.173.119.93]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA19422 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:19:21 -0500 Received: from cliff.concentric.net (cliff [206.173.119.90]) by uhura.concentric.net (8.8.8/(98/01/20 5.9)) id LAA02713; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:19:23 -0500 (EST) [1-800-745-2747 The Concentric Network] Received: from crc3.concentric.net (ts003d05.aus-tx.concentric.net [206.173.144.65]) by cliff.concentric.net (8.8.8) id LAA29871; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:19:21 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980401101859.007136f8@pop3.cris.com> X-Sender: johnhess@pop3.cris.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 10:18:59 -0600 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: John Hess Subject: Re: Diacom runs and ramblings (longish) In-Reply-To: <199804011533.JAA04481@horizon.hit.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980401085023.007ad100@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hey, this one sounds interesting. Can those of you who have analysis programs for the Diacom and Diacom plus expound on what you are doing or even submit your programs, themselves? At 09:33 AM 4/1/98 -0600, you wrote: >> >> >If you want to analyze the data with something more commonly available, >> >try using Microsoft Access. I think you can use it to pull in a text >> >file, but I'm not sure. >> >> YOu absoltuely can with Access, whether the file is space or comma delimited. >> >> Just a FYI :) >> >> > >I have been outputting the diacom stuff in DBase format, and then reading >it in with quickbasic to do analysis. I prefer simple programming languages >over spreadsheets, it is alot simpler for complicated things. I have mine >calculating various things from the data. The DBase format is fairly easy >to reverse engineer. > > Roger > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 12:10:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA20450 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 12:10:29 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA20446 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 12:10:26 -0500 Received: from thalia.fm.intel.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id MAA14588; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 12:10:20 -0500 Received: from fmsmsx26.fm.intel.com (fmsmsx26.fm.intel.com [132.233.42.26]) by thalia.fm.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA25251 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:09:39 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199804011709.JAA25251@thalia.fm.intel.com> Received: by FMSMSX26 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2BLC4TA1>; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:09:38 -0800 From: "Fitzgearld, Fredric" To: "diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu " Subject: More Projection stuff Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 08:58:00 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ok, I probably shouldn't have, but I just ordered the Holley, 502-20, open loop, TBI system (its' the digital version of the old analog system). I'm hoping to use it as a base for some experiments I've been thinking about. I also hope to use it as a learning tool. Questions: 1. What is the difference between the "502-20" and the 4Di ECM? 2. Is there a way to make a PC interface for the 502-20 like the 4Di 3. Anybody have any interesting bits of information on this system? Other comments are welcome. Thanks, FEF From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 12:13:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA20497 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 12:13:16 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail2.mailsorter.net (mail2.mailsorter.net [207.67.128.17] (may be forged)) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA20493 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 12:13:15 -0500 Received: from paccomm ([163.125.16.131]) by mail2.mailsorter.net (Netscape Mail Server v2.02) with SMTP id AAA20652 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:06:25 -0800 From: "Gwyn Reedy" To: Subject: Re: Mileage with a Motor Home Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:51:33 -0000 Message-ID: <01bd5d64$842e9500$LocalHost@paccomm> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Where do you get it? -----Original Message----- From: Joe Boucher To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 01, 1998 3:04 PM Subject: Re: Mileage with a Motor Home >There's a software package called Home Dyno for $40 bucks that does this. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 12:24:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA20727 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 12:24:11 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dns2.anl.gov (dns2.anl.gov [146.139.254.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA20721 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 12:24:08 -0500 From: lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov Received: from smtpgate.anl.gov (smtpgate.anl.gov [146.137.96.36]) by dns2.anl.gov (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id LAA13928 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:24:09 -0600 (CST) Received: from ccMail by smtpgate.anl.gov (ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02) id AA891451449; Wed, 01 Apr 98 11:24:10 -0600 Message-Id: <9804018914.AA891451449@smtpgate.anl.gov> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Wed, 01 Apr 98 11:16:12 -0600 To: Subject: Re[2]: Diacom runs and ramblings (longish) MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Umm...pretty much any spreadsheet/database program can be used to analyze the Diacom data. I do it all the time. Export the Diacom data into DBIII format, and import into anything. What I then do is write some quick off hand queries to analyze, say, average O2 readings between 75-100% throttle, or avg knock retard per 500 rpm increase, etc. So, while I don't have a "program" to specifically do this, anyone can with a little effort. TTYL! Larry Kurek ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Diacom runs and ramblings (longish) Author: at internet Date: 4/1/98 10:18 AM Hey, this one sounds interesting. Can those of you who have analysis programs for the Diacom and Diacom plus expound on what you are doing or even submit your programs, themselves? At 09:33 AM 4/1/98 -0600, you wrote: >> >> >If you want to analyze the data with something more commonly available, >> >try using Microsoft Access. I think you can use it to pull in a text >> >file, but I'm not sure. >> >> YOu absoltuely can with Access, whether the file is space or comma delimited. >> >> Just a FYI :) >> >> > >I have been outputting the diacom stuff in DBase format, and then reading >it in with quickbasic to do analysis. I prefer simple programming languages >over spreadsheets, it is alot simpler for complicated things. I have mine >calculating various things from the data. The DBase format is fairly easy >to reverse engineer. > > Roger > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 12:34:37 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA20979 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 12:34:37 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from thalia.fm.intel.com (thalia.fm.intel.com [132.233.247.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA20972 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 12:34:31 -0500 Received: from fmsmsx28.FM.INTEL.COM (fmsmsx28.fm.intel.com [132.233.42.28]) by thalia.fm.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA02154; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:34:22 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199804011734.JAA02154@thalia.fm.intel.com> Received: by FMSMSX28 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2B3Q671J>; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:32:20 -0800 From: "Fitzgearld, Fredric" To: "diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu " , Tony Cooper Subject: RE: Motorcycle EFI? Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 09:13:00 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu WooHoo!!!! Pinch me, man. I must be dreaming! Very nice to have a list like this, for those of us not even worthy to wear the CSH. :) Thanks, FEF ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Motorcycle EFI? Author: Tony Cooper [SMTP:tony.cooper@virgin.net] at MSXGATE Date: 4/1/98 6:31 AM Hi all, Been in lurk mode, but back now. re. the 1100 cc Kawasaki efi - try the full setup from the Kawasaki GPZ1100. It is fuel injected, injector per cylinder. It will just bolt on I would think (You probably won;t even have to set anything up - it will probably run straight out of the box - esspecially as your engine is a Z1 engine - same as the GPZ11. TTFN Tony -- Sent By Tony Cooper. email: tony.cooper@virgin.net Allow at least 10 working minutes for reply. ;) From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 13:06:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA21641 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 13:06:13 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA21637 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 13:06:10 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-37.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.55]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id NAA17936 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 13:05:02 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: More Projection stuff Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 13:05:29 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5d98$c189fd20$37198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Fitzgearld, Fredric To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 01, 1998 12:46 PM Subject: More Projection stuff >Ok, I probably shouldn't have, but I just ordered the Holley, 502-20, >open loop, TBI system (its' the digital version of the old analog >system). I'm hoping to use it as a base for some experiments I've been >thinking about. I also hope to use it as a learning tool. > >Questions: >1. What is the difference between the "502-20" and the 4Di ECM? You got the analog system, just some dials to twist to calibrate it. The digitial is the 504 series... >2. Is there a way to make a PC interface for the 502-20 like the 4Di No tables, nothing to look at, sept buy a o-scope adapter, and look at pulse lenghts. >3. Anybody have any interesting bits of information on this system? > >Other comments are welcome. Sounds like ya got something crossed on numbers of discription, my book says 502-20 Analog. 504 digitial >Thanks, > >FEF No worries mate Bruce From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 13:12:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA21782 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 13:12:30 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from hpnfssvr.mdhc.mdc.com (hpnfssvr.PHX.AZ.BOEING.COM [130.38.244.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA21776 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 13:12:24 -0500 Received: from hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com (tc75918@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com [130.38.233.24]) by hpnfssvr.mdhc.mdc.com with ESMTP (8.7.6/8.7.3) id LAA13285 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:11:33 -0700 (MST) Received: (from tc75918@localhost) by hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com (8.7.6/8.7.1) id LAA13896 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:11:33 -0700 (MST) From: d houlton x0710 Message-Id: <199804011811.LAA13896@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com> Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 11:11:33 -0700 (MST) In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980401092008.007a4570@xephic.dynip.com> from "Frederic Breitwieser" at Apr 1, 98 09:20:08 am Organization: McDonnell Douglas Helicopter X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > >I considered that stuff... looks good, but how do you apply it to the > >inside? > > I sprayed it using a Wagner Power Painter (those A/C house painters). > Doing the manifold was easy simply because its not that large, and their > are exhaust port holes to allow you to get inside. headers would be more > difficult, but certainly doable :) How hard would it be to rig a nozzle on the end of flexible hose and attach it to the sprayer? Drop the hose down the tube, hit the switch and slowly draw it back out. --Dan From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 14:02:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA22710 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:02:23 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA22703 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:02:20 -0500 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp66.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.66]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id NAA14322 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 13:02:20 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3522906F.1829@genevaonline.com> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 13:07:27 -0600 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: More Projection stuff References: <199804011709.JAA25251@thalia.fm.intel.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I hate to say this... how much did you spend on that projection? The digital and digital interactive are MUCH better systems. Let me know if you need any help with tuning, etc. The system you ordered uses no O2 sensor (open loop), is tuned with your fingers (on pots on the ECU), and has no PC interface. It does not even have a microprocessor. -- Andy Quaas From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 15:32:50 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA23897 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 15:32:50 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA23893 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 15:32:46 -0500 Received: from gap.cco.caltech.edu by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id PAA20446; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 15:32:44 -0500 Received: (from news@localhost) by gap.cco.caltech.edu (8.7.5/8.7.3) id MAA02705; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 12:32:00 -0800 (PST) To: mlist-diy_efi@nntp-server.caltech.edu Path: charlesg From: charlesg@cco.caltech.edu (Charles Grosjean) Newsgroups: mlist.diy_efi Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings Date: 1 Apr 1998 20:31:58 GMT Organization: California Institute of Technology, Pasadena Lines: 18 Message-ID: <6fu87u$2k4@gap.cco.caltech.edu> References: NNTP-Posting-Host: accord.cco.caltech.edu X-Newsreader: NN version 6.5.0 #12 (NOV) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu d houlton x0710 writes: >How hard would it be to rig a nozzle on the end of flexible hose and >attach it to the sprayer? Drop the hose down the tube, hit the switch >and slowly draw it back out. That would be a FloCoater (TM). Check out www.wco.com/~sc7500 for MicroCoat's homepage. FWIW, any honest coater should tell you that they are using products available from techline and others and that you are paying for prep and labor, and possibly some custom formulations (HPC's cool purple color =). Someone asked about temp range, with undercoatings, some coatings will survive at up to 2000F, although they might lose gloss or discolor. If you have access to a blasting cabinet, sprayer, and oven, then it's very doable at home. I'm not good with paint so I'll pay someone else. Charles From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 16:10:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA24336 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 16:10:54 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from buffy.tpgi.com.au (buffy.tpgi.com.au [203.12.160.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA24331 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 16:10:49 -0500 Received: (from smtpd@localhost) by buffy.tpgi.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA16629 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:11:20 +1000 Received: from gou-ppp-065.tpgi.com.au(203.29.140.65), claiming to be "acer-p166" via SMTP by buffy.tpgi.com.au, id smtpda16613; Thu Apr 2 07:11:19 1998 Message-ID: <3522AE8F.4C75@tpgi.com.au> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 07:15:59 +1000 From: Justin Albury X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DIY_EFI Subject: F3 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu who wanted the F3 progie???????? it bounced from the server and i only just noticed(file too large) Juz! From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 17:03:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA25202 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:03:01 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA25198 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:02:59 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-5.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.23]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id RAA15676 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:02:00 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Projection Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:02:26 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5db9$db47f160$17198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Welp my catalog was outta date. A new 2 barrel digitial design?. Does it have a MAP sensor?. Does it have a IAC, or just a throttle kicker?. Does it sit use the knobs for adjustments?. You happen to have the patent numbers?. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 17:18:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA25566 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:18:19 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mailgw1a.lmco.com (mailgw1a.lmco.com [192.31.106.7]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA25562 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:18:16 -0500 Received: from emss02g01.ems.lmco.com (emss02g01.ems.lmco.com [198.7.15.39]) by mailgw1a.lmco.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA17401 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 15:18:18 -0700 (MST) Received: from quest ([143.114.72.6]) by lmco.com (PMDF V5.1-10 #20543) with SMTP id <0EQR00CWS9YG3Z@lmco.com> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 15:18:16 -0700 (MST) Received: from cliffy.lmtas.lmco.com by quest (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA26942; Wed, 01 Apr 1998 16:18:15 -0600 Received: from lmtas.lmco.com by cliffy.lmtas.lmco.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA16260; Wed, 01 Apr 1998 16:18:07 -0600 Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 16:18:07 -0600 From: Joe Boucher Subject: Re: Mileage with a Motor Home To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <3522BD1F.C303000B@lmtas.lmco.com> Organization: Lockheed Martin MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win95; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <01bd5d64$842e9500$LocalHost@paccomm> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ooops. It's called dynacam. Try www.dynacam.com, but I'm getting a "File contains no data" answer. Gwyn Reedy wrote: > Where do you get it? > > -----Original Message----- > From: Joe Boucher > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Date: Wednesday, April 01, 1998 3:04 PM > Subject: Re: Mileage with a Motor Home > > >There's a software package called Home Dyno for $40 bucks that does this. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 17:23:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA25727 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:23:23 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo16.mx.aol.com (imo16.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.38]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA25723 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:23:22 -0500 Received: from TWright669@aol.com by imo16.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8XWYa15786; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:22:44 -0500 (EST) From: TWright669 Message-ID: <88220ca9.3522be36@aol.com> Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:22:44 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Cc: jalbury@tpgi.com.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: F3 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I would like a copy , please. Thank you, Tom From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 17:42:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA26166 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:42:05 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from tomcat.ns.net (root@tomcat.ns.net [209.162.64.15]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA26162 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:42:02 -0500 Received: from outlaw.ns.net (pm07-02.sac.ns.net [209.162.65.21]) by tomcat.ns.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA12109 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:41:58 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <000b01bd5dbf$a502c200$1541a2d1@outlaw.ns.net> From: "Tyson McPherson" To: Subject: Re: More Projection stuff Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:43:50 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The 502-20 is a digital replacement for all of the two barrel analog kits. It is still a open loop system that is adjustable via the familiar control knobs, and there is no interface for any type of PC. This new box does allow for the user to plug a oxygen sensor directly into the ECU; to allow for limited closed loop operation. The 4DI is a better system, but it does cost more. Tyson tyson@ns.net -----Original Message----- From: Fitzgearld, Fredric To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 01, 1998 9:53 AM Subject: More Projection stuff >Ok, I probably shouldn't have, but I just ordered the Holley, 502-20, >open loop, TBI system (its' the digital version of the old analog >system). I'm hoping to use it as a base for some experiments I've been >thinking about. I also hope to use it as a learning tool. > >Questions: >1. What is the difference between the "502-20" and the 4Di ECM? >2. Is there a way to make a PC interface for the 502-20 like the 4Di >3. Anybody have any interesting bits of information on this system? > >Other comments are welcome. > >Thanks, > >FEF > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 17:44:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA26236 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:44:45 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from jason01.u.washington.edu (root@jason01.u.washington.edu [140.142.70.24]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA26232 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:44:44 -0500 Received: from dante16.u.washington.edu (sunn@dante16.u.washington.edu [140.142.15.42]) by jason01.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.05) with ESMTP id OAA30296 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:44:42 -0800 Received: from localhost (sunn@localhost) by dante16.u.washington.edu (8.8.4+UW97.07/8.8.4+UW97.04) with SMTP id OAA49834 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:44:42 -0800 Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:44:41 -0800 (PST) From: Sun Dang To: DIY_EFI Subject: Re: rebuilding turbo In-Reply-To: <3522AE8F.4C75@tpgi.com.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I know this is off subject, but anyone who has rebuilt a turbo could you please e-mail me privately. I need info on how to do it, and any tips they could give. Thanks. Sun Dang http://weber.u.washington.edu/~sunn From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 17:59:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA26815 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:59:38 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from calliope1.fm.intel.com ([132.233.247.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA26809 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 17:59:35 -0500 Received: from fmsmsx27.fm.intel.com (fmsmsx27.fm.intel.com [132.233.42.27]) by calliope1.fm.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA02029; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 22:58:52 GMT Message-Id: <199804012258.WAA02029@calliope1.fm.intel.com> Received: by FMSMSX27 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2BL15BW3>; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:58:06 -0800 From: "Fitzgearld, Fredric" To: "diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu " , Bruce Plecan Subject: RE: More Projection stuff Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 14:45:00 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu HuMmmmmm... I was told that the #502-20 (Universal 2D Digital System $625.) replaced the, now discontinued, 502-2 (analog system ~$500.). It's so new (I guess) that I didn't even see it on Holley's WEB page when I went to look. The 4D and 4Di are about 2x the price. I would love to have the 4Di but the low end will do just as well, for my application (rock crawling). If they send me an analog system, it's going back. I don't want any part of that, again. I shouldn't have any trouble tuning it as I had the analog system for a while. The brain died and they said it would cost $400. to replace it. So, instead of trying to fix/replace the analog ECU I just broke down and got the "NEW" system. I'm hoping that the analog injectors, TPS, and stuff will be compatible with the anolog system as I have a bunch of new stuff for that system. You can see the info at: http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/genpg.pl?products/Fuel/projec/ FEF ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: More Projection stuff Author: Bruce Plecan [SMTP:nacelp@bright.net] at MSXGATE Date: 4/1/98 10:05 AM -----Original Message----- From: Fitzgearld, Fredric To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 01, 1998 12:46 PM Subject: More Projection stuff >Ok, I probably shouldn't have, but I just ordered the Holley, 502-20, >open loop, TBI system (its' the digital version of the old analog >system). I'm hoping to use it as a base for some experiments I've been >thinking about. I also hope to use it as a learning tool. > >Questions: >1. What is the difference between the "502-20" and the 4Di ECM? You got the analog system, just some dials to twist to calibrate it. The digitial is the 504 series... >2. Is there a way to make a PC interface for the 502-20 like the 4Di No tables, nothing to look at, sept buy a o-scope adapter, and look at pulse lenghts. >3. Anybody have any interesting bits of information on this system? > >Other comments are welcome. Sounds like ya got something crossed on numbers of discription, my book says 502-20 Analog. 504 digitial >Thanks, > >FEF No worries mate Bruce From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 18:14:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA27303 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 18:14:30 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from calliope1.fm.intel.com (calliope1.fm.intel.com [132.233.247.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA27296 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 18:14:27 -0500 Received: from fmsmsx28.FM.INTEL.COM (fmsmsx28.fm.intel.com [132.233.42.28]) by calliope1.fm.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA04481 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 23:14:21 GMT Message-Id: <199804012314.XAA04481@calliope1.fm.intel.com> Received: by FMSMSX28 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2B3Q7D93>; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 15:14:17 -0800 From: "Fitzgearld, Fredric" To: "diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu " Subject: RE: More Projection stuff Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 15:00:00 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu It sounds like this low end system is fairly new. If the list is interested, I can post a list of the chips in the "NEW" 2D ECU. I can even compare it to the list of chips in the analog system that I got from the archive. I don't know... It's kinda interesting to me. Is there a list of chips for the 4D and 4Di systems, somewhere? That might be an even more interesting comparison. At least for those of us not even worthy to wear the CSH. :) That is if anyone is interested. FEF From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 19:05:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA28170 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 19:05:07 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28166 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 19:05:04 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-5.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.23]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id TAA10513 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 19:04:10 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: More Projection stuff Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 19:04:37 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5dca$ecf07340$17198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Fitzgearld, Fredric To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ; Bruce Plecan Date: Wednesday, April 01, 1998 6:48 PM Subject: RE: More Projection stuff >HuMmmmmm... I was told that the #502-20 (Universal 2D Digital System >$625.) replaced the, now discontinued, 502-2 (analog system ~$500.). >It's so new (I guess) that I didn't even see it on Holley's WEB page >when I went to look. The 4D and 4Di are about 2x the price. I would >love to have the 4Di but the low end will do just as well, for my >application (rock crawling). If they send me an analog system, it's >going back. I don't want any part of that, again. > >I shouldn't have any trouble tuning it as I had the analog system for a >while. The brain died and they said it would cost $400. to replace it. If ya ain't gonna fix it, I'd like to talk a look inside. Does it come with a MAP sensor, according to the Jegs catalog, says it's speed density Now I curious if it is better than the Alpha-N. Also curious about the chips nos.. >FEF > Bruce This message originated at CSH World Headquarters From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 19:36:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA28547 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 19:36:21 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28543 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 19:36:18 -0500 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp91.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.91]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id SAA27305 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 18:36:17 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3522DEB4.2E02@genevaonline.com> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 18:41:24 -0600 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: More Projection stuff References: <199804012314.XAA04481@calliope1.fm.intel.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Please do post the list of chips for that 2D! I think i am in the wrong about that system. I have heard about this 2D system, but the part number and the 2D designation are beyond my books and knowledge. If it is in fact digital, it will contain a microprocessor. I would also think it would have an O2 sensor, but i may be wrong. If not, it should have expansion for it. If it does, GET IT! I have heard that the 4D system can be made to use the 4Di software for a PC. -- Andy Quaas From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 19:44:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA28695 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 19:44:34 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from calliope1.fm.intel.com (calliope1.fm.intel.com [132.233.247.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28691 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 19:44:31 -0500 Received: from fmsmsx28.FM.INTEL.COM (fmsmsx28.fm.intel.com [132.233.42.28]) by calliope1.fm.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA17152; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 00:44:26 GMT Message-Id: <199804020044.AAA17152@calliope1.fm.intel.com> Received: by FMSMSX28 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2B3Q7F9F>; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 16:44:25 -0800 From: "Fitzgearld, Fredric" To: "diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu " , Bruce Plecan Subject: RE: Projection Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 16:32:00 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm pretty sure it's just like the old analog system with a temp sensor, trigger, TPS, and the possible addition of a O2 sensor. It has the tuning pots like the old system. I know this is a lot to ask for, but I would love to be able to program this unit via the PC, or something, then tune for altitude as needed. I wouldn't even need to do that if I put a O2 sensor on it. The main reason I got the 2D system, instead of the 4Di system, is due to the lack of funds in the budget. I know it's crude at best but the way I see it, any kind of FI is going to be better then the carb when changing altitudes a lot. Changing jets and rods all the time stink. Not to mention the fact that FI will run upside down, an important part of rock crawling. FEF ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Projection Author: Bruce Plecan [SMTP:nacelp@bright.net] at MSXGATE Date: 4/1/98 2:02 PM Welp my catalog was outta date. A new 2 barrel digitial design?. Does it have a MAP sensor?. Does it have a IAC, or just a throttle kicker?. Does it sit use the knobs for adjustments?. You happen to have the patent numbers?. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 20:02:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA28998 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 20:02:23 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA28992 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 20:02:09 -0500 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp12.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.142]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id TAA20195 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 19:02:31 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3522E1EB.42E5F0F7@mwt.net> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 18:55:08 -0600 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: More Projection stuff X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <199804012258.WAA02029@calliope1.fm.intel.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Would you sell the bad box ? if so How much ? contact me off line. Steven Gorkowski Email me at kb4mxo@mwt.net Fitzgearld, Fredric wrote: > HuMmmmmm... I was told that the #502-20 (Universal 2D Digital System > $625.) replaced the, now discontinued, 502-2 (analog system ~$500.). > It's so new (I guess) that I didn't even see it on Holley's WEB page > when I went to look. The 4D and 4Di are about 2x the price. I would > love to have the 4Di but the low end will do just as well, for my > application (rock crawling). If they send me an analog system, it's > going back. I don't want any part of that, again. > > I shouldn't have any trouble tuning it as I had the analog system for > a > while. The brain died and they said it would cost $400. to replace > it. > So, instead of trying to fix/replace the analog ECU I just broke down > and got the "NEW" system. I'm hoping that the analog injectors, TPS, > and stuff will be compatible with the anolog system as I have a bunch > of > new stuff for that system. > > You can see the info at: > http://www.jegs.com/cgi-bin/genpg.pl?products/Fuel/projec/ > > FEF > > ______________________________ Reply Separator > _________________________________ > Subject: Re: More Projection stuff > Author: Bruce Plecan [SMTP:nacelp@bright.net] at MSXGATE > Date: 4/1/98 10:05 AM > > -----Original Message----- > From: Fitzgearld, Fredric > To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu > > Date: Wednesday, April 01, 1998 12:46 PM > Subject: More Projection stuff > > >Ok, I probably shouldn't have, but I just ordered the Holley, 502-20, > > >open loop, TBI system (its' the digital version of the old analog > >system). I'm hoping to use it as a base for some experiments I've > been > >thinking about. I also hope to use it as a learning tool. > > > >Questions: > >1. What is the difference between the "502-20" and the 4Di ECM? > > You got the analog system, just some dials to twist to calibrate it. > The digitial is the 504 series... > > >2. Is there a way to make a PC interface for the 502-20 like the 4Di > > No tables, nothing to look at, sept buy a o-scope adapter, and look > at pulse lenghts. > > >3. Anybody have any interesting bits of information on this system? > > > >Other comments are welcome. > > Sounds like ya got something crossed on numbers of discription, > my book says 502-20 Analog. 504 digitial > > >Thanks, > > > >FEF > > No worries mate > Bruce From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 20:07:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA29089 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 20:07:57 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA29084 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 20:07:51 -0500 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp12.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.142]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id TAA20910 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 19:08:12 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3522E340.39E0A436@mwt.net> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 19:00:49 -0600 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: F3 X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <3522AE8F.4C75@tpgi.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Send me a copy if you could. Steven Gorkowski kb4mxo@mwt.net Justin Albury wrote: > who wanted the F3 progie???????? > it bounced from the server and i only just noticed(file too large) > > Juz! From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 20:20:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA29285 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 20:20:24 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from m28.boston.juno.com (m28.boston.juno.com [205.231.101.186]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA29281 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 20:20:22 -0500 Received: (from cosmic.ray@juno.com) by m28.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id UlV18556; Wed, 01 Apr 1998 20:17:57 EST To: alaint@boisfrancs.qc.ca Cc: cosmic.ray@juno.com, diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 19:21:50 -0500 Subject: Re: Mileage with a Motor Home Message-ID: <19980401.201717.9390.0.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> References: X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2,4,6-9,11-17,20-21,25-26,32-33,36-37,40-41,43-44, 47-48,51-54,58-59,64-67 From: cosmic.ray@juno.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 1 Apr 1998 00:43:41 -0500 (EST) Alain Toussaint writes: >> I like to cruise at around 80 :) Trouble is, my GW has the aerodynamics >> of a box. Ah, well... there's more to life than gas mileage. Converting >> to run propane or methane would help, especially since it's so easy to >> generate your own methane. > >could you explain,i'd like to make my own,but i have some concern such as >the price of generating methane mostly,i want to be able to have a big >motor and cruise at a fairly high speed without costing much $$$. > >Alain Toussaint (alaint@boisfrancs.qc.ca) > To generate your own methane, just eat lots of beans and other fiberous foods. (Unfortunately, you won't get enough to run an engine for very long.) All kidding aside, it's easy in princable to generate methane. You'll need a large air-tight container, some bacteria (E. Coli will work), and lots of organic matter. You could probablly modify your septic tank to do the trick. Put the organic matter (grass clippings, leaves, table scraps, manure, etc) into the airtight container and keep the oxygen out. As soon as the oxygen in the container has been used up, the bacteria will start producing methane. Use a fitting and a hose at the other end. You'll want to filter the methane, perhaps by bubbling it through water and passing it through an automotive air filter. I'm sure that there will be more details to work out when you actually start building the system, but the princable is simple. (Ray's first law of engineering and program: It's always more complicated than it looks) I saw a compresser at the Detroit North American Auto Show that is used to compress the natural gas that is piped to most urban and suburban houses and store it in the vehicle's CNG (compressed natural gas) tanks. Can't beat that... turn grass clippings and du-du into fuel for your car and home. One of my later projects is to find a way to use the Holley Pro-Jection system to control some valves and esentially inject the propane or methane into the manifold. By the way, there are other advantages of using propane or methane as a fuel. They have high octane values (I have heard 110-120 for propane, 130 for methane). Also, your oil will last longer and remain cleaner. The disadvantage is that they contain less energy than Gasoline. That can be compensated for by raising the compression, using an engine with more displacement, or supercharging. You can get away with a lot because of the high octane. Also, some states will let you modify the engine all you want if you burn these alternate fuels. You'll just have to pass a tailpipe test, which is easy to do, since these fuels burn very cleanly. I don't know the details because I live in a state where the smog police don't come calling. Ray Drouillard _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 21:03:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA30214 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:03:08 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparky.franz.com (sparky.franz.com [192.132.95.33]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA30210 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:03:07 -0500 Received: from charlotte.franz.com by sparky.franz.com (8.8.8/FI-2.0) id SAA07312; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 18:02:50 -0800 (PST) Received: from charlotte by charlotte.franz.com (SMI-8.6/FI-2.0) id SAA28431; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 18:02:49 -0800 Message-Id: <199804020202.SAA28431@charlotte.franz.com> To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: cosmic.ray@juno.com (Raymond C Drouillard), kem@franz.com Subject: Compressed Natural Gas In-reply-to: Your message of "Wed, 01 Apr 1998 20:20:33 EST." <199804020120.UAA29298@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 18:02:49 -0800 From: Kelly Murray Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >.. > I saw a compresser at the Detroit North American Auto Show that is used > to compress the natural gas that is piped to most urban and suburban > houses and store it in the vehicle's CNG (compressed natural gas) tanks. >.. > By the way, there are other advantages of using propane or methane as a > fuel. They have high octane values (I have heard 110-120 for propane, > 130 for methane). The high octane rating of CNG has got me thinking about using it over methanol when running in a boost state. This should allow a high compression ratio for non-boost conditions when running on gasoline, such as freeway crusing, and then flow the CNG when the boost comes in. Only a small tank of CNG would be needed, not some heavy monster tank. If the CNG runs out, just wastegate out the boost until you get home to fill it up again from the public-utility natural gas supply running off your CNG compressor. Sounds like a plan to me! Are the electronically controlled CNG regulators? -Kelly Murray kem@franz.com http://www.htrd.com/kem/efi.html -- needs up now for CNG! From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 21:45:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA30581 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:45:34 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from horizon.hit.net (root@horizon.hit.net [206.252.160.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA30577 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:45:30 -0500 Received: from horizon.hit.net (ark216.hit.net [206.252.167.53]) by horizon.hit.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA10461 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:30:27 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3522FB7B.9FC16EA@horizon.hit.net> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 20:44:11 -0600 From: Roger Heflin X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Diacom runs and ramblings (longish) References: <3.0.5.32.19980401085023.007ad100@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.1.32.19980401101859.007136f8@pop3.cris.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu John Hess wrote: > > Hey, this one sounds interesting. Can those of you who have analysis > programs for the Diacom and Diacom plus expound on what you are doing or > even submit your programs, themselves? > > At 09:33 AM 4/1/98 -0600, you wrote: > >> > >> >If you want to analyze the data with something more commonly available, > >> >try using Microsoft Access. I think you can use it to pull in a text > >> >file, but I'm not sure. > >> > >> YOu absoltuely can with Access, whether the file is space or comma > delimited. > >> > >> Just a FYI :) > >> > >> > > > >I have been outputting the diacom stuff in DBase format, and then reading > >it in with quickbasic to do analysis. I prefer simple programming languages > >over spreadsheets, it is alot simpler for complicated things. I have mine > >calculating various things from the data. The DBase format is fairly easy > >to reverse engineer. > > > > Roger > > > > Well, here is the basic code to determine what variables are in what columns and load the data into variables. This basic code can be used to setup a program to read in a diacom file from a car with the needed columns and load it into variables. After you find out what variable is in what column you can then do whatever calculations you want to. If you had the diacom plus certain arrays would need to be enlarged to handle it. The program handles the data in whatever order diacom outputs it in, since order does not seem to be consistant. Code follows: DIM record AS STRING * 16 DIM vn AS INTEGER DIM frame AS INTEGER DIM i AS INTEGER DIM byteloc AS LONG TYPE varinfo vname AS STRING * 16 vtype AS STRING * 1 END TYPE DIM onechar AS STRING * 1 DIM twochar AS STRING * 2 DIM eightchar AS STRING * 7 DIM valuec(50, 200) AS STRING * 6 DIM maxspeed AS INTEGER DIM speedvar AS INTEGER DIM timevar AS INTEGER DIM rpmvar AS INTEGER DIM airvar AS INTEGER DIM knockvar AS INTEGER DIM throtposvar AS INTEGER DIM lefto2var AS INTEGER DIM righto2var AS INTEGER DIM advvar AS INTEGER DIM weight AS SINGLE DIM a AS INTEGER DIM variable(50) AS varinfo DIM filename AS STRING * 64 FILES "*.dbf" PRINT "Enter the name of the file" INPUT filename OPEN filename FOR BINARY AS #1 OPEN "output.dat" FOR OUTPUT AS #2 GET #1, , record vn = 1 GET #1, , record GET #1, , record WHILE ASC(LEFT$(record, 1)) <> 13 i = 1 WHILE i < 16 AND ASC(MID$(record, i, 1)) <> 0 i = i + 1 WEND variable(vn).vname = LEFT$(record, i - 1) variable(vn).vtype = MID$(record, 12, 1) IF (LEFT$(variable(vn).vname, 10) = "VHCL_SPEED") THEN speedvar = vn ELSEIF (LEFT$(variable(vn).vname, 9) = "Frame_num") THEN timevar = vn ELSEIF (LEFT$(variable(vn).vname, 10) = "ENGINE_RPM") THEN rpmvar = vn ELSEIF (LEFT$(variable(vn).vname, 8) = "SPRK_ADV") THEN advvar = vn ELSEIF (LEFT$(variable(vn).vname, 10) = "KNOCK_RETD") THEN knockvar = vn ELSEIF (LEFT$(variable(vn).vname, 8) = "AIR_FLOW") THEN airvar = vn ELSEIF (LEFT$(variable(vn).vname, 9) = "THROT_POS") THEN throtposvar = vn ELSEIF (LEFT$(variable(vn).vname, 7) = "LEFT_O2") THEN lefto2var = vn ELSEIF (LEFT$(variable(vn).vname, 8) = "RIGHT_O2") THEN righto2var = vn END IF vn = vn + 1 GET #1, , record byteloc = LOC(1) GET #1, , record WEND vn = vn - 1 PRINT USING "## variables found"; vn FOR i = 1 TO vn PRINT USING " ## \ \ \\"; i; variable(i).vname; variable(i).vtype NEXT i GET #1, byteloc, twochar FOR frame = 1 TO 200 FOR i = 1 TO vn - 1 GET #1, , valuec(i, frame) NEXT i GET #1, , valuec(vn, frame) GET #1, , onechar NEXT frame -- From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 21:51:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA30650 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:51:53 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp2.erols.com (smtp2.erols.com [207.172.3.235]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA30646 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:51:52 -0500 Received: from mkupec.erols.com (207-172-74-114.s51.as6.man.erols.com [207.172.74.114]) by smtp2.erols.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA28505 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:51:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <01e201bd5de2$e19d0cc0$0280a8c0@mkupec.erols.com> From: "Michael J. Kupec" To: Subject: Re: Projection Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:56:04 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Fredric, I thought your name looked familiar. Nice to see fellow EB members here on this list. I wasn't aware you were running a Projection on your EB. Anyway, if you find out that the older analog stuff won't work on the new system, let me know, I'd be interested in the parts. You're right about the O2 setup for the 2D. The older system uses an add on box that modifies the TPS signal to make the system either lean or richen the injector flow. Neither the 2D or the analog has/had a MAP sensor. Both just take the TPS and distributor pulses and use that to change the fuel flow throught the injectors, crude, but it works. The 2D is simpler, just an O2 and the wiring harness is all you need. Not sure if Holley use a heated one or not though. All the temp sensor is used for is for cold starting of the engine. After the engine is at operating temp, the temp sensor is out of the loop. BTW what's the chance of you scanning in the manual and sending it to me? Mostly I want to see what differences they did at the ECU plug. I'm thinking I might be able to use a 2D whenever my analog system dies. Anyone got the manual for the 4D/4Di? It'd be interesting see what I can do with a 4's computer and the 2BBl TBI. Michael J. Kupec mkupec@erols.com I live with constant fear and danger every day... and sometimes she lets me go four-wheeling! Get in, Sit down, Shut up, and Hold on! Management & Data Systems, Lockheed Martin Corporation Woodbridge, Virginia, USA (703) 680-6903 1970 Bronco w/351W (in a constant state of dissassembly/refinement...) 1964 1/2 260 Convertible w/PS, PB, & Power Top 1965 289 HP "K" Coupe w/PS, PB, & Pony Int. (Early '65, not a GT) -----Original Message----- From: Fitzgearld, Fredric To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ; Bruce Plecan Date: Wednesday, April 01, 1998 8:30 PM Subject: RE: Projection >I'm pretty sure it's just like the old analog system with a temp sensor, >trigger, TPS, and the possible addition of a O2 sensor. It has the >tuning pots like the old system. I know this is a lot to ask for, but I >would love to be able to program this unit via the PC, or something, >then tune for altitude as needed. I wouldn't even need to do that if I >put a O2 sensor on it. > >The main reason I got the 2D system, instead of the 4Di system, is due >to the lack of funds in the budget. I know it's crude at best but the >way I see it, any kind of FI is going to be better then the carb when >changing altitudes a lot. Changing jets and rods all the time stink. >Not to mention the fact that FI will run upside down, an important part >of rock crawling. > >FEF > > >______________________________ Reply Separator >_________________________________ >Subject: Projection >Author: Bruce Plecan [SMTP:nacelp@bright.net] at MSXGATE >Date: 4/1/98 2:02 PM > > >Welp my catalog was outta date. A new 2 barrel digitial design?. >Does it have a MAP sensor?. >Does it have a IAC, or just a throttle kicker?. >Does it sit use the knobs for adjustments?. >You happen to have the patent numbers?. >Bruce > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 22:18:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA31212 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 22:18:22 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.anc.net (mail.anc.net [208.133.27.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA31207 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 22:18:20 -0500 Received: from terry-elliott (max01-ba-44.ba.anc.net [209.12.2.45]) by mail.anc.net (8.8.8/SCO5) with SMTP id VAA05400 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:18:15 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <010b01bd5de5$fa271080$21020cd1@terry-elliott> From: "Eric Elliott" To: Subject: Ford Triton Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:17:11 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello, What custom stuff exists for the 5.4 L Triton engine? Has anyone reprogrammed the PCM? I would like to have the 5.4 run like the 4.0 does. My 97 Explorer 4 L has same gear ratio weighs 4300 & could easily outrun my 4700 pound 98 F250 5.4 L. The 4 L is tame below 3000 RPM. Runs strong from 3000 to 6000. The 5.4 L is strong from 2000 to 4000 & done at 4700 RPM. If the 5.4 L got cams cut like the 4 L engine has and some PCM code from the 4 L.... Eric From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 22:42:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA31595 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 22:42:18 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA31589 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 22:42:15 -0500 Received: from main (alaint@ppp10.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.31]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA29462 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 22:44:58 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 22:40:33 -0500 (EST) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: magazine article: build the data monitor Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu there's an article in the "electronic now" magazine that i think should be interresting to all,here's an excerpt (hope i spell it right): -------------------------------------------------------------------------- Imagine how useful it would be to be able to monitor and record information about your environment for extended periods of time without having to be physically there. With a variety of input sensors,you could analyze the temperature of your attic to see if really needed those ridge vents........(unimportant stuff skipped)..........Now imagine how useful such a device would be if it could be run from either battery or AC power and didn't need to be tied to a PC to store information. The data monitor described in the this article is just such an instrument. It is highly configurable, low in cost (my eyes,the company in question ask 299$ for an assembled unit with the software for win3.1 and 95) and easy to use. It can monitor and store up to four analog and four digital inputs at the same time. The sampling rate can be set anywhere from 30 milliseconds to more than 49 days. There is also an eight-term complex trigger that can include up to four digital and four analog inputs. All the information is recorded in an EEPROM that has a capacity of 2048 words (does it have an IDE interface ???)..........(lot O'stuff skipped)......... The data monitor's hardware can monitor and record almost any electronic or electrical circuit through the use of plug-in personality modules. An accompanying article details the building of a general-purpose personality module that include four digital and three analog (where's the fourth ????????? ok,just kidding) inputs. Also included is a temperature sensor that use the data monitor's fourth analog input (did i said anything about a fourth input ??? well never mind). Altough not needed to test the data monitor,buiding that personality module is a good idea and is very handy for testing the various functions of the data monitor. ------------------------------------------------------------------------ if ya want the full stories (and the plan of the thing) get the April 98 issue of Electronic now,along with the personality module,this is the main article of the mag so you wont miss it !!! Alain Toussaint (alaint@boisfrancs.qc.ca) Frederic Breitweiser: your inbox dont seem to receive message i send,my isp has been trying to send you a messages for the past 4 hours (in fact,i sent it this morning). From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 23:19:58 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA32637 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 23:19:58 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.35]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA32633 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 23:19:57 -0500 Received: from [12.65.70.169] ([12.65.1.132]) by mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA29643 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 04:19:25 +0000 Message-ID: <3522A31A.74AB@worldnet.att.net> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 20:27:11 +0000 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DIY_EFI Subject: LT1 EFI Question Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello All, I installed a '95 LT1 in my 240Z. I have removed EGR, air pump, canister purge valve, shift indicator lamp, and MIL. Everything else is intact. About 30 seconds after starting the car, the cooling fan activates. Is this some sort of quasi limp-home mode due to the missing components? The PCM *does* go into closed loop, so I am assuming that it isnt a full blown "limp". Would I be correct? TIA -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 1 23:57:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA00619 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 23:57:26 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA00615 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 23:57:23 -0500 Received: from main (alaint@ppp142.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.142]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA00415 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 00:00:07 -0500 (EST) Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 23:55:35 -0500 (EST) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: magazine article: build the data monitor In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu forgot a thing,the e-mail address of the company making it is: JVEntrepri@aol.com Alain Toussaint From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 00:10:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA00800 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 00:10:31 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from tomcat.ns.net (root@tomcat.ns.net [209.162.64.15]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA00796 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 00:10:30 -0500 Received: from outlaw.ns.net (pm08-41.sac.ns.net [209.162.65.107]) by tomcat.ns.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA23165 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:10:28 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <001601bd5df5$d3261160$6b41a2d1@outlaw.ns.net> From: "Tyson McPherson" To: Subject: Re: Projection 502-20 2bbl Digital ProJection Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 21:11:40 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I am positive that the O2 sensor used with the 502-20 is the same as used in the 4d/di systems (three wire). No IAC, or MAP sensor. The 502-20 is the same 502-1 or 502-2 kit, but with a digital box. The digital box is still adjustable like the analog box was, but you can directly plug the O2 sensor into to it for closed loop operation (based on RPM, TPS, and O2 readings). Closed loop kit is part number 534-54 >>Welp my catalog was outta date. A new 2 barrel digital design?. Look on page 70 of Holley's 1998 Performance catalog for more info. Yes, nothing is listed on the web. >>Does it have a MAP sensor?. No >>Does it have a IAC, or just a throttle kicker?. None >>Does it sit use the knobs for adjustments?. Yes, just like the analog box. >>You happen to have the patent numbers? Which patent numbers? Tyson tyson@ns.net >>______________________________ Reply Separator >>_________________________________ >>Subject: Projection >>Author: Bruce Plecan [SMTP:nacelp@bright.net] at MSXGATE >>Date: 4/1/98 2:02 PM >> >> >>Welp my catalog was outta date. A new 2 barrel digitial design?. >>Does it have a MAP sensor?. >>Does it have a IAC, or just a throttle kicker?. >>Does it sit use the knobs for adjustments?. >>You happen to have the patent numbers?. >>Bruce >> > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 00:47:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA01592 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 00:47:56 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA01588 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 00:47:53 -0500 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-042.mcn.net [208.26.146.42]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA10598 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 22:47:49 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <352323C4.4EFD12BC@mcn.net> Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 22:36:04 -0700 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question References: <3522A31A.74AB@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ron Tyler wrote: > > Hello All, > > I installed a '95 LT1 in my 240Z. I have removed EGR, air pump, > canister purge valve, shift indicator lamp, and MIL. Everything else is > intact. About 30 seconds after starting the car, the cooling fan > activates. Is this some sort of quasi limp-home mode due to the missing > components? The PCM *does* go into closed loop, so I am assuming that it > isnt a full blown "limp". Would I be correct? > > TIA > -- > Ron & Stephanie Tyler > '72 LT1/T56 240Z > http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg Do you have a/c installed? does the ecm know? ecm will turn on cooling fans when a/c pressure reaches predetermined value. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 01:29:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA02278 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 01:29:44 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mozart.bcit.bc.ca (aix4.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.189.164]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA02274 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 01:29:40 -0500 Received: from pfenske (usr010.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.188.110]) by mozart.bcit.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA18548 for ; Wed, 1 Apr 1998 22:28:08 -0800 Date: Wed, 1 Apr 1998 22:28:08 -0800 Message-Id: <199804020628.WAA18548@mozart.bcit.bc.ca> X-Sender: ffnsp955@pophost.bcit.bc.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: peter paul fenske Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Ron Haven't done much with PCMS.. Generally you can replace the solenoids with 100 ohm resistors. Certain solenoids open circuited will cause a fault condition. With OBD 11 who knows. There are various states of limp home in the PCM.. I seem to recall the airpump getting your into one of these since it is electric and controlled by the ecm.. anyways try putting 100 ohm ala skip shift resistors whereever a solenoid is supposed to be. There are more complicated routines to find malf egr ect but they won't report directly :peter At 08:27 PM 4/1/98 +0000, you wrote: >Hello All, > > I installed a '95 LT1 in my 240Z. I have removed EGR, air pump, >canister purge valve, shift indicator lamp, and MIL. Everything else is >intact. About 30 seconds after starting the car, the cooling fan >activates. Is this some sort of quasi limp-home mode due to the missing >components? The PCM *does* go into closed loop, so I am assuming that it >isnt a full blown "limp". Would I be correct? > >TIA >-- >Ron & Stephanie Tyler >'72 LT1/T56 240Z >http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 01:31:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA02320 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 01:31:33 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA02316 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 01:31:31 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-36.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.105]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id BAA11831 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 01:30:40 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 01:31:08 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5e00$ebac7200$69198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 1:24 AM Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question >Ron Tyler wrote: >> I installed a '95 LT1 in my 240Z. I have removed EGR, air pump, >> canister purge valve, shift indicator lamp, and MIL. Everything else is >> intact. About 30 seconds after starting the car, the cooling fan >> activates. Is this some sort of quasi limp-home mode due to the missing >> components? The PCM *does* go into closed loop, so I am assuming that it >> isnt a full blown "limp". Would I be correct? >> >> TIA >> -- >> Ron & Stephanie Tyler Sounds like it is failing part of the self diagnostics, and turns the fan on. OBDII I'm not too familiar with. Do you have a scan tool, or can you have someone scan it for codes etc??.. Got to get accurate info for diagnosing, at this stage anything is quessing. No worries mate Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 01:38:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA02477 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 01:38:28 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo29.mx.aol.com (imo29.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.73]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA02472 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 01:38:28 -0500 Received: from TWright669@aol.com by imo29.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8OIFa02885 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 01:38:05 -0500 (EST) From: TWright669 Message-ID: <1930df9c.3523324f@aol.com> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 01:38:05 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re:Projection 502-20 2bbl Digital ProJection Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have a BRAND NEW Jeg's catalog (recieved it today!) and it has the :Holley 2D Digital system, 510-502-20, and it says (among other things): "2D digital system is a Microprocessor-based speed-density system." Hope that answers some questions on whether its anolog or digital. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 07:32:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA04554 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:32:09 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id HAA04550 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:32:05 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id HAA14118; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:32:05 -0500 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id HAB00258 for ; Thu, 02 Apr 1998 07:31:32 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 07:31:32 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804021231.HAB00258@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980401211721.007bd590@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 21:17:21 -0800 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo In-Reply-To: <199804011531.IAA12707@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Would this stuff work on the turbine housing of a turbo? Seems like >it would if it works on headers, but I've seen pictures with the turbine >red hot while I've never seen headers glow quite so brightly. What is >the temp limit for these coatings? Please, either don't do this, or be very, very careful if you coat the inside housing of your turbo. A friend and I had done just that in an attempt to keep it from glowing red under high use - and either we made the coating too thick or the turbo's tolerances are extremely tight - the turbine seemed okay when we assembled it, however on the car the thing made loud noises for a very short amount of time, then we found that the edges of the impellor had chipped and the inside of the housing was scraped (Jet Hot actually). Maybe a really thin coat ? Maybe not, we decided not to try again with the replacement turbo. This was on a Mitsu Starion. Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 07:54:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA04828 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:54:04 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA04822 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:53:46 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-9.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.78]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id HAA29629 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:52:42 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Re:Projection 502-20 2bbl Digital ProJection Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:53:12 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5e36$4b8fc480$4e198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: TWright669 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 2:29 AM Subject: Re:Projection 502-20 2bbl Digital ProJection >I have a BRAND NEW Jeg's catalog (recieved it today!) and it has the :Holley >2D Digital system, 510-502-20, and it says (among other things): "2D digital >system is a Microprocessor-based speed-density system." ALSO key words speed-density, means it has a MAP, from what's said so far, no MAP Then it's not S/D. Everything that fires an injector in the advertizing world would be considered digitial. So it may be digitial in that respect. >Hope that answers some questions on whether its anolog or digital. No worries mate Bruce > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 08:20:58 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA05113 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:20:58 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA05109 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:20:55 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-9.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.78]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id IAA07745; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:20:04 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Prog 101 Update Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:20:31 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5e3a$1caa9f60$4e198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On the 747 project another set of tables has been confirmed, in reveiw, for those who've missed it. I've shown where the main spark, main fuel, checksum, and file name are. We now have WOT%TPS enable, WOT Enrichment, WOT spark, WOT retard, MAP retard, EGR On+Off, Open loop idle, mafunction flags injector constants and as of yesterday ACCEL enrichment all 3 tables......... There are a couple critical ones we have yet to find, ie Knock retard decay (if there is) TCC conditions (TPS, VSS ?) EGR, timing and fuel corrections Target AFR for closed loop Closed loop function parameters Injector size (?) >From those of you that were going to bench run ecms I need an update of who has found an ecm, and enough wiring to do a hook-up. For these folk I still got a couple packets of free chips.. On the 165/730 good news there, more info has come in and some of this is gonna be, nice, real nice. Also some really exciting software is pending. No worries mate Bruce Be sure to include at least two Cone Shaped Hats in your summer wardrobe collection (I need the royalties) LOL From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 08:36:14 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA05306 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:36:14 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dns2.anl.gov (dns2.anl.gov [146.139.254.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA05302 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:36:11 -0500 From: lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov Received: from smtpgate.anl.gov (smtpgate.anl.gov [146.137.96.36]) by dns2.anl.gov (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id HAA17451 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:36:11 -0600 (CST) Received: from ccMail by smtpgate.anl.gov (ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02) id AA891524167; Thu, 02 Apr 98 07:36:11 -0600 Message-Id: <9804028915.AA891524167@smtpgate.anl.gov> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Thu, 02 Apr 98 07:28:18 -0600 To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu First of all, the 95 PCM is *NOT* a full OBDII implementation. It may have the ALDL connector (implemented late 95), and the flash memory, but the data sensors/error states are OBDI. Now to your question...yes, you are in a limp home mode. From what you posted, the removal of the AIR pump and EGR, which both return feedback to the PCM that they are working, can cause the computer to go into this mode. If you need any specific info, please feel free to drop me a line...I've done a *LOT* of work with the LT1's. TTYL! Larry Kurek ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: LT1 EFI Question Author: at internet Date: 4/1/98 8:27 PM Hello All, I installed a '95 LT1 in my 240Z. I have removed EGR, air pump, canister purge valve, shift indicator lamp, and MIL. Everything else is intact. About 30 seconds after starting the car, the cooling fan activates. Is this some sort of quasi limp-home mode due to the missing components? The PCM *does* go into closed loop, so I am assuming that it isnt a full blown "limp". Would I be correct? TIA -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 08:43:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA05379 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:43:34 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dmzserv.kemet.com (dmzserv.kemet.com [206.74.114.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA05375 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:43:33 -0500 Received: from smtpgw.kemet.com ([206.74.114.1]) by dmzserv.kemet.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id 114 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:38:48 -0500 Received: from Lotus Notes (PU Serial #1724) by smtpgw.kemet.com (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) id AA-1998Apr02.074528.1724.671612; Thu, 02 Apr 1998 08:45:35 -0500 From: MikeTurner@kemet.com (Mike Turner) To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (Diy_efi) Message-ID: <1998Apr02.074528.1724.671612@smtpgw.kemet.com> X-Conversion-ID: X-Mailer: Lotus Notes via PostalUnion/SMTP for Windows NT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Organization: KEMET Electronics Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 08:45:35 -0500 Subject: PROM holders Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id IAA05376 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does anyone have part numbers for the GM PROM holders? I believe a recent discussion mentioned Robinson Nugent as a source. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 09:02:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA05655 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:02:09 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA05650 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:01:58 -0500 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp82.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.82]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id IAA18538 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:01:58 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <35239B8B.214A@genevaonline.com> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 08:07:07 -0600 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Projection References: <01e201bd5de2$e19d0cc0$0280a8c0@mkupec.erols.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have 2 4Di manuals. One is not released yet (i feel so special...). If you would like a copy of that an the software, gimme a jingle. The 4Di uses a heated O2 sensor, by the way. I drive mine to work and all over the place all the time, so i know it works! -- Andy Quaas From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 09:29:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA06134 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:29:05 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.35]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA06130 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:29:02 -0500 Received: from [12.65.70.106] by mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA5726 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 14:29:00 +0000 Message-ID: <352331F9.2B06@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 06:37:33 +0000 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question References: <01bd5e00$ebac7200$69198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Sounds like it is failing part of the self diagnostics, and turns the > fan on. OBDII I'm not too familiar with. > Do you have a scan tool, or can you have someone scan it for > codes etc??.. > Got to get accurate info for diagnosing, at this stage anything > is quessing. > No worries mate > Bruce This PCM is not OBDII. I Have a scanner. The codes are... EGR, air pump, canister purge, shift indicator, MIL lamp, and speedo (havent decided on a solution yet). There are no other codes. All sensors seem to be working in there intended range. The A/C doesnt exist. Does everybody agree on the 100 Ohm res. that Peter mentioned? Thanx everyone for your quick replies (you too P.Rusch :) -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 09:37:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA06310 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:37:18 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.35]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA06306 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:37:16 -0500 Received: from [12.65.70.106] ([12.65.18.79]) by mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA11069 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 14:37:11 +0000 Message-ID: <352333E7.372E@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 06:45:48 +0000 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question References: <199804020628.WAA18548@mozart.bcit.bc.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu BTW, There is no temp sensor for the EGR, so I'm assuming that the PCM is verifying its operation through current measurement. Is this true? If so, then using a resistor here should also satisfy the PCM -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 09:42:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA06384 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:42:06 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA06380 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:42:05 -0500 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-042.mcn.net [208.26.146.42]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA11718 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:42:03 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <3523A0F7.A175807@mcn.net> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 07:30:15 -0700 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo References: <3.0.5.32.19980401211721.007bd590@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > >Would this stuff work on the turbine housing of a turbo? Seems like > >it would if it works on headers, but I've seen pictures with the turbine > >red hot while I've never seen headers glow quite so brightly. What is > >the temp limit for these coatings? > > Please, either don't do this, or be very, very careful if you coat the > inside housing of your turbo. A friend and I had done just that in an > attempt to keep it from glowing red under high use - and either we made the > coating too thick or the turbo's tolerances are extremely tight extremely tight. - the > turbine seemed okay when we assembled it, however on the car the thing made > loud noises for a very short amount of time, then we found that the edges > of the impellor had chipped and the inside of the housing was scraped (Jet > Hot actually). > > Maybe a really thin coat ? Maybe not, we decided not to try again with the > replacement turbo. This was on a Mitsu Starion. > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > Homebrew Automotive Website: > http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HMMWV > 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 09:52:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA06708 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:52:54 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA06700 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:52:50 -0500 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-042.mcn.net [208.26.146.42]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA14860 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:52:46 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <3523A37A.D94C6DF0@mcn.net> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 07:40:58 -0700 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Prog 101 Update References: <01bd5e3a$1caa9f60$4e198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > > On the 747 project another set of tables has been confirmed, > in reveiw, for those who've missed it. > > > There are a couple critical ones we have yet to find, ie > Knock retard decay (if there is) > Knock retard is handled by the esc box mounted on the right side of the intake manifold. it intercepts computed timing signal from 747 TCC conditions (TPS, VSS ?) > EGR, timing and fuel corrections > Target AFR for closed loop > Closed loop function parameters > Injector size (?) > > > No worries mate > Bruce Be sure to include at least two Cone Shaped Hats > in your summer wardrobe collection (I need the > royalties) LOL > /\ > /C \ > / S \ > /____H_\ ( _\ ( @ ( \ ( _\ ( __} ( } From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 09:54:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA06753 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:54:39 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [205.139.62.192]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA06749 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:54:38 -0500 Received: (qmail 26344 invoked from network); 2 Apr 1998 07:56:27 -0700 Received: from ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.169) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 1998 07:56:27 -0700 Received: by ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD5E0C.05F8C590@ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:50:36 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD5E0C.05F8C590@ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Projection 502-20 2bbl Digital ProJection Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:50:32 -0800 Encoding: 14 TEXT, 42 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hmmmm.... A Jegs tech rep told me earlier this week that it's throttle position only. I guess a call to Holley is in order. Mike J. TWright669 Wednesday, April 01, 1998 10:38 PM diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Re:Projection 502-20 2bbl Digital ProJection I have a BRAND NEW Jeg's catalog (recieved it today!) and it has the :Holley 2D Digital system, 510-502-20, and it says (among other things): "2D digital system is a Microprocessor-based speed-density system." Hope that answers some questions on whether its anolog or digital. begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(B0/`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, ,````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M M2 $$@ $`,P```%)%.B!06)E``@0`0`` M`&4```!(34U-34%*14=35$5#2%)%4%1/3$1-145!4DQ)15)42$E35T5%2U1( M051)5%-42%)/5%1,15!/4TE424].3TY,64E'54534T%#04Q,5$](3TQ,15E) M4TE.3U)$15)-24M%2E17``````(!"1 !````L0(``*T"```G! ``3%I&=1XG M7.W_``H!#P(5`J0#Y 7K`H,`4!,#5 (`8V@*P'-E=.XR!@`&PP*#,@+D!Q," M@R(S#WIH96P#($1LNF<"@'T*@ C/"=D[%D]X,C4U`H *@0VQ"V!N\& @2&T;02X;@4(@$U @2F5G!"!T:060:" 64' <0 ;P9-(@ M!X @90K ; B1'$!2: 0`('<)X&L=T6'1!4!I="<<,6@#8 ) DFP=0'!O`)!T M:0(@$B "(&QY&[%)(&?C"E $$6$@8P= `R \2%0H35Q;V<@*!908PB0GSF0'1 >T!S1+?$A*2$@WFX[ MXQ' 'P(=0#HAU J%)C(Z(#4V _( -P M'4!Q[R#A'_($(" 1=Q300;,>T/TA$6X5T4&!! Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA07299 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:08:12 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA07294 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:08:10 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-41.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.110]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id KAA12318 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:07:19 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: PROM holders Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:07:49 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5e49$19bd45a0$6e198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Mike Turner To: Diy_efi Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 9:56 AM Subject: PROM holders >Does anyone have part numbers for the GM PROM holders? I believe a recent discussion mentioned Robinson Nugent as a source. Yes, they are, you have to buy 2,500 to get them thou, assuming you want the 2732A type holder. Larry Fisher GNOne@tia.net has them in small quantities Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 10:09:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA07333 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:09:22 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [205.139.62.192]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA07328 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:09:21 -0500 Received: (qmail 29265 invoked from network); 2 Apr 1998 08:11:11 -0700 Received: from ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.169) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 1998 08:11:11 -0700 Received: by ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD5E0E.14C21A20@ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:05:20 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD5E0E.14C21A20@ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Projection Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:05:16 -0800 Encoding: 28 TEXT, 49 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Andy, Can the 4Di be used without the O2 sensor? (I realize tuning becomes more critical.) Due to water-cooled exhaust system my marine application makes implementation of an O2 sensor difficult. (One possibility I thought of is to tap into the currently blanked-off EGR port and run a seperate mini exhaust, but this raises questions of its own, such as how much flow would be required to give accurate feedback, where to discharge this exhaust, etc. So for now no O2 sensor is my goal.) Holley is advertising a marine 4Di which should go on sale in a couple of months. I've spoke with Holley tech twice. One rep said that the marine 4Di must use the O2 sensor and the other one said that it wasn't necessary. Sadly typical for Holley. Thanks, Mike Jones >>Squash wrote: I have 2 4Di manuals. One is not released yet (i feel so special...). If you would like a copy of that an the software, gimme a jingle. The 4Di uses a heated O2 sensor, by the way. I drive mine to work and all over the place all the time, so i know it works! Andy Quaas>> begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(A00`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, ,````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M M2 $$@ $`#P```%)%.B!06)E``@0`0```&4```!!3D19+$-!3E1(131$24)%55-%1%=) M5$A/55142$5/,E-%3E-/4C\H25)%04Q)6D5454Y)3D="14-/345334]214-2 M251)0T%,*415151/5T%415(M0T]/3$5$15A(05535%-9``````(!"1 !```` M*00``"4$``"3!@``3%I&=:D?.&W_``H!#P(5`J0#Y 7K`H,`4!,#5 (`8V@* MP'-E=.XR!@`&PP*#,@+D!Q,"@R(S#WIH96P#($1L^F<"@'T*@ C/"=D"@ J! M@PVQ"V!N9S$P,Q0`-PL*$O$+\F,-X!-0;F2L>2P*A0J%0P.1=!300" T1&D@ M8AMP=?D1\&0@`_ ;4 A@!4 ;4AY/$B 1\ " !; _(""8*$D@%E '0&EZ&W#\ M='4#`!@`&\$%H >"!&!%%E @!0%T:6,'0"Y:*1VP1 I0&T!O'$!A.G0$D"T% MH ;P'"%E>"<1P!P`!4!S>2(096T]'V!Y'V *P N &W!A<-\+4" !'_ "("+1 M:P>1!W"?"U B@ GP`9 CPV]F(T!3`Z =%R!D!I!F( !U*&QT+AVQ3R,A<&_Y M!!!I8@,0'& BP!W@'')\9V@%0"5A! `@L@&0<-\D8 (P*4$;82:P M;"+ `F `<"0P9"TE8/$E<$5'4B=A`" E@1PP[G(>D"- '3%P!) A`1]@]PN M&[ AQ2P;P!RC*0$M`/L$``>1<0I0(A CT00@*-*2="^Q=VXN$'-U$;#O(T $ M(!R !^!M,*(7T#$A>G<(8&P<,!O1%E O,&FC%E$@LF=I=B,Q8RHQI2T29@G@ M9&(`T&LN$'YW%- ?D2#!)F $\!'!9Z\>82Z"+:<2`&,F\5,@T/L"$ 7 ;C$A M-Z EN2D!(K'L9V\@(AH\2 ;P(8 BP/DI`6%D,V `( 0`'K(LH-\BY1N2-, @ M`## ,#$$.# "T6DM,30T MSPWP#-!.,PM9,389D@J@GP-@0/$%0 J'&-\^/D[O[4_X4R\P,.!H40\9P!VP M.G=0(CI27T__3,TS-O].UQDX4 <=X!' ,V$2($.3^P!P5"!L/T(G,BD!-Z % M0.\64"& ,. <(7D2`!W &["_-"$#(!UP/\$%D 0A@ M,>7W'C! `3XR<"+ )6%"DQLEOQUP`8 @\!90+A S0&T'@+TLD6H>L2& )O%* MT&4*A?\;DAP!.M$Q`!X0(1 <,!T7ORX10-$;82#P2"(=X&0%$&\S82U1(*0% ML&LL$P= ;/T*A6\[$1M#"U%!<&C2&T/?'_ '@#!Q(- ;L&LWHD<"F6AAO0% ``@P@"640$]>O0$#``)9`@```!X`/0`! 9````!0```%)%.B ``````P`--/TW``!)GB64 ` end From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 10:10:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA07405 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:10:53 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA07398 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:10:52 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-41.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.110]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id KAA13137 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:10:01 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Projection Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:10:31 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5e49$7a9bdb20$6e198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Squash To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 10:00 AM Subject: Re: Projection >I have 2 4Di manuals. One is not released yet (i feel so special...). >If you would like a copy of that an the software, gimme a jingle. The >4Di uses a heated O2 sensor, by the way. I drive mine to work and all >over the place all the time, so i know it works! >-- >Andy Quaas I'd like to know the table sizes, ie 16x16? And what they have tables for. If that's on the software then a copy of that would be nice, and a copy of maybe the tables as you have them set?. Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 10:14:03 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA07516 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:14:03 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from diamond.sunset.net (root@diamond.sunset.net [205.138.253.252]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA07512 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:14:02 -0500 Received: from default (d20.mercury.sunset.net [205.138.253.20]) by diamond.sunset.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA18330 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:16:36 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199804021516.HAA18330@diamond.sunset.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: Subject: C3 & Diacom Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:20:08 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello all I am new to the list!! I have a couple questions to get my feet wet. Is anyone out there really familliar with the GM's C-3??? I would like to know what makes this puppy tick. i.e. controller type..? My wifes car is an 81 camaro with a C-3, and it has a 5 pin ALDL, Diacom only offers a 12 pin ALDL GM connector! Has anyone succesfully adapted the 12 pin module to an older 5 pin ALDL..? If so what pins did you use on the 5 pin ALDL, and what pins in the 12 pin module did you use..? I'm afraid I might fry the diacom cable!!! What would really be slick is if I could create a new cable that pluged right into a 5 pin ALDL!!! Any help would be greatly appreciated! Derek Jewett From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 10:19:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA07575 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:19:17 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from diamond.sunset.net (root@diamond.sunset.net [205.138.253.252]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA07571 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:19:16 -0500 Received: from default (d20.mercury.sunset.net [205.138.253.20]) by diamond.sunset.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA18615 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:21:49 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199804021521.HAA18615@diamond.sunset.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: "Do-it-Yourself Fuel Injection" Subject: New User! Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:25:09 -0800 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just wanted to say hello to everyone on the list!! Being the "family mechanic" I am excited to have found a good resource on fuel injection. I am from Redding, CA and work as a computer consultant for our local government. I dabble in the OBD-II systems and Holley's pro-jection units, as well as some feedback systems (carbureted). I hope I can be of benefit to the list..!! Derek From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 10:26:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA07708 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:26:43 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [205.139.62.192]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA07701 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:26:16 -0500 Received: (qmail 16 invoked from network); 2 Apr 1998 08:27:49 -0700 Received: from ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.169) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 1998 08:27:49 -0700 Received: by ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD5E10.679D9470@ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:21:58 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD5E10.679D9470@ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Ford Triton (long) Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:21:49 -0800 Encoding: 99 TEXT, 88 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Eric, I'm on an Expedition list and one member (thomas_E_Vlach@ccm.fm.intel.com) added a Borla Cat-Back system JET chip, and K&N filter. Following is some of his post, including dyno results. Mike Jones >>T. Vlatch excerpt: The result show no SIGNIFICANT improvement over previously reported STOCK readings in either max HP or max TORQUE. However, there are REASONABLE improvements in both HP and TORQUE in the mid-RPM range. All runs performed in 2nd gear (we confirmed the 2nd gear start on this vehicle). RESULTS: There is no statistically significant difference introduced by adding or removing the K&N Air Filter. Deltas between any run where the K&N was in place vs. any run where it was not are nominal at best. This even after I drilled those HOLES! I'll bet the only way to get any HP bang from the K&N is to replace the entire intake system - but then you wouldn't need the K&N to help you get the added HP, so it's only value (at least on the X) is that it is the LAST cleaner cartridge you'll ever need to buy. My opinion. Of the 9 runs done (5 w/ BORLA, JET, & K&N, 1 w/ BORLA & JET, 1 w/ BORLA & K&N, and 2 w/ just the BORLA) here are the max values from the best runs taken in each category: BORLA Max TORQUE occurred @ 3250 RPM = 264.10 Max HP occurred @ 3750 RPM = 179.30 BORLA/JET Max TORQUE occurred @ 3000 RPM = 290.80 Max HP occurred @ 3750 RPM = 182.10 BORLA/JET/K&N Max TORQUE occurred @ 3000 RPM = 288.60 Max HP occurred @ 3750 RPM = 181.70 OK, a couple or three observations. 01. As I said before the K&N results are so close to any non-K&N results that the K&N can be ignored. 02. The JET Chip however added a reasonable increase in both the HP and TORQUE band in the mid-RPM range, 2250-3750. 30 addition ft lbs of TORQUE and over 17 additional HP. 03. So the chip not only increased the TORQUE and HP but also broadened the band, so now I'm getting more TORQUE and HP sooner, and more longer. All in all not a bad deal, in my opinion. 04. Not having any actual STOCK readings for my vehicle, and not having any detailed STOCK RPM range stats from other X owners I cannot say, for certain, that the increases cited here are more or less than if compared to STOCK. Keep in mind that my BASELINE is STOCK + BORLA. In closing I'll say that I am not as thrilled as I'd hoped I was going to be with the results I got, but at least I did get some. The JET Chip is noticeable when installed. I noticed it right off when I had to climb the hill to Tahoe. Downshifting from overdrive to 3rd takes place much sooner, and it's a lot more smooth. And I can feel the added HP when passing, and when just crusing around town. Also, though I cannot say that the BORLA bought me HP or TORQUE or MPG, I can say that it sounds really cool! ---------------------------------------------------------------------- DETAILED STATS BY RPM I would ignore the stats in the 2000 and 2250 RPM range. These stats came from significant spikes in the results that occurred as the DYNO recorded the vehicle's initial JUMP off the line. Perhaps they are significant and real. I'd like to think so. But they appear to be dubious to me. RUN => 1 BORLA 2 BORLA, JET 3 BORLA, JET, K&N MAX: 287.50 179.30 305.80 182.10 304.70 181.70 AVG: 239.37 153.18 249.40 158.88 249.15 158.92 MIN: 160.40 109.10 162.50 116.40 164.90 116.00 RPM TORQUE HP TORQUE HP TORQUE HP 2,000 286.60 109.10 305.80 116.40 304.70 116.00 2,250 287.50 123.20 288.30 123.50 286.90 122.90 2,500 262.80 125.00 277.30 132.00 276.40 131.60 2,750 250.60 131.20 279.40 146.30 279.50 146.40 3,000 260.70 148.90 290.80 166.10 288.60 164.80 3,250 264.10 163.40 275.20 170.20 273.90 169.50 3,500 261.30 174.10 265.50 176.90 266.20 177.40 3,750 251.10 179.30 255.10 182.10 254.50 181.70 4,000 232.70 177.20 236.90 180.40 235.40 179.30 4,250 216.40 175.10 221.80 179.50 220.70 178.60 4,500 197.30 169.00 201.60 172.70 202.70 173.70 4,750 180.30 163.10 182.00 164.60 184.60 167.00 5,000 160.40 152.70 162.50 154.70 164.90 157.00 >> begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(CH0`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\MO0$>`' ``0```!<```!213H@1F]R9"!4`* DT3H'```>`!X, M`0````4```!33510`````!X`'PP!````&0```')M:F]N97- 8WEB97)H:6=H M=V%Y+FYE= `````#``80+# ``'@`($ $```!E````15))0RQ) M34].04Y%6%!%1$E424].3$E35$%.1$].14U%34)%4BA42$]-05-%5DQ!0TA M0T--1DU)3E1%3$-/32E!1$1%1$%"3U),04-!5"U"04-+4UE35$5-2D540TA) M4"Q!3@`````"`0D0`0```.4*``#A"@``\!,``$Q:1G7-(N$(_P`*`0\"%0*D M`^0%ZP*#`% 3`U0"`&-H"L!S973N,@8`!L,"@S("Y <3`H,B,P]Z:&5L`R!$ M;!IG`H,T`\4"`'!R<:$2(G-T96T"@'T*@#\(SPG9`H *@0VQ"V!N9W@Q,#,4 M``L*$O$+\2 R10408RP*A0J%22<4;2 "(" #D45X<-$)@&ET:1RQ; 0`!4#E M`'!D'*%E( > !M $D! @*'1H`W%S7T4,7U8+8!&P0&-C;9HN!% N"X 6P&PN M!: T;2D<&]F("-@N00@ M<&\6L".0"X!C"D"#'5 E,61Y;F\@%_ D)9C!) %,#HB\"!4%- ?)Y4B@!\@!^ G<5-)1X!.249) M0T%.(S#S!W 60&]V%M )\ 5 +B$3!< 60&5V'8!U2>1)E `( F "H53 M5/A/0TLGD2$@)2$$( N 'RLP'6 4T 7 `,!X($@.4!R@,@0PH%)1547]))!( M)0`O$ 20(Y QTAYP!0K 90J%4D5!4T_@3D%"3$4MVC%C!N!_'Q R4AX2,P0Q M 'C Q@3(>(3D0 M_0K!*#.@(T "("0P.P,X(N\[AQ:P"L N@6X*A1\0)6%G+C C8";092DH'32G M4_!53%13*[ K\31!)6'_)W$]P1UP%K ;8 = +W$`D/YG`P`D,$*P+G$=4 W0 M-#'/)L!!L0(P`V!D=2M@'C#^8B^ "H4A(24B!;$7\ 1@[R\@)3$X(B/R03R0 M)+ D1=Y$%. !D 0@'L!T,Z )\.<P!:P)) K\+\$``J%,[$< MP0& 'M%))T"?!1 4\#S#)F ><$A/-9#\4R$<813Q2+$X$P(@+W&[2P`O@'0G M@#D0'?)Y"H7],F%B&9$D( -A1O0A@PTF@"&!L9&XG!4 >8.\\Q2/R4R$4T7!8\U-2."+?(20R8".0 M)9!,X2<$(%*2_0J%=@= "E >\$YA/U ?4/L^`C@36"$`58(1P 5 3/'[7U,> M<$PU,",Q7E$>8 7 ]T*P`" %$&0Y$%B84=(SLE=9Q2> 6!!Y))!-+X!O;G + M@!V!*!U/)? X(CFE.E1D'E(H-4F@+R&0WS,08' CD",1(Y F(^(CD/XQ9K=G MH6=C:"(*A6AV9]/W'A(2(&;!:B]04C1F\R$`_S0F.!0R,5VS!" #4CY''G#_ M3I(Z5%E39-<@2;041)3(?-),B=P;BTC\0J%CR9? M@[]'!D.!2*$E4$,PCF%DC&[W@/ KXR,20R-A)@`SE"$7_S#Q)9!.( )@1&(% M`%YA1&+_-K0X(C)@168W6%1A.S,X+_4CD#)T(2UW\B20>.!%P_\=$WA1X3ORZR>*"F/-2_GEE4 M,E@A!T ED J%8@-@_R$@"? \Q9HR7&,G< ?@''+_4U$=<"4Q!& T0:.\)9 > M4?\SX)D9I_,7@#D!)($Z(C&!_T+!351441XP#; '0":2'H#_8^^,YG3@![!- M<1' 1K-),OD`T'1U3C$PG3KAK.(_!?\CE$UA"H6O"0VP`9 #$"%1OS"4.*=" M(VVT'* QTU@>\CD+$2*V&SP6XS\I)EEZ;]!"!C M'6 A46Q7I_,%L J%_S]0!!%?@6^A)? @T0JQ8R3[,),DD$L)X%L`K,(+@#S2 M"TYAK/%"-3!%3$E.MS6A*98PE"MFY"@=20.@OY 2)2)1P[?!7W104&$ ON&.8OYS M!& VT8UQ'B%04),21 #_%. ;]ENJS)0*L 00)2$CE/_,HVM3!0`O4*\S`V Z M<&,R_[9P.3\ED#/R"&#.D-@$MX7_DCAH= ;@WG&^X9C2,H*#5OD%P5!'(Y#/ M5Y,2PQ=,\7\ED-QQ!" P\4+2!: &\"&]&YPMY@_G'^@OZ3\M&YQ21",@04DU MD$0P@4'[03 AD%ET4AN=6323=9JC_[4TFH4!T'QA:L-T)CCD*^*_42&U,[;G M);%4LT,:<$19_$Y/D5<%H2%"FK(_!5S1YZU!'7!. M,4I5XA#.PYJRMQW 'F DD% $D!' <& 3_Z^1-(=#&AX2Y&+-@<4Q'8B\R4Q+*44 -5200/7X^(O!H M('&\$B!F^'(",\]FZX*T<@(H+4%8*[*%$9PW+G0Q>)4$$3 U?2'_`A& XP?R M=.")0 ARB2(YIW161P;$,WC!GV!H$#57H5" T ,1-'C - =B-=^%0(4P"]0+ M< Q4.1(@*);;OX &PS&%8 PD, T1!V+^-H#P!U,.T PD=-%]`! T_WQA0 TX ML7("-X6')A,?%"CY164R+'Q2!O(0<(5@#SC_"!<090D7$6L6,'0B!OD*\/XN M[W &\H5 !](;$@=2%K+_$1/P`!$"%<=T,!9S#^$(4_=T(!&".W W!S ;TW00 M'R7]$'4SB2 6\17'> (#$9Q1WQ;S(0$;4WBQ##,T$' 'TO\C4@=3(^$,,=/6 M%D8.X0E3_C0-D1MB?0,.LA!P"-*%)/\0M A1)4<:-733#K*A4 PR_Q]P"# ; M4GB@?1 C%*%0$1.^-B1S)4<>%HD@&],W*C3_=, (, =4'+1TP!!P*U0',/\E M&B'VB2 /DP>E=" (, ^3WPBE="!TX =3":LT%D8@`7<)4Q^!&U,S'+5],"K$ M,_\(, PS!Z0TQQHU$&8K(2?SWSF0"$0D9? `)E4W*%,TQ_D>%#$Y'Y4LH1\S MC5$6\_XW-=3O<#76H5 TFB'T-S*_/;0+D0AE%F(0TA;S.$+UMC8',!&8-19% M#MO0% ``@P8-'1#U)>O0$>`#T``0````4```!213H@``````,`#33]-P`` "RT%> ` end From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 10:38:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA07908 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:38:42 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sgi.sgi.com (SGI.COM [192.48.153.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA07904 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:38:41 -0500 Received: from aspire.dearborn.sgi.com ([169.238.139.226]) by sgi.sgi.com (980309.SGI.8.8.8-aspam-6.2/980304.SGI-aspam) via SMTP id HAA19937 for <@external-mail-relay.sgi.com:diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu>; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 07:38:28 -0800 (PST) mail_from (afgun@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com) Received: from mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com by aspire.dearborn.sgi.com via ESMTP (950413.SGI.8.6.12/930416.SGI) for <@aspire.dearborn.sgi.com:diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu> id KAA21218; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:38:27 -0500 Received: (from afgun@localhost) by mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) id KAA02363 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:38:22 -0500 From: "Andrew F. Gunnesch" Message-Id: <9804021038.ZM2361@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:38:22 -0500 In-Reply-To: Shannen Durphey "Re: Prog 101 Update" (Apr 2, 7:40am) References: <01bd5e3a$1caa9f60$4e198fd1@nacelp> <3523A37A.D94C6DF0@mcn.net> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.3 08feb96 MediaMail) To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Prog 101 Update Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > There are a couple critical ones we have yet to find, ie > > Knock retard decay (if there is) > > > Knock retard is handled by the esc box mounted on the right > side of the intake manifold. > it intercepts computed timing signal from 747 Is that how my '165 TPI motor works then? Is there any way to program the esc box ? From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 10:38:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA07902 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:38:38 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from hpnfssvr.mdhc.mdc.com (hpnfssvr.PHX.AZ.BOEING.COM [130.38.244.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA07887 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:37:59 -0500 Received: from hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com (tc75918@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com [130.38.233.24]) by hpnfssvr.mdhc.mdc.com with ESMTP (8.7.6/8.7.3) id IAA20239 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:37:32 -0700 (MST) Received: (from tc75918@localhost) by hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com (8.7.6/8.7.1) id IAA20332 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:37:32 -0700 (MST) From: d houlton x0710 Message-Id: <199804021537.IAA20332@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com> Subject: Re: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:37:31 -0700 (MST) In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980401211721.007bd590@xephic.dynip.com> from "Frederic Breitwieser" at Apr 1, 98 09:17:21 pm Organization: McDonnell Douglas Helicopter X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > >Would this stuff work on the turbine housing of a turbo? Seems like > >it would if it works on headers, but I've seen pictures with the turbine > >red hot while I've never seen headers glow quite so brightly. What is > >the temp limit for these coatings? > > Please, either don't do this, or be very, very careful if you coat the > inside housing of your turbo. A friend and I had done just that in an Good advice. I was talking about the outside of the turbo though. I was just wondering if the coating could take the heat. Do turbine housings really get hotter than a strait header would? Seems like they would if you were always running boost, but for the average street goer that wouldn't be a problem. --Dan From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 11:04:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA08434 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:04:47 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA08430 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:04:44 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-41.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.110]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id LAA00423 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:03:53 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Prog 101 Update Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:04:21 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5e50$ffad8b40$6e198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Prog 101 Update >Bruce Plecan wrote: >> >> On the 747 project another set of tables has been confirmed, >> in reveiw, for those who've missed it. >> >> There are a couple critical ones we have yet to find, ie >> Knock retard decay (if there is) >> >Knock retard is handled by the esc box mounted on the right >side of the intake manifold. >it intercepts computed timing signal from 747 > The est mod. does the signal processing. The ecm has limits for how much and when the retard is applied. On some ecms there is a decay rate to allow the retard to go back to zero. The one in my car, you have to turn the ignition off for it to cancel >TCC conditions (TPS, VSS ?) >> EGR, timing and fuel corrections >> Target AFR for closed loop >> Closed loop function parameters >> Injector size (?) >> > >> >> No worries mate >> Bruce Be sure to include at least two Cone Shaped Hats >> in your summer wardrobe collection (I need the >> royalties) LOL >> /\ >> /C \ >> / S \ >> /____H_\ > ( _\ > ( @ > ( \ > ( _\ > ( __} > ( } Extra points for art work Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 11:07:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA08489 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:07:47 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mozart.bcit.bc.ca (aix4.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.189.164]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA08485 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:07:44 -0500 Received: from pfenske (usr101.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.188.201]) by mozart.bcit.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA21756 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:06:13 -0800 Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:06:13 -0800 Message-Id: <199804021606.IAA21756@mozart.bcit.bc.ca> X-Sender: ffnsp955@pophost.bcit.bc.ca X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.1.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: peter paul fenske Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Ron Most current measurements can be defeated by resistor subs.. Note actuators are rated at 20 ohms. I use 100 ohms to keep the heat down. Don't use 1/8 watts resistors. I now remember the air pump. You will have to keep the relay I think. The pcm checks that the relay applies voltage to the air pump.. similiar to fuel pump voltage check.. EGR is tougher. the resistor will defeat the current check but not the operation check. Ie the pcm applies egr then checks for drop in map. I beg to differ with obd11 implementation. I have looked at a 92 pcm and obd11 is there. It is simply not used ie obd11 errors are noted and not reported. You would need a "HUD" to see it. I guess if all else fails someone can reprogram the pcm. I am not currently able to do this. Generally people will do this for a bit of cash. but don't ask yer dealer to do this. later:peter At 06:37 AM 4/2/98 +0000, you wrote: >> Sounds like it is failing part of the self diagnostics, and turns the >> fan on. OBDII I'm not too familiar with. >> Do you have a scan tool, or can you have someone scan it for >> codes etc??.. >> Got to get accurate info for diagnosing, at this stage anything >> is quessing. >> No worries mate >> Bruce > > > This PCM is not OBDII. I Have a scanner. The codes are... EGR, air >pump, canister purge, shift indicator, MIL lamp, and speedo (havent >decided on a solution yet). There are no other codes. All sensors seem >to be working in there intended range. The A/C doesnt exist. Does >everybody agree on the 100 Ohm res. that Peter mentioned? > >Thanx everyone for your quick replies (you too P.Rusch :) >-- >Ron & Stephanie Tyler >'72 LT1/T56 240Z >http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 11:10:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA08534 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:10:15 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from webserver (brpt01-sh2-port73.snet.net [204.60.23.73]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA08530 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:10:13 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA00241 for ; Thu, 02 Apr 1998 11:09:43 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 11:09:43 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804021609.LAA00241@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980402102718.007b9320@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 10:27:18 -0800 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings In-Reply-To: <199804011811.LAA13896@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19980401092008.007a4570@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >How hard would it be to rig a nozzle on the end of flexible hose and >attach it to the sprayer? Drop the hose down the tube, hit the switch >and slowly draw it back out. The nozzle on my particular Wagner unscrews for easy cleaning (yeah, if the paint hasn't dried!!!), but it is a removable piece, and there is a needle valve under the nozzle, and one o-ring. I'd say it would be pretty easy to thread an extension, but the needle valve that creates the spray pattern would be at the threaded end, not at the end you are sticking into your header. The stuff can be applied with thigns other than spray guns... you could probably get a medium sized paint brush down there. Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 11:12:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA08606 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:12:38 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA08601 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:12:37 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-41.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.110]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id LAA02820 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:11:42 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question/OBD II Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:11:50 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5e52$0b0d6b80$6e198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu First of all, the 95 PCM is *NOT* a full OBDII implementation. It may have the ALDL connector (implemented late 95), and the flash memory, but the data sensors/error states are OBDI. Is there any clues (easy to find) if something is full OBDII, or not.. big snip > > Larry Kurek > Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 11:24:12 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA09010 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:24:12 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA09004 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:24:10 -0500 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp86.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.86]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA23231 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:24:10 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3523BCDF.329C@genevaonline.com> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 10:29:19 -0600 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Projection References: <01bd5e49$7a9bdb20$6e198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The fuel "table" is 16x16 points (256 alltogether). Based on the MAP and RPM, you specify the amount of fuel to give. There is also accel compensation, O2 trigger voltages, temp enrichment, spark advance, and some other tweaks. You can also change the range of rpms on the fuel "table". You can download a copy of the logging and monitoring program called HONDO at http://www.genevaonline.com/~efi/files/hondo.zip (350K) The Actual program that you use to create and modify fuel maps is at http://www.genevaonline.com/~efi/files/eev21.zip (100K). I have included a few different maps with the eev21 program. a few come with the system. The 502 map is from holley (i don't even understand how it runs, i doesn't in mine!), the 20b one is the one i use on my 454. Let me know if you have any questions using any of this. I really wish more people would use this ECU, as it has GREAT potential. -- Andy Quaas From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 11:28:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA09094 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:28:39 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA09090 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:28:37 -0500 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp86.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.86]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA23357 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:28:38 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3523BDEB.1DE8@genevaonline.com> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 10:33:47 -0600 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Projection References: <01BD5E0E.14C21A20@ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Indeed the 4Di will function quite nicely without the O2 sensor. I tried it on mine! And, i have the manual for the marine projection handy right here for reading at work! Without the O2 sensor, cruising efficiency is lost, but if your fuel map is dialed in correctly, you shouldn't need the O2 sensor. I have actually unplugged mine to see what it would do. I drove it to work for a week. That is how i tuned my fuel map. The holley guys are OK. There are only 2 or so that know much about the digital systems. let me know if you have any questions! -- Andy Quaas Mike Jones wrote: > > Andy, > > Can the 4Di be used without the O2 sensor? (I realize tuning becomes more > critical.) Due to water-cooled exhaust system my marine application makes > implementation of an O2 sensor difficult. (One possibility I thought of is > to tap into the currently blanked-off EGR port and run a seperate mini > exhaust, but this raises questions of its own, such as how much flow would > be required to give accurate feedback, where to discharge this exhaust, > etc. So for now no O2 sensor is my goal.) > > Holley is advertising a marine 4Di which should go on sale in a couple of > months. I've spoke with Holley tech twice. One rep said that the marine > 4Di must use the O2 sensor and the other one said that it wasn't necessary. > Sadly typical for Holley. > > Thanks, > > Mike Jones From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 11:34:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA09157 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:34:29 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA09153 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:34:27 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-41.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.110]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id LAA10257 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:33:37 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Projection Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:34:05 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5e55$26d0ef60$6e198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Mike Jones To: 'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu' Subject: RE: Projection >Andy, >Can the 4Di be used without the O2 sensor? (I realize tuning becomes more >critical.) Due to water-cooled exhaust system my marine application makes >implementation of an O2 sensor difficult. (One possibility I thought of is to tap into the currently blanked-off EGR port and run a seperate mini exhaust, but this raises questions of its own, such as how much flow would be required to give accurate feedback, where to discharge this exhaust, etc. So for now no O2 sensor is my goal.) >Holley is advertising a marine 4Di which should go on sale in a couple of >months. I've spoke with Holley tech twice. One rep said that the marine >4Di must use the O2 sensor and the other one said that it wasn't necessary. > Sadly typical for Holley. >Thanks, >Mike Jones Why not run a heated O2 sensor?. Just takes 12V, or are there other considerations?. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 11:34:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA09163 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:34:43 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA09159 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:34:41 -0500 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn4-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.163]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA25414 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:31:53 -0500 Message-ID: <3523BEED.606A@huron.net> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 11:38:05 -0500 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo References: <199804021537.IAA20332@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu d houlton x0710 wrote: > > Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > > > >Would this stuff work on the turbine housing of a turbo? Seems like > > >it would if it works on headers, but I've seen pictures with the turbine > > >red hot while I've never seen headers glow quite so brightly. What is > > >the temp limit for these coatings? > > > > Please, either don't do this, or be very, very careful if you coat the > > inside housing of your turbo. A friend and I had done just that in an > > Good advice. I was talking about the outside of the turbo though. I was > just wondering if the coating could take the heat. Do turbine housings > really get hotter than a strait header would? Seems like they would if > you were always running boost, but for the average street goer that wouldn't > be a problem. > > --Dan Outside coating only would "likely" result in severe overheating, and possible melt-down. A bit like wrapped headers? -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 11:36:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA09247 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:36:23 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA09243 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:36:21 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id LAA20392; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:36:22 -0500 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAE00256 for ; Thu, 02 Apr 1998 11:35:51 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 11:35:51 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804021635.LAE00256@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980402112345.007c5190@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 11:23:45 -0800 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo In-Reply-To: <3523A0F7.A175807@mcn.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980401211721.007bd590@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >extremely tight. Okay, there you have it :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 11:36:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA09279 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:36:45 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from calliope1.fm.intel.com (calliope1.fm.intel.com [132.233.247.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA09274 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:36:44 -0500 Received: from fmsmsx26.fm.intel.com (fmsmsx26.fm.intel.com [132.233.42.26]) by calliope1.fm.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA17589; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 16:36:42 GMT Message-Id: <199804021636.QAA17589@calliope1.fm.intel.com> Received: by FMSMSX26 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2BLCVHGG>; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:34:16 -0800 From: "Fitzgearld, Fredric" To: "diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu " , "Michael J. Kupec " Subject: RE: Projection Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:21:00 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="ISO-8859-1" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ya, I get around. :) This list is nearly over my head, but I like it! Some of the people on this list are so hot they have to wear the hats with the electric fan built in them. One of the things I'm going to look into is the differences between the ECU connections. I suspect that all the stuff external to the ECU is the same, but I won't know till it gets here. Also, rather then spending too much money for the Holley O2 setup, I'm hoping to make it myself for half the price. I'm sure those with the 4D and 4Di can tell us if it's heated or not. With the help of the list, I would love to make this a "2Di" system. I know there is no way for it to be as flexible but there must be something that we can change to make it work for the better, or at least improve it's "Geek Appeal". It could be as easy as adding/changing a few chips. Then again, it may never happen at all. That's right, the temp sensor controls the choke, which is one of "things" (is map the right word?) I might want to change. I will be happy to scan the manual. I can't believe there is a whole lot of differences between the 3 units (2D, 4D, 4Di). There must be a "Magic Box" we can make to program and view what's going on in the ECU. In any case, it's still better then a carb. :) FEF ___________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: Projection Author: Michael J. Kupec [SMTP:mkupec@erols.com] at MSXGATE Date: 4/1/98 6:56 PM Fredric, I thought your name looked familiar. Nice to see fellow EB members here on this list. I wasn't aware you were running a Projection on your EB. Anyway, if you find out that the older analog stuff won't work on the new system, let me know, I'd be interested in the parts. You're right about the O2 setup for the 2D. The older system uses an add on box that modifies the TPS signal to make the system either lean or richen the injector flow. Neither the 2D or the analog has/had a MAP sensor. Both just take the TPS and distributor pulses and use that to change the fuel flow throught the injectors, crude, but it works. The 2D is simpler, just an O2 and the wiring harness is all you need. Not sure if Holley use a heated one or not though. All the temp sensor is used for is for cold starting of the engine. After the engine is at operating temp, the temp sensor is out of the loop. BTW what's the chance of you scanning in the manual and sending it to me? Mostly I want to see what differences they did at the ECU plug. I'm thinking I might be able to use a 2D whenever my analog system dies. Anyone got the manual for the 4D/4Di? It'd be interesting see what I can do with a 4's computer and the 2BBl TBI. Michael J. Kupec mkupec@erols.com I live with constant fear and danger every day... and sometimes she lets me go four-wheeling! Get in, Sit down, Shut up, and Hold on! Management & Data Systems, Lockheed Martin Corporation Woodbridge, Virginia, USA (703) 680-6903 1970 Bronco w/351W (in a constant state of dissassembly/refinement...) 1964 1/2 260 Convertible w/PS, PB, & Power Top 1965 289 HP "K" Coupe w/PS, PB, & Pony Int. (Early '65, not a GT) -----Original Message----- From: Fitzgearld, Fredric To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ; Bruce Plecan Date: Wednesday, April 01, 1998 8:30 PM Subject: RE: Projection >I'm pretty sure it's just like the old analog system with a temp sensor, >trigger, TPS, and the possible addition of a O2 sensor. It has the >tuning pots like the old system. I know this is a lot to ask for, but I >would love to be able to program this unit via the PC, or something, >then tune for altitude as needed. I wouldn't even need to do that if I >put a O2 sensor on it. > >The main reason I got the 2D system, instead of the 4Di system, is due >to the lack of funds in the budget. I know it's crude at best but the >way I see it, any kind of FI is going to be better then the carb when >changing altitudes a lot. Changing jets and rods all the time stink. >Not to mention the fact that FI will run upside down, an important part >of rock crawling. > >FEF > > >______________________________ Reply Separator >_________________________________ >Subject: Projection >Author: Bruce Plecan [SMTP:nacelp@bright.net] at MSXGATE >Date: 4/1/98 2:02 PM > > >Welp my catalog was outta date. A new 2 barrel digitial design?. >Does it have a MAP sensor?. >Does it have a IAC, or just a throttle kicker?. >Does it sit use the knobs for adjustments?. >You happen to have the patent numbers?. >Bruce > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 11:55:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA09742 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:55:19 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from calliope1.fm.intel.com (calliope1.fm.intel.com [132.233.247.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA09738 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:55:15 -0500 Received: from fmsmsx27.fm.intel.com (fmsmsx27.fm.intel.com [132.233.42.27]) by calliope1.fm.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id QAA20478; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 16:54:45 GMT Message-Id: <199804021654.QAA20478@calliope1.fm.intel.com> Received: by FMSMSX27 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2BL1534L>; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:53:59 -0800 From: "Fitzgearld, Fredric" To: "diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu " , Bruce Plecan Subject: RE: More Projection stuff Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 08:41:00 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Forgive me for the simple question but what exactly is "speed density". How does the ECU monitor it? Is it a related to pressure? Is it what you would use to monitor manifold vacuum, instead of a MAP sensor? Thanks, FEF ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: More Projection stuff Author: Bruce Plecan [SMTP:nacelp@bright.net] at MSXGATE Date: 4/1/98 4:04 PM From: Fitzgearld, Fredric To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ; Bruce Plecan Date: Wednesday, April 01, 1998 6:48 PM Subject: RE: More Projection stuff >HuMmmmmm... I was told that the #502-20 (Universal 2D Digital System >$625.) replaced the, now discontinued, 502-2 (analog system ~$500.). >It's so new (I guess) that I didn't even see it on Holley's WEB page >when I went to look. The 4D and 4Di are about 2x the price. I would >love to have the 4Di but the low end will do just as well, for my >application (rock crawling). If they send me an analog system, it's >going back. I don't want any part of that, again. > >I shouldn't have any trouble tuning it as I had the analog system for a >while. The brain died and they said it would cost $400. to replace it. If ya ain't gonna fix it, I'd like to talk a look inside. Does it come with a MAP sensor, according to the Jegs catalog, says it's speed density Now I curious if it is better than the Alpha-N. Also curious about the chips nos.. >FEF > Bruce This message originated at CSH World Headquarters From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 12:09:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA10193 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:09:51 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.4]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA10189 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:09:50 -0500 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id LAA24583 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:09:42 -0600 (CST) Received: from nbw-nj14-04.ix.netcom.com(198.211.225.196) by dfw-ix4.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma024543; Thu Apr 2 11:09:07 1998 Message-ID: <3523C678.2755@ix.netcom.com> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 12:10:16 -0500 From: Ed X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo References: <199804021537.IAA20332@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com> <3523BEED.606A@huron.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Clare Snyder wrote: > > Outside coating only would "likely" result in severe overheating, and > possible melt-down. A bit like wrapped headers? What about those who use that thermotec brand "turbo wrap"? Never tried to coat or wrap a turbo housing...just curious about any overheating problems. -Ed From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 12:12:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA10212 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:12:56 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from webserver (brpt01-sh2-port73.snet.net [204.60.23.73]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA10207 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:12:54 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAC00237; Thu, 02 Apr 1998 12:12:24 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 12:12:24 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804021712.MAC00237@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980402120747.007ae100@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 12:07:47 -0800 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo In-Reply-To: <199804021537.IAA20332@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19980401211721.007bd590@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Good advice. I was talking about the outside of the turbo though. I was >just wondering if the coating could take the heat. Do turbine housings >really get hotter than a strait header would? Seems like they would if Yes they do get hotter because they restrict the airflow more than a header would. Before I wrote this, I called my bud to ask if his coating is still on his turbo (we coated the outside only) and he said it flaked off after a few months or hard use. Knowing his driving style for years, he tends to be more rough on things than even I. Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 12:12:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA10218 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:12:59 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA10214 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:12:58 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id MAA21348; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:12:58 -0500 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAD00237 for ; Thu, 02 Apr 1998 12:12:27 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 12:12:27 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804021712.MAD00237@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980402121007.007aebc0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 12:10:07 -0800 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: New User! In-Reply-To: <199804021521.HAA18615@diamond.sunset.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >I hope I can be of benefit to the list..!! Welcome to the list Derek, and don't forget to send your annual membership dues to my home address. I'm kidding by the way . You'll find a good group of folks... we have several projects going, and whether you percieve your ability to add value, trust me, we all help each other and it really works out good. This is actually one of my favorite lists, aside from the information and ideas we pass along, the members are friendly and happy to help, and not as judgemental as some of the other lists. Anyhoo, welcome aboard (and I was kidding about the dues :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 12:37:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA10665 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:37:16 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lsi.lsil.com (lsi.lsil.com [147.145.40.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA10660 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:37:13 -0500 Received: from mhbs.lsil.com ([147.145.29.36]) by lsi.lsil.com with ESMTP id JAA14855 (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:37:13 -0800 Received: from mms10.lsil.com by mhbs.lsil.com; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 09:37:12 -0800 Received: from mm104.minn by mms10 (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id LAA15457; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:13:22 -0600 Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:13:22 -0600 From: mdill@lsil.com (Mike Dillon) Message-Id: <199804021713.LAA15457@mms10> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: PROM holders Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I was told by my distributor that mim order was 250, with ~ 3-6 week lead time. 250 sounds bad, but heck they only cost 20-30 cents so a whole order would be 50-75 bucks. If there is enough interest I could put an order in, and do the cost+ thing. Mike D. > From diy_efi-owner@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Thu Apr 2 10:24 CST 1998 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Mike Turner > To: Diy_efi > Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 9:56 AM > Subject: PROM holders > > > >Does anyone have part numbers for the GM PROM holders? I believe a recent > discussion mentioned Robinson Nugent as a source. > > > Yes, they are, you have to buy 2,500 to get them thou, assuming > you want the 2732A type holder. > Larry Fisher GNOne@tia.net has them in small quantities > Cheers > Bruce > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 13:06:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA11355 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:06:52 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA11351 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:06:50 -0500 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id MAA28865 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:06:45 -0600 (CST) Received: from rc-025.blueridge.net(205.152.121.25) by dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma028828; Thu Apr 2 12:06:13 1998 Message-ID: <003701bd5e61$7d2a3a40$197998cd@bernie> From: "Bernie Jacobsen" To: Subject: Re: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:02:17 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The heat's got to go somewhere. Inside coating would keep it away from the metal housing (although you would need to MAKE SURE you have enough clearence after thermal expansion, remember the turbine expands the same, the cooler housing expands less). Coating or wrapping the outside allows the heat to enter the housing but it can't escape. The housing temperature will get significantly hotter than normal. Also, with the housing hotter, theoretically it will expand more, causing increased clearence between the turbine and the housing. Performance loss? probably negligable. But I would be concerned with other parts getting hot i.e. bearings... ^Bernie >Clare Snyder wrote: >> >> Outside coating only would "likely" result in severe overheating, and >> possible melt-down. A bit like wrapped headers? > > What about those who use that thermotec brand "turbo wrap"? Never tried >to coat or wrap a turbo housing...just curious about any overheating >problems. > >-Ed > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 13:07:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA11363 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:07:17 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com [198.133.22.42]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA11359 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:07:16 -0500 Received: from relay1.server.ibm.com (relay1.server.ibm.com [9.14.2.98]) by smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA17342 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:00:48 -0500 Received: from US.IBM.COM (d03lms05.boulder.ibm.com [9.99.80.15]) by relay1.server.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA62700 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:05:08 -0500 Received: by US.IBM.COM (Soft-Switch LMS 2.1.0.0) with snapi via D03AU045 id 5030050008396647; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:07:20 -0500 From: Kevin Vannorsdel To: Subject: Re: PROM holders Message-ID: <5030050008396647000002L572*@MHS> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:07:20 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id NAA11360 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Awhile back someone suggested that I install a ZIF socket in my C3 inplace of the goofy GM socket that requires those holders. I did and boy am I glad... Those holders are nothing but a pain IMHO. It might be worth your while, if ya haven't allready, to think about spending the 11 bucks and time for a ZIF socket and be done with the holders once and for all... Also- You CAN plug into the GM socket without the holder... just stick your EPROM in a normal machined pin IC socket and then gently snap the assembly into the GM holder. Must have done 30 or 40 insertions this way with no significant problems. Just my .02 ________________________________________________ Kevin Vannorsdel IBM Arm Electronics Development 408-256-6492 Tie 276-6492 kv@us.ibm.com owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu on 04/02/98 10:03:02 AM Please respond to diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: Subject: Re: PROM holders I was told by my distributor that mim order was 250, with ~ 3-6 week lead time. 250 sounds bad, but heck they only cost 20-30 cents so a whole order would be 50-75 bucks. If there is enough interest I could put an order in, and do the cost+ thing. Mike D. > From diy_efi-owner@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Thu Apr 2 10:24 CST 1998 > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Mike Turner > To: Diy_efi > Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 9:56 AM > Subject: PROM holders > > > >Does anyone have part numbers for the GM PROM holders? I believe a recent > discussion mentioned Robinson Nugent as a source. > > > Yes, they are, you have to buy 2,500 to get them thou, assuming > you want the 2732A type holder. > Larry Fisher GNOne@tia.net has them in small quantities > Cheers > Bruce > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 13:16:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA11618 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:16:32 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com (problem.tantech.com [204.225.232.52]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA11612 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:16:11 -0500 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0yKoYK-0000bqC; Thu, 2 Apr 98 13:17 EST Message-Id: Subject: Re: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:17:27 -0500 (EST) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: <3523BEED.606A@huron.net> from "Clare Snyder" at Apr 2, 98 11:38:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > > > >Would this stuff work on the turbine housing of a turbo? Seems like > > > >it would if it works on headers, but I've seen pictures with the turbine > > > >red hot while I've never seen headers glow quite so brightly. What is > > > >the temp limit for these coatings? > > > > > > Please, either don't do this, or be very, very careful if you coat the > > > inside housing of your turbo. A friend and I had done just that in an > > > > Good advice. I was talking about the outside of the turbo though. I was > > just wondering if the coating could take the heat. Do turbine housings > > really get hotter than a strait header would? Seems like they would if > > you were always running boost, but for the average street goer that wouldn't > > be a problem. > > > Outside coating only would "likely" result in severe overheating, and > possible melt-down. A bit like wrapped headers? I would think may benefit would be from coating the exhauset side of the turbine unit and the inside of the exhaust scroll this would really help keep heat out od the turbo housing and bearing, and put it into the gasses where it belongs should also reduce tendency to turbo lag Clive > -- > _/\_ > --|-----([])-----|-- > S 0/ \0 B > Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back > E-Mail service is back to normal > To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages > Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca > OR > Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the > spammers!!! > It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of > Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 13:19:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA11662 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:19:54 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com (problem.tantech.com [204.225.232.52]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA11657 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:19:52 -0500 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0yKoc6-0000bqC; Thu, 2 Apr 98 13:21 EST Message-Id: Subject: Re: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:21:21 -0500 (EST) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980402102718.007b9320@xephic.dynip.com> from "Frederic Breitwieser" at Apr 2, 98 10:27:18 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > >How hard would it be to rig a nozzle on the end of flexible hose and > >attach it to the sprayer? Drop the hose down the tube, hit the switch > >and slowly draw it back out. > > The nozzle on my particular Wagner unscrews for easy cleaning (yeah, if the > paint hasn't dried!!!), but it is a removable piece, and there is a needle > valve under the nozzle, and one o-ring. I'd say it would be pretty easy to > thread an extension, but the needle valve that creates the spray pattern > would be at the threaded end, not at the end you are sticking into your > header. > > The stuff can be applied with thigns other than spray guns... you could > probably get a medium sized paint brush down there. or you could dust tape the ends of the tubes dump the stuff in and shake the subes around so that iy gets to flow everywhere then drain the excess out and bake Clive From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 13:32:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA11911 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:32:18 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [205.139.62.192]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA11907 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 13:32:16 -0500 Received: (qmail 10083 invoked from network); 2 Apr 1998 11:34:08 -0700 Received: from ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.169) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 2 Apr 1998 11:34:08 -0700 Received: by ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD5E2A.6CC1A7B0@ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:28:14 -0800 Message-ID: <01BD5E2A.6CC1A7B0@ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Projection Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 11:28:02 -0800 Encoding: 17 TEXT, 41 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >>Bruce Plecan wrote (re: marine 4Di) Why not run a heated O2 sensor?. Just takes 12V, or are there other considerations? Bruce>> The exhaust manifolds and risers are water cooled, i.e. double walled with cooling passages. I could replace one riser with a non-cooled piece, take the water from the manifold and bypass it downstream, but I think I can get the results I'm after by careful tuning. I would argue that a marine engine is easier to tune than an auto since load doesn't vary much (you don't go up hills too often while on the water.) Feel free to poke holes (but not in the boat, please) Mike J. begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(@X3`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M6)E``@0`0```&4```!"4E5#15!,14-!3E=23U1%*%)%.DU! M4DE.131$22E72%E.3U1254Y!2$5!5$5$3S)314Y33U(_2E535%1!2T53,3)6 M+$]205)%5$A%4D5/5$A%4D-/3E-)1$52051)3TY3/T)2``````(!"1 !```` MO0(``+D"``!?! ``3%I&=;>>&4C_``H!#P(5`J0#Y 7K`H,`4!,#5 (`8V@* MP'-E=.XR!@`&PP*#,@+D!Q,"@R(S#WIH96P#($1LNF<"@'T*@ C/"=D[%D]X M,C4U`H *@0VQ"V!N\&\ FTW0 M;B<%0'8*P,TCL&T?8#?0*'D(8#:Q94D29T;@=7 D8 ,0;/<$($;01N!O0G$? M\4L!.@+9/)@N*260)9!&"> #(*<#4 G@1L)P;SQQ:#81_P0@(&! `B/2"X \ MDP;@)) G)I +4$9A92DPC$UI63QQ2BX*A15Q`%+@`````P`0$ (````#`!$0 M`0```$ `!S#P1\0K:EZ]`4 `"##P1\0K:EZ]`1X`/0`!````!0```%)%.B ` -`````P`--/TW```0,5Z] ` end From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 15:24:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA13650 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:24:09 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dns2.anl.gov (dns2.anl.gov [146.139.254.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA13640 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:24:04 -0500 From: lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov Received: from smtpgate.anl.gov (smtpgate.anl.gov [146.137.96.36]) by dns2.anl.gov (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id OAA03218 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 14:24:04 -0600 (CST) Received: from ccMail by smtpgate.anl.gov (ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02) id AA891548644; Thu, 02 Apr 98 14:24:06 -0600 Message-Id: <9804028915.AA891548644@smtpgate.anl.gov> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Thu, 02 Apr 98 14:15:51 -0600 To: Subject: Re[2]: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Seems to me you guys are only looking at one side of this coin. There are also coatings available that are called "Heat Rejection Coatings", which actually enhance thermal transfer between the substrate and the cooling medium. I would think a coating of this on the outside of the turbo housing, along with a "light" coat of barrier coating on the inside (.0005-.001") would be the ticket for preventing heat transfer into the housing, and then rejecting the heat that does get in easier. BTW, I would think if you could apply it evenly, a light coat of TBC on the turbine would get rid of any problems caused by changing the expansion characteristics of one part and not the other (may also help to keep heat out of the bearings). TTYL! Larry Kurek ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo Author: at internet Date: 4/2/98 1:17 PM > > > > >Would this stuff work on the turbine housing of a turbo? Seems like > > > >it would if it works on headers, but I've seen pictures with the turbine > > > >red hot while I've never seen headers glow quite so brightly. What is > > > >the temp limit for these coatings? > > > > > > Please, either don't do this, or be very, very careful if you coat the > > > inside housing of your turbo. A friend and I had done just that in an > > > > Good advice. I was talking about the outside of the turbo though. I was > > just wondering if the coating could take the heat. Do turbine housings > > really get hotter than a strait header would? Seems like they would if > > you were always running boost, but for the average street goer that wouldn't > > be a problem. > > > Outside coating only would "likely" result in severe overheating, and > possible melt-down. A bit like wrapped headers? I would think may benefit would be from coating the exhauset side of the turbine unit and the inside of the exhaust scroll this would really help keep heat out od the turbo housing and bearing, and put it into the gasses where it belongs should also reduce tendency to turbo lag Clive > -- > _/\_ > --|-----([])-----|-- > S 0/ \0 B > Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back > E-Mail service is back to normal > To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages > Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca > OR > Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the > spammers!!! > It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of > Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 15:38:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA13832 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:38:41 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo26.mx.aol.com (imo26.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.70]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA13827 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:38:19 -0500 Received: from TWright669@aol.com by imo26.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8STMa11408 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:37:32 -0500 (EST) From: TWright669 Message-ID: Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:37:32 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Projection 502-20 2bbl Digital ProJection Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Now, I'm doing this from memory, BUT I think the map sensor is built into the throttle body? I know all the other sensors are (except coolant temp.) Tom From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 16:01:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA14193 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 16:01:09 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kerplunk.csc.com (kerplunk.csc.com [20.1.10.30]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA14184 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 16:00:37 -0500 From: jdzura@csc.com Received: from va-fch34.vtc.csc.com ([20.1.6.97] helo=csc.com) by kerplunk.csc.com with smtp (Exim 1.90 #1) for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu id 0yKr5Q-00057z-00; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:59:48 -0500 Received: by csc.com(Lotus SMTP MTA v4.6.1 (569.2 2-6-1998)) id 852565DA.006D4694 ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:53:34 -0400 X-Lotus-FromDomain: CSC To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-ID: <852565DA.0058D1B1.00@csc.com> Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 12:10:48 -0400 Subject: Re: PROM holders Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Disposition: inline Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Why not contact a small mail order supplier like Digi Key? Joe nacelp@bright.net on 04/02/98 10:07:49 AM Please respond to diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: (bcc: Joe Dzura/SED/CSC) Subject: Re: PROM holders -----Original Message----- From: Mike Turner To: Diy_efi Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 9:56 AM Subject: PROM holders >Does anyone have part numbers for the GM PROM holders? I believe a recent discussion mentioned Robinson Nugent as a source. Yes, they are, you have to buy 2,500 to get them thou, assuming you want the 2732A type holder. Larry Fisher GNOne@tia.net has them in small quantities Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 15:39:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA13862 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:39:52 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from rs422.bb-elec.com ([206.1.0.38]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA13844 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:39:16 -0500 Received: from mfahrion.bb-elec.com ([206.1.0.170]) by rs422.bb-elec.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) ID# 103-48821U100L100S0) with SMTP id AAA308 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 14:38:42 -0600 From: mfahrion@bb-elec.com (Mike Fahrion) To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question/OBD II Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 14:38:41 -0600 Message-ID: <01bd5e77$525d3040$aa0001ce@mfahrion.bb-elec.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > First of all, the 95 PCM is *NOT* a full OBDII implementation. It may >have the ALDL connector (implemented late 95), and the flash memory, but the >data sensors/error states are OBDI. > > >Is there any clues (easy to find) if something is full OBDII, or not.. > >big snip Yes - here's a pretty easy way, that (I think) always works... In the coming days and weeks you should be able to find more comprehensive info at www.obdii.com. All OBDII vehicles must have the connector defined by SAE J1962. The connector can always be found within 3 feet of the driver, usually low on the dash or behind the ashtray. If your vehicle is pre-1996, it could have the J1962 connector and not be OBDII. Follow the rules below to know for sure. First, you have to have the J1962 connector. This is a 16 pin, D shaped connector, not the rectangular ALDL connector. If the connector has pin 2, 7 or 10 then it is OBDII. If the connector has a pin 2, but no pin 7 or pin 10 it uses the J1850 VPW standard If the connector has pin 10, but no pin 2 or pin 7 it uses the J1850 PWM standard If the connector has a pin 7, but no pin 2 or pin 10 it uses the ISO 9141-2 standard I don't think any pre 1996 LT1's were OBDII. The 95 Fbodies and Impalla SS's were not OBDII, although I think some of the Fbodies had the J1962 connector. If anyone knows differently - please let me know. -mike mfahrion@bb-elec.com From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 15:48:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA14057 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:48:48 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from nemesis.cyberdrive.net (nemesis.cyberdrive.net [207.25.206.25]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA14049 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:48:12 -0500 Received: from dilbert (pix-230.nordson.com [207.206.59.230]) by nemesis.cyberdrive.net (8.8.8/8.8.8/CICnet/IAG) with SMTP id PAA03749 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:48:52 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <027b01bd5e78$540ebb60$657cbdc0@dilbert.nordson.com> From: "Gary Derian" To: Subject: Re: rebuilding turbo Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:45:22 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Glass bead all the parts but not the bearing journals. Install new seals and bearings. Reassemble. Check all clearances, especially compressor and turbine to their housings. Gary Derian >I know this is off subject, but anyone who has rebuilt a turbo could you >please e-mail me privately. I need info on how to do it, and any tips >they could give. Thanks. > >Sun Dang >http://weber.u.washington.edu/~sunn From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 15:52:49 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA14083 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:52:49 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA14078 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:52:28 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-41.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.110]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id PAA15226 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:51:24 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Spare Stuff for 101 Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:51:52 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5e79$2a0275e0$6e198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does any one have any prom burning equipment to donate to the programming project? Major helper in this wants to do more, but needs a burner software, and eraser. Gotta be able to do 2732A and the 128/256 style. Also still have a couple of the free prom packs for folks doing bench testing with the ecms, just mail me. Again Thanks Bruce If ya wanna clue about how this is going last Sat CSH HQ did 10Mb on net traffic.. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 18:03:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA16224 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 18:03:11 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA16220 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 18:03:10 -0500 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp43.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.43]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id RAA06493 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 17:03:10 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <35241A64.16F8@genevaonline.com> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 17:08:20 -0600 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Projection 502-20 2bbl Digital ProJection References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu My 4Di projection uses a standard GM MAP sensor. -- Andy Quaas TWright669 wrote: > > Now, I'm doing this from memory, BUT I think the map sensor is built into the > throttle body? I know all the other sensors are (except coolant temp.) > Tom From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 18:49:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA16772 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 18:49:18 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mxserver.forbin.com (mxserver.forbin.com [204.71.100.246]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA16767 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 18:48:50 -0500 Received: from fraser.forbin.com (x2-189.forbin.com [208.149.197.189]) by mxserver.forbin.com (2.5 Build 2630 (Berkeley 8.8.6)/8.8.4) with SMTP id RAA00467 for ; Thu, 02 Apr 1998 17:48:44 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19960401173719.006fcb74@forbin.com> X-Sender: fraser@forbin.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Mon, 01 Apr 1996 17:37:19 -0600 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Jennifer and Brock Fraser Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question In-Reply-To: <199804021000.FAA03915@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >From: Ron Tyler >Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 20:27:11 +0000 >Subject: LT1 EFI Question > >Hello All, > > I installed a '95 LT1 in my 240Z. I have removed EGR, air pump, >canister purge valve, shift indicator lamp, and MIL. Everything else is >intact. About 30 seconds after starting the car, the cooling fan >activates. Is this some sort of quasi limp-home mode due to the missing >components? The PCM *does* go into closed loop, so I am assuming that it >isnt a full blown "limp". Would I be correct? > >TIA >- -- >Ron & Stephanie Tyler >'72 LT1/T56 240Z >http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg Ron, I've got a twin-turbocharged LT1 in my Jaguar that runs on a '96 PCM. I don't have any of the emissions-related equipment you mentioned on my car, and my fans don't turn on after startup. (The fans are PCM controlled, as in the factory f-body) If '96 can deal with these losses (with OBD-II diags), then your '95 should. Come to think of it, I've used my '95 PCM in the car with no fan errors as well... How did you defeat the VATS to be able to start the engine? There are really only two possibilities... 1. modify the PCM data (re-program) 2. used the factory "body" wiring, including ign. key cylinder and factory key Assuming you didn't GUT OUT a F/B/Y car to get the body wiring, I guess somebody re-programmed your PCM. I'd start there. The first sign of a seriously un-happy PCM is a fan-on condition. There's one other thing puzzling me... You say that the fans turn on after 30 seconds. This is very odd. Usually the "I've lost my mind" PCM condition turns on the fans upon key-on, i.e- engine not necessarily running. In fact, that's the DIY_EFI insti-check for a clean programming is "key-on, fans-no". The reason I mentioned the re-programming was that a programming error (incomplete file, incompatible T&E side, etc) can make the car run "OK" but have the fan-on condition. A 96/97 PCM will set a code (don't recall the P-number) that indicates a calibration error... I don't recall if this code is used in '95 or not. Does your scan tool indicate "FANS: YES" for the fan status? Of course, I don't know what you are using for a scan tool. Make sure that the PCM is really commanding the fans. Are both fans on? Besides the fans, how does the car run? Is the real-time data from your scan tool reasonable? Good luck, Brock From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 19:31:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA17363 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 19:31:35 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kla-tencor.com (mail01.kla-tencor.com [206.67.220.38]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA17358 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 19:31:32 -0500 Received: from milxbh03.kla-tencor.com by kla-tencor.com (8.8.5/KLA-Tencor.3.6irm) id QAA05938; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 16:30:25 -0800 (PST) Received: by exchange3.kla-tencor.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2FKLLSTB>; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 16:30:57 -0800 Message-ID: <933713F1FB7BD111AC2300A0C98F1AD17750B3@milxpr06.kla-tencor.com> From: "Buchholz, Steven" To: "'DIY-EFI'" Subject: EPROM device used in Motronic BMW Motorcycles Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 16:33:18 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just a quick qusetion ... I was going to help someone by making a copy of the EPROM in my stock Motronic bx on my BMW 16v, 1000cc K bike. Anyone BTDT enough to know if the device is socketed or not and what device type it is? TIA! Steve Buchholz San Jose, CA (USA) PS - Since I get the list in digest form there's a chance I may miss a response. I'd appreciate it if you could copy me on any responses you might have. PPS - has anyone out there delved into the Motronic code for the Beemers? If so, I'd appreciate hearing about that as well ... From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 19:41:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA17500 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 19:41:07 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA17496 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 19:41:06 -0500 Received: from [12.65.1.61] ([12.65.70.246]) by mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA14848 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 00:41:01 +0000 Message-ID: <3523C16B.7E84@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 16:48:47 +0000 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question/OBD II References: <01bd5e77$525d3040$aa0001ce@mfahrion.bb-elec.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > All OBDII vehicles must have the connector defined by SAE J1962. > > If the connector has pin 2, 7 or 10 then it is OBDII. > If the connector has a pin 2, but no pin 7 or pin 10 it uses the J1850 VPW > standard > If the connector has pin 10, but no pin 2 or pin 7 it uses the J1850 PWM > standard > If the connector has a pin 7, but no pin 2 or pin 10 it uses the ISO 9141-2 > standard FWIW, I had the J1962 connector and none of the pinouts described. The PCM is from a '95 F-body. I disposed of the J1962 and installed an ALDL -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 20:08:49 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA17910 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 20:08:49 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA17903 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 20:08:27 -0500 Received: from [12.65.1.61] ([12.65.70.61]) by mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA7828 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 01:07:47 +0000 Message-ID: <3523C7B1.284C@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 17:15:36 +0000 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question References: <3.0.2.32.19960401173719.006fcb74@forbin.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > How did you defeat the VATS to be able to start the engine? There are I wired the VATS module into the car. I gutted out a spade fuse and soldered in the proper resistor and epoxied it back to original shape. I installed the holder out of view under dash. When I park in risky territory, I just pull the "fuse". > seriously un-happy PCM is a fan-on condition. I tried the "Key-on" for about 90 seconds. Nothing. I started the car and 28 seconds later the fan came to life. It seems to be a consistant time period. The PCM has never been reprogrammed. > > Does your scan tool indicate "FANS: YES" for the fan status? Of course, I > don't know what you are using for a scan tool. Make sure that the PCM is > really commanding the fans. Are both fans on? > > Besides the fans, how does the car run? Is the real-time data from your > scan tool reasonable? > The scan tool is an AutoXray Xp240. It does indicate "fan: on". The realtime data seems reasonable. I am only running the primary fan. The car seems to run very well, although slightly better somtimes. The one thing that I have noticed that doesnt seem right (other than the fan) is the idle seems to take a while to settle in. In other words, When you start the car, It runs a low rpm (mabey 1100). As it warms, it raises to as high as 1500. But even after the car is fully warmed, you come to a stop, engage clutch, and its still idling 1300, and then slowly drops to around 1000. By slowly, I mean several seconds. It never matches the requested RPM. Thanx Again -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 20:48:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA18515 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 20:48:20 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from m28.boston.juno.com (m28.boston.juno.com [205.231.101.186]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA18507 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 20:48:16 -0500 Received: (from cosmic.ray@juno.com) by m28.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id TvB18556; Thu, 02 Apr 1998 19:36:40 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 19:05:54 -0500 Subject: Re: Projection 502-20 2bbl Digital ProJection Message-ID: <19980402.193558.9390.0.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> References: X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-6,9-11 From: cosmic.ray@juno.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Thu, 2 Apr 1998 15:37:32 EST TWright669 writes: >Now, I'm doing this from memory, BUT I think the map sensor is built into the >throttle body? I know all the other sensors are (except coolant temp.) >Tom > The MAP sensor is a black rectangular box. I mounted mine on the firewall and hooked it to a good source of vacuum on the manifold with a vacuum hose. Ray Drouillard _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 21:35:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA19128 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 21:35:21 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.clarityconnect.com (mail.clarityconnect.com [206.64.143.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA19124 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 21:35:20 -0500 Received: from LOCALNAME (206.114.169.44) by mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.0.1); Thu, 2 Apr 1998 21:36:08 -0500 Message-ID: <35247178.1B02@clarityconnect.com> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 21:19:52 -0800 From: Scot Sealander X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E-KIT (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Prog 101 Update References: <01bd5e3a$1caa9f60$4e198fd1@nacelp> <3523A37A.D94C6DF0@mcn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Shannen Durphey wrote: > Knock retard is handled by the esc box mounted on the right > side of the intake manifold. > it intercepts computed timing signal from 747 That is incorrect. The ESC box only reports knock duration to the ECM, and the ECM program handles knock. There is no EST connection to the ESC box. Scot Sealander Sealand@clarityconnect.com From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 21:38:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA19170 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 21:38:21 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.clarityconnect.com (mail.clarityconnect.com [206.64.143.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA19166 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 21:38:21 -0500 Received: from LOCALNAME (206.114.169.44) by mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.0.1); Thu, 2 Apr 1998 21:39:36 -0500 Message-ID: <352472FA.4B2A@clarityconnect.com> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 21:26:18 -0800 From: Scot Sealander X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E-KIT (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Prog 101 Update References: <01bd5e3a$1caa9f60$4e198fd1@nacelp> <3523A37A.D94C6DF0@mcn.net> <9804021038.ZM2361@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Andrew F. Gunnesch wrote: > Is that how my '165 TPI motor works then? No. > Is there any way to program the esc box ? Not really, no need. You really have to understand what the ECM program is doing. Scot Sealander Sealand@clarityconnect.com From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 21:52:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA19543 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 21:52:52 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from motgate.mot.com (motgate.mot.com [129.188.136.100]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA19538 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 21:52:50 -0500 Received: from pobox.mot.com (pobox.mot.com [129.188.137.100]) by motgate.mot.com (8.8.5/8.6.10/MOT-3.8) with ESMTP id UAA16585 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 20:50:56 -0600 (CST) Comments: ( Received on motgate.mot.com from client pobox.mot.com, sender rjardine@fraser.asc.corp.mot.com ) Received: from fraser.asc.corp.mot.com (fraser.asc.corp.mot.com [217.1.8.8]) by pobox.mot.com (8.8.5/8.6.10/MOT-3.8) with ESMTP id UAA29713 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 20:50:52 -0600 (CST) Received: from checkov.asc.corp.mot.com (checkov [217.1.8.19]) by fraser.asc.corp.mot.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA29806 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:20:47 +0930 (CST) Received: from checkov.asc.corp.mot.com (rjardine@localhost) by checkov.asc.corp.mot.com (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id MAA16128 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:20:21 +0930 (CST) Message-Id: <199804030250.MAA16128@checkov.asc.corp.mot.com> X-Mailer: exmh version 1.6.5 12/11/95 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: An introduction.... and a question or two. :) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 12:20:20 +0930 From: Raymond Jardine Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi folks, I'm new to the diy_efi list so an introduction is probably in order. I've been involved in club level motorsport for more years and $$$ than I care to remember, and have over recent years developed an interest in Powertrain control and data aquisition. At the moment I'm trying to develop a test rig that can simulate the analog inputs normally provided by MAP sensors, lambda sensors and the like. In order to successfully simulate such a signal I'll need to establish the operating characteristics of such a sensor. To summarize, I need to know the range and frequency at which I should alter a signal, in order to simulate the behaviour of various analog inputs. Can anyone suggest a reference source ? rgds, Ray Jardine. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 22:30:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA20151 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:30:52 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.anc.net (mail.anc.net [208.133.27.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA20146 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:30:49 -0500 Received: from terry-elliott (max01-ba-14.ba.anc.net [209.12.2.15]) by mail.anc.net (8.8.8/SCO5) with SMTP id VAA21938 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 21:30:46 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <004701bd5eb0$e7673e40$05020cd1@terry-elliott> From: "Eric Elliott" To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 10:11:06 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello, Older GMC ECMs diddled the EGR & looked at injector duration to se if EGR functioned. So it had to actually change AFR via EGR to pass test. Test was done after engine warm. My new 5.4 L measures EGR flow with a differential pressure transmitter. Another case where a resistor won't fool it. Eric -----Original Message----- From: Ron Tyler To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 9:56 AM Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question >BTW, There is no temp sensor for the EGR, so I'm assuming that the PCM >is verifying its operation through current measurement. Is this true? If >so, then using a resistor here should also satisfy the PCM > >-- >Ron & Stephanie Tyler >'72 LT1/T56 240Z >http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 22:34:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA20247 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:34:22 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from darius.concentric.net (darius.concentric.net [207.155.184.79]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA20243 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:34:21 -0500 Received: from mcfeely.concentric.net (mcfeely.concentric.net [207.155.184.83]) by darius.concentric.net (8.8.8/(98/01/20 5.9)) id WAA19463; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:34:20 -0500 (EST) [1-800-745-2747 The Concentric Network] Received: from crc3.concentric.net (ts004d19.oak-ca.concentric.net [206.173.201.103]) by mcfeely.concentric.net (8.8.8) id WAA27042; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:34:19 -0500 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980402211528.006aec5c@pop3.cris.com> X-Sender: johnhess@pop3.cris.com (Unverified) X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 21:15:28 -0600 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: John Hess Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question In-Reply-To: <3522A31A.74AB@worldnet.att.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Don't know about the LT1, specifically; but, the L98 turns on the cooling fan when it detects the air conditioner compresser is running. You might neet to check out that lead. At 08:27 PM 4/1/98 +0000, you wrote: >Hello All, > > I installed a '95 LT1 in my 240Z. I have removed EGR, air pump, >canister purge valve, shift indicator lamp, and MIL. Everything else is >intact. About 30 seconds after starting the car, the cooling fan >activates. Is this some sort of quasi limp-home mode due to the missing >components? The PCM *does* go into closed loop, so I am assuming that it >isnt a full blown "limp". Would I be correct? > >TIA >-- >Ron & Stephanie Tyler >'72 LT1/T56 240Z >http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 22:45:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA20519 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:45:05 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mozart.bcit.bc.ca (aix4.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.189.164]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA20514 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:45:04 -0500 Received: from Unknown (cardinal.seet.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.147.60]) by mozart.bcit.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA16918 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 19:43:29 -0800 Message-Id: <199804030343.TAA16918@mozart.bcit.bc.ca> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Peter Fenske" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 19:39:18 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: KNOCKS Priority: normal In-reply-to: <01bd5e77$525d3040$aa0001ce@mfahrion.bb-elec.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.53/R1) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Gang.. Knock retard. When the ecm sees a knock signal the ecm will start to pull out timing. ie retard the timing..The max timing the ecm will pull out is given by a rpm indexed table. How fast it pulls out the timing(attack??) is governed by another rpm indexed table. and how fast it releases or returns to normal timing is governed by another rpm indexed table. Note this is a generalization.. The knock module in 85-89 tpi and the thick film in the newer pcms ecms are merely filter noise detectors. later:peter From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 23:10:46 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA21028 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:10:46 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.anc.net (mail.anc.net [208.133.27.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA21021 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:10:43 -0500 Received: from terry-elliott (max01-ba-07.ba.anc.net [209.12.2.8]) by mail.anc.net (8.8.8/SCO5) with SMTP id WAA29912 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:10:38 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <006401bd5eb6$79abc140$05020cd1@terry-elliott> From: "Eric Elliott" To: Subject: C3 & P4 ECM information Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:09:34 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello, The older GM ECMs were well discussed in this mailing list about 3 years back. The web site makes archive downloads easy. Just search the archive for "C3" or "P4" or.... Some letters in the archives describe books that describe the ECMs. Also mentioned are books that give values for the various sensors used with domestic & foreign ECMs. The recent letter about what resistor to make the water sensor lie about temperature could have easily been answered by letters replied in the archives. Eric From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 23:12:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA21100 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:12:21 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA21096 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:12:20 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-3.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.72]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id XAA05542 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:11:25 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:11:50 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5eb6$a07c4740$48198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Eric Elliott >Hello, >Older GMC ECMs diddled the EGR & looked at injector duration to se if EGR >functioned. So it had to actually change AFR via EGR to pass test. Test was >done after engine warm. >My new 5.4 L measures EGR flow with a differential pressure transmitter. >Another case where a resistor won't fool it. >Eric And perchance what ecm would be an example of that?.. Bruce When taller Cone Shaped Hat are made, we'll be wearing them here first at world HQ From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 23:21:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA21398 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:21:20 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kauri.lincoln.ac.nz (kauri.lincoln.ac.nz [138.75.10.7]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA21393 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:21:14 -0500 Received: from whio.lincoln.ac.nz by kauri.lincoln.ac.nz (PMDF V5.1-9 #1) with ESMTP id <0EQT0075MKWDBN@kauri.lincoln.ac.nz> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:09:52 +1200 (NZS) Received: from WHIO/SpoolDir by whio.lincoln.ac.nz (Mercury 1.40); Fri, 03 Apr 1998 16:08:53 +1200 Received: from SpoolDir by WHIO (Mercury 1.40); Fri, 03 Apr 1998 16:08:50 +1200 Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 15:50:47 +1200 From: Simon Quested Subject: Idle probelm..... To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <0EQT0075NKWDBN@kauri.lincoln.ac.nz> Organization: Lincoln University MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.00 beta 6) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Priority: normal Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi All My car wont Idle well under 1100 rpm. Car specs Ford SOHC 4cyl "pinto" engine Ported head Mild "turbo" cam said the wrecker I got the motor from....could be anything. 16th of an inch taken off the top of the pistons ( was a turbo engine, turbo died, saving dollars for the replacement ) Aftermarket old analog efi controller on it. ( Had 2" SU carb when the turbo was on) Nissan Silvia injectors (1800 cc turbo) I don't know the rating Toyota injection manifold. It has new spark plugs NGK AP5FS and new plug leads. I pulled the injector rail out and turned the key on, no leaky injector. I have an O2 sensor and the car runs well as long as you are over 1100rpm and It's reading above ~.7 any suggestions???? Simon ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Simon Quested (E-mail questeds@lincoln.ac.nz) Computer Technician, Silicon Graphics & Windows NT Support Centre for Computing and Biometrics LINCOLN UNIVERSITY OF NEW ZEALAND Phone (64)(03) 3252811 Ext. 8087 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ http://www.lincoln.ac.nz/ccb/techs/simon/default.htm ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I drive way too fast to worry about cholesterol ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 23:28:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA21625 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:28:29 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.anc.net (mail.anc.net [208.133.27.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA21620 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:28:28 -0500 Received: from terry-elliott (max01-ba-35.ba.anc.net [209.12.2.36]) by mail.anc.net (8.8.8/SCO5) with SMTP id WAA03063 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:28:27 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <00bf01bd5eb8$f5b4c460$05020cd1@terry-elliott> From: "Eric Elliott" To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:26:16 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello, The VATS defeat problem can be cured by your local alarm system installer. A resistor or a 555 timer chip are commonly used to defeat (make happy) VATS systems. Eric -----Original Message----- From: Jennifer and Brock Fraser To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 6:48 PM Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question >>From: Ron Tyler >>Date: Wed, 01 Apr 1998 20:27:11 +0000 >>Subject: LT1 EFI Question >> >>Hello All, >> >> I installed a '95 LT1 in my 240Z. I have removed EGR, air pump, >>canister purge valve, shift indicator lamp, and MIL. Everything else is >>intact. About 30 seconds after starting the car, the cooling fan >>activates. Is this some sort of quasi limp-home mode due to the missing >>components? The PCM *does* go into closed loop, so I am assuming that it >>isnt a full blown "limp". Would I be correct? >> >>TIA >>- -- >>Ron & Stephanie Tyler >>'72 LT1/T56 240Z >>http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg > > >Ron, > >I've got a twin-turbocharged LT1 in my Jaguar that runs on a '96 PCM. I >don't have any of the emissions-related equipment you mentioned on my car, >and my fans don't turn on after startup. (The fans are PCM controlled, as >in the factory f-body) If '96 can deal with these losses (with OBD-II >diags), then your '95 should. Come to think of it, I've used my '95 PCM in >the car with no fan errors as well... > >How did you defeat the VATS to be able to start the engine? There are >really only two possibilities... > >1. modify the PCM data (re-program) >2. used the factory "body" wiring, including ign. key cylinder and factory >key > >Assuming you didn't GUT OUT a F/B/Y car to get the body wiring, I guess >somebody re-programmed your PCM. I'd start there. The first sign of a >seriously un-happy PCM is a fan-on condition. > >There's one other thing puzzling me... You say that the fans turn on after >30 seconds. This is very odd. Usually the "I've lost my mind" PCM >condition turns on the fans upon key-on, i.e- engine not necessarily >running. In fact, that's the DIY_EFI insti-check for a clean programming >is "key-on, fans-no". > >The reason I mentioned the re-programming was that a programming error >(incomplete file, incompatible T&E side, etc) can make the car run "OK" but >have the fan-on condition. A 96/97 PCM will set a code (don't recall the >P-number) that indicates a calibration error... I don't recall if this >code is used in '95 or not. > >Does your scan tool indicate "FANS: YES" for the fan status? Of course, I >don't know what you are using for a scan tool. Make sure that the PCM is >really commanding the fans. Are both fans on? > >Besides the fans, how does the car run? Is the real-time data from your >scan tool reasonable? > >Good luck, >Brock > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 23:51:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA22235 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:51:36 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from tomcat.ns.net (root@tomcat.ns.net [209.162.64.15]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA22230 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:51:34 -0500 Received: from tbone.ns.net (pm04-14.sac.ns.net [209.162.64.127]) by tomcat.ns.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA08695 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 20:51:29 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <002801bd5ebb$e1786120$7f40a2d1@tbone.ns.net> From: "Tyson McPherson" To: Subject: Re: Projection Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 20:48:46 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello all, Yes, you can use the D or DI systems without the O2 sensor. Unpluging the O2 simply puts the system in open loop mode. Also, I will state again: the 502-20 digital two barrel system is idenitcal to the orginal 2bbl Pro-Jection system, with the exception that it is now digital and not analog. All adjustments are still made the same way, and it does not use a Map sensor or IAC. I have been on this list since last December. Most of what takes place here is above my level of knowledge, but I do find it very interesting. I subscribed to this list to learn more about EFI, and what is being done by people like yourself. I am an outside sale person for Holley Performance Products (northern California), and this has kept my experice limited to Pro-Jection only. If there is anything I can to help just let me know. Tyson tyson@ns.net www.holley.com -----Original Message----- From: Mike Jones To: 'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu' Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 8:26 AM Subject: RE: Projection >Andy, > >Can the 4Di be used without the O2 sensor? (I realize tuning becomes more >critical.) Due to water-cooled exhaust system my marine application makes >implementation of an O2 sensor difficult. (One possibility I thought of is >to tap into the currently blanked-off EGR port and run a seperate mini >exhaust, but this raises questions of its own, such as how much flow would >be required to give accurate feedback, where to discharge this exhaust, >etc. So for now no O2 sensor is my goal.) > >Holley is advertising a marine 4Di which should go on sale in a couple of >months. I've spoke with Holley tech twice. One rep said that the marine >4Di must use the O2 sensor and the other one said that it wasn't necessary. > Sadly typical for Holley. > >Thanks, > >Mike Jones > >>>Squash wrote: > >I have 2 4Di manuals. One is not released yet (i feel so special...). >If you would like a copy of that an the software, gimme a jingle. The >4Di uses a heated O2 sensor, by the way. I drive mine to work and all >over the place all the time, so i know it works! > >Andy Quaas>> > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 2 23:57:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA22387 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:57:08 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from tomcat.ns.net (root@tomcat.ns.net [209.162.64.15]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA22383 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:57:07 -0500 Received: from tbone.ns.net (pm04-14.sac.ns.net [209.162.64.127]) by tomcat.ns.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA09706 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 20:57:03 -0800 (PST) Message-ID: <003901bd5ebc$a8839460$7f40a2d1@tbone.ns.net> From: "Tyson McPherson" To: Subject: Re: Projection Date: Thu, 2 Apr 1998 20:54:59 -0800 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sorry about the spelling. I was typing and entertaining my one-year old son at the same time. Tyson tyson@ns.net -----Original Message----- From: Tyson McPherson To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 8:48 PM Subject: Re: Projection >Hello all, > >Yes, you can use the D or DI systems without the O2 sensor. Unpluging the O2 >simply puts the system in open loop mode. > >Also, I will state again: the 502-20 digital two barrel system is idenitcal >to the orginal 2bbl Pro-Jection system, with the exception that it is now >digital and not analog. All adjustments are still made the same way, and it >does not use a Map sensor or IAC. > >I have been on this list since last December. Most of what takes place here >is above my level of knowledge, but I do find it very interesting. I >subscribed to this list to learn more about EFI, and what is being done by >people like yourself. I am an outside sale person for Holley Performance >Products (northern California), and this has kept my experice limited to >Pro-Jection only. If there is anything I can to help just let me know. > >Tyson >tyson@ns.net >www.holley.com > > >-----Original Message----- >From: Mike Jones >To: 'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu' >Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 8:26 AM >Subject: RE: Projection > > >>Andy, >> >>Can the 4Di be used without the O2 sensor? (I realize tuning becomes more >>critical.) Due to water-cooled exhaust system my marine application makes >>implementation of an O2 sensor difficult. (One possibility I thought of is >>to tap into the currently blanked-off EGR port and run a seperate mini >>exhaust, but this raises questions of its own, such as how much flow would >>be required to give accurate feedback, where to discharge this exhaust, >>etc. So for now no O2 sensor is my goal.) >> >>Holley is advertising a marine 4Di which should go on sale in a couple of >>months. I've spoke with Holley tech twice. One rep said that the marine >>4Di must use the O2 sensor and the other one said that it wasn't necessary. >> Sadly typical for Holley. >> >>Thanks, >> >>Mike Jones >> >>>>Squash wrote: >> >>I have 2 4Di manuals. One is not released yet (i feel so special...). >>If you would like a copy of that an the software, gimme a jingle. The >>4Di uses a heated O2 sensor, by the way. I drive mine to work and all >>over the place all the time, so i know it works! >> >>Andy Quaas>> >> >> >> > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 00:33:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA23110 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 00:33:04 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA23105 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 00:33:02 -0500 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm303-165.mcn.net [208.26.146.165]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA05963 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 22:32:58 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <352471C1.C4EACB2A@mcn.net> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 22:21:05 -0700 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Prog 101 Update References: <01bd5e3a$1caa9f60$4e198fd1@nacelp> <3523A37A.D94C6DF0@mcn.net> <35247178.1B02@clarityconnect.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Scot Sealander wrote: > > Shannen Durphey wrote: > > > Knock retard is handled by the esc box mounted on the right > > side of the intake manifold. > > it intercepts computed timing signal from 747 > > That is incorrect. The ESC box only reports knock duration to the > ECM, and the ECM program handles knock. There is no EST connection to > the ESC box. > > Scot Sealander Sealand@clarityconnect.com Greater knowledge can never be obtained until one accepts that one hasn't a clue what they're talking about. I stand (humbly) corrected. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 01:44:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA23820 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 01:44:32 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA23816 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 01:44:29 -0500 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm303-165.mcn.net [208.26.146.165]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA22807 for ; Thu, 2 Apr 1998 23:44:27 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <35248284.3621BD92@mcn.net> Date: Thu, 02 Apr 1998 23:32:36 -0700 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: New User! References: <3.0.5.32.19980402121007.007aebc0@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > > Anyhoo, welcome aboard (and I was kidding about the dues :) > He sure was! They go to my address. nope. Just try to post something incorrect once in a while. You'll get to pay your dues. That was mentioned in good humour. :) > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > Homebrew Automotive Website: > http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HMMWV > 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car Shannen Durphey From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 03:05:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA24309 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 03:05:00 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from geocities.com (mail2.geocities.com [209.1.224.30]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA24305 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 03:04:59 -0500 Received: from Default (slper13p06.ozemail.com.au [203.108.46.7]) by geocities.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA18841 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 00:04:47 -0800 (PST) Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 00:04:47 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199804030804.AAA18841@geocities.com> X-Sender: dzorde@mail.geocities.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: dzorde@geocities.com (dzorde) Subject: Re: Idle probelm..... Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Howz the fuel pressure and vacuum during idle ? erratic ? Dan dzorde@geocities.com >Hi All > >My car wont Idle well under 1100 rpm. >Car specs >Ford SOHC 4cyl "pinto" engine >Ported head >Mild "turbo" cam said the wrecker I got the motor from....could be anything. >16th of an inch taken off the top of the pistons ( was a turbo engine, turbo died, >saving dollars for the replacement ) >Aftermarket old analog efi controller on it. ( Had 2" SU carb when the turbo was >on) >Nissan Silvia injectors (1800 cc turbo) I don't know the rating >Toyota injection manifold. > >It has new spark plugs NGK AP5FS and new plug leads. >I pulled the injector rail out and turned the key on, no leaky injector. >I have an O2 sensor and the car runs well as long as you are over 1100rpm and >It's reading above ~.7 > >any suggestions???? > >Simon >++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Simon Quested (E-mail questeds@lincoln.ac.nz) > Computer Technician, Silicon Graphics & Windows NT Support > Centre for Computing and Biometrics > LINCOLN UNIVERSITY OF NEW ZEALAND > Phone (64)(03) 3252811 Ext. 8087 >++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >http://www.lincoln.ac.nz/ccb/techs/simon/default.htm >++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >I drive way too fast to worry about cholesterol >++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 03:47:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA24706 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 03:47:26 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mailout04.btx.dtag.de (mailout04.btx.dtag.de [194.25.2.152]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id DAA24702 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 03:47:24 -0500 Received: from fwd12.btx.dtag.de (fwd12.btx.dtag.de [194.25.2.172]) by mailout04.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 0yL26r-0003Vk-00; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:46:01 +0200 Received: (091059380-0001(btxid)@[193.159.43.15]) by fwd12.btx.dtag.de id ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:45:46 +0200 Message-Id: Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:45:46 +0200 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu References: <933713F1FB7BD111AC2300A0C98F1AD17750B3@milxpr06.kla-tencor.com> Subject: Re: EPROM device used in Motronic BMW Motorcycles X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Sender: 091059380-0001@t-online.de From: wenning.motorsport@t-online.de (Alexander Wenning) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Buchholz, Steven schrieb: > Just a quick qusetion ... I was going to help someone by making a copy > of the EPROM in my stock Motronic bx on my BMW 16v, 1000cc K bike. > Anyone BTDT enough to know if the device is socketed or not and what > device type it is? TIA! Most BMW ECU´s have already a socket inside. The chip´s a 27C256 device. Regards Alex Wenning wenning.motorsport@t-online.de From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 03:47:58 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA24719 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 03:47:58 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id DAA24715 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 03:47:57 -0500 Received: from emerald.tufts.edu by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id DAA14857; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 03:47:57 -0500 Received: from tufts.edu (st1254.tc.tufts.edu) by emerald.tufts.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #23568) with ESMTP id <0EQT00B9PXRWCF@emerald.tufts.edu> for diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 03:47:57 -0500 (EST) Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 03:48:20 -0500 From: Andris Skulte Subject: SVO injectors To: DIY_EFI Message-id: <3524A254.BDC13AC5@tufts.edu> X-Envelope-to: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Before I go and blow up my DFI ECU, I'd like to doublecheck the resistance on the SVO injectors. Is it the high impedance type? DFI said as long as I run 16-18 ohm injectors, I'll be fine w/ 4 on one driver. If they aren't, poof! I'd love to put on a multimeter on the pins, but they are buried under the Super Ram intake, and I just don't feel like buying new gaskets, and also taking off rockers just to check this. I'm putting on the DFI tonight, and according to you guys, I can run 1.5-1.6ms pulsewidths at idle, so we'll see how things go. How do I know if I've gone past the too little pulsewidth stage? Any setup hints? DFI gave me a base program for a 305 on the ECU, but I have the CALMAP software to fix things (such as 30# injectors on a 300hp V8) TIA! Andris "gotta get back to (starting) studying bearings and gears at 3:45 am" Skulte From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 07:34:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA26250 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 07:34:38 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com (imo12.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA26245 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 07:34:18 -0500 Received: from ECMnut@aol.com by imo12.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8NSEa20222 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 07:33:44 -0500 (EST) From: ECMnut Message-ID: <62ff3d39.3524d72b@aol.com> Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 07:33:44 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: PROM holders Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mike, I'll take 50 if you'ree going to do it... Figure out a price w/shipping. You should make a litlle for handling, too. Thanks, Mike V From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 09:01:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA26856 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:01:21 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA26852 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:01:18 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-29.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.98]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id JAA19755 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:00:22 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: SVO injectors Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:00:52 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5f08$ea1ba7e0$62198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Andris Skulte To: DIY_EFI Date: Friday, April 03, 1998 4:19 AM Subject: SVO injectors >Before I go and blow up my DFI ECU, I'd like to doublecheck the >resistance on the SVO injectors. Is it the high impedance type? DFI said >as long as I run 16-18 ohm injectors, I'll be fine w/ 4 on one driver. Just measure the resistance at the ECM. Figure four 16 ohm injectors in parrarel, and you' know about what the min should be. Measure from the fuse thru the injectors to the ecm. Bruce I wish ecms had been designed different, and they had, that soothing orange glow. From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 09:58:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA27322 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:58:35 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA27318 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:58:33 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-29.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.98]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id JAA07383 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:57:38 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: File needed Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:58:09 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5f10$eabb49a0$62198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does anyone have a .bin for a Holden (Australian car) V-8, Auto using a 808?. Does anyone know anyone who might?. Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 10:01:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA27379 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:01:31 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.anc.net (mail.anc.net [208.133.27.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA27375 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:01:30 -0500 Received: from terry-elliott (max01-ba-40.ba.anc.net [209.12.2.41]) by mail.anc.net (8.8.8/SCO5) with SMTP id JAA00145 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:01:25 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002c01bd5f11$5de1be00$29020cd1@terry-elliott> From: "Eric Elliott" To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 08:11:21 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello, The old GMC pickup had a 1988 TBI EFI system, 1227747, PROM "AMUR". The new Ford has a PCM that I have found no information on except what is in the Electrical & Vacuum Manual. -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Plecan To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 11:06 PM Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question > Eric Elliott > > >>Hello, >>Older GMC ECMs diddled the EGR & looked at injector duration to se if EGR >>functioned. So it had to actually change AFR via EGR to pass test. Test was >>done after engine warm. >>My new 5.4 L measures EGR flow with a differential pressure transmitter. >>Another case where a resistor won't fool it. >>Eric > > >And perchance what ecm would be an example of that?.. >Bruce When taller Cone Shaped Hat are made, we'll > be wearing them here first at world HQ > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 10:40:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA28047 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:40:11 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dns2.anl.gov (dns2.anl.gov [146.139.254.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA28042 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:40:04 -0500 From: lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov Received: from smtpgate.anl.gov (smtpgate.anl.gov [146.137.96.36]) by dns2.anl.gov (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id JAA02092 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:40:04 -0600 (CST) Received: from ccMail by smtpgate.anl.gov (ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02) id AA891618003; Fri, 03 Apr 98 09:40:05 -0600 Message-Id: <9804038916.AA891618003@smtpgate.anl.gov> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Fri, 03 Apr 98 09:32:24 -0600 To: Subject: Re[2]: LT1 EFI Question MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The scan tool is an AutoXray Xp240. It does indicate "fan: on". The >realtime data seems reasonable. I am only running the primary fan. The >car seems to run very well, although slightly better somtimes. The one >thing that I have noticed that doesnt seem right (other than the fan) is >the idle seems to take a while to settle in. In other words, When you >start the car, It runs a low rpm (mabey 1100). As it warms, it raises to >as high as 1500. But even after the car is fully warmed, you come to a >stop, engage clutch, and its still idling 1300, and then slowly drops to >around 1000. By slowly, I mean several seconds. It never matches the >requested RPM. Are the requested RPM and engine RPM the same or no? There are *so* many things you can check, but just for the idle circuit the IAC motor, the P/N switch, the VSS, the Distributor Reference Signal (either high or low resolution), etc. If the scan tool is indicating a requested 900 rpm, yet it is idling higher...I'd check the VSS/PN circuit first. Did the PCM come out of an auto or manual trans car? If it was from an auto, you will need to get it flashed for the manual program. In this case, if the PCM gets a VSS signal, it will raise the idle to prevent stalling. Later, Larry From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 10:53:12 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA28265 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:53:12 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA28260 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:53:10 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-29.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.98]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id KAA25024 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:52:14 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:52:43 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5f18$89d2f680$62198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Eric Elliott Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question >Hello, >The old GMC pickup had a 1988 TBI EFI system, 1227747, PROM "AMUR". >The new Ford has a PCM that I have found no information on except what is in >the Electrical & Vacuum Manual. >>>Hello, >>>Older GMC ECMs diddled the EGR & looked at injector duration to se if EGR >>>functioned. So it had to actually change AFR via EGR to pass test. Test was done after engine warm.My new 5.4 L measures EGR flow with a differential pressure transmitter. >>>Another case where a resistor won't fool it. >>>Eric >> >>And perchance what ecm would be an example of that?.. >>Bruce > Kinda funny in a way, what I did on a EGR Coding TBI was use the EGR lead wire to trigger a voltage divider (resistor bridge) on the MAP signal to stop the coding. I thought the ECM was looking for a MAP signal change to see if it was working, never thought it was looking for a injector pulse change. It did get rid of the coding thou. Bruce I'm sure glad my Cone Shaped Hat covers the bruises from beating my head against the wall...... From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 10:55:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA28321 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:55:48 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.anc.net (mail.anc.net [208.133.27.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA28316 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:55:43 -0500 Received: from terry-elliott (max01-ba-19.ba.anc.net [209.12.2.20]) by mail.anc.net (8.8.8/SCO5) with SMTP id JAA08919 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:55:40 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000601bd5f18$f3ae9280$14020cd1@terry-elliott> From: "Eric Elliott" To: Subject: Project 101?? Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:54:27 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello, Don't know what is project 101, haven't screened the recent archives, but would yall like dumps of PROMS for a 1227747 for a 1988 210 HP TBI system? If yall want them, I'll search for a reader & post them. Or if that isn't easy, will mail some EPROMs to some one that has a reader. Every 2732 & 2764 PROM that I have tried worked OK in my old 1227747 system. Even the Radio Shack PROM. Also I have a 16134847 ECM containing SMD and QFP parts on a single board, no recognizable CPU number & no PROM in a DIP. It is plug compatible with my 1227747 ECM and was intended for a ?? Perhaps this is a standard replacement unit to be programmed before use. Does some one have a need for this? Eric From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 10:59:14 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA28388 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:59:14 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from horizon.hit.net (rah@horizon.hit.net [206.252.160.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA28384 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:59:12 -0500 Received: (from rah@localhost) by horizon.hit.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) id KAA09788 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:44:46 -0600 (CST) From: Roger Heflin Message-Id: <199804031644.KAA09788@horizon.hit.net> Subject: Re: Re[2]: LT1 EFI Question To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 10:44:46 -0600 (CST) In-Reply-To: <9804038916.AA891618003@smtpgate.anl.gov> from "lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov" at Apr 3, 98 09:32:24 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > > > > The scan tool is an AutoXray Xp240. It does indicate "fan: on". The > >realtime data seems reasonable. I am only running the primary fan. The > >car seems to run very well, although slightly better somtimes. The one > >thing that I have noticed that doesnt seem right (other than the fan) is > >the idle seems to take a while to settle in. In other words, When you > >start the car, It runs a low rpm (mabey 1100). As it warms, it raises to > >as high as 1500. But even after the car is fully warmed, you come to a > >stop, engage clutch, and its still idling 1300, and then slowly drops to > >around 1000. By slowly, I mean several seconds. It never matches the > >requested RPM. > > Are the requested RPM and engine RPM the same or no? There are *so* > many things you can check, but just for the idle circuit the IAC > motor, the P/N switch, the VSS, the Distributor Reference Signal > (either high or low resolution), etc. If the scan tool is indicating a > requested 900 rpm, yet it is idling higher...I'd check the VSS/PN > circuit first. Did the PCM come out of an auto or manual trans car? If > it was from an auto, you will need to get it flashed for the manual > program. In this case, if the PCM gets a VSS signal, it will raise the > idle to prevent stalling. > > Later, > > Larry > > > On top of what larry said, check the value of IAC, idling out of gear it should be fairly low. This controls the air that bypasses the main throttle body and is how the car controls idle. It this value is 0 it means the TB is open too far at idle. There is a set screw to adjust this. Also if there is a large enough cam in the engine it is really difficult to get it down to a low idle. My idle is currently set at 850 (out of gear) and 800 in gear, and cannot seem to get the idle down that far. Stock with an auto the computer will request somewhere around 650 out of gear, and 550 in gear. If it is requesting much higher that it was probably repogrammed. Roger Heflin From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 12:18:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA29961 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:18:02 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lsi.lsil.com (lsi.lsil.com [147.145.40.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA29956 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:17:59 -0500 Received: from mhbs.lsil.com ([147.145.29.36]) by lsi.lsil.com with ESMTP id JAA15713 (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:17:52 -0800 Received: from mms10.lsil.com by mhbs.lsil.com; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 09:17:51 -0800 Received: from mm104.minn by mms10 (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id LAA08070; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 11:16:25 -0600 Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 11:16:25 -0600 From: mdill@lsil.com (Mike Dillon) Message-Id: <199804031716.LAA08070@mms10> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: PROM holders Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Mike, Your second on the list. as a guess shipping and handling, would be in the $3-$5, On the low side if I have a box that will work on the high side if I have to buy some boxes. For the two requests I have I can dig up a couple of boxes, I was worried about having 50 requests for 3-4 carriers, at which point shipping would be more problematic. Mike D. > From diy_efi-owner@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Fri Apr 3 07:38 CST 1998 > From: ECMnut > > Mike, > I'll take 50 if you'ree going to do it... > Figure out a price w/shipping. > You should make a litlle for handling, too. > Thanks, > Mike V > > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 12:26:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA30121 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:26:17 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ds9.symtx.com (ds9.symtx.com [38.242.16.12]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA30116 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:26:15 -0500 Received: by ds9 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id <2GNWXH4P>; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 11:26:12 -0600 Message-ID: <47D5AD54221AD111873F00600831A35B13201B@ds9> From: Greg Woods To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Marine FI was RE: Projection Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 11:26:10 -0600 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Can the 4Di be used without the O2 sensor? (I realize tuning becomes more > critical.) Due to water-cooled exhaust system my marine application makes > implementation of an O2 sensor difficult. ..... > So for now no O2 sensor is my goal.) > > Holley is advertising a marine 4Di which should go on sale in a couple of > months. I've spoke with Holley tech twice. One rep said that the marine > 4Di must use the O2 sensor and the other one said that it wasn't necessary. > Sadly typical for Holley. > > Thanks, > > Mike Jones Mike, I also have a marine engine with a wet exhaust. It's a 4.3L mercruiser which is basically a marinized GM 4.3L. I've been thinking about how I could use a standard 4.3L GM TBI and ECM on this. I'd have no O2, no EGR, no Smog pump and no spark distributer control:(. The marine 4Di system sounds kind of tempting, but I'd like to try and go the lower cost (junk yard available) route of the GM stuff. Does anyone have any thoughts about how I might adapt a GM ECM for this type of situation? Will it run without all the above mentioned hooked up? Greg Woods gwoods@symtx.com Austin, TX back into lurk mode.... From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 12:53:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA30609 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:53:38 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA30604 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:53:35 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-29.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.98]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id MAA02718 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:52:41 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Project 101?? Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:53:11 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5f29$5df86660$62198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Eric Elliott >Hello, >Don't know what is project 101, haven't screened the recent archives, About identifing as many addresses on a 1227747 and going from there. but would yall like dumps of PROMS for a 1227747 for a 1988 210 HP TBI system? Bins and Broadcast codes would be fine, thank you >If yall want them, I'll search for a reader & post them. Or if that isn't >easy, will mail some EPROMs to some one that has a reader. nacelp@bright.net > >Also I have a 16134847 ECM containing SMD and QFP parts on a single board, >no recognizable CPU number & no PROM in a DIP. It is plug compatible with my >1227747 ECM and was intended for a ?? '92 Chev 2.2 eng code 4 Beretta types >Eric > No worries mate Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 12:59:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA30725 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:59:25 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.cgocable.net (mail.cgocable.net [24.226.1.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA30721 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:59:24 -0500 Received: from cgocable.net (cgowave-26-13.cgocable.net [24.226.26.13]) by mail.cgocable.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id MAA29926 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:59:28 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <35254F3A.67A4D476@cgocable.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 13:06:02 -0800 From: Emmett Stanicki X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu" Subject: [Fwd: Returned mail: User unknown] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I tried to Email this and it bounced, so I thought I would try tr list since I got te address from DIY EFI member list. Mail Delivery Subsystem wrote: > The original message was received at Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:54:23 -0500 (EST) > from cgowave-26-13.cgocable.net [24.226.26.13] > > ----- The following addresses had permanent fatal errors ----- > > > ----- Transcript of session follows ----- > ... while talking to ixmail9.ix.netcom.com.: > >>> RCPT To: > <<< 550 ... User unknown > 550 ... User unknown > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > Reporting-MTA: dns; mail.cgocable.net > Received-From-MTA: DNS; cgowave-26-13.cgocable.net > Arrival-Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:54:23 -0500 (EST) > > Final-Recipient: RFC822; karwood@ix.netcom.com > Action: failed > Status: 5.1.1 > Remote-MTA: DNS; ixmail9.ix.netcom.com > Diagnostic-Code: SMTP; 550 ... User unknown > Last-Attempt-Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:54:27 -0500 (EST) > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > Subject: EEC > Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 13:00:57 -0800 > From: Emmett Stanicki > To: karwood@ix.netcom.com > > Hi > I just seen your name on the DIY EFI list members info. > I'm just getting started in decoding the Ford EEC-IV ECU and also A > friend asked me about building a data collector for his Funny car. > I was thinking I could use the Ford ECU to collect data once I figured > out to program it. > Well as you probably know its not that simple. > Is there a lot of work in building a data collector like you have and > would you sell one? > Any and all info and advice welcome. > Thank you and Take care- Emmett From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 13:05:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA30892 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:05:47 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.cgocable.net (mail.cgocable.net [24.226.1.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA30888 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:05:46 -0500 Received: from cgocable.net (cgowave-26-13.cgocable.net [24.226.26.13]) by mail.cgocable.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id NAA01568 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:05:50 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <352550B8.6E31F85D@cgocable.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 13:12:24 -0800 From: Emmett Stanicki X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: EEC-IV References: <199804031716.LAA08070@mms10> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm trying to learn and decode Ford EEC-IV . Does anyone have any Europe. Aussie or other foreign .bin files or info as Ive heard they are different from North American? I have a few ECU's that I'm working on now and starting to read, decode them. Thank you - Emmett From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 13:08:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA30996 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:08:48 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from itt-bh.ittauto.com (itt-bh.ittauto.com [199.92.116.66]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA30992 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:08:47 -0500 From: Sean_Meldrum@ittauto.com Received: (from uucp@localhost) by itt-bh.ittauto.com (8.6.12/8.6.11) id NAA27597 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:08:48 -0500 Received: from 172.16.1.3 by itt-bh.ittauto.com via smap (3.2) id xma027511; Fri, 3 Apr 98 13:08:24 -0500 Received: by (Lotus SMTP MTA SMTP v4.6 (462.2 9-3-1997)) id 852565DB.0063A428 ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:08:20 -0500 X-Lotus-FromDomain: ITTA To: DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-ID: <852565DB.00627725.00@> Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 13:06:24 -0500 Subject: New to the list and a question. Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello all. New to the DIY-EFI list and have a question (I don't have net access here at work so I hope this isn't covered in an archive...if so, my apologies). I have a module designed to allow the removal of the catalytic converter (for dragstrip use) on my '97 Dodge Dakota 5.2L. I checked the output of the #2 O2 sensor and measured approx. 40 mV. The module is simply a voltage divider that modifies the output to about 9-10% of the mV coming into the module. This would bring an ave. 450mV signal (since the cat is gone it reads like the front O2 sensor) and output the 40mV, thus not tripping the CEL. Am I on the right track here or is there something I'm missing? Thanks in advance for any help. *******97 RPM Dakota - 14.98 @ 91.76******* sean meldrum Email @ Work: sean_meldrum@ittauto.com Homepage: http://surf.to/real-per4mance **************************************************** From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 14:11:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA32182 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 14:11:51 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA32178 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 14:11:48 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id OAA00327; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 14:11:47 -0500 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAC00266 for ; Fri, 03 Apr 1998 14:11:23 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 14:11:23 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804031911.OAC00266@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980403140940.007ae200@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 14:09:40 -0800 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: EEC-IV In-Reply-To: <352550B8.6E31F85D@cgocable.net> References: <199804031716.LAA08070@mms10> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >I'm trying to learn and decode Ford EEC-IV . >Does anyone have any Europe. Aussie or other foreign .bin files or info >as Ive heard they are different from North American? How many would you like? I was given "80MB" of some kind of ECM code binaries for all of the Ford ECMs from 198x to 1995, and all they do is sit there. I haven't made them available because I didn't think anyone wanted to download an 80MB zip file, and I didn't have 250MB of space on my server (uncompressed). They aren't very sorted, but you are welcome to play with them. I haven't really put the effort into figuring out exactly what is there. Is this of any value to the group or no? Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 14:19:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA32330 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 14:19:28 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA32326 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 14:19:27 -0500 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm302-075.mcn.net [208.26.146.75]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA10288 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 12:19:25 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <35253370.2CE2F042@mcn.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 12:07:28 -0700 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Marine FI was RE: Projection References: <47D5AD54221AD111873F00600831A35B13201B@ds9> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Greg Woods wrote: > > > I also have a marine engine with a wet exhaust. It's a 4.3L mercruiser > which is basically a marinized GM 4.3L. I've been thinking about how I > could use > a standard 4.3L GM TBI and ECM on this. I'd have no O2, no EGR, no > Smog pump and no spark distributer control:(. The marine 4Di system > sounds kind of tempting, but I'd like to try and go the lower cost (junk > yard available) route of the GM stuff. > > Does anyone have any thoughts about how I might adapt a GM ECM > for this type of situation? Will it run without all the above mentioned > hooked up? > > Greg Woods gwoods@symtx.com Austin, TX > back into lurk mode.... I've worked on two mercruiser 4.3 engines, one 4bbl, one 2bbl. They used non-gm distributors, Ford ignition systems, had non gm roller cams. ECM can be installed and made to run without too much trouble, but my 2 cents worth is to keep it carb'ed and simple. Don't know how big the lakes are where you are, but we can and have been a long way from shore and people when the boat broke down. Not fun. One item to note would be that the ecm usually used with the 4.3, the 1227747, is designed to be mounted inside a vehicle and is not watertight. Have fun, whatever you do. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 15:06:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA00249 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 15:06:34 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.33]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA00245 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 15:06:32 -0500 Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.69.1.222]) by mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with ESMTP id AAA198 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 20:06:01 +0000 Message-ID: <35254127.1934A7E1@worldnet.att.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 15:05:59 -0500 From: Thomas Matthews X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: PROM holders References: <199804031716.LAA08070@mms10> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mike- could I get 25 of these or are all of them spoken for? Tom as a guess shipping and handling, would be in the $3-$5, On the low side if I have a box that will work on the high side if I have to buy some boxes. For the two requests I have I can dig up a couple of boxes, I was worried about having 50 requests for 3-4 carriers, at which point shipping would be more problematic. Mike D. From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 15:39:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA00645 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 15:39:33 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.cgocable.net (mail.cgocable.net [24.226.1.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA00641 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 15:39:30 -0500 Received: from cgocable.net (cgowave-26-13.cgocable.net [24.226.26.13]) by mail.cgocable.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id PAA10454 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 15:39:36 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <352574C4.36FEFAD7@cgocable.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 15:46:13 -0800 From: Emmett Stanicki X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC-IV References: <199804031716.LAA08070@mms10> <3.0.5.32.19980403140940.007ae200@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > I was given "80MB" of some kind of ECM code binaries for all of the Ford > ECMs from 198x to 1995, and all they do is sit there. I haven't made them > available because I didn't think anyone wanted to download an 80MB zip > file, and I didn't have 250MB of space on my server (uncompressed). They > aren't very sorted, but you are welcome to play with them. I haven't > really put the effort into figuring out exactly what is there. > Sure I'd like a copy. How were can I get it? Thank you very much. From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 16:00:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA00955 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:00:20 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo28.mx.aol.com (imo28.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.72]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA00951 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:00:18 -0500 Received: from TWright669@aol.com by imo28.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8LSQa19782 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 15:59:43 -0500 (EST) From: TWright669 Message-ID: <7c061779.35254dc0@aol.com> Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 15:59:43 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Carl Summers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hey, Carl Summers, are you out there? Did anyone else order a Haltech from Carl Summers? More importantly, has anyone else RECEIVED a Haltech from him? His email and phone have been disconnected. And he did not return my calls when his phone WAS connected. Luckily, I've got myself covered financially, but if your out there Carl, you had BETTER give me a call, or else you will be getting one (where ever you are) and you will be WISHING it was from me (cuz it wont be). Mail fraud is a Federal offense. If there was a mix up, I apologize, but it is fairly irresponsable of you to turn off your phone and not let people know what is going on. Tom From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 16:37:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA01495 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:37:20 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from zed.ludd.luth.se (zed.ludd.luth.se [130.240.16.33]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA01490 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:37:17 -0500 Received: from sister.ludd.luth.se (rotax@sister.ludd.luth.se [130.240.16.77]) by zed.ludd.luth.se (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA28328 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:37:16 +0200 From: "Daniel R. Henriksson" Received: (rotax@localhost) by sister.ludd.luth.se (8.6.11/8.6.11) id XAA16162 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:37:15 +0200 Message-Id: <199804032137.XAA16162@sister.ludd.luth.se> Subject: Motronic switch? To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:37:15 +0200 (MET DST) In-Reply-To: <352574C4.36FEFAD7@cgocable.net> from Emmett Stanicki at "Apr 3, 98 03:46:13 pm" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL15 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I've got a Motronic box 0 261 200 012 in my Volvo 760 Turbo. A CDP1802 based box, with a 2732 ROM chip. Does anyone know how to alter the rev limiter? Inside it i found a blue 8-position switch. What does the switch do? /Daniel Henriksson From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 16:38:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA01531 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:38:24 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo23.mx.aol.com (imo23.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.67]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA01527 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:38:23 -0500 Received: from TWright669@aol.com by imo23.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8UDIa07411 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:37:48 -0500 (EST) From: TWright669 Message-ID: <2e19d2c6.352556af@aol.com> Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:37:48 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: SVO injectors Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Coincidently enough, I just bought some 24# Ford Motorsport SVO injectors and recieved them 2 days ago. I just put a multimeter on them and came up with 14.8 ohms. They are a good deal aren't they!? They were only $25 a piece. I cant get my old ones rebuilt that cheaply, and now I have a bunch of spares to boot! Tom From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 17:15:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA02315 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:15:16 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from palrel3.hp.com (palrel3.hp.com [156.153.255.226]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA02308 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:15:10 -0500 From: DAVE_HEMPSTEAD@HP-Andover-om3.om.hp.com Received: from andom1.an.hp.com (andom1.an.hp.com [15.4.128.104]) by palrel3.hp.com (8.8.5/8.8.5tis) with ESMTP id OAA15184 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 14:15:07 -0800 (PST) Received: from localhost (root@localhost) by andom1.an.hp.com with SMTP (8.7.1/8.7.3 TIS 5.0 Openmail) id RAA25471 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:15:07 -0500 (EST) X-OpenMail-Hops: 1 Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:14:56 -0500 Message-Id: Subject: LT-1 questions from a beginner MIME-Version: 1.0 TO: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu CC: HEMPSTEAD_DAVE/HP-Andover_om3@andom1.an.hp.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; name="cc:Mail" Content-Disposition: inline; filename="cc:Mail" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi, I've been a member of this digest for some time now, but haven't been paying a whole lot of attention (my fault, not enough time in the day :-). I've seen recent posts regarding LT1 engines and I could use some advice and help. If my questions are too long or too detailed, I'll be glad to send email offline to the 'experts'. I've got a LT1 and 4L60E trans from a '96 Impala SS. I'm putting these into my '34 Ford street rod . I've talked with John Spears (found through the NAISSO digest). He has swapped my '96 PCM for a '95 Camare PCM and selected a speedometer calibration from the possible Camaro selections to nearly match my rear end and tire size. I'm running one O2 sensor on each side of the exhaust, headers, no catalytic converter (the car remains registered as a 1934 model :-). Here are my questions: 1. I've been told my pair of knock sensors will not work with the '95 PCM. I need a Camaro knock sensor, and I need only one. Is this true? 2. The headers will force me to move the knock sensor. Can I relocate it in the block? Does it matter which side I put it on? General question: I'm sure I will need a scan tool. How expensive are they? I have an electrical engineering background, can I build one myself? Is it RS-232 based? I'm sure this will be a critical tool for me. 3. I've removed the AIR pump and the gas canister. Can I disable the trouble codes for these? Or, can I fake the PCM to think that they are present? 4. I've read about the VAT. I think I can build up a 555 circuit to fake it. 5. For space reasons (the '34 engine compartment is VERY tight) I may need to remove the MAF. Is this a mistake???? 6. For the same reasons, I may need to remove the EGR. Is this a mistake??? 7. Should I assume that I will need to buy a PCM programmer to customize my setup? I know that they are expensive. I think I have access to a scan tool at a friend's shop, but I think I'll really need my own. If I also need a programmer, I'm on my own there. Thanks in advance, Dave Hempstead dave_hempstead@hp.com '34 Ford Sedan Andover, Massachusetts From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 17:16:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA02341 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:16:05 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA02337 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:16:04 -0500 Received: from bullwinkle (du183-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.5.183]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id OAA26769 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 14:16:02 -0800 Message-Id: <199804032216.OAA26769@mail.wgn.net> X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 14:19:03 -0800 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Subject: Re: Carl Summers In-Reply-To: <7c061779.35254dc0@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id RAA02338 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I got mine, and spoke with a while ago before I sent a check. So I'm not sure what's up. Sandy At 03:59 PM 4/3/98 -0500, you wrote: >Hey, Carl Summers, are you out there? >Did anyone else order a Haltech from Carl Summers? >More importantly, has anyone else RECEIVED a Haltech from him? >His email and phone have been disconnected.  And he did not return my calls >when his phone WAS connected. >Luckily, I've got myself covered financially, but if your out there Carl, you >had BETTER give me a call, or else you will be getting one (where ever you >are) and you will be WISHING it was from me (cuz it wont be).  Mail fraud is a >Federal offense. >If there was a mix up, I apologize, but it is fairly irresponsable of you to >turn off your phone and not let people know what is going on. > >Tom > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 17:47:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA03097 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:47:41 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo20.mx.aol.com (imo20.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.42]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA03093 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:47:38 -0500 Received: from TWright669@aol.com by imo20.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8AGYa04943 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:47:02 -0500 (EST) From: TWright669 Message-ID: <5595f798.352566ea@aol.com> Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:47:02 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Carl Summers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA03454 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:01:51 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from UPIMSSMTPUSR03 (smtp.email.msn.com [207.68.143.159]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA03450 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:01:49 -0500 Received: from default - 208.254.255.172 by email.msn.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 15:01:10 -0800 Message-ID: <002e01bd5f54$94eb92c0$acfffed0@default> From: "David" To: Subject: Automotive Applications Handbook for 67F687 and 67F6612 Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:02:00 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Greetings all, I just finished scanning the Automotive Applications Handbook for 67F687 and 67F6612. Where do I put the collections of files? Thanks for the opportunity to help. David Edwards From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 18:03:49 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA03499 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:03:49 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo25.mx.aol.com (imo25.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.69]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA03492 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:03:47 -0500 Received: from TWright669@aol.com by imo25.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8HVUa10381 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:03:09 -0500 (EST) From: TWright669 Message-ID: <932ae1ca.35256aaf@aol.com> Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:03:09 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Carl Summers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu P.S. Sorry to the rest of you for making veiled threats over your mailing list, but I was pissed and freaked out after finding a bunch of returned email and the "this line has been disconnected" message when try to call and find out whats up. Also, very disappointed in myself for (potentially) falling for this. Tom From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 18:11:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA03659 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:11:04 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com [198.133.22.42]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA03655 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:11:03 -0500 Received: from relay1.server.ibm.com (relay1.server.ibm.com [9.14.2.98]) by smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA41376 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:04:33 -0500 Received: from US.IBM.COM (d03lms05.boulder.ibm.com [9.99.80.15]) by relay1.server.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA14786 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:08:55 -0500 Received: by US.IBM.COM (Soft-Switch LMS 2.1.0.0) with snapi via D03AU045 id 5030050008499267; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:11:08 -0500 From: Kevin Vannorsdel To: Subject: Re: Carl Summers Message-ID: <5030050008499267000002L572*@MHS> Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:11:08 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id SAA03656 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I had some dealings with Carl a while back. I doubt very much that he scammed you. He was very helpful to me and has contributed to this list and its members a number of times over the past few months.... matter of fact he went quite out of his way for me once... I really appreciated that. I recommend giving him the benefit of the doubt- maybe he has come into some bad fortune lately... maybe he could use a little slack. Humbly submitted, ________________________________________________ Kevin Vannorsdel IBM Arm Electronics Development 408-256-6492 Tie 276-6492 kv@us.ibm.com owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu on 04/03/98 03:01:17 PM Please respond to diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: Subject: Re: Carl Summers Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA03865 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:16:15 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA03861 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:16:14 -0500 Received: from quartz.ucs.ualberta.ca by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id SAA06375; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:16:15 -0500 Received: from gpu1.srv.ualberta.ca (gpu1.srv.ualberta.ca [129.128.98.10]) by quartz.ucs.ualberta.ca (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA15446 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:16:14 -0700 Received: from localhost (mbeaubie@localhost) by gpu1.srv.ualberta.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA50462 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:16:13 -0700 Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:16:12 -0700 (MST) From: Matt Beaubien X-Sender: mbeaubie@gpu1.srv.ualberta.ca To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: HEI timing jump In-Reply-To: <199710281000.KAA23686@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi all, There was some discussion a little while ago about how certain HEI modules will suddenly advance the timing when not connected to the ECM. I would like to use a couple of these on a motorcycle engine that has a missing timing box. It has two Hall-effect pickups and a coil pack. I could just use a standard module but the thing would be hard to start with the proper amount of advance. My question is what module do I need exactly? A couple were mentioned but I'm not sure which I need. Also, how does it get wired? Thanks. Matt Beaubien mbeaubie@gpu.srv.ualberta.ca 3 x 510's 1 x 300ZXT 1 x Civic 1200 From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 18:18:46 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA03968 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:18:46 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA03963 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:18:45 -0500 Received: from bullwinkle (du206-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.5.206]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id PAA01336 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 15:18:44 -0800 Message-Id: <199804032318.PAA01336@mail.wgn.net> X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 15:21:45 -0800 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Subject: Re: Carl Summers In-Reply-To: <932ae1ca.35256aaf@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id SAA03964 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just seems very strange, as I have a F3 sitting here, but yes, the email bounced, and I tossed his phone number after I got the package. A bit on the odd side. I think all the units were spoken for, so I wonder who else may have got burned or got the F3's? Just ODD, and it would bumm me out to have this happen, as I have had very good luck with Internet buying and selling. Sandy At 06:03 PM 4/3/98 -0500, you wrote: >P.S. >Sorry to the rest of you for making veiled threats over your mailing list, but >I was pissed and freaked out after finding a bunch of returned email and the >"this line has been disconnected" message when try to call and find out whats >up.  Also, very disappointed in myself for (potentially) falling for this. > >Tom > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 18:25:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA04270 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:25:22 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imes.com ([209.184.4.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA04265 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:25:20 -0500 Received: from elvis by imes.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id RAA10773; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 17:27:04 -0600 Message-ID: <352526D5.299D@imes.com> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 18:13:41 +0000 From: steve ravet Organization: International Meta Systems X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT-1 questions from a beginner References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu DAVE_HEMPSTEAD@HP-Andover-om3.om.hp.com wrote: > 2. The headers will force me to move the knock sensor. Can I relocate it in > the block? Does it matter which side I put it on? For my S-10 V8 conversion I moved it from the block to a hole I drilled and tapped in the motor mount. The JTR swap manual said it was fine, and as far as I know it is... > > > General question: I'm sure I will need a scan tool. How expensive are > they? I have an electrical engineering background, can I build one myself? Is > it RS-232 based? I'm sure this will be a critical tool for me. If yours has an ALDL connector, you can pretty easily make your own scan tool to read the data. It's an unusual baud rate, 8192. The problem is decoding the data packet that comes out. Seems like every ECM uses a different size frame, and all the bytes mean different things. There's lots and lots of ALDL info in the archives, spend a weekend or so browsing and you'll come up with lots of stuff. Can't help with the rest.... --steve -- Steve Ravet International Meta Systems http://www.imes.com steve@imes.com From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 18:47:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA04677 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:47:00 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA04672 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:46:57 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-23.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.41]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id SAA09373 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:46:03 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Carl Summers Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:46:29 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5f5a$b9307d20$29198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: TWright669 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Friday, April 03, 1998 6:34 PM Subject: Re: Carl Summers >P.S. >Sorry to the rest of you for making veiled threats over your mailing list, but >I was pissed and freaked out after finding a bunch of returned email and the >"this line has been disconnected" message when try to call and find out whats >up. Also, very disappointed in myself for (potentially) falling for this. > >Tom For what it is worth he has been a huge help in the initial phases of Programming 101. I'm more worried about his well being... Bruce CSH HQ From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 19:05:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA04925 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 19:05:01 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA04921 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 19:04:59 -0500 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn41-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.200]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA05022 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 19:01:43 -0500 Message-ID: <35257940.78DD@huron.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 19:05:20 -0500 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Marine FI was RE: Projection References: <47D5AD54221AD111873F00600831A35B13201B@ds9> <35253370.2CE2F042@mcn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Shannen Durphey wrote: > Don't know how big the lakes > are where you are, but we can and have been a long way from > shore and people when the boat broke down. Not fun. A simple carburetor and point ignition is not foolproof either - as I found out about 3 miles out from Murray Harbour PEI one warm summer day in 1973 - and again on the Chobe river in Botswana southern Africa about a year later. Got to the point I didn't want to be in a boat more than jumping distance from shore. One reason I'm not too thrilled about 2 strokers in aircraft - I can swim a bit, but my arms get tired when I try to fly!! I know you guys are talking 4 stroke, automotive derived marine engines, but the point still holds. In many cases I'd rather trust electronics - a ludite I am not. > > One item to note would be that the ecm usually used with the > 4.3, the 1227747, is designed to be mounted inside a vehicle > and is not watertight. > > Have fun, whatever you do. > Shannen -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 19:20:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA05298 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 19:20:20 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA05294 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 19:20:19 -0500 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn27-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.186]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA07175 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 19:17:37 -0500 Message-ID: <35257CFB.6428@huron.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 19:21:15 -0500 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: HEI timing jump References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Matt Beaubien wrote: > > Hi all, > > There was some discussion a little while ago about how certain HEI modules > will suddenly advance the timing when not connected to the ECM. I would like > to use a couple of these on a motorcycle engine that has a missing timing > box. It has two Hall-effect pickups and a coil pack. I could just use a > standard module but the thing would be hard to start with the proper amount > of advance. > > My question is what module do I need exactly? A couple were mentioned but > I'm not sure which I need. Also, how does it get wired? > > Thanks. > > Matt Beaubien > mbeaubie@gpu.srv.ualberta.ca > 3 x 510's > 1 x 300ZXT > 1 x Civic 1200 >From what I figured out, will not give you advance with hall sensors as they are strictly a switch. The advance appears to be a result of the "trigger voltage" being reached more quickly at higher rotational speeds. Sorry the news is not better. -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 20:11:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA05984 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 20:11:18 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.hutchtel.net (ns1.hutchtel.net [206.9.112.100]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA05980 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 20:11:16 -0500 Received: from chiasson (hutch-228.hutchtel.net [206.9.112.63]) by ns1.hutchtel.net (8.8.8/8.8.3) with ESMTP id TAA26062 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 19:10:23 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199804040110.TAA26062@ns1.hutchtel.net> From: "Joe Chiasson" To: Subject: Re: Compressed Natural Gas Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 19:06:23 -0600 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > The high octane rating of CNG has got me thinking about > using it over methanol when running in a boost state. > This should allow a high compression ratio for non-boost conditions > when running on gasoline, such as freeway crusing, > and then flow the CNG when the boost comes in. > Only a small tank of CNG would be needed, not some heavy monster tank. > If the CNG runs out, just wastegate out the boost until you get home > to fill it up again from the public-utility natural gas supply > running off your CNG compressor. Sounds like a plan to me! > Are the electronically controlled CNG regulators? > > -Kelly Murray kem@franz.com > http://www.htrd.com/kem/efi.html -- needs up now for CNG! 1 gallon of CNG stored under 2400 psi gets you about 22% of the energy of 1 gallon gasoline. 3600 psi gets you about 33%. If you make you tank too small you will be making alot of trips back home. But if your just looking for a few passes on the strip it would be a cool idea. Methane has a RON of 120, while methanol has a RON of ~109 and a MON of ~89 (at least form some of the literature i've read). There is also LNG where I have read you can get upto 67% of gasoline gallon equivalence. j. From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 20:50:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA06515 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 20:50:21 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA06505 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 20:50:16 -0500 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp42.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.172]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id TAA26521 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 19:50:35 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <35258FD4.1DF15F34@mwt.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 19:41:42 -0600 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Carl is out there Re: Carl Summers X-Priority: 1 (Highest) References: <7c061779.35254dc0@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu TO All Carl is out there and is waiting for checks for about 5 boxes and cut the money to close on getting the boxes and they shut off his internet service and will not be on till monday and will be back on the net. If you guys want the boxes you need to get money in the mail you know who you are. Steven Gorkowski TWright669 wrote: > Hey, Carl Summers, are you out there? > Did anyone else order a Haltech from Carl Summers? > More importantly, has anyone else RECEIVED a Haltech from him? > His email and phone have been disconnected. And he did not return my > calls > when his phone WAS connected. > Luckily, I've got myself covered financially, but if your out there > Carl, you > had BETTER give me a call, or else you will be getting one (where ever > you > are) and you will be WISHING it was from me (cuz it wont be). Mail > fraud is a > Federal offense. > If there was a mix up, I apologize, but it is fairly irresponsable of > you to > turn off your phone and not let people know what is going on. > > Tom From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 21:11:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA06827 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:11:59 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA06821 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:11:49 -0500 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp42.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.172]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id UAA28785 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 20:12:09 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <35259545.2A0C9E52@mwt.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 20:04:54 -0600 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: File needed X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <01bd5f10$eabb49a0$62198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu There was one on the net that I down loaded is that the one you want? Steve Bruce Plecan wrote: > Does anyone have a .bin for a Holden (Australian car) V-8, Auto > using a 808?. > Does anyone know anyone who might?. > Cheers > Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 21:38:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA07316 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:38:29 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo29.mx.aol.com (imo29.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.73]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA07312 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:38:26 -0500 Received: from A70Duster@aol.com by imo29.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8JVNa02886 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:37:50 -0500 (EST) From: A70Duster Message-ID: <3fbf1070.35259d00@aol.com> Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:37:50 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Carl is out there Re: Carl Summers Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 69 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Dudes, I smell a RAT, keep your checks. See ya, Mike From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 21:48:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA07488 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:48:26 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from deliverator.sgi.com (deliverator.sgi.com [204.94.214.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA07483 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:48:24 -0500 Received: from rtrman.engr.sgi.com (rtrman.engr.sgi.com [150.166.97.164]) by deliverator.sgi.com (980309.SGI.8.8.8-aspam-6.2/980310.SGI-aspam) via SMTP id SAA15426 for <@external-mail-relay.sgi.com:diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu>; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:47:50 -0800 (PST) mail_from (gervais@rtrman.engr.sgi.com) Received: (from gervais@localhost) by rtrman.engr.sgi.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/960327.SGI.AUTOCF) id SAA24421 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:45:41 -0800 Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 18:45:41 -0800 From: gervais@rtrman.engr.sgi.com (Joe Gervais) Message-Id: <9804031845.ZM24419@rtrman.engr.sgi.com> In-Reply-To: DAVE_HEMPSTEAD@HP-Andover-om3.om.hp.com "LT-1 questions from a beginner" (Apr 3, 5:14pm) References: X-Mailer: Z-Mail-SGI (3.2S.3 08feb96 MediaMail) To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT-1 questions from a beginner Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Dave, I'm nearly in a similar boat. I'm putting a 93 LT1 in my 61 Vette, and helping a buddy put a 91 L98 in his 33 Ford Roadster. Two resources I'd recommend is the JTR engine swap manual (www.jtr.com) and the helm manual for the doner car. If you're running a 95 camaro PCM and harness, I'd consider that the doner. This will answer questions like your knock sensors and the like. Mike Knell's JTR books talk about moving knock sensors - not a big deal. With the camaro PCM code, you should be okay with your VAT. Vettes were more complex, and you're better off programming it out. Earlier this week, I saw a post about using 100 ohm resisters instead of solenoids (like EGR and AIR) to keep the PCM happy. As far as removing the MAF, you're better off with a 92/93 ECM setup and harness. These were batch fire injectors (fire all four injectors at a time per bank) rather than sequential like the 94 and up, but also were speed density and didn't use the MAF. Switching from one to the other can be an expensive proposition, which may be better solved by selling your 96 motor and buying a 92/93 motor. Diacom makes scanning software that runs on a Laptop. Roughly $300 for the basic model and $500 for the advanced one. I don't know about programming tools for the PCM. Everything I've seen says that other than Hypertech's tool which doesn't do a whole bunch more than let you change rear end ratios, it's find a shop to send the PCM in for reprogramming. Joe -- _________________________________________________________________________ Joe Gervais gervais@sgi.com Product Manager (650) 933-7479 voice High Performance Networking (650) 964-0811 fax Silicon Graphics www.sgi.com 2011 North Shoreline Blvd, Mail Stop 08L-855, Mountain View, CA 94043-1389 From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 21:48:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA07516 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:48:43 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA07510 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:48:39 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-49.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.67]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id VAA21605 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:47:46 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: File needed Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:48:11 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd5f74$1b5a7500$43198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Steven Gorkowski To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: File needed >There was one on the net that I down loaded is that the one you want? >Steve >Bruce Plecan wrote: >> Does anyone have a .bin for a Holden (Australian car) V-8, Auto >> using a 808?. >> Does anyone know anyone who might?. >> Cheers >> Bruce > There doesn't seem to be enough on that one for a TCC, is why I'm asking for another. By enough I mean tables, or I'm missing something (probably the later) LOL Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 21:51:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA07603 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:51:08 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo27.mx.aol.com (imo27.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.71]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA07599 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:51:07 -0500 Received: from TWright669@aol.com by imo27.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8FUKa04720 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:50:33 -0500 (EST) From: TWright669 Message-ID: <43eb2eab.35259ffa@aol.com> Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:50:33 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Carl is out there. Confirmed and apologies Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Well, the good news is that Carl called and left a message today. (probably while I was on the net looking for him!) I called him back, his phone was turned back on. Apparently he spent ALL his money on the initial purchase of the Haltechs. (and his phone and internet were shut off). I will sigh a deeper sigh of relief when my Haltech shows up on my doorstep, but in the mean time, I feel much better. Apparently a bunch of you guys know him and he's been around awhile. Anyway, I'm sorry I flew off the handle, so I'm headed out to down a few beers and relieve some stress! Again, I apologize, Carl. I freaked. Tom Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08694 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 22:48:22 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08689 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 22:48:20 -0500 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp24.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.154]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id VAA09776 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:48:38 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <3525ABDF.9D9D21F0@mwt.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 21:41:19 -0600 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: File needed X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <01bd5f74$1b5a7500$43198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ok bruce just thought you may not have seen it . Steve Bruce Plecan wrote: > From: Steven Gorkowski > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > Subject: Re: File needed > > >There was one on the net that I down loaded is that the one you want? > > >Steve > >Bruce Plecan wrote: > >> Does anyone have a .bin for a Holden (Australian car) V-8, Auto > >> using a 808?. > >> Does anyone know anyone who might?. > >> Cheers > >> Bruce > > > There doesn't seem to be enough on that one for a TCC, is why > I'm asking for another. By enough I mean tables, or I'm missing > something (probably the later) LOL > Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 22:48:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08687 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 22:48:18 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ultra2.syspac.com (ultra2.syspac.com [204.96.14.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08683 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 22:48:15 -0500 Received: from mailrelay.syspac.com ([204.96.14.7]) by ultra2.syspac.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-37030U5000L500S0) with ESMTP id AAA23746 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 20:46:04 -0700 Received: from p57030.syspac.com (p57030.syspac.com [204.181.57.30]) by mailrelay.syspac.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA23742 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 20:46:02 -0700 (MST) From: bamcknig@postoffice.syspac.com Message-Id: <199804040346.UAA23742@mailrelay.syspac.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:07:40 +0000 Subject: Re: HEI timing jump Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The last I remember, i was going to the library and gar thought he might round up some info. I still haven't been to the library. I think that we determined that the 4 terminal was strictly a switch. Also that there was probably about8 deg advance because of the way the reluctor built its magnetic field as the speed of the distributor increased. No help to you with a crank- hall timing. There are other modules. 5pin for sure and I think a seven pin. The question is: Is there a control signal(that could be hacked) causing the change in timing, or is the change in timing coming from the computer. I lean towards an intelligent module that can be hacked. Some place I got the notion that extra pin(s) receiaved a signal derived from the knock sensor that changed the timeing. The vacuum advance and mechanical advance were of course still in the loop. Wheteher the signal was a short, open, change in resistance or voltage, I have no idea. And remember, at this point in time I am just rcollecting. The SHADOW knows| | and so doesGM. Bob McKnight Phx AZ From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 23:03:46 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA09035 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:03:46 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA09031 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:03:44 -0500 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-042.mcn.net [208.26.146.42]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA03017 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:03:37 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <3525AE4D.723C8C71@mcn.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 20:51:41 -0700 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: HEI timing jump References: <35257CFB.6428@huron.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Clare Snyder wrote: > > Matt Beaubien wrote: > > > > Hi all, > > > > There was some discussion a little while ago about how certain HEI modules > > will suddenly advance the timing when not connected to the ECM. I would like > > to use a couple of these on a motorcycle engine that has a missing timing > > box. It has two Hall-effect pickups and a coil pack. I could just use a > > standard module but the thing would be hard to start with the proper amount > > of advance. > > > > My question is what module do I need exactly? A couple were mentioned but > > I'm not sure which I need. Also, how does it get wired? > > > > Thanks. > > > > Matt Beaubien > > mbeaubie@gpu.srv.ualberta.ca > > 3 x 510's > > 1 x 300ZXT > > 1 x Civic 1200 > >From what I figured out, will not give you advance with hall sensors as > they are strictly a switch. The advance appears to be a result of the > "trigger voltage" being reached more quickly at higher rotational > speeds. > Sorry the news is not better. > -- > _/\_ > --|-----([])-----|-- > S 0/ \0 B > Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back > E-Mail service is back to normal > To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages > Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca > OR > Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the > spammers!!! > It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of > Turkeys!!! Would it be possible to build a signal amplifier for hall effect switches that will increase module trigger voltage as rpm increases? Seems like this is what you need. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 23:08:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA09115 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:08:23 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo23.mx.aol.com (imo23.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.67]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA09111 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:08:22 -0500 Received: from ECMnut@aol.com by imo23.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8THIa07410 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:07:40 -0500 (EST) From: ECMnut Message-ID: Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:07:40 EST To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: PROM holders Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thanks Mike, let me know where to send check and for how much.... Mike V. __________________________________________________ _________________ reply separator ____________________ Your second on the list. as a guess shipping and handling, would be in the $3-$5, On the low side if I have a box that will work on the high side if I have to buy some boxes. For the two requests I have I can dig up a couple of boxes, I was worried about having 50 requests for 3-4 carriers, at which point shipping would be more problematic. Mike D. >> From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 23:15:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA09326 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:15:09 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA09321 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:15:07 -0500 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-042.mcn.net [208.26.146.42]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA06829 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:15:02 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <3525B0FA.60D2068E@mcn.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 21:03:06 -0700 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Marine FI was RE: Projection References: <47D5AD54221AD111873F00600831A35B13201B@ds9> <35253370.2CE2F042@mcn.net> <35257940.78DD@huron.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Clare Snyder wrote: > > Shannen Durphey wrote: > > Don't know how big the lakes > > are where you are, but we can and have been a long way from > > shore and people when the boat broke down. Not fun. > > A simple carburetor and point ignition is not foolproof either - as I > found out about 3 miles out from Murray Harbour PEI one warm summer day > in 1973 - and again on the Chobe river in Botswana southern Africa about > a year later. Got to the point I didn't want to be in a boat more than > jumping distance from shore. One reason I'm not too thrilled about 2 > strokers in aircraft - I can swim a bit, but my arms get tired when I > try to fly!! ha. > I know you guys are talking 4 stroke, automotive derived marine engines, > but the point still holds. In many cases I'd rather trust electronics - > a ludite I am not. > > > > One item to note would be that the ecm usually used with the > > 4.3, the 1227747, is designed to be mounted inside a vehicle > > and is not watertight. > > > > Have fun, whatever you do. > > Shannen > > -- > _/\_ > --|-----([])-----|-- > S 0/ \0 B > Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back > E-Mail service is back to normal > To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages > Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca > OR > Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the > spammers!!! > It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of > Turkeys!!! Points or electronic ignition are fine. But increasing complexity adds more potential for problems. I trust an electronic ignition module setup, but would be far less trusting of a converted automotive engine system. Far far less. Would probably offer to wait by the radio on shore in case anything happened. ; ) Anyone else find they're constantly looking at a marine engine when running a long stretch at 5500 RPM and just waiting for a bang? Just for curiosity's sake, what do some of you 4 cycle marine guys redline at? What engine? Shannen From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 3 23:18:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA09493 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:18:31 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA09488 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 23:18:30 -0500 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-042.mcn.net [208.26.146.42]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA07904 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 21:18:28 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <3525B1C8.5620A52F@mcn.net> Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 21:06:32 -0700 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC-IV References: <199804031716.LAA08070@mms10> <3.0.5.32.19980403140940.007ae200@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > > I was given "80MB" of some kind of ECM code binaries for all of the Ford > ECMs from 198x to 1995 Is this of any value to the group or no? > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > Homebrew Automotive Website: > http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HMMWV > 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car > > - Would this have been from Tom Cloud? Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 01:02:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA10542 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 01:02:13 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA10536 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 01:02:05 -0500 Received: from bullwinkle (du334-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.6.80]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id WAA09524 for ; Fri, 3 Apr 1998 22:02:02 -0800 Message-Id: <199804040602.WAA09524@mail.wgn.net> X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Fri, 03 Apr 1998 22:05:03 -0800 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Subject: Re: HEI timing jump In-Reply-To: <3525AE4D.723C8C71@mcn.net> References: <35257CFB.6428@huron.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id BAA10537 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Would it be possible to build a signal amplifier for hall >effect switches that will increase module trigger voltage as >rpm increases?  Seems like this is what you need. > >Shannen > Probabally could be done with some simple circuits, or even a PIC, and you could just dial in your advance curve. Would require some thought to make it all work. And yes, the standard 4 prong HEI module does not advance the timing when fed digitally. It is the increase in voltage at higher RPM that cause the trigger point to be hit sooner. Halleffects don't have that problem. Sandy From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 09:09:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA12687 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 09:09:05 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA12683 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 09:09:02 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id JAA28386; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 09:08:53 -0500 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA00079 for ; Sat, 04 Apr 1998 09:08:35 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Sat, 04 Apr 1998 09:08:35 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804041408.JAA00079@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980404084128.007a5aa0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 04 Apr 1998 08:41:28 -0800 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: EEC-IV In-Reply-To: <3525B1C8.5620A52F@mcn.net> References: <199804031716.LAA08070@mms10> <3.0.5.32.19980403140940.007ae200@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Would this have been from Tom Cloud? *cough*, *cough*. Tom who? *cough* *cough* Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 13:09:37 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA14321 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 13:09:37 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.anc.net (mail.anc.net [208.133.27.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA14314 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 13:09:35 -0500 Received: from terry-elliott (max01-ba-07.ba.anc.net [209.12.2.8]) by mail.anc.net (8.8.8/SCO5) with SMTP id MAA14098 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 12:09:38 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000301bd5ff4$d5b66000$08020cd1@terry-elliott> From: "Eric Elliott" To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:33:30 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Neat solution. Change the MAP output measured, the fuel feed changes to compensate, it works. Even if my information is wrong, your solution would probably work for most EGR checks. Besides I just assumed the Ford 5.4 Triton uses the EGR flow for its EGR test. It may measure EGR flow but test EGR by an older method. Eric -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Plecan To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Friday, April 03, 1998 10:59 AM Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question >From: Eric Elliott >Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question > > >>Hello, >>The old GMC pickup had a 1988 TBI EFI system, 1227747, PROM "AMUR". >>The new Ford has a PCM that I have found no information on except what is >in >>the Electrical & Vacuum Manual. >>>>Hello, >>>>Older GMC ECMs diddled the EGR & looked at injector duration to se if EGR >>>>functioned. So it had to actually change AFR via EGR to pass test. Test >was done after engine warm.My new 5.4 L measures >EGR flow with a differential pressure transmitter. >>>>Another case where a resistor won't fool it. >>>>Eric >>> >>>And perchance what ecm would be an example of that?.. >>>Bruce >> >Kinda funny in a way, what I did on a EGR Coding TBI was use the >EGR lead wire to trigger a voltage divider (resistor bridge) on the MAP >signal to stop the coding. I thought the ECM was looking for a MAP signal >change to see if it was working, never thought it was looking for a injector >pulse change. It did get rid of the coding thou. >Bruce I'm sure glad my Cone Shaped Hat covers the bruises > from beating my head against the wall...... > From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 13:09:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA14312 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 13:09:34 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.anc.net (mail.anc.net [208.133.27.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA14307 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 13:09:32 -0500 Received: from terry-elliott (max01-ba-07.ba.anc.net [209.12.2.8]) by mail.anc.net (8.8.8/SCO5) with SMTP id MAA14093 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 12:09:36 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <000201bd5ff4$d42511a0$08020cd1@terry-elliott> From: "Eric Elliott" To: Subject: Re: C3 & P4 ECM information Date: Fri, 3 Apr 1998 16:26:52 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mike, Off the top of my head I can give you an answer. The archives can do much better. When the archives covered this area, Auto MFG engineers were on the list and occasionally contributed to the discussion. I have studied a little of EFI. Engineers, professors, Professional race engine builders and tuners were in the list a few years back. I wrote with your interest in mind, not my poor efforts. Eric -----Original Message----- From: Mike Jones To: 'eelliott@arkansas.net' Date: Friday, April 03, 1998 10:15 AM Subject: RE: C3 & P4 ECM information >Eric, > >I asked the question hoping that someone on the list had detailed knowledge >about Powerstroke control schemes. (The dealers I've been to sure as hell >don't. The Powerstroke mailing list is populated by a bunch of hicks more >concerned with bug deflectors.) Nothing especially enlightening in the >archives that I was able to find -- especially since it turns out that the >engine looks at oil temp, not coolant temp. > >Just like the motorcycle EFI question. It started out as a simple request >which sparked discussion and in the end (whoever it was that wanted the >info) found out that there is a solution. > >I seen no harm in asking a question that might take someone all of 20 >seconds to answer off the top of their head. I wasn't asking anybody to do >any research for me. If you don't know the answer or it isn't convenient >for you to answer, then don't. > >That's my philosophy; yours may differ. Sorry to have wasted your time. > >Mike Jones > >---------- >Eric Elliott wrote: > >(snip)The recent letter about what resistor to make the water sensor lie >about >temperature could have easily been answered by letters replied in the >archives. > >Eric > > > > > From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 14:25:40 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA15243 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 14:25:40 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA15239 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 14:25:36 -0500 Received: from main (alaint@ppp140.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.140]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA08239 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 14:28:34 -0500 (EST) Date: Sat, 4 Apr 1998 14:23:42 -0500 (EST) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC-IV In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980404084128.007a5aa0@xephic.dynip.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu does anyone here want a program to play with these files,there's one for win3.1 on the intel site,i think it can run .bin files,it give all the content of register,memory and the likes,i'll search it for you tonight. Alain Toussaint From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 15:14:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA15709 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 15:14:18 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA15705 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 15:14:15 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-32.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.50]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id PAA27940 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 15:13:05 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: EEC-IV Date: Sat, 4 Apr 1998 15:13:26 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd6006$208e2a20$32198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Alain Toussaint To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC-IV >does anyone here want a program to play with these files,there's one for >win3.1 on the intel site,i think it can run .bin files,it give all the >content of register,memory and the likes,i'll search it for you tonight. >Alain Toussaint Are you talking about a dissassemblier?. No worries mate Bruce From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 15:43:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA15961 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 15:43:21 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net (eagle.ptialaska.net [198.70.245.243]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA15956 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 15:43:15 -0500 Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net by eagle.ptialaska.net (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id LAA27421; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 11:42:54 -0900 Message-ID: <35269C4B.33E3EC31@eagle.ptialaska.net> Date: Sat, 04 Apr 1998 11:47:07 -0900 From: Ron & Cathy Webb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC-IV References: <01bd6006$208e2a20$32198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu What they have is an emulator for the 8096. Close enough. It "runs" a program on screen where you can see what is happening to all the internal registers, and output pins. These things are great tools for debugging a program you wrote, or at least understand in detail, but it can require a lot of effort if you are really trying to understand an unknown program. It's worse yet if you don't know the addresses and detailed innards of all the peripheral chips. Ron Webb From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 16:03:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA16280 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 16:03:36 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from buffy.tpgi.com.au (buffy.tpgi.com.au [203.12.160.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA16276 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 16:03:30 -0500 Received: (from smtpd@localhost) by buffy.tpgi.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA00167 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 07:03:59 +1000 Received: from gou-ppp-066.tpgi.com.au(203.29.140.66), claiming to be "acer-p166" via SMTP by buffy.tpgi.com.au, id smtpda00143; Sun Apr 5 07:03:45 1998 Message-ID: <3526A150.5F56@tpgi.com.au> Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 07:08:32 +1000 From: Justin Albury X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: File needed References: <01bd5f10$eabb49a0$62198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------1783469EC0B" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------1783469EC0B Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bruce Plecan wrote: > > Does anyone have a .bin for a Holden (Australian car) V-8, Auto > using a 808?. > Does anyone know anyone who might?. > Cheers > Bruce Which file would you like?? I have many different V8 files to suite the delco 808 (P4) manual or auto (one has TCC lockup) attched is a asbx memcal file for vn auto have fun justin --------------1783469EC0B Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="Vnv8asbx.std" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="Vnv8asbx.std" K0wMughYaLxdGAwaChgJ/+//WAoZCP9sCwgpODxLfR8KSKsPehwcWEgISAj/uDn/Gf8NKP8q HBwuTy4sHBwcHBwYCAscOTk5KysrKhwcGSsrKzlMPz06LikfWFhYXV1KOT8rKCpYWF1aWl1M TD4+Phw5bGxsbF1YPzw8K11sbGxbTVhYT00rTVhYW1tYTUpPTzlYbGxsaU9PT0xMOUpsbE1J PD4+OTk5WGxpXTk5PDk/PzldaW5dPDs5OT8/OVtuaWxsW09NT08oSA08P0lJSTw/SUlJPD8/ Pz85OTk5OTk5OTk5OTk5OTk5OTk5OTk5OTk5OTk5OTk5OTk5OTk5KysrOTkrKysoCA8ICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgo KCgoKCgoKDgIDggICAgICAgICAgICPsNGDgODwoICAgIKAwNCwkJWSodCwkI/5t5HK8oTYoY 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CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgI CAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgJCQkJCQkJ CQk+PzwYPBg4ODs6CQkJCQkJCQkJOeje6S7pOPqs7J3sLPq571vo/Pq9+t766/ro6RvsneuZ fu0cfupfaAjaT9ocaAjYCNgI2AjYCA== --------------1783469EC0B-- From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 16:26:50 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA16592 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 16:26:50 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp.algonet.se (angel.algonet.se [194.213.74.112]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA16588 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 16:26:46 -0500 Received: (qmail 6744 invoked from network); 4 Apr 1998 21:26:44 -0000 Received: from du214-150.ppp.algonet.se (HELO default) (195.100.150.214) by angel.algonet.se with SMTP; 4 Apr 1998 21:26:44 -0000 From: "Stefan Olsson" To: Subject: SV: File needed Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:26:38 +0200 Message-ID: <01bd60d9$84c33fc0$729764c3@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Dear sirs Please check if we have the file on our chiplist www.bsrab.se Choose ,Swedish, Chiptrimning, Chiplistan, Manufacturer. There is hundreds of files! Best Regards Stefan -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Justin Albury Till: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Datum: den 4 april 1998 23:14 Ämne: Re: File needed >Bruce Plecan wrote: >> >> Does anyone have a .bin for a Holden (Australian car) V-8, Auto >> using a 808?. >> Does anyone know anyone who might?. >> Cheers >> Bruce > > >Which file would you like?? > >I have many different V8 files to suite the delco 808 (P4) >manual or auto (one has TCC lockup) >attched is a asbx memcal file for vn auto > >have fun > >justin > From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 19:15:49 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA17742 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 19:15:49 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA17738 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 19:15:46 -0500 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-32.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.101]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id TAA14856 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 19:14:51 -0500 (EST) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: File needed Date: Sat, 4 Apr 1998 19:15:14 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd6027$e7d79be0$65198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Justin Albury To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: File needed Plecan wrote: >> Does anyone have a .bin for a Holden (Australian car) V-8, Auto >> using a 808?. >> Does anyone know anyone who might?. >> Cheers >> Bruce >Which file would you like?? >I have many different V8 files to suite the delco 808 (P4) >manual or auto (one has TCC lockup) >attched is a asbx memcal file for vn auto >have fun >justin The one with the TTC is exactly what I'm looking for!. No worries mate Bruce Thanks From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 20:32:03 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA18381 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 20:32:03 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA18377 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 20:32:02 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id UAA15258; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 20:32:01 -0500 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA00242 for ; Sat, 04 Apr 1998 20:31:01 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Sat, 04 Apr 1998 20:31:01 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804050131.UAA00242@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980404202928.007b13f0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 04 Apr 1998 20:29:28 -0800 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: EEC-IV In-Reply-To: <35269C4B.33E3EC31@eagle.ptialaska.net> References: <01bd6006$208e2a20$32198fd1@nacelp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >It's worse yet if you don't know the addresses and detailed >innards of all the peripheral chips. True. However, for those who are really, really savvy, I have an X-ray of an EEC-IV module from a 5.0L Mustang, at my friend's bodyshop. Its a multi-layer board, however the different layers are different levels of gray, due to the thickness of the board, layers etc. Next time I go up there I'll see how usable it is. Its been a while. I was talking with Tom Cloud approximately 3-4 months ago about dissecting a EEC-IV, and I made friends with the director of Radiology at the hospital I work at, and he said "Sure, X-Ray anything you like". So, I did. Anyway, I didn't get the 80MB archive up yet.... stubborn drives !!! Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 21:27:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA18825 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:27:48 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.cgocable.net (mail.cgocable.net [24.226.1.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA18821 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:27:45 -0500 Received: from cgocable.net (cgowave-26-13.cgocable.net [24.226.26.13]) by mail.cgocable.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id VAA11674 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:27:51 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <352717DE.349D3B70@cgocable.net> Date: Sat, 04 Apr 1998 21:34:23 -0800 From: Emmett Stanicki X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC-IV References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Yes I would like to look at anything to do with EEC. Thank you Alain Toussaint wrote: > does anyone here want a program to play with these files,there's one for > win3.1 on the intel site,i think it can run .bin files,it give all the > content of register,memory and the likes,i'll search it for you tonight. > > Alain Toussaint From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 21:38:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA19000 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:38:39 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.cgocable.net (mail.cgocable.net [24.226.1.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA18995 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:38:38 -0500 Received: from cgocable.net (cgowave-26-13.cgocable.net [24.226.26.13]) by mail.cgocable.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id VAA14128 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:38:42 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <35271A6B.CCC3D743@cgocable.net> Date: Sat, 04 Apr 1998 21:45:15 -0800 From: Emmett Stanicki X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC-IV References: <01bd6006$208e2a20$32198fd1@nacelp> <3.0.5.32.19980404202928.007b13f0@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > >It's worse yet if you don't know the addresses and detailed > >innards of all the peripheral chips. > > True. > > However, for those who are really, really savvy, I have an X-ray of an > EEC-IV module from a 5.0L Mustang, at my friend's bodyshop. Its a > multi-layer board, however the different layers are different levels of > gray, due to the thickness of the board, layers etc. Next time I go up > there I'll see how usable it is. Its been a while. I was talking with Tom > Cloud approximately 3-4 months ago about dissecting a EEC-IV, and I made > friends with the director of Radiology at the hospital I work at, and he > said "Sure, X-Ray anything you like". > > So, I did. > Now that is relay neat! I'll bet Ford even doesn't have that.I was telling someone I thought it was 3 layer and they asked why. Well I was getting nowhere with VOM but I would have never thought of trying an XRAY. Boy you gotta use all available stuff for serious hacking! Can you blow up an xray like a photo? That would make a cool picture to hang on the wall. > Anyway, I didn't get the 80MB archive up yet.... stubborn drives !!! > Darn! From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 23:13:49 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA19815 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 23:13:49 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.anc.net (mail.anc.net [208.133.27.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA19811 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 23:13:47 -0500 Received: from terry-elliott (max01-ba-05.ba.anc.net [209.12.2.6]) by mail.anc.net (8.8.8/SCO5) with SMTP id WAA07562 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 22:13:50 -0600 (CST) Message-ID: <002301bd6049$385f7120$30020cd1@terry-elliott> From: "Eric Elliott" To: Subject: Re: Motronic switch? Date: Sat, 4 Apr 1998 22:04:31 -0600 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Daniel, This looks very familiar, but I don't have a perfect memory. I think the archives have a letter that answers your question. After reading about 80 letters in the archive, I still think your answer is there. Maybe you can find it in 1995 or 1996. Eric -----Original Message----- From: Daniel R. Henriksson To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Saturday, April 04, 1998 3:16 AM Subject: Motronic switch? >I've got a Motronic box 0 261 200 012 in my Volvo 760 Turbo. >A CDP1802 based box, with a 2732 ROM chip. >Does anyone know how to alter the rev limiter? >Inside it i found a blue 8-position switch. >What does the switch do? > > >/Daniel Henriksson From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 4 23:39:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA20043 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 23:39:52 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA20039 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 23:39:50 -0500 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id XAA19885; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 23:39:48 -0500 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA00261 for ; Sat, 04 Apr 1998 23:38:49 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Sat, 04 Apr 1998 23:38:49 -0500 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804050438.XAA00261@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980404233813.007a85c0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 04 Apr 1998 23:38:13 -0800 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: EEC-IV In-Reply-To: <35271A6B.CCC3D743@cgocable.net> References: <01bd6006$208e2a20$32198fd1@nacelp> <3.0.5.32.19980404202928.007b13f0@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Now that is relay neat! I'll bet Ford even doesn't have that.I was telling Sorta neat, I don't think its terribly useful. SInce the different layers (however many they are) cross each ohter between layers, its really hard to tell what goes where. And while an ohm meter is suitable for tracing circuit boards, having parts on the board realy makes it nearly impossible to really know what goes where. All you need is a diode and the ohm meter going the right way, and it appears to be a foil trace. I've spent a lot of time growing up reverse engineering not so sophisticated items before. Mostly electronics in musical instruments and MIDI related stuff. >with VOM but I would have never thought of trying an XRAY. Boy you gotta use >all available stuff for serious hacking! Well, I did it for giggles, not really expecting anything useful. But it was an opportunity to play with million dollar equipment :) >Can you blow up an xray like a photo? That would make a cool picture to hang >on the wall. Not sure really... you get 11x16" film and that's about it I think. Though we just installed video capture equipment on both the X-ray machines and the MRI machines, so images can be reviewed without film - a major expense for the hospital I work at. Though considering they are upgrading all their networks to 100MB of bandwith point to point for the 20-25MB images that have to pass through, its not exactly cheap either. That's my job function - I design and manage the implementation of anything relating to the backbone. Just got lucky with the department head of radiology - he's a sports car enthusiast... Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 00:10:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA20479 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 00:10:53 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA20475 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 00:10:50 -0500 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-020.mcn.net [208.26.146.20]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA04776 for ; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 22:10:44 -0700 (MST) Message-ID: <35270F87.D0EA3061@mcn.net> Date: Sat, 04 Apr 1998 21:58:47 -0700 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC-IV References: <199804031716.LAA08070@mms10> <3.0.5.32.19980403140940.007ae200@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980404084128.007a5aa0@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > >Would this have been from Tom Cloud? > > *cough*, *cough*. Tom who? *cough* *cough* > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > Homebrew Automotive Website: > http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HMMWV > 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car > > - Ok. Just didn't want to "me too" a second time. Still got 80 megs of stuff that may come in handy some time. Pack rats gotta watch out what they pack. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 00:59:27 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA20958 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 00:59:27 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA20950 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 00:59:24 -0500 Received: from wolfenet.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id AAA21846; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 00:59:24 -0500 Received: from gonzo.wolfenet.com (orin@gonzo.wolfenet.com [204.157.98.2]) by wolfenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA13862; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:59:22 -0800 (PST) From: Orin Eman Received: (from orin@localhost) by gonzo.wolfenet.com (8.8.3/8.7) id VAA07440; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:59:22 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199804050559.VAA07440@gonzo.wolfenet.com> Subject: Re: EEC-IV To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:59:21 -0800 (PST) Cc: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980404233813.007a85c0@xephic.dynip.com> from "Frederic Breitwieser" at Apr 4, 98 11:38:13 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Sorta neat, I don't think its terribly useful. SInce the different layers > (however many they are) cross each ohter between layers, its really hard to > tell what goes where. And while an ohm meter is suitable for tracing > circuit boards, having parts on the board realy makes it nearly impossible > to really know what goes where. All you need is a diode and the ohm meter > going the right way, and it appears to be a foil trace. My DMM has a diode test position... beeps for continuity, otherwise shows the forward voltage for a diode and out of range for open circuit or reverse biased diode. Might solve the diode problem ;-) Orin. From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 00:59:27 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA20959 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 00:59:27 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from wolfenet.com (root@frapp.wolfe.net [207.178.61.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA20953 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 00:59:24 -0500 Received: from gonzo.wolfenet.com (orin@gonzo.wolfenet.com [204.157.98.2]) by wolfenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA13862; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:59:22 -0800 (PST) From: Orin Eman Received: (from orin@localhost) by gonzo.wolfenet.com (8.8.3/8.7) id VAA07440; Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:59:22 -0800 (PST) Message-Id: <199804050559.VAA07440@gonzo.wolfenet.com> Subject: Re: EEC-IV To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sat, 4 Apr 1998 21:59:21 -0800 (PST) Cc: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980404233813.007a85c0@xephic.dynip.com> from "Frederic Breitwieser" at Apr 4, 98 11:38:13 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Sorta neat, I don't think its terribly useful. SInce the different layers > (however many they are) cross each ohter between layers, its really hard to > tell what goes where. And while an ohm meter is suitable for tracing > circuit boards, having parts on the board realy makes it nearly impossible > to really know what goes where. All you need is a diode and the ohm meter > going the right way, and it appears to be a foil trace. My DMM has a diode test position... beeps for continuity, otherwise shows the forward voltage for a diode and out of range for open circuit or reverse biased diode. Might solve the diode problem ;-) Orin. From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 01:21:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA21381 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 01:21:26 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id BAA21371 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 01:21:20 -0500 From: xxalexx@ix.netcom.com Received: from dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id BAA22414; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 01:21:20 -0500 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id AAA08463 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 00:21:19 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199804050621.AAA08463@dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com> Received: from ron-ny10-54.ix.netcom.com(207.94.105.118) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma008448; Sun Apr 5 00:21:03 1998 Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 12:57:08 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: ion chip Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu delphi has some product info. on a direct ignition ion system. if this list becomes over 100000 maybe they could send one sample. http://www.delco.com alex From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 01:21:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA21389 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 01:21:31 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.13]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA21384 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 01:21:30 -0500 From: xxalexx@ix.netcom.com Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id AAA08470 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 00:21:20 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199804050621.AAA08470@dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com> Received: from ron-ny10-54.ix.netcom.com(207.94.105.118) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma008448; Sun Apr 5 00:21:09 1998 Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 12:57:08 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: coolant sensor liar (wasTuning 101) Priority: normal In-reply-to: <01BD5CB9.13BBC5A0@ts2-06.rpt.cyberhighway.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > From: Mike Jones > To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" > > Subject: coolant sensor liar (wasTuning 101) > Date: Tue, 31 Mar 1998 15:24:16 -0800 > Reply-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Bruce Plecan wrote: > Just got reminded of something I didn't mention earlier. No I do not > stop, and start the car for every change I make. > Again depending on the car. I might make a coolant temp sensor > liar (adjustable pot in series with sensor), >>> > > > > Speaking of coolant sensor liar-- > > I've been working through a problem with my Powerstroke diesel, which if > you're not familiar with the breed, is a direct-injected diesel completely > controlled by the PCM, right down to the drive-by-wire throttle. > > The problem is what can only be described as a lean missfire under > acceleration when fully warm. It feels just like a gas engine with a plug > wire off. Done it since new. No codes are set, and I've heard through a > couple of reliable sources that there is no 'defect', the PCM was > calibrated this way for California and California wannabe's. It runs > strong as a horse when partially warm, coolant temp around 120-130 > degrees. > > Anybody have an idea of what range resistor I should begin experimenting > with so as to knock the reported temp down from 160? This may be a quick > and dirty way to get me where I want to go. > > Mike Jones > > I have used 10K pot to ground. Most work shops manuals have a themistor curve. alex From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 01:21:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA21382 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 01:21:26 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id BAA21376 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 01:21:22 -0500 From: xxalexx@ix.netcom.com Received: from dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id BAA22417; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 01:21:21 -0500 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id AAA08467 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 00:21:20 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199804050621.AAA08467@dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com> Received: from ron-ny10-54.ix.netcom.com(207.94.105.118) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma008448; Sun Apr 5 00:21:06 1998 Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 12:57:09 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: plasma injection system Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Would like to know if anyone interested in making low cost laser injection system for drag racing. It needs to heat 0.6 cu. in. of air to 54000 F one inch behind the driver at 20 times a sec. Also a large air injector is needed to spin the car for stability. More details are in April, 98 Discover Mag. page 32. alex From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 01:56:03 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA21937 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 01:56:03 -0500 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mxserver.forbin.com (mxserver.forbin.com [204.71.100.246]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA21933 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 01:55:59 -0500 Received: from fraser.forbin.com (x2-196.forbin.com [208.149.197.196]) by mxserver.forbin.com (2.5 Build 2630 (Berkeley 8.8.6)/8.8.4) with SMTP id AAA05668 for ; Sun, 05 Apr 1998 00:56:49 -0600 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19960404001203.006ce46c@forbin.com> X-Sender: fraser@forbin.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Thu, 04 Apr 1996 00:12:03 -0600 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Jennifer and Brock Fraser Subject: Re: LT-1 questions from a beginner In-Reply-To: <199804040248.VAA07499@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > 1. I've been told my pair of knock sensors will not work with the '95 PCM. >I need a Camaro knock sensor, and I need only one. Is this true? I wasn't aware that the '96 Impala engine had 2 knock sensors. A '96 Camaro engine has only one sensor, and it feeds pin Blue-22 on the PCM. Call the dealership and try to match knock sensor P/N's from a B and F car, then you will know for sure. > > 2. The headers will force me to move the knock sensor. Can I relocate it in >the block? Does it matter which side I put it on? There are many opinions on this... Try to locate it in a location that has similar acoustic mass between the meat of the block and the threads as the factory location. > > 3. I've removed the AIR pump and the gas canister. Can I disable the >trouble codes for these? Or, can I fake the PCM to think that they are present? Disabling the codes is not an easy task. I'd reccomend faking out the system. You'll need a shop manual to study the schematic and system description, if you don't already have one. The best bet is to live with codes, but have your scan tool handy so that you know what they all are anytime you want to check the status... > > 4. I've read about the VAT. I think I can build up a 555 circuit to fake >it. > > 5. For space reasons (the '34 engine compartment is VERY tight) I may need >to remove the MAF. Is this a mistake???? Removing the MAF will set codes, of course. My experience is that these controllers run just as well on the backup-mode (speed-density) as they do with the MAF sensor in place. In fact, no difference at all as indicated on a chassis dyno. As for drivability / idle / cold ambient, I don't have much experience with that. Another source claims BETTER throttle response running on backup mode (MAF removed). Of course, this should be done with a virtually un-modified engine unless you are going to re-tune. Backup mode won't compensate for your changes well... > > 6. For the same reasons, I may need to remove the EGR. Is this a mistake??? No W.O.T power penalties, but part throttle ping and/or stumble may occur. And of course, more codes that aren't easily defeatable. > > 7. Should I assume that I will need to buy a PCM programmer to customize my >setup? I know that they are expensive. I think I have access to a scan tool at >a friend's shop, but I think I'll really need my own. If I also need a >programmer, I'm on my own there. Somebody else reccomended a Diacom. I agree - hard to beat it. There's another product at: www.carcomp.com Hope this helped, Brock From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 03:12:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA22193 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 03:12:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dfw-ix14.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix14.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA22189 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 03:12:55 -0400 From: xxalexx@ix.netcom.com Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix14.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id BAA26580 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 01:12:52 -0600 (CST) Message-Id: <199804050712.BAA26580@dfw-ix14.ix.netcom.com> Received: from ron-ny10-54.ix.netcom.com(207.94.105.118) by dfw-ix14.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma026565; Sun Apr 5 01:12:26 1998 Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 13:48:33 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: SPAM ALERT Priority: normal In-reply-to: References: <351AA3CB.61C8430C@etc.ec.gc.ca> from "Will McGonegal" at Mar 26, 98 01:51:55 pm X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Re: SPAM ALERT > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Date: Thu, 26 Mar 1998 15:18:42 -0500 (EST) > From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" > Reply-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > > > Working at Environment Canada's vehicle emissions test lab, I have seen many oil/fuel > > additives and devices (magnets, rare metals, etc.) tested here that are supposed to > Yes, we tested some magnets spark plugs and fuel catalyzers. For old carburetor cars there is non repeatable deviation that customer assumes is a improvement. I have heard the magnets are selling well in third world countries, were people are dropping dead in streets from breathing air. > what city are you in > I am in Toronto > Ronkonkoma, NY. If you need any help in testing please contact. Currently installing enhanced evap. Alex http://www.he.net/~certlab From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 08:17:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA23818 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 08:17:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.36]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA23814 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 08:17:49 -0400 Received: from MRASHAN@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8VWPa22932 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 08:17:14 -0500 (EDT) From: MRASHAN Message-ID: Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 08:17:14 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: X-ray...... Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu In a message dated 98-04-04 23:50:46 EST, you write: << frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com >> Hi Fred.....i saw your post about your hospital work. I have been installing CAT Scanners and MRI Scanners for the last 15 years. i never though about using them to explore engine / electronics parts. I think you started a new trend. I have unlimited use of an X-ray and CAT Scanner. Let me know what else might be interesting to see...... Thanks, Art From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 10:27:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA24517 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 10:27:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp.algonet.se (angel.algonet.se [194.213.74.112]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA24513 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 10:27:03 -0400 Received: (qmail 16447 invoked from network); 5 Apr 1998 14:26:56 -0000 Received: from du67-151.ppp.algonet.se (HELO default) (195.100.151.67) by angel.algonet.se with SMTP; 5 Apr 1998 14:26:56 -0000 From: "Stefan Olsson" To: Subject: SV: Motronic switch? Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 16:26:48 +0200 Message-ID: <01bd6168$08f048e0$439764c3@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi With the switch You can correct the fuel +/- 3%lambda and correct the ignition +/- 3degres. Check my site www.bsrab.se Choose : Swedish/Chiptrimning/Chiplista/Manufacturer -Volvo. Best Regards Stefan -----Ursprungligt meddelande----- Från: Daniel R. Henriksson Till: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Datum: den 3 april 1998 23:57 Ämne: Motronic switch? >I've got a Motronic box 0 261 200 012 in my Volvo 760 Turbo. >A CDP1802 based box, with a 2732 ROM chip. >Does anyone know how to alter the rev limiter? >Inside it i found a blue 8-position switch. >What does the switch do? > > >/Daniel Henriksson > From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 12:19:58 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA25450 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 12:19:58 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA25446 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 12:19:55 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id MAA07198; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 12:19:46 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAB00243; Sun, 05 Apr 1998 12:18:39 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 12:18:39 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804051618.MAB00243@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980405121209.007a8150@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 12:12:09 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: EEC-IV Cc: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu In-Reply-To: <199804050559.VAA07440@gonzo.wolfenet.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19980404233813.007a85c0@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >My DMM has a diode test position... beeps for continuity, otherwise >shows the forward voltage for a diode and out of range for open circuit >or reverse biased diode. Might solve the diode problem ;-) True. Though I'm still an advocate of removing all the circuitry, if possible. Makes the process go much, much faster. On older circuits, this is pretty easy. On all these new surface mount stuff, makes it more difficult. An oven at 500 degrees doesn't cut it :( Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 16:01:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA26772 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 16:01:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.clarityconnect.com (mail.clarityconnect.com [206.64.143.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA26768 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 16:01:02 -0400 Received: from LOCALNAME (206.114.169.15) by mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.0.1); Sun, 5 Apr 1998 16:01:58 -0400 Message-ID: <35280D1F.14F8@clarityconnect.com> Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 16:00:47 -0700 From: Scot Sealander X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E-KIT (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: File needed References: <01bd5f10$eabb49a0$62198fd1@nacelp> <3526A150.5F56@tpgi.com.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Justin Albury wrote: > attched is a asbx memcal file for vn auto This file is NG. There is a bit picked in a lot of locations. Scot Sealander Sealand@clarityconnect.com From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 16:42:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA27135 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 16:42:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA27129 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 16:42:34 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp109.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.109]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA21917; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 16:45:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 15:40:39 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Bruce Plecan cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC-IV In-Reply-To: <01bd6006$208e2a20$32198fd1@nacelp> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Are you talking about a dissassemblier?. > No worries mate > Bruce no,a full featured program for testing every files you care to give it (i was debuging an OS with it back when i was running win95). Alain p.s.sorry for the late reply,i was doing a party this week-end From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 17:31:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA27714 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 17:31:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA27710 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 17:31:50 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp110.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.110]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA22431; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 17:34:52 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 16:30:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Jennifer and Brock Fraser cc: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT-1 questions from a beginner In-Reply-To: <3.0.2.32.19960404001203.006ce46c@forbin.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > > > 6. For the same reasons, I may need to remove the EGR. Is this a > mistake??? > > No W.O.T power penalties, but part throttle ping and/or stumble may occur. > And of course, more codes that aren't easily defeatable. i would be nervous about doing that,your motor have (according to all my sources) 10:1 compression and according to the naisso web site,they even have 10.5:1 compression so unless you're going to coat the cylinder head,piston and take great care about anything that can play a role in detonation,i would not do that if i where you. Alain Toussaint p.s.the cylinder head are retain more heat than aluminium head too From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 17:53:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA27924 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 17:53:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA27918 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 17:52:59 -0400 Received: from bullwinkle (du340-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.6.86]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id OAA25856 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 14:52:58 -0700 Message-Id: <199804052152.OAA25856@mail.wgn.net> X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 14:55:59 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Subject: Re: EEC-IV In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980405121209.007a8150@xephic.dynip.com> References: <199804050559.VAA07440@gonzo.wolfenet.com> <3.0.5.32.19980404233813.007a85c0@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id RAA27919 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > Though I'm still an advocate of removing all the circuitry, if possible. > Makes the process go much, much faster.  On older circuits, this is pretty > easy.  On all these new surface mount stuff, makes it more difficult. > > An oven at 500 degrees doesn't cut it :( Come on, you have a bar-b-que dont you ;-) From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 18:17:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA28293 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 18:17:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kauri.lincoln.ac.nz (kauri.lincoln.ac.nz [138.75.10.7]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA28289 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 18:17:10 -0400 Received: from whio.lincoln.ac.nz by kauri.lincoln.ac.nz (PMDF V5.1-9 #1) with ESMTP id <0EQY001VLNLZZZ@kauri.lincoln.ac.nz> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 10:17:12 +1200 (NZS) Received: from WHIO/SpoolDir by whio.lincoln.ac.nz (Mercury 1.40); Mon, 06 Apr 1998 10:16:15 +1200 Received: from SpoolDir by WHIO (Mercury 1.40); Mon, 06 Apr 1998 09:55:58 +1200 Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 09:39:02 +1200 From: Simon Quested Subject: Re: Idle probelm..... In-reply-to: <199804030804.AAA18841@geocities.com> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <0EQY00160OKNZZ@kauri.lincoln.ac.nz> Organization: Lincoln University MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.00 beta 6) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Priority: normal Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Dan > Howz the fuel pressure and vacuum during idle ? erratic ? Vacuum is erratic, FP unknown I don't have a gauge..... Cheers Simon ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Simon Quested (E-mail questeds@lincoln.ac.nz) Computer Technician, Silicon Graphics & Windows NT Support Centre for Computing and Biometrics LINCOLN UNIVERSITY OF NEW ZEALAND Phone (64)(03) 3252811 Ext. 8087 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ http://www.lincoln.ac.nz/ccb/techs/simon/default.htm ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I drive way too fast to worry about cholesterol ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 19:02:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA28750 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:02:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28746 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:02:26 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-7.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.76]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id TAA21523 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:01:31 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: File needed Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:01:52 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd60e6$d22f4620$4c198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Scot Sealander To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sunday, April 05, 1998 4:38 PM Subject: Re: File needed >Justin Albury wrote: >> attched is a asbx memcal file for vn auto >This file is NG. There is a bit picked in a lot of locations. > >Scot Sealander Sealand@clarityconnect.com > What does "This file is NG", mean?. What does "There is a bit picked in a lot of locations", mean?.. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 19:09:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA28825 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:09:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from wolfenet.com (root@frapp.wolfe.net [207.178.61.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28821 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:09:50 -0400 Received: from gonzo.wolfenet.com (orin@gonzo.wolfenet.com [204.157.98.2]) by wolfenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA19331 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 16:09:49 -0700 (PDT) From: Orin Eman Received: (from orin@localhost) by gonzo.wolfenet.com (8.8.3/8.7) id QAA03520 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 16:09:49 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804052309.QAA03520@gonzo.wolfenet.com> Subject: Re: EEC-IV To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 16:09:49 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980405121209.007a8150@xephic.dynip.com> from "Frederic Breitwieser" at Apr 5, 98 12:12:09 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Though I'm still an advocate of removing all the circuitry, if possible. > Makes the process go much, much faster. On older circuits, this is pretty > easy. On all these new surface mount stuff, makes it more difficult. > An oven at 500 degrees doesn't cut it :( I suppose the hot air gun on high would deal with the surface mount... of course, it may be difficult finding the little Rs and Cs after they get blown across the room! Fortunately, my Audi ECU is all thru hole and pretty easy to see where everything goes... so much so that I hadn't really considered removing all the circuitry. Applying the wire snips would make short work of most of it! It certainly worked for the pressure sensor when I upgraded from the stock 2.0 bar to a motorola 2.5 bar. Orin. From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 19:48:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA29357 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:48:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from online.no (pilt.online.no [193.212.1.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA29353 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:48:04 -0400 Received: from siemens-nixdorf (ti34a01-0043.dialup.online.no [130.67.64.107]) by online.no (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA16554 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 01:47:49 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199804052347.BAA16554@online.no> From: "Espen Hilde" To: Subject: Re: Marine FI was RE: Projection Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 01:44:01 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have a mercury 2.5 efi outboard, it's two stroke,280hp v6 .The new engines have digital injection ,my 92 model have analog injection ,it's a speed density system. I have heard it's the same as on old VW's.Bosch d-jetronic? It uses low ohm injectors.Its possible to alter the fuel by turning a pot on the side of the fuel computer. Do anybody know how to "program" this computer for a modifyed engine? Is it possible to fit a GM EFI to this engine? a 747? 97year world champion tunnel boat, used a formula 1 (car) efi.They used one EGT probe for each cyl.The engine gave nearly 400hp.(2,5l)Under 10000rpm. They did not have a single break down during the season.The efi box was inside the boat in a dirt cheep rubber maid box. Espen From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 19:51:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA29404 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:51:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA29399 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:50:59 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp41.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.62]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA23966 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:54:03 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 18:49:09 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT-1 questions from a beginner In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > p.s.the cylinder head are retain more heat than aluminium head too ^^^ talk about goofing,i need to review my english knowledge !!!! Alain From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 21:13:50 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA30217 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 21:13:50 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA30213 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 21:13:48 -0400 Received: from emerald.tufts.edu by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id VAA20365; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 21:13:48 -0400 Received: from tufts.edu (st1254.tc.tufts.edu) by emerald.tufts.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #23568) with ESMTP id <0EQY00JGDWR0W6@emerald.tufts.edu> for diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 21:13:48 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 21:14:05 -0400 From: Andris Skulte Subject: DFI open/closed loop problems To: DIY_EFI Message-id: <35282C5D.26FBEC30@tufts.edu> X-Envelope-to: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I put the DFI in yesterday, and everything is running pretty well. The one major problem right now is getting the darn thing into closed loop. >From what I've got programmed, it should be in closed loop above 100 degrees coolant, 750 Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA30232 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 21:14:53 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp1.mailsrvcs.net (smtp1.gte.net [207.115.153.30]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA30228 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 21:14:52 -0400 Received: from paulb3 (1Cust118.tnt1.hilo.hi.gt.uu.net [208.255.248.118]) by smtp1.mailsrvcs.net with SMTP id TAA20170 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 19:06:24 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <35281B81.5826@gte.net> Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 14:02:09 -1000 From: "Paul E. Bueltmann III" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Idle probelm..... References: <0EQY00160OKNZZ@kauri.lincoln.ac.nz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Simon Quested wrote: > > Hi Dan > > > Howz the fuel pressure and vacuum during idle ? erratic ? > > Vacuum is erratic, FP unknown I don't have a gauge..... > > Cheers > > Simon > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > Simon Quested (E-mail questeds@lincoln.ac.nz) > Computer Technician, Silicon Graphics & Windows NT Support > Centre for Computing and Biometrics > LINCOLN UNIVERSITY OF NEW ZEALAND > Phone (64)(03) 3252811 Ext. 8087 > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > http://www.lincoln.ac.nz/ccb/techs/simon/default.htm > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > I drive way too fast to worry about cholesterol > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Do a compression check or the pull one sparkplug wire off at a time (do with caution and protection). It sounds like you have a broken valve spring or something mechanical wrong. later paulb3@gte.net From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 22:06:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA30892 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 22:06:41 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA30888 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 22:06:39 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-39.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.57]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id WAA12593 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 22:05:45 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 22:06:05 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6100$8e47b400$1b198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Andris Skulte To: DIY_EFI Subject: DFI open/closed loop problems >I put the DFI in yesterday, and everything is running pretty well. The >one major problem right now is getting the darn thing into closed loop. >From what I've got programmed, it should be in closed loop above 100 >degrees coolant, Sure it's F, and not C? 750just stays into open loop. Idle, cruise, whatever, it is still in open >loop. A weird symptom is the 02 is always 806mV at whatever throttle I'm >at. I richened the entire fuel map 10% to raise the o2's, but it still >stay at 806. I then lowered the stock fuel map 7%, and o2's didn't >change at all. I figured in open loop they should change. I'm pretty >sure the o2 sensor works correctly, since the volts climb as it warms >up, and when I shift or lift off the throttle, they drop down from >806mV. I will be putting the heated O2 next weekend, in the hope that >will cure some of this... Any ideas? > >Andris Does the O2 need to swing for it to look awake to the ecm. ie, it's so rich, that it doesn't "look" right to the ecm. Were ya using a 1.8 msec base pulse?. Might try way down like 1.5, just a guess. Bruce Easier to ask for forgiveness, than get permission, some married dude... From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 22:38:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA31320 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 22:38:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.33]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA31316 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 22:38:42 -0400 Received: from [12.65.70.124] ([12.65.70.18]) by mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA2880 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 02:38:38 +0000 Message-ID: <3527D183.667@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 18:49:22 +0000 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems References: <35282C5D.26FBEC30@tufts.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Andris Skulte wrote: > > I put the DFI in yesterday, and everything is running pretty well. The > one major problem right now is getting the darn thing into closed loop. FWIW, I programmed an SDS system w/closed loop option. It had a 25% limitation, meaning that the pulse-width had to be within 25% of 14.7. Hope this helps -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 23:03:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA31826 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:03:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sgi.sgi.com (SGI.COM [192.48.153.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA31821 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:02:58 -0400 Received: from aspire.dearborn.sgi.com ([169.238.139.226]) by sgi.sgi.com (980309.SGI.8.8.8-aspam-6.2/980304.SGI-aspam) via SMTP id UAA22738; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 20:02:57 -0700 (PDT) mail_from (afgun@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com) Received: from mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com by aspire.dearborn.sgi.com via ESMTP (950413.SGI.8.6.12/930416.SGI) id XAA08005; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:02:56 -0400 Received: (from afgun@localhost) by mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) id XAA06271; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:02:50 -0400 From: "Andrew F. Gunnesch" Message-Id: <9804052302.ZM6269@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com> Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:02:50 -0400 In-Reply-To: Andris Skulte "DFI open/closed loop problems" (Apr 5, 9:14pm) References: <35282C5D.26FBEC30@tufts.edu> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.3 08feb96 MediaMail) To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, DIY_EFI Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems Cc: askulte@emerald.tufts.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sure it's in F, not C, Andris? Since your O2 is stable, however, it leads me to believe that you have a problem with your sensor or the circuit. The DFI might likely stay in open-loop mode if it believes that the O2 sensor is inoperative. Sure you got the hookup correct ? Maybe a DVM on the O2 lead at idle to see if it's changing at all... or an el-cheap-o LED meter for O2 sensors? Good luck, andrew From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 23:03:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA31833 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:03:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA31829 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:03:01 -0400 Received: from sgi.sgi.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id XAA23052; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:03:01 -0400 Received: from aspire.dearborn.sgi.com ([169.238.139.226]) by sgi.sgi.com (980309.SGI.8.8.8-aspam-6.2/980304.SGI-aspam) via SMTP id UAA22738; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 20:02:57 -0700 (PDT) mail_from (afgun@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com) Received: from mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com by aspire.dearborn.sgi.com via ESMTP (950413.SGI.8.6.12/930416.SGI) id XAA08005; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:02:56 -0400 Received: (from afgun@localhost) by mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) id XAA06271; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:02:50 -0400 From: "Andrew F. Gunnesch" Message-Id: <9804052302.ZM6269@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com> Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:02:50 -0400 In-Reply-To: Andris Skulte "DFI open/closed loop problems" (Apr 5, 9:14pm) References: <35282C5D.26FBEC30@tufts.edu> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.3 08feb96 MediaMail) To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, DIY_EFI Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems Cc: askulte@emerald.tufts.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sure it's in F, not C, Andris? Since your O2 is stable, however, it leads me to believe that you have a problem with your sensor or the circuit. The DFI might likely stay in open-loop mode if it believes that the O2 sensor is inoperative. Sure you got the hookup correct ? Maybe a DVM on the O2 lead at idle to see if it's changing at all... or an el-cheap-o LED meter for O2 sensors? Good luck, andrew From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 23:13:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA32096 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:13:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from fastnet.magiclink.com (fastnet.magiclink.com [199.104.22.8]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA32091 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:13:14 -0400 From: mailohost@cyberhighway.net Received: from 199.104.22.2.magiclink.com [204.134.240.139] by fastnet.magiclink.com (SMTPD32-4.03) id A7D4E7200E0; Sun, 05 Apr 1998 21:11:16 MST Message-ID: <3528471E.57FB@cyberhighway.net> Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 21:13:41 -0600 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: C3 & P4 ECM information References: <000201bd5ff4$d42511a0$08020cd1@terry-elliott> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Eric, Fair enough. Your comment makes more sense now. Thought you were one of the 'mailinglist police' that trys to limit discussion only to the high and mighty... Mike Eric Elliott wrote: > > Mike, > Off the top of my head I can give you an answer. The archives can do much > better. When the archives covered this area, Auto MFG engineers were on the > list and occasionally contributed to the discussion. > I have studied a little of EFI. Engineers, professors, Professional race > engine builders and tuners were in the list a few years back. > I wrote with your interest in mind, not my poor efforts. > > Eric From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 23:47:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA32726 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:47:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from fastnet.magiclink.com (fastnet.magiclink.com [199.104.22.8]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA32721 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:47:09 -0400 From: mailohost@cyberhighway.net Received: from 199.104.22.2.magiclink.com [204.134.240.139] by fastnet.magiclink.com (SMTPD32-4.03) id AFC8D6F013E; Sun, 05 Apr 1998 21:45:12 MST Message-ID: <3528505A.5BA2@cyberhighway.net> Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 21:47:38 -0600 X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04Gold (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Marine FI was RE: Projection References: <47D5AD54221AD111873F00600831A35B13201B@ds9> <35253370.2CE2F042@mcn.net> <35257940.78DD@huron.net> <3525B0FA.60D2068E@mcn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Anyone else find they're constantly looking at a marine >engine when running a long stretch at 5500 RPM and just >waiting for a bang? >Just for curiosity's sake, what do some of you 4 cycle >marine guys redline at? What engine? My 351W in an inboard 'tournament' Malibu Skier turns all of 3900 rpms. It's low 'cause I live at 4500 ft elevation. I'm in the process of adding GT-40 heads and converting to a roller cam to get back what's lost to altitude. You have a point about reliability, but I still want to pursue FI because of the frequent trips I make to high elevation lakes (6500 ft). I'm also after nearly instant starts: My setup takes a fair amount of cranking when fully warm. I expect I'll carry my old carb and mech. fuel pump on board with me just in case... Funny, but I don't worry about this setup going bang. Don't know why, just doesn't worry me. Now my old Evinrude 125 horse, THAT one DID go bang. Twice. Once the propshaft broke and a nearly new stainless prop headed for the bottom, and once a piston pin broke. Actually made it back on three. Mike Jones From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 5 23:52:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA00042 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:52:20 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from emerald.tufts.edu (pmdf@emerald.tufts.edu [130.64.1.16]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA00038 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:52:19 -0400 Received: from tufts.edu (st1254.tc.tufts.edu) by emerald.tufts.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #23568) with ESMTP id <0EQZ00NGB43749@emerald.tufts.edu> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:52:20 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 23:52:36 -0400 From: Andris Skulte Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <35285184.681F8862@tufts.edu> X-Envelope-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <01bd6100$8e47b400$1b198fd1@nacelp> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > > >From what I've got programmed, it should be in closed loop above 100 > >degrees coolant, > > Sure it's F, and not C? Pretty sure, since the default is 140, and that is kinda hot in C for coolant :) > Does the O2 need to swing for it to look awake to the ecm. ie, it's > so rich, that it doesn't "look" right to the ecm. Were ya using a 1.8 > msec base pulse?. Might try way down like 1.5, just a guess. DFI doesn't have a base pulse feature. The fuel map is rpm vs MAP, and the values are pulsewidths. At the 1 bar row, the values go from 7.7ms@400rpm, peak at 9.15@4000, and go back down to 8.5@5200. DFI lets you reduce the value of the whole map by a certain percentage, and I tried 93%(7% reduction) to see if there was an 02 change (wasn't). I'm leery of leaning it out too much, since I'm afraid of detonation and blowing up the motor... I'll hood up the DIY_EFI o2meter onto it as soon as I build another one (first one croaked after a cold spell) FWIW, I'm running 30# injectors, on a 320hp (350 w/ SR intake maybe) V8 motor and batch fire speed density injection. I can email DFI files to anyone that is interested, or can help. Thanks again :) Andris From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 00:08:58 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA00276 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 00:08:58 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA00271 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 00:08:56 -0400 Received: from mail.utexas.edu by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via SMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id AAA24682; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 00:08:55 -0400 Received: (qmail 11240 invoked by uid 0); 6 Apr 1998 04:08:55 -0000 Received: from piglet.cc.utexas.edu (128.83.42.61) by mail.utexas.edu with SMTP; 6 Apr 1998 04:08:55 -0000 Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:08:55 -0500 (CDT) From: Robert Wilkinson X-Sender: rw@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: DIY_EFI Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems In-Reply-To: <35282C5D.26FBEC30@tufts.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > just stays into open loop. Idle, cruise, whatever, it is still in open > loop. A weird symptom is the 02 is always 806mV at whatever throttle I'm > at. I richened the entire fuel map 10% to raise the o2's, but it still 1rst, a constant 806 mV o2 reading indicates a *very* rich condition, and the A/F bar will stop toggling when this happens. Try leaning up the fuel values in that area, and see if you can get the bar to start toggling. 2nd, how do you know it's in open loop?? The only way I know of to determine that is to see if the A/F bar is toggling or not. There are 4 possible conditions: 1: bar is there, but doesnt toggle; means way too rich. 2: bar is not there at all; means it is in closed loop. 3: bar is on right side of 14.7; means it's too lean. 4: bar is toggling to the left of 14.7, means you're values are good in that area (for cruising and light throttle). '86 Z28 350 DFI Richmond 6-speed Robert Wilkinson http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~rw From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 00:08:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA00272 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 00:08:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.utexas.edu (mail.utexas.edu [128.83.126.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA00264 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 00:08:54 -0400 Received: (qmail 11240 invoked by uid 0); 6 Apr 1998 04:08:55 -0000 Received: from piglet.cc.utexas.edu (128.83.42.61) by mail.utexas.edu with SMTP; 6 Apr 1998 04:08:55 -0000 Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:08:55 -0500 (CDT) From: Robert Wilkinson X-Sender: rw@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: DIY_EFI Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems In-Reply-To: <35282C5D.26FBEC30@tufts.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > just stays into open loop. Idle, cruise, whatever, it is still in open > loop. A weird symptom is the 02 is always 806mV at whatever throttle I'm > at. I richened the entire fuel map 10% to raise the o2's, but it still 1rst, a constant 806 mV o2 reading indicates a *very* rich condition, and the A/F bar will stop toggling when this happens. Try leaning up the fuel values in that area, and see if you can get the bar to start toggling. 2nd, how do you know it's in open loop?? The only way I know of to determine that is to see if the A/F bar is toggling or not. There are 4 possible conditions: 1: bar is there, but doesnt toggle; means way too rich. 2: bar is not there at all; means it is in closed loop. 3: bar is on right side of 14.7; means it's too lean. 4: bar is toggling to the left of 14.7, means you're values are good in that area (for cruising and light throttle). '86 Z28 350 DFI Richmond 6-speed Robert Wilkinson http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~rw From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 02:17:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA01630 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 02:17:48 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from geocities.com (mail4.geocities.com [209.1.224.24]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA01626 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 02:17:45 -0400 Received: from Default (slper12p48.ozemail.com.au [203.108.227.184]) by geocities.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA16446 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:17:27 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:17:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804060617.XAA16446@geocities.com> X-Sender: dzorde@mail.geocities.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: dzorde@geocities.com (dzorde) Subject: Re: HEI timing jump Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Use a signal amp with voltage controlled gain, a F-V converted will give you the increasing voltage as your rpm's increase, which in turn will bump the gain on your amp. A neat little all hardware method. Dan dzorde@geocities.com >Would it be possible to build a signal amplifier for hall >effect switches that will increase module trigger voltage as >rpm increases? Seems like this is what you need. > >Shannen > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 02:24:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA01661 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 02:24:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from geocities.com (mail4.geocities.com [209.1.224.24]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA01657 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 02:24:32 -0400 Received: from Default (slper12p48.ozemail.com.au [203.108.227.184]) by geocities.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA19907 for ; Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:24:27 -0700 (PDT) Date: Sun, 5 Apr 1998 23:24:27 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804060624.XAA19907@geocities.com> X-Sender: dzorde@mail.geocities.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: dzorde@geocities.com (dzorde) Subject: Re: plasma injection system Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Try Scotty, should be able to get you at leadt warp 5. Dan dzorde@geocities.com >Would like to know if anyone interested in making low cost >laser injection system for drag racing. >It needs to heat 0.6 cu. in. of air to 54000 F one inch behind the >driver at 20 times a sec. Also a large air injector is needed to spin >the car for stability. More details are in April, 98 Discover Mag. >page 32. > >alex > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 05:48:50 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA02994 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 05:48:50 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from crianlarich.indigo-avs.com (crianlarich.indigo-avs.com [194.200.210.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id FAA02989 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 05:48:46 -0400 Received: by crianlarich.indigo-avs.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BD6149.34C19290@crianlarich.indigo-avs.com>; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 10:46:08 +0100 Message-ID: From: Robert Humphris To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Snake oil too?? High Temp Coatings Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 10:46:07 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 Encoding: 18 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have been away for a few days, and got this so if the thread has progressed.. On the outside of the turbo you should be fine, I would not put the internals of the housing up against a grit blast. What I would do though, is apply it a little way down the inside of inlet and outlet of the housing. While I was at it I would put WSX on the shaft and turbine bearingings, and also coat the outside of the compressor housing but using DFL >---------- >From: d houlton x0710[SMTP:tc75918@hpnfssvr.mdhc.mdc.com] >Would this stuff work on the turbine housing of a turbo? Seems like >it would if it works on headers, but I've seen pictures with the turbine >red hot while I've never seen headers glow quite so brightly. What is >the temp limit for these coatings? > > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 07:05:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA03656 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 07:05:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mbox.ualr.edu (mbox.ualr.edu [144.167.10.38]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA03652 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 07:05:25 -0400 Received: from vn-gateway by UALR.EDU (PMDF V4.2-11 #15587) id <01IVJELP2OC00000A4@UALR.EDU>; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 06:05:20 CDT Date: Sun, 05 Apr 1998 20:08:00 -0500 From: dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams) Subject: Re: LT-1 questions from a beginner To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <462740.7.uupcb@chaos.lrk.ar.us> Organization: The Courts of Chaos * Jacksonville AR USA * 501-985-0059 X-Envelope-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -> i would be nervous about doing that,your motor have (according to all -> my sources) 10:1 compression and according to the naisso web -> site,they even have 10.5:1 compression so unless you're going to coat -> the cylinder head,piston and take great care about anything that can -> play a role in detonation,i would not do that if i where you. My 2-liter Ford engine is fully coated, pistons, valves, combustion, chambers, and ports are thermal barrier coated. With 11.5:1 on regular gas I can advance the timing until it no longer runs and it still won't ping. Of course, it takes forever to get any warm water for the heater in the winter time, but that's the breaks... From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 07:06:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA03674 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 07:06:21 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from post.mail.demon.net (post-31.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.41]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id HAA03669 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 07:06:20 -0400 From: martin@mgass.demon.co.uk Received: from (mgass.demon.co.uk) [158.152.172.199] by post.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 1.82 #2) id 0yM9jF-0005oX-00; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:06:18 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:02:34 +0000 Subject: OBD-II (related to LT1 EFI) Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Message-Id: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I wonder if there are vehicles out there that have a J1962 16 pin socket but are not OBD-II. I have a European GM car that appears to be this way (CarComp won't work with it) yet the error codes the ECU logs are definately OBD-II P0XXX codes. (It has pin 7 but no pin 10 or 10). I have noted on the Actron site that they have a NON-OBD-II ScanTool that works with US GM vehicles, some of which need a special 16pin J1962 adaptor cable. The OBD-II module is a separate option for a different list of cars again.. So it looks to me that some manufacturers are fitting the J1962 connector (presumable for standardisation reasons) but not implementing the OBD-II protocols unless they are forced to (which in Europe they do not have to...yet!). The question remains about my GM vehicle... is it perhaps OBD-I or a GM proprietary protocol ? Is OBD-I as well defined as OBD-II (and where is it defined). regards, Martin ----------------------------------------------------------- martin@mgass.demon.co.uk ----------------------------------------------------------- From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 08:08:40 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA04317 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 08:08:40 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.enter.net (root@mail.enter.net [204.170.70.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA04312 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 08:08:37 -0400 From: rbraun@mail.enter.net Received: from rbraun (m40atwn-1-9.enter.net [204.170.16.19]) by mail.enter.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA16125 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 08:08:34 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804061208.IAA16125@mail.enter.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 20:12:22 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems Priority: normal In-reply-to: <35285184.681F8862@tufts.edu> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sounds like your too rich or the O2 sensor is not working, E-mail me your file and I'll look at it, I'm running Calmap V6.2 > > DFI doesn't have a base pulse feature. The fuel map is rpm vs MAP, and > the values are pulsewidths. At the 1 bar row, the values go from > 7.7ms@400rpm, peak at 9.15@4000, and go back down to 8.5@5200. DFI lets > you reduce the value of the whole map by a certain percentage, and I > tried 93%(7% reduction) to see if there was an 02 change (wasn't). I'm > leery of leaning it out too much, since I'm afraid of detonation and > blowing up the motor... I'll hood up the DIY_EFI o2meter onto it as soon > as I build another one (first one croaked after a cold spell) FWIW, I'm > running 30# injectors, on a 320hp (350 w/ SR intake maybe) V8 motor and > batch fire speed density injection. I can email DFI files to anyone that > is interested, or can help. Thanks again :) > > Andris > > Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 08:58:37 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA04674 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 08:58:37 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from student.canberra.edu.au (student.canberra.edu.au [137.92.12.102]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA04670 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 08:58:32 -0400 Received: from by student.canberra.edu.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA01779; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:58:30 +1000 (EST) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:58:30 +1000 (EST) From: Bruno! To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: X-ray...... In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Sun, 5 Apr 1998, MRASHAN wrote: > In a message dated 98-04-04 23:50:46 EST, you write: > > << frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com >> > Hi Fred.....i saw your post about your hospital work. I have been installing > CAT Scanners and MRI Scanners for the last 15 years. i never though about > using them to explore engine / electronics parts. So you could see any tumors in engine blocks.. sounds like a good idea :) Bruno. (b.marzano@student.canberra.edu.au) Diet sig: low bandwidth signature From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 09:12:40 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA04831 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 09:12:40 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from rs422.bb-elec.com ([206.1.0.38]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA04827 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 09:12:38 -0400 Received: from mfahrion.bb-elec.com ([206.1.0.170]) by rs422.bb-elec.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) ID# 103-48821U100L100S0) with SMTP id AAA151 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 08:12:38 -0500 From: mfahrion@bb-elec.com (Mike Fahrion) To: Subject: Re: OBD-II (related to LT1 EFI) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 08:12:35 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd615d$aad6d260$aa0001ce@mfahrion.bb-elec.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >I wonder if there are vehicles out there that have a J1962 16 pin >socket but are not OBD-II. Absolutely. It does add to the confusion. Many 1995 LT1's were shipped like this. The absolute way to tell is by looking at the pin configuration. >I have a European GM car that appears to be this way (CarComp won't >work with it) yet the error codes the ECU logs are definately OBD-II >P0XXX codes. (It has pin 7 but no pin 10 or 10). hmmmm - sounds like an iso9141 configuration - what model/year car? Where was it mfg'ed? How are you reading the error codes? I am trying to add as much relevant information as I can on this subject to our web site at www.obdii.com. It does seem like there is a large fuzzy line during the transition to obdii where it was gradually phased in. Obviously its a little easier to tell in the states. >I have noted on the Actron site that they have a NON-OBD-II ScanTool >that works with US GM vehicles, some of which need a special 16pin >J1962 adaptor cable. The OBD-II module is a separate option for a >different list of cars again.. > >So it looks to me that some manufacturers are fitting the J1962 >connector (presumable for standardisation reasons) but not >implementing the OBD-II protocols unless they are forced to >(which in Europe they do not have to...yet!). > >The question remains about my GM vehicle... is it perhaps OBD-I or a >GM proprietary protocol ? >Is OBD-I as well defined as OBD-II (and where is it defined). > >regards, > >Martin >----------------------------------------------------------- >martin@mgass.demon.co.uk >----------------------------------------------------------- > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 09:25:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA05052 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 09:25:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mailgw1a.lmco.com (mailgw1a.lmco.com [192.31.106.7]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA05048 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 09:25:26 -0400 Received: from emss02g01.ems.lmco.com (emss02g01.ems.lmco.com [198.7.15.39]) by mailgw1a.lmco.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA25713 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 07:25:26 -0600 (MDT) Received: from quest ([143.114.72.6]) by lmco.com (PMDF V5.1-10 #20543) with SMTP id <0EQZ00O3MUMD3N@lmco.com> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 07:25:25 -0600 (MDT) Received: from cliffy.lmtas.lmco.com by quest (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id IAA09215; Mon, 06 Apr 1998 08:25:24 -0500 Received: from lmtas.lmco.com by cliffy.lmtas.lmco.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id IAA21832; Mon, 06 Apr 1998 08:25:23 -0500 Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 08:25:22 -0500 From: Joe Boucher Subject: Re: Automotive Applications Handbook for 67F687 and 67F6612 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <3528D7C1.E111FE2@lmtas.lmco.com> Organization: Lockheed Martin MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win95; U) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <002e01bd5f54$94eb92c0$acfffed0@default> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Try: ftp://efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu/incoming David wrote: > Greetings all, > > I just finished scanning the Automotive Applications Handbook for 67F687 and > 67F6612. > > Where do I put the collections of files? > > Thanks for the opportunity to help. > > David Edwards From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 09:59:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA05746 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 09:59:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from post.mail.demon.net (post-30.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.40]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA05735 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 09:59:38 -0400 From: martin@mgass.demon.co.uk Received: from (mgass.demon.co.uk) [158.152.172.199] by post.mail.demon.net with smtp (Exim 1.82 #2) id 0yMCQu-0005Qv-00; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:59:35 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:54:19 +0000 Subject: Re: OBD-II (related to LT1 EFI) Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.10) Message-Id: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mike, Thanks for the reply, further info as follows : > The absolute way to tell is by looking at the pin configuration. > ..Should have read ...has pin 7, but no pin 10 or 2. > >I have a European GM car that appears to be this way (CarComp won't > >work with it..etc etc > hmmmm - sounds like an iso9141 configuration - what model/year car? Where > was it mfg'ed? How are you reading the error codes? ..1996 Vauxhall Omega 2ltr (SimTec ECU), model first released 1994. Marketed in US as Cadillac Catera (but with different engines & different ECU ?) ...Car had some problems with Crank Sensor (now fixed), can read the error codes by connecting pins 4 & 6 (if I remember correct) to get the MIL to blink the codes. (Code was 01335). CarComp OBDTool does not get beyond the break sequence, i.e. the ScanTool does not see a 55H back from the ECU at the ECU preferred baud rate (was expecting 10.4Kb). Also got access to a GM Tec 2 Scanner (briefly unfortunately), this confirmed error codes. ..Do you have any info on OBD-I ? > I am trying to add as much relevant information as I can on this subject to > our web site at www.obdii.com. ...Yes i've been there...looks like will be a great site. regards, Martin ----------------------------------------------------------- martin@mgass.demon.co.uk ----------------------------------------------------------- From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 10:54:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA06492 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 10:54:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ultra2.syspac.com (ultra2.syspac.com [204.96.14.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA06488 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 10:54:19 -0400 Received: from mailrelay.syspac.com ([204.96.14.7]) by ultra2.syspac.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-37030U5000L500S0) with ESMTP id AAA3673 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 07:52:00 -0700 Received: from p57065.syspac.com (p57065.syspac.com [204.181.57.65]) by mailrelay.syspac.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA03661 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 07:51:58 -0700 (MST) From: bamcknig@postoffice.syspac.com Message-Id: <199804061451.HAA03661@mailrelay.syspac.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 08:10:59 +0000 Subject: Re: HEI timing jump Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Dan The amp sounds interesting, but I wonder if you will have the angular shift of the trigger voltage that you get with the reluctor. I suspect that the hall device works over a narrower range(crank rotation) than the reluctor. If anybody trys this, please publish your results. Bob McKnight Phx AZ From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 11:01:14 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA06572 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 11:01:14 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from crianlarich.indigo-avs.com (crianlarich.indigo-avs.com [194.200.210.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA06568 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 11:01:13 -0400 Received: by crianlarich.indigo-avs.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BD6174.DCA3E0F0@crianlarich.indigo-avs.com>; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 15:58:38 +0100 Message-ID: From: Robert Humphris To: "'Fuel Injection List'" Subject: Average fuel maps Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 15:58:35 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 Encoding: 15 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi, Does anyone out there have some average figures for the injector 'on-times' that you would expect to see on an engine? I would imagine that they would fall into a similar set of values as the size and flow of an injector would be selected to suit the engine, so what I am wanting is to try and generate a list of typical injector durations for say a 4, 6, 8 and perhaps 12 cylinder engines, so that it is possible to start a mapping with very 'ball park' figures based on some statistical stuff... Cheers Rob Humphris From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 11:36:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA07189 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 11:36:53 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ilios.engin.umich.edu (root@ilios.engin.umich.edu [141.212.134.59]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA07185 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 11:36:52 -0400 Received: from localhost (brunov@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by ilios.engin.umich.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA12391 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 11:36:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 11:36:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Bruno P Vanzieleghem To: DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Honda F2 injectors. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I am looking for suitable injectors for a Honda F2 engine (600cc). We are running the engine with a 20 mm restricter. Does anyone know of suitable injectors (at a reasonable price). Bruno Vanzieleghem From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 11:50:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA07472 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 11:50:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ds9.symtx.com (ds9.symtx.com [38.242.16.12]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA07468 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 11:50:14 -0400 Received: by ds9 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id <2NDB9BKH>; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 10:50:09 -0500 Message-ID: <47D5AD54221AD111873F00600831A35B133F71@ds9> From: Greg Woods To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: DIY_EFI Digest V3 #148 Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 10:50:08 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Anyone else find they're constantly looking at a marine > engine when running a long stretch at 5500 RPM and just > waiting for a bang? > Just for curiosity's sake, what do some of you 4 cycle > marine guys redline at? What engine? I have the mercruiser 4.3L w/ the "thunderbolt" ignition in a 91 18' sea ray. I'm pretty sure the manual says to not exceed 4800 RPM. Greg Woods gwoods@symtx.com austin, tx From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 12:16:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA07990 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:16:42 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from eris.web-plus.dk (www.web-plus.dk [195.78.64.12]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA07986 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:16:40 -0400 Received: from nez (arhppp1.web.dk [195.78.73.1]) by eris.web-plus.dk (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA24061 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 18:16:55 +0200 (CEST) Message-Id: <199804061616.SAA24061@eris.web-plus.dk> From: "Niels Ezerman" To: Subject: Re: OBD-II (related to LT1 EFI) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 18:15:46 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello Martin, > 1996 Vauxhall Omega 2ltr (SimTec ECU), model first released 1994. > Marketed in US as Cadillac Catera (but with different engines & > different ECU ?) My best guess is, there is no OBD-II program code in the ECU. At the moment i know that in Europe a few Saab 9000, Volvo 850 and Lotus will communicate with fx. CarComp OBDTool. I am going to a SAE OBD-II meeting in Belgium at the end of this month, i hope to know more about the state of OBD-II here in Europe then. Niels Ezerman Silkeborg, DK nez@cybernet.dk http://www.cybernet.dk/users/nez From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 12:21:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA08088 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:21:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA08084 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:21:30 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-48.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.117]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id MAA16079 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:20:35 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Average fuel maps Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:20:59 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6177$fc1b6c20$75198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Robert Humphris To: 'Fuel Injection List' Date: Monday, April 06, 1998 11:40 AM Subject: Average fuel maps >Does anyone out there have some average figures for the injector >'on-times' that you would expect to see on an engine? I would imagine >that they would fall into a similar set of values as the size and flow >of an injector would be selected to suit the engine, so what I am >wanting is to try and generate a list of typical injector durations for >say a 4, 6, 8 and perhaps 12 cylinder engines, so that it is possible to >start a mapping with very 'ball park' figures based on some statistical >stuff... >Cheers >Rob Humphris >From what I just heard was 1-5ms for TBI, and 2-10 for Port. No worries mate Bruce From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 12:47:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA08672 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:47:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from rs422.bb-elec.com ([206.1.0.38]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA08666 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:47:30 -0400 Received: from mfahrion.bb-elec.com ([206.1.0.170]) by rs422.bb-elec.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) ID# 103-48821U100L100S0) with SMTP id AAA314 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 11:47:27 -0500 From: mfahrion@bb-elec.com (Mike Fahrion) To: Subject: Re: OBD-II (related to LT1 EFI) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 11:47:25 -0500 Message-ID: <01bd617b$ada0a520$aa0001ce@mfahrion.bb-elec.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >> >I have a European GM car that appears to be this way (CarComp won't >> >work with it..etc etc >> hmmmm - sounds like an iso9141 configuration - what model/year car? Where >> was it mfg'ed? How are you reading the error codes? >..1996 Vauxhall Omega 2ltr (SimTec ECU), model first released 1994. >Marketed in US as Cadillac Catera (but with different engines & >different ECU ?) hmmmm - the US version of the Cadillac Catera uses the ISO9141 implementation of OBDII. >...Car had some problems with Crank Sensor (now fixed), can read the error >codes by connecting pins 4 & 6 (if I remember correct) to get the MIL to >blink the codes. (Code was 01335). I think if it was true obdii this wouldn't have worked. >CarComp OBDTool does not get beyond the break sequence, i.e. the ScanTool >does not see a 55H back from the ECU at the ECU preferred baud rate (was >expecting 10.4Kb). That pretty well rules out ISO9141. I think you're on the right track with "obd-i". You get into a real grey area here though since this isn't really a standard the way obdii is. The guy at carcomp has some expertise in pre-obdii german cars (vw in particular), perhaps he could offer some insight. Good Luck -mike >Also got access to a GM Tec 2 Scanner (briefly unfortunately), this >confirmed error codes. >..Do you have any info on OBD-I ? >regards, > >Martin >----------------------------------------------------------- >martin@mgass.demon.co.uk >----------------------------------------------------------- From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 13:25:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA09343 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 13:25:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mx.seanet.com (dns2.seanet.com [199.181.164.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA09332 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 13:25:47 -0400 Received: from lino-pc (ab01.dialup.seanet.com [207.12.134.1]) by mx.seanet.com (8.8.8/Seanet-8.7.3) with SMTP id KAB17150 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 10:25:42 -0700 (PDT) From: "Lino Verna" To: Subject: Re: Honda F2 injectors. Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 10:22:51 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6180$a09e9ee0$2a5c8080@lino-pc> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Smells like formula SAE to me.... We injected an FZR 600 when I was working on the project a couple years ago with University of Washington. If I remember right, we searched up and down to find a suitable OEM source. Then we called Siemens and they helped us figure exactly what size and spray pattern we needed, then they made us custom injectors to that spec, then they gave us 8 of them! GOD BLESS SIEMENS. I would try to do the same. Remember, Siemens is an awfully big company, so you need to find the right contact in the right division. Not an easy task I am afraid, and as I was not the one who talked to them, I am not gonna be able to help you much in that direction either. Good Luck lino >I am looking for suitable injectors for a Honda F2 engine (600cc). We are >running the engine with a 20 mm restricter. Does anyone know of suitable >injectors (at a reasonable price). > >Bruno Vanzieleghem > > > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 14:02:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA09870 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:02:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA09866 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:02:43 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp118.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.118]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA03905; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:05:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 13:00:43 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Dave Williams cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT-1 questions from a beginner In-Reply-To: <462740.7.uupcb@chaos.lrk.ar.us> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > My 2-liter Ford engine is fully coated, pistons, valves, combustion, > chambers, and ports are thermal barrier coated. With 11.5:1 on regular > gas I can advance the timing until it no longer runs and it still won't > ping. > > Of course, it takes forever to get any warm water for the heater in the > winter time, but that's the breaks... i guess your engine have aluminium cylinder (does it's a zetec ??) unless it's a destroked ford 2.3 unit,aluminium head reject more temperature than iron head (Impala SS LT1 have iron head unlike their LT1 counterpart from the F-body and Y-body),your cylinder head is coated,the LT1 is not,but if you have a destroked 2.3,the LT1 has an advantage compared to your setup,it's reverse cooled (if you have the zetec,i think you have reverse cooling too but i'm not sure),the way EGR counter detonation is by introducing inert gas in the cylinder at part trottle (it dont need it when WOT,the mix is rich enough),these inert gas prevent hot spot in the head because cylinder pressure is not too high and the head are cooler,hope all this helped. Alain Toussaint p.s.how much power does your 2.0 liter make and does it has good trottle reaction too,i'm just currious ?? From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 14:03:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA09894 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:03:19 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA09882 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:03:16 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id OAA15347; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:02:54 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA00269 for ; Mon, 06 Apr 1998 14:02:07 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 14:02:07 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804061802.OAA00269@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980406135635.007a96b0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 13:56:35 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Removing Electronic Parts In-Reply-To: <199804052309.QAA03520@gonzo.wolfenet.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19980405121209.007a8150@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >I suppose the hot air gun on high would deal with the surface mount... >of course, it may be difficult finding the little Rs and Cs after they get >blown across the room! Could be. That's one method I haven't tried yet. Though a shopvac with a mesh screen (window screen) over the end certainly is one way of catching them. >all the circuitry. Applying the wire snips would make short work of most Put the board edge into your vice, and use a good quality serraded bread knive, cut everything off in one shot. Watch your fingers. I've done this one successfully. I knew Ginsu Knives would come in useful. And no, don't use a BBQ (that was to you Sandy ) >of it! It certainly worked for the pressure sensor when I upgraded from >the stock 2.0 bar to a motorola 2.5 bar. Good Orin, very good :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 14:08:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA10077 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:08:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA10073 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:08:10 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id OAA15483; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:08:10 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA00195 for ; Mon, 06 Apr 1998 14:07:21 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 14:07:21 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804061807.OAA00195@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980406140559.007b3a10@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 14:05:59 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: X-ray...... In-Reply-To: References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >So you could see any tumors in engine blocks.. sounds like a good >idea :) X-raying an engine block I would imagine would be a pain in the ass, since medical X-ray equipment is designed to handle bodies rather than blocks. To properly X-ray a block, one would have to put the x-ray head against the outside of the block, and put the film inside the cylinder walls. I don't see how to get all angles, and all shots easily. Nor, how to carry in a Buick V6 into the ER. A circuit board is one thing :) Well, back to your regularly programming of DIYEFI :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 14:12:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA10211 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:12:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA10206 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:12:23 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp135.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.135]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA04023 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:15:33 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 13:10:30 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: plasma injection system In-Reply-To: <199804060624.XAA19907@geocities.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > >Would like to know if anyone interested in making low cost > >laser injection system for drag racing. > >It needs to heat 0.6 cu. in. of air to 54000 F one inch behind the > >driver at 20 times a sec. Also a large air injector is needed to spin > >the car for stability. More details are in April, 98 Discover Mag. > >page 32. > > > >alex > > can someone explain what's this ????? (sound something straight out of the nasa lab !!!) Alain Toussaint From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 14:45:37 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA11073 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:45:37 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA11068 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:45:33 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm303-166.mcn.net [208.26.146.166]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA09325 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 12:45:23 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <35291FED.820DF5CA@mcn.net> Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 12:33:17 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: X-ray...... References: <3.0.5.32.19980406140559.007b3a10@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > Nor, how to carry in a > Buick V6 into the ER. > > A circuit board is one thing :) > Well, back to your regularly programming of DIYEFI :) > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > Homebrew Automotive Website: > http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HMMWV > 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car Glue enough wires to it and it can pass as "special test equipment" Shannen From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 15:13:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA11628 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 15:13:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA11623 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 15:13:41 -0400 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp64.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.64]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA28170 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:13:38 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <35292A95.248E@genevaonline.com> Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 14:18:45 -0500 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: high rpm "popping" sound Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I was out 4-wheeling (yup, in the mud) sunday and noticed something. This is my first high-rpm run with this truck/motor. 4500-5000 rpm, 454 with holley projection, 268 cam, headers, alum intake, etc. It sounded like an ignition miss. I have a new accell blueprint HEI (electronic advance) with all new accell parts except the coil, which is probably 100 years old. Also running 34 degrees total ignition advance. I recorded a run on the laptop, and analyzed it. I could not see much of a pattern except that it only occurs over 4500 rpm. The O2 almost the entire time was around 60 mV. Normal cruising usually reads around 85 mV. Here's the question(s): Will the O2 read correctly under very heavy throttle (50% and up), and if so, does 60mV sound lean, and could my popping sound be from running lean? Could this be my ignition? The only original part is the HEI coil. The spark plugs are brand new and gapped according to the manual (can't remember what, tho). And lastly, could this be valve float? I know that big-block chevrolets are known to do this, but i have never experienced it, so i don't know if it is or not! Thanks in advance for everyones help. -- Andy Quaas From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 15:13:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA11635 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 15:13:47 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA11630 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 15:13:46 -0400 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp64.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.64]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id OAA28178 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 14:13:46 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <35292A95.248E@genevaonline.com> Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 14:18:54 -0500 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: high rpm "popping" sound Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I was out 4-wheeling (yup, in the mud) sunday and noticed something. This is my first high-rpm run with this truck/motor. 4500-5000 rpm, 454 with holley projection, 268 cam, headers, alum intake, etc. It sounded like an ignition miss. I have a new accell blueprint HEI (electronic advance) with all new accell parts except the coil, which is probably 100 years old. Also running 34 degrees total ignition advance. I recorded a run on the laptop, and analyzed it. I could not see much of a pattern except that it only occurs over 4500 rpm. The O2 almost the entire time was around 60 mV. Normal cruising usually reads around 85 mV. Here's the question(s): Will the O2 read correctly under very heavy throttle (50% and up), and if so, does 60mV sound lean, and could my popping sound be from running lean? Could this be my ignition? The only original part is the HEI coil. The spark plugs are brand new and gapped according to the manual (can't remember what, tho). And lastly, could this be valve float? I know that big-block chevrolets are known to do this, but i have never experienced it, so i don't know if it is or not! Thanks in advance for everyones help. -- Andy Quaas From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 16:50:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA12880 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 16:50:25 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.clarityconnect.com (mail.clarityconnect.com [206.64.143.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA12875 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 16:50:23 -0400 Received: from LOCALNAME (206.114.169.11) by mail.clarityconnect.com with SMTP (Eudora Internet Mail Server 2.0.1); Mon, 6 Apr 1998 16:51:49 -0400 Message-ID: <35296A9C.54F1@clarityconnect.com> Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 16:51:56 -0700 From: Scot Sealander X-Mailer: Mozilla 2.02E-KIT (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: File needed References: <01bd60e6$d22f4620$4c198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > What does "This file is NG", mean?. NG = No good. > What does "There is a bit picked in a lot of locations", mean?.. That is what is wrong with the file. Bits on in the same bit location at various addresses. Scot Sealander Sealand@clarityconnect.com From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 21:08:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA14997 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 21:08:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from Edison.EBICom.Net (root@Edison.EBICom.Net [205.218.114.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA14991 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 21:08:23 -0400 Received: from s1-41.EBICom.Net (s2-79.EBICom.Net [206.26.198.79]) by Edison.EBICom.Net with SMTP id UAA17304 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 20:08:20 -0500 Message-ID: <352997C5.49B6@ra.msstate.edu> Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 20:04:37 -0700 From: Steve N Organization: Home X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DIYEFI Subject: Home Dyno/ 2d v 3d/ new list? Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > There's a software package called Home Dyno for $40 bucks that does > this. Speaking of the home dyno, has anyone tried this? It looks to be a great idea, and would be alot cheaper than real dyno time. Granted it may not be a spot on as a dyno would be, but it seems like it would be perfect for dialing in a aftermarket EFI system. Comments? Next I have some questions on 2d vs 3d. Now from what I understand 2d is a system where two values are entered and one numebr pops out for the computer to make use of. If this is true, this is a 2d system right: ftp://ftp.mr2.com/pub/geoff/mr2/sw20inj3.gif Or is it a 3d system, and they just do not show the 3rd axis, and just show the maximum vaules for the z? I guess it could be both, it just depends on if the vaue for the z axis is variable. Now a 3d system would once again input 2 numbers thus isolating a single axis paralle to the z-axis. Then the final number would be output based on what the z-axis said. Right? Finally I must say that I love this list! There is all kinds of great talk to get you thinking. And while I know this is a EFI list, it is obvious that we easliy and often go into other non-EFI subjects most notabley Turbos and engine desgin. (the huge thread on variable compression was great!) Now while this does not bother me in any way, I was wondering if it would be a good idea to start a sperate list that is devoted to just these things, so that we would not bother those that doesn't like reading all that stuff. Unless of course everyone on this list likes it. The High-performacne engine desgin and forced induction list. (HPED&FIL, it just rolls off the touge doesn't it? :) Steve N. From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 21:25:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA15183 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 21:25:25 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA15177 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 21:25:12 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp22.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.152]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id UAA14917 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 20:25:29 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <35297EE0.54962745@mwt.net> Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 20:18:24 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu" Subject: EFI PC proto board X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Cleaning out the the lab and something has to go so I decided to sell my PC AT and XT proto boards. I will sell the XT cards for $15, AT cards for $20 + COD and shipping or if you trust me send a check to save COD charge . These cards are full size cards with the whole card filled with machine tool gold plated wire wrap pins covering the whole board would make a great EFI PC project card . Hope no one is offended by this just want members to get first shot. PLEASE CONTACT ME OFF LINE. Steven Gorkowski kb4mxo@mwt.net From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 21:27:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA15226 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 21:27:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA15222 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 21:27:16 -0400 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn24-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.183]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA07831 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 21:24:44 -0400 Message-ID: <3529819E.3ABE@huron.net> Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 21:30:06 -0400 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: HEI timing jump References: <199804060617.XAA16446@geocities.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu dzorde wrote: > > Use a signal amp with voltage controlled gain, a F-V converted will give you > the increasing voltage as your rpm's increase, which in turn will bump the > gain on your amp. A neat little all hardware method. > > Dan dzorde@geocities.com > > >Would it be possible to build a signal amplifier for hall > >effect switches that will increase module trigger voltage as > >rpm increases? Seems like this is what you need. > > > >Shannen > > Still won't work. It is not the absolute voltage that mnatters. Digital at ANY voltage will not produce the advance. It is the RATE OF RIZE of the voltage that is critical. The ignitor triggers at a particular voltage. This voltage is reached ealier or later depending onspeed due to the distictive qualities of an inductive pickup. Don't matter what you do to a switch, and a HALL device is just a switch, you will not duplicate the "built in advance" of a magnetic pickup with a hall on an HEI module. Forget trying - it will not happen. -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 22:05:55 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA15987 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:05:55 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA15981 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:05:53 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-27.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.96]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id WAA11115 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:04:59 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: HEI timing jump Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:05:23 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd61c9$a002c9e0$60198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Clare Snyder To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu dzorde wrote: >> Use a signal amp with voltage controlled gain, a F-V converted will give you >> the increasing voltage as your rpm's increase, which in turn will bump the >> gain on your amp. A neat little all hardware method. >> Dan dzorde@geocities.com >> >Would it be possible to build a signal amplifier for hall >> >effect switches that will increase module trigger voltage as >> >rpm increases? Seems like this is what you need. >> >Shannen >Still won't work. It is not the absolute voltage that mnatters. Digital >at ANY voltage will not produce the advance. It is the RATE OF RIZE of >the voltage that is critical. The ignitor triggers at a particular >voltage. This voltage is reached ealier or later depending onspeed due >to the distictive qualities of an inductive pickup. Don't matter what >you do to a switch, and a HALL device is just a switch, you will not >duplicate the "built in advance" of a magnetic pickup with a hall on an >HEI module. Forget trying - it will not happen. > Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back > E-Mail service is back to normal Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca How about flipping from a rising to a falling signal trigger, no ramping just all or nothing. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 22:19:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA16267 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:19:36 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA16261 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:19:34 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp29.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.50]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA10185; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:22:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:17:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Steve N cc: DIYEFI Subject: Re: Home Dyno/ 2d v 3d/ new list? In-Reply-To: <352997C5.49B6@ra.msstate.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > ...................so that we would not bother those that > doesn't like reading all that stuff. Unless of course everyone on this > list likes it................ wouldn't make a difference to me to start a new list for these topic or to keep them on this list (1 more list or 1 less in a pack of 10+ list,this dont make much difference on the mass of messages i receive) but i sure do like it !! Alain Toussaint From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 22:42:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA16624 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:42:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from outwest1.outwest.net (www.outwest.net [209.75.60.19]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA16619 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:42:05 -0400 Received: (from scott@localhost) by outwest1.outwest.net (8.7.5/8.7.2) id TAA19062; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 19:47:49 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 19:47:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott Croughwell X-Sender: scott@outwest1 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: DIYEFI Subject: Re: Home Dyno/ 2d v 3d/ new list? In-Reply-To: <352997C5.49B6@ra.msstate.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi gang, > > There's a software package called Home Dyno for $40 bucks that does > > this. I have this package and use it. The thing takes your vehicle data (weight, gear/final drive, coefficient of drag, etc) and combines this with a .WAV file that you record of your engine using an inductive pickup on a spark plug, to calculate engine power. Though the horsepower figures given by the program seem to be lacking in accuracy, there is a good degree of precision (ie. consistency) between runs, and this has been tremendously helpful in doing things like tuning adjustable cam sprockets and seeing if removing the air filter really does help your engine make power. For $40 and the cost of a timing light (to cut off the inductive pickup) I'd say it's a worthwhile expenditure for the home-hotrodder! -Scott From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 22:42:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA16629 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:42:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from outwest1.outwest.net (www.outwest.net [209.75.60.19]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA16625 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 22:42:07 -0400 Received: (from scott@localhost) by outwest1.outwest.net (8.7.5/8.7.2) id TAA19062; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 19:47:49 -0700 (PDT) Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 19:47:48 -0700 (PDT) From: Scott Croughwell X-Sender: scott@outwest1 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: DIYEFI Subject: Re: Home Dyno/ 2d v 3d/ new list? In-Reply-To: <352997C5.49B6@ra.msstate.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi gang, > > There's a software package called Home Dyno for $40 bucks that does > > this. I have this package and use it. The thing takes your vehicle data (weight, gear/final drive, coefficient of drag, etc) and combines this with a .WAV file that you record of your engine using an inductive pickup on a spark plug, to calculate engine power. Though the horsepower figures given by the program seem to be lacking in accuracy, there is a good degree of precision (ie. consistency) between runs, and this has been tremendously helpful in doing things like tuning adjustable cam sprockets and seeing if removing the air filter really does help your engine make power. For $40 and the cost of a timing light (to cut off the inductive pickup) I'd say it's a worthwhile expenditure for the home-hotrodder! -Scott From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 23:14:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA17298 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 23:14:36 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mxserver.forbin.com (mxserver.forbin.com [204.71.100.246]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA17294 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 23:14:34 -0400 Received: from fraser.forbin.com (x2-220.forbin.com [208.149.197.220]) by mxserver.forbin.com (2.5 Build 2630 (Berkeley 8.8.6)/8.8.4) with SMTP id WAA01129 for ; Mon, 06 Apr 1998 22:15:46 -0500 Message-Id: <3.0.2.32.19960405194505.00727a94@forbin.com> X-Sender: fraser@forbin.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.2 (32) Date: Fri, 05 Apr 1996 19:45:05 -0600 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Jennifer and Brock Fraser Subject: Re: LT-1 questions from a beginner In-Reply-To: <199804060900.FAA02743@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >> > 6. For the same reasons, I may need to remove the EGR. Is this a >> mistake??? >> >> No W.O.T power penalties, but part throttle ping and/or stumble may occur. >> And of course, more codes that aren't easily defeatable. > >i would be nervous about doing that,your motor have (according to all my >sources) 10:1 compression and according to the naisso web site,they even >have 10.5:1 compression so unless you're going to coat the cylinder >head,piston and take great care about anything that can play a role in >detonation,i would not do that if i where you. > >Alain Toussaint > >p.s.the cylinder head are retain more heat than aluminium head too I mentioned "no W.O.T power penalties" only because EGR isn't used while in Power Enrichment mode... But, at part throttle, you are right... Iron heads will accentuate the detonation potential with 10-ish:1 compression. Hopefully, the PCM will deduct spark when it sees that EGR is not operational. I think this can be expected, from what I recall. -Brock From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 23:16:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA17333 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 23:16:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from m28.boston.juno.com (m28.boston.juno.com [205.231.101.186]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA17329 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 23:16:03 -0400 Received: (from cosmic.ray@juno.com) by m28.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id XTD18556; Mon, 06 Apr 1998 23:05:31 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Mon, 6 Apr 1998 21:31:11 -0400 Subject: Re: high rpm "popping" sound Message-ID: <19980406.230435.12662.0.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> References: <35292A95.248E@genevaonline.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 3-39 From: cosmic.ray@juno.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have the rev limiter in my Pro-Jection set at 5300 RPM. Where is yours set? I have found that bouncing against the rev limiter sounds a bit like a miss. It will cut out for a fraction of a second, and cut back in. It'll keep repeating this until you let up on the throttle. In your recording, you should see the injecter volume cutting in and out. Ray Drouillard '89 Grand Wagoneer with Holley Pro-Jection 4Di (and lots of other stuff) On Mon, 06 Apr 1998 14:18:54 -0500 Squash writes: >I was out 4-wheeling (yup, in the mud) sunday and noticed something. >This is my first high-rpm run with this truck/motor. 4500-5000 rpm, 454 >with holley projection, 268 cam, headers, alum intake, etc. It sounded >like an ignition miss. I have a new accell blueprint HEI (electronic >advance) with all new accell parts except the coil, which is probably >100 years old. Also running 34 degrees total ignition advance. I >recorded a run on the laptop, and analyzed it. I could not see much of >a pattern except that it only occurs over 4500 rpm. The O2 almost the >entire time was around 60 mV. Normal cruising usually reads around 85 >mV. Here's the question(s): > >Will the O2 read correctly under very heavy throttle (50% and up), and >if so, does 60mV sound lean, and could my popping sound be from running >lean? > >Could this be my ignition? The only original part is the HEI coil. The >spark plugs are brand new and gapped according to the manual (can't >remember what, tho). > >And lastly, could this be valve float? I know that big-block chevrolets >are known to do this, but i have never experienced it, so i don't know >if it is or not! > >Thanks in advance for everyones help. >-- >Andy Quaas > _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 23:20:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA17465 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 23:20:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA17460 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 23:20:15 -0400 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn11-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.170]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA15228 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 23:17:41 -0400 Message-ID: <35299C1C.5236@huron.net> Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 23:23:08 -0400 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: HEI timing jump References: <01bd61c9$a002c9e0$60198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > > From: Clare Snyder > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > dzorde wrote: > >> Use a signal amp with voltage controlled gain, a F-V converted will give > you > >> the increasing voltage as your rpm's increase, which in turn will bump > the > >> gain on your amp. A neat little all hardware method. > >> Dan dzorde@geocities.com > >> >Would it be possible to build a signal amplifier for hall > >> >effect switches that will increase module trigger voltage as > >> >rpm increases? Seems like this is what you need. > >> >Shannen > >Still won't work. It is not the absolute voltage that mnatters. Digital > >at ANY voltage will not produce the advance. It is the RATE OF RIZE of > >the voltage that is critical. The ignitor triggers at a particular > >voltage. This voltage is reached ealier or later depending onspeed due > >to the distictive qualities of an inductive pickup. Don't matter what > >you do to a switch, and a HALL device is just a switch, you will not > >duplicate the "built in advance" of a magnetic pickup with a hall on an > >HEI module. Forget trying - it will not happen. > > Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back > > E-Mail service is back to normal > Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca > > How about flipping from a rising to a falling signal trigger, no ramping > just all or nothing. > Bruce How? The module only works one way - it fires on the way up. The only thing that will affect timing is the ramp, or rate of rise. Sorry. -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 6 23:55:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA18226 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 23:55:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from linux1.americasnet.com (root@www.americasnet.com [207.155.121.128]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA18220 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 23:55:20 -0400 Received: from beachscene.com (ppp02.americasnet.com [207.155.14.217]) by linux1.americasnet.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA29182 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 21:00:31 -0700 Message-ID: <3529A3D6.6A48F37A@beachscene.com> Date: Mon, 06 Apr 1998 20:56:06 -0700 From: gt bradley X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Home Dyno/ 2d v 3d/ new list? References: <352997C5.49B6@ra.msstate.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Steve N wrote: > > There's a software package called Home Dyno for $40 bucks that does > > this. > > Next I have some questions on 2d vs 3d. Now from what I understand 2d > is a system where two values are entered and one numebr pops out for the > computer to make use of. If this is true, this is a 2d system right: > > ftp://ftp.mr2.com/pub/geoff/mr2/sw20inj3.gif > > Or is it a 3d system, and they just do not show the 3rd axis, and just > show the maximum vaules for the z? I guess it could be both, it just > depends on if the vaue for the z axis is variable. > This is a 3D graph, two axis are shown, and the third is represented with color, Kind of like a topogragical map where you have longitude, latatude, and elevation on a 2d piece of paper. The plot is rotated, and no key is given for the Z-axis, Now maybe the 2 inputs to the system make it a 2D system, but the graph is a 3D graph. GT From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 01:59:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA19152 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 01:59:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from brain.uccs.edu (brain.uccs.edu [128.198.1.126]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id BAA19148 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 01:58:57 -0400 Received: from deadcats.uccs.edu (usrp51.uccs.edu [128.198.11.151]) by brain.uccs.edu (8.6.9/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA00867 for ; Mon, 6 Apr 1998 23:58:56 -0600 Message-Id: <199804070558.XAA00867@brain.uccs.edu> From: "mfwic" To: Subject: Re: Spare Stuff for 101 Date: Mon, 9 Mar 1998 22:53:12 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have access to a BP Micro programmer. It can read and program any PROM or PLD up to 28-pins. I would be happy to read/reprogram PROM's. E-mail me at: raklinge@mail.uccs.edu I am also building a programmer that uses the JTAG pins on PLD's larger than 28-pins. I will be using this on a regular basis in the fall semester. Rich ---------- > From: Bruce Plecan > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Spare Stuff for 101 > Date: Thursday, April 02, 1998 1:51 PM > > Does any one have any prom burning equipment to donate to the > programming project? > Major helper in this wants to do more, but needs a burner software, and > eraser. Gotta be able to do 2732A and the 128/256 style. > > Also still have a couple of the free prom packs for folks doing bench > testing with the ecms, just mail me. > > Again Thanks > Bruce If ya wanna clue about how this is going last Sat CSH HQ > did 10Mb on net traffic.. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 02:22:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA19379 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 02:22:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.utexas.edu (mail.utexas.edu [128.83.126.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA19375 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 02:22:20 -0400 Received: (qmail 3691 invoked by uid 0); 7 Apr 1998 06:22:21 -0000 Received: from piglet.cc.utexas.edu (128.83.42.61) by mail.utexas.edu with SMTP; 7 Apr 1998 06:22:21 -0000 Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 01:22:21 -0500 (CDT) From: Robert Wilkinson X-Sender: rw@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Printing a fuel map from Calmap Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does anybody know a way to print the DFI base fuel map?? '86 Z28 350 DFI Richmond 6-speed Robert Wilkinson http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~rw From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 02:38:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA19603 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 02:38:19 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo22.mx.aol.com (imo22.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.66]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA19599 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 02:38:17 -0400 Received: from A70Duster@aol.com by imo22.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8BLPa03578 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 02:37:36 -0500 (EDT) From: A70Duster Message-ID: <9d2a6c25.3529c9b2@aol.com> Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 02:37:36 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Question on header coating? Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 69 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sorry for the repeat, but what was a good product/supplier for that thermal coating diy stuff. Thanks in advance and sorry for the repeat. This time I listen better. See ya, Mike From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 03:58:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA20373 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 03:58:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from geocities.com (mail1.geocities.com [209.1.224.29]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA20369 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 03:57:58 -0400 Received: from Default (slper13p15.ozemail.com.au [203.108.46.16]) by geocities.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA15598 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 00:57:55 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 00:57:55 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804070757.AAA15598@geocities.com> X-Sender: dzorde@mail.geocities.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: dzorde@geocities.com (dzorde) Subject: Re: HEI timing jump Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu As for an actual angular shift, I can't see why not. I'm pretty sure I have seen amps that will allow you to do limited phase shifting via an external voltage as well. It would definitely be interesting if someone was to try it. Dan dzorde@geocities.com >Dan > >The amp sounds interesting, but I wonder if you will have the angular >shift of the trigger voltage that you get with the reluctor. I >suspect that the hall device works over a narrower range(crank >rotation) than the reluctor. If anybody trys this, please publish >your results. > >Bob McKnight >Phx AZ > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 04:07:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA20433 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 04:07:05 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from geocities.com (mail1.geocities.com [209.1.224.29]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA20429 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 04:07:01 -0400 Received: from Default (slper13p15.ozemail.com.au [203.108.46.16]) by geocities.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA19904 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 01:06:53 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 01:06:53 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804070806.BAA19904@geocities.com> X-Sender: dzorde@mail.geocities.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: dzorde@geocities.com (dzorde) Subject: Re: Question on header coating? Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Please, also the actual name of the products as well, so that us unfortunate souls on the other side of the world may be able to find our own supplier. Dan dzorde@geocities.com >Sorry for the repeat, but what was a good product/supplier for that thermal >coating diy stuff. Thanks in advance and sorry for the repeat. This time I >listen better. > >See ya, > >Mike > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 06:19:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA21426 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 06:19:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from crianlarich.indigo-avs.com (crianlarich.indigo-avs.com [194.200.210.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id GAA21422 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 06:19:07 -0400 Received: by crianlarich.indigo-avs.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BD6216.9FBCB930@crianlarich.indigo-avs.com>; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:16:34 +0100 Message-ID: From: Robert Humphris To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Average fuel maps Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:16:33 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 Encoding: 18 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >From what I just heard was 1-5ms for TBI, and 2-10 for Port. > Okay, thanks for that, what I could also use is the frequency of these pulses, I heard that they should not be 'on' for more than 90% of the time, is this true? So at a 9ms pulse width at maximum flow I would imagine that the minimum 'off' time would be 1ms. Therefore my next question is, what are the average spaces ( this may be a crap question ) between pulses at tick over and maximum revs... now I know that there is probably no rule of thumb, all I am trying to do is get rough start up figures so that the system has at least some data to start from. My thinking is that it is easier to modify an existing value, than to create one from scratch from thin air. Rob Humphris > > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 07:55:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA21961 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 07:55:21 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id HAA21957 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 07:55:18 -0400 Received: from oasys.dt.navy.mil by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via SMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id HAA11913; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 07:55:17 -0400 Received: from gallant.dt.navy.mil by oasys.dt.navy.mil (5.61/oasys.dt.navy.mil) id AA01229; Tue, 7 Apr 98 07:54:56 EDT Message-Id: <352A22B9.2CFC@oasys.dt.navy.mil> Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 07:57:32 -0500 From: Robert Gallant X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi Subject: Haltech Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just though I'd let those in question know, I got my Haltech from Carl yesterday! Everything looks great and I'll install it this weekend. He shipped the computer the day my check arrived instead of waiting for it to clear. Carl; Thanks for putting yourself out and helping us get a good deal!!! BTW: Does anyone know what the resistance of the trim control is? -- Rob MailTo:gallant@oasys.dt.navy.mil From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 08:31:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA22539 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 08:31:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA22534 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 08:31:15 -0400 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp53.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.53]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id HAA27245 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 07:31:14 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <352A1DC5.1EF1@genevaonline.com> Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 07:36:21 -0500 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: high rpm "popping" sound References: <35292A95.248E@genevaonline.com> <19980406.230435.12662.0.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu My rev limiter is set at 6350 rpm. Way too high, but far away from where my problem is occuring. -- Andy Quaas From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 08:34:58 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA22602 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 08:34:58 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dmzserv.kemet.com (dmzserv.kemet.com [206.74.114.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA22598 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 08:34:57 -0400 Received: from smtpgw.kemet.com ([206.74.114.1]) by dmzserv.kemet.com (Netscape Messaging Server 3.01) with SMTP id 446 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 08:29:58 -0400 Received: from Lotus Notes (PU Serial #1724) by smtpgw.kemet.com (PostalUnion/SMTP(tm) v2.1.9i(b5) for Windows NT(tm)) id AA-1998Apr07.063647.1724.680801; Tue, 07 Apr 1998 08:37:43 -0400 From: MikeTurner@kemet.com (Mike Turner) To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu (diy_efi) Message-ID: <1998Apr07.063647.1724.680801@smtpgw.kemet.com> X-Conversion-ID: X-Mailer: Lotus Notes via PostalUnion/SMTP for Windows NT Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Organization: KEMET Electronics Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 08:37:43 -0400 Subject: Re: Spare Stuff for 101 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id IAA22599 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have a Needham's EMP-20 and would be willing to burn any EPROM's needed. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 08:40:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA22679 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 08:40:36 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from unix.mcmsys.com (root@unix.mcmsys.com [207.140.115.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA22675 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 08:40:35 -0400 Received: from default (flex-23.mcmsys.com [207.140.115.143]) by unix.mcmsys.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id HAA21626 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 07:40:34 -0500 Message-Id: <199804071240.HAA21626@unix.mcmsys.com> From: "Mike Ayres" To: Subject: Re: Average fuel maps Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 07:44:17 -0500 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I would be interested. What do you want for them and would like to know which type you have. Think the two piece is what I like. Where is the stuff located?? Mike ---------- > From: Robert Humphris > To: 'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu' > Subject: RE: Average fuel maps > Date: Tuesday, April 07, 1998 5:16 AM > > > >From what I just heard was 1-5ms for TBI, and 2-10 for Port. > > > > Okay, thanks for that, what I could also use is the frequency of these > pulses, I heard that they should not be 'on' for more than 90% of the > time, is this true? So at a 9ms pulse width at maximum flow I would > imagine that the minimum 'off' time would be 1ms. Therefore my next > question is, what are the average spaces ( this may be a crap question ) > between pulses at tick over and maximum revs... now I know that there is > probably no rule of thumb, all I am trying to do is get rough start up > figures so that the system has at least some data to start from. My > thinking is that it is easier to modify an existing value, than to > create one from scratch from thin air. > > Rob Humphris > > > > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 08:50:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA22851 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 08:50:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.enter.net (root@mail.enter.net [204.170.70.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA22847 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 08:49:59 -0400 From: rbraun@mail.enter.net Received: from rbraun (m40atwn-1-9.enter.net [204.170.16.19]) by mail.enter.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA27761 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 08:49:58 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804071249.IAA27761@mail.enter.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 20:53:44 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Printing a fuel map from Calmap Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just do a printscreen. > Does anybody know a way to print the DFI base fuel map?? > > '86 Z28 350 DFI Richmond 6-speed > Robert Wilkinson > http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~rw > > > > Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 11:00:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA24591 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:00:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24586 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:00:40 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-10.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.28]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id KAA02321 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 10:59:41 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Average fuel maps Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:00:07 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6235$da885b40$1c198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Robert Humphris To: 'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu' Date: Tuesday, April 07, 1998 7:59 AM Subject: RE: Average fuel maps >>From what I just heard was 1-5ms for TBI, and 2-10 for Port. >Okay, thanks for that, what I could also use is the frequency of these >pulses, I heard that they should not be 'on' for more than 90% of the >time, is this true? So at a 9ms pulse width at maximum flow I would >imagine that the minimum 'off' time would be 1ms. Therefore my next >question is, what are the average spaces ( this may be a crap question ) >between pulses at tick over and maximum revs... now I know that there is >probably no rule of thumb, all I am trying to do is get rough start up >figures so that the system has at least some data to start from. My >thinking is that it is easier to modify an existing value, than to >create one from scratch from thin air. > >Rob Humphris >> The TBI's fire alternately on ignition pulses. The Ports fire once per crankshaft revolution. The TBI's have other firing strategies for accleration, etc.. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 11:20:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA24892 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:20:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from attila.stevens-tech.edu (zzehnack@attila.stevens-tech.edu [155.246.14.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24888 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:20:56 -0400 Received: from localhost (zzehnack@localhost) by attila.stevens-tech.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/7) with SMTP id LAA11592 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:20:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:20:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Zachary Zehnacker To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems In-Reply-To: <35282C5D.26FBEC30@tufts.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Sun, 5 Apr 1998, Andris Skulte wrote: > degrees coolant, 750 Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA24953 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:25:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from attila.stevens-tech.edu (zzehnack@attila.stevens-tech.edu [155.246.14.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24948 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:25:56 -0400 Received: from localhost (zzehnack@localhost) by attila.stevens-tech.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/7) with SMTP id LAA13355 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:25:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:25:56 -0400 (EDT) From: Zachary Zehnacker To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Printing a fuel map from Calmap In-Reply-To: <199804071249.IAA27761@mail.enter.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Tue, 7 Apr 1998 rbraun@mail.enter.net wrote: > Just do a printscreen. When I use printscreen, I get the outline of the grid and some of the words on the outside of the grid, but I don't get any of the MAP values. I have found that copying the screen to the clipboard in Windows95 works, however. I then paste it into Adobe and invert the colors. It works, but it takes some time. I haven't really looked into the print screen problem to see if I can change some settings to get it to work correctly though. This is with version 6.32 if it makes a difference. Zak From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 11:53:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA25504 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:53:21 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA25500 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:53:20 -0400 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp21.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.21]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id KAA03943 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 10:53:19 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <352A4D21.5709@genevaonline.com> Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 10:58:25 -0500 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: O2 sensor function Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Very simply, will a heated oxygen sensor read accurately over 50% throttle? If so, would 65 mV at full throttle be to lean? -- Andy Quaas From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 12:22:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA26226 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:22:48 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.utexas.edu (mail.utexas.edu [128.83.126.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA26221 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:22:44 -0400 Received: (qmail 14392 invoked by uid 0); 7 Apr 1998 16:22:42 -0000 Received: from piglet.cc.utexas.edu (128.83.42.61) by mail.utexas.edu with SMTP; 7 Apr 1998 16:22:42 -0000 Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:22:41 -0500 (CDT) From: Robert Wilkinson X-Sender: rw@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Printing a fuel map from Calmap In-Reply-To: <199804071249.IAA27761@mail.enter.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Just do a printscreen. > > > > Does anybody know a way to print the DFI base fuel map?? > > Well, in the "edit file" mode, a print screen will print the base fuel map screen background, but none of the values will show up in the boxes. I can't do it in the "edit ecu" mode b/c my car is not near my printer:) Does your computer print out the entire map with a print screen in "edit file" mode?? I am guessing it may be a compatibility problem with my laptop and printer. '86 Z28 350 DFI Richmond 6-speed Robert Wilkinson http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~rw From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 12:26:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA26292 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:26:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from emerald.tufts.edu (pmdf@emerald.tufts.edu [130.64.1.16]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA26288 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:26:13 -0400 Received: from tufts.edu (st1254.tc.tufts.edu) by emerald.tufts.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #23568) with ESMTP id <0ER1004IGXNKUS@emerald.tufts.edu> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:26:08 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 12:26:24 -0400 From: Andris Skulte Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <352A53B0.8B465A0F@tufts.edu> X-Envelope-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Zachary Zehnacker wrote: > > degrees coolant, 750 > Is the 750 vals are a hysterises area that keeps the DFI from constantly going in and > out of closed loop. I believe that they should both be much lower. We > have both of ours set to below idle speed rpm (something like > 400 haven't had ours very long, so someone else on the list should be able to > correct me if I am wrong. I've got the low closed loop setting at 750, and the idle is at 850 (it idles around 875-900, though). The high limit is at 2000 rpms. From what I have it set at, the DFI will go to open loop below 750, above 2000, above 70% TPS, or below 120 degrees coolant (yes, it is F). Problem is that it doesn't. I did reduce the fuel map to 65% of original, and now at cruise, the o2's are actually jumping around, instead of being pegged at 806mV. It still doesn't go into closed loop :p I'm going to keep leaning it out till I get 3-400 mV at cruise. Since the DFI doesn't control EGR, will I need to run less timing than before at cruise? Later! Andris From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 12:35:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA26509 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:35:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from emerald.tufts.edu (pmdf@emerald.tufts.edu [130.64.1.16]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA26504 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:34:59 -0400 Received: from tufts.edu (st1254.tc.tufts.edu) by emerald.tufts.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #23568) with ESMTP id <0ER100E6IY2AMF@emerald.tufts.edu> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:34:58 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 12:35:13 -0400 From: Andris Skulte Subject: Re: O2 sensor function To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <352A55C1.16119114@tufts.edu> X-Envelope-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <352A4D21.5709@genevaonline.com> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Squash wrote: > Very simply, will a heated oxygen sensor read accurately over 50% > throttle? If so, would 65 mV at full throttle be to lean? Umm... yes! :) Do you mean 650 mV? At 14.7 air:fuel, the o2 should read around 500 mV, and when the computer is in closed loop, you should see the o2s constantly jumping across 500 (maybe 200-700 range). Andris "the man of 1050 mV o2's" Skulte From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 12:42:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA26741 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:42:25 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA26737 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:42:24 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-10.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.28]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id MAA05252 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:41:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Programming 101 Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:41:47 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6244$0e552080$1c198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Once again if you haven't read the opening pages please do so at this time. The first two tables we covered where spark, and fuel so in that same light we'll continue. Gm has a feature for extra power ie for passing, and heavy load conditions (also makes ya feel like you're going fast). For some applications they use a WOT enable. it adds timing, and fuel. Most notably on the heavier vehicles there seems to be a delay to this feature, at times, and then at other times it doesn't seem as noticeable. On the 747 there are a couple of parts to this. One is that they add fuel, and timing. The other part is that there is a time delay, and rpm bypass. So that at times, say from idle when ya floor it it takes a moment for it to seem like your really acclerating, and from higher rpm there is almost no waiting. Now again remember this as we'll be stumbling around with this from time to time. Reading down from the spark table, we stumble across some interesting numbers at 015E-0165, in hex they range from 06 to 0E. Since we are looking for timing in this area, if we convert 0E to Decimal we get 14, divide by 256, and multiply by 90 and we get 5. This might be a good area for an amount of spark that is added to an enrichment for WOT. OK we're going to look now for some fuel. Hmm, well we'll look like we did with the timing, where the fuel tables are. Well like for the spark that is added there is almost a constant amount of fuel added, but since they don't want the engine to make too much top end power, and the resulting engine damage they probably turn off the fuel on one end of the scale. So if ya look at the end of the fuel area, ya see exactly that, again depending on what application, it reads hex 64 for a few entries, and then the last few are 00. So we wind up at 03C7-03D7 as being the fuel enrichment for WOT. Varifing the above is just test driving a few proms with a scanner, and the DIY O2 display. Adding lots of timing, in the WOT timing area will set a bunch of knock counts, and turning off the fuel makes the car lame, and the O2 display looks noticeably leaner. Again, just do it for a few moments, ya don't want to risk any engine damage. Well, we've now got just enough knowledge to get into real trouble. By running too much timing/too little fuel you can cause serious engine trouble, always remember TOO little timing, and you buy spark plugs. TOO much timing and you buy all sorts of internal engine parts, ranging from head gaskets, to exhaust valves, and pistons, so sneek up on making tuning changes. ALSO remember TOO much fuel, and you waste gas, and buy spark plugs. TOO little fuel, and it's just like buying parts from too much timing. IF you have any doubts take small steps, and also reread the tuning pages, and stare at fuel, and timing tables til they really make sense. Also, be sure to wear a Con Shaped Hat so you aren't interupted too often. No worries mate Bruce Again if repling to this edit down. Couple sentences quoted is fine, not the whole text. TY From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 12:52:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA26937 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:52:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA26933 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:52:24 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-10.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.28]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id MAA08461 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:51:31 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: O2 sensor function Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:51:56 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6245$795dd560$1c198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Squash To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Tuesday, April 07, 1998 12:36 PM Subject: O2 sensor function >Very simply, will a heated oxygen sensor read accurately over 50% >throttle? Yes, but it's accuracy is just lean or rich. Once properly tuned it can be a "reference" for mixture. You first need to know what the engine likes, ie 850mv. Don't tune to a specific v, your engine might like more or less. Use it as an aid, not as proof positive, that you are at x value AFR. If so, would 65 mV at full throttle be to lean? I wouldn't run there with a BBC, on gasoline. >Andy Quaas > Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 13:04:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA27199 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:04:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from Edison.EBICom.Net (root@Edison.EBICom.Net [205.218.114.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA27193 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:04:38 -0400 Received: from s1-44.EBICom.Net (s1-44.EBICom.Net [206.26.198.44]) by Edison.EBICom.Net with SMTP id MAA16933 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:04:37 -0500 Message-ID: <352A77E5.23EE@ra.msstate.edu> Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 12:00:53 -0700 From: Steve N Organization: Home X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (Win16; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: DIY_EFI Digest V3 #152 References: <199804070622.CAA19388@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > This is a 3D graph, two axis are shown, and the third is represented with > color, Kind of like a topogragical map where you have longitude, latatude, > and elevation on a 2d piece of paper. The plot is rotated, and no key is > given for the Z-axis, > Now maybe the 2 inputs to the system make it a 2D system, but the graph is a > 3D graph. I guess that is what I was trying to ask. Do 2d systems have have only 2 inputs even though their graphs can look like a 3d? Or is this what a 3d system is? If this is true, has there ever been systems that allow three variables to calculate the fuel needed? i.e. a variable for each axis, x,y, and z. Steve N. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 13:05:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA27216 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:05:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.13]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA27212 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:05:15 -0400 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id MAA05057 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:05:05 -0500 (CDT) Received: from rc-052.blueridge.net(205.152.121.52) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma004999; Tue Apr 7 12:04:35 1998 Message-ID: <004a01bd6246$aabeb6a0$347998cd@bernie> From: "Bernie Jacobsen" To: Subject: Re: Question on header coating? Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:59:58 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ceramic coating for headers: Most coatings I have looked in to use proprietary names. Micro Coat uses 'Cermakrome' or 'TRR' ceramic coatings, some are good to 2000 degF They are coating my BIG headers for $170.00 + $7.50 hazmat http://www.wco.com/~sc7500/people.html Jet Hot uses their name (JETHOT 1300, JETHOT 2000) for their coatings WWW.JET-HOT.COM For my headers they wanted $395.00 to coat them with 2000 deg F ceramic. A little rich for my blood! There is also HTC Web Page?? Also, the material is important, but the even application will keep it in place. JETHOT and MicroCoat use 'flowcoat' for the ID to get it uniform. How uniform is it? I have no idea, but I know it's better than I could do. There is also 'apply it yourself' stuff available from Summit and Jegs, Both have web sites. I'm no expert, but I just went through it with my headers. Hope this helps, ^Bernie -----Original Message----- From: A70Duster To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Tuesday, April 07, 1998 2:47 AM Subject: Question on header coating? >Sorry for the repeat, but what was a good product/supplier for that thermal >coating diy stuff. Thanks in advance and sorry for the repeat. This time I >listen better. > >See ya, > >Mike > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 13:37:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA27867 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:37:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA27858 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:36:57 -0400 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp21.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.21]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id MAA07109 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:36:58 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <352A656C.199@genevaonline.com> Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 12:42:04 -0500 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: O2 sensor function References: <352A4D21.5709@genevaonline.com> <352A55C1.16119114@tufts.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu yup- 650 mV! I lost a zero there! 65 mV would be very lean, indeed! -- Andy Quaas Andris Skulte wrote: > Umm... yes! :) Do you mean 650 mV? At 14.7 air:fuel, the o2 should read > around 500 mV, and when the computer is in closed loop, you should see > the o2s constantly jumping across 500 (maybe 200-700 range). > > Andris "the man of 1050 mV o2's" Skulte From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 13:39:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA27930 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:39:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from attila.stevens-tech.edu (zzehnack@attila.stevens-tech.edu [155.246.14.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA27926 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:39:22 -0400 Received: from localhost (zzehnack@localhost) by attila.stevens-tech.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8/7) with SMTP id NAA00500 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:39:15 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:39:15 -0400 (EDT) From: Zachary Zehnacker To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems In-Reply-To: <352A53B0.8B465A0F@tufts.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Tue, 7 Apr 1998, Andris Skulte wrote: > idles around 875-900, though). The high limit is at 2000 rpms. From what > I have it set at, the DFI will go to open loop below 750, above 2000, > above 70% TPS, or below 120 degrees coolant (yes, it is F). Problem is I don't think that the 2000 rpm high limit is really an upper limit for closed loop operation. I believe that the high limit is the RPM that much be reached before the DFI will switch into closed loop (while RPM is increasing) and the low limit is the RPM that much be reached (while RPM is decreasing) before the DFI goes to open loop. Having two values just keeps the DFI from constantly switching back and forth between open and closed loop like it would if there was only 1 RPM limit for closed loop operation. If my understanding is correct, your setup would have to go up to 2000 RPM before closed loop operation would begin. It would then stay in closed loop until it dropped below 750 rpm. If it did drop below 750 and come out of closed loop it would then require the engine to reach 2000 RPM again before going back into closed loop. I hope someone will correct me if I am wrong in my understanding of these two limit settings. The manual isn't very clear about them. I also don't think I remember seeing anywhere that the DFI actually tells you that you are in open or closed loop. The only way that I have found is to see if the oxygen sensor is correcting the mixture (on the 'V' screen) or when the bar on the fuel map screen comes on to show you what your mixture would be if the unit were in open loop. I think your 30 lb injectors might be the reason you are having to lean out the maps so much. I think the stock maps are usually setup for 18-20 lb injectors. Zak From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 13:53:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA28310 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:53:47 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.utexas.edu (mail.utexas.edu [128.83.126.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA28306 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:53:46 -0400 Received: (qmail 17539 invoked by uid 0); 7 Apr 1998 17:53:46 -0000 Received: from piglet.cc.utexas.edu (128.83.42.61) by mail.utexas.edu with SMTP; 7 Apr 1998 17:53:46 -0000 Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 12:53:44 -0500 (CDT) From: Robert Wilkinson X-Sender: rw@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems In-Reply-To: <352A53B0.8B465A0F@tufts.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > idles around 875-900, though). The high limit is at 2000 rpms. From what > I have it set at, the DFI will go to open loop below 750, above 2000, > above 70% TPS, or below 120 degrees coolant (yes, it is F). Problem is I think you may misunderstand what the high limit does (I did when I was setting mine up). It is the rpm at which the engine must be *above* in order to go into *open* loop. If the engine rpm is between the low and high cl rpm limits, and the ecu is configured for closed loop operation, and the temperature is abovce the limit, then you *are* in *closed* loop. (closed loop can be identified by a toggling a/f bar, assuming your predefined pulsewidths are close enough for the o2 to correct). '86 Z28 350 DFI Richmond 6-speed Robert Wilkinson http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~rw From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 14:05:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA28471 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:05:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lsi.lsil.com (lsi.lsil.com [147.145.40.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA28467 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:05:05 -0400 Received: from mhbs.lsil.com ([147.145.29.36]) by lsi.lsil.com with ESMTP id LAA27680 (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:04:52 -0700 Received: from mms10.lsil.com by mhbs.lsil.com; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 11:04:49 -0700 Received: from mm104.minn by mms10 (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id NAA26259; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:04:43 -0500 Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 13:04:43 -0500 From: mdill@lsil.com (Mike Dillon) Message-Id: <199804071804.NAA26259@mms10> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, nacelp@bright.net, ECMnut@aol.com, Tmatthe1@worldnet.att.net Subject: PROM holders last call. Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hey Guy's, It does not look like there is enough demand on the PROM carriers to generate an order. So far I have requests from three people for a total of 125, I could use about 25, leaving about 100 uncommited. (Reiterate for those on the list: Robinson-Nugent PROM carriers part # PRC-246-E3 used in GM and ?? ECU's to hold the 24 pin PROMS. Min order need is 250 and I was quoted about 25 cents/part give or take a few cents, with 3-6 week lead time.) We'll see if shaking the trees one more time will get a few more commitments. Mike D. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 14:50:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA29375 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:50:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA29371 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:50:32 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-10.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.28]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id OAA16277 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:49:37 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: More 808,165 questions Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:50:00 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6255$f780d680$1c198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does anyone know of 6-8 cylinder applications using these ecms that are TBI.. Would said person happen to have a bin of said application?. TIA Bruce From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 14:54:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA29443 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:54:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA29438 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:54:29 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-10.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.28]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id OAA17558 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:53:34 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Proms Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:53:57 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6256$85199e00$1c198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Cap'tn there be proms. Duh, gotta figure out some packaging, but they are here. So for those of you who ordered them I need your snail mail addresses. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 14:57:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA29520 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:57:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA29516 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:57:55 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-10.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.28]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id OAA18835 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:57:02 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 14:57:25 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6257$011b8720$1c198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Zachary Zehnacker To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Tue, 7 Apr 1998, Andris Skulte wrote: > >values just keeps the DFI from constantly switching back and forth between open and closed loop like it would if there was only 1 RPM limit for closed loop operation. If my understanding is correct, your setup would have to go up to 2000 RPM before closed loop operation would begin. It would then stay in closed loop until it dropped below 750 rpm. If it did drop below 750 and come out of closed loop it would then require the engine to reach 2000 RPM again before going back into closed loop. I hope >someone will correct me if I am wrong in my understanding of these two >limit settings. The manual isn't very clear about them. > > I also don't think I remember seeing anywhere that the DFI actually >tells you that you are in open or closed loop. The only way that I have >found is to see if the oxygen sensor is correcting the mixture (on the >'V' screen) or when the bar on the fuel map screen comes on to show you >what your mixture would be if the unit were in open loop. > > I think your 30 lb injectors might be the reason you are having to >lean out the maps so much. I think the stock maps are usually setup for >18-20 lb injectors. > > Zak Also makes perfect sense for an open loop idle (for big cams), and to prevent stalling on overrun.. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 18:15:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA31664 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 18:15:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.utexas.edu (mail.utexas.edu [128.83.126.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA31660 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 18:14:59 -0400 Received: (qmail 17737 invoked by uid 0); 7 Apr 1998 22:14:59 -0000 Received: from piglet.cc.utexas.edu (128.83.42.61) by mail.utexas.edu with SMTP; 7 Apr 1998 22:14:59 -0000 Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:14:58 -0500 (CDT) From: Robert Wilkinson X-Sender: rw@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > I don't think that the 2000 rpm high limit is really an upper > limit for closed loop operation. I believe that the high limit is the RPM > that much be reached before the DFI will switch into closed loop (while > RPM is increasing) and the low limit is the RPM that much be reached > (while RPM is decreasing) before the DFI goes to open loop. Having two You may be right, but I don't remember seeing anything in the manuals about rpm increasing or decreasing. I could be wrong in pulling this from memory, but I am pretty sure that the high limit is a limit that must be exceeded before the DFI will switch to closed loop. My guess at the purpose of this would be that at very low rpms, you would want a 14.7:1 a/f ratio, and implementing that limit would allow that, while also allowing you to have control of the CL throttle limit at higher rpm's. '86 Z28 350 Richmond 6-speed Robert Wilkinson http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~rw From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 18:59:49 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA32590 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 18:59:49 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from emerald.tufts.edu (pmdf@emerald.tufts.edu [130.64.1.16]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA32583 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 18:59:46 -0400 Received: from tufts.edu (st1254.tc.tufts.edu) by emerald.tufts.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #23568) with ESMTP id <0ER200062FVFF6@emerald.tufts.edu> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 18:59:40 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 18:59:54 -0400 From: Andris Skulte Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <352AAFEA.EA665A4@tufts.edu> X-Envelope-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <199804061208.IAA16125@mail.enter.net> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thanks guys :) I've got tons of responses explaining the real way the HL and CL works for closed loops. I changed the HL down to 1050 and CL to 875 since it idles better in open loop. The car idles noticeably smoother at 1.74ms than 1.66, and when the DFI takes out even more to get the 02s down, well... doesn't idle as well. Thanks again :) A. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 20:03:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00317 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 20:03:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.35]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00312 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 20:03:06 -0400 Received: from [12.65.19.115] ([12.65.70.136]) by mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA11432 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 00:03:02 +0000 Message-ID: <352A5E1E.7422@worldnet.att.net> Date: Tue, 07 Apr 1998 16:13:02 +0000 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question References: <3.0.2.32.19960401173719.006fcb74@forbin.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu All interested, I cleared my codes and ran the car for 25 sec (the fan turns on at 28 seconds consistantly). I shut it down and read the codes. Not one code. I restarted and ran untill the fan kicked on and quickly shut it down. Checked codes. All aformentioned codes existed. I cleared codes again and unplugged the MAF. Restarted the car again. 5 seconds later the fan activated. I shut the car off and checked codes. MAF code *ONLY* -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 20:05:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00405 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 20:05:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from wolfenet.com (root@frapp.wolfe.net [207.178.61.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00401 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 20:05:58 -0400 Received: from gonzo.wolfenet.com (orin@gonzo.wolfenet.com [204.157.98.2]) by wolfenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id RAA11721 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:05:58 -0700 (PDT) From: Orin Eman Received: (from orin@localhost) by gonzo.wolfenet.com (8.8.3/8.7) id RAA09954 for diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:05:56 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804080005.RAA09954@gonzo.wolfenet.com> Subject: PROM Carrier Buy is a go !!! (fwd) To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (DIY EFI List) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:05:55 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Forwarded message: > From orin@WOLFENET.com Tue Apr 7 15:59:50 1998 > Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:58:52 -0500 > From: mdill@lsil.com (Mike Dillon) > Message-Id: <199804072258.RAA17751@mms10> > To: mweber@interaccess.com, ECMnut@aol.com, nacelp@bright.net, > Tmatthe1@worldnet.att.net, diy_efi-owner@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: PROM Carrier Buy is a go !!! > Hey Guy's > Mr Weber, put us over the top, I will call the distributor > tomarrow, and order them. I will get the exact price and update on > delivery. > Mike Weber 100 ish (FSJ mail list !!!) > Mike Dillon 25 ish > Bruce Plecan 50 > Mike V. 50 > Thomas Matthews 25 > -------- > 250 ish > Cool, I will email when I have more data. > These are Robinson-Nugent PRC-246-E3 PROM Carriers (Not the socket just the > PROM carrier). they are in the 20-30 cent/each range on price, and delivery > is about 3-6 weeks. > Mike D. > > From owner-fsj-list@unix.off-road.com Tue Apr 7 17:23 CDT 1998 > > From mweber@interaccess.com Tue Apr 7 17:25 CDT 1998 > > Return-Path: > > Received: from mhbs.lsil.com by mms10 (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) > > id RAA15653; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:25:26 -0500 > > Received: by mhbs.lsil.com; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 15:21:45 -0700 > > (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Tue, 7 Apr 1998 15:17:57 -0700 > > Received: from clavin.interaccess.com (clavin.interaccess.com [207.70.126.132]) by mail2.lsil.com with ESMTP id PAA11698 > > (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Tue, 7 Apr 1998 15:17:57 -0700 > > Received: from mweber.interaccess.com (d188.nhe.interaccess.com [206.183.79.188]) by clavin.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id RAA03499 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:19:15 -0500 (CDT) > > X-From: Umail2 Tue Apr 7 15:21 PDT 1998 > > >Received: from clavin.interaccess.com (clavin.interaccess.com [207.70.126.132]) by mail2.lsil.com with ESMTP id PAA11698 > >> > Mike D. > > > > > Mike, > > > > I could use about 100 of them if it would help out. Let me know. > > > > W(847) 391-0626 > > H(847) 392-3037 > > > > > > Mike Weber > > mweber@interaccess.com > > > > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 20:37:03 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00864 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 20:37:03 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (foothillnet.com [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00857 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 20:36:54 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-43.foothill.net [209.77.119.43]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA18245 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:38:30 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: Proms Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:35:56 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6286$4b9c0de0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Are you talking about 2732A's? I should have gotten in on it. TK -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Plecan To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Tuesday, April 07, 1998 12:44 PM Subject: Proms >Cap'tn there be proms. Duh, gotta figure out some packaging, >but they are here. So for those of you who ordered them I need >your snail mail addresses. >Bruce > > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 20:39:55 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00957 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 20:39:55 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (foothillnet.com [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00952 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 20:39:54 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-43.foothill.net [209.77.119.43]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id RAA18568 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:41:32 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:38:59 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6286$b82341e0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Any chance you've got the fan relay and fuel pump relay swapped? I had a similar problem where the 730 ECM uses the MAFS input for Vats (you can't have a MAFS system and Vats at the same time.) The Mafs would output 30Hz periodically and start the car. That one took awhile to figure out! That's similar isn't it? TK -----Original Message----- From: Ron Tyler To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Tuesday, April 07, 1998 5:35 PM Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question >All interested, > > I cleared my codes and ran the car for 25 sec (the fan turns on at >28 seconds consistantly). I shut it down and read the codes. Not one >code. I restarted and ran untill the fan kicked on and quickly shut it >down. Checked codes. All aformentioned codes existed. I cleared codes >again and unplugged the MAF. Restarted the car again. 5 seconds later >the fan activated. I shut the car off and checked codes. MAF code *ONLY* > >-- >Ron & Stephanie Tyler >'72 LT1/T56 240Z >http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 22:06:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA02060 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:06:05 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA02056 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:06:02 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-25.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.43]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id WAA29836 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:05:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Edelbrock 1227747 to TPI Conversion Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:05:35 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6292$d13b17a0$2b198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Has anyone seen one of these run, or know any of the details, other than, the below?. Edelbrock makes a conversion for putting a TPI on Pick ups with a 747 ecm, and uses the stock ecm, with a prom change. The TPI is based on a single plane type carb manifold, and looks to use the stock Throttle Body, with the injectors removed for an air valve. Don't suppose anyone has a bin of the prom?, or could get one?. TIA Bruce From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 22:40:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA02585 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:40:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail1.i1.net (root@mail1.i1.net [207.230.32.4]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA02580 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:40:16 -0400 From: ktretter@i1.net Received: from x2stl1-83.i1.net (x2stl1-83.i1.net [207.230.58.83]) by mail1.i1.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA23923 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 21:51:41 -0500 (CDT) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 21:51:41 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199804080251.VAA23923@mail1.i1.net> X-Sender: ktretter@i1.net Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: cancel subscription X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Please tell me what I must do to cancel this subsciption. ktretter@i1.net From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 7 22:45:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA02660 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:45:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA02656 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:45:06 -0400 Received: from d25.syd1.zeta.org.au (d25.syd1.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.153]) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA28519 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 12:43:56 +1000 Received: by d25.syd1.zeta.org.au with Microsoft Mail id <01BD62EB.D75BDBC0@d25.syd1.zeta.org.au>; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 12:42:50 +-1000 Message-ID: <01BD62EB.D75BDBC0@d25.syd1.zeta.org.au> From: "A.HOLLEY" To: "'DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: New Member Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 12:42:47 +-1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id WAA02657 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just a short note to introduce myself to your group. My name is Andrew Holley, I am an Australian Living in Sydney Aus. I am a motor mechanic by trade and a member of the Royal Australian Air Force. I also have had training in electronics . I drive a 1977 Jaguar XJ-S V12 with the old Bosch D jetronic injection. I know this is "barely" technology but I am still interested in getting the best out of it. I have done the easy mods like cold air induction and a variable resistor in series with the coolant temp sensor. But am always on the look out for any other mods that people may have come across to squeeze a bit more life out of the old girl. So if any one can help, would be very happy to hear from them. Look forward to being part of the group. Andrew Holley. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 01:44:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA04400 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 01:44:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from geocities.com (mail4.geocities.com [209.1.224.24]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA04396 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 01:44:10 -0400 Received: from Default (slper12p02.ozemail.com.au [203.108.227.138]) by geocities.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA07169 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:44:02 -0700 (PDT) Date: Tue, 7 Apr 1998 22:44:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804080544.WAA07169@geocities.com> X-Sender: dzorde@mail.geocities.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: dzorde@geocities.com (dzorde) Subject: Re: high rpm "popping" sound Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Try putting a scope on the tacho signal to the computer, its possible the signal starts to get noisy and the computer suddenly gets extra pulses and actually hits the rev limiter, despite you not even being close to the limiter value. At our last event a D-type jag had this problem, at 4300 rpm it sounded like it was sitting on the rev limiter. Turned out his crank trigger signal (magnetic) was getting too large in amplitude and it was causing the computer to mis-read the true rpm, told him to go back to the people that installed his system and get them to install a filter circuit on the tacho line. Guess I'll find out at the next event if I cured his problem, I would think so as I initially had this problem on my own car with the chev HEI. Dan dzorde@geocities.com >My rev limiter is set at 6350 rpm. Way too high, but far away from >where my problem is occuring. >-- >Andy Quaas > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 04:43:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA05710 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 04:43:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.lig.bellsouth.net (mail.lig.bellsouth.net [205.152.0.50]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA05704 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 04:43:01 -0400 Received: from zippy (host-209-138-53-31.chs.bellsouth.net [209.138.53.31]) by mail.lig.bellsouth.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id EAA05027 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 04:42:59 -0400 (EDT) From: "M&D" <91coupe@bellsouth.net> To: Subject: Request for ECU Info Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 04:48:07 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd62cb$0d136560$1f358ad1@zippy> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does anyone here have any data on the Bosch L-Motronic systems? That is what I believe the RX-7's have. I am interested in doing two things: removing the fuel cut under high boost, and extending the fuel maps. Any ideas? Michael Harrington 91coupe@bellsouth.net 91 RX-7 Coupe "Pearl" w/ some mods 88 RX-7 T2 "Beast" sitting in carport :( N3WJE Technician+ Ham From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 05:13:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA06053 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 05:13:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp1.us.dell.com (smtp1.us.dell.com [143.166.224.25]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA06046 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 05:13:19 -0400 Received: from ccmail2.dell.com (ccmail2.us.dell.com [143.166.233.35]) by smtp1.us.dell.com (8.8.5/DELL-INET-10-14-1997) with SMTP id DAA21314 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 03:13:19 -0600 (GMT) Received: by ccmail2.dell.com (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA15131; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 04:13:11 -0500 Date: 8 Apr 98 04:13 CDT X400-Trace: us*attmail*dell computer; Arrival 8 Apr 98 04:13 CDT Action: Relayed Priority: normal P1-Message-Id: us*attmail*dell computer;0892026789/1424109404/1 Original-Encoded-Information-Types: IA5-Text P1-Recipients: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Terry Sare To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-Id: <@m400gw.dell.com> Subject: RE: HEI timing jump Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu At the risk of much laughter, what about combining a RC circuit with the F-V converter. Replace the resister with a FET and control the FET resistance with the F-V. As your freq. increases, the FET resistance decrease and the voltage goes up faster. Given that my memory is somewhat fossilized -- this may be the wrong approach but you can control the rate of rise in analog circuits. Of course, you can also take a PIC, count the pulses (RPM), and generate the output pulse, delayed by some X amount based upon the RPM. No analog!! Oh well, back to sleep. ts dzorde wrote: > > Use a signal amp with voltage controlled gain, a F-V converted will give you > the increasing voltage as your rpm's increase, which in turn will bump the > gain on your amp. A neat little all hardware method. > > Dan dzorde@geocities.com > > >Would it be possible to build a signal amplifier for hall > >effect switches that will increase module trigger voltage as > >rpm increases? Seems like this is what you need. > > > >Shannen > > Still won't work. It is not the absolute voltage that mnatters. Digital at ANY voltage will not produce the advance. It is the RATE OF RIZE of the voltage that is critical. The ignitor triggers at a particular voltage. This voltage is reached ealier or later depending onspeed due to the distictive qualities of an inductive pickup. Don't matter what you do to a switch, and a HALL device is just a switch, you will not duplicate the "built in advance" of a magnetic pickup with a hall on an HEI module. Forget trying - it will not happen. -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 05:17:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA06138 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 05:17:20 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from crianlarich.indigo-avs.com (crianlarich.indigo-avs.com [194.200.210.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id FAA06133 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 05:17:19 -0400 Received: by crianlarich.indigo-avs.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BD62D7.2BB0A710@crianlarich.indigo-avs.com>; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 10:14:52 +0100 Message-ID: From: Robert Humphris To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Average fuel maps Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 10:14:51 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 Encoding: 20 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thanks for the info Bruce, but I must say it has me a little perplexed now.... TBI 1-5ms on every ignition pulse ( 2 crank revolutions ) Port 2-10ms on every crank rotation This would mean that the TBI system gets a quater of the fuel that the Port system gets. Now remember that you are talking to someone who yesterday left work, drove 50miles for an appointment, which was actually for tomorrow... But this does not seem right to me! Only if smaller injectors are used for Port injection, would this work. Rob Humphris > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 09:36:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA08143 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 09:36:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.enter.net (root@mail.enter.net [204.170.70.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA08139 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 09:36:14 -0400 From: rbraun@mail.enter.net Received: from rbraun (m40atwn-3-14.enter.net [204.170.16.120]) by mail.enter.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA05897 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 09:36:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804081336.JAA05897@mail.enter.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 21:40:23 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Printing a fuel map from Calmap Priority: normal References: <199804071249.IAA27761@mail.enter.net> In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu printscreen does not work ( properly if at all) in W95. Restart in ms dos mode and then run calmap, see if that works. > > > Just do a printscreen. > > When I use printscreen, I get the outline of the grid and some of > the words on the outside of the grid, but I don't get any of the MAP > values. I have found that copying the screen to the clipboard in > Windows95 works, however. I then paste it into Adobe and invert the > colors. It works, but it takes some time. I haven't really looked into > the print screen problem to see if I can change some settings to get it to > work correctly though. This is with version 6.32 if it makes a > difference. > > Zak > > > > Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 09:41:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA08190 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 09:41:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.enter.net (root@mail.enter.net [204.170.70.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA08186 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 09:41:22 -0400 From: rbraun@mail.enter.net Received: from rbraun (m40atwn-3-14.enter.net [204.170.16.120]) by mail.enter.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA06976 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 09:41:21 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804081341.JAA06976@mail.enter.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 21:45:31 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems Priority: normal References: <352A53B0.8B465A0F@tufts.edu> In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The below is correct... > I don't think that the 2000 rpm high limit is really an upper > limit for closed loop operation. I believe that the high limit is the RPM > that much be reached before the DFI will switch into closed loop (while > RPM is increasing) and the low limit is the RPM that much be reached > (while RPM is decreasing) before the DFI goes to open loop. Having two > values just keeps the DFI from constantly switching back and forth between > open and closed loop like it would if there was only 1 RPM limit for > closed loop operation. If my understanding is correct, your setup would > have to go up to 2000 RPM before closed loop operation would begin. It > would then stay in closed loop until it dropped below 750 rpm. If it did > drop below 750 and come out of closed loop it would then require the > engine to reach 2000 RPM again before going back into closed loop. I hope > someone will correct me if I am wrong in my understanding of these two > limit settings. The manual isn't very clear about them. > > Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 09:51:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA08304 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 09:51:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.enter.net (root@mail.enter.net [204.170.70.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA08300 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 09:51:15 -0400 From: rbraun@mail.enter.net Received: from rbraun (m40atwn-3-14.enter.net [204.170.16.120]) by mail.enter.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA09195 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 09:51:10 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804081351.JAA09195@mail.enter.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 21:55:21 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Edelbrock 1227747 to TPI Conversion Priority: normal In-reply-to: <01bd6292$d13b17a0$2b198fd1@nacelp> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I've been thinking of getting one, this will keep my "new" '89 truck emmissions legal, as oppossed to moving the Accel system from my '77 to my '89. I do know a guy that put the Edelbrock package on his 4.3L S-10 Blazer although this is not port, I may be able to talk him into pulling his chip and letting me read it. Let me know if interested. > Has anyone seen one of these run, or know any of the details, > other than, the below?. > Edelbrock makes a conversion for putting a TPI on Pick ups with > a 747 ecm, and uses the stock ecm, with a prom change. The > TPI is based on a single plane type carb manifold, and looks to use > the stock Throttle Body, with the injectors removed for an air valve. > Don't suppose anyone has a bin of the prom?, or could get one?. > TIA > Bruce > > > Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 12:28:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA10431 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 12:28:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com (ts26l2.pathcom.com [209.112.17.229]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA10416 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 12:28:36 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0yMxPQ-0000kOC; Wed, 8 Apr 98 12:09 EDT Message-Id: Subject: ATTN Tom McCabe To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 12:09:08 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: from "Robert Humphris" at Apr 7, 98 11:16:33 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I got your message about the SBCs I cannot find my original contact info for the source The message got deleted as soon as I find you about the SBCs will let you know Clive From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 13:20:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA11116 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 13:20:20 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bear.wattscc.org (root@1Cust69.max8.dallas.tx.ms.uu.net [153.35.179.197]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA11112 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 13:20:17 -0400 Received: from millenia.wattscc.org (comp0.1.168.192.in-addr.arpa [192.168.1.10] (may be forged)) by bear.wattscc.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA04940 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 12:12:43 -0500 Message-ID: <004201bd6311$89c49e80$0a01a8c0@millenia.wattscc.org> From: "Matthew B. Watts" To: Subject: Re: Printing a fuel map from Calmap Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 11:45:24 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: rbraun@mail.enter.net To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 08, 1998 10:02 AM Subject: Re: Printing a fuel map from Calmap > printscreen does not work ( properly if at all) in W95. Restart in > ms dos mode and then run calmap, see if that works. Had a similar problem with the PAFZ software for the electromotive TEC II unit. Just hit F8 when you get the "Starting Windows 95" prompt and bring the PC up in the "Command Prompt" mode. I had to do this on an older 486 laptop to get data logging to work reliably. It seems that the overhead of Win95 tended to bog down the serial port enough to loose sync on occasion. It's a little bit of a hassle, but does get around the unwanted glitches having Win95 in full control of the system. Matt _________ From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 13:25:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA11214 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 13:25:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from wolfenet.com (root@frapp.wolfe.net [207.178.61.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA11210 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 13:25:03 -0400 Received: from gonzo.wolfenet.com (orin@gonzo.wolfenet.com [204.157.98.2]) by wolfenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA07017 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 10:25:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Orin Eman Received: (from orin@localhost) by gonzo.wolfenet.com (8.8.3/8.7) id KAA07769 for diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 10:25:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804081725.KAA07769@gonzo.wolfenet.com> Subject: Re: PROM Carrier Buy is a go !!! (fwd) To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (DIY EFI List) Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 10:25:02 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I wasn't the original sender, I had forwarded a message that was addressed to the list owner, not the list: > Sorry..I must have missed all this....are you talking about the GM type PROM carrier...the type that is 66 pin in 2 rows that takes the EPROM and 2 PALs' and has a clip on lid ?? > If these are what you are talking about I'm keen...maybe a 100 as well... > Please reply ASAP thanks > Grant Gatenby > > > Hey Guy's > > > > > Mr Weber, put us over the top, I will call the distributor > > > tomarrow, and order them. I will get the exact price and update on > > > delivery. > > > > > Mike Weber 100 ish (FSJ mail list !!!) > > > Mike Dillon 25 ish > > > Bruce Plecan 50 > > > Mike V. 50 > > > Thomas Matthews 25 > > > -------- > > > 250 ish > > > > > Cool, I will email when I have more data. > > > > > These are Robinson-Nugent PRC-246-E3 PROM Carriers (Not the socket just the > > > PROM carrier). they are in the 20-30 cent/each range on price, and delivery > > > is about 3-6 weeks. > > > > > Mike D. > > > > > > From owner-fsj-list@unix.off-road.com Tue Apr 7 17:23 CDT 1998 > > > > From mweber@interaccess.com Tue Apr 7 17:25 CDT 1998 > > > > Return-Path: > > > > Received: from mhbs.lsil.com by mms10 (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) > > > > id RAA15653; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:25:26 -0500 > > > > Received: by mhbs.lsil.com; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 15:21:45 -0700 > > > > (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Tue, 7 Apr 1998 15:17:57 -0700 > > > > Received: from clavin.interaccess.com (clavin.interaccess.com [207.70.126.132]) by mail2.lsil.com with ESMTP id PAA11698 > > > > (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Tue, 7 Apr 1998 15:17:57 -0700 > > > > Received: from mweber.interaccess.com (d188.nhe.interaccess.com [206.183.79.188]) by clavin.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id RAA03499 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:19:15 -0500 (CDT) > > > > X-From: Umail2 Tue Apr 7 15:21 PDT 1998 > > > > >Received: from clavin.interaccess.com (clavin.interaccess.com [207.70.126.132]) by mail2.lsil.com with ESMTP id PAA11698 > > > >> > Mike D. > > > > > > > > > Mike, > > > > > > > > I could use about 100 of them if it would help out. Let me know. > > > > > > > > W(847) 391-0626 > > > > H(847) 392-3037 > > > > > > > > > > > > Mike Weber > > > > mweber@interaccess.com > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > Get free personalized email at http://four11.iname.com From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 16:04:46 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA13159 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:04:46 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lsi.lsil.com (lsi.lsil.com [147.145.40.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA13155 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:04:44 -0400 Received: from mhbs.lsil.com ([147.145.29.36]) by lsi.lsil.com with ESMTP id NAA05675 (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Wed, 8 Apr 1998 13:04:39 -0700 Received: from mms10.lsil.com by mhbs.lsil.com; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 13:04:33 -0700 Received: from mm104.minn by mms10 (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id PAA03571; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 15:04:26 -0500 Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 15:04:26 -0500 From: mdill@lsil.com (Mike Dillon) Message-Id: <199804082004.PAA03571@mms10> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, nacelp@bright.net, ECMnut@aol.com, Tmatthe1@worldnet.att.net, mweber@interaccess.com, MikeTurner@kemet.com, scicior@uswest.com Subject: PROM Carriers are ordered Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hey Guy's The carriers, have been ordered. Here is the list of people who have requested them and the number they ordered, if there are any errors let me know. 1) "Bruce Plecan" 50 2) Mike V -> From: ECMnut 50 3) Thomas Matthews 25 4) Mike Weber mweber@interaccess.com 100 ish 5) MikeTurner@kemet.com (Mike Turner) 25-50 6) Steven Ciciora 25 ish 7) Mike Dillon mdill@lsil.com 25 ish I ordered 350 of them so we should be covered, with a few left over. (Reiterate for those on the list: Robinson-Nugent PROM carriers part # PRC-246-E3 used in GM and ?? ECU's to hold the 24 pin PROMS. Min order need is 250 and I was quoted about 25 cents/part give or take a few cents, with 3-6 week lead time.) This is just the "clip" that holds the PROM not including the socket that is soldered to the board. Mike D. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 16:12:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA13292 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:12:43 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lsi.lsil.com (lsi.lsil.com [147.145.40.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA13288 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:12:41 -0400 Received: from mhbs.lsil.com ([147.145.29.36]) by lsi.lsil.com with ESMTP id NAA05953 (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Wed, 8 Apr 1998 13:12:40 -0700 Received: from mms10.lsil.com by mhbs.lsil.com; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 13:12:37 -0700 Received: from mm104.minn by mms10 (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id PAA03975; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 15:12:31 -0500 Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 15:12:31 -0500 From: mdill@lsil.com (Mike Dillon) Message-Id: <199804082012.PAA03975@mms10> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: PROM Carrier Buy- Grant Gatenby Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Grant, Sorry no it is not. Read the other posts for full discription. I think it is what you refer to as the "clip on the lid". Mike D > From diy_efi-owner@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Wed Apr 8 14:44 CDT 1998 > I wasn't the original sender, I had forwarded a message that was addressed to > the list owner, not the list: > > > Sorry..I must have missed all this....are you talking about the GM type PROM carrier...the type that is 66 pin in 2 rows that takes the EPROM and 2 PALs' and has a clip on lid ?? > > > If these are what you are talking about I'm keen...maybe a 100 as well... > > > Please reply ASAP thanks > > > Grant Gatenby > > > > > > Hey Guy's > > > > > > > Mr Weber, put us over the top, I will call the distributor > > > > tomarrow, and order them. I will get the exact price and update on > > > > delivery. > > > > > > > Mike Weber 100 ish (FSJ mail list !!!) > > > > Mike Dillon 25 ish > > > > Bruce Plecan 50 > > > > Mike V. 50 > > > > Thomas Matthews 25 > > > > -------- > > > > 250 ish > > > > > > > Cool, I will email when I have more data. > > > > > > > These are Robinson-Nugent PRC-246-E3 PROM Carriers (Not the socket just the > > > > PROM carrier). they are in the 20-30 cent/each range on price, and delivery > > > > is about 3-6 weeks. > > > > > > > Mike D. > > > > > > > > From owner-fsj-list@unix.off-road.com Tue Apr 7 17:23 CDT 1998 > > > > > From mweber@interaccess.com Tue Apr 7 17:25 CDT 1998 > > > > > Return-Path: > > > > > Received: from mhbs.lsil.com by mms10 (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) > > > > > id RAA15653; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:25:26 -0500 > > > > > Received: by mhbs.lsil.com; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 15:21:45 -0700 > > > > > (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Tue, 7 Apr 1998 15:17:57 -0700 > > > > > Received: from clavin.interaccess.com (clavin.interaccess.com [207.70.126.132]) by mail2.lsil.com with ESMTP id PAA11698 > > > > > (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Tue, 7 Apr 1998 15:17:57 -0700 > > > > > Received: from mweber.interaccess.com (d188.nhe.interaccess.com [206.183.79.188]) by clavin.interaccess.com (8.8.5/8.7.5) with SMTP id RAA03499 for ; Tue, 7 Apr 1998 17:19:15 -0500 (CDT) > > > > > X-From: Umail2 Tue Apr 7 15:21 PDT 1998 > > > > > >Received: from clavin.interaccess.com (clavin.interaccess.com [207.70.126.132]) by mail2.lsil.com with ESMTP id PAA11698 > > > > >> > Mike D. > > > > > > > > > > > Mike, > > > > > > > > > > I could use about 100 of them if it would help out. Let me know. > > > > > > > > > > W(847) 391-0626 > > > > > H(847) 392-3037 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Mike Weber > > > > > mweber@interaccess.com > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------ > > Get free personalized email at http://four11.iname.com > > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 16:27:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA13522 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:27:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from vega.netquest.com (www.netquest.com [209.69.94.27]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA13515 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:27:21 -0400 Received: from bob-s-computer ([209.69.95.44]) by vega.netquest.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) ID# 0-37888U2500L250S0) with SMTP id AAA211 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:32:37 -0400 Message-ID: <352BDCEA.3161@netquest.com> Date: Wed, 08 Apr 1998 16:24:10 -0400 From: bailey@netquest.com (Bailey, Robert B.) Organization: Bailey Engineering Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Printing DFI maps Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu You must type 'graphics' and hit enter before loading calmap. This loads memory resident program GRAPHICS.COM which handles print-screens from CGA graphics mode. The dos help system can provide additional details about how to use GRAPHICS.COM Bob Bailey Bailey Engineering From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 17:38:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA14512 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 17:38:31 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.utexas.edu (mail.utexas.edu [128.83.126.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA14508 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 17:38:29 -0400 Received: (qmail 7579 invoked by uid 0); 8 Apr 1998 21:38:29 -0000 Received: from piglet.cc.utexas.edu (128.83.42.61) by mail.utexas.edu with SMTP; 8 Apr 1998 21:38:29 -0000 Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:38:28 -0500 (CDT) From: Robert Wilkinson X-Sender: rw@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Printing a fuel map from Calmap In-Reply-To: <199804081336.JAA05897@mail.enter.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > printscreen does not work ( properly if at all) in W95. Restart in > ms dos mode and then run calmap, see if that works. > I have a 386 running just dos, and I still have the exact same problem mentioned below.... so I don't think it is a Win95 problem. > > When I use printscreen, I get the outline of the grid and some of > > the words on the outside of the grid, but I don't get any of the MAP > > values. I have found that copying the screen to the clipboard in '86 Z28 350 DFI Richmond 6-speed Robert Wilkinson http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~rw From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 17:46:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA14638 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 17:46:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.utexas.edu (mail.utexas.edu [128.83.126.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA14634 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 17:46:08 -0400 Received: (qmail 12456 invoked by uid 0); 8 Apr 1998 21:46:05 -0000 Received: from piglet.cc.utexas.edu (128.83.42.61) by mail.utexas.edu with SMTP; 8 Apr 1998 21:46:05 -0000 Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:46:05 -0500 (CDT) From: Robert Wilkinson X-Sender: rw@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, Andris Skulte Subject: Re: DFI open/closed loop problems In-Reply-To: <352BE4C1.139BC313@emerald.tufts.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Whoops!! I goofed up. One condition mentioned in my previous post listed below is that the a/f bar is not there at all. When this happens, it is *open* loop, not closed loop. > Robert Wilkinson wrote: > > 2nd, how do you know it's in open loop?? The only way I know of to > > determine that is to see if the A/F bar is toggling or not. There are 4 > > possible conditions: > > 1: bar is there, but doesnt toggle; means way too rich. > > 2: bar is not there at all; means it is in closed loop. > > 3: bar is on right side of 14.7; means it's too lean. > > 4: bar is toggling to the left of 14.7, means you're values are good in > > that area (for cruising and light throttle). '86 Z28 350 DFI Richmond 6-speed Robert Wilkinson http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~rw From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 20:00:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA16188 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 20:00:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA16184 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 19:59:56 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA7097 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 16:59:56 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Return of the diy_EGOmeter Date: Wed, 08 Apr 1998 17:00:31 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35760b2a.58721515@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id TAA16185 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hey Maties. Didja miss me? Hee. Yeah, ya know what they say, "absence makes the heart grow fungus", or sumpin like at. Anyway, I was s'posed to phone home more brain surgery results on ole UEGO, but then a historic aviation event delayed it, and now I'm starring in a live episode of Invasion of the Viral Body Snatchers. Sigh. Anyway, I DO have some progress to report. I've just about got the proto for the EGOmeter wired (perfect for convalescing), and have even that trick gizmo Frank found in the NTK box built in, where it protects from pumping the oxygen ion cell (geez, do yous guys remember any of this; seems like eons, only been couple weeks, tempus foogit, eh?) until the O2 measurement cell has warmed and made a pass through stoich on it's way to really-lean-cuz-it's-in-open-air. This seemed better/more snazzy than the Horiba simple time delay of 100secs. But both probably would work equally well, I guess. By using the NTK scheme, if you power the meter off and then on again, you don't wait the extra 100secs, cuz since the sensor's warmed up already, it immediately gets through stoich, and poof, you're up and running. Frank tested the NTK this way too, and that IS how it works; no delays if the sensor is already warm. Speaking of other delays I have to note, is that Barrett did put me in contact with his O2 Meter guy who's built them before, and from what I've seen he really does know his stuff; just that I haven't had time to strike up the dialog just yet and compare notes. But it's a comin, honest engine. Give me another week before you tar and feather me for dragging my virus-infested butt. Whimper. Man how can such tiny lil critters make you feel like sucha pieceOyou-know-what. Gar-flu-gel-nose (sounds more musical if you say it faster) From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 22:07:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA17103 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 22:07:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA17099 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 22:07:03 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-32.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.101]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id WAA05115 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 22:06:11 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Proms+things Pro 101 Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 22:06:37 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd635c$20ff8680$65198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Well folks, in appreciation for the help I've received, and for the folks that I can never repay for their help, I've decided to send out all the chips, no charge. I missed the Post Office today, and there are two packages that I got to figure out packaging for, but all the others will hit the mail tomorrow. In yesterdays post there may be a error that is under review, and another that I consider to some degree a point of veiw. In the fuel area, I mentioned that they probably turned the fuel off to keep from over reving the engine, and it's been also pointed out that do to the engine limited breathing, maintaining the fuel flow isn't nessecary. There are a few folks that perfer to remain unnamed that have really made this happen, and I'd like the list in general to know how much I appreciate their efforts. Sincerely Bruce From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 22:21:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA17297 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 22:21:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from geocities.com (mail3.geocities.com [209.1.224.23]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA17293 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 22:21:42 -0400 Received: from Default (slper13p54.ozemail.com.au [203.108.46.55]) by geocities.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA01729 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 19:21:34 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 19:21:34 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804090221.TAA01729@geocities.com> X-Sender: dzorde@mail.geocities.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: dzorde@geocities.com (dzorde) Subject: RE: Average fuel maps Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I think the TBI injectors are much bigger, like 2 or 3 times. Dan dzorde@geocities.com >Thanks for the info Bruce, but I must say it has me a little perplexed >now.... > >TBI >1-5ms on every ignition pulse ( 2 crank revolutions ) > >Port >2-10ms on every crank rotation > >This would mean that the TBI system gets a quater of the fuel that the >Port system gets. > >Now remember that you are talking to someone who yesterday left work, >drove 50miles for an appointment, which was actually for tomorrow... But >this does not seem right to me! Only if smaller injectors are used for >Port injection, would this work. > >Rob Humphris > >> > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 8 23:23:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA18111 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 23:23:21 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA18107 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 23:23:19 -0400 Received: from dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id XAA10425; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 23:23:19 -0400 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id WAA14108 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 22:23:14 -0500 (CDT) Received: from prt-or7-08.ix.netcom.com(207.220.34.40) by dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma014063; Wed Apr 8 22:22:40 1998 Received: by prt-or7-08.ix.netcom.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BD632B.E722C100@prt-or7-08.ix.netcom.com>; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 20:21:24 -0700 Message-ID: <01BD632B.E722C100@prt-or7-08.ix.netcom.com> From: Paul Ruschman To: "'DIY-EFI'" Subject: O-2 Failure Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 20:21:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id XAA18108 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu "THE" list, I recently purchased a ECHLIN O-2 sensor and installed it in the collector of my Hooker Street Rod headers on my V-8 Datsun Z car. It worked great at first. I haven't been monitoring it lately and when I hooked my trusty Fluke 87 to the wires I ran in the car from the O-2 it was putting out between .18-.2 volts no matter what load/RPM. I looked at the O-2 sensor itself and I noticed exhaust soot coming from the metal cap where the electrical lead comes out. I take it his is NOT good. Any insight on this problem or experience using these generic one wire ECHLIN O-2 sensors? The parts guy at NAPA said it was a quality unit and recommended it over the generic BOSCH unit I originally wanted. Thanks in advance for any and all info, Paul (BRAAP) Ruschman 75' 280 ZR-1 http://www.datsuns.com/projects/paulrproject.htm From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 00:36:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA18857 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 00:36:35 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (foothillnet.com [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA18853 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 00:36:33 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-37.foothill.net [209.77.119.37]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA18511 for ; Wed, 8 Apr 1998 21:37:43 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: Proms+things Pro 101 Date: Wed, 8 Apr 1998 21:34:45 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6370$d2a72be0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Did I say 10? Sorry I meant 100. Seriously, I am more than happy to pay for them. Well, not more than happy, but happy. Well, not happy, but willing. Ok, not willing, but I will. Probibly at least. TK -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Plecan To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 08, 1998 7:52 PM Subject: Proms+things Pro 101 >Well folks, in appreciation for the help I've received, and for the folks >that I can never repay for their help, I've decided to send out all the >chips, no charge. > I missed the Post Office today, and there are two packages that >I got to figure out packaging for, but all the others will hit the mail >tomorrow. > In yesterdays post there may be a error that is under review, and >another that I consider to some degree a point of veiw. In the fuel >area, I mentioned that they probably turned the fuel off to keep from >over reving the engine, and it's been also pointed out that do to the >engine limited breathing, maintaining the fuel flow isn't nessecary. > > There are a few folks that perfer to remain unnamed that have really >made this happen, and I'd like the list in general to know how much I >appreciate their efforts. >Sincerely >Bruce > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 04:32:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA20277 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 04:32:53 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA20273 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 04:32:49 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-010.mcn.net [208.26.146.10]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA13324 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 02:32:47 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <352C84D3.F9AA7831@mcn.net> Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 02:20:35 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: O-2 Failure References: <01BD632B.E722C100@prt-or7-08.ix.netcom.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Paul Ruschman wrote: > > > "THE" list, > I recently purchased a ECHLIN O-2 sensor and installed it in the collector of my Hooker Street Rod headers on my V-8 Datsun Z car. It worked great at first. I haven't been monitoring it lately and when I hooked my trusty Fluke 87 to the wires I ran in the car from the O-2 it was putting out between .18-.2 volts no matter what load/RPM. I looked at the O-2 sensor itself and I noticed exhaust soot coming from the metal cap where the electrical lead comes out. I take it his is NOT good. > Any insight on this problem or experience using these generic one wire ECHLIN O-2 sensors? The parts guy at NAPA said it was a quality unit and recommended it over the generic BOSCH unit I originally wanted. > > Thanks in advance for any and all info, > > Paul (BRAAP) Ruschman > 75' 280 ZR-1 > http://www.datsuns.com/projects/paulrproject.htm I have had problems with aftermarket O2 sensors. They can send a voltage prematurely, causing the ecm to go into open loop before the sensor is properly warmed up, they can fail prematurely, and the connecto0rs sometimes don't make good connection. I like to use a GM unit from a 90 pickup for one wire sensors in GM vehicles. These are somewhat protected from mud intrusion. I'm sure that many people have used aftermarket sensors without trouble, but I have had problems with them. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 06:07:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA20954 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 06:07:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA20949 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 06:07:53 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp2.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.132]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id FAA12879 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 05:08:13 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <352C9C46.D4FE536@mwt.net> Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 05:00:39 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: O-2 Failure X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <01BD632B.E722C100@prt-or7-08.ix.netcom.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Paul put the O2 in a flame of a propane torch it will read 1v after heated. Steve Paul Ruschman wrote: > "THE" list, > I recently purchased a ECHLIN O-2 sensor and installed it in the > collector of my Hooker Street Rod headers on my V-8 Datsun Z car. It > worked great at first. I haven't been monitoring it lately and when I > hooked my trusty Fluke 87 to the wires I ran in the car from the O-2 > it was putting out between .18-.2 volts no matter what load/RPM. I > looked at the O-2 sensor itself and I noticed exhaust soot coming > from the metal cap where the electrical lead comes out. I take it his > is NOT good. > Any insight on this problem or experience using these generic > one wire ECHLIN O-2 sensors? The parts guy at NAPA said it was a > quality unit and recommended it over the generic BOSCH unit I > originally wanted. > > Thanks in advance for any and all info, > > Paul (BRAAP) Ruschman > 75' 280 ZR-1 > http://www.datsuns.com/projects/paulrproject.htm From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 07:40:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA21528 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 07:40:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from hotmail.com (f28.hotmail.com [207.82.250.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id HAA21524 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 07:40:15 -0400 Received: (qmail 7667 invoked by uid 0); 9 Apr 1998 11:39:44 -0000 Message-ID: <19980409113944.7666.qmail@hotmail.com> Received: from 202.135.31.13 by www.hotmail.com with HTTP; Thu, 09 Apr 1998 04:39:42 PDT X-Originating-IP: [202.135.31.13] From: "Rusdi Harahap" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Newcomers from Indonesia Content-Type: text/plain Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 04:39:42 PDT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi everybody .... I just joined this mailing list and still trying to catch up the basic knowledge so I can follow you all. I'm an EE but working in software company, and not dealing with microprocessor stuff quite a long time ... I own a Mazda MX6 2.0 litre 4 cly DOHC engine, with specs : type : FE in line 4 cylinder DOHC 16 valve capacity : 1998 cc piston bore X stroke : 86 X 86 mm compression ratio : 10.0 : 1 output : 148/6000 (ps/rpm), 109/6000 (kw/rpm) (I'm not sure this small type is available in US) Since last year I started to enhance my car performance.I replaced the bolt on parts, cylinder head and when came to modify the ECU,I found noone in my country can help me. They said why I didn't go for Honda or Toyota and they had plenty of upgraded ECU for them. I really love my car and swore to the God I'll fight to develop the ECU by my own. I contacted an EFI performance chips supplier in Australia and sent my stock EPROM programme by mail. After they reprogammed it, I uploaded it into a new EPROM but it didn't work properly. My car RPM was really unstable, could not stay at iddle RPM and even could not go higher than 4000 RPM. If I put my stock EPROM back, it works normally, so there are no damage happened during socketing and installation. I consulted this matter quite a lot with the Australian supplier, and they were very sure that the programme could work properly since I have informed them quite detail (type of ECU, type of EPROM and all detail modifications) But after several times discussion and trial, there are no significant progress with this. What do I miss ???? Now I try to dig more in ECU knowledge so I can locate the problem precisely. My short term goal is just to optimize all engine modification I have and bypass the rev limiter (6700 RPM). In the long term I would like to install a high lift cam, adjustable sprocket and even turbocharger. Does anyone can lead me to the right way ? Please help ... Thanks Rusdi Harahap BDN II/1 Jakarta 12430 Indonesia ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 09:52:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA22584 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 09:52:38 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bert.acesag.auburn.edu (bert.acesag.auburn.edu [131.204.46.47]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA22580 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 09:52:37 -0400 Received: from bert (bert [131.204.46.47]) by bert.acesag.auburn.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA06353 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 08:52:32 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 08:52:31 -0500 (CDT) From: "Gregory A. Parmer" X-Sender: gparmer@bert To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Printing a fuel map from Calmap In-Reply-To: <199804081336.JAA05897@mail.enter.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 8 Apr 1998 rbraun@mail.enter.net (?) wrote: > printscreen does not work ( properly if at all) in W95. Restart in > ms dos mode and then run calmap, see if that works. For the clueless like me, I found out recently that it's *supposed* to work like.... If you press PrintScreen, Windows95/NT copies the entire window to the Clipboard; Alt-PrintScreen copies only the active window. To print, open Paint and paste from the clipboard, then choose File, Print. ...your mileage will vary, obviously. And according to Mr. Gates there are no bugs in MS software! -greg From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 10:28:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA22951 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 10:28:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.utexas.edu (mail.utexas.edu [128.83.126.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA22947 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 10:27:59 -0400 Received: (qmail 3354 invoked by uid 0); 9 Apr 1998 14:27:59 -0000 Received: from piglet.cc.utexas.edu (128.83.42.61) by mail.utexas.edu with SMTP; 9 Apr 1998 14:27:59 -0000 Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 09:27:58 -0500 (CDT) From: Robert Wilkinson X-Sender: rw@piglet.cc.utexas.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Printing DFI maps In-Reply-To: <352BDCEA.3161@netquest.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 8 Apr 1998, Bailey, Robert B. wrote: > You must type 'graphics' and hit enter before loading calmap. > > This loads memory resident program GRAPHICS.COM which handles > print-screens from CGA graphics mode. The dos help system can > provide additional details about how to use GRAPHICS.COM > > > Bob Bailey > Bailey Engineering > Wow!! This made it work just fine!! '86 Z28 350 DFI Richmond 6-speed Robert Wilkinson http://ccwf.cc.utexas.edu/~rw From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 14:05:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA25414 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 14:05:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [205.139.62.192]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA25410 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 14:04:58 -0400 Received: (qmail 12535 invoked from network); 9 Apr 1998 12:04:57 -0600 Received: from ts6-31.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.157) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 9 Apr 1998 12:04:57 -0600 Received: by ts6-31.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD63AF.2C6AB820@ts6-31.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 12:01:05 -0700 Message-ID: <01BD63AF.2C6AB820@ts6-31.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Projection Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 12:01:01 -0700 Encoding: 13 TEXT, 39 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Well, I did it. I purchased a Holley 4D system for my 351W-powered boat. I've changed my mind (again) and will try and fit the O2 sensor somehow. Question: My EGR port (Edelbrock Performer manifold) is blanked off. A perhaps stupid question, but does anyone have a feel for whether there would be enough 'fresh' exhaust (now there's a concept), perhaps due to firing order pulsation, that sensing the EGR port for O2 content would work? My own intuition is telling me to try and figure out a more conventional solution... Thanks, Mike Jones begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(@43`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M6)E``@0`0```&4```!714Q,+$E$241)5$E055)#2$%3141! M2$],3$59-$1365-414U&3U)-63,U,57-T92QM( (0!0(@'T 1P!\Q&W#N9@G@`R 0:.HG+4!X$ H1F0*4"%@;W\AX040& `GL L@)D$:T&S^/$UI)X @2LTJD7,*BS>0,S8-\!C+=PJ@`V <8&,%0 J%%7$``4& M```#`! 0``````,`$1 `````0 `',&!8TWOI8[T!0 `(,&!8TWOI8[T!'@`] ;``$````%````4D4Z( `````#``TT_3<``"83 ` end From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 15:15:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA26302 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 15:15:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA26293 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 15:15:48 -0400 Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id PAA04390; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 15:15:48 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA08362; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 12:15:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id MAA28622; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 12:15:11 -0700 Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 12:15:10 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: "'DIY-EFI'" Subject: Re: O-2 Failure In-Reply-To: <01BD632B.E722C100@prt-or7-08.ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu What orientation was the sensor in the collector? i.e. was it at 3 o'clock, 9 o'clock, sticking out the top (12 o'clock) or bottom (6 o'clock) etc etc ? I've heard that anything between 9 and 3 o'clock is good (i.e. the top half of the dial) as below that moisture collects and can damage the sensor I presume by rusting. just my $0.02 worth jw From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 15:15:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA26301 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 15:15:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca (mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA26295 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 15:15:48 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA08362; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 12:15:42 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id MAA28622; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 12:15:11 -0700 Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 12:15:10 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: "'DIY-EFI'" Subject: Re: O-2 Failure In-Reply-To: <01BD632B.E722C100@prt-or7-08.ix.netcom.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu What orientation was the sensor in the collector? i.e. was it at 3 o'clock, 9 o'clock, sticking out the top (12 o'clock) or bottom (6 o'clock) etc etc ? I've heard that anything between 9 and 3 o'clock is good (i.e. the top half of the dial) as below that moisture collects and can damage the sensor I presume by rusting. just my $0.02 worth jw From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 16:24:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA27458 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 16:24:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kla-tencor.com (mail01.kla-tencor.com [206.67.220.38]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA27454 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 16:24:03 -0400 Received: from milxbh03.kla-tencor.com by kla-tencor.com (8.8.5/KLA-Tencor.3.6irm) id NAA00435; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 13:22:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: by exchange3.kla-tencor.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2TW4WV16>; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 13:18:49 -0700 Message-ID: <933713F1FB7BD111AC2300A0C98F1AD192FEC4@milxpr06.kla-tencor.com> From: "Buchholz, Steven" To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Intel B57684 EPROM Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 12:36:40 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Well, I opened up the Motronic box from my beemer today. As others had mentioned from my prior post the PROM is indeed socketed ... and has a nifty clip to ensure that it stays seated in the socket. The EPROM device has an Intel logo on it and a device type of B57684. I'm without my nerd novels here at home and was wondering if any of you happen to have a databook that describes this device. It is a 28 pin, 0.6" spacing package. I suspect it is similar to a 27128 or 27256, but I'd rather know than guess when I try to read it in. Interestingly enough, the CPU in this box says that it is a Siemens B57656, but it also has "Intel" stamped on it. Does anyone know anything about this CPU as well? TIA! Steve Buchholz San Jose, CA (USA) '92 BMW k1 (K1DRBAR) but when I cage, I quattro ... From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 17:00:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA27990 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 17:00:41 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA27986 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 17:00:40 -0400 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp10.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.10]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id QAA05476 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 16:00:39 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <352D3682.7EE7@genevaonline.com> Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 15:58:42 -0500 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Projection References: <01BD63AF.2C6AB820@ts6-31.rpt.cyberhighway.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have a copy of the marine 4D and Di system in front of me here and it says to install the o2 sensor in the cast-iron manifold, right next to one exhaust port. I have a newer manual than the one released (for the marine projection) and it goes into much much better detail than the original manuals. -- Andy Quaas From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 18:00:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA28610 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 18:00:35 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [205.139.62.192]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA28605 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 18:00:32 -0400 Received: (qmail 3786 invoked from network); 9 Apr 1998 16:00:31 -0600 Received: from ts6-31.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.157) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 9 Apr 1998 16:00:31 -0600 Received: by ts6-31.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD63D0.14656A60@ts6-31.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 15:56:38 -0700 Message-ID: <01BD63D0.14656A60@ts6-31.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Projection Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 15:56:31 -0700 Encoding: 18 TEXT, 44 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu There may be enough room to do this but it will be tight. Those ports on my setup are quite short, not terribly wide and not very deep either. I think I'll have to make a new riser and bypass the water around that section. Won't be too difficult and shouldn't be too frought with hidden dangers, and as a bonus I'll end up with a less restrictive riser. Mike Jones ---------- >>Squash wrote: I have a copy of the marine 4D and Di system in front of me here and it says to install the o2 sensor in the cast-iron manifold, right next to one exhaust port. I have a newer manual than the one released (for the marine projection) and it goes into much much better detail than the original manuals. -- Andy Quaas>> begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(B86`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, ,````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M M2 $$@ $`#P```%)%.B!06)E``@0`0```&4```!42$5214U!64)%14Y/54=(4D]/351/ M1$]42$E30E54251724Q,0D5424=(5%1(3U-%4$]25%-/3DU94T5455!!4D51 M54E415-(3U)4+$Y/5%1%4E))0DQ95TE$14%.1$Y/5%9%``````(!"1 !```` M-P,``#,#``!'!0``3%I&=8.MJPG_``H!#P(5`J0#Y 7K`H,`4!,#5 (`8V@* MP'-E=.XR!@`&PP*#,@+D!Q,"@T8S`\4"`'!R<1(BFAEHFP# M($1L9P* ?0J BPC/"=D[%^\R-34"@ <*@0VQ"V!N9S$P,R\4``L*$O$+\F,- MX"!4BQ9P%_ @`,!Y(&(=$&,)\ A@9V@@`V #<""0=&\@9!YP=&@$`/4=8'4% M0&D%0 /P%I$=<41T:1W@="X@',%O^1'P(' 7D00@`B =(!U0,1'Q=7 @"L = M$'%UFQ]0'1!S() `("P@';#[!4 5('(%$ )@'5 #\ VPZ2'P;F0C`W8$D!U0 M#;"Z92'@91]0'.$@44D>LO1N:R70)Q:1$< DL!Y2_0# :R01(P`'T040$? % MP'DD,F)Y"K $$25Q'W!A?R-1(?$(8"1!'L I0"&18]<@``(@(%%7`B G!4 ? MT@<>(!Z !I!F:6-U;.\%0"0R(J$L(&0K&0-1'=&_'V(>P":@(_ -L .@9!KA M?0200,XML:3$$.# "T6DM,30TSPWP#- W M\PM9,38<@C.@YP-@%2 J<" M.E(Z/+\YN/,S'S !:!P'5!O9BCC1P# !1 GH" T M1"0C1/YI(9 5`Q] `Z #40(P1C*_!X FH!SR)#(?4#.%1"X G`G7_$;!6)!UP M`D H$0VP`9 #$;]1IDZF3=$+@%%Q431S,P;;.E S=D$D0!U043Z *+#_0[\\ M>APE0:U##UT?,X47$0(`86 ``P`0$ `````#`!$0`@```$ `!S#PV)TM!V2] M`4 `"##PV)TM!V2]`0,``ED"````'@`]``$````%````4D4Z( `````#``TT &_3<``"Q5 ` end From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 19:19:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA29270 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 19:19:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ultra2.syspac.com (ultra2.syspac.com [204.96.14.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA29266 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 19:19:42 -0400 Received: from mailrelay.syspac.com ([204.96.14.7]) by ultra2.syspac.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-37030U5000L500S0) with ESMTP id AAA12553 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 16:17:03 -0700 Received: from p57146.syspac.com (p57076.syspac.com [204.181.57.76]) by mailrelay.syspac.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA12549 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 16:17:02 -0700 (MST) From: bamcknig@postoffice.syspac.com Message-Id: <199804092317.QAA12549@mailrelay.syspac.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 15:53:02 +0000 Subject: RE: Projection Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mike Not sure exactly what the path of the exhaust gas would be. So it would seem that the main consideration would be getting enough exhaust gas over the sensor to reach its operating temp (700 deg +F). The temp could be obtained with a three wire sensor, but you would still need enough flow to be representative of engine performance. Bob McKnight Phx AZ From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 20:15:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA29875 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 20:15:05 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.35]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA29871 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 20:15:03 -0400 Received: from [12.65.70.186] ([12.65.18.152]) by mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA27736 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 00:15:01 +0000 Message-ID: <352CF5DF.CAA@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 17:24:58 +0100 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question References: <01bd6286$b82341e0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu TBK wrote: > > Any chance you've got the fan relay and fuel pump relay swapped? > > I had a similar problem where the 730 ECM uses the MAFS input for Vats (you > can't have a MAFS system and Vats at the same time.) The Mafs would output > 30Hz periodically and start the car. That one took awhile to figure out! > That's similar isn't it? Not likley that they are crossed... W/key on I get f.pump for 2 sec. and then shuts down as it should. -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 20:25:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA29974 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 20:25:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA29970 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 20:25:32 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id UAA12030; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 20:25:20 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA00217 for ; Thu, 09 Apr 1998 20:24:47 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 20:24:47 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804100024.UAA00217@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980409202334.007ac280@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 20:23:34 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Ford PROMS (unsorted) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I unfortunately couldn't get my drive working correctly, so I had to place the 88MB archive online as an 88MB ZIP file. ftp://xephic.dynip.com/outgoing/ford/c96d.zip If your transfer is slow, its because multiple people are trying for it... and being a cheapo kinda guy, I only have 128KB line to the internet. Cheers, Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 9 20:44:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA30229 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 20:44:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.13]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA30223 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 20:44:21 -0400 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id TAA28443 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 19:44:11 -0500 (CDT) Received: from rc-143.blueridge.net(205.152.121.143) by dfw-ix13.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma028432; Thu Apr 9 19:43:48 1998 Message-ID: <008501bd6419$25517fa0$8f7998cd@bernie> From: "Bernie Jacobsen" To: Subject: Mail lists Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 20:39:30 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does anybody know how to get a list of what different mail lists there are? Thanks, ^Bernie From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 00:37:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA31975 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 00:37:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA31971 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 00:37:56 -0400 Received: from bullwinkle (du451-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.6.197]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA14668 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 21:37:55 -0700 Message-Id: <199804100437.VAA14668@mail.wgn.net> X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 21:40:52 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Subject: Carl, and the Haltech In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980323084517.0091aa90@xephic.dynip.com> References: <35151622.3D359B91@mwt.net> <199803220629.GAA185868@out4.ibm.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Diy'er Got a message from Carl today, and was very concerned that he was getting a bad rep here in the DIY list. It was a message so I didn't get to find out the scoop. He just want to make sure that it was know that he took care of the folks that bought the Haltech's, and that to make sure that everyone who got one let the list know to avert anything bad said about him. I think the issue is pretty much put to rest, as I have seen an other person who also got thiers. Again, I don't know what happend to him, but he did get me mine when he said and to that I again thank him. Sandy From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 00:42:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA32014 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 00:42:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.35]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA32010 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 00:42:01 -0400 Received: from [12.65.70.186] by mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA5238 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:41:30 +0000 Message-ID: <352D3456.2470@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 09 Apr 1998 21:51:53 +0100 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DIY_EFI Subject: LT1 EFI Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hey, I've satisfied the codes for EGR solenoid, canister purge, and air pump w/100 ohm resistors. What I have left are the skip shift and MIL lights and also code 97, wich is the speedo side of VSS. The FSM states that it will set this code after 26 seconds of the wrong voltage potential in the speedo circut. Anybody got any clues to what kind of resistance it would take to satisfy? I would now expect to see code 32 (EGR) after driving the car. The PCM expects to see a 1.0 kpa change in MAP when it shuts down the EGR solenoid. Is there any reasonably easy way to accomplish this? TIA -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 01:36:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA32637 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 01:36:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo13.mx.aol.com (imo13.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.35]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA32633 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 01:36:22 -0400 Received: from JCsDOOR@aol.com by imo13.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8KBBa02393 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 01:35:49 -0500 (EDT) From: JCs DOOR Message-ID: <41f9b269.352dafb7@aol.com> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 01:35:49 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: mailing proms box Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 40 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu bruce. to mail eproms: take a box that your checks come in,line box with tin foil. cut two pices of conductive fome to fit box. back in the videocipher days we hauled eproms all over the place,in check boxs. i have a buner and a large eraser,if you need. orange cone hats let you be found in snow banks. jim crance From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 02:25:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA00333 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 02:25:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA00329 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 02:25:16 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-42.foothill.net [209.77.119.42]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id XAA27961 for ; Thu, 9 Apr 1998 23:26:47 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question Date: Thu, 9 Apr 1998 23:24:16 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6449$49a9d8e0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sounds good. Air pump failure as indicated by Peter? TK -----Original Message----- From: Ron Tyler To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 09, 1998 5:43 PM Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question >TBK wrote: >> >> Any chance you've got the fan relay and fuel pump relay swapped? >> >> I had a similar problem where the 730 ECM uses the MAFS input for Vats (you >> can't have a MAFS system and Vats at the same time.) The Mafs would output >> 30Hz periodically and start the car. That one took awhile to figure out! >> That's similar isn't it? > > > Not likley that they are crossed... W/key on I get f.pump for 2 sec. >and then shuts down as it should. >-- >Ron & Stephanie Tyler >'72 LT1/T56 240Z >http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 03:20:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA00972 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 03:20:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA00968 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 03:20:48 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-042.mcn.net [208.26.146.42]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA16378 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 01:20:44 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <352DC570.49864245@mcn.net> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 01:08:32 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Projection References: <01BD63AF.2C6AB820@ts6-31.rpt.cyberhighway.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mike Jones wrote: > > Well, I did it. I purchased a Holley 4D system for my 351W-powered boat. > > I've changed my mind (again) and will try and fit the O2 sensor somehow. > Question: My EGR port (Edelbrock Performer manifold) is blanked off. A > perhaps stupid question, but does anyone have a feel for whether there > would be enough 'fresh' exhaust (now there's a concept), perhaps due to > firing order pulsation, that sensing the EGR port for O2 content would > work? My own intuition is telling me to try and figure out a more > conventional solution... > > Thanks, > > Mike Jones > > Name: WINMAIL.DAT > WINMAIL.DAT Type: WordPerfect Document (6.1) File (application/x-unknown-content-type-WPWin6.1File) > Encoding: x-uuencode You know, I just had an idea. Does your intake manifold have an exhaust crossover? Are you using it or is it plugged? Might be an optimum place to put a heated ego sensor. Plus would raise some eyebrows... Shannen From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 03:46:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA01482 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 03:46:43 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.36]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA01477 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 03:46:40 -0400 Received: from EFISYSTEMS@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8ITJa02269 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 03:45:48 -0500 (EDT) From: EFISYSTEMS Message-ID: Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 03:45:48 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Carl Summers...Tried to help the group Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 40 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu So here I am waiting for my payment to hit my visa card so I can re-use my internet and my e-mail site......I used all the money I had to pay my past due bills so I could help the group...the people that wanted some Haltech's....and YES I agree I shouldn't have.....I have been blamed for being a thief, a liar and a con....I have learned alot from this group and I have alot to offer....so now I go on vacation and sit in the archives (only place I can read from at this point) When I finally was able to get back on-line from my home on my AOL account I was disturbed to find I was considered a thief.....So Tom when your check STOP payment.... It shouldn't have hurt me except you didn't tell me when I talked to you FRIDAY,last week,,,So when I read the archive's sunday night I got a little concerned you had cancelled your check,,,so I sat on your Haltech,,,good for me I guess,,,,At this point I'd rather have my kids solder on it than ship it to you.............If you think COD's are better I could have just have easily sent you a phone book COD so when you shook it you would have thought you were getting something..........and yes, Group, I am a bit pissed.....just because I have a little knowledge doesn't mean I am rich.....I stretched my self a little too thin thinking I would be repayed in a couple of weeks.....I do thank, however, the people that backed me and my good will..ie... Sandy,Steve,Robert, Bruce, Kevin, Mike(EcmNut),Matt, Ken,(FiSystems),and others I can't remember now...........................And you A70duster.....FUCK YOU............it seems that the AOL members are the worst,,and here I am writing from my AOL account....Sorry Orin that my mail bounced back to you....couldn't be helped........I'll re-subscribe as InTech@writeme.com sometime soon and help this group as much as possible... I do feel for Tom as no-one wants to get fu#%&^#'d.....but this is a pretty good group and it might be better next time to not jump to conclusions........Thanks to all that have helped me in the past......I'm just going to simmer here in the background for a while..... -Carl Summers From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 04:56:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA02197 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:56:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from newmail.virgin.net (newmail.virgin.net [194.168.54.44]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA02193 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 04:56:25 -0400 Received: from tony-s-machine ([194.168.123.188]) by newmail.virgin.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 1-55555U125000L125000S0) with SMTP id AAA10613 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 08:56:24 +0000 Message-ID: <352DDD50.1BC4@virgin.net> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 09:50:24 +0100 From: Tony Cooper X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-VN709-003 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Carl Summers...Tried to help the group References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu EFISYSTEMS wrote: > > So here I am waiting for my payment to hit my visa card so I can re-use my > internet and my e-mail site......I used all the money I had to pay my past due > to not jump to conclusions........Thanks to all that have helped me in the > past......I'm just going to simmer here in the background for a while..... > -Carl Summers Carl, I know what you are feeling, I have had the same experience myself - I am glad that it hasn't hit you so hard for you to say 'bugger the list'. Good on you Carl - look forward to your return. Tony -- Sent By Tony Cooper. email: tony.cooper@virgin.net Allow at least 10 working minutes for reply. ;) From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 10:50:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA04431 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 10:50:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA04427 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 10:50:19 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-16.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.85]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id KAA10436 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 10:49:22 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Error at Programming 101 Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 10:49:53 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd648f$eba98be0$55198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I made a mistake, 03C7-03D7, is not a fuel adder for WOT, enable. It is a continuation of the VE tables, for extending the map to high rpm values. Also, the mention of the TPS enable percentages are not the only parameters to be meet for WOT enable. I hope Carl doesn't simmer too long, I miss his help on the 101 project. NICE having him back. Sincerely Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 10:53:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA04479 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 10:53:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from vega.netquest.com (www.netquest.com [209.69.94.27]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA04475 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 10:53:29 -0400 Received: from bob-s-computer ([209.69.95.59]) by vega.netquest.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) ID# 0-37888U2500L250S0) with SMTP id AAA67 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 10:58:53 -0400 Message-ID: <352E3192.3681@netquest.com> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 10:49:54 -0400 From: bailey@netquest.com (Bailey, Robert B.) Organization: Bailey Engineering Inc. X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: LT1 EFI Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello What year LT1 PCM are you using? Disabling EGR will probably cause part throttle detonation due to the additional spark advance programmed during EGR operation. If you are using a '94 - '95 PCM then reprogramming to prevent EGR might be the best solution. In my experience most codes will cause the PCM to turn on both fans and shut off 'learning'. Bob Bailey From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 12:40:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA05624 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 12:40:20 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [205.139.62.192]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA05620 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 12:40:17 -0400 Received: (qmail 14424 invoked from network); 10 Apr 1998 10:13:35 -0600 Received: from ts6-30.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.156) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 10 Apr 1998 10:13:35 -0600 Received: by ts6-30.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD6468.C9284D80@ts6-30.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 10:09:45 -0700 Message-ID: <01BD6468.C9284D80@ts6-30.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Projection Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 10:09:40 -0700 Encoding: 35 TEXT, 48 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Exactly what I meant -- I was emphasizing the EGR aspect, but that is indeed the crossover. So what do you think? Enough flow for timely O2 info? Mike J. Shannen wrote: >>You know, I just had an idea. Does your intake manifold have an exhaust crossover? Are you using it or is it plugged? Might be an optimum place to put a heated ego sensor. Plus would raise some eyebrows... Shannen>> Mike Jones wrote: > > Well, I did it. I purchased a Holley 4D system for my 351W-powered boat. > > I've changed my mind (again) and will try and fit the O2 sensor somehow. > Question: My EGR port (Edelbrock Performer manifold) is blanked off. A > perhaps stupid question, but does anyone have a feel for whether there > would be enough 'fresh' exhaust (now there's a concept), perhaps due to > firing order pulsation, that sensing the EGR port for O2 content would > work? My own intuition is telling me to try and figure out a more > conventional solution... > > Thanks, > > Mike Jones begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(BT1`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, ,````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M M2 $$@ $`#P```%)%.B!06)E``@0`0```&4```!%6$%#5$Q95TA!5$E-14%.5"TM25=! M4T5-4$A!4TE:24Y'5$A%14=205-014-4+$)55%1(051)4TE.1$5%1%1(14-2 M3U-33U9%4E-/5TA!5$1/64]55$A)3DL_14Y/54=(1DQ/``````(!"1 !```` M"P0```<$``#6!@``3%I&=::L>\K_``H!#P(5`J0#Y 7K`H,`4!,#5 (`8V@* MP'-E=.XR!@`&PP*#,@/&!Q,"@T8S`\4"`'!R<1(B$$=2(!_@<,$%D'0L(&)U!4 @T/<>P00`(E!N#; )@"## M!0!2;P00;W8$D"X?`%/J;QZ49"00>0A@(,$+@"1K/Q\`16X(8&=HNB <$&\' MX (0!*$0"( >1*YL^VR?&3,!7%]$PDF0QD#:1=R/1'O Z,'(1L1'P M,4$@BD@&\&P]D" T1#N0"Q4C)B-M'H S-3%7_"UP)@`$D"+1!N >P"BF^4S) M22 #("8R'J 2`!? !< @PK\90%(' M/(0XP0GP)9,G`U!I!Y!H)S1W*#!A860GWU]1(S "(#G0!3 I(;!=5OYD"E Y M\5('1F %$""A!;#S!($Z(6QS'L!>DR(3.Z+_()I98R8R)N%E015 'U$\@WUA MR7(E,ECQ)@`Q<0(P=?\VH%B1(E(50!?@()(]83H!_56(9PAP(/ (8#I2!&!A MJ?]E02.@`C!8D0= /3$*0%B"BSX83,E4*R%K'@`]``$````%````4D4Z( `````#``TT_3<``#JD ` end From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 13:22:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA06044 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 13:22:42 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail1.dac.neu.edu (mail1.dac.neu.edu [129.10.1.75]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA06039 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 13:22:38 -0400 Received: from lynx02.dac.neu.edu (lynx02.dac.neu.edu [129.10.1.79]) by mail1.dac.neu.edu with ESMTP id NAA19194 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 13:22:38 -0400 (EDT) From: Iestyn Guest Received: by lynx02.dac.neu.edu with id NAA30793; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 13:22:38 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804101722.NAA30793@lynx02.dac.neu.edu> Subject: Re: Carl Summers...Tried to help the group To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 13:22:37 -0400 (EDT) In-Reply-To: from "EFISYSTEMS" at Apr 10, 98 03:45:48 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL25] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Carl, I just finnished reading your email, It's a shame some folks don't apreciate your generosity. Remember that the path to hell is paved with good intensions. Respectfully, Iestyn. PS. Spell-check not working, sorry! From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 16:10:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA07659 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 16:10:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bert.acesag.auburn.edu (bert.acesag.auburn.edu [131.204.46.47]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA07655 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 16:10:19 -0400 Received: from bert (bert [131.204.46.47]) by bert.acesag.auburn.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAB25453 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 15:10:12 -0500 (CDT) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 15:10:12 -0500 (CDT) From: "Gregory A. Parmer" X-Sender: gparmer@bert To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Mail lists In-Reply-To: <008501bd6419$25517fa0$8f7998cd@bernie> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu There are others which I don't know, but the EEC-EFI list can be subscribed to automagically by sending mail to eec-subscribe@eelink.net It is for discussion of Ford's EEC-IV. -greg Greg Parmer Auburn, AL From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 16:37:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA08038 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 16:37:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from SIVM.SI.EDU (sivm.si.edu [160.111.4.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA08034 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 16:37:53 -0400 Message-Id: <199804102037.QAA08034@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Received: from SIVM.SI.EDU by SIVM.SI.EDU (IBM VM SMTP V2R3) with BSMTP id 0429; Fri, 10 Apr 98 16:33:01 EDT Received: from SIVM (NJE origin TGOODING@SIVM) by SIVM.SI.EDU (LMail V1.2c/1.8c) with BSMTP id 8608; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 16:33:01 -0400 Comments: Converted from OV/VM to RFC822 format by PUMP V2.2X Date: Fri, 10 Apr 98 16:32:12 EDT From: Tim Gooding Subject: HC11 and prop To: Sender: owner-diy_efi@EFI332.ENG.OHIO-STATE.EDU Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@EFI332.ENG.OHIO-STATE.EDU Greetings! I am laying out an HC11 board for use as a datalogger on a motorcycle initially, and as a programmable ignition at some point down the road. The ignition will use some sort of Hall effect sensor to determine crank position. I wanted to use a simple inductive pickup around a spark plug wire to pick up an RPM signal. There are a couple of problems here. On our new GSXR the coils are incorporated in the spark plug caps, so no plug wires with the big inductive collapse. The coil/cap thing is new to motorcycles but has been on cars for a while, I understand. Has anybody figured out how to measure ignition pulses without splicing into an ignition wire(something known to cause problems, at least with motorbike digital ignitions), or resorting to building a box to split and amplify ignition signals.What kind of noise precautions are necessary when measuring inductive collapse? What effect do the other(three) plugs have? I could install a separate Hall effect sensor to read a camshaft bolt, or use the stock sensor(mounted on the countershaft), but the question intrigued me. On an unrelated topic, the use of isopropyl alcohol as a fuel additive/oxygenator has come to my attention. Does anybody know the ratio, and what percentage jet increases would be necessary? We are an endurance team looking for an edge, so any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance, Tim Gooding Army of Darkness Racing Smithsonian Institution From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 16:56:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA08383 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 16:56:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from post.mail.demon.net (post-10.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA08379 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 16:56:50 -0400 From: martin@mgass.demon.co.uk Received: from mgass.demon.co.uk ([158.152.172.199]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa1020444; 10 Apr 98 20:50 GMT MMDF-Warning: Parse error in original version of preceding line at post.mail.demon.net To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 21:29:09 +0000 Subject: OBD Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Message-ID: <892241448.1020444.0@mgass.demon.co.uk> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thought this may be of interest : Extract/summary from UK Consumer Magazine entitled "Campaign to block proposed repairs monopoly" "The Consumers Association is blocking a bid to prevent a small anti-polution gadget becoming the key to a multi-million pound monopoly on car repairs (for vehicle manufacturers) by proposing an ammendment to forthcoming legislation... By 2001 all new petrol-engined Eurpopean cars will have to contain an on-board diagnostic system (OBD)......the problem is that car makers intend to design OBDs so that only proprietary devices can read the codes and to use proprietary codes.....this would unfairly limit competition... and penalise independant repairers.. ...as of this date the European Parliament has endorsed the proposed ammendment but European government ministers remain to be persuaded" --Well, lets wait and see with interest.......the "small anti-polution gadget" is of course ECU with OBD capability. I guess this may cause a bit of amusement or deja vu with some of the US based diy_efi subscribers. Martin ---------------------------------------------------------- martin@mgass.demon.co.uk ---------------------------------------------------------- From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 18:57:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA09325 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 18:57:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from wolfenet.com (root@frapp.wolfe.net [207.178.61.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA09321 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 18:57:22 -0400 Received: from gonzo.wolfenet.com (orin@gonzo.wolfenet.com [204.157.98.2]) by wolfenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA26897 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 15:57:20 -0700 (PDT) From: Orin Eman Received: (from orin@localhost) by gonzo.wolfenet.com (8.8.3/8.7) id PAA31963 for diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 15:57:20 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804102257.PAA31963@gonzo.wolfenet.com> Subject: BOUNCE diy_efi: Admin request (fwd) To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (DIY EFI List) Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 15:57:19 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Please try to keep s*bscribe or uns*bscribe out of your subjects and the first few lines of your posts or it bounces... Forwarded message: > From orin@WOLFENET.com Fri Apr 10 14:09:17 1998 > Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 17:09:14 -0400 > Message-Id: <199804102109.RAA08677@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> > X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f > To: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > From: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: BOUNCE diy_efi: Admin request > >From diy_efi-owner@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Fri Apr 10 17:09:14 1998 > Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca (mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2]) > by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA08672 > for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 17:09:13 -0400 > Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) > by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA00809 > for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 14:09:04 -0700 (PDT) > Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) > id OAA01340; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 14:08:32 -0700 > Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 14:08:32 -0700 (PDT) > From: James Weiler > X-Sender: james@koala > To: diy_efi@EFI332.ENG.OHIO-STATE.EDU > Subject: sxbscribing to the EEC-IV list > In-Reply-To: <199804102037.QAA08034@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> > Message-ID: > MIME-Version: 1.0 > Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII > Hello: It seems some are having trouble finding the new EEC-IV list. It > has been moved so to sxbscribe to it use the following: > eec-subscribe@eelink.net > cheers > jw From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 18:58:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA09343 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 18:58:41 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from belize.it.earthlink.net (belize-c.it.earthlink.net [204.250.46.130]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA09339 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 18:58:40 -0400 Received: from odin (1Cust5.tnt22.atl2.da.uu.net [153.36.127.5]) by belize.it.earthlink.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA08347 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 15:58:38 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804102258.PAA08347@belize.it.earthlink.net> From: "Thor Johnson" To: Subject: RE: DIY_EFI Digest V3 #152 - More Q's on data visualization? Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 18:58:38 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <352A77E5.23EE@ra.msstate.edu> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > I guess that is what I was trying to ask. Do 2d systems have have only > 2 inputs even though their graphs can look like a 3d? Or is this what a > 3d system is? If this is true, has there ever been systems that allow > three variables to calculate the fuel needed? i.e. a variable for each > axis, x,y, and z. The graph is probably (as you surmized) 2 inputs (x,y), z out. The real problem with more inputs (IE... 4D table, a cube with the color representing the output) would probably lie in the amount of space required for the table. (10x10 = 100... 10x10x10= 100) Here is where I get lost.... using a 4D/5D table, I would assume that you could tune the engine perfectly (x=RPM, Y=MAP, Z=Delta-Throttle, P=Engine Coolant,... etc). But how would you get the data to reduce to something a microcontroller could handle? (10x10x10x10x10 = too much for a 68hc11!) How would you take data to put it into the 5 dimensional thingy (ie. how would you make test runs to populate the grid)? And the best question.... I control the Fuel, which controls RPMs.... what do I do about interactions? From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 19:35:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA09860 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 19:35:41 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from oasys.dt.navy.mil (oasys.dt.navy.mil [130.46.1.53]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA09855 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 19:35:38 -0400 Received: from slip-32-100-159-108.dc.us.ibm.net by oasys.dt.navy.mil (5.61/oasys.dt.navy.mil) id AA04969; Fri, 10 Apr 98 19:35:37 EDT Message-Id: <352EAC8A.4022@oasys.dt.navy.mil> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 19:34:35 -0400 From: Robert Gallant X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC) Mime-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Haltech wiring? References: <199804101722.NAA30793@lynx02.dac.neu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Can someone with an F3 check their manual for me? What are the connections for the following wires. pink grey brown Thanks Rob gallant@oasys.dt.navy.mil From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 19:41:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA09935 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 19:41:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from out2.ibm.net (out2.ibm.net [165.87.194.229]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA09931 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 19:41:08 -0400 Received: from 32.100.159.108 (slip-32-100-159-108.dc.us.ibm.net [32.100.159.108]) by out2.ibm.net (8.8.5/8.6.9) with SMTP id XAA07344 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 23:41:07 GMT Message-ID: <352EADD4.4F13@ibm.net> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 19:40:05 -0400 From: Robert Gallant X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Haltech wiring? References: <199804101722.NAA30793@lynx02.dac.neu.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Can someone with an F3 check their manual for me? What are the following wires: pink grey brown Thanks Rob gallant@oasys.dt.navy.mil From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 23:34:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA11765 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 23:34:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA11761 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 23:34:26 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm302-090.mcn.net [208.26.146.90]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA25199 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 21:34:13 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <352EE1D6.54FF625C@mcn.net> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 21:21:58 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: OBD References: <892241448.1020444.0@mgass.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu martin@mgass.demon.co.uk wrote: > >snip< By 2001 all new > petrol-engined Eurpopean cars will have to contain an on-board > diagnostic system (OBD)......the problem is that car makers > intend to design OBDs so that only proprietary devices can read > the codes and to use proprietary codes.....this would unfairly > limit competition... and penalise independant repairers.. > > --Well, lets wait and see with interest.......the "small > anti-polution gadget" is of course ECU with OBD capability. > > I guess this may cause a bit of amusement or deja vu with some > of the US based diy_efi subscribers. > > Martin > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > martin@mgass.demon.co.uk > ---------------------------------------------------------- Throw OBD away and get right on to OBDII. Standard diagnostic capability is the only way to go. The great thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 23:34:37 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA11771 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 23:34:37 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA11767 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 23:34:36 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm302-090.mcn.net [208.26.146.90]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA25287 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 21:34:34 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <352EE1E9.9BA65492@mcn.net> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 21:22:17 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: OBD References: <892241448.1020444.0@mgass.demon.co.uk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu martin@mgass.demon.co.uk wrote: > >snip< By 2001 all new > petrol-engined Eurpopean cars will have to contain an on-board > diagnostic system (OBD)......the problem is that car makers > intend to design OBDs so that only proprietary devices can read > the codes and to use proprietary codes.....this would unfairly > limit competition... and penalise independant repairers.. > > --Well, lets wait and see with interest.......the "small > anti-polution gadget" is of course ECU with OBD capability. > > I guess this may cause a bit of amusement or deja vu with some > of the US based diy_efi subscribers. > > Martin > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > martin@mgass.demon.co.uk > ---------------------------------------------------------- Might as well throw OBD away and get right on to OBDII. Standard diagnostic capability is the only way to go. The great thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 10 23:55:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA12114 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 23:55:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA12110 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 23:55:41 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm302-090.mcn.net [208.26.146.90]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA02067 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 21:55:39 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <352EE6DB.3BA28868@mcn.net> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 21:43:23 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Projection References: <01BD6468.C9284D80@ts6-30.rpt.cyberhighway.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mike Jones wrote: > > Exactly what I meant -- I was emphasizing the EGR aspect, but that is > indeed the crossover. So what do you think? Enough flow for timely O2 > info? > Well, I've been thinking about this one. You would probably have to install the sensor at an angle so the tip reached into one of the heads. I don't think the crossover is deep enough to mount the sensor vertically. Enough exhaust flow? I would think so. Since you are programming the ecu, and since you basically run at a fixed rpm, it seems like you could use the readings reliably. Flow would depend on exhaust pressure differences between banks. You might find a way to measure the temp of the crossover right by the head, before and during a run across the lake. Cold or cool would mean no exhaust flow. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 00:00:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12191 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 00:00:53 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA12187 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 00:00:51 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm302-090.mcn.net [208.26.146.90]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA03707 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 22:00:48 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <352EE80E.2CB39553@mcn.net> Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 21:48:30 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Carl Summers...Tried to help the group References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thanks to all that have helped me in the > past......I'm just going to simmer here in the background for a while..... > -Carl Summers Hey Carl, been there. Have had "good friends" stiff me for parts and work enough times that I often don't bother to help anymore. It sucks, but that's the way it is for me. Glad you're back, though. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 00:42:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12759 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 00:42:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from m28.boston.juno.com (m28.boston.juno.com [205.231.101.186]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA12753 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 00:42:27 -0400 Received: (from cosmic.ray@juno.com) by m28.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id A_G18556; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 00:40:27 EDT To: fsj@digest.net, fsj-list@unix.off-road.com, diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 22:58:41 -0400 Subject: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup Message-ID: <19980411.003943.11246.0.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 3-4,6-9,11-14,16-18 From: cosmic.ray@juno.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have a Motorcraft Duraspark ignition in my '89 Grand Wagoneer. I am trying to use a seven-pin GM ignition module so that I can control the spark timing with the Holley Pro-Jection 4Di box. I want to trigger the GM module with the pickup coil output of the Motorcraft distributer. The seven-pin module is the one that is used in the GM HEI (High Energy Ignition) systems - both coil-in-cap and the external coil module. This is rather obscure info, but maybe someone can help me. 1) What is the voltage output of the ignition pickup coil that is used for the Motorcraft Duraspark? 2) What voltage is required to trigger the GM module? Do you know of anyone who has used a Motorcraft distributer to trigger a GM module? Ray Drouillard _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 00:54:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12937 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 00:54:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com (imo17.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA12933 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 00:54:33 -0400 Received: from A70Duster@aol.com by imo17.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8EANa02745 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 00:53:48 -0500 (EDT) From: A70Duster Message-ID: <2fd2b915.352ef75e@aol.com> Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 00:53:48 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Carl Summers...Tried to help the group Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 69 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu In a message dated 98-04-10 03:54:07 EDT, you write: << And you A70duster.....F*** YOU............it seems that the AOL members are the worst,,and here I am writing from my AOL account.. >> Oh yeah, got a real live one here..... Hope the rest of you out there didn't get F****D. Please return to DIY_EFI Bye... From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 01:26:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA13370 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 01:26:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA13364 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 01:26:02 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-35.foothill.net [209.77.119.35]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA16564 for ; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 22:27:23 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: Carl Summers...Tried to help the group Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 22:25:03 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd650a$2df2b100$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I say we get 'em, Men! Are you with me? String 'em up! Dance! I said DANCE! Can we move on to EFI now? DIY-FYI Thought Police -----Original Message----- From: A70Duster To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Friday, April 10, 1998 10:22 PM Subject: Re: Carl Summers...Tried to help the group >In a message dated 98-04-10 03:54:07 EDT, you write: > ><< And you A70duster.....F*** YOU............it > seems that the AOL members are the worst,,and here I am writing from my AOL > account.. >> > > >Oh yeah, got a real live one here..... > >Hope the rest of you out there didn't get F****D. > >Please return to DIY_EFI > >Bye... > From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 01:28:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA13422 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 01:28:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id BAA13415 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 01:28:05 -0400 Received: from mail-gw6.pacbell.net by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id BAA25064; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 01:28:06 -0400 Received: from default (ppp-207-214-185-190.anhm01.pacbell.net [207.214.185.190]) by mail-gw6.pacbell.net (8.8.8/8.7.1+antispam) with SMTP id WAA11515; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 22:24:35 -0700 (PDT) From: "Duane Reed" To: "EMCNUT" , "MN12 Mailing List" , "Homebrew Automotive" , , , Subject: want used injectors Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 22:20:36 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6509$8f232c80$beb9d6cf@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-7" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu looking for 6 used injectors the ones I can use now are from a Ford Thunderbird Super Coupe bosch injector +ACM-0-280-150-756 around 14-16 k ohms and flow about 32lbs hr. at 45psi or if you can recommend a suitable replacement ? willing to pay +AH4AJA-25 each thanks for your time Duane Reed From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 01:28:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA13423 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 01:28:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail-gw6.pacbell.net (mail-gw6.pacbell.net [206.13.28.41]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA13413 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 01:28:05 -0400 Received: from default (ppp-207-214-185-190.anhm01.pacbell.net [207.214.185.190]) by mail-gw6.pacbell.net (8.8.8/8.7.1+antispam) with SMTP id WAA11515; Fri, 10 Apr 1998 22:24:35 -0700 (PDT) From: "Duane Reed" To: "EMCNUT" , "MN12 Mailing List" , "Homebrew Automotive" , , , Subject: want used injectors Date: Fri, 10 Apr 1998 22:20:36 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6509$8f232c80$beb9d6cf@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-7" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu looking for 6 used injectors the ones I can use now are from a Ford Thunderbird Super Coupe bosch injector +ACM-0-280-150-756 around 14-16 k ohms and flow about 32lbs hr. at 45psi or if you can recommend a suitable replacement ? willing to pay +AH4AJA-25 each thanks for your time Duane Reed From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 07:28:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA15060 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 07:28:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo20.mx.aol.com (imo20.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.42]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA15056 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 07:28:28 -0400 Received: from ECMnut@aol.com by imo20.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8ZPHa04942 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 07:27:46 -0500 (EDT) From: ECMnut Message-ID: <7d994aa8.352f53b5@aol.com> Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 07:27:46 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Carl Summers...Tried to help the group Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Carl is a helpful guy that always gives more to the list as he takes away. Let's hope that doesn't change, now that the list turned and bit him.. He was nice enough to hold a Haltech almost indefinitely for me, while I figured out that the tax-man had first claim to my money this month.. When I told him I could not buy it, he said "no problem" "thanks for letting me know"... After the flames started flying, I was very sorry to hear that it was his own money that was making these units available to us. (okay, hang me first) . Glad he's back. Mike V. From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 08:36:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA15600 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 08:36:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA15596 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 08:36:25 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-6.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.24]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id IAA19825 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 08:35:30 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 08:36:03 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6546$643edf40$18198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ----Original Message----- From: Raymond C Drouillard To: fsj@digest.net ; fsj-list@unix.off-road.com ; diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Saturday, April 11, 1998 1:16 AM Subject: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup >I have a Motorcraft Duraspark ignition in my '89 Grand Wagoneer. I am >trying to use a seven-pin GM ignition module so that I can control the >spark timing with the Holley Pro-Jection 4Di box. I want to trigger the >GM module with the pickup coil output of the Motorcraft distributer. > >The seven-pin module is the one that is used in the GM HEI (High Energy >Ignition) systems - both coil-in-cap and the external coil module. > >This is rather obscure info, but maybe someone can help me. > >1) What is the voltage output of the ignition pickup coil that is used >for the Motorcraft Duraspark? > >2) What voltage is required to trigger the GM module? > >Do you know of anyone who has used a Motorcraft distributer to trigger a >GM module? > >Ray Drouillard > In the "Dr's Guide to Optimizing your Ignition System" they have a chapter on doing this and the mopar to gm adaptation. Off the top of my head ya just wire the pickup coil to the two "normal" pickup pins of the gm. It does matter which lead goes to which pin (the most initial advance being correct). Bruce From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 08:50:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA15810 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 08:50:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA15806 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 08:50:49 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-6.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.24]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id IAA23267 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 08:49:54 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Aftermarket ecn maps Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 08:50:28 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6548$676a1ca0$18198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Would the owners of the various aftermarket ecms mind posting what each offers to be programmed?. I've tried to go to the various wb sites, but have not been able to access them, or when I do the download I get stuff I can't read. Or would ya e-mail me, with a list of tables if you think it's off base for discussion here. Bruce nacelp@bright.net From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 12:49:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA17183 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 12:49:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ihgw1.lucent.com (ihgw1.lucent.com [207.19.48.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA17179 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 12:49:52 -0400 Received: from hfcnfs.hobl.lucent.com by ihig1.firewall.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-L sol2) id MAA27285; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 12:12:35 -0500 Received: from lucent.com by hfcnfs.hobl.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-1.3.1 sol2) id MAA04471; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 12:49:43 -0400 Message-ID: <352F56C9.3F9CDD0E@lucent.com> Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 12:40:57 +0000 From: Angel Gomez Organization: Lucent Technologies X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en]C-EMS-1.3.1 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, charset=iso-8859-1@lucent.com Subject: Re: Request for ECU Info References: <01bd62cb$0d136560$1f358ad1@zippy> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mazdatrix had a gadget to not cut the fuel to the rear rotor on high boost. It lies, and you place it in series with the boost sensor. They have a web site http://www.mazdatrix.com I would still like to know some data on the Rotary System. My application is for an orphan engine (the 20B). Angel M&D wrote: > > Does anyone here have any data on the Bosch L-Motronic systems? That is what > I believe the RX-7's have. I am interested in doing two things: removing the > fuel cut under high boost, and extending the fuel maps. Any ideas? > > Michael Harrington > 91coupe@bellsouth.net > 91 RX-7 Coupe "Pearl" w/ some mods > 88 RX-7 T2 "Beast" sitting in carport :( > N3WJE Technician+ Ham From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 13:34:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA17504 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 13:34:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kla-tencor.com (mail01.kla-tencor.com [206.67.220.38]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA17494 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 13:34:19 -0400 Received: from milxbh03.kla-tencor.com by kla-tencor.com (8.8.5/KLA-Tencor.3.6irm) id KAA21022; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 10:33:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: by exchange3.kla-tencor.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2VX9TKZ4>; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 10:33:48 -0700 Message-ID: <933713F1FB7BD111AC2300A0C98F1AD192FF75@milxpr06.kla-tencor.com> From: "Buchholz, Steven" To: DIY-EFI Subject: DIY_EFI Archives? Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 10:36:14 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu For some reason the list server likes to kick me off the digest every once in a while. I haven't received digests for the past few days ... is there an archive somewhere that I can access to read them? TIA! Steve Buchholz San Jose, CA (USA) From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 16:18:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA18835 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 16:18:43 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca (mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA18825 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 16:18:34 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id NAA13655; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 13:18:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id NAA02178; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 13:17:57 -0700 Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 13:17:57 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: eec@eelink.net cc: EMCNUT , MN12 Mailing List , Homebrew Automotive , eec@eelink.net, diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu, diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC: want used injectors In-Reply-To: <01bd6509$8f232c80$beb9d6cf@default> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Try the Buick GN list. These cars came with 30-32 lb/hr injectors. jw On Fri, 10 Apr 1998, Duane Reed wrote: > looking for 6 used injectors the ones I can use now are from a Ford > Thunderbird Super Coupe bosch > injector +ACM-0-280-150-756 around 14-16 k ohms and flow about 32lbs hr. at > 45psi or if you can recommend a suitable replacement ? > > willing to pay +AH4AJA-25 each > thanks for your time > Duane Reed > > *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ** > EEC@eelink.net -- For more info go to: > > http://eelink.umich.edu/~p-nowak/eec-efi/EEC-Mailadddrop.html > From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 16:18:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA18834 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 16:18:42 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA18829 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 16:18:40 -0400 Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id QAA17057; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 16:18:37 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id NAA13655; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 13:18:30 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id NAA02178; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 13:17:57 -0700 Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 13:17:57 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: eec@eelink.net cc: EMCNUT , MN12 Mailing List , Homebrew Automotive , eec@eelink.net, diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu, diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC: want used injectors In-Reply-To: <01bd6509$8f232c80$beb9d6cf@default> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Try the Buick GN list. These cars came with 30-32 lb/hr injectors. jw On Fri, 10 Apr 1998, Duane Reed wrote: > looking for 6 used injectors the ones I can use now are from a Ford > Thunderbird Super Coupe bosch > injector +ACM-0-280-150-756 around 14-16 k ohms and flow about 32lbs hr. at > 45psi or if you can recommend a suitable replacement ? > > willing to pay +AH4AJA-25 each > thanks for your time > Duane Reed > > *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ** > EEC@eelink.net -- For more info go to: > > http://eelink.umich.edu/~p-nowak/eec-efi/EEC-Mailadddrop.html > From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 16:58:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA19459 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 16:58:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from beavis.inetdirect.net (root@beavis.inetdirect.net [204.120.164.7]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA19455 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 16:58:20 -0400 Received: from inetdirect.net (p2-term8-ind.netdirect.net [204.248.210.191]) by beavis.inetdirect.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id PAA19455 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 15:58:18 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <352FC958.9378363D@inetdirect.net> Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 15:49:44 -0400 From: Scott Linder X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Honda F2 injectors. References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu bruno, We offer reconditioned fuel injectors of all types for $ 24.95 each with a exchange if needed to increase or add fuel. Call us at 317-487-9460 and talk to doug Garriot our fuel injection wizzard or request fuel injection info at our web page from : www.lindertech.com Jim Linder the injector " guru" Bruno P Vanzieleghem wrote: > I am looking for suitable injectors for a Honda F2 engine (600cc). We are > running the engine with a 20 mm restricter. Does anyone know of suitable > injectors (at a reasonable price). > > Bruno Vanzieleghem From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 17:01:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA19507 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 17:01:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from beavis.inetdirect.net (root@beavis.inetdirect.net [204.120.164.7]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA19503 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 17:01:51 -0400 Received: from inetdirect.net (p2-term8-ind.netdirect.net [204.248.210.191]) by beavis.inetdirect.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id QAA19847 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 16:01:48 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <352FCA2A.641546FB@inetdirect.net> Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 15:53:14 -0400 From: Scott Linder X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: want used injectors References: <01bd6509$8f232c80$beb9d6cf@default> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Duane, We offer many reconditioned injectors at $ 24.95 each. Call 317-487-9460 and talk to the injector wizzard Doug Garriott. Or request info from our web page at www.lindertech.com. Jim Linder the injector : guru: Duane Reed wrote: > looking for 6 used injectors the ones I can use now are from a Ford > Thunderbird Super Coupe bosch > injector +ACM-0-280-150-756 around 14-16 k ohms and flow about 32lbs hr. at > 45psi or if you can recommend a suitable replacement ? > > willing to pay +AH4AJA-25 each > thanks for your time > Duane Reed From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 18:37:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA20440 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 18:37:35 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA20435 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 18:37:34 -0400 Received: from send1e.yahoomail.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via SMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id SAA20482; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 18:37:33 -0400 Message-ID: <19980411223818.17634.rocketmail@send1e.yahoomail.com> Received: from [153.37.171.143] by send1e; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 15:38:18 PDT Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 15:38:18 -0700 (PDT) From: RS Subject: Re: EEC: want used injectors To: eec@eelink.net, eec@eelink.net Cc: homebrew-autos@xephic.dynip.com, eec@eelink.net, diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu, diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have some 35 pph injectors from an SVO. leme know Randy > On Fri, 10 Apr 1998, Duane Reed wrote: > > > looking for 6 used injectors the ones I can use now are from a Ford > > Thunderbird Super Coupe bosch > > injector +ACM-0-280-150-756 around 14-16 k ohms and flow about 32lbs hr. at > > 45psi or if you can recommend a suitable replacement ? > > > > willing to pay +AH4AJA-25 each > > thanks for your time > > Duane Reed > > > > *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ** > > EEC@eelink.net -- For more info go to: > > > > http://eelink.umich.edu/~p-nowak/eec-efi/EEC-Mailadddrop.html > > > *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ** > EEC@eelink.net -- For more info go to: > > http://eelink.umich.edu/~p-nowak/eec-efi/EEC-Mailadddrop.html > _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 18:37:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA20436 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 18:37:35 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from send1e.yahoomail.com (send1e.yahoomail.com [205.180.60.64]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA20428 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 18:37:32 -0400 Message-ID: <19980411223818.17634.rocketmail@send1e.yahoomail.com> Received: from [153.37.171.143] by send1e; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 15:38:18 PDT Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 15:38:18 -0700 (PDT) From: RS Subject: Re: EEC: want used injectors To: eec@eelink.net, eec@eelink.net Cc: homebrew-autos@xephic.dynip.com, eec@eelink.net, diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu, diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have some 35 pph injectors from an SVO. leme know Randy > On Fri, 10 Apr 1998, Duane Reed wrote: > > > looking for 6 used injectors the ones I can use now are from a Ford > > Thunderbird Super Coupe bosch > > injector +ACM-0-280-150-756 around 14-16 k ohms and flow about 32lbs hr. at > > 45psi or if you can recommend a suitable replacement ? > > > > willing to pay +AH4AJA-25 each > > thanks for your time > > Duane Reed > > > > *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ** > > EEC@eelink.net -- For more info go to: > > > > http://eelink.umich.edu/~p-nowak/eec-efi/EEC-Mailadddrop.html > > > *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** *** ** > EEC@eelink.net -- For more info go to: > > http://eelink.umich.edu/~p-nowak/eec-efi/EEC-Mailadddrop.html > _________________________________________________________ DO YOU YAHOO!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 19:09:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA21084 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 19:09:05 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA21079 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 19:09:02 -0400 Received: from [12.65.70.164] ([12.65.18.236]) by mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA24628 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 23:08:40 +0000 Message-ID: <352F8956.19B9@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 16:17:13 +0100 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DIY_EFI Subject: LT1 progress! Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello, I satisifed DTC 11 (MIL) with a bulb. This left only two other codes, skip shift, and speedo. The FSM states that the speedo error code will not illuminate the MIL. The skip shift apparently does not either. Bottom line...I no longer have premature fan operation! The car also seems to be idling a little lower (Ill know more after a day of driving). I do have another question...The MIL draws .16 amps at 13.5V. The bulb I am using draws .21 amps at 12.5V. I installed a 30 ohm resistor to bring the amperage in line. This dimmed the bulb a bit. Does anyone know if the .21 amps would do any damage to the PCM? Thanx for all the help guys. -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 19:12:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA21147 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 19:12:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA21142 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 19:12:30 -0400 Received: from [12.65.70.164] ([12.65.1.36]) by mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA26428 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 23:12:30 +0000 Message-ID: <352F8A3B.6A39@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 16:21:03 +0100 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT1 EFI References: <352E3192.3681@netquest.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bailey, Robert B. wrote: > > Hello > > What year LT1 PCM are you using? > > Disabling EGR will probably cause part throttle detonation due to the > additional spark advance programmed during EGR operation. If you > are using a '94 - '95 PCM then reprogramming to prevent EGR might > be the best solution. > > In my experience most codes will cause the PCM to turn on both fans and > shut off 'learning'. > > Bob Bailey I'm using a '95 PCM, scanner shows no knock at cruise, and scanner also reports learn enabled -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 11 19:13:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA21192 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 19:13:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA21187 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 19:13:27 -0400 Received: from [12.65.70.164] ([12.65.1.36]) by mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA26794 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 23:13:21 +0000 Message-ID: <352F8A70.292@worldnet.att.net> Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 16:21:56 +0100 From: Ron Tyler Organization: T. Engineering X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: LT1 EFI Question References: <01bd6449$49a9d8e0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Sounds good. Air pump failure as indicated by Peter? Yep -- Ron & Stephanie Tyler '72 LT1/T56 240Z http://www.whit.org/jcaudle/LT1-3.jpg From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 00:13:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA23611 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 00:13:20 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from barney.iocc.com (barney.iocc.com [204.214.235.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA23607 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 00:13:19 -0400 Received: from iocc.com (ar-132.iocc.com [204.214.235.132]) by barney.iocc.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA31323 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 23:13:16 -0500 Message-ID: <35303F0C.AD8D5E21@iocc.com> Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 23:11:57 -0500 From: Brian Dotson X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Haltech F9 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi, I am looking for a haltech f9 or f9a for a project I am working on. If you have one or know of a place I can get one used please e-mail me direct. Thanks Brian~;} From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 01:10:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA24288 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 01:10:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp1.mailsrvcs.net (smtp1.gte.net [207.115.153.30]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA24284 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 01:10:14 -0400 Received: from paulb3 (1Cust51.tnt1.hilo.hi.gt.uu.net [208.255.248.51]) by smtp1.mailsrvcs.net with SMTP id AAA17572 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 00:10:08 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <35304BAB.5D8E@gte.net> Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 19:05:47 -1000 From: "Paul E. Bueltmann III" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup References: <01bd6546$643edf40$18198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > > ----Original Message----- > From: Raymond C Drouillard > To: fsj@digest.net ; fsj-list@unix.off-road.com > ; diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > Date: Saturday, April 11, 1998 1:16 AM > Subject: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup > > >I have a Motorcraft Duraspark ignition in my '89 Grand Wagoneer. I am > >trying to use a seven-pin GM ignition module so that I can control the > >spark timing with the Holley Pro-Jection 4Di box. I want to trigger the > >GM module with the pickup coil output of the Motorcraft distributer. > > > >The seven-pin module is the one that is used in the GM HEI (High Energy > >Ignition) systems - both coil-in-cap and the external coil module. > > > >This is rather obscure info, but maybe someone can help me. > > > >1) What is the voltage output of the ignition pickup coil that is used > >for the Motorcraft Duraspark? > > > >2) What voltage is required to trigger the GM module? > > > >Do you know of anyone who has used a Motorcraft distributer to trigger a > >GM module? > > > >Ray Drouillard I measured the voltage at the pins on a napa echlin tp49 7 pin and measured 3 volts at low rpm and 5 volts at the high rpm don't know if I was measuring from the right pins. The pins I used were the b pin and + pin on the 3 wire side. later paulb3@gte.net From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 02:47:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA25264 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 02:47:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mozart.bcit.bc.ca (aix4.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.189.164]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA25260 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 02:47:10 -0400 Received: from omnibook (usr058.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.188.158]) by mozart.bcit.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA11934 for ; Sat, 11 Apr 1998 23:45:38 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980411234256.00819db0@pophost.bcit.bc.ca> X-Sender: ffnsp955@pophost.bcit.bc.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 11 Apr 1998 23:42:56 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: peter paul fenske Subject: Re: wpappy holiday In-Reply-To: <01bd5ab0$586e27c0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Terry How are ya. Es stupor chargor raunning.. put aircleaner together.. found lots of rubbers joint elbows ect at home hardware.. well truck does run ok.. well off to bed :peter From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 04:11:50 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA25728 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 04:11:50 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA25724 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 04:11:47 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-041.mcn.net [208.26.146.41]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA22660 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 02:11:44 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3530745C.35BD8082@mcn.net> Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 01:59:25 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: DIY_EFI Archives? References: <933713F1FB7BD111AC2300A0C98F1AD192FF75@milxpr06.kla-tencor.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Buchholz, Steven wrote: > For some reason the list server likes to kick me off the digest every > once in a while. I haven't received digests for the past few days ... > is there an archive somewhere that I can access to read them? > > TIA! > Steve Buchholz > San Jose, CA (USA) You betcha! http://efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu/diy_efi/archive/archive_current Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 09:09:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA27147 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 09:09:21 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com (dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com [206.214.98.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA27143 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 09:09:18 -0400 From: xxalexx@ix.netcom.com Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id IAA07817 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 08:09:13 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <199804121309.IAA07817@dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com> Received: from ron-ny7-35.ix.netcom.com(206.217.124.163) by dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma007812; Sun Apr 12 08:08:55 1998 Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 19:43:57 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: DIY_EFI Archives? Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3530745C.35BD8082@mcn.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 01:59:25 -0600 > From: Shannen Durphey > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Re: DIY_EFI Archives? > Reply-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > > Buchholz, Steven wrote: > > > For some reason the list server likes to kick me off the digest every > > once in a while. I haven't received digests for the past few days ... > > is there an archive somewhere that I can access to read them? > > Same thing happened to me, Is there something offensive it does not like? > > TIA! > > Steve Buchholz > > San Jose, CA (USA) > > You betcha! > > http://efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu/diy_efi/archive/archive_current > Shannen > > > From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 10:09:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA27556 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 10:09:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from battleship.genevaonline.com (battleship.genevaonline.com [156.46.205.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA27552 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 10:09:21 -0400 Received: from mpc.genevaonline.com (pm3-ppp12.genevaonline.com [156.46.117.12]) by battleship.genevaonline.com (8.8.7/8.7.3) with SMTP id JAA04388 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 09:09:20 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3530CAA3.29A0@genevaonline.com> Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 09:07:31 -0500 From: Squash X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Projection References: <199804092317.QAA12549@mailrelay.syspac.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu 4D and Di systems all have heated O2 sensors. -- Andy Quaas bamcknig@postoffice.syspac.com wrote: > > Mike > > Not sure exactly what the path of the exhaust gas would be. > So it would seem that the main consideration would be getting enough > exhaust gas over the sensor to reach its operating temp (700 deg +F). > The temp could be obtained with a three wire sensor, but you would > still need enough flow to be representative of engine performance. > > Bob McKnight > Phx AZ From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 11:31:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA28267 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 11:31:20 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA28263 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 11:31:18 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm302-087.mcn.net [208.26.146.87]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id JAA23051 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 09:31:16 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3530DB60.5D1F7CEE@mcn.net> Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 09:18:56 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: DIY_EFI Archives? References: <199804121309.IAA07817@dfw-ix5.ix.netcom.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu xxalexx@ix.netcom.com wrote: > > > Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 01:59:25 -0600 > > From: Shannen Durphey > > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > Subject: Re: DIY_EFI Archives? > > Reply-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > > > > > > Buchholz, Steven wrote: > > > > > For some reason the list server likes to kick me off the digest every > > > once in a while. I haven't received digests for the past few days ... > > > is there an archive somewhere that I can access to read them? > > > > Same thing happened to me, Is there something offensive it does not > like? > > > TIA! > > > Steve Buchholz > > > San Jose, CA (USA) > > > > You betcha! > > > > http://efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu/diy_efi/archive/archive_current > > Shannen > > > > > > Maybe DIY_EFI isn't always emissions legal... From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 19:24:27 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA30931 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 19:24:27 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from wolfenet.com (root@frapp.wolfe.net [207.178.61.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA30927 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 19:24:25 -0400 Received: from gonzo.wolfenet.com (orin@gonzo.wolfenet.com [204.157.98.2]) by wolfenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA16444 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 16:24:25 -0700 (PDT) From: Orin Eman Received: (from orin@localhost) by gonzo.wolfenet.com (8.8.3/8.7) id QAA02239 for diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 16:24:24 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804122324.QAA02239@gonzo.wolfenet.com> Subject: What is the necessary resolution of Injector times? (fwd) To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (DIY EFI List) Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 16:24:23 -0700 (PDT) X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Please note the original Reply-To: Forwarded message: > Reply-To: > I know more is better, but the linear interpolation routines are > killing me, so its time for a realistic approach. > Solution #1: > What is the max % I can be off ideal before the engine notices? > Do I need to get withing 5%, or is 10% ok? I would eliminate the > linear interpolation & just use the closest index. > Solution #2: > Can anyone provide me with a *quick* 2 point linear interpolation > (1d map)... and a quick 4 point interpolation (2d map)? > My current code looks like: > return (x-curve[i-1].x)*(curve[i].y - curve[i-1].y)/ > (curve[i].x - curve[i-1].x) + curve[i-1].y; > This is for a 68hc11 uC, so the less math the better. :-/ > -Thor Johnson > thormj@iname.com From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 20:05:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA31305 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 20:05:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net (eagle.ptialaska.net [198.70.245.243]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA31301 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 20:05:30 -0400 Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net by eagle.ptialaska.net (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA11331; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 16:02:55 -0800 Message-ID: <353156E7.75A3255D@eagle.ptialaska.net> Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 16:05:59 -0800 From: Ron & Cathy Webb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: What is the necessary resolution of Injector times? (fwd) References: <199804122324.QAA02239@gonzo.wolfenet.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thor - I am surprised to see an attempt at interpolation. I was under the impression that the resolution of the map (256*) was more than adequate. I have one map that is 16* (an aftermarket add on ECU for a 2 stroke snowmobile engine - open loop), and as best I can tell by looking at the pulse widths, it is not interpolated. My approach would be to go with a 16* map, and fine tune to the O2 sensor. Remember that even with a 16* map, the max error comes out to (1/32) or about 3%. If that isn't good enough for you, I hope you never try to tune a carburated engine (the carb on the aformentioned snowmobile has 5 jets for different points on the curve, all adjested differently) you would wind up in the funny farm if you insisted on better than 3% for all. From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 21:53:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA32018 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 21:53:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from guardian.egr.up.edu (guardian.egr.up.edu [192.102.10.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA32014 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 21:53:14 -0400 Received: from upsun28.egr.up.edu by guardian.egr.up.edu with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0yOYUE-000pQwC; Sun, 12 Apr 98 18:56 PDT Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 18:52:03 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Vandrachek To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Source for MC33293 Injector Drivers? In-Reply-To: <353156E7.75A3255D@eagle.ptialaska.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does anybody in EFI land have a good source for Motorola's Quad Fuel Injector driver - MC33293? Newark doesn't carry them anymore...and I need at least one real quick for a design contest. Any leads would be greatly appreciated. Thank you, Chris Vondrachek chrisv@egr.up.edu ********************************************** 68-73 Datsun 510 addict and EFI nut. From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 22:11:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA32232 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 22:11:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA32228 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 22:11:15 -0400 Received: from bullwinkle (du488-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.6.234]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id TAA05205 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 19:11:13 -0700 Message-Id: <199804130211.TAA05205@mail.wgn.net> X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 19:14:12 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Subject: Re: Haltech wiring? In-Reply-To: <352EAC8A.4022@oasys.dt.navy.mil> References: <199804101722.NAA30793@lynx02.dac.neu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu At 07:34 PM 4/10/98 -0400, you wrote: >Can someone with an F3 check their manual for me? > >What are the connections for the following wires. > >pink High current for fuel pump or relay >grey Connects to 12V when Ignition is On >brown Connects to Tach output on MSD or Points on regular points on the negative side of the coil > >Thanks > >Rob >gallant@oasys.dt.navy.mil > From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 22:36:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA32647 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 22:36:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp2.mailsrvcs.net (smtp2.gte.net [207.115.153.31]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA32643 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 22:36:06 -0400 Received: from paulb3 (1Cust252.tnt1.hilo.hi.gt.uu.net [208.255.248.252]) by smtp2.mailsrvcs.net with SMTP id VAA04592 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 21:35:59 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <35317907.7E03@gte.net> Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 16:31:35 -1000 From: "Paul E. Bueltmann III" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Emulators, EPROM Programers Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have poked around on the various search engines and have been wondering what would be the best/cost effective choice out there. I have seen a range of prices for both the emulators with their accompaning software and the programers also. Just courious as to what you guys are using considering to get deeper into this efi programing stuff. later paulb3@gte.net p.s. what are the diffrent proms being used by G.M. From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 12 23:50:12 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA00667 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 23:50:12 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from slovakia.it.earthlink.net (slovakia-c.it.earthlink.net [204.119.177.80]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA00662 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 23:50:08 -0400 Received: from odin (1Cust79.tnt22.atl2.da.uu.net [153.36.127.79]) by slovakia.it.earthlink.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA13041 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 20:51:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804130351.UAA13041@slovakia.it.earthlink.net> From: "Thor Johnson" To: "Diy-Efi" Subject: How consistent are stock EGO sensors? Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 23:49:56 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I know that they are not terribly accurate for getting exact A/F measurements, but I bought 4 sensors the same day, and installed them on the four output ports (about 3" down from the engine. A typical line of readings are: 0x90 0x92 0x80 0x92 (forgive the hex.... these are arbitrary, 0x70 is "stoich") Does this mean that Cyl #3 is getting more air than the others (& therefore needs more fuel, or needs to have its intake reworked), or is this pretty much expected from ordinary $20 "universal oxygen sensors"? TIA, Thor Johnson thormj@iname.com From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 00:00:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA00868 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 00:00:43 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from slovakia.it.earthlink.net (slovakia-c.it.earthlink.net [204.119.177.80]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA00864 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 00:00:41 -0400 Received: from odin (1Cust79.tnt22.atl2.da.uu.net [153.36.127.79]) by slovakia.it.earthlink.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA17310 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 21:01:53 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804130401.VAA17310@slovakia.it.earthlink.net> From: "Thor Johnson" To: "Diy-Efi" Subject: Programming 101... Eproms vs Flash? Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 00:00:41 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just curious... anyone out there using Flash instead of EProms? The parts are pretty cheap (esp for small qtys... I got 4 samples from AMD for the asking). The big thing is that they don't need to sit under UV to be erased.... but you might have a hard time find programmers that like them. I was thinking about making a parallel port flash programmer at one time... if there's and interest (or if you know of anyone who's already done this), lemme know. -Thor Johnson thormj@iname.com From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 00:15:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA01126 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 00:15:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from guardian.egr.up.edu (guardian.egr.up.edu [192.102.10.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA01121 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 00:15:44 -0400 Received: from upsun28.egr.up.edu by guardian.egr.up.edu with smtp (Smail3.1.28.1 #1) id m0yOai9-000pRBC; Sun, 12 Apr 98 21:19 PDT Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 21:14:33 -0700 (PDT) From: Chris Vandrachek To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Pin-out of GM MAP sensor needed In-Reply-To: <199804130211.TAA05205@mail.wgn.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Would anybody be kind enough to tell me what the A, B, and C pins of a GM 3 pin MAP sensor are? I only have one so I can't tear it apart to find out for myself. Thanks, Chris Vondrachek chrisv@egr.up.edu From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 00:16:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA01145 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 00:16:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA01140 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 00:16:11 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm302-101.mcn.net [208.26.146.101]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id WAA18143 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 22:16:10 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <35318EA4.C1886E4A@mcn.net> Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 22:03:48 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: How consistent are stock EGO sensors? References: <199804130351.UAA13041@slovakia.it.earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thor Johnson wrote: > > I know that they are not terribly accurate for getting exact A/F > measurements, but I bought 4 sensors the same day, and installed > them on the four output ports (about 3" down from the engine. A > typical line of readings are: > > 0x90 0x92 0x80 0x92 (forgive the hex.... these are > arbitrary, 0x70 is "stoich") > > Does this mean that Cyl #3 is getting more air than the others (& > therefore needs more fuel, or needs to have its intake reworked), > or is this pretty much expected from ordinary $20 "universal > oxygen sensors"? > > TIA, > Thor Johnson > thormj@iname.com Never checked consistancy, but if I were, I'd rotate the sensors and compare readings. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 01:08:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA01833 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 01:08:25 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from wavecom.net (root@wave.sheridan.wy.us [206.54.116.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA01829 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 01:08:22 -0400 From: jac@wavecom.net Received: from default (sher47.wavecom.net [206.54.116.132]) by wavecom.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA14572 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 23:05:19 -0600 Message-Id: <199804130505.XAA14572@wavecom.net> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 23:07:46 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Pin-out of GM MAP sensor needed Priority: normal References: <199804130211.TAA05205@mail.wgn.net> In-reply-to: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu A is 5V Return B is signal C is 5V Reference > Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 21:14:33 -0700 (PDT) > From: Chris Vandrachek > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Pin-out of GM MAP sensor needed > Reply-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > Would anybody be kind enough to tell me what the A, B, and C pins of a GM > 3 pin MAP sensor are? I only have one so I can't tear it apart to find > out for myself. > > Thanks, > Chris Vondrachek > chrisv@egr.up.edu > > > John Carroll jac@wavecom.net From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 01:28:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA02074 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 01:28:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from wolfenet.com (root@frapp.wolfe.net [207.178.61.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA02070 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 01:28:49 -0400 Received: from gonzo.wolfenet.com (orin@gonzo.wolfenet.com [204.157.98.2]) by wolfenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id WAA20018 for ; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 22:28:50 -0700 (PDT) From: Orin Eman Received: (from orin@localhost) by gonzo.wolfenet.com (8.8.3/8.7) id WAA25957 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Sun, 12 Apr 1998 22:28:49 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804130528.WAA25957@gonzo.wolfenet.com> Subject: Re: How consistent are stock EGO sensors? To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 12 Apr 1998 22:28:49 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <199804130351.UAA13041@slovakia.it.earthlink.net> from "Thor Johnson" at Apr 12, 98 11:49:56 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > I know that they are not terribly accurate for getting exact A/F > measurements, but I bought 4 sensors the same day, and installed > them on the four output ports (about 3" down from the engine. A > typical line of readings are: > 0x90 0x92 0x80 0x92 (forgive the hex.... these are > arbitrary, 0x70 is "stoich") > Does this mean that Cyl #3 is getting more air than the others (& > therefore needs more fuel, or needs to have its intake reworked), > or is this pretty much expected from ordinary $20 "universal > oxygen sensors"? Try swapping the sensors and see if you get different results... Orin. From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 11:38:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA05157 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 11:38:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA05153 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 11:38:48 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-17.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.35]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id LAA10710 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 11:37:53 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Programming 101 Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 11:38:29 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd66f2$34ee6780$23198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu If you have not been following this series please refer to the archives, and use the search for programming 101. Again this is for educational purposes, and is my opinion, and experiences. Your results will vary. Prom reprogramming is serious business, and not to be taken lightly. Again if you find errors in my writtings please e-mail me at: nacelp@bright.net . If you have any tables, or known switch locations I would appreciate you sharing them with me or the list. Not as a matter of power/control I'd like to hear about them, and you'll get the credit for the contribution (if you want it). But, I'm trying to organize this into a logical progression, and format. I think now would be a good time to cover some protection for tuning. There are two areas for the knock sensor retard limits, one being for WOT it would be 017F-0187, and for non WOT 0188-018C. The first of the two areas is by rpm, and the other appears to be MAP related. In either case, I'd just set the entries to 44, and be done with it. On some scan tools they use knock counts for the display of knock sensed, and others use degrees. IMHE, the knock counts equate to twice the actual degrees. ie, with a OTC scanner if I find 6 knock counts, then I know my timing is 3 degrees off. If you do the hex to dec, and multiply by 90, and divide by 255, you get 24. Which seems to work out to 12 degrees of retard, which should all but cover the worst of circumstance (ie bad tank of fuel). No worries mate Bruce Rumor control is saying that in the final episode of Seinfeld they all wear, yep, Cone Shaped Hats From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 12:46:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA06165 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 12:46:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mailout03.btx.dtag.de (mailout03.btx.dtag.de [194.25.2.151]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA06161 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 12:45:59 -0400 Received: from fwd11.btx.dtag.de (fwd11.btx.dtag.de [194.25.2.171]) by mailout03.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 0yOmFL-00077Z-00; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 18:38:15 +0200 Received: (091059380-0001(btxid)@[193.159.44.215]) by fwd11.btx.dtag.de id ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 18:37:58 +0200 Message-Id: Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 18:37:58 +0200 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu References: <933713F1FB7BD111AC2300A0C98F1AD192FEC4@milxpr06.kla-tencor.com> Subject: Re: Intel B57684 EPROM X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Sender: 091059380-0001@t-online.de From: wenning.motorsport@t-online.de (Alexander Wenning) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Buchholz, Steven schrieb: The EPROM > device has an Intel logo on it and a device type of B57684. I'm without > my nerd novels here at home and was wondering if any of you happen to > have a databook that describes this device. It is a 28 pin, 0.6" > spacing package. I suspect it is similar to a 27128 or 27256, but I'd > rather know than guess when I try to read it in. They usually use 27C256 and 27C512. Try 27C512 and look at $8000. If there´s the same data as at $0000 then it´s a 27C256. If you tell me the ECU-no. (0261 ...) and the chip-no. (126735 ...) (each no. has 10 digits) I can tell you the chip type exactly. Regards Alex Wenning wenning.motorsport@t-online.de From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 12:58:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA06295 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 12:58:19 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mailout04.btx.dtag.de (mailout04.btx.dtag.de [194.25.2.152]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA06291 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 12:58:18 -0400 Received: from fwd13.btx.dtag.de (fwd13.btx.dtag.de [194.25.2.173]) by mailout04.btx.dtag.de with smtp id 0yOmXy-0004HS-00; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 18:57:30 +0200 Received: (091059380-0001(btxid)@[193.159.45.16]) by fwd13.btx.dtag.de id ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 18:57:27 +0200 Message-Id: Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 18:57:27 +0200 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: home dyno X-Mailer: T-Online eMail 2.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8BIT X-Sender: 091059380-0001@t-online.de From: wenning.motorsport@t-online.de (Alexander Wenning) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Unfortunately I´ve missed the discussion about that home dyno for $40. Does anybody know where I can get the tool and where I can get informations? Regards Alex. From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 13:56:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA07167 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 13:56:36 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from thalia.fm.intel.com (thalia.fm.intel.com [132.233.247.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA07163 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 13:56:32 -0400 Received: from fmsmsx26.fm.intel.com (fmsmsx26.fm.intel.com [132.233.42.26]) by thalia.fm.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id RAA23617 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 17:56:32 GMT Message-Id: <199804131756.RAA23617@thalia.fm.intel.com> Received: by FMSMSX26 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2V90X9KF>; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 10:56:37 -0700 From: "Fitzgearld, Fredric" To: "diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu " Subject: 2D Pro-Jection O2 sensor Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 10:39:00 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu All, I got my 2D Por-jection (502-20) system late last week. Inside I found a bunch of resistors, a PROM, something that that might be a processor (a small square chip), and what might be a driver chip. Holley painted over the tops of the 2 chips that were not the PROM. I'll look into getting the numbers, later. Now, for the question of the day: Do any of you have a wiring diagram for what plugs into the 6 pin plug? I have the heated sensor from the analog system. What goes between the sensor and the ECU? If the sensor goes directly into the ECU, what pins do they go to? Anyone have the information for the 4D closed loop system? Thanks, FEF From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 14:17:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA07432 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:17:43 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from r02n02.cac.psu.edu (r02a02.cac.psu.edu [146.186.15.12]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA07428 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:17:41 -0400 Received: from pft101.rh.psu.edu (PFT101.rh.psu.edu [128.118.125.178]) by r02n02.cac.psu.edu (8.8.7/8.6.12) with SMTP id OAA79100 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:17:41 -0400 Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:17:41 -0400 Message-Id: <199804131817.OAA79100@r02n02.cac.psu.edu> X-Sender: pft101@email.psu.edu X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Paul Tholey Subject: 1985 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hey Bruce, I was just out with my friend in his 1985 Pontiac TA. It has a cold start problem, and there is a slight hesitation when the trottle is applied. Kinda like a car without the accelarator pump working on the carb. The car has 150,000 on it, mods are a Hypertech chip, and a 3 inch Flowmaster cat back kit. I found codes 12(self diagnostics?) 34, 54, 12 again. Any input? I also will be calling about the burner, again. TIA Paul From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 14:49:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA07874 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:49:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [205.139.62.192]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA07869 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:49:04 -0400 Received: (qmail 929 invoked from network); 13 Apr 1998 12:49:03 -0600 Received: from ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.169) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 13 Apr 1998 12:49:03 -0600 Received: by ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD66DA.04A137A0@ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 12:45:20 -0700 Message-ID: <01BD66DA.04A137A0@ts6-43.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: 2D Pro-Jection O2 sensor Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 12:45:17 -0700 Encoding: 14 TEXT, 35 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Fredric, My 4D should arrive tomorrow or Wednesday. I can help you then if no one else does... Mike J. Fitzgearld, Fredric wrote: >>(snip) Anyone have the information for the 4D closed loop system? Thanks, FEF>> begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(A03`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M`' ``0```!T```!213H@,D0@4')O+4IE M8W1I;VX@3S(@6)EN.X`P`'$*<````>``@0 M`0```&4```!&4D5$4DE#+$U9-$132$]53$1!4E))5D543TU/4E)/5T]25T5$ M3D531$%924-!3DA%3%!93U542$5.249.3T].145,4T5$3T5334E+14I&251: M1T5!4DQ$+$92141224-74D]4``````(!"1 !````J@$``*8!``!3`P``3%I& M==9]>A+_``H!#P(5`J0#Y 7K`H,`4!,#5 (`8V@*P'-E=.XR!@`&PP*#,@/& M!Q,"@Q(S$P]F- ]Z:&5LT0,@1&QG`H!]"H (S\4)V3L7GS(U-0* "H&##;$+ M8&YG,3 S%""7"PH2\@P!8PW@($87H1D%$&,L"H4*A4UY(" T1"!S: A@;&2& M( K !1!V92!T`W"O!; #8 ?@!;%7"8!N!Y `9&%Y+B @22#&8P.1%B%P('D( M8!\0QQ8@`Z &D"!N;Q^@(!!&(!8P$? @9&\'D"[3(Q =#6EK'P!*(ST*]"!L M:3$X, +1:2UX,30T#? ,T"9S"UDQ;C8<,@J@`V!T!9 %0$9@:71Z9V4*P!Z M+*<<=AM?'& @=RAB.B\A8@(=!N`A!R`,!T=&D"(" U$32C'A%C+Q MD!]`4 `"#!@ EL1@\%&>]`1X`/0`!````!0```%)%.B ``````P`--/TW```NRV>] ` end From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 14:59:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA08113 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:59:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from blackie.cruzers.com (cruzers.com [205.215.232.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA08109 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:59:27 -0400 Received: from 205.215.232.29 (surf29.cruzers.com [205.215.232.29]) by blackie.cruzers.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id MAA10460; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 12:00:05 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <35326E90.112B@cruzers.com> Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 11:59:39 -0800 From: Ludis Langens X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Diy_efi CC: thormj@iname.com Subject: Interpolation Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu wrote: > Solution #2: > Can anyone provide me with a *quick* 2 point linear interpolation > (1d map)... and a quick 4 point interpolation (2d map)? > > My current code looks like: > return (x-curve[i-1].x)*(curve[i].y - curve[i-1].y)/ > (curve[i].x - curve[i-1].x) + curve[i-1].y; > > This is for a 68hc11 uC, so the less math the better. :-/ What is that code fragment trying to do? And why do you have both an x and a y in each array element? Here's what GM uses (on a 68xx) to interpolate in a one dimensional array. "scale" is usually 16 which means that a 17 byte table maps all input byte values. "scale" of 8 allows a 9 byte table. Other values are also possible. typedef unsigned char uchar; uchar Interpolate(uchar *table, uchar input, uchar scale) { unsigned int temp; uchar whole, fract; temp = input * scale; whole = temp >> 8; fract = temp & 0xff; table += whole; if (table[0] <= table[1]) return table[0] + (((table[1] - table[0]) * fract + 0x80) >> 8); else return table[0] - (((table[0] - table[1]) * fract + 0x80) >> 8); } For a two dimensional array, the above algorithm gets used three times: once in row n, once in row n + 1, and once more on the previous two results. To interpolate or not to interpolate: The main reason to interpolate is likely not the increased accuracy. Instead, interpolating gets rid of a step function in the output value. Control algorithms won't work good when a table lookup doesn't produce a smooth output. unsigned long BinToBCD(unsigned long i) {unsigned long t; Ludis Langens return i ? (t = BinToBCD(i >> 1), (t << 1) + (i & 1) + ludis@cruzers.com (t + 858993459 >> 2 & 572662306) * 3) : 0;} From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 15:44:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA08805 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 15:44:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA08801 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 15:44:11 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-21.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.39]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id PAA06660 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 15:43:09 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: 2D Pro-Jection O2 sensor Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 15:43:45 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6714$7890bc00$27198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Fitzgearld, Fredric To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Monday, April 13, 1998 2:38 PM Subject: 2D Pro-Jection O2 sensor >All, >I got my 2D Por-jection (502-20) system late last week. Inside I found a bunch of resistors, a PROM, something that that might be a processor (a small square chip), and what might be a driver chip. Holley painted over the tops of the 2 chips that were not the PROM. I'll look into getting the numbers, later. Now, for the question of the day: >Do any of you have a wiring diagram for what plugs into the 6 pin plug? >I have the heated sensor from the analog system. What goes between the sensor and the ECU? If the sensor goes directly into the ECU, what pins do they go to? > >Anyone have the information for the 4D closed loop system? > >Thanks, > >FEF > Did the system include a map sensor?... Inquirin mindless gotta no.. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 17:05:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA10091 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 17:05:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from thalia.fm.intel.com (thalia.fm.intel.com [132.233.247.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA10087 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 17:05:24 -0400 Received: from fmsmsx26.fm.intel.com (fmsmsx26.fm.intel.com [132.233.42.26]) by thalia.fm.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA18016; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:05:24 GMT Message-Id: <199804132105.VAA18016@thalia.fm.intel.com> Received: by FMSMSX26 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id <2V90YNW6>; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 14:05:29 -0700 From: "Fitzgearld, Fredric" To: "diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu " , Bruce Plecan Subject: RE: 2D Pro-Jection O2 sensor Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 13:49:00 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Nope. This system is definitely not Speed Density. It uses the TPS and tach signal for reference. The one thing I'm curious about is what the O2 sensor controls. Does it move the whole "map" like the "main" knob does? FEF ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: Re: 2D Pro-Jection O2 sensor Author: Bruce Plecan [SMTP:nacelp@bright.net] at MSXGATE Date: 4/13/98 12:43 PM -----Original Message----- From: Fitzgearld, Fredric To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Monday, April 13, 1998 2:38 PM Subject: 2D Pro-Jection O2 sensor >All, >I got my 2D Por-jection (502-20) system late last week. Inside I found a bunch of resistors, a PROM, something that that might be a processor (a small square chip), and what might be a driver chip. Holley painted over the tops of the 2 chips that were not the PROM. I'll look into getting the numbers, later. Now, for the question of the day: >Do any of you have a wiring diagram for what plugs into the 6 pin plug? >I have the heated sensor from the analog system. What goes between the sensor and the ECU? If the sensor goes directly into the ECU, what pins do they go to? > >Anyone have the information for the 4D closed loop system? > >Thanks, > >FEF > Did the system include a map sensor?... Inquirin mindless gotta no.. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 18:01:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA10636 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 18:01:19 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca (mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA10632 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 18:01:18 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA01475 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 15:01:18 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id PAA04914; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 15:00:45 -0700 Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 15:00:44 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: Diy-Efi Subject: Re: How consistent are stock EGO sensors? In-Reply-To: <199804130351.UAA13041@slovakia.it.earthlink.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Try swapping them into different exhaust ports and see if these numbers follow the cylinder or the O2 sensor. HTH jw On Sun, 12 Apr 1998, Thor Johnson wrote: > I know that they are not terribly accurate for getting exact A/F > measurements, but I bought 4 sensors the same day, and installed > them on the four output ports (about 3" down from the engine. A > typical line of readings are: > > 0x90 0x92 0x80 0x92 (forgive the hex.... these are > arbitrary, 0x70 is "stoich") > > Does this mean that Cyl #3 is getting more air than the others (& > therefore needs more fuel, or needs to have its intake reworked), > or is this pretty much expected from ordinary $20 "universal > oxygen sensors"? > > TIA, > Thor Johnson > thormj@iname.com > > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 19:29:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA11377 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 19:29:36 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from freenet.macatawa.org (smtp.americanlogistics.com [206.26.113.2] (may be forged)) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA11366 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 19:29:30 -0400 Received: from odie (pm4m12.egl.net [208.159.114.204]) by freenet.macatawa.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA05619; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 19:22:58 -0400 (EDT) From: "Kevin Timmerman" To: , "'Diy_efi'" Cc: Subject: RE: Interpolation Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 19:30:20 -0400 Message-ID: <000b01bd6734$345e5680$010101c0@odie> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <35326E90.112B@cruzers.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Importance: Normal Disposition-Notification-To: "Kevin Timmerman" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > wrote: > > Solution #2: > > Can anyone provide me with a *quick* 2 point linear interpolation > > (1d map)... and a quick 4 point interpolation (2d map)? > > > > My current code looks like: > > return (x-curve[i-1].x)*(curve[i].y - curve[i-1].y)/ > > (curve[i].x - curve[i-1].x) + curve[i-1].y; > > > > This is for a 68hc11 uC, so the less math the better. :-/ Here is some 68HC11 asm code from Bosch/VW Digifant ECU..... *-------------------------------------------------------------- * * Simple table lookup for 16 byte table * * Entry: B - Index ( 0 to $FF ) * X - Table address * * Exit: B - Lookup value * X - Points to lookup value * tbl_lu LSRB LSRB LSRB LSRB ABX LDAB ,X RTS *-------------------------------------------------------------- * Interpolated table lookup * * Entry: B - Table index * 0 - $F0 for 16 byte table * 0 - $FF for 17 byte table * X - Table address * * Exit: B - Interpolated table lookup * A - Zero * X - Address of uninterpolated value * tbl_itp PSHB ; Save index LSRB ; Divide by 16 LSRB LSRB LSRB ABX ; Adjust table pointer PULB ; Restore index JSR interp ; Interpolate CLRA RTS *------------------------------------------------------------------- * * 2D interpolation of 16 * 16 table * * Entry: A - Table Y (row) 0 to $F0 * B - Table X (column) 0 to $FF * X - Table address * * Exit: B - Interpolated result * X - Trashed * A - Trashed * interp2d ;4AC3 STAA tmp3 ; Save row STAB tmp4 ; Save column LSRB ; Divide column by 16 LSRB LSRB LSRB STAB tmp1 ; Save column/16 LDAB tmp3 ; Get row ANDB #$F0 ; Mask ADDB tmp1 ; Add column ; B = row/16*16 + column/16 ABX ; Adjust table address LDAA tmp3 ; Get row LDAB tmp4 ; Get column CMPA #$F0 ; Row at max ?? BCS row_ok ; 2D interpolate if not LDAA #$F0 ; Limit row to $F0 CMPB #$F0 ; Column max ?? BNE LBL4AE6 ; 1D Interpolate if not LDAB $00,X ; Get uninterpolated value BRA LBL4AE9 ; Return LBL4AE6 JSR interp ; Interpolate within row LBL4AE9 BRA LBL4B10 ; Return row_ok CMPB #$F0 ; Column max ??? BNE col_ok ; 1D interpolate if it is LDAA ,X ; Get low STAA tmp1 ; Save LDAA $10,X ; Get high STAA tmp2 ; Save BRA LBL4B08 ; Interpolate... col_ok JSR interp ; Interpolate row STAB tmp1 ; Save LDAB #$10 ; Next row ABX LDAB tmp4 ; Get column (for interp index) JSR interp ; Interpolate row STAB tmp2 ; Save LBL4B08 LDAB tmp3 ; Get row (for interp index) LDX #tmp1 ; Interpolate saved values JSR interp LBL4B10 RTS *-------------------------------------------------------------- * * Interpolation for 16 byte tables * * B = ( ( low * (16-index) ) + ( high * index ) ) / 16 * * Entry: B - interpolation index, only lowest four bits used * [X] - low value * [X+1] - high value * * Exit: B - interpolated value * A - zero (trashed) * interp ANDB #$0F ; Use only lowest four bits PSHB ; Save for later LDAA 1,X ; Get high MUL ; high * index PSHB ; Save PSHA LDAA ,X ; Get low PSHX ; Save X TSX ; S -> X LDAB 4,X ; Get saved index off stack SUBB #$10 ; index = 16 - index NEGB MUL ; low * (16 - index) ADDD 2,X ; Add low*(16-index) to (high*index) from stack ADDD #$0008 ; Rounding LSRD ; Divide by 16 LSRD LSRD LSRD PULX ; Restore X INS ; Cleanup stack INS INS RTS From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 19:29:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA11376 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 19:29:35 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from freenet.macatawa.org (smtp.americanlogistics.com [206.26.113.2] (may be forged)) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA11371 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 19:29:33 -0400 Received: from odie (pm4m12.egl.net [208.159.114.204]) by freenet.macatawa.org (8.7.5/8.7.3) with SMTP id TAA05619; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 19:22:58 -0400 (EDT) From: "Kevin Timmerman" To: , "'Diy_efi'" Cc: Subject: RE: Interpolation Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 19:30:20 -0400 Message-ID: <000b01bd6734$345e5680$010101c0@odie> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <35326E90.112B@cruzers.com> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Importance: Normal Disposition-Notification-To: "Kevin Timmerman" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > wrote: > > Solution #2: > > Can anyone provide me with a *quick* 2 point linear interpolation > > (1d map)... and a quick 4 point interpolation (2d map)? > > > > My current code looks like: > > return (x-curve[i-1].x)*(curve[i].y - curve[i-1].y)/ > > (curve[i].x - curve[i-1].x) + curve[i-1].y; > > > > This is for a 68hc11 uC, so the less math the better. :-/ Here is some 68HC11 asm code from Bosch/VW Digifant ECU..... *-------------------------------------------------------------- * * Simple table lookup for 16 byte table * * Entry: B - Index ( 0 to $FF ) * X - Table address * * Exit: B - Lookup value * X - Points to lookup value * tbl_lu LSRB LSRB LSRB LSRB ABX LDAB ,X RTS *-------------------------------------------------------------- * Interpolated table lookup * * Entry: B - Table index * 0 - $F0 for 16 byte table * 0 - $FF for 17 byte table * X - Table address * * Exit: B - Interpolated table lookup * A - Zero * X - Address of uninterpolated value * tbl_itp PSHB ; Save index LSRB ; Divide by 16 LSRB LSRB LSRB ABX ; Adjust table pointer PULB ; Restore index JSR interp ; Interpolate CLRA RTS *------------------------------------------------------------------- * * 2D interpolation of 16 * 16 table * * Entry: A - Table Y (row) 0 to $F0 * B - Table X (column) 0 to $FF * X - Table address * * Exit: B - Interpolated result * X - Trashed * A - Trashed * interp2d ;4AC3 STAA tmp3 ; Save row STAB tmp4 ; Save column LSRB ; Divide column by 16 LSRB LSRB LSRB STAB tmp1 ; Save column/16 LDAB tmp3 ; Get row ANDB #$F0 ; Mask ADDB tmp1 ; Add column ; B = row/16*16 + column/16 ABX ; Adjust table address LDAA tmp3 ; Get row LDAB tmp4 ; Get column CMPA #$F0 ; Row at max ?? BCS row_ok ; 2D interpolate if not LDAA #$F0 ; Limit row to $F0 CMPB #$F0 ; Column max ?? BNE LBL4AE6 ; 1D Interpolate if not LDAB $00,X ; Get uninterpolated value BRA LBL4AE9 ; Return LBL4AE6 JSR interp ; Interpolate within row LBL4AE9 BRA LBL4B10 ; Return row_ok CMPB #$F0 ; Column max ??? BNE col_ok ; 1D interpolate if it is LDAA ,X ; Get low STAA tmp1 ; Save LDAA $10,X ; Get high STAA tmp2 ; Save BRA LBL4B08 ; Interpolate... col_ok JSR interp ; Interpolate row STAB tmp1 ; Save LDAB #$10 ; Next row ABX LDAB tmp4 ; Get column (for interp index) JSR interp ; Interpolate row STAB tmp2 ; Save LBL4B08 LDAB tmp3 ; Get row (for interp index) LDX #tmp1 ; Interpolate saved values JSR interp LBL4B10 RTS *-------------------------------------------------------------- * * Interpolation for 16 byte tables * * B = ( ( low * (16-index) ) + ( high * index ) ) / 16 * * Entry: B - interpolation index, only lowest four bits used * [X] - low value * [X+1] - high value * * Exit: B - interpolated value * A - zero (trashed) * interp ANDB #$0F ; Use only lowest four bits PSHB ; Save for later LDAA 1,X ; Get high MUL ; high * index PSHB ; Save PSHA LDAA ,X ; Get low PSHX ; Save X TSX ; S -> X LDAB 4,X ; Get saved index off stack SUBB #$10 ; index = 16 - index NEGB MUL ; low * (16 - index) ADDD 2,X ; Add low*(16-index) to (high*index) from stack ADDD #$0008 ; Rounding LSRD ; Divide by 16 LSRD LSRD LSRD PULX ; Restore X INS ; Cleanup stack INS INS RTS From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 21:12:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA12547 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:12:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from algw2.lucent.com (algw2.lucent.com [205.147.213.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA12539 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:12:19 -0400 Received: from emsr1.emsr.lucent.com by alig2.firewall.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-L sol2) id VAA02494; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:20:28 -0400 Received: by emsr1.emsr.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-1.2 Solaris/emsr) id VAA24758 for diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu.smtp; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:12:11 -0400 From: kenkelly@lucent.com Received: by emsr1.emsr.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-1.2 Solaris/emsr) id VAA24749 for esl.eng.ohio-state.edu!diy_efi; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:12:10 -0400 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Received: from lucent.com (kkelly-rdid.wh.lucent.com) by pace10.wh.lucent.com (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA21922; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:10:58 -0400 Message-Id: <3532B7E3.4AEE915B@lucent.com> Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:12:03 -0400 Original-From: Ken Kelly Organization: Lucent Technologies X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en]C-EMS-1.3.1 (Win95; U) Mime-Version: 1.0 Original-To: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu!diy_efi Subject: LT1 Engine Swap II Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just joined the list today. I am putting a 96 LT1 & 4L60E in My 48 Ford daily driver. I really mean driver, I have used it to commute for the last three years and am doing a refresh. In my first visit I played with your search engine a little. Enjoyed and learned from the 240Z transplant thread. I had already figured out the 30 Hz squarewave for VAT. Several people had advised me to get a 95 computer because they couldn't delete the aftercat O2 sensors from the 96. I am running near stock. I am leaving out the Cats, and deleting the air Pump since it has no value without the Cats. I did get the 95 ECU with factory programming. I am using the stock Engine Harness. I found after the fact that I should have picked up the Forward Lamp Harness with the Engine harness. I am still collecting parts, I won't start the swap till after Carlisle. I bought the factory manuals and have made a table of the 5 connectors and 44 pins that connect the stock Engine Harness to the car. The table give the location, color, and function of each wire. The reason for joining the group: EFI is new to me. I have played with cars and PC's for over 30 years, and I decided it's time to link the 2. I want to do some simple ECU hacks, like change the Gear ratio, and tire diameter. I could buy a Hypertech PP+, but what fun is that? I am looking for info on interfaceing a PC to the diagnostic connector. Then I would like to use it for a Scantool, and EEprom hacking. I saw the thread that talked about a homebuilt scantool for some Chrysler products. Does anyone have any info on interfacing to the 95 LT1 ECU? Does anyone have a protocol document for the ECU serial port? A basic Peek and Poke command with some information on the location of various tables would get me started. Ken From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 23:01:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA13755 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 23:01:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA13751 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 23:01:03 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA4937 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 20:01:02 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 20:01:40 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <3586c7c8.73411203@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <35760b2a.58721515@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> In-Reply-To: <35760b2a.58721515@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id XAA13752 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 08 Apr 1998 17:00:31 -0700, garfield@pilgrimhouse.com wrote: >it's a comin, >honest engine. Give me another week before you tar and feather me for >dragging my virus-infested butt. Whimper. Man how can such tiny lil >critters make you feel like sucha pieceOyou-know-what. Man, that was almost a week ago, and I'm way worse than I was then. What a sissy! I'm tellin yous man, these virii vermin are kickin me buttocks!! My doctor wants to hospitalize me if I develop even a hint of a secondary lung infection; I'm right on the doorstep of viral pnuemonia! Whimper is right! Crapola, what a BORE. BUT, do I have good news for YOUS GUYS!!! I got in some quality time today testing our diy_EGOmeter, and I just got finished sending off a missive to Frank with the nitty gritty details, but suffice it to say, it looks like we have a *weiner*. The free-air O2 ion pumping current my circuit settles at (the so-called free-air calibration point) is only 5% off from what Frank gets with his NTK sensor and interface box!!!! This is stunning confirmation that we are go-for-launch, and that the Honda OEM sensors are indeed essentially the same as the NTK sensors. I measured 6.3 mA @0.445V, and he (Frank) gets 6.0 mA @ 0.428V. Before you think them stoich voltages are somewhat different, lemme tell ya that we discovered there's a real black-hole steep Ip null right at stoich, just like that cliff-edge part of the conventional Lambda curve. The voltage of the measurement cell, VsCell, goes along niceNlinearly heading for stoich, as you crank up the O2 cell current, IpCell, but just as you get to 0.450V, all hell breaks loose, and even a tiny lil tweak of IpCell, and you're on the other side of stoich by 200-400mV. So what I'm saying is that Frank's instrument's feedback loop locks stoich up at 0.428V, and mine at 0.445V (hey, mine's more precise than NTK's, hee hee; alright, it's also a tad twitchy at the moment), but for all intents and purposes, it's smack on the same point in the curve of IpCell vrs. VsCell. Hence, the free-air calibration currents diff. by only 5%. You couldn't ask for a better reassurance that the Honda OEM sensor and the NTK "special salsa" version are essentially the same, except for their method/values of embedding CAL resistances. The most important thing is that since the sensors perform basically identical, we can just plan on calibrating the boxes each of us build with this "free-air self-calibration" procedure, and care not a wit about what the internal CAL Rs are set at, for their various original usage. "We don't need no stinking CAL Rs", is the bottom line. Besides, as I mentioned to Frank, use of the CAL Rs also can't compensate for sensor aging nor deterioration due to lead/dirt contamination, like a self-calibration in free-air can, so it's better we don't mess with them Rs anyway, eh? Actually, I have a theory about what the CAL Rs in the Honda sensors actually are, and will test me hypothesis when I get a couple more, but the main thing is we aren't dependent on even knowing what they mean, since the sensors can be self-calibrated in free-air. In fact, this is THE method of choice for the Horiba boxes, since they don't ship their sensors with ANY embedded CAL R in the cable. They ASSUME you're going to self-calibrate it yourself. I mentioned to Frank that I have a couple tweaks still needed to the circuit, one to detune the hyperactive feedback; I didn't count on the Ip vrs Vs relationship being so sensitive near stoich (hence it twitches on it's way to settling, instead of gracefully landing via a smooth approach, when you first turn it on), and I need to replace one of the parts in the "warm-up" circuit with one I've got on order; the current part doesn't like anything but 12V supply (some times it switches, sometimes it lounges), and I want the whole thing to function on 5V. But the bottom line is, at this point, looks like we get our O2 meters finally! As soon as I get the last tweaks done and everything checked out completely, I'll post the schematic & parts list up in my group's aviation DropBox, which I'll post the URL for when the stuff's ready. Give me another week or so to recover and clean up things, and we can all go about building a clone of ole diy_hUEGO. [Too bad they don't make the O2 sensor tips in the shape of a cone; that would be so fitting]. Cheers, Garfield From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 13 23:38:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA14208 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 23:38:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo25.mx.aol.com (imo25.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.69]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA14204 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 23:38:11 -0400 Received: from ABTSZ@aol.com by imo25.mx.aol.com (IMOv13.ems) id 8PZPa23731 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 23:33:29 -0500 (EDT) From: ABTSZ Message-ID: <28a908fa.3532d90a@aol.com> Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 23:33:29 EDT To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: ?s about EFI conversion using GM ECM Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu HI, I am new to the list, and I have a couple of questions. I looked thru the archives but there are so many, I'm sure I missed the answers that must be in there! Basically, I am going to try to adapt a GM EFI system to my non-GM engine. I was considering using the ever-popular "730" computer. My engine is a 6-cyl and I would pull the EFI system from a J-body with a v6. I would then adjust the fuel pressure until it was "close" and let the block-learn do the rest. I have already looked around and all the harness I can find are hacked. I have finally decided that I might just be "lazy" and order a new harness. There are many aftermarket harnesses for V8 TPI conversions around for as low as $200 maybe less if I look some more. One of those, a 730 from the junkyard, and some new sensors from DAP and I'll be set...maybe. The questions I have are: 1: Will a V8 TPI harness function as a 6cyl harness, so long as the 730 computer has the right calibrator, etc. Or will I have to rearrange all the wires at the connector? 2: I will not be attaching anything but the bare essentials to the harness. In other words, No VSS, EGR, etc. Just the MAP, Water temp, air temp,and TPS and HEI. Will this cause any problems? The computer can flash error codes all day long for all I care, just so long as it runs OK. Or will I have to buy a chip with all these things disabled (I have NO programming skills)? TIA, Adam From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 00:40:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA14776 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 00:40:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (foothillnet.com [206.170.175.1] (may be forged)) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA14769 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 00:40:27 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-57.foothill.net [209.77.119.57]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA00740; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:42:09 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: , Subject: Re: ?s about EFI conversion using GM ECM Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:39:22 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd675f$4b6c8880$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu With a 730, the VSS is a must. Oh, it will run, but there are speed dependent things in the code. Having the VSS connected on a 730 makes a world of difference. Is this a manual or auto application? Yes, you can run without a VSS, but once you put one in, you wonder how you lived without it. The "etc", I don't know. You will need: MAP (Mass air flow won't work on a HEI system. It is for a DIS system only on the 6 cyl.) TPS VSS Temp sender HEI IAT (Intake air temp) Fans, fuel pump control are optional. The Digital or Linear EGR not being there will require some malfunction flags to be disabled. VATS may need disabling in the chip. (MAP/SD systems use the Mass input for Vats). -----Original Message----- From: ABTSZ To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Monday, April 13, 1998 9:11 PM Subject: ?s about EFI conversion using GM ECM >HI, >I am new to the list, and I have a couple of questions. I looked thru the >archives but there are so many, I'm sure I missed the answers that must be in >there! >Basically, I am going to try to adapt a GM EFI system to my non-GM engine. I >was considering using the ever-popular "730" computer. My engine is a 6-cyl >and I would pull the EFI system from a J-body with a v6. I would then adjust >the fuel pressure until it was "close" and let the block-learn do the rest. > I have already looked around and all the harness I can find are hacked. I >have finally decided that I might just be "lazy" and order a new harness. >There are many aftermarket harnesses for V8 TPI conversions around for as low >as $200 maybe less if I look some more. One of those, a 730 from the >junkyard, and some new sensors from DAP and I'll be set...maybe. >The questions I have are: >1: Will a V8 TPI harness function as a 6cyl harness, so long as the 730 >computer has the right calibrator, etc. Or will I have to rearrange all the >wires at the connector? >2: I will not be attaching anything but the bare essentials to the harness. >In other words, No VSS, EGR, etc. Just the MAP, Water temp, air temp,and TPS >and HEI. Will this cause any problems? The computer can flash error codes >all day long for all I care, just so long as it runs OK. Or will I have to >buy a chip with all these things disabled (I have NO programming skills)? > >TIA, >Adam > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 00:40:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA14774 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 00:40:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (foothillnet.com [206.170.175.1] (may be forged)) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA14765 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 00:40:25 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-57.foothill.net [209.77.119.57]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA00740; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:42:09 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: , Subject: Re: ?s about EFI conversion using GM ECM Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 21:39:22 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd675f$4b6c8880$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu With a 730, the VSS is a must. Oh, it will run, but there are speed dependent things in the code. Having the VSS connected on a 730 makes a world of difference. Is this a manual or auto application? Yes, you can run without a VSS, but once you put one in, you wonder how you lived without it. The "etc", I don't know. You will need: MAP (Mass air flow won't work on a HEI system. It is for a DIS system only on the 6 cyl.) TPS VSS Temp sender HEI IAT (Intake air temp) Fans, fuel pump control are optional. The Digital or Linear EGR not being there will require some malfunction flags to be disabled. VATS may need disabling in the chip. (MAP/SD systems use the Mass input for Vats). -----Original Message----- From: ABTSZ To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Monday, April 13, 1998 9:11 PM Subject: ?s about EFI conversion using GM ECM >HI, >I am new to the list, and I have a couple of questions. I looked thru the >archives but there are so many, I'm sure I missed the answers that must be in >there! >Basically, I am going to try to adapt a GM EFI system to my non-GM engine. I >was considering using the ever-popular "730" computer. My engine is a 6-cyl >and I would pull the EFI system from a J-body with a v6. I would then adjust >the fuel pressure until it was "close" and let the block-learn do the rest. > I have already looked around and all the harness I can find are hacked. I >have finally decided that I might just be "lazy" and order a new harness. >There are many aftermarket harnesses for V8 TPI conversions around for as low >as $200 maybe less if I look some more. One of those, a 730 from the >junkyard, and some new sensors from DAP and I'll be set...maybe. >The questions I have are: >1: Will a V8 TPI harness function as a 6cyl harness, so long as the 730 >computer has the right calibrator, etc. Or will I have to rearrange all the >wires at the connector? >2: I will not be attaching anything but the bare essentials to the harness. >In other words, No VSS, EGR, etc. Just the MAP, Water temp, air temp,and TPS >and HEI. Will this cause any problems? The computer can flash error codes >all day long for all I care, just so long as it runs OK. Or will I have to >buy a chip with all these things disabled (I have NO programming skills)? > >TIA, >Adam > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 01:49:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA15601 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 01:49:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mozart.bcit.bc.ca (aix4.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.189.164]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA15597 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 01:49:27 -0400 Received: from omnibook (usr091.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.188.191]) by mozart.bcit.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA12630 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 22:47:59 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980413224515.00815c00@pophost.bcit.bc.ca> X-Sender: ffnsp955@pophost.bcit.bc.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 22:45:15 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: peter paul fenske Subject: Re: 1985 In-Reply-To: <199804131817.OAA79100@r02n02.cac.psu.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Paul Check your fuel pump rail pressure and bleeddown. Pump might be going. Also there is a MAF error. Check for 0.5v at idle at the MAF a/d input to the ecm. Burnoff is not a relay but a solid state bosch unit for 85. later:peter At 02:17 PM 4/13/98 -0400, you wrote: >Hey Bruce, > I was just out with my friend in his 1985 Pontiac TA. It has a cold >start problem, and there is a slight hesitation when the trottle is applied. >Kinda like a car without the accelarator pump working on the carb. The car >has 150,000 on it, mods are a Hypertech chip, and a 3 inch Flowmaster cat >back kit. I found codes 12(self diagnostics?) 34, 54, 12 again. > >Any input? I also will be calling about the burner, again. TIA > >Paul > > > > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 02:01:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA15678 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 02:01:31 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mozart.bcit.bc.ca (aix4.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.189.164]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA15674 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 02:01:29 -0400 Received: from omnibook (usr091.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.188.191]) by mozart.bcit.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA12880 for ; Mon, 13 Apr 1998 22:59:59 -0700 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980413225715.007a8b00@pophost.bcit.bc.ca> X-Sender: ffnsp955@pophost.bcit.bc.ca X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 22:57:15 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: peter paul fenske Subject: Re: ?s about EFI conversion using GM ECM In-Reply-To: <28a908fa.3532d90a@aol.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Adam Lots of jcars junk yard full of em but if you got the money buy a harness. Yep a V8 will work You will have to move the serial data pin prob one pin over on the A connector if using J car call. If you use the 3.1 cam cal you won't If you gnd the PN input to the ecm you don't need VSS cannister and port air won't work, and egr won't work and won't be tested. Oh course it is as TBK says sometimes nicer to run the whole schebang. later:peter At 11:33 PM 4/13/98 EDT, you wrote: >HI, >I am new to the list, and I have a couple of questions. I looked thru the >archives but there are so many, I'm sure I missed the answers that must be in >there! >Basically, I am going to try to adapt a GM EFI system to my non-GM engine. I >was considering using the ever-popular "730" computer. My engine is a 6-cyl >and I would pull the EFI system from a J-body with a v6. I would then adjust >the fuel pressure until it was "close" and let the block-learn do the rest. > I have already looked around and all the harness I can find are hacked. I >have finally decided that I might just be "lazy" and order a new harness. >There are many aftermarket harnesses for V8 TPI conversions around for as low >as $200 maybe less if I look some more. One of those, a 730 from the >junkyard, and some new sensors from DAP and I'll be set...maybe. >The questions I have are: >1: Will a V8 TPI harness function as a 6cyl harness, so long as the 730 >computer has the right calibrator, etc. Or will I have to rearrange all the >wires at the connector? >2: I will not be attaching anything but the bare essentials to the harness. >In other words, No VSS, EGR, etc. Just the MAP, Water temp, air temp,and TPS >and HEI. Will this cause any problems? The computer can flash error codes >all day long for all I care, just so long as it runs OK. Or will I have to >buy a chip with all these things disabled (I have NO programming skills)? > >TIA, >Adam > > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 03:11:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA16316 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 03:11:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from linux1.americasnet.com (root@www.americasnet.com [207.155.121.128]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA16312 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 03:11:31 -0400 Received: from beachscene.com (ppp01.americasnet.com [207.155.14.216]) by linux1.americasnet.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA25512 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 00:14:25 -0700 Message-ID: <35330B93.835AB004@beachscene.com> Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 00:09:07 -0700 From: gt bradley X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (WinNT; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) References: <35760b2a.58721515@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> <3586c7c8.73411203@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu garfield@pilgrimhouse.com wrote: > On Wed, 08 Apr 1998 17:00:31 -0700, garfield@pilgrimhouse.com wrote: > > BUT, do I have good news for YOUS GUYS!!! I got in some quality time > today testing our diy_EGOmeter, and I just got finished sending off a > missive to Frank with the nitty gritty details, but suffice it to say, > it looks like we have a *weiner*. Cool, I'm anxious for the final results.... GT '72 914-6 2.7 From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 03:25:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA16433 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 03:25:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA16429 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 03:25:55 -0400 Received: from chopper (du193-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.5.193]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id AAA02218 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 00:25:53 -0700 Message-Id: X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 00:22:48 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Ganz Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: <3586c7c8.73411203@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <35760b2a.58721515@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> <35760b2a.58721515@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Man, you are pumped Garfield! As soon as you get the schematics up, I'll see about whipping up a nice PCB if people will be interested. Sounds like you have done quite a bit of work to beat the high $$ meters, and that is GOOD! Let me know when you get all the kinks worked out of the circuit, and I'll take a crack at the PCB for the group. Sandy From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 04:13:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA16920 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 04:13:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from scud.pronet.net.au (scud.pronet.net.au [203.34.103.243]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA16916 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 04:13:45 -0400 Received: (qmail 15544 invoked from network); 14 Apr 1998 08:09:26 -0000 Received: from dud043.pronet.net.au (HELO daves-1) (202.139.16.43) by scud.pronet.net.au with SMTP; 14 Apr 1998 08:09:26 -0000 Message-ID: <35331B06.3D1B@pronet.net.au> Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 18:15:02 +1000 From: David Chambers X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) References: <35760b2a.58721515@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> <3586c7c8.73411203@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu garfield@pilgrimhouse.com wrote: > > On Wed, 08 Apr 1998 17:00:31 -0700, garfield@pilgrimhouse.com wrote: > > >it's a comin, > >honest engine. Give me another week before you tar and feather me for > >dragging my virus-infested butt. Whimper. Man how can such tiny lil > >critters make you feel like sucha pieceOyou-know-what. > > Man, that was almost a week ago, and I'm way worse than I was then. What > a sissy! I'm tellin yous man, these virii vermin are kickin me > buttocks!! My doctor wants to hospitalize me if I develop even a hint of > a secondary lung infection; I'm right on the doorstep of viral > pnuemonia! Whimper is right! Crapola, what a BORE. > > BUT, do I have good news for YOUS GUYS!!! I got in some quality time > today testing our diy_EGOmeter, and I just got finished sending off a > missive to Frank with the nitty gritty details, but suffice it to say, > it looks like we have a *weiner*. The free-air O2 ion pumping current my > circuit settles at (the so-called free-air calibration point) is only 5% > off from what Frank gets with his NTK sensor and interface box!!!! This > is stunning confirmation that we are go-for-launch, and that the Honda > OEM sensors are indeed essentially the same as the NTK sensors. I > measured 6.3 mA @0.445V, and he (Frank) gets 6.0 mA @ 0.428V. Before you > think them stoich voltages are somewhat different, lemme tell ya that we > discovered there's a real black-hole steep Ip null right at stoich, just > like that cliff-edge part of the conventional Lambda curve. The voltage > of the measurement cell, VsCell, goes along niceNlinearly heading for > stoich, as you crank up the O2 cell current, IpCell, but just as you get > to 0.450V, all hell breaks loose, and even a tiny lil tweak of IpCell, > and you're on the other side of stoich by 200-400mV. So what I'm saying > is that Frank's instrument's feedback loop locks stoich up at 0.428V, > and mine at 0.445V (hey, mine's more precise than NTK's, hee hee; > alright, it's also a tad twitchy at the moment), but for all intents and > purposes, it's smack on the same point in the curve of IpCell vrs. > VsCell. Hence, the free-air calibration currents diff. by only 5%. You > couldn't ask for a better reassurance that the Honda OEM sensor and the > NTK "special salsa" version are essentially the same, except for their > method/values of embedding CAL resistances. The most important thing is > that since the sensors perform basically identical, we can just plan on > calibrating the boxes each of us build with this "free-air > self-calibration" procedure, and care not a wit about what the internal > CAL Rs are set at, for their various original usage. "We don't need no > stinking CAL Rs", is the bottom line. Besides, as I mentioned to Frank, > use of the CAL Rs also can't compensate for sensor aging nor > deterioration due to lead/dirt contamination, like a self-calibration in > free-air can, so it's better we don't mess with them Rs anyway, eh? > > Actually, I have a theory about what the CAL Rs in the Honda sensors > actually are, and will test me hypothesis when I get a couple more, but > the main thing is we aren't dependent on even knowing what they mean, > since the sensors can be self-calibrated in free-air. In fact, this is > THE method of choice for the Horiba boxes, since they don't ship their > sensors with ANY embedded CAL R in the cable. They ASSUME you're going > to self-calibrate it yourself. > > I mentioned to Frank that I have a couple tweaks still needed to the > circuit, one to detune the hyperactive feedback; I didn't count on the > Ip vrs Vs relationship being so sensitive near stoich (hence it twitches > on it's way to settling, instead of gracefully landing via a smooth > approach, when you first turn it on), and I need to replace one of the > parts in the "warm-up" circuit with one I've got on order; the current > part doesn't like anything but 12V supply (some times it switches, > sometimes it lounges), and I want the whole thing to function on 5V. But > the bottom line is, at this point, looks like we get our O2 meters > finally! As soon as I get the last tweaks done and everything checked > out completely, I'll post the schematic & parts list up in my group's > aviation DropBox, which I'll post the URL for when the stuff's ready. > Give me another week or so to recover and clean up things, and we can > all go about building a clone of ole diy_hUEGO. [Too bad they don't make > the O2 sensor tips in the shape of a cone; that would be so fitting]. > > Cheers, > Garfield This sounds great. Do you need anything done in the way of a user interface to the output of this?. Ie a processor circuit some LED displays and software to run same. Dave From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 06:02:46 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA17919 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 06:02:46 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from vlad.cs.tut.fi (root@vlad.cs.tut.fi [130.230.36.90]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA17915 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 06:02:42 -0400 Received: from localhost (mono.cs.tut.fi [130.230.36.11]) by vlad.cs.tut.fi (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id NAA18782 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 13:02:42 +0300 (EETDST) Message-Id: <199804141002.NAA18782@vlad.cs.tut.fi> X-Mailer: exmh version 2.0.1 12/23/97 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: ALDL linking Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 12:51:30 +0200 From: Michael Giannini Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id GAA17916 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I connected a scope at the M pins of diacom ALDL connector and set it up for -87 TPI (my GTA ;). In aldl mode, it sends data to pin M, but does not link up. The ECM is the early P4 #165, which is supposed to be commanded to 8192bps mode, but can anyone identify what diacom tries to send from screenshots of the scope? In 160bps mode all works fine. Scope pics from diacom pin M @ http://lenkkari.cs.tut.fi/~gini/aldl.html first pics are with 0.5ms per grid and the last ones with 1ms and 50ms per grid. Also note the cursors on the images showind time values. Can anyone figure out the data values it tries to send to the ECM? thanks, Michael From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 14:21:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA22862 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:21:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from fxiod01.is.chrysler.com (firewall-user@fxiod01.is.chrysler.com [204.189.94.70]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA22858 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:21:54 -0400 From: jb24@chrysler.com Received: by fxiod01.is.chrysler.com; id OAA27648; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:18:58 -0400 Received: from mhbclpr2-nf0.is.chrysler.com(129.9.212.187) by fxiod01.is.chrysler.com via smap (3.2) id xma027606; Tue, 14 Apr 98 14:18:50 -0400 Received: from ODEMXPR1.ODDC.CHRYSLER.COM (odemxpr1-dgen0.oddc.chrysler.com [129.9.196.20]) by mhbclpr2-nf0.is.chrysler.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/chrysler-relay.1.2-kcd) with SMTP id OAA23627 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:21:21 -0400 (EDT) Received: by ODEMXPR1.ODDC.CHRYSLER.COM (Soft-Switch LMS 2.0) with snapi via NOTES id 0041200005561652; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:20:44 -0400 To: Subject: re: HC11 and prop Message-ID: <0041200005561652000002L022*@MHS> Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:20:44 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@EFI332.ENG.OHIO-STATE.EDU Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@EFI332.ENG.OHIO-STATE.EDU Tim, It may not be any use to you, but you can get a signal off the tach output of the ignition ECU. ---------------------- Forwarded by John R Bucknell/JTE/Chrysler on 04/14/98 01:32 PM --------------------------- owner-diy_efi @ EFI332.ENG.OHIO-STATE.EDU 04/10/98 05:04 PM Please respond to diy_efi@EFI332.ENG.OHIO-STATE.EDU @ SMTP To: DIY_EFI @ EFI332.ENG.OHIO-STATE.EDU @ SMTP cc: Subject: HC11 and prop Greetings! I am laying out an HC11 board for use as a datalogger on a motorcycle initially, and as a programmable ignition at some point down the road. The ignition will use some sort of Hall effect sensor to determine crank position. I wanted to use a simple inductive pickup around a spark plug wire to pick up an RPM signal. There are a couple of problems here. On our new GSXR the coils are incorporated in the spark plug caps, so no plug wires with the big inductive collapse. The coil/cap thing is new to motorcycles but has been on cars for a while, I understand. Has anybody figured out how to measure ignition pulses without splicing into an ignition wire(something known to cause problems, at least with motorbike digital ignitions), or resorting to building a box to split and amplify ignition signals.What kind of noise precautions are necessary when measuring inductive collapse? What effect do the other(three) plugs have? I could install a separate Hall effect sensor to read a camshaft bolt, or use the stock sensor(mounted on the countershaft), but the question intrigued me. On an unrelated topic, the use of isopropyl alcohol as a fuel additive/oxygenator has come to my attention. Does anybody know the ratio, and what percentage jet increases would be necessary? We are an endurance team looking for an edge, so any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance, Tim Gooding Army of Darkness Racing Smithsonian Institution From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 14:58:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA23191 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:58:31 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca (mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA23187 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 14:58:28 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA11446 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 11:58:27 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id LAA14371; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 11:57:54 -0700 Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 11:57:54 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Yo, where do I sign up for a PCB ? Sandy if and when this happens I'm a definite yes. thanks jw On Tue, 14 Apr 1998, Sandy Ganz wrote: > > Man, you are pumped Garfield! As soon as you get the schematics up, I'll > see about whipping up a nice PCB if people will be interested. Sounds like > you have done quite a bit of work to beat the high $$ meters, and that is > GOOD! > > Let me know when you get all the kinks worked out of the circuit, and I'll > take a crack at the PCB for the group. > > Sandy > > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 18:55:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA25308 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 18:55:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA25298 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 18:55:03 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA9397 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 15:55:03 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 15:55:41 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35fbe95f.147546734@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <35760b2a.58721515@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> <35760b2a.58721515@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id SAA25299 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Tue, 14 Apr 1998 00:22:48 +0100, Sandy Ganz wrote: >Man, you are pumped Garfield! As soon as you get the schematics up, I'll >see about whipping up a nice PCB if people will be interested. Sounds like >you have done quite a bit of work to beat the high $$ meters, and that is >GOOD! Yeah, I'm pretty jazzed, mainly cuz I want one of these REAL ego meters to use, meself! But nah, not really much work (and no, I'm not the modest type); Frank Parker supplied a tremendously complete set of intel for the whole operation, so it was just a matter of piecing his SAE info, private intel, and inputs from several of yous guys together. Him also being in possession of an NTK sensor and interface box (and NO, he NEVER broke seals and opened the thing up to look inside; they're toooo eXpensive to do that!!), and being able to watch it's behavior and run I/O tests on his end, was another key to fast closure on several issues/questions that came up in the process. >Let me know when you get all the kinks worked out of the circuit, and I'll >take a crack at the PCB for the group. OK, eXcellent! It'll be real soon. I've already detuned the feedback path and now it settles tamely, but I now see why the NTK "stoich" offsets Frank was seeing are seemingly so "large". Like, his one box seems to always stabilize at VsCell = 0.428V instead of the target 0.450V, and at first glance that seems significant, until you find that this diff. of 22milliVolts represents a Ip pumping current change around stoich of a few microAmps. Vewy sensitive! The way we should look at this is, anything between say 0.420 and 0.480 is still eXtremely, exquisitely tightly locked in "on stoich", so with the feedback detuned, I now settle at around 0.435V instead of 0.445V. The difference is still WAY down in the noise, but it doesn't "twitch" around stoich, like it did before. So that's one down, and one minor one to go. The other remaining thing to confirm as working properly is just basically a switch that stops the Ip pump from operating until the sensor warms up and it's output has had a chance to cross over to the lean side of stoich (remember, we're powering up in essentially free air), before turning on the ion pump to pump us back up to stoich. This is such a dirt simple part of the circuit, that I expect it will take me 10 mins to confirm proper working of the switch, and that's it. The hysteresis in the mechanism has already been tested, and works fine; it's only the current switches I'm using that don't work reliably on 5V Vdd. The new ones coming from Analog Devices are guaranteed to work on 5V, so I think that's a no-brainer. Once they arrive and that checking is done, it's off to the Black Forest to put the Elves to work. I can't imagine the parts costing more than about $30, eXcluding the O2 sensor. Once I build a couple more to confirm they're repeatably cloneable, we oughta see what kinda deal we can get with Honda for a group buy of the sensors. Since anyone can get them in one-zies for $130 from their local dealer, I'll bet we could easily get them below $100 if we bought a couple dozen at a wack. That would put the total cost below most of them El Cheapo meters. I love it! One thing I do need to point out, tho, for due diligence sake, is that we haven't yet tested the whole thang all the way from filthy rich to bone lean, nor will I be able to send my proto back to Frank for a side-by-side calibration/comparison with his NTK boxNsensor, until I get them AD switches. Yeah, that's really the very NEXT thing to do, once I get the parts, is send the proto to Frank for a sanity check & comparison, and built say two more to confirm repeatibility. If it passes both THOSE tests, we're truly home free. Gar From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 18:55:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA25309 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 18:55:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA25303 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 18:55:05 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAB9397 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 15:55:04 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 15:55:43 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35fce967.147554609@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <35760b2a.58721515@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> <3586c7c8.73411203@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> <35331B06.3D1B@pronet.net.au> In-Reply-To: <35331B06.3D1B@pronet.net.au> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id SAA25304 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Tue, 14 Apr 1998 18:15:02 +1000, David Chambers wrote: >This sounds great. Do you need anything done in the way of a user >interface to the output of this?. Ie a processor circuit some LED >displays and software to run same. Hey Dave. Yeah, we discussed this earlier, and because some will be logging data, while others will want to incorporate these lil beasties into their custom ECUs for such things as WOT closed-loop, etc., and some will just wanna build a visual meter, what I was assuming we'd do is start with a basic "interface", like what NTK sells. Then, depending on what people's application is, the rest can be layered atop that "interface". I'll give ya an example: whilst Horiba does a two-segment piecewise linear curve to completely linearize their output over the AFR range (this, for example, is just one of the myriad tid-bits Frank passed along to me), NTK has chosen to simply output their Ip pump current values, which ARE directly relatable to AFR, but the curve of Ip vrs. AFR has two diff. linear slopes depending on lean or rich side of stoich. That's the basics of how the instrument/circuitry works, so they just pass that on out to the user. This makes best sense if you're gonna be tieing a micro to the interface anyway for control or gui purposes, where as Horiba's full linearization DOES allow one to hook up a data logger directly to it and go instantly. But all's I'm gonna provide is the schematic & ops of the basic interface, so it'll look a lot like the NTK box, concept wise. That seems to be the most versatile and all-round best way to go. From their, the factions of usage might coagulate around further ideas for the additional layers, but we'll all decide that as a group or groups, like everything else like that. That's my take on the situation; once the egg's been laid, everybody's free to hatch it which ever way they want. BTW, the schematic will be copyrighted by our non-profit aviation group "AirSIG, Inc.", and freely available to anyone to use, eXcept for commercial eXploitation without written permission. This is done solely to keep someone from sucking up on our labors, and milking it as a cash cow. That's also how we've handled the EFI & IGN circuits our aviation group has developed for our eXperimental aviation engines. Kinda like the Free Software Foundation idea that gave us Gnu, if you're familiar with that. Garfield From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 20:36:14 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA26405 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:36:14 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com [198.133.22.42]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA26401 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:36:13 -0400 Received: from relay3.server.ibm.com (relay3.server.ibm.com [9.14.2.100]) by smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA22114 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:29:17 -0400 Received: from US.IBM.COM (d04lms02.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.164.194]) by relay3.server.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA147470 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:32:02 -0400 Received: by US.IBM.COM (Soft-Switch LMS 2.0) with snapi via D04AU004 id 5040200013989955; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:39:37 -0400 From: Jason Greene To: Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Message-ID: <5040200013989955000002L052*@MHS> Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:39:37 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'd be interested in the schematics when you are done. Check out this page and let me know what you think. http://www.students.tut.fi/~eppu/dev/EGO-bar.html Jason G. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 20:37:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA26427 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:37:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com [198.133.22.42]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA26423 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:37:15 -0400 Received: from relay3.server.ibm.com (relay3.server.ibm.com [9.14.2.100]) by smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA11670 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:30:19 -0400 Received: from US.IBM.COM (d04lms02.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.164.194]) by relay3.server.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA69498 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:33:04 -0400 Received: by US.IBM.COM (Soft-Switch LMS 2.0) with snapi via D04AU004 id 5040200013989978; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:40:39 -0400 From: Jason Greene To: Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Message-ID: <5040200013989978000002L082*@MHS> Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 20:40:39 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'd be interested in the schematics when you are done. Check out this page and let me know what you think. http://www.students.tut.fi/~eppu/dev/EGO-bar.html Jason G. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 22:26:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA27488 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 22:26:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ultra2.syspac.com (ultra2.syspac.com [204.96.14.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA27483 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 22:26:03 -0400 Received: from mailrelay.syspac.com ([204.96.14.7]) by ultra2.syspac.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-37030U5000L500S0) with ESMTP id AAA2286 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 19:23:40 -0700 Received: from p57004.syspac.com (p57004.syspac.com [204.181.57.4]) by mailrelay.syspac.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA02283 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 19:23:38 -0700 (MST) From: bamcknig@postoffice.syspac.com Message-Id: <199804150223.TAA02283@mailrelay.syspac.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Mon, 13 Apr 1998 11:38:35 +0000 Subject: Re: How consistent are stock EGO sensors? Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thor Mix them up and try again. A couple of times rotating the sensors to different cylinders and recording what sensor is in what cyl should give a good idea of whether its the sensor or the cylinder. Bob McKnight Phx AZ From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 14 23:12:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA27794 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 23:12:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from m28.boston.juno.com (m28.boston.juno.com [205.231.101.186]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA27790 for ; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 23:12:06 -0400 Received: (from cosmic.ray@juno.com) by m28.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id XMP00431; Tue, 14 Apr 1998 23:08:25 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 22:36:46 -0400 Subject: Re: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup Message-ID: <19980414.230744.12726.3.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> References: <01bd6546$643edf40$18198fd1@nacelp> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-12,14,16,18-20,22-26,28-32,34-46,48-49,56-60 From: cosmic.ray@juno.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Sat, 11 Apr 1998 19:05:47 -1000 "Paul E. Bueltmann III" writes: >Bruce Plecan wrote: >> >> ----Original Message----- >> From: Raymond C Drouillard >> To: fsj@digest.net ; fsj-list@unix.off-road.com >> ; diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >> >> Date: Saturday, April 11, 1998 1:16 AM >> Subject: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup >> >> >I have a Motorcraft Duraspark ignition in my '89 Grand Wagoneer. I am >> >trying to use a seven-pin GM ignition module so that I can control the >> >spark timing with the Holley Pro-Jection 4Di box. I want to trigger the >> >GM module with the pickup coil output of the Motorcraft distributer. >> > >> >The seven-pin module is the one that is used in the GM HEI (High Energy >> >Ignition) systems - both coil-in-cap and the external coil module. >> > >> >This is rather obscure info, but maybe someone can help me. >> > >> >1) What is the voltage output of the ignition pickup coil that is used >> >for the Motorcraft Duraspark? >> > >> >2) What voltage is required to trigger the GM module? >> > >> >Do you know of anyone who has used a Motorcraft distributer to trigger a >> >GM module? >> > >> >Ray Drouillard > >I measured the voltage at the pins on a napa echlin tp49 7 pin and >measured 3 volts at low rpm and 5 volts at the high rpm don't know if I >was measuring from the right pins. The pins I used were the b pin and + >pin on the 3 wire side. > >later paulb3@gte.net > Thanks for going to the trouble of measuring your module. I think you have a different module, though. The module I have has five pins on one side and two on the other. The "two pin" side goes to the coil. Three pins on the "five pin" side go to the ECM (signal out, signal in, and a 5v level that will cause the ECM to be bypassed if it's missing). The other two pins go to the magnetic pickup coil in the distributer. I'm trying to feed the signal from a Motorcraft Duraspark distributer into those two pins. I tried both polarities. I would measure the voltage myself, but I don't have access to a 'scope. Ray Drouillard _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 03:20:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA29279 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 03:20:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA29275 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 03:20:19 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-014.mcn.net [208.26.146.14]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id BAA16616 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 01:20:05 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <35345CB9.5DCD21E1@mcn.net> Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 01:07:37 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup References: <01bd6546$643edf40$18198fd1@nacelp> <19980414.230744.12726.3.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Raymond C Drouillard wrote: > > > The module I have has five pins on one side and two on the other. The > "two pin" side goes to the coil. Three pins on the "five pin" side go to > the ECM (signal out, signal in, and a 5v level that will cause the ECM to > be bypassed if it's missing). The other two pins go to the magnetic > pickup coil in the distributer. I'm trying to feed the signal from a > Motorcraft Duraspark distributer into those two pins. I tried both > polarities. > > I would measure the voltage myself, but I don't have access to a 'scope. > > Ray Drouillard > I seem to remember that 5-7VAC is enough to trigger the module. If you have a DVOM you can measure the voltage from the distributor. Do you have the module powered up? One of the wires from the coil is ign+ to turn on the module, the other is coil-. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 04:31:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA29703 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 04:31:19 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp1.mailsrvcs.net (smtp1.gte.net [207.115.153.30]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA29699 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 04:31:15 -0400 Received: from paulb3 (1Cust180.tnt1.hilo.hi.gt.uu.net [208.255.248.180]) by smtp1.mailsrvcs.net with SMTP id DAA16129 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 03:31:02 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <35346F3E.2958@gte.net> Date: Tue, 14 Apr 1998 22:26:38 -1000 From: "Paul E. Bueltmann III" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: 1612759,1612231 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu My latest trip to the salvage yard I came across these two GM computers a gm pt# 1612759 and pt# 1612231 both were missing the donar cars and I was wondering if these computers worth getting or not. thanks paulb3@gte.net From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 12:12:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA32327 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 12:12:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ultra2.syspac.com (ultra2.syspac.com [204.96.14.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA32322 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 12:12:32 -0400 Received: from mailrelay.syspac.com ([204.96.14.7]) by ultra2.syspac.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-37030U5000L500S0) with ESMTP id AAA19859 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 09:10:07 -0700 Received: from p57048.syspac.com (p57048.syspac.com [204.181.57.48]) by mailrelay.syspac.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA19849 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 09:10:04 -0700 (MST) From: bamcknig@postoffice.syspac.com Message-Id: <199804151610.JAA19849@mailrelay.syspac.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 09:27:11 +0000 Subject: Re: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ray You might try using the old 4 pin HEI module to start. I have been intending to find more info on the five and seven pin modules but haven't. I have no idea about the motorcraft distributors, I like the HEI mostly because it works, its cheap and plentiful. You might look at the possibility of modifing one of the many HEI bodies to fit your engine. Bob McKnight Phx AZ From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 14:48:27 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA01197 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 14:48:27 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bert.acesag.auburn.edu (bert.acesag.auburn.edu [131.204.46.47]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA01193 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 14:48:21 -0400 Received: from bert (bert [131.204.46.47]) by bert.acesag.auburn.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id NAA21971 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 13:48:20 -0500 (CDT) Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 13:48:19 -0500 (CDT) From: "Gregory A. Parmer" X-Sender: gparmer@bert To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: GM 1227747 ECM drivers In-Reply-To: <35345CB9.5DCD21E1@mcn.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm missing a great deal of background info, so here are a few real simple quick questions. I think a good portion of my problem is mixed terminology used on the list. The LM1949 is a "injector driver" chip, but it's not really what I consider the "driver". The LM1949 just controls the transistor that actually sinks the current, no? So what should I call the transistor? To me it's the driver. Enlighten me. With that said, I'm wanting to know the function of several parts in the '747. It has 4 discreet transistors which I would assume are drivers and one other multi-pin heat sunk part in the middle of the board. Is that the infamous quad-driver? Which of these 5 parts control outputs from the ECM? A pointer to the appropriate URL for beginners would be most acceptable too. If there ain't one, there can be soon. :) BTW--Count me in on the '747 project. Searching for "101" in the archives did turn up plenty of much useful info. -greg From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 14:57:27 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA01286 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 14:57:27 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.33]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA01282 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 14:57:26 -0400 Received: from fiat ([12.69.33.133]) by mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA25742 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 18:57:05 +0000 Message-ID: <008601bd68a0$30a1ad40$8521450c@fiat> From: "Scott Flanagan" To: Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 14:56:21 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu When the project is ready, I could make an HTML tutorial of the entire construction of the sensor box, where we can always have help for those making it and we can even put people's add-ons for interfacing up there. Let me know if anyone is interested in this idea? -Scott Flanagan From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 15:24:40 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA01886 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 15:24:40 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA01881 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 15:24:38 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA14083 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 12:24:38 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM 1227747 ECM drivers Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 12:25:17 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <355f08e1.47953484@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id PAA01882 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 15 Apr 1998 13:48:19 -0500 (CDT), "Gregory A. Parmer" wrote: >I think a good portion of my problem is >mixed terminology used on the list. The LM1949 >is a "injector driver" chip, but it's not >really what I consider the "driver". The >LM1949 just controls the transistor that >actually sinks the current, no? So >what should I call the transistor? To me >it's the driver. Enlighten me. Well, I'll nose in here. You're right, the terms aren't so tidy. If you was in the trade, you'd probly still call the LM1949 the "injector driver" because it does all the smarts, and opt for refering to the outboard current amp simply as the "external Darlington". Then everyone's clear. Don't worry about it too much. When language fails us, we can always point and say "this thang here". Garfield From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 15:31:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA02065 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 15:31:20 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [205.139.62.192]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA02060 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 15:31:18 -0400 Received: (qmail 21528 invoked from network); 15 Apr 1998 13:31:17 -0600 Received: from ts6-40.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.166) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 15 Apr 1998 13:31:17 -0600 Received: by ts6-40.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD6872.42B52490@ts6-40.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 13:27:39 -0700 Message-ID: <01BD6872.42B52490@ts6-40.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: 2D Pro-Jection O2 sensor Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 13:27:32 -0700 Encoding: 34 TEXT, 52 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu My 4D arrived today. Can't help too much I'm afraid, but on the 4D the 02 sensor plugs directly into the ECU (via the harness, of course, but there is no other interface of any type) I imagine the 2D is the same, but you'll have to figure out which wire goes where. (The 4d has a 36 pin connector) Holley may be willing to help you answer that one. If not you should be able to reason what's what. Is the 2D as heavily potted as the 4D is? You can't see anything except one PROM and a couple of regulators w/o/ ruining the potting. >>Fredric Fitzgearld wrote: All, I got my 2D Por-jection (502-20) system late last week. Inside I found a bunch of resistors, a PROM, something that that might be a processor (a small square chip), and what might be a driver chip. Holley painted over the tops of the 2 chips that were not the PROM. I'll look into getting the numbers, later. Now, for the question of the day: Do any of you have a wiring diagram for what plugs into the 6 pin plug? I have the heated sensor from the analog system. What goes between the sensor and the ECU? If the sensor goes directly into the ECU, what pins do they go to? Anyone have the information for the 4D closed loop system? Thanks, FEF>> begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(B<4`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M`' ``0```!T```!213H@,D0@4')O+4IE M8W1I;VX@3S(@6)E``@0 M`0```&4```!-631$05)2259%1%1/1$%90T%.5$A%3%!43T]-54-(24U!1E)! M240L0E543TY42$4T1%1(13 R4T5.4T]24$Q51U-$25)%0U1,64E.5$]42$5% M0U4H5DE!5$A%2$%23D534RQ/``````(!"1 !````J@0``*8$```0" ``3%I& M=2S99(O_``H!#P(5`J0#Y 7K`H,`4!,#5 (`8V@*P'-E=&XR!@`&PP*#,@/% M`@!PS')Q$B /_V8S$PP'$PT"@S03# :P %T'D@-$0@"L E!1!V"8 @= 1P87G0+B @0P!P)P5 &V%"<"*1;R!M M=1&P(#A))VTB$ -0"W!D+/@@8G4%0 (@(I ;8"'B?262,!(@$? `@ 6Q"U!U M$F<$(&1I'.!C=&P/(= +@"*@)8-%0U4@7"AV!S E@Q'!;@>0<_$E`&]F( 6@ M"' 1\"4$KR61'. GP 0@;B/P;RJR^R?"!)!F`- EL"G!`' AT*!T>7!E*2,` M22? W0# 9PN ); EDC(B`"L162620A@)P\;@1' (F BD2!F:6?' M"' L424Q=VAI)#$#\'DJX6=O!Y$Q$"K1(O$H/E0EHB* $< $("C0,S;W)M + M@"GA;BE@)X %L"TAP(H S(265! `_(P#Z M63:18R,S$? Y$2RP)9 Y-<)E>"Q !3$W@2!0^%)/32R1/6$IX@M0+%,?'. P M@ M@-$$Q\2]O+_TYH'4+@#7#):$]$C7!.MTC"O0UL#$X, +1:2UX,30T#? , MT$8#"UDQ_QE@(8$*H -@%[ G@$2((+_L/CY&OT?(1ASA!1 `X!]([R,`"T82 M\DKN:71ZNF"^:S>R`($-L"U!`A!U0/'W"H4HT"4@;B0Q0;,`D!>@_T)1)0`HT$"2)0`F MH > /X3K-S,W,VTP<&@%0#D")M!?`V L0 00!;$*A2@HT'/C`, ;@7-Q=0K M); 1L/T%("E=L4#Q.B)?BDP!(F!_!R\R^B''!O:R?$"H5/<$/#>26#;G4& MT 20*9%:`G+Q.MU.;W\# M4B6#`' '0&\UX%F4(O'N5S=",<,U4'1:H25T"H7_)G5 XB@E/D$WX2Z3)H0Q MPW\G3RA2)0!S! N !" *A62O* ,AT#' (I$_.NQ!++#_0%)UIPN ;>$`P%BS M;>8A\?YC'' 1\"* :?$CL%F4@$T;,J `<&LID3KL1D5&_T_?2>I5-5*O4[\+ M514"57T+"H4<`0"-\ ```P`0$ `````#`!$0`@```$ `!S! .'8&IVB]`4 ` H"#! .'8&IVB]`1X`/0`!````!0```%)%.B ``````P`--/TW``#W[FB] ` end From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 15:36:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA02182 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 15:36:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com [198.133.22.42]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA02178 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 15:36:44 -0400 Received: from relay3.server.ibm.com (relay3.server.ibm.com [9.14.2.100]) by smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA17962 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 15:29:47 -0400 Received: from US.IBM.COM (d04lms02.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.164.194]) by relay3.server.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA118244 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 15:32:27 -0400 Received: by US.IBM.COM (Soft-Switch LMS 2.0) with snapi via D04AU004 id 5040200014027305; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 15:39:57 -0400 From: Jason Greene To: Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Message-ID: <5040200014027305000002L052*@MHS> Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 15:39:57 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm very interested. Jason G. When the project is ready, I could make an HTML tutorial of the entire construction of the sensor box, where we can always have help for those making it and we can even put people's add-ons for interfacing up there. Let me know if anyone is interested in this idea? -Scott Flanagan From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 16:06:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA02836 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 16:06:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.synergration.com ([207.86.17.140]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA02832 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 16:05:59 -0400 Received: by mail.synergration.com from localhost (router,SLMail V2.5); Wed, 15 Apr 1998 16:15:18 -0400 Received: by mail.synergration.com from pjs (209.38.34.42::mail daemon; unverified,SLMail V2.5); Wed, 15 Apr 1998 16:15:17 -0400 From: "Peter Shoebridge" To: Subject: RE: Ford PROMS (unsorted) Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 14:04:38 -0600 Message-ID: <000501bd68a9$b880ea60$c7c7c7c7@pjs> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980409202334.007ac280@xephic.dynip.com> Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3007.0 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hey Fred, What happened to the file? Did you take the zip off-line? Peter -----Original Message----- From: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu [mailto:owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu] On Behalf Of Frederic Breitwieser Sent: Thursday, April 09, 1998 9:24 PM To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Ford PROMS (unsorted) I unfortunately couldn't get my drive working correctly, so I had to place the 88MB archive online as an 88MB ZIP file. ftp://xephic.dynip.com/outgoing/ford/c96d.zip If your transfer is slow, its because multiple people are trying for it... and being a cheapo kinda guy, I only have 128KB line to the internet. Cheers, Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 16:36:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA03287 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 16:36:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA03283 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 16:36:21 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA16987 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 13:36:22 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 13:37:01 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <3563188f.51967781@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <008601bd68a0$30a1ad40$8521450c@fiat> In-Reply-To: <008601bd68a0$30a1ad40$8521450c@fiat> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id QAA03284 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 15 Apr 1998 14:56:21 -0400, "Scott Flanagan" wrote: >When the project is ready, I could make an HTML tutorial of the entire >construction of the sensor box, where we can always have help for those >making it and we can even put people's add-ons for interfacing up there. >Let me know if anyone is interested in this idea? IMNSHO, this is an eXcellent idea/offer! I'll prepare an ops description of the circuit internals, so if someone wants to do some further mods, this could also speed their learning curve. Nuthin complicated about the circuit, and even if you don't want to do mods, it's still nice to see/understand how it works. Don't have to be an EE to enjoy that part of it, eh? Maybe a family tree of mutant diy_EGOs will sprout from this, um, fertile ground. Heh. Now if Newark would just deliver my one remaining errant part, we could launch the party! (sound of foot-tapping in the background). Gar From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 17:50:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA04327 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 17:50:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from godzilla.zeta.org.au (godzilla.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.19]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA04323 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 17:50:23 -0400 Received: from d85.syd1.zeta.org.au (d85.syd1.zeta.org.au [203.2.228.213]) by godzilla.zeta.org.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id HAA05384 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 07:46:12 +1000 Received: by d85.syd1.zeta.org.au with Microsoft Mail id <01BD690B.A1B51D80@d85.syd1.zeta.org.au>; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 07:45:31 +-1000 Message-ID: <01BD690B.A1B51D80@d85.syd1.zeta.org.au> From: "A.HOLLEY" To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 07:45:27 +-1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD690B.A1B51D80" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD690B.A1B51D80 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Dont know how to tell you people this , but there is a kit available = from one of the local electronics chains here in Aus of a very similar = device. Comes with PCB and all components except case and EGO sensor. Fitted one in my XJS Jag about a yr ago. Works like a charm. And all for $15 Aus. ---------- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD690B.A1B51D80 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+Ih8VAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYAYAEAAAEAAAAMAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAAYQAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMy LmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQBTTVRQAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVk dQAAAAAeAAIwAQAAAAUAAABTTVRQAAAAAB4AAzABAAAAIgAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5v aGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQAAAAMAFQwBAAAAAwD+DwYAAAAeAAEwAQAAACQAAAAnZGl5X2VmaUBlZmkz MzIuZW5nLm9oaW8tc3RhdGUuZWR1JwACAQswAQAAACcAAABTTVRQOkRJWV9FRklARUZJMzMyLkVO Ry5PSElPLVNUQVRFLkVEVQAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAKcSAEEgAEA OwAAAFJFOiBSZXR1cm4gb2YgdGhlIGRpeV9FR09tZXRlciAoWUVTLCBpdCdzIGZpbmFsbHkgQUxJ VkUhISkAixIBBYADAA4AAADOBwQAEAAHAC0AGwAEADwBASCAAwAOAAAAzgcEABAABwApABwABAA5 AQEJgAEAIQAAADY3RUU1OTk4RkRENEQxMTE4QTY3NDQ0NTUzNTQwMDAwAPcGAQOQBgBoAwAAFAAA AAsAIwAAAAAAAwAmAAAAAAALACkAAAAAAAMALgAAAAAAAwA2AAAAAABAADkAwF/OzbdovQEeAHAA AQAAADsAAABSRTogUmV0dXJuIG9mIHRoZSBkaXlfRUdPbWV0ZXIgKFlFUywgaXQncyBmaW5hbGx5 IEFMSVZFISEpAAACAXEAAQAAABYAAAABvWi3zc6YWe5o1P0R0YpnREVTVAAAAAAeAB4MAQAAAAUA AABTTVRQAAAAAB4AHwwBAAAAEwAAAGhvbGxleUB6ZXRhLm9yZy5hdQAAAwAGEGvce1ADAAcQ7QAA AB4ACBABAAAAZQAAAERPTlRLTk9XSE9XVE9URUxMWU9VUEVPUExFVEhJUyxCVVRUSEVSRUlTQUtJ VEFWQUlMQUJMRUZST01PTkVPRlRIRUxPQ0FMRUxFQ1RST05JQ1NDSEFJTlNIRVJFSU5BVVNPRkEA AAAAAgEJEAEAAAC6AQAAtgEAAJkCAABMWkZ1RDCNJP8ACgEPAhUCpAPkBesCgwBQEwNUAgBjaArA c2V07jIGAAbDAoMyA8YHEwKDujMTDX0KgAjPCdk7Ff94MjU1AoAKgQ2xC2Bu8GcxMDMUIAsKEvIM ARJjAEAgRAIhIGtuSm8H4GgbUXRvG7BlCmwDIHkIYCBwZW8VC1BlG7BoBAAgLCB8YnUFQBzwBJAc 0B0RYeUbIGkFQGF2C3ALYAJgmxzQA1IgAiAc0G9mHZJqIBWQYwdAIBwABZB0+wNgAwBjBCARsQuA BCAdtLkDoEF1BCAfwR4wdgSQdHkgAJBtHsEFwA2wdvkhEGUuCoUIUAeCA/Ac8JAgUENCHiBuZB4g cxwRBaBtcB+BAjAEIGU+eCPgBTEgUBHwJWNFR7ZPIxAJ8HMFsCQGRh5gLxvwJZAfgiIRbSMAWErx BfBKYWceIAbgHXEeMFZ5BcAqIG8kBlcFsGsxBCBsaWsnQSFCcm0eLhNwJYUCEAXAJDE1HyIyJAYu PAr0LBAxODDBAtFpLTE0NA3wDNDzMIMLWTE2CqADYBvwIMDMIC0ypy8dMzYxJxo1FzImCoUVIQA2 gAAAAwAQEAAAAAADABEQAAAAAEAABzDA7yI/t2i9AUAACDDA7yI/t2i9AR4APQABAAAABQAAAFJF OiAAAAAAAwANNP03AABE2g== ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD690B.A1B51D80-- From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 19:02:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA05103 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:02:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.36]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA05099 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:02:21 -0400 Received: from ABTSZ@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8FEDa15810 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:01:46 -0400 (EDT) From: ABTSZ Message-ID: Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:01:46 EDT To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: J-bodies and DIS Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi, I am going to try and modify the system from a J-body v6 '87-'89 to work on my car, a non-GM 6 cyl. I've been looking thru manuals at the library and I have a few questions: 1: I was surprised to find that ALL j-body V-6s use DIS. From looking at the diagrams, it seems that the DIS systems work some what on their own, and that the only interaction with the ECM is the same as would be the case with a 7-pin HEI module. In other words, I could do away with the DIS (which would require a crankshaft signal) and wire it up to a HEI module, and the computer will still function. In other words (again) the Sync signal from the crankshaft goes to the DIS module, but doesn't go to the ECM. The DIS module just sends a regular pulse to the ECM, exactly as a HEI module would. Do you know if this is correct? (my car already incorporates a 4-pin HEI module so putting in a 7-pin would be pretty much Plug-n-Play.) 2: I could find no reference to a VATS module in any of the wiring diagrams I saw, so maybe those models (87-89 j-body v6 w/ 7730 ECM) don't use it. That would be a plus! Of course this information may be wrong, Does anybody know otherwise? Thanks for any info, Adam From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 19:14:27 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA05207 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:14:27 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com [198.133.22.42]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA05203 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:14:26 -0400 Received: from relay3.server.ibm.com (relay3.server.ibm.com [9.14.2.100]) by smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA40728 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:07:27 -0400 Received: from US.IBM.COM (d04lms02.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.164.194]) by relay3.server.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA140218 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:10:12 -0400 Received: by US.IBM.COM (Soft-Switch LMS 2.0) with snapi via D04AU004 id 5040200014037601; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:17:41 -0400 From: Jason Greene To: Subject: RE: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Message-ID: <5040200014037601000002L012*@MHS> Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:17:41 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu What is the name and number of the company you are talking about? Jason G. Dont know how to tell you people this , but there is a kit available from one of the local electronics chains here in Aus of a very similar device. Comes with PCB and all components except case and EGO sensor. Fitted one in my XJS Jag about a yr ago. Works like a charm. And all for $15 Aus. ---------- From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 19:34:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA05422 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:34:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from calliope1.fm.intel.com (calliope1.fm.intel.com [132.233.247.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA05418 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:34:12 -0400 Received: from fmsmsx27.fm.intel.com (fmsmsx27.fm.intel.com [132.233.42.27]) by calliope1.fm.intel.com (8.8.6/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA07838; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 23:34:06 GMT Message-Id: <199804152334.XAA07838@calliope1.fm.intel.com> Received: by FMSMSX27 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 16:33:20 -0700 From: "Fitzgearld, Fredric" To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu' " , Mike Jones Subject: RE: 2D Pro-Jection O2 sensor Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 16:14:00 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thanks anyway... The 2D has a 6 pin connector that the sensor plugs into. I guess I need to find someone that has the closed loop "add-on" for the 1 or 2 barrel system. I know that the sensor needs at least 3 of them. If in fact only 3 pins are used I'm sure I can figure out which wire goes where. That in the world would the other wires be for??? I have about 3 chips. All the tops are painted so I can't get the codes off them. I do wish there was a way to reprogram it, though. FEF ____________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: RE: 2D Pro-Jection O2 sensor Author: Mike Jones [SMTP:rmjones@cyberhighway.net] at MSXGATE Date: 4/15/98 1:27 PM My 4D arrived today. Can't help too much I'm afraid, but on the 4D the 02 sensor plugs directly into the ECU (via the harness, of course, but there is no other interface of any type) I imagine the 2D is the same, but you'll have to figure out which wire goes where. (The 4d has a 36 pin connector) Holley may be willing to help you answer that one. If not you should be able to reason what's what. Is the 2D as heavily potted as the 4D is? You can't see anything except one PROM and a couple of regulators w/o/ ruining the potting. >>Fredric Fitzgearld wrote: All, I got my 2D Por-jection (502-20) system late last week. Inside I found a bunch of resistors, a PROM, something that that might be a processor (a small square chip), and what might be a driver chip. Holley painted over the tops of the 2 chips that were not the PROM. I'll look into getting the numbers, later. Now, for the question of the day: Do any of you have a wiring diagram for what plugs into the 6 pin plug? I have the heated sensor from the analog system. What goes between the sensor and the ECU? If the sensor goes directly into the ECU, what pins do they go to? Anyone have the information for the 4D closed loop system? Thanks, FEF>> From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 20:53:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA06497 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 20:53:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from geocities.com (mail6.geocities.com [209.1.224.26]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA06492 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 20:53:14 -0400 Received: from Default (slper11p39.ozemail.com.au [203.108.227.115]) by geocities.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA00947 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 17:53:07 -0700 (PDT) Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 17:53:07 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804160053.RAA00947@geocities.com> X-Sender: dzorde@mail.geocities.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: dzorde@geocities.com (dzorde) Subject: RE: Projection Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Not a bad idea, can anyone verify if this is feasible with the Chev TPI as well. Dan dzorde@geocities.com >Well, I did it. I purchased a Holley 4D system for my 351W-powered boat. > >I've changed my mind (again) and will try and fit the O2 sensor somehow. > Question: My EGR port (Edelbrock Performer manifold) is blanked off. A >perhaps stupid question, but does anyone have a feel for whether there >would be enough 'fresh' exhaust (now there's a concept), perhaps due to >firing order pulsation, that sensing the EGR port for O2 content would >work? My own intuition is telling me to try and figure out a more >conventional solution... > >Thanks, > >Mike Jones > > >Attachment Converted: C:\PROGRA~1\EUDORA\INFILES\WINMAIL.DAT > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 20:53:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA06505 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 20:53:25 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from donkeykong.rs.itd.umich.edu (smtp@donkeykong.rs.itd.umich.edu [141.211.63.19]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA06501 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 20:53:24 -0400 Received: from moonpatrol.rs.itd.umich.edu (smtp@moonpatrol.rs.itd.umich.edu [141.211.63.97]) by donkeykong.rs.itd.umich.edu (8.8.8/4.3-mailhub) with ESMTP id UAA22396 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 20:53:24 -0400 (EDT) Received: from localhost (fparker@localhost) by moonpatrol.rs.itd.umich.edu (8.8.8/5.1-client) with SMTP id UAA21106 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 20:53:23 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 20:53:23 -0400 (EDT) From: Frank F Parker X-Sender: fparker@moonpatrol.rs.itd.umich.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: <5040200014037601000002L012*@MHS> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > Dont know how to tell you people this , but there is a kit available from one > of the local electronics chains here in Aus of a very similar device. > Comes with PCB and all components except case and EGO sensor. > Fitted one in my XJS Jag about a yr ago. > Works like a charm. And all for $15 Aus. > That kit is nothing more than a simple meter to monitor a std O2 sensor which we all should know by now is of limited usefullness is determining actual a/f. frank parker > > ---------- > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 20:56:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA06578 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 20:56:42 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from webserver (brpt01-sh7-port164.snet.net [204.60.24.164]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA06574 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 20:56:40 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAB00225; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 20:55:35 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 20:55:35 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804160055.UAB00225@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980415194445.007a9b10@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:44:45 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: RE: Ford PROMS (unsorted) In-Reply-To: <000501bd68a9$b880ea60$c7c7c7c7@pjs> References: <3.0.5.32.19980409202334.007ac280@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >What happened to the file? Did you take the zip off-line? Not at all... I did one better :) If you go to: ftp://xephic.dynip.com/ You'll get a list of available "virtual" directories, and you can download the stuff. I unzipped it so there is a lot of "stuff" to download, however I felt this was better than people trying to pull down an 88MB file. Several people tried, and lost the download just before it finished. If you use something like WSFTP or FTP Pro, etc, it makes it much easier to download the entire directory. I installed a 3 gig drive, moved some of the FTP outgoing stuff, making room for a bigger swap file. The original 1 gig didn't cut it :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 21:00:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA06674 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 21:00:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ingenico.com.au ([203.10.64.225]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA06670 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 21:00:26 -0400 Received: from pjaramaz [10.10.10.34] by ingenico.com.au [10.10.10.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP0.R) for ; Thu, 16 Apr 98 10:59:46 +1000 Received: by pjaramaz with Microsoft Mail id <01BD6926.804940C0@pjaramaz>; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:57:51 +1000 Message-ID: <01BD6926.804940C0@pjaramaz> From: Peter Jaramaz To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:57:50 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD6926.804940C0" X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD6926.804940C0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Hi all, I think He means Jaycar Electronics, +61-2-9743-6144. They are a = hobbyist store and stock a few nice automotive kits. They have an EGO = kit (about AUS$20) with a line of coloured LEDs that connects to your = EGO sensor. Some people install them in their cars and have a visual = indication of their mixtures. Been meaning to build the thing just no = time :-(=20 Also, an older catalogue (1996) shows a PC driven EGO analyser as well = as a a 3 LED (lean, good, rich) version of the above.=20 Also, Id like to introduce myself to the list having recently. I have a = Holden Commodore (Aus GM) with a 3800 GM V6. I have had a go at hacking = the ECU (16131578 Service number 01227808), 16kB eeprom. Another fellow = on the list gave me a hand at first (HI Peter and thanks) and i've = managed to get a lot of the routines and calibration constants out. = Forced induction is a possible scenario in the future.=20 Cheers all, Peter ---------- From: Jason Greene Sent: Thursday, April 16, 1998 9:17 AM To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) What is the name and number of the company you are talking about? Jason G. Dont know how to tell you people this , but there is a kit available = from one of the local electronics chains here in Aus of a very similar device. Comes with PCB and all components except case and EGO sensor. Fitted one in my XJS Jag about a yr ago. Works like a charm. And all for $15 Aus. ---------- ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD6926.804940C0 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IjMAAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYAYAEAAAEAAAAMAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAAYQAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMy LmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQBTTVRQAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVk dQAAAAAeAAIwAQAAAAUAAABTTVRQAAAAAB4AAzABAAAAIgAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5v aGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQAAAAMAFQwBAAAAAwD+DwYAAAAeAAEwAQAAACQAAAAnZGl5X2VmaUBlZmkz MzIuZW5nLm9oaW8tc3RhdGUuZWR1JwACAQswAQAAACcAAABTTVRQOkRJWV9FRklARUZJMzMyLkVO Ry5PSElPLVNUQVRFLkVEVQAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAKcSAEEgAEA OwAAAFJFOiBSZXR1cm4gb2YgdGhlIGRpeV9FR09tZXRlciAoWUVTLCBpdCdzIGZpbmFsbHkgQUxJ VkUhISkAixIBBYADAA4AAADOBwQAEAAKADkAMgAEAGIBASCAAwAOAAAAzgcEABAACgAaADgABABJ AQEJgAEAIQAAAEQ1QjJFNkI4MDNENUQxMTFCRUJCMDA0MDA1NUYyQTZGADMHAQOQBgAoBwAAFAAA AAsAIwAAAAAAAwAmAAAAAAALACkAAAAAAAMALgAAAAAAAwA2AAAAAABAADkA4IoertJovQEeAHAA AQAAADsAAABSRTogUmV0dXJuIG9mIHRoZSBkaXlfRUdPbWV0ZXIgKFlFUywgaXQncyBmaW5hbGx5 IEFMSVZFISEpAAACAXEAAQAAABYAAAABvWjSrha45rLW1QMR0b67AEAFXypvAAAeAB4MAQAAAAUA AABTTVRQAAAAAB4AHwwBAAAAGQAAAHBqYXJhbWF6QGluZ2VuaWNvLmNvbS5hdQAAAAADAAYQV1mD VQMABxCSBAAAHgAIEAEAAABlAAAASElBTEwsSVRISU5LSEVNRUFOU0pBWUNBUkVMRUNUUk9OSUNT LCs2MS0yLTk3NDMtNjE0NFRIRVlBUkVBSE9CQllJU1RTVE9SRUFORFNUT0NLQUZFV05JQ0VBVVRP TU9USVZFSwAAAAACAQkQAQAAAHMFAABvBQAA0ggAAExaRnUq+Gwm/wAKAQ8CFQKkA+QF6wKDAFAT A1QCAGNoCsBzZXTuMgYABsMCgzIDxgcTAoO6MxMNfQqACM8J2TsV/3gyNTUCgAqBDbELYG7wZzEw MxQgCwoS8gwBQmMAQCBIaSAHQGyGLAqFCoVJIHRoC4AyaxrQZSAHgAYiSmGkeWMKwUVsBZB0A2AB AwBjcywgKzYxAC0yLTk3NDMtAR6QNDQuIFRoZQ55GwAWABsAIGhvYnxieQQABUAgoAWwIAFu2mQg wmMckCAgZgfRHiGNIAF1IOAEYHRpdhzA8GtpdHMfdRHAIwEDkchFR08jIiAoAaAIYCEFQEFVUyQB 0CkgNwPwHFAgEWwLgBzAb2YOIBVyCHAJgCBMRUTbBCAcUGEFQAWgbiZgHeDxJ4FvIHkIYSRTEfAA gBsFsB9wUwNwHMBwZW8/C1AcwAuAIKAbERxBZW37KnEq8mkFwB1xBCAhMiPktCB2BAB1B0AqcWQe MB0nwGkCICaCK4RtaXjmdCcBI2EgQgnhHNMLgPJnKHJidQMQIVArARxD6S/wanUgoW4okCLgKeGY Oi0oG7YKhUFsKXA/HmADkQbwBIEr0Sqxb2eDClAvICgxOTk2JbAKcyBAdywRIFBDIL5kBRAjACRE AHAHQHkR8OUFwGEEIHdlKtE3MSAgfSAgMydCJNAdwABwHmBn/m8EcB5gBRARsCWwIwAR4H8tyBsA BuAjAB9wMl8zYUl7IVAmQGswwSiQC4Ad8WTqdSJRbTbhbC4RMaEwsf8mQCChI+Ev0hYAIlACMDbQ dx9wHDAsdUgzwgOgCFBtEwRhIPIoQTFQIEdNISW3MzgwMEHBIFb+Nj/HEcAhUCAgOPAbAD6yxyGg L9MwsUVDVTTBHpDgMzE1NzgGUizgIlEMbnUG0DPxMDEyMjFF4DA4KR5gRYBrQtogCeBwA2EfcEEx kCsBfwXAIfAbIDVgJoArYz50Z98j8inhICEhMifBZiuwIKH0KEgcMFASADcCIUEnoc0cgHMlsCEy aSdKUjah/mcnISiBTeAFQCYhItA6Jj8DYCKQJlEsFB1wJkBicn8tpCfxKqECMAQgJREfcEb/BbAi UE0xIUA9YC2zBAAgEfxwbwQQUGAqUQTwCfAKwL8twCtFIeAikCcBOv5DH6D/OcEbDwXAS/MbXFiP CrgmQOYxQpECAGktH0EN8AzQf1tDC1lFgAqgA2BMEB3gIL4tXWcKh1wbDDBc5kYDYX46Xm5c5gyC HTEpcAOgR/0J0mVeD18dBmACMGBPYVuzH5AIcHNkHVAeYEFIIB8DEUWAR5E08EXwOToxmjcTcE1i 718dVG9lL5NhWy1weV8NwGlAbUGJGUAyLgnwZy5vHGD8by0qoUwQbeA9UGkPY/44dWJqHdFrL2Fb UkX9cYBSEgAIcDoXbQIkYQeAYUwSKFlFUx5gI0AnHwQgS1A2sTbQE3BMSVYwRSEhKVlvWnMzNu9b 5xQiDAFc5lcnslLxMKK/NrBKgiFBRpU6NQWgbQqwfm4fwCixH9MqsUSjJPM/2xtcYiUuWP8KskQC ISMg/zGQB+A1UT4DN3J8sioVHFH/BCAeYDBABUBIsiphNYIkov8j8AtwC2BTkgNSSWFi1jo1/xWQ UDFH8B3IJrARwCqBIDD/g6MDoEGSJpEswQSQH8AAkP8ukAtgBcANsEZCf2ZA4QeR/yXTNcBH4Erj KtF8MoVhUVL8ZXgiUAUxHXAR8CEjKQn9CoVGI0BMECFQhWErQj2geCBYSgXwHUB9lSARefc3ETjw f2ZXBbBM0Dx0ICDfEbJIU4vUAhAFwCRFwIhy/39vCqNdb3d/W+caNVzmCoUFFSEAmhAAAwAQEAAA AAADABEQAAAAAEAABzAAXKZczmi9AUAACDAAXKZczmi9AR4APQABAAAABQAAAFJFOiAAAAAAAwAN NP03AAB8Iw== ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD6926.804940C0-- From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 21:11:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA06929 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 21:11:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA06925 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 21:11:29 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA27547 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 18:11:29 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 18:12:08 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35715632.67746937@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <01BD690B.A1B51D80@d85.syd1.zeta.org.au> In-Reply-To: <01BD690B.A1B51D80@d85.syd1.zeta.org.au> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id VAA06926 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Thu, 16 Apr 1998 07:45:27 +-1000, "A.HOLLEY" wrote: >Dont know how to tell you people this , but there is a kit available from one of the local electronics chains here in Aus of a very similar device. >Comes with PCB and all components except case and EGO sensor. >Fitted one in my XJS Jag about a yr ago. >Works like a charm. And all for $15 Aus. Golly, is there a lotto in Oz? Cuz if you got one of them circuits, which is dollars-to-donuts a O2 sensor voltage to LED/whatever meter circuit, to "work like a charm" for ya, you need to go down to the lotto office RIGHT NOW, and get some tickets! That company, BTW, (does the name Dick Smith ring a bell?), if it's the major one I'm thinking of, is a major boon to you aussies; electronics experimentation and kit building like they support has long since died in the US. I was overjoyed to get my first catalog from them (yes, they will take phone orders...I've done it, so it's no speculation...long distance from the US and NOT waste your time on the phone), they handle the monetary exchange just fine, and will put you on their catalog/flyer mailing list, all the way from OZ !! I kid you not. They even have serious, state-of-the-art radio receivers in kit form, you'd not find ANYWHERE in the US. But as far as an "equivalent" O2 meter for real, "well Virginia", as we say in the states, "...". It's not their fault. It was the best ANYBODY could do, reading the O2 sensor voltage directly from a conventional lambda sensor element, and trying to do something reasonable with it. Every aftermarket company like MSD followed suit, but THEY charged you $200 for something you could have built for $15 in parts, had you known what was in it. Well, now the neat thang is you CAN build one like a kit, only costing a few bucks more (course the O2 sensor's still a tad pricey, heh), and can REALLY use it as a measurement device. This isn't due to clever circuitry/wizardry, so much as it's due to this new technology of current-pump-mode 5-wire sensors. As a talisman on the viability of this $15 wonder from the land of Oz, just riddle me this; is the sensor it uses, 1-wire, 2-wire, 4-wire, or 5-wire. If it's anything but the last, and only costs $15 to build, it's a myth the likes of Sisyphus. Garfield the Septic Skeptic (refering to my vile viral guests, of course) P.S. Have you ever had your smog check station check the AFR numbers you read on your Jag's O2 meter? Not getting on yer case, AH, just wondering what your level of experience with these thangs is. Call me snoopy. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 22:01:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08170 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:01:31 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08166 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:01:28 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA28950 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:01:28 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:02:07 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35776580.71664046@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <01BD6926.804940C0@pjaramaz> In-Reply-To: <01BD6926.804940C0@pjaramaz> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id WAA08167 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:57:50 +1000, Peter Jaramaz wrote: >Also, Id like to introduce myself to the list having recently.... Hi Peter. Welcome to our crazy bunch of wackos. (self-incrimination). I think you'll be happy with our latest doozle on the O2 meter problem. Same cost to build, better stuff. Heh. I expect there'll be a group buy on the sensors that will lower the cost of the "main organ" considerably. Garfield From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 22:32:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08725 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:32:48 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08721 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:32:45 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe3-123.foothill.net [209.77.119.123]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA00336 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:34:24 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: J-bodies and DIS Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:31:40 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd68df$c94ffc60$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: ABTSZ To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 15, 1998 4:54 PM Subject: J-bodies and DIS Yep! Use 90-91 Camaro V6 wiring diagram. Speed Density (Map) >I've been looking thru manuals at the library and I have a few questions: >1: I was surprised to find that ALL j-body V-6s use DIS. From looking at the >diagrams, it seems that the DIS systems work some what on their own, and that >the only interaction with the ECM is the same as would be the case with a >7-pin HEI module. In other words, I could do away with the DIS (which would >require a crankshaft signal) and wire it up to a HEI module, and the computer >will still function. In other words (again) the Sync signal from the >crankshaft goes to the DIS module, but doesn't go to the ECM. The DIS module >just sends a regular pulse to the ECM, exactly as a HEI module would. Do you >know if this is correct? (my car already incorporates a 4-pin HEI module so >putting in a 7-pin would be pretty much Plug-n-Play.) > >2: I could find no reference to a VATS module in any of the wiring diagrams I >saw, so maybe those models (87-89 j-body v6 w/ 7730 ECM) don't use it. That >would be a plus! Of course this information may be wrong, Does anybody know >otherwise? > >Thanks for any info, >Adam > The J cars with Mass can not use Vats because they use the same input. As I said, Mass/Vats/and DIS go together in J cars and Map/HEI/No-Vats go in Camaro's. Both use 7730. Email mail me directly for all of the info you need. And listen to Mr. Fenske. See ya! TK From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 22:34:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08773 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:34:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08768 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:34:17 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe3-123.foothill.net [209.77.119.123]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA00468 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:35:57 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: GM 1227747 ECM drivers Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 19:33:13 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd68e0$00bd2240$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Or call it the "Johnson valve". >Don't worry about it too much. When language fails us, we can always >point and say "this thang here". > >Garfield > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 22:42:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA08903 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:42:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA08899 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:42:42 -0400 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn26-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.185]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA06260 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 21:39:40 -0400 Message-ID: <353572F9.25FE@huron.net> Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:54:49 -0400 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) References: <01BD690B.A1B51D80@d85.syd1.zeta.org.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu A.HOLLEY wrote: > > Dont know how to tell you people this , but there is a kit available from one of the local electronics chains here in Aus of a very similar device. > Comes with PCB and all components except case and EGO sensor. > Fitted one in my XJS Jag about a yr ago. > Works like a charm. And all for $15 Aus. > > ---------- > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > > Part 1.2 Type: application/ms-tnef > Encoding: base64 I would be willing to bet it uses a standard EGO - lot's of the beasties available here as well but basically useless as a calibration tool - not accurate at all. I could be wrong - Oz is a long ways from here - but double check - what kind of sensor does it use? If it hasn't got an ion pump, forget it mate. -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 22:47:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA09020 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:47:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA09016 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:47:28 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp146.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.146]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA18261; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:51:14 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:45:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Frederic Breitwieser cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: Ford PROMS (unsorted) In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980415194445.007a9b10@xephic.dynip.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > If you go to: > > ftp://xephic.dynip.com/ > > You'll get a list of available "virtual" directories, and you can download > the stuff. I unzipped it so there is a lot of "stuff" to download, however > I felt this was better than people trying to pull down an 88MB file. > Several people tried, and lost the download just before it finished. If > you use something like WSFTP or FTP Pro, etc, it makes it much easier to > download the entire directory. i think i have to do a visit down there (in your server),how busy is your system between midnight and 8 O'Clock in the morning ??? also,what's the size of the directory holding the files ( if 88 MB zipped,should be about 176 unzipped ???) Alain Toussaint From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 22:56:12 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA09220 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:56:12 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA09211 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:56:02 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp15.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.145]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id VAA01852 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 21:55:37 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <35357141.FF5E553A@mwt.net> Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 21:47:30 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <01BD690B.A1B51D80@d85.syd1.zeta.org.au> <35715632.67746937@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Don't lock and throw away the key on standard heated O2's . I still maintain that a heated O2 can be built to give fairly good results and remember they are cheap and can be found every where. Glad you got that O2 going looking forward to build the new meter in time . Steve garfield@pilgrimhouse.com wrote: > On Thu, 16 Apr 1998 07:45:27 +-1000, "A.HOLLEY" > wrote: > > >Dont know how to tell you people this , but there is a kit available > from one of the local electronics chains here in Aus of a very similar > device. > >Comes with PCB and all components except case and EGO sensor. > >Fitted one in my XJS Jag about a yr ago. > >Works like a charm. And all for $15 Aus. > > Golly, is there a lotto in Oz? Cuz if you got one of them circuits, > which is dollars-to-donuts a O2 sensor voltage to LED/whatever meter > circuit, to "work like a charm" for ya, you need to go down to the > lotto > office RIGHT NOW, and get some tickets! > > That company, BTW, (does the name Dick Smith ring a bell?), if it's > the > major one I'm thinking of, is a major boon to you aussies; electronics > > experimentation and kit building like they support has long since died > > in the US. I was overjoyed to get my first catalog from them (yes, > they > will take phone orders...I've done it, so it's no speculation...long > distance from the US and NOT waste your time on the phone), they > handle > the monetary exchange just fine, and will put you on their > catalog/flyer > mailing list, all the way from OZ !! I kid you not. They even have > serious, state-of-the-art radio receivers in kit form, you'd not find > ANYWHERE in the US. > > But as far as an "equivalent" O2 meter for real, "well Virginia", as > we > say in the states, "...". It's not their fault. It was the best > ANYBODY > could do, reading the O2 sensor voltage directly from a conventional > lambda sensor element, and trying to do something reasonable with it. > Every aftermarket company like MSD followed suit, but THEY charged you > > $200 for something you could have built for $15 in parts, had you > known > what was in it. > > Well, now the neat thang is you CAN build one like a kit, only costing > a > few bucks more (course the O2 sensor's still a tad pricey, heh), and > can > REALLY use it as a measurement device. This isn't due to clever > circuitry/wizardry, so much as it's due to this new technology of > current-pump-mode 5-wire sensors. > > As a talisman on the viability of this $15 wonder from the land of Oz, > > just riddle me this; is the sensor it uses, 1-wire, 2-wire, 4-wire, or > > 5-wire. If it's anything but the last, and only costs $15 to build, > it's > a myth the likes of Sisyphus. > > Garfield the Septic Skeptic (refering to my vile viral guests, of > course) > > P.S. Have you ever had your smog check station check the AFR numbers > you > read on your Jag's O2 meter? Not getting on yer case, AH, just > wondering > what your level of experience with these thangs is. Call me snoopy. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 22:58:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA09305 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:58:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA09301 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:58:58 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-35.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.53]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id WAA02793 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:58:02 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: J-bodies and DIS Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:58:44 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd68e3$91debb00$35198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: ABTSZ To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 15, 1998 7:54 PM Subject: J-bodies and DIS >I've been looking thru manuals at the library and I have a few questions: >1: I was surprised to find that ALL j-body V-6s use DIS. From looking at the diagrams, it seems that the DIS systems work some what on their own, and that the only interaction with the ECM is the same as would be the case with a 7-pin HEI module. In other words, I could do away with the DIS (which would require a crankshaft signal) and wire it up to a HEI module, and the computer will still function. In other words (again) the Sync signal from the >crankshaft goes to the DIS module, but doesn't go to the ECM. The DIS module just sends a regular pulse to the ECM, exactly as a HEI module would. Do you know if this is correct? (my car already incorporates a 4-pin HEI module so putting in a 7-pin would be pretty much Plug-n-Play.) 2: I could find no reference to a VATS module in any of the wiring diagrams I saw, so maybe those models (87-89 j-body v6 w/ 7730 ECM) don't use it. That would be a plus! Of course this information may be wrong, Does anybody know >otherwise? >Thanks for any info, >Adam The 730 was also used in 90-92 F-bodies, with a 7 pin distributor. Might dig a little there. Cheers Bruce Thought it was a family reunion, nope just a contruction zone Didn't look like much of party, they all had orange Cone Shaped Hats on.. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 15 23:08:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA09377 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 23:08:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mailhub.omen.com.au (root@mailhub.omen.com.au [203.8.107.50]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA09369 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 23:08:05 -0400 Received: from wattsgl2 (geoff@ttyE11.taipan.omen.com.au [203.55.58.76]) by mailhub.omen.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA22416 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:07:55 +0800 From: "wattsg" To: Subject: RE: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:08:18 +0800 Message-ID: <001401bd68e4$e8c504a0$LocalHost@wattsgl2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3007.0 In-Reply-To: <35715632.67746937@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> Importance: Normal Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The nice little meter we have over here in Oz just uses a NS dot/bar driver into some leds. It's purpose isn't to give you a smog check, or to help you tune your car to stoich. It's only use is to give you a relative indication, and the zero-point varies depending on EGT etc etc etc. So the sensor that's used (which is normally the factory one fitted to the car) is a 1-wire sensor (sometimes with heater). I personally use mine solely for warning me when it starts to get a bit lean under boost, and just to keep an eye on things. It's cool to see the ECU go closed-loop too :) geoff -----Original Message----- From: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu [mailto:owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu]On Behalf Of garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Sent: Thursday, April 16, 1998 9:12 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) On Thu, 16 Apr 1998 07:45:27 +-1000, "A.HOLLEY" wrote: >Dont know how to tell you people this , but there is a kit available from one of the local electronics chains here in Aus of a very similar device. >Comes with PCB and all components except case and EGO sensor. >Fitted one in my XJS Jag about a yr ago. >Works like a charm. And all for $15 Aus. Golly, is there a lotto in Oz? Cuz if you got one of them circuits, which is dollars-to-donuts a O2 sensor voltage to LED/whatever meter circuit, to "work like a charm" for ya, you need to go down to the lotto office RIGHT NOW, and get some tickets! That company, BTW, (does the name Dick Smith ring a bell?), if it's the major one I'm thinking of, is a major boon to you aussies; electronics experimentation and kit building like they support has long since died in the US. I was overjoyed to get my first catalog from them (yes, they will take phone orders...I've done it, so it's no speculation...long distance from the US and NOT waste your time on the phone), they handle the monetary exchange just fine, and will put you on their catalog/flyer mailing list, all the way from OZ !! I kid you not. They even have serious, state-of-the-art radio receivers in kit form, you'd not find ANYWHERE in the US. But as far as an "equivalent" O2 meter for real, "well Virginia", as we say in the states, "...". It's not their fault. It was the best ANYBODY could do, reading the O2 sensor voltage directly from a conventional lambda sensor element, and trying to do something reasonable with it. Every aftermarket company like MSD followed suit, but THEY charged you $200 for something you could have built for $15 in parts, had you known what was in it. Well, now the neat thang is you CAN build one like a kit, only costing a few bucks more (course the O2 sensor's still a tad pricey, heh), and can REALLY use it as a measurement device. This isn't due to clever circuitry/wizardry, so much as it's due to this new technology of current-pump-mode 5-wire sensors. As a talisman on the viability of this $15 wonder from the land of Oz, just riddle me this; is the sensor it uses, 1-wire, 2-wire, 4-wire, or 5-wire. If it's anything but the last, and only costs $15 to build, it's a myth the likes of Sisyphus. Garfield the Septic Skeptic (refering to my vile viral guests, of course) P.S. Have you ever had your smog check station check the AFR numbers you read on your Jag's O2 meter? Not getting on yer case, AH, just wondering what your level of experience with these thangs is. Call me snoopy. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 00:05:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA10184 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 00:05:31 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ingenico.com.au ([203.10.64.225]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA10180 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 00:05:23 -0400 Received: from pjaramaz [10.10.10.34] by ingenico.com.au [10.10.10.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP0.R) for ; Thu, 16 Apr 98 14:04:40 +1000 Received: by pjaramaz with Microsoft Mail id <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz>; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:02:45 +1000 Message-ID: <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> From: Peter Jaramaz To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:02:44 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD6940.547948E0" X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD6940.547948E0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Thanks, I've been called a wacko myself - and no, I don't have a single = whitw glove....... The aus kit is just a linear comparator type chip that takes a voltage = from your 1-3 wire sensor and displayes a coloured bar graph. I guess = the accuracy of the whole lot depends on the sensor being used - I've = got a magazine article on it at home somewhere. A good Aus magazine is = Sillicon Chip, a mag aimed at the elec hobbyist. They do feature quite a = few auto projects. They have a sister mag called Zoom which is oriented = towards the car enthusiest with the emphasis on hi tech and electronics. = Keep us informed. Peter=20 ---------- From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Sent: Thursday, April 16, 1998 12:02 PM To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) On Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:57:50 +1000, Peter Jaramaz wrote: >Also, Id like to introduce myself to the list having recently.... Hi Peter. Welcome to our crazy bunch of wackos. (self-incrimination). I think you'll be happy with our latest doozle on the O2 meter problem. Same cost to build, better stuff. Heh. I expect there'll be a group buy on the sensors that will lower the cost of the "main organ" considerably. 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Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:25:25 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <353694d7.346359@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> In-Reply-To: <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id BAA10906 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:02:44 +1000, Peter Jaramaz wrote: >A good Aus magazine is Sillicon Chip, a mag aimed at the elec hobbyist. >They do feature quite a few auto projects. Dang, ya know, that's where I saw that cool multiple-spark CDI IGN circuit recently. I can't remember if it was someone from THIS group or the aviation group that turned me onto Silicon Chip Mag, but I agree it's a good one. And they do these projects where Dick Smith carries the parts kit-up, so if you wanna built it, and you don't wanna do all the buying and etching yerself, you can order the ready-made board and parts list from DS. Very nice arrangement. Now if we could only do something like that in the US with this EGOmeter, eh? >They have a sister mag called Zoom which is oriented towards the car >enthusiest with the emphasis on hi tech and electronics. Hmmm, never heard of that one. Gotta check to see if them guys that import Silicon Chip can get it as well. Thanks for the tip. Gar From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 01:26:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA10942 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 01:26:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from m28.boston.juno.com (m28.boston.juno.com [205.231.101.186]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA10938 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 01:26:58 -0400 Received: (from cosmic.ray@juno.com) by m28.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id BWJ00431; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 01:25:06 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 00:15:44 -0400 Subject: Re: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup Message-ID: <19980416.012417.10790.1.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> References: <01bd6546$643edf40$18198fd1@nacelp> <19980414.230744.12726.3.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> <35345CB9.5DCD21E1@mcn.net> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-6,8,10-15,17-31,33-34,38-39,41-43 From: cosmic.ray@juno.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 15 Apr 1998 01:07:37 -0600 Shannen Durphey writes: >Raymond C Drouillard wrote: >> >> >> The module I have has five pins on one side and two on the other. The >> "two pin" side goes to the coil. Three pins on the "five pin" side go to >> the ECM (signal out, signal in, and a 5v level that will cause the ECM to >> be bypassed if it's missing). The other two pins go to the magnetic >> pickup coil in the distributer. I'm trying to feed the signal from a >> Motorcraft Duraspark distributer into those two pins. I tried both >> polarities. >> >> I would measure the voltage myself, but I don't have access to a 'scope. >> >> Ray Drouillard >> >I seem to remember that 5-7VAC is enough to trigger the >module. If you have a DVOM you can measure the voltage from >the distributor. > >Do you have the module powered up? One of the wires from >the coil is ign+ to turn on the module, the other is coil-. > >Shannen Uh...... ya busted me! That was indeed the problem with my first try . I couldn't get the GM distributer that I pulled the module from to fire it. A couple days later, it dawned on me that I need to "plug it in". I ran a wire from an ignition source to the "+" pin, hooked up the Holley, and tried it. It fired the Jacobs ignition, and the Holley dutifully injected fuel down the throttle body. Still, I can't get the Ford distributer to fire it. Maybe I'm missing something very basic (again) <:-) Ray Drouillard _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 02:04:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA11412 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 02:04:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA11408 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 02:04:56 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-013.mcn.net [208.26.146.13]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA23131 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 00:04:54 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <35359C9A.8591269@mcn.net> Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 23:52:26 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup References: <01bd6546$643edf40$18198fd1@nacelp> <19980414.230744.12726.3.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> <35345CB9.5DCD21E1@mcn.net> <19980416.012417.10790.1.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Raymond C Drouillard wrote: > > > That was indeed the problem with my first try . I > couldn't get the GM distributer that I pulled the module from to fire it. > > A couple days later, it dawned on me that I need to "plug it in". I ran > a wire from an ignition source to the "+" pin, hooked up the Holley, and > tried it. It fired the Jacobs ignition, and the Holley dutifully > injected fuel down the throttle body. > > Still, I can't get the Ford distributer to fire it. Maybe I'm missing > something very basic (again) <:-) ok... Need to connect the metal portion of the back to ground for complete circuit. Easy to overlook.... : ) Shannen Shannen From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 02:16:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA11638 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 02:16:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from wolfenet.com (root@frapp.wolfe.net [207.178.61.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA11633 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 02:16:24 -0400 Received: from gonzo.wolfenet.com (orin@gonzo.wolfenet.com [204.157.98.2]) by wolfenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id XAA24964 for ; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 23:16:23 -0700 (PDT) From: Orin Eman Received: (from orin@localhost) by gonzo.wolfenet.com (8.8.3/8.7) id XAA13785 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 23:16:23 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804160616.XAA13785@gonzo.wolfenet.com> Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 15 Apr 1998 23:16:23 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> from "Peter Jaramaz" at Apr 16, 98 02:02:44 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > The aus kit is just a linear comparator type chip that takes a voltage = > from your 1-3 wire sensor and displayes a coloured bar graph. I guess = LM3914 no doubt. I have a home built unit. I use it to make sure it isn't going lean under boost. I look forward to the new ion-pump based design! Orin. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 04:02:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA12523 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 04:02:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail1.uct.ac.za (exim@mail1.uct.ac.za [137.158.128.73]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA12516 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 04:02:13 -0400 Received: from mort by mail1.uct.ac.za with local (Exim 1.70 #2) id 0yPjcV-0007Oi-00; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:02:07 +0200 Received: by mail1.uct.ac.za (Mort 2.22) id 789 from ABOSCH@SPORTS; Thu Apr 16 10:02:06 1998 From: "A. Bosch" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:17:13 UTC-2 Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) X-Confirm-Reading-To: "A. Bosch" X-pmrqc: 1 Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail v3.22 Message-Id: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > When the project is ready, I could make an HTML tutorial of the entire > construction of the sensor box, where we can always have help for those > making it and we can even put people's add-ons for interfacing up there. > Let me know if anyone is interested in this idea? > Most definitely! Andrew Dr A. N. Bosch Physiology Department/ Sports Science Institute University of Cape Town Medical School P. O. Box 115 Newlands 7700 South Africa From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 08:23:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA14200 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 08:23:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA14192 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 08:22:58 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id IAA03423; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 08:22:57 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAD00249 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 08:21:55 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 08:21:55 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804161221.IAD00249@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980416000559.007aa620@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 00:05:59 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: winmail.dat files In-Reply-To: <199804160053.RAA00947@geocities.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >>Attachment Converted: C:\PROGRA~1\EUDORA\INFILES\WINMAIL.DAT Not to start a flame war, large discussion, or distract the list... however I think a lot of us would appreciate those of you running MS-Mail, MS-Outlook, or MS-Express if you could kindly turn off "Rich text format", "Mime", "Text Formatting" and other options that don't yield pure ascii to the DIYEFI list. In the MS products, you create an address book entry, and call it something like "DIYEFI" or whatever you prefer. Then for that address entry, you can turn all this "stuff" off, and send pure ascii. Whether you use the address book entry or not to send messages, MS products check the address book for the same internet address, and uses the same settings, so its no additional work on your part, other than to set it up. We appreciate it :) I bitched because I just wiped out approximately 75 megs of winmail.dat files, sequentually numbered :( Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 08:23:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA14199 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 08:23:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from webserver (brpt01-sh7-port164.snet.net [204.60.24.164]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA14190 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 08:22:57 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAC00249; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 08:21:52 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 08:21:52 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804161221.IAC00249@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980416000131.007aa620@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 00:01:31 -0700 To: Alain Toussaint From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: RE: Ford PROMS (unsorted) Cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.5.32.19980415194445.007a9b10@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >i think i have to do a visit down there (in your server),how busy is your >system between midnight and 8 O'Clock in the morning ??? Its not so busy during the day, eastern standard time. During the evening it starts to pick up with people getting their mail, surfing the web, and now, the FTP for the Ford ROM files. Plus, this webserver is my proxy server for my entire house - which means if I'm surfing, its much slower . And from 4am to 6am, the tape backup is running off another server in the house... but the Webserver is kinda busy passing its data to the other server. Its 100MB internal, so its not *that* slow on the internet. Something like 5-6% I'd esitmate. >also,what's the size of the directory holding the files ( if 88 MB >zipped,should be about 176 unzipped ???) Its a zipped CDROM, so unzipped, which is how I have it now, is approximately 500MB :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 09:35:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA15361 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 09:35:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bert.acesag.auburn.edu (bert.acesag.auburn.edu [131.204.46.47]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA15357 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 09:35:50 -0400 Received: from bert (bert [131.204.46.47]) by bert.acesag.auburn.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA27406 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 08:35:48 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 08:35:47 -0500 (CDT) From: "Gregory A. Parmer" X-Sender: gparmer@bert To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM 1227747 ECM drivers In-Reply-To: <355f08e1.47953484@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Not to be bothered with terms then, I can document a little based on last night's experimentation. Nothing like answering your own questions. The doomaflotchy in the middle switches the IAC lines. The 2 transistors on the side and closest to the connector switch the injector lines. The transistor farthest from the connector is apparently the 5V regulator for everything else, but that's a little bigger guess. I'll put up the details on my soon to be started personal diy-efi project page. -greg From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 10:15:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA15937 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:15:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kvikk.uit.no (kvikk.Uit.No [129.242.4.32]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA15933 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:14:58 -0400 Received: from mitra.phys.uit.no (mitra.Phys.Uit.No [129.242.28.41]) by kvikk.uit.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id QAA17627 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:14:54 +0200 (METDST) Received: from mitra.phys.uit.no (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by mitra.phys.uit.no (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA17518 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:14:53 +0200 (MET DST) Message-ID: <3536125C.41C6@phys.uit.no> Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:14:52 +0200 From: Hein Volden X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (X11; I; OSF1 V4.0 alpha) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: (no subject) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu which[hein@phys.uit.no] From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 10:23:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA16135 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:23:38 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA16131 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:23:37 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-30.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.99]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id KAA11210 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:22:44 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: GM 1227747 ECM drivers Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:23:24 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6943$36fe4240$63198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Gregory A. Parmer To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 16, 1998 10:13 AM Subject: Re: GM 1227747 ECM drivers >Not to be bothered with terms then, I can >document a little based on last night's >experimentation. Nothing like answering >your own questions. Hey, jus wait till ya can't even word the questions right. If ya think that's funny just wait.... > >The doomaflotchy in the middle switches >the IAC lines. I just luv it when the wording gets high tech, and I already have my cone shaped hat on.. > >The 2 transistors on the side and closest >to the connector switch the injector lines. > >I'll put up the details on my soon to be started >personal diy-efi project page. > >-greg > Bruce Lately I've learned how to sleep with my Cone Shaped Hat on...... From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 10:44:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA16601 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:44:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dns2.anl.gov (dns2.anl.gov [146.139.254.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA16597 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:44:08 -0400 From: lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov Received: from smtpgate.anl.gov (smtpgate.anl.gov [146.137.96.36]) by dns2.anl.gov (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id JAA13161 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 09:44:07 -0500 (CDT) Received: from ccMail by smtpgate.anl.gov (ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02) id AA892737846; Thu, 16 Apr 98 09:44:08 -0600 Message-Id: <9804168927.AA892737846@smtpgate.anl.gov> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Thu, 16 Apr 98 09:35:58 -0600 To: Subject: Re: J-bodies and DIS MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Yup...DIS is pretty much a stand alone system. However, I think the ECM handles cranking timing and knock retard control, both of which are then translated within the DIS module. If you can adapt an HEI module to work, I would think that would be sufficient. Also, there are no J-bodies, even the current ones, that use a VATS/Pass-Key system. From what I know, the Vette and F-bodies have it, along with maybe a truck (?). TTYL! Larry FWIW, I used to have an 89 Z24...no VATS! ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: J-bodies and DIS Author: at internet Date: 4/15/98 7:01 PM Hi, I am going to try and modify the system from a J-body v6 '87-'89 to work on my car, a non-GM 6 cyl. I've been looking thru manuals at the library and I have a few questions: 1: I was surprised to find that ALL j-body V-6s use DIS. From looking at the diagrams, it seems that the DIS systems work some what on their own, and that the only interaction with the ECM is the same as would be the case with a 7-pin HEI module. In other words, I could do away with the DIS (which would require a crankshaft signal) and wire it up to a HEI module, and the computer will still function. In other words (again) the Sync signal from the crankshaft goes to the DIS module, but doesn't go to the ECM. The DIS module just sends a regular pulse to the ECM, exactly as a HEI module would. Do you know if this is correct? (my car already incorporates a 4-pin HEI module so putting in a 7-pin would be pretty much Plug-n-Play.) 2: I could find no reference to a VATS module in any of the wiring diagrams I saw, so maybe those models (87-89 j-body v6 w/ 7730 ECM) don't use it. That would be a plus! Of course this information may be wrong, Does anybody know otherwise? Thanks for any info, Adam From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 10:48:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA16685 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:48:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dns2.anl.gov (dns2.anl.gov [146.139.254.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA16681 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:48:06 -0400 From: lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov Received: from smtpgate.anl.gov (smtpgate.anl.gov [146.137.96.36]) by dns2.anl.gov (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id JAA13299 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 09:48:06 -0500 (CDT) Received: from ccMail by smtpgate.anl.gov (ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02) id AA892738083; Thu, 16 Apr 98 09:48:06 -0600 Message-Id: <9804168927.AA892738083@smtpgate.anl.gov> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Thu, 16 Apr 98 09:39:04 -0600 To: Subject: Re[2]: Projection MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I wouldn't do this at all. From what I recall, the EGR feed is through the center two exhaust ports in the head. So, assuming the intake manifold is properly restricted to bias the flow through the intake in one direction...you will only be reading the O2 output from two cylinders. If you stick an injector in one of these cylinders and get a rich reading at the O2 sensor, and the ECM leans out ALL the injectors...you will be running very lean...which is not a good thing. TTYL! Larry ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: RE: Projection Author: at internet Date: 4/15/98 5:53 PM Not a bad idea, can anyone verify if this is feasible with the Chev TPI as well. Dan dzorde@geocities.com >Well, I did it. I purchased a Holley 4D system for my 351W-powered boat. > >I've changed my mind (again) and will try and fit the O2 sensor somehow. > Question: My EGR port (Edelbrock Performer manifold) is blanked off. A >perhaps stupid question, but does anyone have a feel for whether there >would be enough 'fresh' exhaust (now there's a concept), perhaps due to >firing order pulsation, that sensing the EGR port for O2 content would >work? My own intuition is telling me to try and figure out a more >conventional solution... > >Thanks, > >Mike Jones > > >Attachment Converted: C:\PROGRA~1\EUDORA\INFILES\WINMAIL.DAT > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 11:24:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA17368 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:24:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA17363 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:24:20 -0400 Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id LAA07998; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:24:20 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp130.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.130]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA27265; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:28:16 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:22:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Frederic Breitwieser cc: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: winmail.dat files In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980416000559.007aa620@xephic.dynip.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > We appreciate it :) yep,sure i'll apreciate !!!! > I bitched because I just wiped out approximately 75 megs of winmail.dat > files, sequentually numbered :( you should take a look at how *nix (linux) mail client handle these,cryptic message to say the least !!! Alain From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 11:56:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA17855 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:56:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA17850 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:56:15 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-30.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.99]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id LAA10576 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:55:20 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Did I miss anyone?. Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:56:02 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6950$27cba6c0$63198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I think I've finally caught up with all the volunteers, for the 101 project. If I have not returned a e-mail to you some how ya got lost in the shuffle here, and please write again. If you've had a change in heart and want to help share info, again my e-mail is nacelp@bright.net Thanks Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 12:39:37 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA18672 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:39:37 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mozart.bcit.bc.ca (aix4.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.189.164]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA18668 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:39:33 -0400 Received: from Unknown (cardinal.seet.bcit.bc.ca [142.232.147.60]) by mozart.bcit.bc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA17548 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 09:38:06 -0700 Message-Id: <199804161638.JAA17548@mozart.bcit.bc.ca> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Peter Fenske" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 09:41:14 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: J-bodies and DIS Priority: normal In-reply-to: <9804168927.AA892737846@smtpgate.anl.gov> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.53/R1) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi All Non of the J bodies implemented vats. However the newer speed density ones using the 730 ecm did have VATS in the code. It was simply not enabled. I like using the j -body harness for all applications They run a ton of wire. So you end up shortening the wires. Lots of room for most V8 apps. Adapting the hei is easy Only prob we had was using a DIS cal You guys can use the 3.1 L 90 camaro cal to interface to the HEI dist. Not sure why the DIS cal won't work directly. we tried but??? wouldn't run right. I don't think it was a spark ref angle problem. More like the signal was inverted.. later:peter From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 12:51:49 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA18844 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:51:49 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from cbgw1.lucent.com (cbgw1.lucent.com [207.24.196.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA18840 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:51:47 -0400 Received: from emsr1.emsr.lucent.com by cbig1.firewall.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-L sol2) id MAA08042; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:50:54 -0400 Received: by emsr1.emsr.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-1.2 Solaris/emsr) id MAA02556 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu.smtp; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:51:35 -0400 From: kkk@pace10.wh.lucent.com Received: by emsr1.emsr.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-1.2 Solaris/emsr) id MAA02485 for efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu!diy_efi; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:51:29 -0400 Original-From: kkk@pace10.lucent.com To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Received: from kkk by pace10.wh.lucent.com (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA21673; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:47:31 -0400 Message-Id: <35363574.D7FE33F6@pace10.wh.lucent.com> Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:44:36 -0400 Original-From: Ken Kelly Organization: Lucent Technologies X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en]C-EMS-1.3.1 (WinNT; U) Mime-Version: 1.0 Original-To: efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu!diy_efi Subject: Re: J-bodies and DIS References: <9804168927.AA892737846@smtpgate.anl.gov> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The Impala with LT1 engine also uses VAT. The 94 police cars actually had a VAT disable module because they didn't incorporate VAT in the key. Ken lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov wrote: > > Yup...DIS is pretty much a stand alone system. However, I think the > ECM handles cranking timing and knock retard control, both of which > are then translated within the DIS module. If you can adapt an HEI > module to work, I would think that would be sufficient. > > Also, there are no J-bodies, even the current ones, that use a > VATS/Pass-Key system. From what I know, the Vette and F-bodies have > it, along with maybe a truck (?). > > TTYL! > > Larry > > FWIW, I used to have an 89 Z24...no VATS! > > ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ > Subject: J-bodies and DIS > Author: at internet > Date: 4/15/98 7:01 PM > > Hi, > I am going to try and modify the system from a J-body v6 '87-'89 to work on my > car, a non-GM 6 cyl. > I've been looking thru manuals at the library and I have a few questions: > 1: I was surprised to find that ALL j-body V-6s use DIS. From looking at the > diagrams, it seems that the DIS systems work some what on their own, and that > the only interaction with the ECM is the same as would be the case with a > 7-pin HEI module. In other words, I could do away with the DIS (which would > require a crankshaft signal) and wire it up to a HEI module, and the computer > will still function. In other words (again) the Sync signal from the > crankshaft goes to the DIS module, but doesn't go to the ECM. The DIS module > just sends a regular pulse to the ECM, exactly as a HEI module would. Do you > know if this is correct? (my car already incorporates a 4-pin HEI module so > putting in a 7-pin would be pretty much Plug-n-Play.) > > 2: I could find no reference to a VATS module in any of the wiring diagrams I > saw, so maybe those models (87-89 j-body v6 w/ 7730 ECM) don't use it. That > would be a plus! Of course this information may be wrong, Does anybody know > otherwise? > > Thanks for any info, > Adam > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 13:38:49 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA19803 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 13:38:49 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [205.139.62.192]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA19795 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 13:38:45 -0400 Received: (qmail 9536 invoked from network); 16 Apr 1998 11:38:42 -0600 Received: from ts5-15.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.123) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 16 Apr 1998 11:38:42 -0600 Received: by ts5-15.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD692B.B57DC270@ts5-15.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 11:35:08 -0700 Message-ID: <01BD692B.B57DC270@ts5-15.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Re[2]: Projection Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 09:58:00 -0700 Encoding: 29 TEXT, 53 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu One of my concerns as well. The marine installation manual indicates that the proper position is in one of the individual exhaust runners, just before it enters the water cooled exhaust manifold. This doesn't seem like a good idea either (although if you chose one farthest away from the TB you would improve your chances of having the inboard cylinders running rich, which is better than lean at least). Also, that means that the sensor would have to be mounted upside down, which is supposedly not good for long term health of the sensor. So I dunno. Maybe I'll go back to plan A which is to not use the sensor at all. It's easy enough, though, to install the sensor. I think what I'll do is tune it w/o the sensor (as the manual describes) then hook up the sensor. If performance noticeably decreases or if I pick up a lean stumble then I'll know that the sensor is in the wrong place. Mike J. >>lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov wrote: I wouldn't do this at all. From what I recall, the EGR feed is through the center two exhaust ports in the head. So, assuming the intake manifold is properly restricted to bias the flow through the intake in one direction...you will only be reading the O2 output from two cylinders. If you stick an injector in one of these cylinders and get a rich reading at the O2 sensor, and the ECM leans out ALL the injectors...you will be running very lean...which is not a good thing. TTYL! Larry>> begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(@@2`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M6)E``@0`0```&4```!/3D5/1DU9 M0T].0T523E-!4U=%3$Q42$5-05))3D5)3E-404Q,051)3TY-04Y504Q)3D1) M0T%415-42$%45$A%4%)/4$524$]3251)3TY)4TE.3TY%3T942$5)3D1)5DE$ M54%,``````(!"1 !````S00``,D$```W" ``3%I&=>_'/*'_``H!#P(5`J0# MY 7K`H,`4!,#5 (`8V@*P'-E="XR!@`&PP*#,@]Z:&6B; ,@1&QG`H,S`\;+ M!Q,"@S04KV8U`\4"`-APP6YU8P= 'S%D:6,?L >1=)\1P 5 (2 < MX!>0;W $D/TAH&\`D!_#! `?,1SP'-0C(7(@@G9I9"!"97B%$ L(&HDLF(-P 6POQ\A!4 )\"#@$> A8W<@T?\%P 6@!O )@"1G`X$& MD ;P)F0>8R*Q9&\'D&XG`P5 $?!E;2!L:6MQ'.!A(&0A@'5!W+ `1\",#9@K (7$DP6%/)R =0 -2 M(6-40BR#=]<(8"C0'S!M(;%V'. LD?\G81' '8$$(!T!$< D`!K@[R-U!N + M$1U0>2I () FHM\D\C%B!1 1L"5@=RDP$;#_(J(ET ) (?$A(0.@)[ #D1S4S'V!U!M GL$Q40 -K_SOP!^ W7B*T)N,# M8#%Q"U'7'9 >8$/<32I22D/-"O01*D Q.# "T6DM,3PT- WP#-!8PQNO(#[R M/@M*,38<<@J@`V @X IC-9%K"'!E:T!ST&UT<&<@T2X`8$X!+)(?8%#2`Y$+@/YJ7#%00B+Z M+0$R: !P)]#^9Q(`:+LJD#."=9-#O='EU Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA19836 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 13:40:27 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dns2.anl.gov (dns2.anl.gov [146.139.254.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA19832 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 13:40:26 -0400 From: lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov Received: from smtpgate.anl.gov (smtpgate.anl.gov [146.137.96.36]) by dns2.anl.gov (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id MAA19442; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:40:08 -0500 (CDT) Received: from ccMail by smtpgate.anl.gov (ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02) id AA892748407; Thu, 16 Apr 98 12:40:09 -0600 Message-Id: <9804168927.AA892748407@smtpgate.anl.gov> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Thu, 16 Apr 98 12:31:31 -0600 To: , , Subject: How does an increase in GPS relate to power output? MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Guys: Quick question for you all.... Before we make it back to a dyno, is there any way to calculate an increase in power from an increase in MAF readings (GPS)? Here is why I ask. A buddy of mine (Brian) just did a head/cam swap and showed a pretty decent increase in airflow from his previous runs. He went from 252 GPS to 294 GPS (if I remember this correctly) from Diacom readings (could be off since he has a 96...which Diacom has a bit of trouble working with). When we made the earlier reading, he was at the dyno where he made 255 RWHP. Now, if I do a simple percent of increase in airflow and multiply by his old HP...I get 298 RWHP. Does this work, or are there other factors I need to take into account? The air pressure now was higher, but the air temperature was lower than when he made his dyno run. Now...the monkey wrench. On the SAME day he was at the dyno, I was as well. I made 278 RWHP with only 264 GPS airflow readings. So, if I do an interpolation using these numbers, I end up with nearly 400 RWHP he will be making. Now, the 298hp above seems a bit light, but the 400 seems high (would be nice if it is correct though). So, first of all, does anyone have a formula that predicts power output based on airflow in GPS? Second, I assume it isn't a linear relationship based on the above....but should it be? Any feedback would be appreciated! Larry Kurek BTW..please copy my Lkurek@anl.gov address so I can get your response ASAP. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 14:49:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA20772 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:49:05 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bear.wattscc.org (root@1Cust118.max8.dallas.tx.ms.uu.net [153.35.179.246]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA20767 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:49:01 -0400 Received: from millenia.wattscc.org (comp0.1.168.192.in-addr.arpa [192.168.1.10] (may be forged)) by bear.wattscc.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA03843 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 13:48:47 -0500 Message-ID: <007001bd6968$4816a200$0a01a8c0@millenia.wattscc.org> From: "Matthew B. Watts" To: Subject: Re: winmail.dat files Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 13:32:19 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Frederic Breitwieser To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 16, 1998 7:50 AM Subject: winmail.dat files >Not to start a flame war, large discussion, or distract the list... however >I think a lot of us would appreciate those of you running MS-Mail, >MS-Outlook, or MS-Express if you could kindly turn off "Rich text format", >"Mime", "Text Formatting" and other options that don't yield pure ascii to >the DIYEFI list. >In the MS products, you create an address book entry, and call it something >like "DIYEFI" or whatever you prefer. Then for that address entry, you can >turn all this "stuff" off, and send pure ascii. Whether you use the >address book entry or not to send messages, MS products check the address >book for the same internet address, and uses the same settings, so its no >additional work on your part, other than to set it up. Plus, if you reply to the list, set your mailer to send in the same format as received--I think that's an option for Outlook, maybe others as well. >We appreciate it :) From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 14:53:46 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA20822 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:53:46 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.33]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA20818 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:53:45 -0400 Received: from fiat ([12.69.33.56]) by mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA20991 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 18:53:41 +0000 Message-ID: <009701bd6968$dfe230e0$3821450c@fiat> From: "Scott Flanagan" To: Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:52:53 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Great, let me know if there is any way you want the interface/layout to be. Also, where do we want to put it? We could maybe put it on the DIY_EFI web page, let me know who to contact about that, or I can get some free space somewhere, Tripod runs an excelent service. I would like to see more things like this in the group, there is so much knowledge in this group that needs a place so it can be easily accessed by it's members. The FTP site is clumsy and archaic. We could put lots of reference materials, and other circuits, whatever on the web. I would be happy to help out with this process. Maybe set the overall layout, which is the toughest thing to do. Making is compatible for all browsers is tough, and I might be able to talk my friend into making some nice graphics for it. We both are making the homepage for our high school, www.mindspring.com/~brookwoodhigh/ Through the web we can make a lot of information easily accessible. -Scott Flanagan >IMNSHO, this is an eXcellent idea/offer! I'll prepare an ops description >of the circuit internals, so if someone wants to do some further mods, >this could also speed their learning curve. Nuthin complicated about the >circuit, and even if you don't want to do mods, it's still nice to >see/understand how it works. Don't have to be an EE to enjoy that part >of it, eh? Maybe a family tree of mutant diy_EGOs will sprout from this, >um, fertile ground. Heh. Now if Newark would just deliver my one >remaining errant part, we could launch the party! (sound of foot-tapping >in the background). > >Gar > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 14:55:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA20868 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:55:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA20864 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 14:55:30 -0400 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn47-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.206]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA20373 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 13:52:33 -0400 Message-ID: <35365725.79F2@huron.net> Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 15:08:21 -0400 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM 1227747 ECM drivers References: <01bd6943$36fe4240$63198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > > -----Original Message----- > From: Gregory A. Parmer > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Date: Thursday, April 16, 1998 10:13 AM > Subject: Re: GM 1227747 ECM drivers > > >Not to be bothered with terms then, I can > >document a little based on last night's > >experimentation. Nothing like answering > >your own questions. > > Hey, jus wait till ya can't even word the questions right. > If ya think that's funny just wait.... > > > >The doomaflotchy in the middle switches > >the IAC lines. > > I just luv it when the wording gets high tech, and I already > have my cone shaped hat on.. > > > >The 2 transistors on the side and closest > >to the connector switch the injector lines. > > > >I'll put up the details on my soon to be started > >personal diy-efi project page. > > > >-greg > > > Bruce Lately I've learned how to sleep with my Cone Shaped > Hat on...... Sounds like the explanation given for the sudden noisy death of a customers car engine - The hammer shaft jumped over the giggling pin. -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 15:04:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA21018 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 15:04:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [205.139.62.192]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA21013 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 15:04:06 -0400 Received: (qmail 29878 invoked from network); 16 Apr 1998 13:04:03 -0600 Received: from ts5-15.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.123) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 16 Apr 1998 13:04:03 -0600 Received: by ts5-15.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD6937.A1CE46D0@ts5-15.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 13:00:29 -0700 Message-ID: <01BD6937.A1CE46D0@ts5-15.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: 4D installation Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 13:00:26 -0700 Encoding: 7 TEXT, 35 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu So wadda y'all think? The 600 cfm carb had a 1" aluminum spacer under it. Do I use it w/ the 4D I'm installing? I've forgotten why the spacer is there. Is it to improve the metering signal to the carb or is it for runner tuning, i.e. to lower the rpm at which peak power occurs? Sheesh. Getting old. My CSH is getting rusty. Mike J. begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(AT4`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M`!X,`0````4```!33510```` M`!X`'PP!````&0```')M:F]N97- 8WEB97)H:6=H=V%Y+FYE= `````#``80 M>KO0*P,`!Q#_````'@`($ $```!E````4T]7041$05E!3$Q42$E.2S]42$4V M,#!#1DU#05)"2$%$03$B04Q534E.54U34$%#15)53D1%4DE41$])55-%2517 M+U1(131$24U)3E-404Q,24Y'/TE6149/4D=/5%1%3E=(60`````"`0D0`0`` M`+,!``"O`0``0@(``$Q:1G6;]=AC_P`*`0\"%0*D`^0%ZP*#`% 3`U0"`&-H M"L!S970N,@8`!L,"@S(/>FAEHFP#($1L9P*#,P/%<0(`<')Q$B '$P* ?7\* M@ C/"=D"@ J!#;$+8&[P9S$P,Q20"PH4D@P!!F,-X 8`;R!W861@9&$@>2<' M0 ,@=()H"X!K/R @5!/ V" V,!I &B!M'$ *P"1B(!' 9" :T#$BFQT0"D!M M"X =D"!S"K B8P20('5N!($@:=1T+ANP1!IP21Y@$?";'L$:@"\;01OP-$0? M0'8G'' +@',!D!/@"X!G&QNA((!V&_ "$')G;^<"0 GP&H!H>2 #'@4$`+<@ M`A;0'O%)!" ?L70:<%IN'D%T'G A,2P>P"XW(^$D@19@=RA"&^%R\4<2`%9T)<(&\&0>\4TB MH$-T4T@C8F Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA21569 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 15:32:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA21565 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 15:31:59 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp125.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.125]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA00773 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 15:36:01 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 15:29:46 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: DIY list Subject: A FREE 25 MILLION! (fwd) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu does there is a subscriber to this list who's domain name is hk.super.net or something like that,my last posting i did is to this list and (the only 2 list i post is this list and the debian-user list and i hasn't posted on the debian list since saturday),also,is there other person who receive spam from this site,i allready took some action for this a**hole but i'd like to know where is that come from. Alain ---------- Forwarded message ---------- Return-Path: Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca ([127.0.0.1]) by main with esmtp id m0yPq8P-0008ZkC (Debian Smail-3.2 1996-Jul-4 #2); Thu, 16 Apr 1998 10:59:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from atlnet.atlonline.com (atlnet.atlonline.com [207.153.72.193]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id DAA21375 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 03:04:25 -0400 (EDT) From: majordomo@hk.super.net Message-Id: <199804160704.DAA21375@mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca> Received: from smtp.atlonline.com [207.153.72.41] by atlnet.atlonline.com (SMTPD32-4.03) id A18615B01F8; Wed, 15 Apr 1998 22:48:38 EST To: Friend@public.com Date: Wed, 15 Apr 98 22:23:48 EST Subject: A FREE 25 MILLION! X-UIDL: a6b5ac758d9f4a7f12f4b29daf10b1ab Please excuse the intrusion. YES! A FREE 25 MILLION E-mail Addresses at your disposal!!!! If you have a business that needs E-mail addresses, I have some good news for you! If you have checked out E-mail services before, you probably have found out they are very expensive to buy! Like $200 for 2,000 E-mail addresses! That is ridiculous!! Well, I have wonderful news for you! For only a ONE TIME FEE of only $5.00, I will send you 250 MILLION Legitimate E-mail Addresses!! How could you lose on this one? But BEWARE, SUPPY IS LIMITED, so hurry and send your one time fee of $5.00 (cash or money order only) and I will E-mail you your 250 MILLION addresses!! INSTRUCTIONS: Make sure the cash is concealed by wrapping it in at least two sheets of paper! On one of those sheets of paper write "FREE E-MAIL" and include your name and E-mail address and I will send them to you the same day received! SEND YOUR ORDER IMMEDIATELY TO: Cynthia Parker 638 Wood Hollow Drive Marietta, GA 30067 HURRY! DON'T DELAY, at this price they are going SUPER FAST!! From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 15:48:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA21852 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 15:48:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from vcc11.vcc.bc.ca (vcc11.vcc.bc.ca [207.102.127.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA21848 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 15:48:32 -0400 Received: (from jimd@localhost) by vcc11.vcc.bc.ca (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id MAA30194; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:48:32 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 12:48:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Davies To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM 1227747 ECM drivers In-Reply-To: <35365725.79F2@huron.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Thu, 16 Apr 1998, Clare Snyder wrote: > > Hey, jus wait till ya can't even word the questions right. > > If ya think that's funny just wait.... > > > > > >The doomaflotchy in the middle switches > > >the IAC lines. > > > > I just luv it when the wording gets high tech, and I already > > have my cone shaped hat on.. > > > > Sounds like the explanation given for the sudden noisy death of a > customers car engine - The hammer shaft jumped over the giggling pin. > -- Just today I saw a failed transmission in which the bull gear had jumped the heifer shaft. Very messy... From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 16:22:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA22449 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:22:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from emerald.tufts.edu (pmdf@emerald.tufts.edu [130.64.1.16]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA22445 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:22:08 -0400 Received: from tufts.edu (st1254.tc.tufts.edu) by emerald.tufts.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #23568) with ESMTP id <0ERI00O3RWKRKS@emerald.tufts.edu> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:22:03 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:22:07 -0400 From: Andris Skulte Subject: Re: How does an increase in GPS relate to power output? To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, lkurek@anl.gov Message-id: <3536686F.1E262FBB@tufts.edu> X-Envelope-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <9804168927.AA892748407@smtpgate.anl.gov> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov wrote: > > airflow and multiply by his old HP...I get 298 RWHP. Does this work, > or are there other factors I need to take into account? The air > pressure now was higher, but the air temperature was lower than when > he made his dyno run. I doubt it's a linear relationship, but it is accurate for improvements in the same car. The GPS shows exactly how much air your engine is using, which can give you the volumetric efficiency. It depends on what your fuel mixture is, but if you keep things the same, and the GPS goes up, you are making more power. Sorry I couldn't help any more.. A From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 16:25:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA22507 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:25:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo30.mx.aol.com (imo30.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.74]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA22503 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:25:23 -0400 Received: from ABTSZ@aol.com by imo30.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8SKVa26228 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:24:45 -0400 (EDT) From: ABTSZ Message-ID: Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:24:45 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: J-bodies and DIS Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA22686 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:33:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA22682 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:33:16 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-20.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.38]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id QAA13517 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:32:22 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: 4D installation Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:33:06 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6976$dc84f3c0$26198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Mike Jones To: 'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu' Date: Thursday, April 16, 1998 3:35 PM Subject: 4D installation >So wadda y'all think? The 600 cfm carb had a 1" aluminum spacer under it. > Do I use it w/ the 4D I'm installing? I've forgotten why the spacer is >there. Is it to improve the metering signal to the carb or is it for >runner tuning, i.e. to lower the rpm at which peak power occurs? Sheesh. > Getting old. My CSH is getting rusty. > >Mike J. > IMHE, It's a matter of cylinder filling/reversion damping, tuned lenghts and moon phases. But keeping the same plenum volume/runner lenghts from Carb to TBI has worked out well for me. Also the best air filter/housing wound up being the same. I tried optimizing all variables, as much as possible, and the same combination worked from carb to TBI. But, they were right to begin with.. On some of the weber carb'd stuff some engines liked a certain tuned lenght, with the jets/venturis a certain distance from the intake valve, ie some like long stacks on the carbs with no spacers, and some liked really short stacks with long spacers between the carb, and manifold. Not a worry Bruce Imagine a world where everyone wore a Cone Shaped Hat proudly.... From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 16:40:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA22863 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:40:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo17.mx.aol.com (imo17.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA22853 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:40:16 -0400 Received: from ABTSZ@aol.com by imo17.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8YLVa06445 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:39:38 -0400 (EDT) From: ABTSZ Message-ID: Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 16:39:38 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: J-bodies and DIS Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu In a message dated 98-04-16 15:01:01 EDT, you write: << Not sure why the DIS cal won't work directly. we tried but??? wouldn't run right. I don't think it was a spark ref angle problem. More like the signal was inverted.. >> According to the chilton manuals, The crank sensor sends twice as many pulses to the DIS as would a HEI to the ECM. The Chilton then implies that the DIS cuts the number of impulses in half and then sends them to the ECM. This would be the same number of impulse going to the ECM as in an HEI system. BUT they aren't actually "pulses". I'm not sure how to describe it, but I'll try to "draw" it: HEI system: _____[]_____[]_____[]_____[] etc. DIS: ______ ______ _____[ ]_____[ ]______ etc. At least that's the impression I got. SO if I convert a J-body system to HEI, I will need a F-body prom with VATS disabled. Thanks for the info, Adam From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 20:04:50 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA24629 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:04:50 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lnagate.foxboro.com.au (lnagate.foxboro.com.au [202.12.113.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA24625 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:04:46 -0400 X-Received: (qmail 25124 invoked from network); 16 Apr 1998 23:57:25 -0000 Received: from foxlnqtc.foxboro.com.au (HELO foxboro.com.au) (202.12.112.10) by gatekeeper.foxln.com.au with SMTP; 16 Apr 1998 23:57:25 -0000 Received: from wayneb-nt (fwserver [202.12.112.56]) by foxboro.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA25634 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 09:57:24 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980417095723.0092dce0@qtc-mail> X-Sender: wayneb@qtc-mail X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 09:57:23 +1000 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Wayne Blair Subject: diy_EGOmeter Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi EGO meter gru's, Well I'm keen to build one and the html tutorial would be great. The Down under factor maybe a draw back. We may have to build our own boards hw etc. And find a local source for the sensor. The OZ guys interested maybe should link up when the time comes and the info is published, or can we link in with the US bulk parts buy . In ref to DELCO PROGRAMMING 101 Does any one know of a list/reference of data/info/features on DELCO ECU's sorted according to program ID (usually at addr 0x08) instead of HW platform (eg 747). Which is the best way to organise the info, platform or prog id or something else. Any ideas etc please mail list or direct wayne From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 20:11:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA24708 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:11:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo29.mx.aol.com (imo29.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.73]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA24704 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:11:29 -0400 Received: from ABTSZ@aol.com by imo29.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8QGIa24124 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:10:51 +2000 (EDT) From: ABTSZ Message-ID: <8491d7d.35369e0c@aol.com> Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:10:51 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi, I've been told different things by different people about whether J-body V6s are MAF or MAP. According to the schematics I've seen, some are MAF and some are MAP based on different years and\or models. The manuals I have only go up to '90, however. Does anyone know if any J-bodies are MAP based, and what years or models? I don't know if I should trust the Chilton manuals I've been lookin at or not. Also, If all I can find is a MAF based system with a 7730 ECM, is this difficult to convert to MAP? I realize I'd have to get a prom for a MAP based care (F-body V6). What about the wiring to the MAP? Is there "vestual" wiring in the harness? Adam From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 20:36:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA24965 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:36:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bear.wattscc.org (root@1Cust83.max8.dallas.tx.ms.uu.net [153.35.179.211]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA24956 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:36:52 -0400 Received: from millenia.wattscc.org (comp0.1.168.192.in-addr.arpa [192.168.1.10] (may be forged)) by bear.wattscc.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA04171 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 19:36:49 -0500 Message-ID: <007401bd6998$e6b4dc80$0a01a8c0@millenia.wattscc.org> From: "Matthew B. Watts" To: Subject: Re: Web posting of vital info Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 18:44:02 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Scott Flanagan To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 16, 1998 3:01 PM Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) >Great, let me know if there is any way you want the interface/layout to be. >Also, where do we want to put it? We could maybe put it on the DIY_EFI web >page, let me know who to contact about that, or I can get some free space >somewhere, Tripod runs an excelent service. I would like to see more things >like this in the group, there is so much knowledge in this group that needs >a place so it can be easily accessed by it's members. The FTP site is >clumsy and archaic. We could put lots of reference materials, and other >circuits, whatever on the web. I would be happy to help out with this >process. Maybe set the overall layout, which is the toughest thing to do. >Making is compatible for all browsers is tough, and I might be able to talk >my friend into making some nice graphics for it. We both are making the >homepage for our high school, www.mindspring.com/~brookwoodhigh/ Through >the web we can make a lot of information easily accessible. Hey Scott, Some tips for the layout... Have an area for "Special Projects" such as the EGOmeter and hopefully many others of past and to follow. Another area for "Contributors" having a little bio information and what not. A third area for "Links" to other similar or participating Web sites such as Fred's Automotive Website. Maybe an area up front that has an introduction and mail list basics. As far as compatibility, I'd target mid to upper end browsers. Don't use DHTML, ActiveX or XML--too specific and too new for many. Since anyone can download a free copy of Netscape 4.04 or there abouts, to run on most any machine, I'd make sure the site works with that. I think JavaScript for the menus and such will probably work out okay. For images I'd probably use links instead of just dropping them in any ol' place. That way the "text" folks can still get the info they're after and the download speeds will be faster. If frames are used, keep them simple so that the individual HTML files can still be accessed easily with direct links. Just my twin pennies worth... Matt ________ From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 20:36:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA24964 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:36:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bear.wattscc.org (root@1Cust83.max8.dallas.tx.ms.uu.net [153.35.179.211]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA24957 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:36:52 -0400 Received: from millenia.wattscc.org (comp0.1.168.192.in-addr.arpa [192.168.1.10] (may be forged)) by bear.wattscc.org (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA04174 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 19:36:50 -0500 Message-ID: <007501bd6998$e6ffa120$0a01a8c0@millenia.wattscc.org> From: "Matthew B. Watts" To: Subject: Re: A FREE 25 MILLION! (fwd) Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 18:53:40 -0500 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Alain Toussaint To: DIY list Date: Thursday, April 16, 1998 3:01 PM Subject: A FREE 25 MILLION! (fwd) >does there is a subscriber to this list who's domain name is hk.super.net >or something like that,my last posting i did is to this list and (the only >2 list i post is this list and the debian-user list and i hasn't posted on >the debian list since saturday),also,is there other person who receive >spam from this site,i allready took some action for this a**hole but i'd >like to know where is that come from. It may be one of those auto email scouters that hunt down mass email addresses and happened to find the DIY_EFI list as a valid address. I've had several mail lists like this one begin to get scattered with junk. Maybe we can have filters added that are a little more strict in where the originator comes from. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 21:22:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA25975 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:22:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp1.erols.com (smtp1.erols.com [207.172.3.234]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA25971 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:22:14 -0400 Received: from mkupec.erols.com (207-172-73-26.s26.tnt1.man.erols.com [207.172.73.26]) by smtp1.erols.com (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA19159 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:22:14 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <00c401bd699f$daab0700$0280a8c0@mkupec.erols.com> From: "Michael J. Kupec" To: Subject: Re: 4D installation Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:26:27 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Mike Jones To: 'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu' Date: Thursday, April 16, 1998 3:54 PM Subject: 4D installation >So wadda y'all think? The 600 cfm carb had a 1" aluminum spacer under it. > Do I use it w/ the 4D I'm installing? I've forgotten why the spacer is >there. Is it to improve the metering signal to the carb or is it for >runner tuning, i.e. to lower the rpm at which peak power occurs? Sheesh. > Getting old. My CSH is getting rusty. Mike, The way I always understood it, the plate (if it is the 4-hole type) helps in improving the metering signal(s) in the carb at high RPM. Since you really don't have any metering signals to worry about with the TBI - you should be able to leave the plate off and bolt the TBI right to the intake. If you look at the TBI you'll notice that it really doesn't have a venturi type shape to it like the carb does, just a straight shot down to the throtle plates. The vaccum hoses that attach to the TBI do provide the necessarry vacuum signals to the specific hardware (i.e.: vacuum advance) but don't need the spacer plate to provide this. HTH Michael J. Kupec mkupec@erols.com I live with constant fear and danger every day... and sometimes she lets me go four-wheeling! Get in, Sit down, Shut up, and Hold on! It's a Bronco thing, They wouldn't have a clue! Management & Data Systems, Lockheed Martin Corporation Woodbridge, Virginia, USA (703) 680-6903 1970 Bronco w/351W (in a constant state of dissassembly/refinement...) 1964 1/2 260 Convertible w/PS, PB, & Power Top 1965 289 HP "K" Coupe w/PS, PB, & Pony Int. (Early '65, not a GT) From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 21:44:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA26318 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:44:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA26313 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:44:20 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-6.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.24]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id VAA04039 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:43:25 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Sites Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:40:49 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd69a1$d940ddc0$70198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu There seem to be a fair amount of interest in this which I think is a good thing, but I think a bit early. The O2 looks to be close to a done deal, and the 101 is hardly off the ground. As for making it accessible, MHO is make it for the lowest common denomenator. The trouble with this whole net thing is that it is soo computer related. I read posts about settings for e-mail that I have to write to other folks to find out what the heck people are even talking about. The whole purpose of 101 is to put the info in a format where any one tuning in can figure out where we're at. For the average Joe who is better with a wrench then a keyboard. The EE, and software types can do this stuff, but we ain't all wired that way. If this ain't tech enough for you then there's 332. Heck I can't even read the stuff. They have it so wrapped up in zip'd slp'd dkkmeng'd dkmgnd"d, that it's only for the club that understands the language. Please what ever ya do keep it accessible for everyone. Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 22:00:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA26790 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 22:00:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from solomon (solomon.ij.net [207.22.166.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA26786 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 22:00:41 -0400 Received: from [209.4.43.64] by solomon (NTMail 3.02.13) with ESMTP id ea018490 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:59:23 -0400 From: "Jesse R. Ortiz" To: Subject: Fueltronics? Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 22:01:03 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd69a4$ad06d0e0$402b04d1@jr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu If anyone here has any experience with the Fueltronics TCC3, or any of the other Turbo Control Centeres, could you please E-mail me? I would like to know what anyone thought/thinks of it, especially the additional Injector controller part of it... Please e-mail with any info.... It would be very much appreciated.... jr From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 23:16:10 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA27973 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 23:16:10 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (pop3.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA27969 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 23:16:05 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-50.foothill.net [209.77.119.50]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA11535 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:17:32 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 20:14:56 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd69ae$ff5309e0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mass systems had map too. Therefore on the Mass needs to be added. The EGR (digital or linear) may be different. HEI or DIS is slightly different. -----Original Message----- From: ABTSZ To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 16, 1998 6:05 PM Subject: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF > Hi, > I've been told different things by different people about whether J-body V6s >are MAF or MAP. According to the schematics I've seen, some are MAF and some >are MAP based on different years and\or models. The manuals I have only go up >to '90, however. > Does anyone know if any J-bodies are MAP based, and what years or models? I >don't know if I should trust the Chilton manuals I've been lookin at or not. > Also, If all I can find is a MAF based system with a 7730 ECM, is this >difficult to convert to MAP? I realize I'd have to get a prom for a MAP based >care (F-body V6). What about the wiring to the MAP? Is there "vestual" >wiring in the harness? > >Adam > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 16 23:32:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA28174 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 23:32:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from m28.boston.juno.com (m28.boston.juno.com [205.231.101.186]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA28170 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 23:32:13 -0400 Received: (from cosmic.ray@juno.com) by m28.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id XaG00431; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 23:30:06 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 22:28:48 -0400 Subject: Re: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup Message-ID: <19980416.232926.12654.0.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> References: <01bd6546$643edf40$18198fd1@nacelp> <19980414.230744.12726.3.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-6,8,10-11,13,15-25,34-36 From: cosmic.ray@juno.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 15 Apr 1998 23:52:26 -0600 Shannen Durphey writes: >Raymond C Drouillard wrote: >> > >> >> That was indeed the problem with my first try . I >> couldn't get the GM distributer that I pulled the module from to fire it. >> >> A couple days later, it dawned on me that I need to "plug it in". I ran >> a wire from an ignition source to the "+" pin, hooked up the Holley, and >> tried it. It fired the Jacobs ignition, and the Holley dutifully >> injected fuel down the throttle body. >> >> Still, I can't get the Ford distributer to fire it. Maybe I'm missing >> something very basic (again) <:-) > >ok... Need to connect the metal portion of the back to >ground for complete circuit. Easy to overlook.... : ) >Shannen I know the value of good grounding (I'm a ham radio operater). I actually mounted the module to the top cover of an old (inoperative) hard drive. I wire brushed the finish off and used aluminum screws to securely bolt the module to the aluminum. Then, I used sheet metal screws to mount the whole assembly to the top of the right fender well. Not being satisfied, I ran a ground wire from one of the mounting screws (the same one that I used for the ground wire of the ECM connecter) to the one common grounding screw that I have on my right fender well that ties the battery and just about everything else together. Ray Drouillard _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 00:52:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA29277 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 00:52:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ultra2.syspac.com (ultra2.syspac.com [204.96.14.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA29273 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 00:52:51 -0400 Received: from mailrelay.syspac.com ([204.96.14.7]) by ultra2.syspac.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-37030U5000L500S0) with ESMTP id AAA15492 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:50:25 -0700 Received: from p57058.syspac.com (p57113.syspac.com [204.181.57.113]) by mailrelay.syspac.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA15484 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:50:20 -0700 (MST) From: bamcknig@postoffice.syspac.com Message-Id: <199804170450.VAA15484@mailrelay.syspac.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 21:54:09 +0000 Subject: Re: diy_EGOmeter Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Wayne (Australia) Looking for Subaru manual(s). Impreza with EJ-20 engine. 2 liter DOHC intercooled(water) EFI. Need Engine and Engine Electrical. I think that is manual 2 and 6. Bob McKnight Phx AZ From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 01:15:46 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA29643 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 01:15:46 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp1.mailsrvcs.net (smtp1.gte.net [207.115.153.30]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA29639 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 01:15:44 -0400 Received: from paulb3 (1Cust41.tnt1.hilo.hi.gt.uu.net [208.255.248.41]) by smtp1.mailsrvcs.net with SMTP id AAA13170 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 00:15:33 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3536E46C.149E@gte.net> Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 19:11:08 -1000 From: "Paul E. Bueltmann III" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup References: <01bd6546$643edf40$18198fd1@nacelp> <19980414.230744.12726.3.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> <35345CB9.5DCD21E1@mcn.net> <19980416.012417.10790.1.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Raymond C Drouillard wrote: > > On Wed, 15 Apr 1998 01:07:37 -0600 Shannen Durphey > writes: > >Raymond C Drouillard wrote: > >> > >> > >> The module I have has five pins on one side and two on the other. The > >> "two pin" side goes to the coil. Three pins on the "five pin" side go > to > >> the ECM (signal out, signal in, and a 5v level that will cause the ECM > to > >> be bypassed if it's missing). The other two pins go to the magnetic > >> pickup coil in the distributer. I'm trying to feed the signal from a > >> Motorcraft Duraspark distributer into those two pins. I tried both > >> polarities. > >> > >> I would measure the voltage myself, but I don't have access to a > 'scope. > >> > >> Ray Drouillard > >> > >I seem to remember that 5-7VAC is enough to trigger the > >module. If you have a DVOM you can measure the voltage from > >the distributor. > > > >Do you have the module powered up? One of the wires from > >the coil is ign+ to turn on the module, the other is coil-. > > > >Shannen > > Uh...... ya busted me! > > That was indeed the problem with my first try . I > couldn't get the GM distributer that I pulled the module from to fire it. > > A couple days later, it dawned on me that I need to "plug it in". I ran > a wire from an ignition source to the "+" pin, hooked up the Holley, and > tried it. It fired the Jacobs ignition, and the Holley dutifully > injected fuel down the throttle body. > > Still, I can't get the Ford distributer to fire it. Maybe I'm missing > something very basic (again) <:-) > > Ray Drouillard > > _____________________________________________________________________ > You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. > Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com > Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] I mesured a five and two wire module and I got 3.8 volts at the c anf + pin at low rpm and 5.75 ant higher rpm hope this helps later paulb3@gte.net From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 01:28:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA29811 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 01:28:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA29807 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 01:28:31 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-034.mcn.net [208.26.146.34]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA08934 for ; Thu, 16 Apr 1998 23:28:30 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3536E591.A77DE7BC@mcn.net> Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 23:16:01 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Output of distributer's magnetic pickup References: <01bd6546$643edf40$18198fd1@nacelp> <19980414.230744.12726.3.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> <19980416.232926.12654.0.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Raymond C Drouillard wrote: > > On Wed, 15 Apr 1998 23:52:26 -0600 Shannen Durphey > writes: > >Raymond C Drouillard wrote: > >> > > > >> > >> That was indeed the problem with my first try . > I > >> couldn't get the GM distributer that I pulled the module from to fire > it. > >> > >> A couple days later, it dawned on me that I need to "plug it in". I > ran > >> a wire from an ignition source to the "+" pin, hooked up the Holley, > and > >> tried it. It fired the Jacobs ignition, and the Holley dutifully > >> injected fuel down the throttle body. > >> > >> Still, I can't get the Ford distributer to fire it. Maybe I'm missing > >> something very basic (again) <:-) > > > >ok... Need to connect the metal portion of the back to > >ground for complete circuit. Easy to overlook.... : ) > >Shannen > > I know the value of good grounding (I'm a ham radio operater). I > actually mounted the module to the top cover of an old (inoperative) hard > drive. I wire brushed the finish off and used aluminum screws to > securely bolt the module to the aluminum. Then, I used sheet metal > screws to mount the whole assembly to the top of the right fender well. > Not being satisfied, I ran a ground wire from one of the mounting screws > (the same one that I used for the ground wire of the ECM connecter) to > the one common grounding screw that I have on my right fender well that > ties the battery and just about everything else together. > > Ray Drouillard > > Couldn't be much more complete than that. Only other step is to get a dvom and a helper and measure output voltage from the distributor while the engine is cranking. I'll try to find time tomorrow (like I've been trying the last two days) to find some Motorcraft distributor info. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 07:01:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA32397 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 07:01:47 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.snip.net ([208.211.64.8]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA32393 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 07:01:44 -0400 Received: from phillya144.snip.net ([208.211.74.144]) by mail.snip.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) ID# 103-45128U8000L3500S0) with SMTP id AAA128 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 07:01:15 -0400 Received: by phillya144.snip.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD69CE.A8865FC0@phillya144.snip.net>; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 07:01:34 -0500 Message-ID: <01BD69CE.A8865FC0@phillya144.snip.net> From: Pete Datcuk To: "EFI List (E-mail)" Subject: Northstar Date: Thu, 16 Apr 1998 18:18:05 -0500 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id HAA32394 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I wrote a while back looking for information on the electronics of this drivetrain. Someone out there wrote back offering help, but I have lost his address/name. If you are out there, please drop me a line. Pete Datcuk Mechanical Engineer Sewell, NJ '87 Fiero, some day to be Northstar'ed :-) '67 Jeep Commando, to be risen from the dead ;-) From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 10:46:50 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA01113 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 10:46:50 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lennier.qonline.com.au (root@lennier.qonline.com.au [203.103.144.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA01109 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 10:46:45 -0400 Received: from bernie (sinclair.qonline.com.au [203.103.236.104]) by lennier.qonline.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA03392 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 00:49:48 +1000 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980418004617.007aa3e0@mail.qonline.com.au> X-Sender: mharding@mail.qonline.com.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 00:46:17 +1000 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Matthew Harding Subject: Re: How does an increase in GPS relate to power output? In-Reply-To: <9804168927.AA892748407@smtpgate.anl.gov> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu At 12:31 PM 4/16/98 -0600, you wrote: > > Guys: > > Quick question for you all.... > > Before we make it back to a dyno, is there any way to calculate an > increase in power from an increase in MAF readings (GPS)? Here is why > I ask. A buddy of mine (Brian) just did a head/cam swap and showed a > pretty decent increase in airflow from his previous runs. He went from > 252 GPS to 294 GPS (if I remember this correctly) from Diacom readings > (could be off since he has a 96...which Diacom has a bit of trouble > working with). When we made the earlier reading, he was at the dyno > where he made 255 RWHP. Now, if I do a simple percent of increase in > airflow and multiply by his old HP...I get 298 RWHP. Does this work, > or are there other factors I need to take into account? The air > pressure now was higher, but the air temperature was lower than when > he made his dyno run. > > Now...the monkey wrench. On the SAME day he was at the dyno, I was as > well. I made 278 RWHP with only 264 GPS airflow readings. So, if I do > an interpolation using these numbers, I end up with nearly 400 RWHP he > will be making. Now, the 298hp above seems a bit light, but the 400 > seems high (would be nice if it is correct though). So, first of all, > does anyone have a formula that predicts power output based on airflow > in GPS? Second, I assume it isn't a linear relationship based on the > above....but should it be? > > Any feedback would be appreciated! > > Larry Kurek > > BTW..please copy my Lkurek@anl.gov address so I can get your response > ASAP. The difference in the relative GPS/RWHP ratio of yours and your friends car is due to the efficiency of the two engines at burning the air/feul mixture, this results from factors such as copression ratio , combustion chamber shape/size etc, etc. if you had the figures for the RPM at which the peak HP and GPS were reached, then you could possibly make an estimation of the new HP reading. eg. if the first peak reading was obtained at for example 5000 rpm then you would need the new GPS reading for that rpm... if the rpm at which the new reading was obtained has varied dramatically, then it would be back to the dyno.... ask your dyno guy to print you a graph of GPS vs RPM, and RPM vs HP, then next time you'll be able to estimate better no matter what RPM the new GPS figure appears at. From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 10:51:58 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA01178 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 10:51:58 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lennier.qonline.com.au (root@lennier.qonline.com.au [203.103.144.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA01173 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 10:51:55 -0400 Received: from bernie (sinclair.qonline.com.au [203.103.236.104]) by lennier.qonline.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA03412 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 00:54:56 +1000 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> X-Sender: mharding@mail.qonline.com.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 00:51:25 +1000 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Matthew Harding Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: <199804160616.XAA13785@gonzo.wolfenet.com> References: <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu At 11:16 PM 4/15/98 -0700, you wrote: > >> The aus kit is just a linear comparator type chip that takes a voltage = >> from your 1-3 wire sensor and displayes a coloured bar graph. I guess = > >LM3914 no doubt. I have a home built unit. I use it to make sure >it isn't going lean under boost. > >I look forward to the new ion-pump based design! > >Orin. Yep, you're right on the chip. I've built around 12 of these, and they are being used in road and racing applications, and seem to work great. I'll be intersted in any new design you may have, as I've got more people wanting these. From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 11:13:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA01522 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:13:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA01518 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:13:05 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-22.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.91]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.8.7/8.8.7/FNG) with SMTP id LAA06206 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:12:11 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: GM Bins/ecm Q's Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:12:56 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6a13$4cc454e0$5b198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On the flash prom pcm's is that all 1024 file lenght stuff?. Would any one happen to have a bin of one that I could see?. Also, if anyone has any 256, and 512 file lenght bins I'd like to see some of them. I'm working on figuring out how the aussie ecms compare to ours. It would also be neat if you included the application (engine size/no. cyl/tranny type/year/model, and best yet a Broadcast code). No worries mate Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 11:36:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA01959 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:36:47 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com [198.133.22.42]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA01933 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:36:43 -0400 Received: from relay3.server.ibm.com (relay3.server.ibm.com [9.14.2.100]) by smtp3.ny.us.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA20756 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:29:42 -0400 Received: from US.IBM.COM (d04lms02.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.164.194]) by relay3.server.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA100646 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:32:28 -0400 Received: by US.IBM.COM (Soft-Switch LMS 2.0) with snapi via D04AU004 id 5040200014110825; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:39:49 -0400 From: Jason Greene To: Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Message-ID: <5040200014110825000002L052*@MHS> Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:39:49 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > >LM3914 no doubt. I have a home built unit. I use it to make sure >it isn't going lean under boost. > >I look forward to the new ion-pump based design! > >Orin. Yep, you're right on the chip. I've built around 12 of these, and they are being used in road and racing applications, and seem to work great. I'll be intersted in any new design you may have, as I've got more people wanting these. I posted this before but I'm not sure if it went through, so here it is again. Jason G. http://www.students.tut.fi/~eppu/dev/EGO-bar.html From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 11:38:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA02021 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:38:25 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from users.qual.net (users.qual.net [207.25.206.25]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA02017 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:38:24 -0400 Received: from gary (clv-shv2-06.cyberdrive.net [207.25.201.75]) by users.qual.net (8.8.8/8.8.8/CICnet/IAG) with SMTP id LAA27444 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:39:45 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <001f01bd6a16$1cdfdda0$4bc919cf@gary> From: "Gary Derian" To: Subject: Re: 4D installation Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:32:35 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The plate increases the plenum volume so each cylinder can pull from all 4 barrels. This makes an underside carb flow better. Gary Derian >So wadda y'all think? The 600 cfm carb had a 1" aluminum spacer under it. > Do I use it w/ the 4D I'm installing? I've forgotten why the spacer is >there. Is it to improve the metering signal to the carb or is it for >runner tuning, i.e. to lower the rpm at which peak power occurs? Sheesh. > Getting old. My CSH is getting rusty. > >Mike J. > > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 11:56:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA02508 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:56:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA02503 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:56:09 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA537 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 08:56:10 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 08:56:50 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35c277b6.123961296@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id LAA02504 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Sat, 18 Apr 1998 00:51:25 +1000, Matthew Harding wrote: >Yep, you're right on the chip. I've built around 12 of these, and they are >being used in road and racing applications, and seem to work great. I'll >be intersted in any new design you may have, as I've got more people >wanting these. As I've said before, there's gonna be a stipulation in the permission to use the circuit, that you not be making use of the circuit for profit-making purposes, without express written permission. Make as many for you and your pals, AT COST, that you want, but you start selling them for a profit, and yer name'll be mud, bud. Just a reminder. Garfield From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 13:04:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA03984 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 13:04:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from dns2.anl.gov (dns2.anl.gov [146.139.254.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA03980 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 13:04:06 -0400 From: lkurek@smtpgate.anl.gov Received: from smtpgate.anl.gov (smtpgate.anl.gov [146.137.96.36]) by dns2.anl.gov (8.8.7/8.6.11) with SMTP id MAA16015 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 12:04:06 -0500 (CDT) Received: from ccMail by smtpgate.anl.gov (ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02) id AA892832645; Fri, 17 Apr 98 12:04:08 -0600 Message-Id: <9804178928.AA892832645@smtpgate.anl.gov> X-Mailer: ccMail Link to SMTP R6.00.02 Date: Fri, 17 Apr 98 11:56:19 -0600 To: Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Whoa...time out on this. Like I said, I had an 89 Z24, and it didn't have VATS and it was a MAP only system. However, I just swapped an 89 Camaro 2.8 into my S10, and not only did it NOT have DIS or VATS, it also has a MAF sensor. Funny thing is, the MAF isn't a hotwire type...it has what looks like a thermistor or something in the airstream, and the circuit board is internally mounted, also in the airstream. FYI, it kind of ticked me off to find the Camaro motor still had HEI and a MAF. After the Z24, I came to realize the joys of DIS!!! TTYL! Larry Kurek ______________________________ Reply Separator _________________________________ Subject: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF Author: at internet Date: 4/16/98 8:10 PM Hi, I've been told different things by different people about whether J-body V6s are MAF or MAP. According to the schematics I've seen, some are MAF and some are MAP based on different years and\or models. The manuals I have only go up to '90, however. Does anyone know if any J-bodies are MAP based, and what years or models? I don't know if I should trust the Chilton manuals I've been lookin at or not. Also, If all I can find is a MAF based system with a 7730 ECM, is this difficult to convert to MAP? I realize I'd have to get a prom for a MAP based care (F-body V6). What about the wiring to the MAP? Is there "vestual" wiring in the harness? Adam From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 13:08:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA04054 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 13:08:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha2.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.111]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA04050 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 13:08:29 -0400 Received: from CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha1.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.1]) by CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA31794 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 18:13:38 +0100 (BST) Received: from [136.148.36.156] by CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (5.65v4.0/1.1.10.5/06Nov96-0356PM) id AA16320; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 18:07:24 +0100 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980417170923.006751c0@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Sender: cameroa@unix.sbu.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 18:09:23 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Gus Cameron Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu At 08:56 17/04/98 -0700, you wrote: >On Sat, 18 Apr 1998 00:51:25 +1000, Matthew Harding > wrote: > >>Yep, you're right on the chip. I've built around 12 of these, and they are >>being used in road and racing applications, and seem to work great. I'll >>be intersted in any new design you may have, as I've got more people >>wanting these. > >As I've said before, there's gonna be a stipulation in the permission to >use the circuit, that you not be making use of the circuit for >profit-making purposes, without express written permission. > >Make as many for you and your pals, AT COST, that you want, but you >start selling them for a profit, and yer name'll be mud, bud. > >Just a reminder. > >Garfield Garfield, What a star you are. I'd love to be able to offer electrical expertese but it's all I can do to read instructions and use a soldering iron properly. However, I may be able to offer free web space. If this would be of use let me know. Lets pull this one off. Gus Cameron. From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 14:14:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA05258 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 14:14:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA05253 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 14:14:16 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA6848 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:14:16 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 11:14:56 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35c59611.131732265@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <1.5.4.32.19980417170923.006751c0@unix.sbu.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980417170923.006751c0@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id OAA05254 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Fri, 17 Apr 1998 18:09:23 +0100, Gus Cameron wrote: >What a star you are. I'd love to be able to offer electrical expertese but >it's all I can do to read instructions and use a soldering iron properly. >However, I may be able to offer free web space. If this would be of use let >me know. >Lets pull this one off. Yeah, sure. A 'star'. Now that's a hoot. Reminds me of the commercial where the guy sees this meteorite coming in his telescope, realizes he has only a few minutes before the earth is toast, decides his last meal will be quick steak on the barby (it's a commercial for steak sauce). So anyway, he's relishing his "last bite" as the meteor smacks the ground right next to him, and it turns out to be about the size of a charcoal briquette (his telescope may have exaggerated things, ya see). Hee hee. He just smiles, shrugs, and goes on enjoying his steak. Thas the kinda star I am, ya know, briquette size, so put yer accolades away and save em for someone like Princess Di or whoever. Garfield Willis (sadly not related to Bob Willis, a REAL star) P.S. Hey, waitaminuto, you're a Brit! Say, I wonder if you could do me a favor, and look about to see if Subaru in England sells/imports into yer fine country a model of the Soobs called the Imprezza, that has a 2.0L DOHC 4banger in it. There are supposedly two variants, a normally aspirated type, jus refered to as the Imprezza 2.0 (I think), and a turbo'd version that's popular in Euro for hot-rodding, called the Imprezza WRX, both 2.0L DOHC. Reason I'm asking if these are cars imported into your country, is that engine ISN'T imported into the US domestically, and we've got a couple guys in our aviation group that are tryna get manuals for the engine part of the car (we CAN get the engines from Jap engine importers, ya know the ones that have only bout 30K mi on them). We can't even order the manuals from here, cuz they aren't listed in the US price list, but if they knew an English speaking country where they could at least get the Subaru part no. off the cover of the manual, we could order the manuals via. the part no. directly from Subaru/Japan (our local dealer thinks they could pull that off, if they only new the part no.). Soooo, if you could possibly determine just if these cars ARE in merry ole England, we could research the rest from there. Be a huge help. TIA. From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 17:17:27 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA06842 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 17:17:27 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from zed.ludd.luth.se (zed.ludd.luth.se [130.240.16.33]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA06838 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 17:17:23 -0400 Received: from sister.ludd.luth.se (rotax@sister.ludd.luth.se [130.240.16.77]) by zed.ludd.luth.se (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA25980 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 23:17:21 +0200 From: "Daniel R. Henriksson" Received: (rotax@localhost) by sister.ludd.luth.se (8.6.11/8.6.11) id XAA16971 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 23:17:20 +0200 Message-Id: <199804172117.XAA16971@sister.ludd.luth.se> Subject: Rom images? To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 23:17:20 +0200 (MET DST) In-Reply-To: <01bd6a13$4cc454e0$5b198fd1@nacelp> from Bruce Plecan at "Apr 17, 98 11:12:56 am" X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4ME+ PL15 (25)] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Where can i find rom images from a GM ECM 1227749? I need one from a 4 cyl. and one from a 6 cyl. Regards Daniel Henriksson From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 19:13:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA08002 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 19:13:41 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha2.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.111]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA07997 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 19:13:37 -0400 Received: from CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha1.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.1]) by CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id AAA31763 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 00:18:49 +0100 (BST) Received: from [136.148.36.156] by CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (5.65v4.0/1.1.10.5/06Nov96-0356PM) id AA31845; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 00:12:35 +0100 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980417231434.00671678@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Sender: cameroa@unix.sbu.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 00:14:34 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Gus Cameron Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu At 11:14 17/04/98 -0700, Garfield wrote: > >Yeah, sure. A 'star'. Now that's a hoot. snip >Garfield Willis (sadly not related to Bob Willis, a REAL star) > >P.S. Hey, waitaminuto, you're a Brit! Say, I wonder if you could do me a >favor, and look about to see if Subaru in England sells/imports into yer >fine country a model of the Soobs called the Imprezza, that has a 2.0L >DOHC 4banger in it. There are supposedly two variants, a normally >aspirated type, jus refered to as the Imprezza 2.0 (I think), and a >turbo'd version that's popular in Euro for hot-rodding, called the >Imprezza WRX, both 2.0L DOHC. > >Reason I'm asking if these are cars imported into your country, is that >engine ISN'T imported into the US domestically, and we've got a couple >guys in our aviation group that are tryna get manuals for the engine >part of the car (we CAN get the engines from Jap engine importers, ya >know the ones that have only bout 30K mi on them). We can't even order >the manuals from here, cuz they aren't listed in the US price list, but >if they knew an English speaking country where they could at least get >the Subaru part no. off the cover of the manual, we could order the >manuals via. the part no. directly from Subaru/Japan (our local dealer >thinks they could pull that off, if they only new the part no.). Soooo, >if you could possibly determine just if these cars ARE in merry ole >England, we could research the rest from there. Be a huge help. TIA. > > I'm a Scot actually Jimmie, and a biker to boot, but I'll see what I can dig up. The Imprezza is over here, Colin McRay (another Scot) won the World Rally Championship in it I think (remember, I'm a bike boy) but WRX? I'll have to ask. I could even get the manual and send it out. Would a Hanes manual be good enough or is it the full Monty or nothing? Toodle-pip old chum, gus ;-) From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 20:45:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA08578 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 20:45:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA08574 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 20:45:50 -0400 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn13-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.172]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id TAA05261 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 19:42:56 -0400 Message-ID: <3537F85D.427A@huron.net> Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 20:48:29 -0400 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF References: <01bd69ae$ff5309e0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu TBK wrote: > > Mass systems had map too. Therefore on the Mass needs to be added. The EGR > (digital or linear) may be different. HEI or DIS is slightly different. > > -----Original Message----- > From: ABTSZ > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Date: Thursday, April 16, 1998 6:05 PM > Subject: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF > > > Hi, > > I've been told different things by different people about whether J-body > V6s > >are MAF or MAP. According to the schematics I've seen, some are MAF and > some > >are MAP based on different years and\or models. The manuals I have only go > up > >to '90, however. > > Does anyone know if any J-bodies are MAP based, and what years or models? > I > >don't know if I should trust the Chilton manuals I've been lookin at or > not. > > Also, If all I can find is a MAF based system with a 7730 ECM, is this > >difficult to convert to MAP? I realize I'd have to get a prom for a MAP > based > >care (F-body V6). What about the wiring to the MAP? Is there "vestual" > >wiring in the harness? > > > >Adam > > There were so many problems with the MASS sensors that GM developed the speed-density prom rather than replace the mass sensors. Many vehicles with the mass installed don't use it at all. Eventually they stopped installing it. -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 21:30:50 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA09052 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 21:30:50 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA09048 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 21:30:47 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-2.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.71]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id VAA25250 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 21:29:51 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 21:30:38 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6a69$977b6a40$47198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Clare Snyder To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Friday, April 17, 1998 9:22 PM Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF >TBK wrote: >> Mass systems had map too. Therefore on the Mass needs to be added. The EGR >> (digital or linear) may be different. HEI or DIS is slightly different. >> Subject: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF . According to the schematics I've seen, some are MAF and some are MAP based on different years and\or models. The manuals I have only go up to '90, however. >> > Does anyone know if any J-bodies are MAP based, and what years or models? >> >Adam >> > >There were so many problems with the MASS sensors that GM developed the >speed-density prom rather than replace the mass sensors. Many vehicles >with the mass installed don't use it at all. Eventually they stopped >installing it. >-- You wouldn't happen to have a TSB number on when they were doing this would you?. Or a part no for the wire update/prom part no. would you?. TIA Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 21:42:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA09232 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 21:42:36 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA09226 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 21:42:33 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-d33.foothill.net [209.76.43.33]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA06543 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 18:43:53 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 18:41:25 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6a6b$19784800$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The Mass problem existed for a short period time. The thick (thin?) film mass got used long into the future. It certainly was easier than replacing all of the mass sensors. However that problem was in 86-87 I think and the J cars had the mass well into the 90's. I prefer mass over map any day of the week.......when it works.....If you are altering the system, the mass is tons more forgiving. An example is my X-11. With the mass and a very hot aftermarket cam, the mass flow is correct at about 6 gm/S at idle and 135 gm/S at 6000 RPM. With the SD system, it reads the ECM "calculated" 20 gm/s at idle and 255 gm/s (pegged) at 6000 RPM. I don't think so. A lot of correction to the rom is needed to get it back into reality. Something not a lot of people can do. That same SD system on the stock 2.8L/3.1L reads correct. Just the cam alone throws the system off. On the other hand, SD is simpler to deal with. I do get your point. TK -----Original Message----- From: Clare Snyder To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Friday, April 17, 1998 6:20 PM Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF >TBK wrote: >> >> Mass systems had map too. Therefore on the Mass needs to be added. The EGR >> (digital or linear) may be different. HEI or DIS is slightly different. >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: ABTSZ >> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >> Date: Thursday, April 16, 1998 6:05 PM >> Subject: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF >> >> > Hi, >> > I've been told different things by different people about whether J-body >> V6s >> >are MAF or MAP. According to the schematics I've seen, some are MAF and >> some >> >are MAP based on different years and\or models. The manuals I have only go >> up >> >to '90, however. >> > Does anyone know if any J-bodies are MAP based, and what years or models? >> I >> >don't know if I should trust the Chilton manuals I've been lookin at or >> not. >> > Also, If all I can find is a MAF based system with a 7730 ECM, is this >> >difficult to convert to MAP? I realize I'd have to get a prom for a MAP >> based >> >care (F-body V6). What about the wiring to the MAP? Is there "vestual" >> >wiring in the harness? >> > >> >Adam >> > >There were so many problems with the MASS sensors that GM developed the >speed-density prom rather than replace the mass sensors. Many vehicles >with the mass installed don't use it at all. Eventually they stopped >installing it. >-- > _/\_ > --|-----([])-----|-- > S 0/ \0 B > Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back > E-Mail service is back to normal > To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages > Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca > OR >Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the >spammers!!! >It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of >Turkeys!!! > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 22:14:14 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA09819 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 22:14:14 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA09814 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 22:14:10 -0400 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn31-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.190]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA08910 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 21:11:15 -0400 Message-ID: <35380D13.4847@huron.net> Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 22:16:51 -0400 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF References: <01bd6a69$977b6a40$47198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > > -----Original Message----- > From: Clare Snyder > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Date: Friday, April 17, 1998 9:22 PM > Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF > > >TBK wrote: > >> Mass systems had map too. Therefore on the Mass needs to be added. The > EGR > >> (digital or linear) may be different. HEI or DIS is slightly different. > > >> Subject: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF > > . According to the schematics I've seen, some are MAF and > some are MAP based on different years and\or models. The manuals I have > only go up to '90, however. > >> > Does anyone know if any J-bodies are MAP based, and what years or > models? > >> >Adam > >> > > >There were so many problems with the MASS sensors that GM developed the > >speed-density prom rather than replace the mass sensors. Many vehicles > >with the mass installed don't use it at all. Eventually they stopped > >installing it. > >-- > You wouldn't happen to have a TSB number on when they were doing this would > you?. Or a part no for the wire update/prom part no. > would you?. > TIA > Bruce No wire update. Just the prom. I don't have thetsb available - might be able to dig it up next week when I can get to my brother's Mitchel On Demand system -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 22:50:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA10388 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 22:50:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA10383 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 22:50:35 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA25514 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 19:50:24 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 19:51:04 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35ec1306.163721390@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <1.5.4.32.19980417231434.00671678@unix.sbu.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: <1.5.4.32.19980417231434.00671678@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id WAA10384 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Sat, 18 Apr 1998 00:14:34 +0100, Gus Cameron wrote: >I'm a Scot actually Jimmie, and a biker to boot, but I'll see what I can dig up. >The Imprezza is over here, Colin McRay (another Scot) won the World Rally >Championship in it I think (remember, I'm a bike boy) but WRX? I'll have to >ask. >I could even get the manual and send it out. Would a Hanes manual be good >enough or is it the full Monty or nothing? >Toodle-pip old chum, >gus ;-) Beg'in yer pardon, Scotty. There's a fine tradition there, alright. Shoulda know from that old Scot name Cameron. Sheesh, how coulda miss that? But I looked at the .uk on your address and presumed d'plume. Oh well, the brain falls mainly on the plane. Anyhoo, I don't mean to be ungrateful, but I really do NEED the actual Subaru official manual (the engine section is refered to as section 2), so getting the Subaru part no. for it would earn you a place in our family album, and if you were to ever be able to get the actual thing itself (at my cost & post, of course, amount immaterial), well I think I might just remember you in my WILL! Fact I definitely would! This may be a difficult quest, so I'm makin no assumptions on what's possible, and ANY info crumbs along the way will be received with profuse gratitude. Gar P.S. Don't be thrown off by my guess at the WRX. I'm interested in BOTH the normally aspirated and turbo'd info on the engine, but for me, primarily the NA engine, anyway. Others in the group need the turbo info. From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 17 23:56:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA11114 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 23:56:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from norway.it.earthlink.net (norway-c.it.earthlink.net [204.119.177.49]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA11110 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 23:56:41 -0400 Received: from earthlink.net (pool010-max12.ds18-ca-us.dialup.earthlink.net [209.179.12.210]) by norway.it.earthlink.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA08406 for ; Fri, 17 Apr 1998 20:56:39 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <35382418.B1900FB@earthlink.net> Date: Fri, 17 Apr 1998 20:55:04 -0700 From: Heinrich Gerhardt X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF References: <01bd6a69$977b6a40$47198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > -----Original Message----- > From: Clare Snyder > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Date: Friday, April 17, 1998 9:22 PM > Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF > > >TBK wrote: > >> Mass systems had map too. Therefore on the Mass needs to be added. The > EGR > >> (digital or linear) may be different. HEI or DIS is slightly different. > > >> Subject: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF > > . According to the schematics I've seen, some are MAF and > some are MAP based on different years and\or models. The manuals I have > only go up to '90, however. > >> > Does anyone know if any J-bodies are MAP based, and what years or > models? > >> >Adam > >> > > >There were so many problems with the MASS sensors that GM developed the > >speed-density prom rather than replace the mass sensors. Many vehicles > >with the mass installed don't use it at all. Eventually they stopped > >installing it. > >-- > You wouldn't happen to have a TSB number on when they were doing this would > you?. Or a part no for the wire update/prom part no. > would you?. > TIA > Bruce I've seen some J-cars in the junkyard that had a GM decal under the hood indicating that the EFI system had been converted to speed-density. It looked like a TSB sticker. Don't remember what year had this. Mr. Goatwrench From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 18 05:58:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA12931 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 05:58:35 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha2.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.111]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA12927 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 05:58:31 -0400 Received: from CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha1.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.1]) by CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA24382 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 11:03:44 +0100 (BST) Received: from [136.148.36.156] by CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (5.65v4.0/1.1.10.5/06Nov96-0356PM) id AA13210; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:57:30 +0100 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980418095927.006843b8@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Sender: cameroa@unix.sbu.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:59:27 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Gus Cameron Subject: Re: Subaru Manuals. Was Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Garfield, Yes, I can help, but we are getting off topic so I'll email you privately. snip >Anyhoo, I don't mean to be ungrateful, but I really do NEED the actual >Subaru official manual (the engine section is refered to as section 2), >so getting the Subaru part no. for it would earn you a place in our >family album, and if you were to ever be able to get the actual thing >itself (at my cost & post, of course, amount immaterial), well I think I >might just remember you in my WILL! Fact I definitely would! > >This may be a difficult quest, so I'm makin no assumptions on what's >possible, and ANY info crumbs along the way will be received with >profuse gratitude. > >Gar > >P.S. Don't be thrown off by my guess at the WRX. I'm interested in BOTH >the normally aspirated and turbo'd info on the engine, but for me, >primarily the NA engine, anyway. Others in the group need the turbo >info. > > > From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 18 10:33:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA14244 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:33:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA14240 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:33:01 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-49.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.67]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id KAA07289; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:32:05 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: 1227747 pinout Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:32:53 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6ad6$df600740$43198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu For those of you working on the bench 747 part of the Prog 101, or those of your swapping to one here is a pinout. The * means optional, or emission related A1 drk grn/wht Fuel pump relay A2 Brn Air Port* A3 Grn/Yel Canister Purge* A4 Gray EGR* A5 brn/wht SES Light A6 pnk/blk Ign power A7 Tan/Blk MT/Shift, or TCC* A8 orgn Serial Data A9 Wht/Blk Diagnostic Test A10 brn VSS A11 blk/Pnk MAP Grnd A12 Blk/Wht ECM Grnd B1 orgn Battery B2 Tan/Wht fuel pump input B3 blk/red Dist ref low B5 ppl/wht Distr ref pulse B7 blk EST Retard B8 Grn A/C Signal* B10 org/blk P/N Switch C3-6 blu/grn's IAC C8 Drk Grn 4th gear switch* C9 ppl/wht Crank C10 yel Coolant temp C11 lt grn Map C13 Drk Blu TPS C14 gry 5v ref (sensors) C16 orng battery D1+2 blk grounds D4 wht Spark timing out D5 tan/blk Ign mod bypass D6 tan Ox ref low D7 ppl Ox sesnor high D15+16 Injector D14+C15 Injector If anyone finds an error please yell right away (other than spelling). Bruce From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 18 11:43:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA14896 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 11:43:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from batch3.csd.uwm.edu (root@batch3.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.7.226]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA14892 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 11:43:16 -0400 Received: from alpha1.csd.uwm.edu (root@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.169.1]) by batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id KAA02374; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:43:15 -0500 (CDT) Received: from slirp-user.csd.uwm.edu (garnierd@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.169.1]) by alpha1.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with SMTP id KAA25390; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:43:12 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3538E6DD.333A@alphag.csd.uwm.edu> Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 10:46:05 -0700 From: David Garnier Organization: Say What? X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04Gold (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu CC: garnierd@batch3.csd.uwm.edu, nacelp@bright.net Subject: GM Speed Density for 2.8L W engine Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce I am a newbee to here but maybe I can contribute something to the group. I own a 86 cebebrity eurosport with 2.8L W engine with the speed density update, maybe I can help here. The speed density tag on the front passenger shock tower is 10154721. I think that is the service bulletin number because it is also on the ecm's metal prom cover. The remanufactured ECM number is: 16196344. On the memcal socket-base there is stamped: 86767 with 9030 maybe being the date code. The prom label reads: ASMZ 0742 and there is a thick film ceramic hybrid next to it (the corner which overhags the eprom) with a number of: 5A0213. Both of these device are solder into the memcal socket (%^&*)! Any ideas why there is this hybrid? There is a GM publication for this update and it is listed under the Celebrity section of Helm's publications called: "87-88 driveability and emissions manual section 6E" the pub number of: "ST 399-87/88SD." I think the value of this pub is limited but all of the GM's ECM trouble shooting and circuity is in one small book. I am trying to dump this eprom, but I have been busy lately. I built a wire wrap socket extension so that I won't have to lift the eprom out and possible crack the ceramic hybrid which overhangs one end; the bastards have soldered these devices onto the memcal socket! Work's dataio is too damn smart for itself because it wants the exact device number before one can examine it. I understand that there is a selection to disable the prom ID checking but I have been to busy to check. If you or anyone else is interested, I will send you the prom file when I finally dump it. dave garnier -- -------------------------------------------------------------------------> Dave Garnier Nobody told me that there would be days | University Wisc-Milwaukee like these, strange days indeed, most | h 414-429-3536 perculiar mama! - John Lennon - | w 647-4286 | ars wb9own 44.92.1.8 | http://www.uwm.edu/~garnierd | -------------------------------------------------------------------------> From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 18 14:15:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA16049 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 14:15:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA16045 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 14:15:14 -0400 Received: from bullwinkle (du448-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.6.194]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id LAA19696 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 11:15:14 -0700 Message-Id: <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 11:18:13 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: <35c277b6.123961296@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu YES, I think that this should be true of ALL stuff designed here, and if you are going to do something and make $$ with the designs, the (all) people involved must be contacted. Just a respect thing!! Sandy > >As I've said before, there's gonna be a stipulation in the permission to >use the circuit, that you not be making use of the circuit for >profit-making purposes, without express written permission. > >Make as many for you and your pals, AT COST, that you want, but you >start selling them for a profit, and yer name'll be mud, bud. > >Just a reminder. > >Garfield > From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 18 15:42:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA16628 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 15:42:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA16624 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 15:42:14 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-10.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.79]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id PAA07739 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 15:41:18 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: GM Speed Density for 2.8L W engine Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 15:42:07 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6b02$1231c480$4f198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: David Garnier To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Cc: garnierd@batch3.csd.uwm.edu ; nacelp@bright.net Date: Saturday, April 18, 1998 12:15 PM Subject: GM Speed Density for 2.8L W engine >Bruce > >I am a newbee to here but maybe I can contribute something to the >group. I own a 86 cebebrity eurosport with 2.8L W engine with the >speed density update, maybe I can help here. > >The speed density tag on the front passenger shock tower is 10154721. The remanufactured ECM number is: 16196344. The prom label reads: ASMZ 0742 Any ideas why >there is this hybrid? >I am trying to dump this eprom, but I have been busy lately. >I built a wire wrap socket extension so that I won't have to >lift the eprom out and possible crack the ceramic hybrid which >overhangs one end; the bastards have soldered these devices onto >the memcal socket! Work's dataio is too damn smart for itself >because it wants the exact device number before one can examine >it. I understand that there is a selection to disable the prom ID >checking but I have been to busy to check. If you or anyone else >is interested, I will send you the prom file when I finally dump it. > >dave garnier >-- That is interesting, I show that as having a 1227302 originally, and that's a C-3, with two ecm connectors. Yet you say the replacement has a memcal. Sounds like maybe a version of a 165?. Does that make sense to anyone?.. Ya I'd like to see a bin. on that. Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 18 15:56:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA16739 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 15:56:05 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA16734 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 15:56:02 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp37.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.167]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id OAA09706 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 14:56:20 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 14:48:04 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Don't you think you invoking a double standard. Look at this group breaking O2 meter using an existing meter , reverse engineer GM boxes . It will happen any way and there is no way to protect if they are in the weeds reading mail . It will be built with a twist in the design . If you don't want it copied DON' T post it. After all, the posts are public domain you talk on the net the world knows ,this is great power of the net and if it drops the price of the standard unit down to $200 due to competition the goal was met. Remember not all members want to build one, they want to use one. Build some pc boards and sell them to the members and make a profit after all this is the American way. I'll buy one. Steve Sandy wrote: > YES, I think that this should be true of ALL stuff designed here, and > if you > are going to do something and make $$ with the designs, the (all) > people > involved must be contacted. Just a respect thing!! > > Sandy > > > > >As I've said before, there's gonna be a stipulation in the permission > to > >use the circuit, that you not be making use of the circuit for > >profit-making purposes, without express written permission. > > > >Make as many for you and your pals, AT COST, that you want, but you > >start selling them for a profit, and yer name'll be mud, bud. > > > >Just a reminder. > > > >Garfield > > From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 18 18:23:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA17857 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 18:23:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kcbbs.gen.nz (kcbbs.gen.nz [202.14.102.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA17852 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 18:23:14 -0400 Received: from swbo (as5200-08.kcbbs.gen.nz [202.14.102.38]) by kcbbs.gen.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA05830 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 10:21:59 +1200 (NZST) Message-Id: <199804182221.KAA05830@kcbbs.gen.nz> From: "Steve Baldwin" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 19 Apr 1998 10:26:21 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Priority: normal In-reply-to: <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > After all, the posts are public domain Posts are NOT in the public domain. They are copyrighted by the originator unless there is a statement by that person to put them into the public domain. There is no requirement to put any copyright mark on anything you write but it is useful if you want to defend it. However, copyright only protects against copying. If you use the information in a circuit to determine how the sensor works and come up with something original (which may be extremely similar), copyright doesn't stop you from doing it. Preventing that requires other measures. [I'm no lawyer and this advice is worth what you are paying for it] Steve. ====================================================== Steve Baldwin Electronic Product Design TLA Microsystems Ltd Microcontroller Specialists PO Box 15-680, New Lynn http://www.tla.co.nz Auckland, New Zealand ph +64 9 820-2221 email: steveb@tla.co.nz fax +64 9 820-1929 ====================================================== From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 18 23:07:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA19826 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 23:07:54 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA19822 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 23:07:52 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-10.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.79]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id XAA14703 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 23:06:57 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: 747 Pinout Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 23:07:42 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6b40$51620820$4f198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu OK, I'll admit it, the pinout I posted early today should be right for a V-8 747, if someone would check and make sure that it holds true for a v-6, that might make things easier for someone working on a v-6. Cheers Bruce Yep, the Cone Shaped Hat was on while typing the the pinout.... From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 18 23:42:03 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA20110 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 23:42:03 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA20106 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 23:41:59 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm303-162.mcn.net [208.26.146.162]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA15735 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 21:41:58 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <35396F92.DF1CF179@mcn.net> Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 21:29:22 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF References: <01bd6a69$977b6a40$47198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > > -----Original Message----- > From: Clare Snyder > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Date: Friday, April 17, 1998 9:22 PM > Subject: Re: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF > > >TBK wrote: > >> Mass systems had map too. Therefore on the Mass needs to be added. The > EGR > >> (digital or linear) may be different. HEI or DIS is slightly different. > > >> Subject: J-bodies and MAP vs MAF > > . According to the schematics I've seen, some are MAF and > some are MAP based on different years and\or models. The manuals I have > only go up to '90, however. > >> > Does anyone know if any J-bodies are MAP based, and what years or > models? > >> >Adam > >> > > >There were so many problems with the MASS sensors that GM developed the > >speed-density prom rather than replace the mass sensors. Many vehicles > >with the mass installed don't use it at all. Eventually they stopped > >installing it. > >-- > You wouldn't happen to have a TSB number on when they were doing this would > you?. Or a part no for the wire update/prom part no. > would you?. > TIA > Bruce Service Bulletin # 88-440-6e (from 1997 techline cd) part# for the label is 10154725 list of prom part#'s for various vehicle configurations, '87 and '88 no wiring changes. From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 18 23:47:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA20160 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 23:47:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA20156 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 23:47:14 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm303-162.mcn.net [208.26.146.162]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA17154 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 21:47:12 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <353970CB.37C49963@mcn.net> Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 21:34:35 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM Speed Density for 2.8L W engine References: <3538E6DD.333A@alphag.csd.uwm.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu David Garnier wrote: > > Bruce > > I am a newbee to here but maybe I can contribute something to the > group. I own a 86 cebebrity eurosport with 2.8L W engine with the > speed density update, maybe I can help here. > > The speed density tag on the front passenger shock tower is 10154721. > I think that is the service bulletin number because it is also > on the ecm's metal prom cover. The remanufactured ECM number is: > 16196344. On the memcal socket-base there is stamped: 86767 with > 9030 maybe being the date code. The prom label reads: ASMZ 0742 > and there is a thick film ceramic hybrid next to it (the corner > which overhags the eprom) with a number of: 5A0213. Both of these > device are solder into the memcal socket (%^&*)! Any ideas why > there is this hybrid? There is a GM publication for this update > and it is listed under the Celebrity section of Helm's publications > called: "87-88 driveability and emissions manual section 6E" the > pub number of: "ST 399-87/88SD." I think the value of this pub > is limited but all of the GM's ECM trouble shooting and circuity > is in one small book. > > I am trying to dump this eprom, but I have been busy lately. > I built a wire wrap socket extension so that I won't have to > lift the eprom out and possible crack the ceramic hybrid which > overhangs one end; the bastards have soldered these devices onto > the memcal socket! Work's dataio is too damn smart for itself > because it wants the exact device number before one can examine > it. I understand that there is a selection to disable the prom ID > checking but I have been to busy to check. If you or anyone else > is interested, I will send you the prom file when I finally dump it. > > dave garnier > -- > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------> > Dave Garnier Nobody told me that there would be days > | > University Wisc-Milwaukee like these, strange days indeed, most > | > h 414-429-3536 perculiar mama! - John Lennon - > | > w 647-4286 > | > ars wb9own 44.92.1.8 > | > http://www.uwm.edu/~garnierd > | > -------------------------------------------------------------------------> Was that ECM remanufactured by Delco? ASMZ prom fits 87 A body (Celebrity) with 2.8, 4spd auto, federal emiss. Should be removable. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 00:19:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA20591 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 00:19:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kitfox.anv.net (root@kitfox.anv.net [207.168.90.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA20587 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 00:19:20 -0400 Received: from dad-s-machine (max03-136.anv.net [207.168.181.136]) by kitfox.anv.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA07155 for ; Sat, 18 Apr 1998 21:26:59 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <35397C20.3242@anv.net> Date: Sat, 18 Apr 1998 21:22:56 -0700 From: Dan Painter X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Honda O2 Sensor Part Number Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm interested in making one of these EGO sensors myself (are they really used to find opinionated people? hehe). I used to be in the Auto Parts biz and still have a few good connections for foreign parts. Are these sensors Honda OE only or are they made for Honda by someone else? If someone could email me the specifics, I'd be glad to chase down the best deal I can find and report back to the group. Dan -- Dan Painter dpainter@anv.net His-n-Her 87 GN's From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 06:38:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA22629 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 06:38:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lennier.qonline.com.au (root@lennier.qonline.com.au [203.103.144.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA22625 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 06:38:00 -0400 Received: from bernie (bernie@picard.qonline.com.au [203.103.236.101]) by lennier.qonline.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA12428 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 20:41:36 +1000 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980419203714.0079bc60@mail.qonline.com.au> X-Sender: mharding@mail.qonline.com.au X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Sun, 19 Apr 1998 20:37:14 +1000 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Matthew Harding Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu At 02:48 PM 4/18/98 -0500, you wrote: >Don't you think you invoking a double standard. Look at this group >breaking O2 meter using an existing meter , reverse engineer GM boxes . >It will happen any way and there is no way to protect if they are in the >weeds reading mail . It will be built with a twist in the design . If >you don't want it copied DON' T post it. >After all, the posts are public domain you talk on the net the world >knows ,this is great power of the net and if it drops the price of the >standard unit down to $200 due to competition the goal was met. Remember >not all members want to build one, they want to use one. Build some pc >boards and sell them to the members and make a profit after all this is >the American way. I'll buy one. > > > > >Steve > >Sandy wrote: > >> YES, I think that this should be true of ALL stuff designed here, and >> if you >> are going to do something and make $$ with the designs, the (all) >> people >> involved must be contacted. Just a respect thing!! >> >> Sandy >> >> > >> >As I've said before, there's gonna be a stipulation in the permission >> to >> >use the circuit, that you not be making use of the circuit for >> >profit-making purposes, without express written permission. >> > >> >Make as many for you and your pals, AT COST, that you want, but you >> >start selling them for a profit, and yer name'll be mud, bud. >> > >> >Just a reminder. >> > >> >Garfield Thanks steve, I'm a uni student, with a little electronic background. I build and sell things at VERY SMALL profit.... barely enough to make my time worthwhile. Why shouldn't I? I am most definenly not talking about setting up a comercial manufacturing business. From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 07:31:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA23123 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 07:31:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from buffy.tpgi.com.au (buffy.tpgi.com.au [203.12.160.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA23119 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 07:31:30 -0400 Received: (from smtpd@localhost) by buffy.tpgi.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA14954 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 21:31:58 +1000 Received: from gou-ppp-071.tpgi.com.au(203.29.140.71), claiming to be "acer-p166" via SMTP by buffy.tpgi.com.au, id smtpda14939; Sun Apr 19 21:31:48 1998 Message-ID: <3539E1CD.5E49@tpgi.com.au> Date: Sun, 19 Apr 1998 21:36:45 +1000 From: Justin Albury X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.03 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Fueltronics? References: <01bd69a4$ad06d0e0$402b04d1@jr> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Jesse R. Ortiz wrote: > > If anyone here has any experience with the Fueltronics TCC3, or any of the > other Turbo Control Centeres, could you please E-mail me? I would like to > know what anyone thought/thinks of it, especially the additional Injector > controller part of it... > > Please e-mail with any info.... It would be very much appreciated.... > > jr I have used the TCC3 in a supra and came up with some very good results. ran 15 psi boost and got more than a 50% increase in HP on the dyno :-) very easy to install...martin has done a good job on these little suckers. they are finnished off in a very pro. looking case which fitted in on the supra very nice. have a look at the fueltronics home page for more details.... they are in south australia phone 0883632199 justin From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 16:00:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA25992 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 16:00:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk ([136.148.1.111]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA25988 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 15:59:57 -0400 Received: from CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha1.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.1]) by CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA08472 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 21:05:07 +0100 (BST) Received: from [136.148.36.156] by CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (5.65v4.0/1.1.10.5/06Nov96-0356PM) id AA23454; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 20:58:53 +0100 Message-Id: <1.5.4.32.19980419200046.00664464@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Sender: cameroa@unix.sbu.ac.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.4 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 19 Apr 1998 21:00:46 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Gus Cameron Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >At 02:48 PM 4/18/98 -0500, Steven Gorkowski wrote: snip >>Don't you think you invoking a double standard. *snip* >>this is great power of the net *snip* >>Build some pc boards and sell them to the members and make a >>profit after all this is the American way. And the other great power of the net (and even this group) is that we are not all from the USA. >> >>Steve >> >At 20:37 19/04/98 +1000, Matthew Harding wrote: > >I'm a uni student, with a little electronic background. I build and sell >things at VERY SMALL profit.... > >barely enough to make my time worthwhile. > >Why shouldn't I? > FLAME ON If you don't know yet, don't worry. You will when you grow up. FLAME OFF The golden rule of newsgroups? If you have not got anything to give, don't take (not even bandwidth). >I am most definenly not talking about setting up a comercial manufacturing >business. > > Bully for you. Cheers me dears, Gus From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 16:51:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA26422 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 16:51:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from diamond.sunset.net (root@diamond.sunset.net [205.138.253.252]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA26418 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 16:51:55 -0400 Received: from default (d126.earth.sunset.net [205.138.253.126]) by diamond.sunset.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA15807 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 13:55:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804192055.NAA15807@diamond.sunset.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: "Do-it-Yourself Fuel Injection" Subject: Prog 101 Date: Sun, 19 Apr 1998 13:58:41 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello all, Well after several attempts I am now on the list, wheew.. I was hoping someone might bring me up to speed on this prog 101 project...? My ultimate objective is to assemble a myrid of components to form a "vanilla" EFI setup for use on a small block chevy. As well play with the fuel/timing maps to dial in my effort. As well is there anyone out ther that has played with the older feedback ECM's?? Anyone ever here of a prom programmer for these vintage units? From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 17:04:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA26544 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 17:04:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA26540 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 17:04:25 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA5569 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 14:04:23 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Sun, 19 Apr 1998 14:05:05 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35615eba.48344015@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> In-Reply-To: <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id RAA26541 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Sat, 18 Apr 1998 14:48:04 -0500, Steven Gorkowski wrote: >Remember >not all members want to build one, they want to use one. Build some pc >boards and sell them to the members and make a profit after all this is >the American way. At the risk of adding to this tempest-ina-teapot, I do want to respond to one part of that last statement, cuz it's got a nasty lil zinger in it I can't let by. (A zinger that Steve possiblymean to put his John Hancock to?, I might add). And it's not really personal, per se, but bears directly on what these internet groups are hopefully all about. To wit: "sell them to the members and make a profit, after all this is the American way". Well, the business opportunities and freedoms are wunnerful in my country, which I'm very enamored of, BTW. But you just mustn't lump every social phenomenon under this "business process paradigm", without horrific effects. That's why I choose to be involved in many social relationships where I and the others don't CHARGE each other anything for contributing to each other's fun and enjoyment. You do these kinda things, share your tools, give of your time and efforts, etc. because you see the others as friends, pals, chums, mates, comrades, whatever word you wanna use, INSTEAD of clients, customers, vendors, patrons, etc. If you wanna be crude and extreme about it, ask yourself what your mother's done for you lately. So that's why I was tryna encourage anyone who has friends that want one of these meters but can't (for whatever reason, time, money, skillset), to go ahead and build them one, just do it as a friend mutually enjoying a sport, instead of as a business opportunity. I don't have ANYTHING whatsoever against business, but if you intend to make one out of me or my friend's efforts we're freely sharing with you because we think of YOU as a pal too, well, then you need to deal with us just like you're thinking, as businessmen; and get some commercial agreement in place before you go sucking up on our labors we're sharing AMONG FRIENDS and fellow sportsmen, for free. Now, why you might ask, am I stirring up this silly pot, and why is this important enough to jabber about? Well, I'm part of a sport called eXperimental aViation, a sport born out of the grand adventure of flight that started this century, that Orville and Wilbur were a part of. What you see happening in so many sports, and of late especially in XA, is that just as soon as someone comes up to speed on some aspect, and has gathered all the gems he can from all those in the sport, he decides he's "got something" special, and he's no longer gonna share it as a sportsman, but he's gonna retire from his normal job, and turn his hobby/sport into a cash cow. So he clams up, doesn't contribute anything to the sport anymore, and in fact often trys to make his area of interest seem like it's soooo specialized that nobody but he (and any others "just tryin to make a buck off the sport") can fathom, and that all further eXperimentation should cease and folks should just BUY their stuff from him. Cute huh? Sadly, this has been happening since the dawn of the sport (Orville & Wilbur even got caught up in the greed thang a bit), cuz of course, kinda like these mucho-better O2 meters in a smaller way, people see a "monetary opportunity". Nuthin wrong with treating sumthin as a commercial vendor, really, but I'd say you do that and you just excised yerself from the category as a fellow-sportsman/hobbyist/afficianado. Thas the contrast I was tryna make; I got no anti-business agenda, not at all. I was just sayin, "this stuff is for me diy_efi pals that have given me so much enjoyment and knowledge through the group's beehive of activity, but it's NOT for you for free if you wanna milk it as a business venture". That's all, dudes. Nothin more to it. Simple statement, me thinks. Garfield P.S. Representing simply using an NTK box and observing how it works, as the same as reverse-engineering it, and equivalent to opening the box and copying the circuit,is absolute bullshit, and a gross insult to both myself and Frank Parker's intelligence and integrity. I designed the circuit; I didn't need to copy anyone else's work; and certainly not take credit for it, once I had. I strongly resent the suggestion, so if you plan on pursuing it, count on being trounced if I see you in person. That's also "the American way". Heh. Now let's resume the fun, and forget these nacent sport-parasites. From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 17:14:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA26737 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 17:14:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA26733 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 17:14:55 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA5939 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 14:14:55 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Sun, 19 Apr 1998 14:15:36 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35636965.51075500@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> <35615eba.48344015@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> In-Reply-To: <35615eba.48344015@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id RAA26734 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Sun, 19 Apr 1998 14:05:05 -0700, garfield@pilgrimhouse.com wrote: Oh crap, in the heat of the tempest, I screwed up my typing somewhat; here are some corrections to my last soliloquy. Crumbs, I don't normally write on something I have to be "careful" about, so I didn't proof read this till later. Sigh. >At the risk of adding to this tempest-ina-teapot, I do want to respond >to one part of that last statement, cuz it's got a nasty lil zinger in >it I can't let by. (A zinger that Steve possiblymean to put his John >Hancock to?, I might add). The thing in parens should read (A zinger that Stever possibly didn't mean to put his John Hancock to?, I might add). >Now let's resume the fun, and forget these nacent sport-parasites. The word is spelled nascent, not "nacent". Sheesh, when I'm brewing up my one one-liners, I HATE to mangle the delivery. Grumble. Gar From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 18:12:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA27469 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 18:12:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA27464 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 18:12:20 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp120.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.120]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA29796; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 18:16:29 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sun, 19 Apr 1998 18:09:54 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Derek Jewett cc: Do-it-Yourself Fuel Injection Subject: Re: Prog 101 In-Reply-To: <199804192055.NAA15807@diamond.sunset.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Hello all, > > Well after several attempts I am now on the list, wheew.. I was hoping > someone might bring me up to speed on this prog 101 project...? do you need the posting made to the 101 project,i saved them all and i can send it to you ??? Alain Toussaint From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 18:29:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA27607 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 18:29:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ingenico.com.au ([203.10.64.225]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA27603 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 18:29:46 -0400 Received: from PJARAMAZ [10.10.10.34] by ingenico.com.au [10.10.10.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP0.R) for ; Mon, 20 Apr 98 08:25:01 +1000 Received: by PJARAMAZ with Microsoft Mail id <01BD6C35.8A1C0300@PJARAMAZ >; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 08:23:04 +1000 Message-ID: <01BD6C35.8A1C0300@PJARAMAZ > From: Peter Jaramaz To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 08:23:03 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD6C35.8A252AC0" X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD6C35.8A252AC0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable >Garfield Willis (sadly not related to Bob Willis, a REAL star) >P.S. Hey, waitaminuto, you're a Brit! Say, I wonder if you could do me = a >favor, and look about to see if Subaru in England sells/imports into = yer >fine country a model of the Soobs called the Imprezza, that has a 2.0L >DOHC 4banger in it. There are supposedly two variants, a normally >aspirated type, jus refered to as the Imprezza 2.0 (I think), and a >turbo'd version that's popular in Euro for hot-rodding, called the >Imprezza WRX, both 2.0L DOHC. Got 'em in Oz. The WRX is a smallish 4 door, 4wd, 2.0L Turbo flat 4. = O-100 (KMH) in mid 6s, 1/4 in mid 14's (there are magazine tests that = calim 5.5 and 13.6 but are generally considered to be either wrong, or a = car with boost problems (wink wink), another mag hooked a boost gauge up = to a demo car and found it to be about 5 psi over the factory claimed = boost) Anyway, the engine code is EJ20(T?). I have a list somewhere of all the = EJ20 variants. I'll try find it and post. Cheers, Peter ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD6C35.8A252AC0 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IgQWAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYAYAEAAAEAAAAMAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAAYQAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMy LmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQBTTVRQAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVk dQAAAAAeAAIwAQAAAAUAAABTTVRQAAAAAB4AAzABAAAAIgAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5v aGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQAAAAMAFQwBAAAAAwD+DwYAAAAeAAEwAQAAACQAAAAnZGl5X2VmaUBlZmkz MzIuZW5nLm9oaW8tc3RhdGUuZWR1JwACAQswAQAAACcAAABTTVRQOkRJWV9FRklARUZJMzMyLkVO Ry5PSElPLVNUQVRFLkVEVQAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAKcSAEEgAEA OwAAAFJFOiBSZXR1cm4gb2YgdGhlIGRpeV9FR09tZXRlciAoWUVTLCBpdCdzIGZpbmFsbHkgQUxJ VkUhISkAixIBBYADAA4AAADOBwQAFAAIABcAAwABABABASCAAwAOAAAAzgcEABQACAARABIAAQAZ AQEJgAEAIQAAADQ5MjhCQjEyMjVEOEQxMTFCRUJCMDA0MDA1NUYyQTZGABYHAQOQBgCwBQAAFAAA AAsAIwAAAAAAAwAmAAAAAAALACkAAAAAAAMALgAAAAAAAwA2AAAAAABAADkAIHnAt+FrvQEeAHAA AQAAADsAAABSRTogUmV0dXJuIG9mIHRoZSBkaXlfRUdPbWV0ZXIgKFlFUywgaXQncyBmaW5hbGx5 IEFMSVZFISEpAAACAXEAAQAAABYAAAABvWvht8ASuyhK2CUR0b67AEAFXypvAAAeAB4MAQAAAAUA AABTTVRQAAAAAB4AHwwBAAAAGQAAAHBqYXJhbWF6QGluZ2VuaWNvLmNvbS5hdQAAAAADAAYQKYj0 FgMABxAVAwAAHgAIEAEAAABlAAAAR0FSRklFTERXSUxMSVMoU0FETFlOT1RSRUxBVEVEVE9CT0JX SUxMSVMsQVJFQUxTVEFSKVBTSEVZLFdBSVRBTUlOVVRPLFlPVVJFQUJSSVRTQVksSVdPTkRFUklG WU9VQ09VTAAAAAACAQkQAQAAAPsDAAD3AwAA3AYAAExaRnVBzcBL/wAKAQ8CFQKkA+QF6wKDAFAT A1QCAGNoCsBzZXTuMgYABsMCgzIDxgcTAoO6MxMNfQqACM8J2TsV/3gyNTUCgAqBDbELYG7wZzEw MxQgCwoS8gwBCmMAQCAKi2xpMzZzDfAZzyA+C0YUIgwBcK0DYHQFkAVARwrAZgiQcGxkIFcDEBuw BCAogHNhZGx5IG4eUB4gFgALYB5gHyB0byCIQm9iHzUsIGEH8CBFQUwgcwGQcikfCoUKhxwvHT8e RVAuU6AuIEhleSGwdwtwtQGQbQuAdSDgIbB5CGCWJxYAIcFCBRB0IQYB3SaRSSawAiAEgSAGkCeC 6iAFoHUfEWQg8AeAIcDHIw8kHx2+ZmF2BbAhseUpECAVkG9rIcAG4CdAjyDSEfAn4ClhU3ViCsDz KbALgCBFGQAY4R8gEfDpH2BzLwdwcBWhBCALgP0g4XkEkCqvK78szwuAJ+B7KdECMHIgACHQBGID IG+pKXB0aCfgUy6AYgQg2mMHQGwgsjbxSTFQFgC4enphIbA24CCQIBHAwwQgIdAyLjBMMk8zX4Ed vkRPSEMgNC/g3xkAKTIDoCbgJlBUNvAn0nEn0XN1cDFgEfAf4nT5KPAgdgrABzACMCGjICD2cgDA H2B5Oc863x2+OTCIcGlyIJR5cGUhsOxqdQQgFgBmPkEgwzkxPzf6OXIfoCjQNuALgGspby4UKp9B /0MPdAhwBuAnvR8gdgSQAJACIDjDJwQg/TFgcCnwCsEwMghwIPACEJUFwGgeUC0DYGRkC4B+ZyGw N4hIT0lfHb5Gd1d8UlghsAbgNuA5czzTLn8inht/GjRU3FAPHqAgMSfkZW0wIk96PgNTIilQ3TlC c0CiBABTsDQqIS3y2DR3ZCGwU9NUS3ItsGcggT0gJlBPLRkgRyFLuE1IKTAiJxAfIDYhoUwxL1sw XfUxNEyhKMc24T5VAMBnYXo1ch5gHyJARhI48TeBB3AgNS7CNS4jMTMuNlNwLvH/PoI9cDWARFBA wSnBAIEEgfUgtGIn4GUm4D4xJrADYP9OogWxIdA3gGVBZQFTcT8A/wVAHjECYFkwH5ED8EegZlH/ R6VTkSkxYFFOAS6QILEh0OtmtGBwdT1wID7QRcMqIP9ZMCDwZiIuMgIQNdAfICbg92SFLsRiEHAA kDagS+E20/8twB6ABbBjwQthB4AfIGaz8SKNQW55JsAmkTbiCfBOZzV0DbBaQkVKAdAo+FQ/KSZQ KNARwEvgIcH7H3EFQHMDcAfQPjM2sTeR7zbTcgI/p3KBJ3RiNgE1Yd9sEy4yPvE98CKcQzbwS/F6 LCKcUBIAKTFU1hUhAAF6sAADABAQAQAAAAMAERAAAAAAQAAHMAC/QOrga70BQAAIMAC/QOrga70B HgA9AAEAAAAFAAAAUkU6IAAAAAADAA00/TcAACG5 ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD6C35.8A252AC0-- From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 20:51:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA28537 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 20:51:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail1.i1.net (root@mail1.i1.net [207.230.32.4]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA28533 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 20:51:53 -0400 Received: from qthbhrgm (pm3-9stl22.i1.net [209.74.139.22]) by mail1.i1.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA06001 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 20:04:57 -0500 (CDT) Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980420004717.0072a470@mail.crl.com> X-Sender: carterh@mail.crl.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 19 Apr 1998 19:47:17 -0500 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Carter Hendricks Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu At 02:05 PM 4/19/98 -0700, garfield@pilgrimhouse.com wrote: [lot's of cool stuff] BRAVO! --Carter From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 22:43:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA29300 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 22:43:36 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mailhub.omen.com.au (root@mailhub.omen.com.au [203.8.107.50]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA29296 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 22:43:30 -0400 Received: from wattsgl2 (pbg@ttyE31.quokka.omen.com.au [203.15.92.32]) by mailhub.omen.com.au (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA23011 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 10:43:26 +0800 From: "wattsg" To: Subject: RE: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 10:44:35 +0800 Message-ID: <000f01bd6c06$4362e480$LocalHost@wattsgl2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 In-Reply-To: <35c59611.131732265@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3007.0 Importance: Normal Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subaru australia has these beasties here. Lots of locals drive the (ludicrously quick) WRX's around, because the bang-for-buck value can't be beaten (~ $40,000aus, does the 1/4 mile in 14.4 seconds, and handles like a champ - with scope for cheap hp improvement) I don't have any friends working for Suby dealers, but the service manual should be gettable by faxing a dealer or subaru themselves. Check www.yellowpages.com.au, and search for subaru. Regards, geoff -----Original Message----- From: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu [mailto:owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu]On Behalf Of garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Sent: Saturday, April 18, 1998 2:15 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) On Fri, 17 Apr 1998 18:09:23 +0100, Gus Cameron wrote: P.S. Hey, waitaminuto, you're a Brit! Say, I wonder if you could do me a favor, and look about to see if Subaru in England sells/imports into yer fine country a model of the Soobs called the Imprezza, that has a 2.0L DOHC 4banger in it. There are supposedly two variants, a normally aspirated type, jus refered to as the Imprezza 2.0 (I think), and a turbo'd version that's popular in Euro for hot-rodding, called the Imprezza WRX, both 2.0L DOHC. Reason I'm asking if these are cars imported into your country, is that engine ISN'T imported into the US domestically, and we've got a couple guys in our aviation group that are tryna get manuals for the engine part of the car (we CAN get the engines from Jap engine importers, ya know the ones that have only bout 30K mi on them). We can't even order the manuals from here, cuz they aren't listed in the US price list, but if they knew an English speaking country where they could at least get the Subaru part no. off the cover of the manual, we could order the manuals via. the part no. directly from Subaru/Japan (our local dealer thinks they could pull that off, if they only new the part no.). Soooo, if you could possibly determine just if these cars ARE in merry ole England, we could research the rest from there. Be a huge help. TIA. From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 19 22:45:46 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA29354 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 22:45:46 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.33]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA29350 for ; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 22:45:45 -0400 Received: from [12.64.38.157] by mtigwc04.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with SMTP id AAA9301 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 02:45:18 +0000 Message-Id: <2.2.32.19980420024038.00bc4868@postoffice.worldnet.att.net> X-Sender: e.schumacher@postoffice.worldnet.att.net X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 2.2 (32) Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Sun, 19 Apr 1998 19:40:38 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: eric schumacher Subject: Re: GM Speed Density for 2.8L W engine Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Chuck I am located in North Hills in the SF valley at the junction of the 5 & 405 fry. At 09:34 PM 4/18/98 -0600, you wrote: >David Garnier wrote: >> >> Bruce >> >> I am a newbee to here but maybe I can contribute something to the >> group. I own a 86 cebebrity eurosport with 2.8L W engine with the >> speed density update, maybe I can help here. >> >> The speed density tag on the front passenger shock tower is 10154721. >> I think that is the service bulletin number because it is also >> on the ecm's metal prom cover. The remanufactured ECM number is: >> 16196344. On the memcal socket-base there is stamped: 86767 with >> 9030 maybe being the date code. The prom label reads: ASMZ 0742 >> and there is a thick film ceramic hybrid next to it (the corner >> which overhags the eprom) with a number of: 5A0213. Both of these >> device are solder into the memcal socket (%^&*)! Any ideas why >> there is this hybrid? There is a GM publication for this update >> and it is listed under the Celebrity section of Helm's publications >> called: "87-88 driveability and emissions manual section 6E" the >> pub number of: "ST 399-87/88SD." I think the value of this pub >> is limited but all of the GM's ECM trouble shooting and circuity >> is in one small book. >> >> I am trying to dump this eprom, but I have been busy lately. >> I built a wire wrap socket extension so that I won't have to >> lift the eprom out and possible crack the ceramic hybrid which >> overhangs one end; the bastards have soldered these devices onto >> the memcal socket! Work's dataio is too damn smart for itself >> because it wants the exact device number before one can examine >> it. I understand that there is a selection to disable the prom ID >> checking but I have been to busy to check. If you or anyone else >> is interested, I will send you the prom file when I finally dump it. >> >> dave garnier >> -- >> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------> >> Dave Garnier Nobody told me that there would be days >> | >> University Wisc-Milwaukee like these, strange days indeed, most >> | >> h 414-429-3536 perculiar mama! - John Lennon - >> | >> w 647-4286 >> | >> ars wb9own 44.92.1.8 >> | >> http://www.uwm.edu/~garnierd >> | >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------> >Was that ECM remanufactured by Delco? >ASMZ prom fits 87 A body (Celebrity) with 2.8, 4spd auto, >federal emiss. >Should be removable. > >Shannen > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 00:46:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA30642 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 00:46:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from batch3.csd.uwm.edu (root@batch3.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.7.226]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA30638 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 00:46:06 -0400 Received: from alpha1.csd.uwm.edu (root@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.169.1]) by batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id XAA31462; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 23:46:05 -0500 (CDT) Received: from slirp-user.csd.uwm.edu (garnierd@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.8.201]) by alpha1.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with SMTP id XAA12253; Sun, 19 Apr 1998 23:46:03 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <353AEFE7.682B@alphag.csd.uwm.edu> Date: Sun, 19 Apr 1998 23:49:11 -0700 From: David Garnier Organization: Say What? X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04Gold (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: shannen@mcn.net CC: DIY_EFI-Digest@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Re: GM Speed Density for 2.8L W engine Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Shannen > >ASMZ prom fits 87 A body (Celebrity) with 2.8, 4spd auto, >federal emiss. God, you are good! :-) Yep you got most of it, other than it's a eurosport wagon with 3.31 gears. I was surprised to find that there was different versions for different gear ratios... I rememeber hearing someplace that transmissions are calibrated to engines these days. When I was at my local Chevy dealer, I asked what is suppose to be in there and I got the following. ECM's started as 1227730, then 16198262 and then some others; I then started to get overloaded with the details. I copied down off his tube, 1388ADCK, 3024ADRF, 5486AAXN and 4456ADRF for memcals. I will go back there again and verify this data. I have been looking for another Celebrity with 2.8W engine without the speed density revision but I haven't even found a speed density equiped Celebrity yet. The bone yards I go to have the ECM already yanked and sorted only by ECM number, $35 to $45 seems to be the going price in the yards I have visited. I would like to try MAT version once and see how it feels, seat of the pants that is. >Was that ECM remanufactured by Delco? I assume so since it had the typical GM stickon number and barcode. The one I found for my wifes 90 olds 3.3L did say it was remanufactured by Delco, so go figure. So, how where you able to tell me what I had? Have a good friend or work for mister goodwrench? ;-) thanks dave garnier -- From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 09:32:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA00777 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 09:32:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bert.acesag.auburn.edu (bert.acesag.auburn.edu [131.204.46.47]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA00773 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 09:32:57 -0400 Received: from bert (bert [131.204.46.47]) by bert.acesag.auburn.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA02256; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 08:32:38 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 08:32:38 -0500 (CDT) From: "Gregory A. Parmer" X-Sender: gparmer@bert To: Derek Jewett cc: Do-it-Yourself Fuel Injection Subject: Re: Prog 101 In-Reply-To: <199804192055.NAA15807@diamond.sunset.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Sun, 19 Apr 1998, Derek Jewett wrote: > Well after several attempts I am now on the list, wheew.. I was hoping > someone might bring me up to speed on this prog 101 project...? My ultimate Several of us are trying to get up to speed. :) Visit the DIY-EFI web site and search for "101". I think everybody's pretty much after the same thing. We're planning on using a GM ECMs from the late 80s and early 90s for a starting ground---especially the 1227747. http://efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -greg From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 10:22:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA01240 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 10:22:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from diamond.sunset.net (root@diamond.sunset.net [205.138.253.252]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA01235 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 10:22:53 -0400 Received: from default (d135.earth.sunset.net [205.138.253.135]) by diamond.sunset.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id HAA17979 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 07:26:02 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804201426.HAA17979@diamond.sunset.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: "Do-it-Yourself Fuel Injection" Subject: 747 vs. 730 Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 07:28:35 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce.. You mentioned 747, but I looked all over town and was not able to come up with one, what I did find and bought was a 730 ECM, out of an 89 Beretta... Is this compatible with the 747 at all...??? Thanks.. From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 10:34:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA01366 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 10:34:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bert.acesag.auburn.edu (bert.acesag.auburn.edu [131.204.46.47]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA01362 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 10:34:49 -0400 Received: from bert (bert [131.204.46.47]) by bert.acesag.auburn.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA06076; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 09:34:46 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 09:34:45 -0500 (CDT) From: "Gregory A. Parmer" X-Sender: gparmer@bert To: Bruce Plecan , diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: 1227747 pinout In-Reply-To: <01bd6ad6$df600740$43198fd1@nacelp> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Sat, 18 Apr 1998, Bruce Plecan wrote: > For those of you working on the bench 747 part of the Prog 101, Gives "bench racing" new meaning! My harness is from a 1988 88 Olds ('783), so I know I've got differences related to the DIS (and MAF?). I've noted my diffs and additions with "**"--mostly for my records. May be worth a look though. -greg > A1 drk grn/wht Fuel pump relay > A2 Brn Air Port* **Grn/blk** > A3 Grn/Yel Canister Purge* > A4 Gray EGR* > A5 brn/wht SES Light > A6 pnk/blk Ign power > A7 Tan/Blk MT/Shift, or TCC* > A8 orgn Serial Data > A9 Wht/Blk Diagnostic Test > A10 brn VSS [becomes Brn/white INSIDE THE CAR---ECM harness same] > A11 blk/Pnk MAP Grnd **A11 Blue** > A12 Blk/Wht ECM Grnd > > B1 orgn Battery > B2 Tan/Wht fuel pump input > B3 blk/red Dist ref low **B4 Wht Sumthin in DIS** > B5 ppl/wht Distr ref pulse **B6 Yellow ?** > B7 blk EST Retard **B7 yellow/blk To sumthing DIS(?) on firewall** > B8 Grn A/C Signal* > B10 org/blk P/N Switch > > C3-6 blu/grn's IAC > C8 Drk Grn 4th gear switch* **C7 Drk Grn to trans connector** **C8 Lght Blu to trans connector** > C9 ppl/wht Crank **C9 yel to inside the car** > C10 yel Coolant temp > C11 lt grn Map **C11 biege** **C12 Blk/yel (it was an SFI inj on the '783!--- ----lose this one)** > C13 Drk Blu TPS > C14 gry 5v ref (sensors) **C15 (another SFI inj---not used in '747)** > C16 orng battery > > D1+2 blk grounds **D2 Grn to ??? ** > D4 wht Spark timing out **D4 empty -- I gotta find a new wire for that one!** > D5 tan/blk Ign mod bypass **D5 tan** > D6 tan Ox ref low **Ie., grnd** > D7 ppl Ox sesnor high **D11 Blk/pnk AC Relay and a sensor of some sort** > D15+16 Injector > D14+C15 Injector From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 11:16:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA02139 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 11:16:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA02135 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 11:16:29 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-17.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.35]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id LAA06923 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 11:15:18 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: 747 vs. 730 Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 11:16:09 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6c6f$3f5756a0$23198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Bruce.. You mentioned 747, but I looked all over town and was not able to come up with one, what I did find and bought was a 730 ECM, out of an 89 Beretta... Is this compatible with the 747 at all...??? > >Thanks.. As far as I know the 747 was used for TBI applications and the 730 was used for TPI, in oem designs. Depending on the success of the 747 project hopefully we'll do the 730. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 11:18:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA02167 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 11:18:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from newton.ccs.tuns.ca (fagunddj@newton.ccs.Tuns.Ca [134.190.1.4]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA02163 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 11:18:06 -0400 Received: from localhost (fagunddj@localhost) by newton.ccs.tuns.ca (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA03524 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 12:19:23 -0300 (ADT) Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 12:18:40 -0300 (ADT) From: Dennis J Fagundo To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Still looking for Impreza info? (Garfield?) In-Reply-To: <199804201426.HAA17979@diamond.sunset.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi. to whoever was looking for the Impreza info. I just got home (Bermuda) from school and saw an ad for the impreza if the parts manuals are needed or whatever let me know and I will see what I can do. have been learning a ton from this list and would love to be able to help. Dennis ________________________________________________ Dennis Fagundo fagunddj@tuns.ca dfagundo@ibl.bm Technical University of Nova Scotia http://www.tuns.ca/~fagunddj _______________________________________________ From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 13:21:40 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA03746 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 13:21:40 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA03742 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 13:21:36 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA468 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 10:21:37 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Still looking for Impreza info? (Garfield?) Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 10:22:19 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <359e8135.122707593@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id NAA03743 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Mon, 20 Apr 1998 12:18:40 -0300 (ADT), Dennis J Fagundo wrote: >to whoever was looking for the Impreza info. I just got home (Bermuda) >from school and saw an ad for the impreza if the parts manuals are needed >or whatever let me know and I will see what I can do. > >have been learning a ton from this list and would love to be able to help. Hey Dennis. Yeah, I know the feeling. We've got a couple guys working on it, got one contact I can pursue over in the UK (thanks to Gus Cameron) and another guy in Oz is looking for a sheet he thinks he has with a full taxonomy of that engine/models/yr/power/etc (TIA to Peter Jaramaz). But since this is sorta off-topic for the list, and I'd like to find out a little bit more from ya, I'll carry on via email after this one, OK? Mainly I'm intrigued that NS would be importing them, but that they somehow missed main Canuckland? Seems odd. Anyway, talk to ya later via email. Thanks for the kind offer to help. Most appreciated. Gar From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 15:37:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA05023 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 15:37:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA05019 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 15:37:14 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id PAA18749; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 15:37:12 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA00063 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 15:36:13 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 15:36:13 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804201936.PAA00063@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980420153409.007a4a70@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 15:34:09 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: David Zug Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Greetings, I'm hoping that "David Zug" is on this mailing list. He built a 68HC11-based EFI system from scratc for his turbo'd 89 Grand Prix, and his website link (from Yahoo and AltaVista anyway) is dead, dead, dead. David, if you're on the list, please hollar :) Thanks, Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 15:40:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA05071 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 15:40:54 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from diamond.sunset.net (root@diamond.sunset.net [205.138.253.252]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA05067 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 15:40:52 -0400 Received: from default (d117.earth.sunset.net [205.138.253.117]) by diamond.sunset.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA05975 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 12:43:56 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804201943.MAA05975@diamond.sunset.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: Subject: Re: 747 vs. 730 Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 12:47:40 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu So between the 747 and the 730, I would believe that would make these two probably the more common units available for the late 80/early 90's era... While I am on the subject of ECM's I was wondering what the PROM chip is in these units.. Not to babble but I am working with a fellow from austrailia that has plans for a DIY'ers eprom burner. I have been going back and forth with him regarding it's abilities as for burning ECM proms. I am aware of the 2732 of the older ECM's, what other EPROM's are in wide popular use speaking GM only. As a new user I have a good prespective to the idiots guide to EFI, and this web page is great! Within a week I should have revised plans providing I get info to him regarding what EPROM's it should support, then I will post his link to the list, incase there are any other folks that do not have an eprom burner and wish to make they're own. Derek ---------- > From: Bruce Plecan > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Re: 747 vs. 730 > Date: Monday, April 20, 1998 8:16 AM > > >Bruce.. You mentioned 747, but I looked all over town and was not able to > come up with one, what I did find and bought was a 730 ECM, out of an 89 > Beretta... Is this compatible with the 747 at all...??? > > > >Thanks.. > > > As far as I know the 747 was used for TBI applications and the 730 > was used for TPI, in oem designs. Depending on the success of the 747 > project hopefully we'll do the 730. > Bruce > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 17:04:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA06608 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:04:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA06604 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:04:05 -0400 Received: from mail4.microsoft.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id RAA20895; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:04:05 -0400 Received: by INET-04-IMC with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 14:04:05 -0700 Message-ID: From: Don Berry To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Introduction - Don Berry Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 14:04:02 -0700 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello, I'm Don Berry and I have been a list member for a couple of weeks. I am very impressed with the "quality to noise ratio" of this list. I am a Sr. Network Engineer for Microsoft and responsible for internal corporate networks outside of the US. My passion is drag racing and I have a 9 second '67 Camaro, a couple of show cars an a '64 Chevy II as my daily driver. Currently I am in the engineering stages of my next hot rod. I am planning to build a twin turbo, intercooled small block Chevrolet for one of my Camaros, a '68 convertible. A dyi-efi is high on my list of requirements. Has anyone used the Intel 8XC196 series microcontrollers for diy-efi? The reason I ask is that I have an ICE (in circuit emulator) that would be very helpful for this type of a project. I originally came by this when I was investigating a dyi data acquisition system but didn't have the resources to complete (both time and skill). Thanks! Don Berry From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 17:17:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA06769 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:17:21 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA06764 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:17:17 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-32.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.101]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id RAA16575 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:16:21 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: 747 vs. 730 Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:17:14 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6ca1$b060a4a0$65198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Derek Jewett To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Monday, April 20, 1998 4:10 PM Subject: Re: 747 vs. 730 >So between the 747 and the 730, I would believe that would make these two probably the more common units available for the late 80/early 90's era... The 747 was used in gm pickups (v-6-8s) from 85-91. The 730 was used in numerous cars from about the same error. The 747 uses a 2732, the 730 a 27256. > >Derek > >> As far as I know the 747 was used for TBI applications and the 730 was used for TPI, in oem designs. Depending on the success of the 747 project hopefully we'll do the 730. >> Bruce Again cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 17:21:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA06849 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:21:41 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from linet06.li.net (linet06.li.net [199.171.6.16]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA06844 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:21:40 -0400 Received: from linet01 (jgn@linet01.li.net [199.171.6.11]) by linet06.li.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA05657 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:23:40 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:21:39 -0400 (EDT) From: John Napoli X-Sender: jgn@linet01 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Introduction - Don Berry In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi, Don, welcome to the list, good luck with your projects, and are you looking for a job in the Banking industry? (I'm serious.) Thanks, John On Mon, 20 Apr 1998, Don Berry wrote: > Hello, I'm Don Berry and I have been a list member for a > couple of weeks. I am very impressed with the "quality to noise ratio" of > this list. I am a Sr. Network Engineer for Microsoft and responsible for > internal corporate networks outside of the US. My passion is drag racing and > I have a 9 second '67 Camaro, a couple of show cars an a '64 Chevy II as my > daily driver. > > Currently I am in the engineering stages of my next hot > rod. I am planning to build a twin turbo, intercooled small block Chevrolet > for one of my Camaros, a '68 convertible. A dyi-efi is high on my list of > requirements. > > Has anyone used the Intel 8XC196 series microcontrollers for > diy-efi? The reason I ask is that I have an ICE (in circuit emulator) that > would be very helpful for this type of a project. I originally came by this > when I was investigating a dyi data acquisition system but didn't have the > resources to complete (both time and skill). > > Thanks! > Don Berry > > > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 19:10:50 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA07924 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 19:10:50 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns2.icon.net (root@mailhost.icon.net [209.54.6.22]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA07919 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 19:10:49 -0400 Received: from darkstar (asnd26.icon.net [209.54.8.26]) by ns2.icon.net (8.8.8/Solstice (tm) Internet Mail Server (tm)) with ESMTP id SAA03713; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 18:11:17 -0500 Message-ID: <353BD61F.F80ACD3A@icon.net> Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 18:11:28 -0500 From: staton X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DIY_EFI-Digest , EFI332-Digest Subject: 68hc11 and C code X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have a bag of E28F008SA Flash ram's that are SMT mount items. I would like to trade someone some of these for a C code FI program for the 68hc11, I have all the needed expertise on the mechanical, & machine end but I am a beginner at programming if interested e-mail direct to avoid the clutter in the list. I have the programs from the efi332 file site. Jimmy staton@icon.net From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 20:05:12 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA08542 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 20:05:12 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lnagate.foxboro.com.au (lnagate.foxboro.com.au [202.12.113.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA08538 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 20:05:10 -0400 X-Received: (qmail 10132 invoked from network); 21 Apr 1998 00:05:08 -0000 Received: from foxlnqtc.foxboro.com.au (HELO foxboro.com.au) (202.12.112.10) by gatekeeper.foxln.com.au with SMTP; 21 Apr 1998 00:05:08 -0000 Received: from wayneb-nt (fwserver [202.12.112.56]) by foxboro.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA02458 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 10:05:07 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980421100510.00933eb0@qtc-mail> X-Sender: wayneb@qtc-mail X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 10:05:10 +1000 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Wayne Blair Subject: Impreza Manauls Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi fellow listers: Garfield: You really summed up what sucks hope all the "listner only 's" where really listening. Some one mentioned me( maybe) directly about getting an Impreza Manual. Sorry I cant help but it would appear the other Aussies have come out and offered help. back to the fun wayne From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 21:16:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA09184 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 21:16:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kla-tencor.com (mail01.kla-tencor.com [206.67.220.38]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA09180 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 21:16:54 -0400 Received: from milxbh03.kla-tencor.com by kla-tencor.com (8.8.5/KLA-Tencor.3.6irm) id SAA02917; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 18:16:21 -0700 (PDT) Received: by exchange3.kla-tencor.com with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 18:16:31 -0700 Message-ID: <933713F1FB7BD111AC2300A0C98F1AD1775158@milxpr06.kla-tencor.com> From: "Buchholz, Steven" To: "'DIY-EFI'" Subject: Re: Intel B57684 EPROM Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 18:18:59 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id VAA09181 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I tried this direct reply about a week ago ... I'm thinking that it may not have made it, so I'm posting it to the list. My apologies to the rest of the list participants! TIA! Steve Buchholz San Jose, CA (USA) > ---------- > > The EPROM > > > device has an Intel logo on it and a device type of B57684. I'm > without > > > my nerd novels here at home and was wondering if any of you happen > to > > > have a databook that describes this device. It is a 28 pin, 0.6" > > > spacing package. I suspect it is similar to a 27128 or 27256, but > I'd > > > rather know than guess when I try to read it in. > > > > They usually use 27C256 and 27C512. Try 27C512 and look at $8000. If > there´s > > the same data as at $0000 then it´s a 27C256. If you tell me the > ECU-no. > > (0261 ...) and the chip-no. (126735 ...) (each no. has 10 digits) I > can tell you > > the chip type exactly. > > > Vielen danken! > > I have put the box back together again (so that I could get to work!), > so I can't get the number of the part on the EPROM. It was silly of > me not to write it down! Here are all of the numbers on the exterior > of the box. There is an orange Bosch (Motronic) label which has a > number of 0261 200 250. There is also a plain white label that has 4 > numbers with bar codes printed on it. From top to bottom the numbers > are: 146 4417 , 166.12 , 26 SA 1053 , 1759000166 > > I truly appreciate any help you can give me with getting more > information on this box. It is installed in a 1992 BMW k1 motorcycle > (US spec of course). Do you know if there is any way to get the code > for the European version of this bike's code? I have also heard that > this controller does support closed loop operation simply with the > addition of an OXS, can you confirm this? > > Regards and thanks, > Steve Buchholz > San Jose, CA (USA) > > > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 21:49:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA09429 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 21:49:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA09425 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 21:48:57 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-34.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.52]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id VAA25081 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 21:48:01 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Programming 101 Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 21:48:52 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6cc7$a2f81160$34198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Well if you have missed any of the prior postings on this I would recommend you read the archives, and catch up with this subject. Again, this is for educational purposes, and should only be done with adult supervision. Changes can lead to engine damage, loss of performance, and increased emissions. Any experiments with this subject manner should be for off-road use. In a great number of gm ecms there is what is called Power Enrichment, commonly called PE. There are numerous conditions that must be meet for it to be enabled. The trigger (if you will) is a percentage of TPS. Based on rpm once this theshold is exceeded it puts the ecm into PE, and the O2 sensor is ignored, and the engine answers the helm with a max effort. Now. there seems to be several opinions on how the ecm executes the mixture for this. One train of though is that the ecm basiclly goes open loop. Next is that the ecm applies a correction to the WOT mixture from the block lean correction. The third view is that the ecm applies only a correction of richness from the BL correction. IMHE, it's one of the later two. It also appears to vary from application to application. If you follow the tune-up procedures from my earlier postings it is really a mute point. The percent of TPS to enable PE appears to be at 047D-0485. We covered the WOT spark adder, so now we must look for a WOT Air/Fuel Ratio. That would be at 0487-048E.. Hmm, maybe next we'll talk abit about the math used in some of the tables settings we've found. Again I invite any and all to contribute any information they might have about tables, enables, switchs, and there addresses. No worries mate Bruce Again when refering to this text please edit the rely. nacelp@bright.net From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 22:06:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA09633 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 22:06:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA09628 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 22:06:29 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-34.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.52]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id WAA05533 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 22:05:31 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: MAP vs MAF, again Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 22:06:22 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6cca$14eb4b00$34198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu In the not to distant past there was a post about how when an individual changed from MAP to MAF in a engine with a larger than stock cam how the grams per second changed. As I recall the idle grams/second went from like 20 to 6, and the WOT went from 255 to like 150. I'm just curious if this was most probably from the lack of dampening of the MAP sensor. The MAF has to change current loading (?), or some better engineering term to register a change, where in the MAP all it is a diaphram moving. My point is that in this case the MAP was actually more accurate, and the problem is actually how the ecm sees the more violent intake tract pulses. In one series of experiments I did I tried mounting the MAP on the engine, and then with various lines, starting with min lenght ID, and then large ID, and long line. What has always seemed to work best is a min lenght/ID hose from the manifold to the MAP sensor. Any other experiences, comments Cheers Bruce In the spirit of good will when you see a pal at work having a bad day, please feel free to offer him/her the use of your Cone Shaped Hat... From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 20 23:08:17 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA10380 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 23:08:17 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (pop3.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA10376 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 23:08:15 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-d53.foothill.net [209.76.43.53]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA03891 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 20:09:15 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 20:07:04 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6cd2$8feabea0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I found the opposite. On my V6, the WOT went from 130 to 255 and the idle went from 6 to 20. TK Owner of the only stealth cone-shaped hat -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Plecan To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Monday, April 20, 1998 7:49 PM Subject: MAP vs MAF, again >In the not to distant past there was a post about how when an >individual changed from MAP to MAF in a engine with a larger >than stock cam how the grams per second changed. As I recall >the idle grams/second went from like 20 to 6, and the WOT went >from 255 to like 150. I'm just curious if this was most probably from the >lack of dampening of the MAP sensor. The MAF has to change >current loading (?), or some better engineering term to register >a change, where in the MAP all it is a diaphram moving. My point is >that in this case the MAP was actually more accurate, and the >problem is actually how the ecm sees the more violent intake tract >pulses. In one series of experiments I did I tried mounting the MAP >on the engine, and then with various lines, starting with min lenght >ID, and then large ID, and long line. What has always seemed to >work best is a min lenght/ID hose from the manifold to the MAP >sensor. > Any other experiences, comments >Cheers >Bruce In the spirit of good will when you see a pal at work > having a bad day, please feel free to offer him/her > the use of your Cone Shaped Hat... > > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 01:23:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA11819 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 01:23:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ultra2.syspac.com (ultra2.syspac.com [204.96.14.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA11815 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 01:23:15 -0400 Received: from mailrelay.syspac.com ([204.96.14.7]) by ultra2.syspac.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-37030U5000L500S0) with ESMTP id AAA16734 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 22:20:41 -0700 Received: from p57079.syspac.com (p57079.syspac.com [204.181.57.79]) by mailrelay.syspac.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA16731 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 22:20:39 -0700 (MST) From: bamcknig@postoffice.syspac.com Message-Id: <199804210520.WAA16731@mailrelay.syspac.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 22:44:12 +0000 Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce I need a Map, not an MAP.. I am lost. MAF is a MASS AIR FLOW sensor. usually a hot wire or plate type? MAP is a Manifold Air Pressure sensor? What measures Atmospheric pressure(in a boat its a barometer)? How do I get Speed -Density? One or two sensors? Bob McKnight Phx AZ PS- These alphabets get me. At tax time I find myself putting a 1040 in my independent rear supension(IRS) and sending a 4:11 to the internal revenue system(IRS). My USB(universal serial bus) won't plug into my USB(upper Side Band) ham radio set. Although I hear if I buy a new transceiver I will be able to plug my USB into my USB. Between the Hieroglyphics on my computer screen and the alphonics of the Technical publications, I am losing what little command of the english language I had. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 01:57:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA12136 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 01:57:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (pop3.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA12132 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 01:57:30 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-d57.foothill.net [209.76.43.57]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA21462 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 22:58:29 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 22:56:18 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6cea$34060a00$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu You want a system using a MAP (manifold absolute pressure sensor - this is speed density), not a MAFS (mass air flow sensor). Remember, some systems that use a MASS sensor, also have a MAP for backup or to measure the barometric pressure (altitude). TK -----Original Message----- From: bamcknig@postoffice.syspac.com To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Monday, April 20, 1998 10:55 PM Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again >Bruce > >I need a Map, not an MAP.. >I am lost. MAF is a MASS AIR FLOW sensor. usually a hot wire or >plate type? MAP is a Manifold Air Pressure sensor? What measures >Atmospheric pressure(in a boat its a barometer)? How do I get >Speed -Density? One or two sensors? > >Bob McKnight >Phx AZ > PS- >These alphabets get me. At tax time I find myself putting a 1040 in >my independent rear supension(IRS) and sending a 4:11 to the internal >revenue system(IRS). My USB(universal serial bus) won't plug into my >USB(upper Side Band) ham radio set. Although I hear if I buy a new >transceiver I will be able to plug my USB into my USB. Between the >Hieroglyphics on my computer screen and the alphonics of the >Technical publications, I am losing what little command of the >english language I had. > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 02:40:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA12536 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 02:40:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA12530 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 02:40:53 -0400 Received: from chopper (du150-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.5.150]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id XAA25133 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 23:40:50 -0700 Message-Id: X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 23:23:31 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Ganz Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Way off Steve, first off now one here is proposing that we are making money from reverse engineering other products. AND if anyone does make something it should be the folks that do the work, not someone who takes the design and time that others have spent. So with comments like this, I guess that I hope that this attitued didn't exist. I guess that anything I now put up will be encased in epoxy and all partnumber ground off, and a connector on the end that has the numbers 1,2,3 on it. The idea of using other product to reverse engineer something has some questions, but I guess maybe you missed the point, and that is, if you try to make money with other hard work (which we are not with the EGO or other projects) then we are OK. Sandy At 02:48 PM 4/18/98 -0500, you wrote: >Don't you think you invoking a double standard. Look at this group >breaking O2 meter using an existing meter , reverse engineer GM boxes . >It will happen any way and there is no way to protect if they are in the >weeds reading mail . It will be built with a twist in the design . If >you don't want it copied DON' T post it. >After all, the posts are public domain you talk on the net the world >knows ,this is great power of the net and if it drops the price of the >standard unit down to $200 due to competition the goal was met. Remember >not all members want to build one, they want to use one. Build some pc >boards and sell them to the members and make a profit after all this is >the American way. I'll buy one. > > > > >Steve > >Sandy wrote: > >> YES, I think that this should be true of ALL stuff designed here, and >> if you >> are going to do something and make $$ with the designs, the (all) >> people >> involved must be contacted. Just a respect thing!! >> >> Sandy >> >> > >> >As I've said before, there's gonna be a stipulation in the permission >> to >> >use the circuit, that you not be making use of the circuit for >> >profit-making purposes, without express written permission. >> > >> >Make as many for you and your pals, AT COST, that you want, but you >> >start selling them for a profit, and yer name'll be mud, bud. >> > >> >Just a reminder. >> > >> >Garfield >> > > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 02:40:58 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA12540 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 02:40:58 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA12535 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 02:40:56 -0400 Received: from chopper (du150-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.5.150]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id XAA25142 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 23:40:53 -0700 Message-Id: X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 23:29:33 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Ganz Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980419203714.0079bc60@mail.qonline.com.au> References: <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Matthew, the real question is that are you adding value by doing something, ie making a PCB, building the kit, collection of parts, etc. That's different then taking a design, and selling for profit without the consent of the creator. IE, I design something, you start selling it without asking, that sucks. I did the work, I should be paid if anyone should. Just a matter of due dilligence. Sandy >I'm a uni student, with a little electronic background. I build and sell >things at VERY SMALL profit.... > >barely enough to make my time worthwhile. > >Why shouldn't I? > >I am most definenly not talking about setting up a comercial manufacturing >business. > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 04:08:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA13394 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 04:08:31 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA13390 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 04:08:28 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-014.mcn.net [208.26.146.14]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA27171 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 02:08:20 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <353C50FB.73286F36@mcn.net> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 01:55:39 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM Speed Density for 2.8L W engine References: <353AEFE7.682B@alphag.csd.uwm.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu David Garnier wrote: > > Shannen > > > > >ASMZ prom fits 87 A body (Celebrity) with 2.8, 4spd auto, > >federal emiss. > > God, you are good! :-) Yep you got most of it, other than > it's a eurosport wagon with 3.31 gears. I was surprised to > find that there was different versions for different gear > ratios... I rememeber hearing someplace that transmissions > are calibrated to engines these days. When I was at my local > Chevy dealer, I asked what is suppose to be in there and I > got the following. ECM's started as 1227730, then 16198262 > and then some others; I then started to get overloaded with > the details. I copied down off his tube, 1388ADCK, 3024ADRF, > 5486AAXN and 4456ADRF for memcals. I will go back there again > and verify this data. I have been looking for another Celebrity > with 2.8W engine without the speed density revision but I > haven't even found a speed density equiped Celebrity yet. The > bone yards I go to have the ECM already yanked and sorted only > by ECM number, $35 to $45 seems to be the going price in the > yards I have visited. I would like to try MAT version once > and see how it feels, seat of the pants that is. > > >Was that ECM remanufactured by Delco? > > I assume so since it had the typical GM stickon number and > barcode. The one I found for my wifes 90 olds 3.3L did say > it was remanufactured by Delco, so go figure. > > So, how where you able to tell me what I had? Have a good > friend or work for mister goodwrench? ;-) > > thanks > > dave garnier > -- That's interesting. Something seems funny about that ecm not having a removable prom, but I haven't dug around in enough of them to call myself any kind of expert. I work for the General, and looked that prom up in the bulletin about speed density conversion. I've done a few of these conversions, and I think the car runs better with s/d. BTW GM proms generally run around the same price as a junkyard ECM. Doubt that the MAF prom is available though. As far as all of the ecm number changes, there's a bunch. The parts guys have a chart they use when ordering reman units. Some day I'll copy it, but for now I've got enough information to worry about. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 04:30:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA13573 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 04:30:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha2.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.111]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA13569 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 04:30:20 -0400 Received: from CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha1.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.1]) by CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA07246 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 09:35:34 +0100 (BST) Received: from e130-pc1.sbu.ac.uk by CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (5.65v4.0/1.1.10.5/06Nov96-0356PM) id AA04312; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 09:29:20 +0100 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980421093455.00815c50@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Sender: cameroa@unix.sbu.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 09:34:55 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Gus Cameron Subject: Re: Intel B57684 EPROM In-Reply-To: <933713F1FB7BD111AC2300A0C98F1AD1775158@milxpr06.kla-tencor .com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu At 18:18 20/04/98 -0700, Steve B wrote: >I tried this direct reply about a week ago ... I'm thinking that it may >not have made it, so I'm posting it to the list. My apologies to the >rest of the list participants! > snip >> I have put the box back together again (so that I could get to work!), >> so I can't get the number of the part on the EPROM. It was silly of >> me not to write it down! Here are all of the numbers on the exterior >> of the box. There is an orange Bosch (Motronic) label which has a >> number of 0261 200 250. There is also a plain white label that has 4 >> numbers with bar codes printed on it. From top to bottom the numbers >> are: 146 4417 , 166.12 , 26 SA 1053 , 1759000166 >> >> I truly appreciate any help you can give me with getting more >> information on this box. It is installed in a 1992 BMW k1 motorcycle >> (US spec of course). Do you know if there is any way to get the code >> for the European version of this bike's code? I have also heard that >> this controller does support closed loop operation simply with the >> addition of an OXS, can you confirm this? >> >> Regards and thanks, >> Steve Buchholz >> San Jose, CA (USA) >> >> Steve, I'm not quite sure where you are with code numbers etc etc but I can find out Euro spec Motronic BMW bike code with a bit of faffing about. In fact I have a box next to me with the code 0 261 200 758 on it, the Eprom is a TI with the legend 57 995 DP9249 printed on it and a silver label stuck over the top with 1 267 357 525 printed on. I have absolutely no idea of the relavence/significance of these codes. And I'm not even totally sure what bike this box was from (but probably a euro k100rs). Oh yes, nothing but high quality information from me this (wet, grey, got drenched riding into work, merry old blighty etc) morning! All the best, gus From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 04:57:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA13916 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 04:57:38 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha2.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.111]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA13910 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 04:57:35 -0400 Received: from CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha1.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.1]) by CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA23994 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 10:02:49 +0100 (BST) Received: from e130-pc1.sbu.ac.uk by CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (5.65v4.0/1.1.10.5/06Nov96-0356PM) id AA30062; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 09:56:35 +0100 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980421100210.007fb100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Sender: cameroa@unix.sbu.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 10:02:10 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Gus Cameron Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.5.32.19980419203714.0079bc60@mail.qonline.com.au> <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just to change the subject a little bit.... Can anyone tell me how lambda/AF ratio relates to the true % oxygen? Has anyone ever heard of anyone using these ion pump sensors for non-automotive applications? The reason I ask is that in the course of my work (I'm a biochemist, ex-biochemical engineer) I use mass specs and paramagnetic O2 meters to measure %O2 from athletes lungs. These gizmos are v. accurate but you dont wanna know the cost, and the response time / reliability isnt always what we would like (and we can only afford a couple of them). Maybe a EGO sensor is what we need? Thought, truth be told, these athletes have enough problems with their egos as it is, heh heh. TIA, gus From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 06:07:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA14700 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 06:07:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from crianlarich.indigo-avs.com (crianlarich.indigo-avs.com [194.200.210.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id GAA14696 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 06:06:57 -0400 Received: by crianlarich.indigo-avs.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BD6D15.349FF180@crianlarich.indigo-avs.com>; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 11:04:08 +0100 Message-ID: From: Robert Humphris To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Introduction - Don Berry Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 11:04:07 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 Encoding: 33 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu So lets all start with the 'Windows for Chevy' jokes hehehe Rob Humphris >---------- >From: Don Berry[SMTP:donbe@microsoft.com] >Sent: 20 April 1998 22:04 >To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu >Subject: Introduction - Don Berry > > Hello, I'm Don Berry and I have been a list member for a >couple of weeks. I am very impressed with the "quality to noise ratio" of >this list. I am a Sr. Network Engineer for Microsoft and responsible for >internal corporate networks outside of the US. My passion is drag racing and >I have a 9 second '67 Camaro, a couple of show cars an a '64 Chevy II as my >daily driver. > > Currently I am in the engineering stages of my next hot >rod. I am planning to build a twin turbo, intercooled small block Chevrolet >for one of my Camaros, a '68 convertible. A dyi-efi is high on my list of >requirements. > > Has anyone used the Intel 8XC196 series microcontrollers for >diy-efi? The reason I ask is that I have an ICE (in circuit emulator) that >would be very helpful for this type of a project. I originally came by this >when I was investigating a dyi data acquisition system but didn't have the >resources to complete (both time and skill). > > Thanks! > Don Berry > > > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 10:29:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA16651 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 10:29:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.earthworld.com (falcon.earthworld.com [198.145.144.251]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA16647 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 10:29:55 -0400 Received: from tcpab20.earthworld.com [198.145.145.154] by mail.earthworld.com (SMTPD32-4.03) id ADED1AD6013C; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 07:32:13 PDT Message-ID: <353C9FC1.2B4E@earthworld.com> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 06:31:45 -0700 From: Jon X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0 (Win16; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: EEC4 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have talked to a Ford engineer about the adaptive capability of EEC-4 system. Specifically, I want to use a 1986 5.0 Crown Victoria SFI on a 3.5 liter Buick aluminum V-8. He told me it ought to work, taking about 20 minutes for the controller to figure out my engine. Rover inlet manifold bolts up. Distributor rotates the wrong way, so I made a new interupter. Has anyone tried such a conversion? Jon Axt, Aloha Oregon From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 10:50:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA16868 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 10:50:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imes.com ([209.184.4.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA16864 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 10:50:14 -0400 Received: from elvis by imes.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA22836; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 09:51:59 -0500 Message-ID: <353C68EF.1FD1@imes.com> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 09:37:51 +0000 From: steve ravet Organization: International Meta Systems X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Introduction - Don Berry References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Robert Humphris wrote: > > So lets all start with the 'Windows for Chevy' jokes hehehe > > Rob Humphris If Microsoft were located in West Virginia... they'd call it "winders 95". You'd be able to repair your PC with parts from an old Trans Am Instead of "Yes, No, Cancel" your choices would be "Aww-right, Nah, and Git" When you started soundplayer, you'd hear "Freebird". Apologies to MS employees and West Virginia residents... :-) --steve -- Steve Ravet International Meta Systems http://www.imes.com steve@imes.com From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 11:31:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA17468 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 11:31:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA17464 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 11:31:25 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-40.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.58]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id LAA18682 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 11:30:29 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: NA FWD 148 Bin Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 11:31:23 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6d3a$8a62bf60$3a198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Would anyone have a bin for a 86, 3.8 FWD Buick/Olds using a 1227148 or know if it is the same code/table locations as a GN/TType?.. Or better yet if ya can just use a GN Editor to change the table entries for a NA prom?. Thanks Bruce From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 12:40:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA18445 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 12:40:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA18440 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 12:40:00 -0400 Received: from hpnfssvr.mdhc.mdc.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id MAA19938; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 12:39:44 -0400 Received: from hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com (tc75918@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com [130.38.233.24]) by hpnfssvr.mdhc.mdc.com with ESMTP (8.7.6/8.7.3) id JAA23840 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 09:39:32 -0700 (MST) Received: (from tc75918@localhost) by hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com (8.7.6/8.7.1) id JAA04150 for DIY_EFI@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 09:39:31 -0700 (MST) From: d houlton x0710 Message-Id: <199804211639.JAA04150@hprs9.mdhc.mdc.com> Subject: Re: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo (Revisit: slightly off topic) To: DIY_EFI@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (EFI ) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 09:39:31 -0700 (MST) Organization: McDonnell Douglas Helicopter X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL24] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu This is a re-cap of the thread a few weeks ago. I ask this again as I now have my turbo from a junk yard doner and want to clean it and the manifold up a bit and coat it in the appropriate manner. From all the input before, this is what I gather to be the best advice. Please let me know if anything doesn't look right. For the inside of the manifold and the inside of the turbine scroll housing and its inlet and outlet (all cast iron): Sand blast and coat with: TLHB (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-3.html) or CBC3 (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-2.html) or Black Satin (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-1.html) or Cermakrome (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-1.html) or A combination of these (i.e. CBC3 first, buff, then Black Satin) Any advantage to this? Is any one of these particularly better than the other? I know Black Satin and Cermakrom are available from Summit and are water-based so you can bake them in the kitchen oven (if needed). For the outside of the manifold and turbine housing: Nothing? Coating here would tend to keep the heat in the metal. The idea is to keep the heat in the exhaust gasses by coating the inside, but let the heat that does go to the metal escape to the outside air right? Maybe something that *isn't* a thermal barrier, but can take the heat and looks nicer than rusty cast iron? For the inside of the scroll housing of the compressor and its inlet and outlet: DFL-1 (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-2.html) Then buff with Scotch Brite before assembly. Do you sandblast first? For the outside of compressor: Nothing. For the turbo shaft and bearings: Buff with Scitch Brite then coat with: WSX (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-2.html) For the turbine and compressor blades and their housings: Nothing. The barrier will likely be thick enough to cause damage due to heat expansion and tight tolerances. Although, DFL-1 goes on between .0005" and .0015" and can apparently be buffed to a .0002" thickness after application so it may work, but I don't know that I'd want to chance it. Is that still too thick? OR: Hose the whole thing off with de-greaser, pre-lube with oil, slap it on and don't worry about it. All sand blasting is with fine sand at 40 psi with a suction-type blaster. No glass bead. Blasted parts are cleaned with acetone before applying coating. Tools: I have the compressor and will get the sand blaster for the job. The parts are relatively small so I'll use an airbrush normally used for model airplanes. Any more comments? thanks --Dan From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 13:16:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA18832 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 13:16:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from scarlet.buffalostate.edu (dave@scarlet2.buffalostate.edu [136.183.135.41]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA18826 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 13:16:22 -0400 Received: from localhost (dave@localhost) by scarlet.buffalostate.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA06401 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 13:16:03 -0400 Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 13:16:03 -0400 (EDT) From: "Dave J. Andruczyk" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again In-Reply-To: <199804210520.WAA16731@mailrelay.syspac.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > I need a Map, not an MAP.. > I am lost. MAF is a MASS AIR FLOW sensor. usually a hot wire or > plate type? MAP is a Manifold Air Pressure sensor? What measures > Atmospheric pressure(in a boat its a barometer)? How do I get > Speed -Density? One or two sensors? MAP = Manifold Absoulte Pressure sensor. I see and optimal system utilizing both sensors. MAP is excellent at showing relative load and MPG ( by vacuum), and MAF is excellent for compensating for engine mods, (polished heads, free flow exhaust, etc..) dave From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 14:52:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA19885 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 14:52:42 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from transfer.usit.net (root@transfer.usit.net [208.10.171.67]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA19881 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 14:52:39 -0400 Received: from atn410 (DIALUP69.TNBUL.USIT.NET [199.1.58.100] (may be forged)) by transfer.usit.net (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id OAA29410 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 14:52:32 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <353CEB01.55D@usit.net> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 14:52:49 -0400 From: Derek Organization: Alltrista Zinc Products X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-KIT (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Modified Fuel Injection Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I run a 455 cu in Pontiac motor in a 1976 Trans Am. As I am not aware of any fuel injection made for this engine, I am considering modifying an existing fuel injection setup from another engine to suit. I believe that mass air flow systems are more flexible in terms of accomodating variations in operating parameters and with this in mind I wonder if using say a mass air flow GM or Ford setup might work with the following modifications 1. larger airflow sensor and throttle body unit. 2. larger injectors. Anyone have any thoughts or information - derekt@usit.com From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 15:29:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA20246 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 15:29:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sgi.sgi.com (SGI.COM [192.48.153.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA20242 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 15:29:29 -0400 Received: from aspire.dearborn.sgi.com ([169.238.139.226]) by sgi.sgi.com (980309.SGI.8.8.8-aspam-6.2/980304.SGI-aspam) via SMTP id MAA09513; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 12:29:28 -0700 (PDT) mail_from (afgun@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com) Received: from mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com by aspire.dearborn.sgi.com via ESMTP (950413.SGI.8.6.12/930416.SGI) id PAA26843; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 15:29:25 -0400 Received: (from afgun@localhost) by mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) id PAA28659; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 15:29:23 -0400 From: "Andrew F. Gunnesch" Message-Id: <9804211529.ZM28657@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 15:29:23 -0400 In-Reply-To: Derek "Modified Fuel Injection" (Apr 21, 2:52pm) References: <353CEB01.55D@usit.net> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.3 08feb96 MediaMail) To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection Cc: Derek Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Rance Fuel Injection sells dual quad manifolds modified for port fuel injection, along with other components. Check them out at: http://www.rancefi.com/ On Apr 21, 2:52pm, Derek wrote: > Subject: Modified Fuel Injection > I run a 455 cu in Pontiac motor in a 1976 Trans Am. > As I am not aware of any fuel injection made for this engine, I am > considering modifying an existing fuel injection setup from another > engine to suit. > I believe that mass air flow systems are more flexible in terms of > accomodating variations in operating parameters and with this in mind I > wonder if using say a mass air flow GM or Ford setup might work with the > following modifications > 1. larger airflow sensor and throttle body unit. > 2. larger injectors. > > Anyone have any thoughts or information - derekt@usit.com >-- End of excerpt from Derek From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 15:45:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA20430 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 15:45:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA20426 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 15:45:06 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp125.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.125]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA04538 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 15:49:33 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 15:42:58 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: <353CEB01.55D@usit.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > I run a 455 cu in Pontiac motor in a 1976 Trans Am. > As I am not aware of any fuel injection made for this engine, I am > considering modifying an existing fuel injection setup from another > engine to suit. > I believe that mass air flow systems are more flexible in terms of > accomodating variations in operating parameters and with this in mind I > wonder if using say a mass air flow GM or Ford setup might work with the > following modifications > 1. larger airflow sensor and throttle body unit. > 2. larger injectors. > > Anyone have any thoughts or information - derekt@usit.com on that topic,i'm currious if a 454 Vortec fuel injection system would fit (rather important) & work (i guess it will work fine after all) on this motor ?? Alain From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 16:19:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA21040 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:19:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from smtp4.ny.us.ibm.COM (smtp4.ny.us.ibm.com [198.133.22.43]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA21036 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:19:55 -0400 Received: from relay3.server.ibm.com (relay3.server.ibm.com [9.14.2.100]) by smtp4.ny.us.ibm.COM (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA64648 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:12:48 -0400 Received: from US.IBM.COM (d04lms02.raleigh.ibm.com [9.37.164.194]) by relay3.server.ibm.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA62294 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:15:29 -0400 Received: by US.IBM.COM (Soft-Switch LMS 2.0) with snapi via D04AU004 id 5040200014247281; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:23:39 -0400 From: Jason Greene To: Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again Message-ID: <5040200014247281000002L012*@MHS> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:23:39 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Is there a way to convert an EFI system that uses MAFS to a systemthat uses a MAP and keep the same ECU? Jason G. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 16:44:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA21417 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:44:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.cgocable.net (mail.cgocable.net [24.226.1.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA21408 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:44:52 -0400 Received: from cgocable.net (cgowave-26-13.cgocable.net [24.226.26.13]) by mail.cgocable.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id QAA18595; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:44:53 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <353D06FF.C52375FC@cgocable.net> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:52:16 -0400 From: Emmett X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu CC: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC4 References: <353C9FC1.2B4E@earthworld.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Jon wrote: > I have talked to a Ford engineer about the adaptive capability of EEC-4 > system. Specifically, I want to use a 1986 5.0 Crown Victoria SFI on a > 3.5 liter Buick aluminum V-8. He told me it ought to work, taking about > 20 minutes for the controller to figure out my engine. Rover inlet > manifold bolts up. Distributor rotates the wrong way, so I made a new > interupter. Has anyone tried such a conversion? > Jon Axt, Aloha Oregon Now this I would like to see! Im been told EEC is smart but that smart? OOPs good thing I reread message I thought it said GM6. V8 - no problem. That sould stir em up. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 16:44:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA21418 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:44:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.cgocable.net (mail.cgocable.net [24.226.1.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA21412 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:44:54 -0400 Received: from cgocable.net (cgowave-26-13.cgocable.net [24.226.26.13]) by mail.cgocable.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id QAA18595; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:44:53 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <353D06FF.C52375FC@cgocable.net> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 16:52:16 -0400 From: Emmett X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu CC: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC4 References: <353C9FC1.2B4E@earthworld.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Jon wrote: > I have talked to a Ford engineer about the adaptive capability of EEC-4 > system. Specifically, I want to use a 1986 5.0 Crown Victoria SFI on a > 3.5 liter Buick aluminum V-8. He told me it ought to work, taking about > 20 minutes for the controller to figure out my engine. Rover inlet > manifold bolts up. Distributor rotates the wrong way, so I made a new > interupter. Has anyone tried such a conversion? > Jon Axt, Aloha Oregon Now this I would like to see! Im been told EEC is smart but that smart? OOPs good thing I reread message I thought it said GM6. V8 - no problem. That sould stir em up. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 17:02:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA21758 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 17:02:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail-in1.inet.tele.dk (mail-in1.inet.tele.dk [194.182.148.158]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA21754 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 17:02:53 -0400 Received: (qmail 29505 invoked from network); 21 Apr 1998 20:56:02 -0000 Received: from post7.tele.dk (194.239.134.170) by mail-in1.inet.tele.dk with SMTP; 21 Apr 1998 20:56:02 -0000 Received: from default ([194.239.155.94]) by post7.tele.dk (Netscape Mail Server v2.02) with ESMTP id AAA27812 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 22:56:00 +0200 From: "=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jens_J=F8rgen_Larsen?=" To: Subject: Sv: Intel B57684 EPROM Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 22:49:07 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-ID: <19980421205559.AAA27812@default> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello Steve. Are you sure about the B... number ? I have some Intel proms which are labeled B57604; yes, there is a slash through the zero, but it is still a zero. If the number is B57604 then the prom is a 27256. The way I find out was to read the Silicon Signature ( a electronic ID code inside the device). This can be done with a programmer (not all programmers can do it), I use a Dataman S4. The readout from S4 is: Silicon Signature Signature: 8904 Intel 27256 12.75V Burn pin. 1 100uS No overprog. Alg. 22, Ref 080E Good luck. J.J Larsen Denmark ---------- > Fra: Buchholz, Steven > Til: 'DIY-EFI' > Emne: Re: Intel B57684 EPROM > Dato: 21. april 1998 03.18 > > I tried this direct reply about a week ago ... I'm thinking that it may > not have made it, so I'm posting it to the list. My apologies to the > rest of the list participants! > > > Regards and thanks, > > Steve Buchholz > > San Jose, CA (USA) > > > > > > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 17:34:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA22394 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 17:34:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA22389 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 17:34:43 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA18331 for ; Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:45:10 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Impreza Manauls Date: Mon, 20 Apr 1998 17:45:52 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <3543e8c4.3666312@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <3.0.1.32.19980421100510.00933eb0@qtc-mail> In-Reply-To: <3.0.1.32.19980421100510.00933eb0@qtc-mail> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id RAA22390 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Tue, 21 Apr 1998 10:05:10 +1000, Wayne Blair wrote: >You really summed up what sucks, hope all the "listener only's" where really >listening. Hope doth spring eternal. Dealing with the bugs is just part of campin out, tho. Ya just gotta try not to focus on em. Heh. And if you build a big enough fire and make enough smoke, they go away anyhoo! >Some one mentioned me( maybe) directly about getting an Impreza Manual. >Sorry I cant help but it would appear the other Aussies have come out and >offered help. Not a problem, mate. Got yer fellow countrymen and others comin outta the woodwork to help. I figure in another week, either from the UK or Oz, I'll have a source nailed down. Profuse thanks to ALL who have helped so far. Waytago DIY'ers. PeterJ came through with the WRX taxonomy docs, thanks PJ (gads 280HP from a 2.0L factory engine...whew them Soob guys don't mess around!). Another reason to call them "boxer" engines. >back to the fun Might as well. Life is short and uncertain; always eat dessert first! Gar From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 17:44:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA22537 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 17:44:19 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from uq.net.au (root@fox.uq.net.au [203.101.255.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA22531 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 17:44:14 -0400 Received: from localhost (zzchack@localhost [127.0.0.1]) by uq.net.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id HAA20325 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 07:44:11 +1000 (GMT+1000) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 07:44:11 +1000 (GMT+1000) From: Christian David Hack To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: David Zug In-Reply-To: <199804210900.FAA13945@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu This is his new page. I found it using metacrawler. http://www.delanet.com/~tgp/89gpturbo.html CYA Christian From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 19:21:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA28173 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 19:21:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from out4.ibm.net (out4.ibm.net [165.87.194.239]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28164 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 19:21:47 -0400 Received: from ibm.net (slip-32-100-246-253.ny.us.ibm.net [32.100.246.253]) by out4.ibm.net (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA18860; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:21:43 GMT Message-ID: <353D2B0B.29B4C72E@ibm.net> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 19:26:04 -0400 From: "Christopher G. Moog" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu CC: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC4 References: <353C9FC1.2B4E@earthworld.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Jon wrote: > Specifically, I want to use a 1986 5.0 Crown Victoria SFI on a > 3.5 liter Buick aluminum V-8. He told me it ought to work, taking about > 20 minutes for the controller to figure out my engine. Rover inlet > manifold bolts up. Distributor rotates the wrong way, so I made a new > interupter. Has anyone tried such a conversion? > Jon Axt, Aloha Oregon Thats why I'm subscribed. I've purchased a MAF system from a 1990 Mustang for use on a Rover 3.5 (Federal manifold from a FI Rover 3500) I'm building. I selected MAF because I figured it would be more forgiving. The distributor seems to be the only tricky part. Since Ford uses the hall effect signal to time the sequential fuel injection (one tooth is smaller than the others) I have to rig something up. Will figure it out after assembling the engine this summer. Good luck and let me know how yours works out. Chris Moog, Rome, NY From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 19:21:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA28174 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 19:21:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from out4.ibm.net (out4.ibm.net [165.87.194.239]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28168 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 19:21:50 -0400 Received: from ibm.net (slip-32-100-246-253.ny.us.ibm.net [32.100.246.253]) by out4.ibm.net (8.8.5/8.6.9) with ESMTP id XAA18860; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:21:43 GMT Message-ID: <353D2B0B.29B4C72E@ibm.net> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 19:26:04 -0400 From: "Christopher G. Moog" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu CC: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: EEC4 References: <353C9FC1.2B4E@earthworld.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Jon wrote: > Specifically, I want to use a 1986 5.0 Crown Victoria SFI on a > 3.5 liter Buick aluminum V-8. He told me it ought to work, taking about > 20 minutes for the controller to figure out my engine. Rover inlet > manifold bolts up. Distributor rotates the wrong way, so I made a new > interupter. Has anyone tried such a conversion? > Jon Axt, Aloha Oregon Thats why I'm subscribed. I've purchased a MAF system from a 1990 Mustang for use on a Rover 3.5 (Federal manifold from a FI Rover 3500) I'm building. I selected MAF because I figured it would be more forgiving. The distributor seems to be the only tricky part. Since Ford uses the hall effect signal to time the sequential fuel injection (one tooth is smaller than the others) I have to rig something up. Will figure it out after assembling the engine this summer. Good luck and let me know how yours works out. Chris Moog, Rome, NY From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 19:50:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA28779 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 19:50:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from online.no (pilt.online.no [193.212.1.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA28775 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 19:50:26 -0400 Received: from siemens-nixdorf (ti01a06-0004.dialup.online.no [130.67.1.132]) by online.no (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA08897 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:50:24 +0200 (MET DST) Message-Id: <199804212350.BAA08897@online.no> From: "Espen Hilde" To: Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:47:01 +0200 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1162 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have seen a "thing" from HKS thats supposed to do that,I have not tested it myself.Whats best of a GM, MAP or GM, MAF ? Is the maf fast enough for a big turbo on a small high rpm engine,with a sudden rush of power? ----------Espen Hilde > From: Jason Greene > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again > Date: 21. april 1998 22:23 > > Is there a way to convert an EFI system that uses MAFS to a systemthat uses a > MAP and keep the same ECU? > > Jason G. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 21:17:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA29796 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:17:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA29792 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:17:06 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-18.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.87]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id VAA12745 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:16:10 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:17:04 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6d8c$5c5a1b20$57198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Espen Hilde To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Tuesday, April 21, 1998 8:14 PM Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again >I have seen a "thing" from HKS thats supposed to do that,I have not tested it myself. I thought that was for a Vane type MAF sensor Whats best of a GM, MAP or GM, MAF ? On the buick turbo they used a MAF, and on the syclones they used MAP. The archives are full of opinions, and reasons for one being better than the other. The GN were mid 80's and the TTA 89, the syty's were 91+.. Is the maf fast enough for >a big turbo on a small high rpm engine,with a sudden rush of power? Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 21:32:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA29947 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:32:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA29943 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:32:00 -0400 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn42-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.201]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id UAA06199 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 20:28:52 -0400 Message-ID: <353D494D.7577@huron.net> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:35:09 -0400 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again References: <5040200014247281000002L012*@MHS> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Jason Greene wrote: > > Is there a way to convert an EFI system that uses MAFS to a systemthat uses a > MAP and keep the same ECU? > > Jason G. That'w what GM did when they went speed density. Change the PROM and use MAP instead of MASS. -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 21:34:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA30006 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:34:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from batch3.csd.uwm.edu (root@batch3.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.7.226]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA30002 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:34:56 -0400 Received: from alpha1.csd.uwm.edu (root@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.7.201]) by batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id UAA18886 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 20:34:55 -0500 (CDT) Received: from slirp-user.csd.uwm.edu (garnierd@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.7.201]) by alpha1.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with SMTP id UAA15139; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 20:34:45 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <353D6607.4279@alphag.csd.uwm.edu> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 20:37:43 -0700 From: David Garnier Organization: Say What? X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04Gold (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu, garnierd@batch3.csd.uwm.edu Subject: OTC's ecm system tester Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------5DC84824374" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu This is a multi-part message in MIME format. --------------5DC84824374 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello fellow DIY_EFI'ers I was looking through my OTC tool catalog looking for a tool when I stumbled upon the "ECM System Tester" tool. This tool is designed to be swapped in place of a questionable ECM for the purpose of toggling or measuring the various sensors for malfunctions. OTC was kind enough to list a number GM ECM's and their types. What a great list I thought, this would be *great* in a spead-sheet for general information, perusing the local junk yard or for the beginings of a general FAQ on ECM's that has been talked about. Enclosed is a sort by ECM number and it is in Excel 4 format. dave garnier --------------5DC84824374 Content-Type: application/octet-stream; name="GMECMS1.XLS" Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="GMECMS1.XLS" CQQGAAAAEAD2BVwAIAANZGF2aWQgZ2FybmllciAgICAgICAgICAgICAgICAgIAsCHADDAwAA AAB+ADYEAAA6BgAAqRkAAOksAADGPwAAQgACAOQEDAACAGQADQACAAEADgACAAEADwACAAEA EAAIAPyp8dJNYlA/EQACAAAAIgACAAAAKgACAAAAKwACAAEAXwACAAEAggACAAAAgAAIAAAA AAAAAAAAJQIEAAAA/wCMAAQAAQABAI0AAgAAAIEAAgDBBDECFADIAAAA/38NTVMgU2FucyBT ZXJpZjECFADIAAEA/38NTVMgU2FucyBTZXJpZjECFADIAAIA/38NTVMgU2FucyBTZXJpZjEC FADIAAMA/38NTVMgU2FucyBTZXJpZjECFADIAAAA/38NTVMgU2FucyBTZXJpZhQAAwACJkYV AAgAB1BhZ2UgJlCDAAIAAACEAAIAAAAmAAgAAAAAAAAA6D8nAAgAAAAAAAAA6D8oAAgAAAAA AAAA8D8pAAgAAAAAAAAA8D9NAAwAAAACAAEAZAAsASwBoQAMAAEAZAABAAEAAQAAAEAAAgAA AFYAAgAbAB4ECgAAAAdHZW5lcmFsHgQEAAEAATAeBAcAAQEEMC4wMB4ECAABAgUjLCMjMB4E CwABAwgjLCMjMC4wMB4EFAABBBEjLCMjMF8pO1woIywjIzBcKR4EGQABBRYjLCMjMF8pO1tS 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--------------5DC84824374-- From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 22:03:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA30542 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 22:03:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from vixa.voyager.net (vixa.voyager.net [198.109.136.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA30537 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 22:02:59 -0400 Received: from voyager.net (lnngmi175100.voyager.net [209.153.175.100]) by vixa.voyager.net (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA16590; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 22:00:17 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <353D51BA.A7977E5F@voyager.net> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 22:11:06 -0400 From: Daniel & Laura Burk X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Andrew Golden , "DIY_EFI-Digest@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu" Subject: Re: DIY 5th Wheel Questions References: <199804210418.XAA13140@mailhost.cyberramp.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I didn't finish it due to a change in jobs, family status, and priorities. I have the wheel and the IR box completed, and it works on the oscilloscope, indoors. The problem seems to be when I hook it up to the car and try to pull out of the garage. My speed goes from zero to about the speed of light in less than a second. Talk about eyeball flattening acceleration!! I think the IR receiver is either being saturated by exhaust gas, sunlight, or is picking up RFI from the engine. I was trying to run the IR transmitter with a DC signal. The idea was to saturate the IR receiver such that when the light path was broken, the sensor would turn off. Well, it didn't work for some reason. I think that the next step would be use a pulse-width-modulated signal with a period that is half the length of time that the light path is left open at the wheel's fastest rotation. Then, use a notch filter on the receiver's signal, amplify the result, route the output to a monostable multivibrator, and then pass it to a counter. This would eliminate the problem of extraneous noise from sunlight or other noise sources. By the way, I've haven't thought about this project for almost a year. How did you find out about it? BTW, I have a total of $30 in the bicycle tire, used mountain bike fork, aluminum flag holder from the hardware store, bungee cord, PVC, wood, black paint, and sensors. It tracks OK if you place enough preload on the bungee cord. The idea is to attach the bungee cord to the underside of the bar such that it places a torque at the hinged bracket that forces the rim onto the paved surface. I've only tested it to 45 MPH. Wheel imbalance becomes an issue at higher speeds. It could cause the rim to hop off the pavement. Daniel Burk. Andrew Golden wrote: > I was wondering if you ever finished your DIY 5th wheel project...If so, > what setup did you end up using? What is the cost to reproduce it? Any > info, words of wisdom, etc. that you can pass along would be greatly > apreciated -- Daniel & Laura email: ws6transam@voyager.net Burk Web site: http://www.isthq.com/~dan Haslett,MI Car stuff: http://www.isthq.com/~dan/fcar.html Dan's current interests: '84 Pontiac Trans Am L69/WS6 (retired) '89 Honda VTR 250 Interceptor The ultimate garage (Due in early June) '98 baby (Family cooperative project: Due in mid-June) From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 22:48:10 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA31311 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 22:48:10 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kauri.lincoln.ac.nz (kauri.lincoln.ac.nz [138.75.10.7]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA31306 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 22:48:07 -0400 Received: from whio.lincoln.ac.nz by kauri.lincoln.ac.nz (PMDF V5.1-9 #1) with ESMTP id <0ERS002X7NUHQ7@kauri.lincoln.ac.nz> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:49:31 +1200 (NZS) Received: from WHIO/SpoolDir by whio.lincoln.ac.nz (Mercury 1.40); Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:48:16 +1200 Received: from SpoolDir by WHIO (Mercury 1.40); Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:47:56 +1200 Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:44:36 +1200 From: Simon Quested Subject: Snake Oil! To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <0ERS002X8NUHQ7@kauri.lincoln.ac.nz> Organization: Lincoln University MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.00 beta 6) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Priority: normal Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi All If you guys are interested in a good article on oil additives have a look at this http://www.euro.net/TDRS/MINIWEB/oil_additives.html Snake Oil! Is That Additive Really A Negative? Article by Fred Rau Cheers Simon ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Simon Quested (E-mail questeds@lincoln.ac.nz) Computer Technician, Silicon Graphics & Windows NT Support Centre for Computing and Biometrics LINCOLN UNIVERSITY OF NEW ZEALAND Phone (64)(03) 3252811 Ext. 8087 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ http://www.lincoln.ac.nz/ccb/techs/simon/default.htm ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I drive way too fast to worry about cholesterol ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 23:32:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA31752 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:32:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo29.mx.aol.com (imo29.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.73]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA31748 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:32:55 -0400 Received: from ECMnut@aol.com by imo29.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8YFDa24124 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:31:20 +2000 (EDT) From: ECMnut Message-ID: <148991c5.353d6489@aol.com> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:31:20 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce, Mikey Pitts (tweaker author) once told me that the Turbo SFI has its own unique addresses. And that a Naturally aspirated bin wouldn't match at all. I would love to know if you find otherwise.. Mike V. From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 21 23:45:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA31941 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:45:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo25.mx.aol.com (imo25.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.69]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA31937 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:45:56 -0400 Received: from A70Duster@aol.com by imo25.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8SCFa15615 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:45:20 +2000 (EDT) From: A70Duster Message-ID: <9856c7bf.353d67d1@aol.com> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:45:20 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 69 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu You may read that the AMS (from GM units ) put out a voltage that is directly proportional to the Air Mass. That is NOT true. It is a parabolic function. Friendly advice. Good luck. See ya, Mike From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 00:03:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA32227 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 00:03:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from diamond.sunset.net (root@diamond.sunset.net [205.138.253.252]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA32223 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 00:03:31 -0400 Received: from default (d80.venus.sunset.net [205.138.253.80]) by diamond.sunset.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id VAA00167 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:06:43 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804220406.VAA00167@diamond.sunset.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: "Do-it-Yourself Fuel Injection" Subject: My thanks to Alain Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:10:22 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thanks a bunch Alain for the 101 info fwd's... Saved me a heck of alot of time! Derek From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 00:21:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA32593 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 00:21:41 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (pop3.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA32587 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 00:21:37 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe2-d69.foothill.net [209.76.43.69]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA21951 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:22:31 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 21:20:26 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6da5$fa18c280$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu They don't, but the overall layout is the same for the most part. TK -----Original Message----- From: ECMnut To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Tuesday, April 21, 1998 8:59 PM Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin >Bruce, >Mikey Pitts (tweaker author) once told me that >the Turbo SFI has its own unique addresses. >And that a Naturally aspirated bin wouldn't match at all. >I would love to know if you find otherwise.. >Mike V. > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 01:44:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA00745 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:44:36 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from partech.com (partech.com [206.114.186.31]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA00741 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:44:32 -0400 Received: from claven.partech.com (claven.partech.com [172.16.16.1]) by partech.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA02818 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:44:01 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cliff.partech.com by claven.partech.com (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA20899; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:45:58 -0400 Received: by cliff.partech.com with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) id ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:47:05 -0600 Message-Id: From: Jim Velasquez To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: DIY_EFI Digest V3 #170 Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:47:03 -0600 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Lurker alert! Long post alert! OK, so I'm finally going to get out of lurk mode, and participate in the list... First, a quick introduction... I'm a "senior C/S Support Analyst" which basically means that I have operational and support responsibility for all Servers, Midrange Connectivity, LANs, WANs, Desktop and Laptops (and, for supervising the other support staff) for the Customer Service division of a leading manufacturer of Point Of Sale terminals [see signature at end] When I'm not doing the above, I've got a pair of project cars I'm [slowly] working on: + A 1972 Pontiac Firebird Formula + A 1976 BMW 530i I've been planning to take the firebird to either an port-injected DIY-type EFI on a Pontiac 400/455; or, I've been debating doing 'the deed' and going for a late-model corporate motor and trans, complete with ECU. The beamer is being disassembled, updated to a newer drivetrain (have 80 533i, debating other options) and rebuilt and de-rusted. Both vehicles will receive updated electronics throughout, not just updated engine management electronics. Must be from spending too much time looking at the beamer , because I've also been having visions (delusions?) lately of fabricating an independent rear suspension for the 'bird. Also had visions of fabricating a subframe and internal cage and lopping off the top. (Anyone ever see the scene in "wayne's world" when they're entering the bar; there is a topless 2nd generation firebird in the background that I **REALLY** like the looks of?). OK, so maybe that'd be a project for a 2nd F-car when I get bored with the 1st one... Both projects are mainly stress-relievers, so I'm taking my sweet time about both. I'm more into the electronics and computer side of things, though I'm not leery of sweating and turning wrenches. I call in friends for using 'blue wrenches' or anytime a large electric arc or paint gun is needed. I've got a large collection of cone shaped hats, which are reversible and double as wizards' caps for the day job... No sense letting my users at work think I'm merely mortal! The message that got me off my butt and reply to was [quoted below]: wrote: >Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 14:52:49 -0400 >Subject: Modified Fuel Injection >I run a 455 cu in Pontiac motor in a 1976 Trans Am. >As I am not aware of any fuel injection made for this engine, I am >considering modifying an existing fuel injection setup from another >engine to suit. I have not actually purchased from them, but the following site looks promising: http://www.rancefi.com/ Before I found the site mentioned above, I had been thinking of going for a manifold setup which in my minds' eye would look very much like the one they sell, and then fabricating the parts needed to use a late model big block GM ECU with it. For me, I'd get more enjoyment out of learning by doing this than I would from bolting on an off-the-shelf conversion. (not to mention that for $3500+, I think I can build up a motor **AND** do the DIY_EFI!) As I mentioned above, I've been seriously tempted to just swap in a late-model drivetrain; still debating this. I saw a stunning '70 1/2 Trans-AM with a really clean late-model 454 and corvette 6-speed at a car show here in Colorado last year, which really got me thinking more about doing the late-model drivetrain swap. In my case, the 'bird has an auto trans, so if I went with a late model motor I'd probably opt for a beefed-up 700R4 or whatever the new 'electronic' replacement for the 700R4 trans is called. I would ***LOVE*** to hear from anyone else that had done DIY EFI on a big-block poncho motor. Also interested in finding knowledgeable 'interchange specialists' who might be helpful in junkyard parts scrounging. (Did you know, for example, that there is a GM 4-speed automatic trans that has an old-style Buick-Olds-Pontiac bellhousing bolt pattern? Saw one in Greely, CO!) >I believe that mass air flow systems are more flexible in terms of >accomodating variations in operating parameters and with this in mind I >wonder if using say a mass air flow GM or Ford setup might work with the >following modifications >1. larger airflow sensor and throttle body unit. >2. larger injectors. I keep thinking about trying to adapt a TPI from a 454, but every time I think about it I realize that it would be far easier to swap in motor and trans mounts from a 2nd generation big-block Camaro and just put in the 454 and Chevy trans! On a completely different subject: Anyone out there familiar with BMW 6 cylinder motors, and interchangeability of their EFI systems? I've got an '80 3.3L motor complete with the harness and ECU, which on first inspection seems to be no problem to fit to my '76. Also, a question for the group regarding passing an emissions test... I had to redo my emissions test for my daily driver pickup a few weeks ago, and when I went to the local EnviroTest (Colorado's politically appointed Emissions tester for 82-up vehicles) office, there happened to be a state waiver inspector there that day. I asked him about what would happen when I tried to pass either of my project cars. [the pickup sailed through and passed, BTW] There were two possibilities: + I may show up, and when the incompetent jokers who work at the test station look at the car, they don't realize the motor is swapped, and just check off what emissions components are there. In this scenario, they'd run it through the test and I'd be virtually guaranteed to pass, assuming I'd properly tuned the EFI. (In Colorado, there is an option to visit mom-and-pops type testing stations for pre-82 vehicles, but they are supposed to be better trained and better able to catch things like the swapped motor) + By law, in Colorado when a newer motor is installed into a vehicle it must then pass the emissions requirements for the model year of **that** motor. It must also pass a technical inspection from one of the state's technical inspectors. These guys are **supposed** to verify that all of the required emissions hardware is present (for example, a late model motor would require catalytic converters, O2 sensors, air pumps, etc. if they were on the donor vehicle.) I confronted the inspector about a bad experience I had with the BMW: It had failed at a mom-and-pops test facility as well as at the EnviroTest facility because it has no smog pump. (It never had one previously, and the previous owner had passed the vehicle for the past 15 years up in Vail, Colorado). I failed because the smog pump is not there even though **EVERY** measured parameter was well below the state limits! I suggested to the inspector that since I would be adding an auxiliary or high-output alternator to the BMW that I could fabricate a housing that looked like a smog pump with suitable looking air tubes and would pass with no problem (particularly with a later model motor). He said "you may well get away with it, so I'd try that first. If not, then pull off the fake pump and see me. Have your shit together." Anyone have any experience with dealing with this type of problem? Any suggestions? A final note:I use MS Outlook98 for my mail reader, someone please flame me if I've got it set wrong and you get rich text format, mime or other MS crap formatting... Thanks to everyone with putting up with a lengthy first post! ================================================================= Jim Velasquez | email: jim_velasquez@partech.com Senior C/S Support Analyst - | phone: (303)444-0120 ext.5683 ParTech Inc. NYSE: (PTC) | cellular: (303)641-4546 5757 Central Ave. | URL: http://www.partech.com/ Boulder CO 80301 | 24x7 Pager:303 444 0120 ext.5684 ================================================================= From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 01:48:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA00771 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:48:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from partech.com (partech.com [206.114.186.31]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA00767 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:48:07 -0400 Received: from claven.partech.com (claven.partech.com [172.16.16.1]) by partech.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA02833 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:47:40 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cliff.partech.com by claven.partech.com (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA20915; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:49:37 -0400 Received: by cliff.partech.com with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) id ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:50:44 -0600 Message-Id: From: Jim Velasquez To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: DIY_EFI Digest V3 #170 Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:50:42 -0600 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Lurker alert! Long post alert! OK, so I'm finally going to get out of lurk mode, and participate in the list... First, a quick introduction... I'm a "senior C/S Support Analyst" which basically means that I have operational and support responsibility for all Servers, Midrange Connectivity, LANs, WANs, Desktop and Laptops (and, for supervising the other support staff) for the Customer Service division of a leading manufacturer of Point Of Sale terminals [see signature at end] When I'm not doing the above, I've got a pair of project cars I'm [slowly] working on: + A 1972 Pontiac Firebird Formula + A 1976 BMW 530i I've been planning to take the firebird to either an port-injected DIY-type EFI on a Pontiac 400/455; or, I've been debating doing 'the deed' and going for a late-model corporate motor and trans, complete with ECU. The beamer is being disassembled, updated to a newer drivetrain (have 80 533i, debating other options) and rebuilt and de-rusted. Both vehicles will receive updated electronics throughout, not just updated engine management electronics. Must be from spending too much time looking at the beamer , because I've also been having visions (delusions?) lately of fabricating an independent rear suspension for the 'bird. Also had visions of fabricating a subframe and internal cage and lopping off the top. (Anyone ever see the scene in "wayne's world" when they're entering the bar; there is a topless 2nd generation firebird in the background that I **REALLY** like the looks of). OK, so maybe that'd be a project for a 2nd car when I get bored with the 1st one... Both projects are mainly stress-relievers, so I'm taking my sweet time about both. I'm more into the electronics and computer side of things, though I'm not leery of sweating and turning wrenches. I call in friends for using 'blue wrenches' or anytime a large electric arc or paint gun is needed. I've got a large collection of cone shaped hats, which are reversible and double as wizards' caps for the day job... No sense letting my users at work think I'm merely mortal! The message that got me off my butt and reply to was [quoted below]: wrote: >Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 14:52:49 -0400 >Subject: Modified Fuel Injection >I run a 455 cu in Pontiac motor in a 1976 Trans Am. >As I am not aware of any fuel injection made for this engine, I am >considering modifying an existing fuel injection setup from another >engine to suit. I have not actually purchased from them, but the following site looks promising: http://www.rancefi.com/ Before I found the site mentioned above, I had been thinking of going for a manifold setup which in my minds' eye would look very much like the one they sell, and then fabricating the parts needed to use a late model big block GM ECU with it. For me, I'd get more enjoyment out of learning by doing this than I would from bolting on an off-the-shelf conversion. (not to mention that for $3500+, I think I can build up a motor **AND** do the DIY_EFI!) As I mentioned above, I've been seriously tempted to just swap in a late-model drivetrain; still debating this. I saw a stunning '70 1/2 Trans-AM with a really clean late-model 454 and corvette 6-speed at a car show here in Colorado last year, which really got me thinking more about doing the late-model drivetrain swap. In my case, the 'bird has an auto trans, so I'd probably opt for a beefed-up 700R4 or whatever the new 'electronic' replacement for the 700R4 trans is called. I would ***LOVE*** to hear from anyone else that had done DIY EFI on a big-block poncho motor. Also interested in finding knowledgeable 'interchange specialists' who might be helpful in junkyard parts scrounging. (Did you know, for example, that there is a GM 4-speed automatic trans that has an old-style Buick-Olds-Pontiac bellhousing bolt pattern? Saw one in Greely, CO!) >I believe that mass air flow systems are more flexible in terms of >accomodating variations in operating parameters and with this in mind I >wonder if using say a mass air flow GM or Ford setup might work with the >following modifications >1. larger airflow sensor and throttle body unit. >2. larger injectors. I keep thinking about trying to adapt a TPI from a 454, but every time I think about it I realize that it would be far easier to swap in motor and trans mounts from a 2nd generation big-block Camaro and just put in the 454 and Chevy trans! On a completely different subject: Anyone out there familiar with BMW 6 cylinder motors, and interchangeability of their EFI systems? I've got an '80 3.3L motor complete with the harness and ECU, which on first inspection seems to be no problem to fit to my '76. Also, a question for the group regarding passing an emissions test... I had to redo my emissions test for my daily driver pickup a few weeks ago, and when I went to the local EnviroTest (Colorado's politically appointed Emissions tester for 82-up vehicles) office, there happened to be a state waiver inspector there that day. I asked him about what would happen when I tried to pass either of my project cars. [the pickup sailed through and passed, BTW] There were two possibilities: + I may show up, and when the incompetent jokers who work at the test station look at the car, they don't realize the motor is swapped, and just check off what emissions components are there. In this scenario, they'd run it through the test and I'd be virtually guaranteed to pass, assuming I'd properly tuned the EFI. (In Colorado, there is an option to visit mom-and-pops type testing stations for pre-82 vehicles, but they are supposed to be better trained and better able to catch things like the swapped motor) + By law, in Colorado when a newer motor is installed into a vehicle it must then pass the emissions requirements for the model year of **that** motor. It must also pass a technical inspection from one of the state's technical inspectors. These guys are **supposed** to verify that all of the required emissions hardware is present (for example, a late model motor would require catalytic converters, O2 sensors, air pumps, etc. if they were on the donor vehicle.) I confronted the inspector about a bad experience I had with the BMW: It had failed at a mom-and-pops test facility as well as at the EnviroTest facility because it has no smog pump. (It never had one previously, and the previous owner had passed the vehicle for the past 15 years up in Vail, Colorado). I failed because the smog pump is not there even though **EVERY** measured parameter was well below the state limits! I suggested to the inspector that since I would be adding an auxiliary or high-output alternator to the BMW that I could fabricate a housing that looked like a smog pump with suitable looking air tubes and would pass with no problem (particularly with a later model motor). He said "you may well get away with it, so I'd try that first. If not, then pull off the fake pump and see me. Have your shit together." Anyone have any experience with dealing with this type of problem? Any suggestions? A final note:I use MS Outlook98 for my mail reader, someone please flame me if I've got it set wrong and you get rich text format, mime or other MS crap formatting... Thanks to everyone with putting up with a lengthy first post! ================================================================= Jim Velasquez | email: jim_velasquez@partech.com Senior C/S Support Analyst - | phone: (303)444-0120 ext.5683 ParTech Inc. NYSE: (PTC) | cellular: (303)641-4546 5757 Central Ave. | URL: http://www.partech.com/ Boulder CO 80301 | 24x7 Pager:303 444 0120 ext.5684 ================================================================= From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 01:51:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA00821 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:51:19 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from partech.com (partech.com [206.114.186.31]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA00817 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:51:18 -0400 Received: from claven.partech.com (claven.partech.com [172.16.16.1]) by partech.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA02949 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:50:50 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cliff.partech.com by claven.partech.com (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA20962; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 01:52:48 -0400 Received: by cliff.partech.com with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) id ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:53:55 -0600 Message-Id: From: Jim Velasquez To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: sorry for 2 posts! Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:53:53 -0600 X-Priority: 3 Mime-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1457.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu OK, so somehow I managed to send two posts... sorry! ================================================================= Jim Velasquez | email: jim_velasquez@partech.com Senior C/S Support Analyst - | phone: (303)444-0120 ext.5683 ParTech Inc. NYSE: (PTC) | cellular: (303)641-4546 5757 Central Ave. | URL: http://www.partech.com/ Boulder CO 80301 | 24x7 Pager:303 444 0120 ext.5684 ================================================================= From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 02:50:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA01624 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 02:50:19 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca (mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA01620 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 02:50:16 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id XAA07665 for ; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:50:12 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id XAA29864; Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:49:37 -0700 Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 23:49:37 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: <9856c7bf.353d67d1@aol.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hmm GM and ford too? I knew fords were like that but I thought that the GM units put out a variable frequency vs. mass air flow. Am I getting confused with the ford MAP sensor ? any help mucho appreciado later jw On Tue, 21 Apr 1998, A70Duster wrote: > You may read that the AMS (from GM units ) put out a voltage that is directly > proportional to the Air Mass. That is NOT true. It is a parabolic function. > Friendly advice. Good luck. > > See ya, > > Mike > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 03:12:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA01804 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 03:12:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA01800 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 03:12:53 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp118.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.118]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id DAA15643; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 03:17:21 -0400 (EDT) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 03:10:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Derek Jewett cc: Do-it-Yourself Fuel Injection Subject: Re: My thanks to Alain In-Reply-To: <199804220406.VAA00167@diamond.sunset.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Thanks a bunch Alain for the 101 info fwd's... Saved me a heck of alot of > time! > > Derek you're welcome !! happy to help !! Alain From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 03:48:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA02104 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 03:48:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from cfunet1.cfu.net (root@enterprise.cfu.net [206.29.238.7]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA02100 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 03:48:42 -0400 Received: from cfu (host66095.cfu.net [206.29.66.95]) by cfunet1.cfu.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id CAA01606 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 02:47:53 -0500 From: "Bob McElroy" To: Subject: RE: Modified Fuel Injection Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 02:48:32 -0500 Message-ID: <000001bd6dc3$0c245580$5f421dce@cfu.cfu-cybernet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The Pontiac big-block shares no components with the Chevy big-blocks, so the manifold from the 454 won't work on the Pontiac block. You would be able to adapt a TBI system from the Chevy big-block, and I would expect that the stock programming would at least get the Pontiac engine up and running. Then you would most likely want to re-program the stock ECM to get the Pontiac engine to perform the way it was intended. Bob McElroy rmcelroy@cfu-cybernet.net http://members.xoom.com/rmcelroy -----Original Message----- > I run a 455 cu in Pontiac motor in a 1976 Trans Am. > Anyone have any thoughts or information - derekt@usit.com on that topic,i'm currious if a 454 Vortec fuel injection system would fit (rather important) & work (i guess it will work fine after all) on this motor ?? Alain From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 04:25:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA02619 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 04:25:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA02614 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 04:25:05 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp35.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.165]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id DAA19040 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 03:25:20 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <353DA771.F1257231@mwt.net> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 03:16:49 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ford EECIV map will put out a variable frequency. Have tables if you need them Steve James Weiler wrote: > Hmm GM and ford too? I knew fords were like that but I thought that > the > GM units put out a variable frequency vs. mass air flow. Am I getting > > confused with the ford MAP sensor ? > any help mucho appreciado > later > jw > > On Tue, 21 Apr 1998, A70Duster wrote: > > > You may read that the AMS (from GM units ) put out a voltage that is > directly > > proportional to the Air Mass. That is NOT true. It is a parabolic > function. > > Friendly advice. Good luck. > > > > See ya, > > > > Mike > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 04:30:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA02651 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 04:30:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA02646 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 04:30:03 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp35.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.165]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id DAA19118 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 03:30:15 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 03:21:45 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu GM output map variable voltage , ford variable frequency. Didn't answer in last post. James Weiler wrote: > Hmm GM and ford too? I knew fords were like that but I thought that > the > GM units put out a variable frequency vs. mass air flow. Am I getting > > confused with the ford MAP sensor ? > any help mucho appreciado > later > jw > > On Tue, 21 Apr 1998, A70Duster wrote: > > > You may read that the AMS (from GM units ) put out a voltage that is > directly > > proportional to the Air Mass. That is NOT true. It is a parabolic > function. > > Friendly advice. Good luck. > > > > See ya, > > > > Mike > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 04:33:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA02689 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 04:33:19 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from newmail.virgin.net (newmail.virgin.net [194.168.54.44]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA02684 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 04:33:17 -0400 Received: from tony-s-machine ([194.168.68.162]) by newmail.virgin.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 1-55555U125000L125000S0) with SMTP id AAA2389 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 08:33:16 +0000 Message-ID: <353C6C5D.2677@virgin.net> Date: Tue, 21 Apr 1998 10:52:29 +0100 From: Tony Cooper X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01C-VN709-003 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: MAP vs MAF, again References: <199804210520.WAA16731@mailrelay.syspac.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu bamcknig@postoffice.syspac.com wrote: PS- > These alphabets get me. At tax time I find myself putting a 1040 in > my independent rear supension(IRS) and sending a 4:11 to the internal > revenue system(IRS). My USB(universal serial bus) won't plug into my > USB(upper Side Band) ham radio set. Although I hear if I buy a new > transceiver I will be able to plug my USB into my USB. Between the > Hieroglyphics on my computer screen and the alphonics of the > Technical publications, I am losing what little command of the > english language I had. Bob, Just hold it together mate - I'll get Bruce to send you a CSH for your BBH that needs SPH. Hehehehe Tony -- Sent By Tony Cooper. email: tony.cooper@virgin.net Allow at least 10 working minutes for reply. ;) From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 04:35:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA02734 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 04:35:48 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from crianlarich.indigo-avs.com (crianlarich.indigo-avs.com [194.200.210.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA02730 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 04:35:46 -0400 Received: by crianlarich.indigo-avs.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BD6DD1.9D30DEA0@crianlarich.indigo-avs.com>; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 09:32:48 +0100 Message-ID: From: Robert Humphris To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: High Temp Coatings in a Turbo (Revisit: slightly off topic) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 09:32:47 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 Encoding: 81 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >For the inside of the manifold and the inside of the turbine scroll housing >and its inlet and outlet (all cast iron): > > Sand blast and coat with: > TLHB (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-3.html) > or > CBC3 (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-2.html) > or > Black Satin (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-1.html) > or > Cermakrome (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-1.html) > or > A combination of these (i.e. CBC3 first, buff, then Black Satin) > Any advantage to this? Do CBC3 first then Black Satin, the advantage is of the cost of the TLHB as you cannot get it in the small quantities that you can of CBC3. Black Satin over Cermakrome as it doesn't need to be baked. > > >For the outside of the manifold and turbine housing: Coat the manifold in CBC3 then Black satin, inside and out, this keeps the exhaust heat in, which keeps under bonnet temps down, and the heat moving through to the turbine, where it is used to spin the system up. This will go some way to reduce lag. Coat the turbine housing, the metal will have less heat in it as the internal coating will be blocking a good percentage of any extra heat. You want to keep under bonnet temps down as much as possible. > > >For the inside of the scroll housing of the compressor and its inlet and >outlet: > > DFL-1 (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-2.html) > Then buff with Scotch Brite before assembly. > > Do you sandblast first? Oh yes. I found that spraying this stuff was a nightmare though, so in the end I used a swadge of foam rubber and wiped the stuff on. Do only one coat ( i did two and the second lot came off when I buffed it ) > Use 0000 grade wire wool or plastic equivalent ( 3M make them ) Scotch Brite is used to key surfaces too soft to be blasted. > >For the outside of compressor: Go for CBC2, the ally equivalent to CBC3 will cut down on heat contamination, and when buffed gives a really wild polished sheen to ally, looks rather like a chromed alluminium! > > >For the turbo shaft and bearings: > > Buff with Scitch Brite then coat with: > WSX (http://www.deskmedia.com/~techline/cat-2.html) Work that stuff on, oh yes... I used cotton wool in small balls to buff it into my valves and guides. > > > > >For the turbine and compressor blades and their housings: > > Nothing. The barrier will likely be thick enough to cause damage > due to heat expansion and tight tolerances. And it will screw up the balance of the turbine > > > >OR: > >Hose the whole thing off with de-greaser, pre-lube with oil, slap it on >and don't worry about it. Yea but thats no fun is it? > Any more comments? >Nope, you have all bases covered From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 08:36:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA04767 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 08:36:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mercury.csc.com (mercury-3.csc.com [20.1.20.111]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA04763 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 08:36:06 -0400 From: jdzura@csc.com Received: from va-fch34.vtc.csc.com (csc.com) [20.1.6.97] by mercury.csc.com with smtp (Exim 1.82 #3) id 0yRykM-0002F3-00; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 08:35:31 -0400 Received: by csc.com(Lotus SMTP MTA SMTP MTA v1.1.04 (495.1 10-24-1997)) id 852565EE.004531E0 ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 08:35:47 -0400 X-Lotus-FromDomain: CSC To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-ID: <852565EE.00444C21.00@csc.com> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 08:29:13 -0400 Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm interested, but I don't understand what you mean by "Variable Frequency". I thought the EEC IV put out voltage not frequency. What does a varying voltage caused by changing air flow have to do with frequency? When you say you have t he tables, do you mean the map of airflow vs output voltage for a specific MAF? kb4mxo@mwt.net on 04/22/98 04:16:49 AM Please respond to diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: (bcc: Joe Dzura/SED/CSC) Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection Ford EECIV map will put out a variable frequency. Have tables if you need them Steve James Weiler wrote: > Hmm GM and ford too? I knew fords were like that but I thought that > the > GM units put out a variable frequency vs. mass air flow. Am I getting > > confused with the ford MAP sensor ? > any help mucho appreciado > later > jw > > On Tue, 21 Apr 1998, A70Duster wrote: > > > You may read that the AMS (from GM units ) put out a voltage that is > directly > > proportional to the Air Mass. That is NOT true. It is a parabolic > function. > > Friendly advice. Good luck. > > > > See ya, > > > > Mike > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 09:05:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA05227 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 09:05:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.cfw.com (milo.cfw.com [205.219.240.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA05223 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 09:05:16 -0400 Received: (qmail 902 invoked from network); 22 Apr 1998 13:02:34 -0000 Received: from ras1stn44.cfw.com (HELO wolfed.cfw.com) (208.217.185.195) by milo.cfw.com with SMTP; 22 Apr 1998 13:02:34 -0000 Message-ID: <353DEA68.5472@milo.cfw.com> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 09:02:32 -0400 From: "D. Douglas Wolfe" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Holley 502-3 and IAC Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Regarding the Holley TBI replacement for 2.8L engines, Holley states that it will only work for 85-89. When questioned, they stated that the IAC is different. Can't you just change IAC's? I know that there are different diameters, some with and some without a collar, and different methods of attachment (screw in and bolt on). Is there one that will work? The vehicle in question is a '91 Isuzu Trooper. I had to order a fuel pressure regulator once and the one for a 91 S-10 was the right one. Anyone have experience with this? Doug Wolfe From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 09:53:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA05792 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 09:53:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from algw1.lucent.com (algw1.lucent.com [205.147.213.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA05786 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 09:53:01 -0400 Received: from emsr1.emsr.lucent.com by alig1.firewall.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-L sol2) id KAA12892; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 10:07:22 -0400 Received: by emsr1.emsr.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-1.2 Solaris/emsr) id JAA09467 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu.smtp; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 09:52:32 -0400 From: kenkelly@lucent.com Received: by emsr1.emsr.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-1.2 Solaris/emsr) id JAA09300 for efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu!diy_efi; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 09:52:27 -0400 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Received: from lucent.com (kkk) by pace10.wh.lucent.com (5.x/SMI-SVR4) id AA28850; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 09:50:35 -0400 Message-Id: <353DF509.C3C4DBD0@lucent.com> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 09:47:53 -0400 Original-From: Ken Kelly Organization: Lucent Technologies X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en]C-EMS-1.3.1 (WinNT; U) Mime-Version: 1.0 Original-To: efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu!diy_efi Subject: Re: Prog 101 References: Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Alain, If you have a file with all of the Prog 101 postings, I would love to have a copy. I joined the list a few weeks ago, and have been looking through the archives. I am putting a 95 Camaro EFI system in my 48 Ford street Rod. I want to be able to reprogram a few of the Tables in this ECM, so I am using Prog 101 to learn some of the basics. I will also have to figure out the interface to program EEproms, but I assume the general Idea of tables, and there functions will carry forward. Locating them may be fun! Thanks in advance -- Ken Alain Toussaint wrote: > > > Hello all, > > > > Well after several attempts I am now on the list, wheew.. I was hoping > > someone might bring me up to speed on this prog 101 project...? > > do you need the posting made to the 101 project,i saved them all and i can > send it to you ??? > > Alain Toussaint From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 10:01:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA05886 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 10:01:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA05882 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 10:01:13 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-6.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.24]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id KAA15966 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 10:00:16 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Holley 502-3 and IAC Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 10:01:12 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6df7$1be53dc0$18198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: D. Douglas Wolfe To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 22, 1998 9:45 AM Subject: Holley 502-3 and IAC >Regarding the Holley TBI replacement for 2.8L engines, Holley states that it will only work for 85-89. When questioned, they stated that the IAC is different. Can't you just change IAC's? > Doug Wolfe My suggestion is go to a parts house that has Standard Motor Products. (HQ, Long Island, NY) They have a catalog called Engine Management Illustrated Parts Guide, on page 187 in Cat No ENGB-94 they have pictures of the various IAC, and use that to match up what you have/need. Mounting and the pintles cone are important, Changing pintle cone shapes is not for the light of heart (see earlier postings about tune-up for details).. HTH Bruce From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 11:40:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA07176 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 11:40:42 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imes.com ([209.184.4.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA07172 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 11:40:41 -0400 Received: from elvis by imes.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id KAA09206; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 10:42:42 -0500 Message-ID: <353DC65E.536E@imes.com> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 10:28:46 +0000 From: steve ravet Organization: International Meta Systems X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: OTC's ecm system tester References: <353D6607.4279@alphag.csd.uwm.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu David Garnier wrote: > > Hello fellow DIY_EFI'ers > > I was looking through my OTC tool catalog looking for a tool when > I stumbled upon the "ECM System Tester" tool. This tool is designed > to be swapped in place of a questionable ECM for the purpose of > toggling or measuring the various sensors for malfunctions. OTC was > kind enough to list a number GM ECM's and their types. What a great > list I thought, this would be *great* in a spead-sheet for general > information, perusing the local junk yard or for the beginings of > a general FAQ on ECM's that has been talked about. Enclosed is a > sort by ECM number and it is in Excel 4 format. > > dave garnier > Here's the list for you unix propeller heads that don't have excel... :-) NUMBER TYPE GENERAL INFORMATION 1224690 CLCC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1224760 DFI 81 to 82 & later ECM's found on DFI systems: CADILLAC ONLY 1224770 CLCC w/ ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1224810 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1225120 DFI 81 to 82 & later ECM's found on DFI systems: CADILLAC ONLY 1225330 CLCC w/ ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1225410 CLCC 82 to 83 and later ECM's found on carbureted minimum functioning systems (CLCC) 1225450 CLCC MF 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1225500 CLCC w/ ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1225550 TBI 82 to 85 and later ECM's found on TBI systems 1225570 TBI 82 to 85 and later ECM's found on TBI systems 1225610 TBI 82 to 85 and later ECM's found on TBI systems 1225650 DFI 81 to 82 & later ECM's found on DFI systems: CADILLAC ONLY 1225950 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1226020 CLCC 82 to 83 and later ECM's found on carbureted minimum functioning systems (CLCC) 1226021 CLCC MF 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1226024 CLCC w/ ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1226025 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1226026 TBI 82 to 85 and later ECM's found on TBI systems 1226028 DFI 83 to 86 & later ECM's found on DFI systems: CADILLAC ONLY 1226100 TBI 82 to 85 and later ECM's found on TBI systems 1226153 CLCC w/ ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1226156 TBI 82 to 85 and later ECM's found on TBI systems 1226430 TBI 82 to 85 and later ECM's found on TBI systems 1226441 PFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1226454 CLCC w/ ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1226455 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1226457 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1226458 TBI 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1226459 SFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1226460 PFI-M Turbo 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1226462 DFI 83 to 86 & later ECM's found on DFI systems: CADILLAC ONLY 1226519 CLCC w/ ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1226647 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1226864 TBI 82 to 85 and later ECM's found on TBI systems 1226865 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1226866 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1226867 TBI 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1226868 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1226869 PFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1226870 PFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1226930 DFI 83 to 86 & later ECM's found on DFI systems: CADILLAC ONLY 1226948 PFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227056 DFI 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227057 SFI-3 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227065 PFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227076 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1227137 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227148 SFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227151 PFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227153 MFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227165 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227169 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1227170 PFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227301 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1227302 PFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227303 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227429 TBI 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227727 ? 88 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems: UNDERHOOD 1227730 ? 87 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems 1227746 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227747 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227748 TBI-4 87 to 88 and later ECM's found on TBI-4 mid-functioning systems 1227749 ? 87 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems 1227752 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227783 SFI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227784 MFI 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1227808 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1228022 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1228062 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1228063 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1228079 CLCC w/o ISC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1228253 SFI-4 88 and later ECM's found on SFI-4 systems 1228321 TBI-4 87 to 88 and later ECM's found on TBI-4 mid-functioning systems 1228330 CLCC 80.5 to 88 and later ECM's found on Carbureted Full and Minimum systems (CLCC) 1228547 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1228706 ? 87 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems 1228707 ? 87 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems 1228708 ? 88 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems: UNDERHOOD 1228746 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1228747 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1228838 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 1228934 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16132240 SFI-4 90 to 93 and later ECM's found on SFI-4 systems: CADILLAC ONLY 16132241 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16132792 EFI-4 UNDERHOOD 88 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems UNDERHOOD 16136965 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16138886 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16141470 SFI-4 90 to 91 and later ECM's found on SFI-4 systems 16142013 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16144288 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16146299 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16147525 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16149396 ? 88 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems: UNDERHOOD 16149405 TBI-M 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16153597 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16156450 ? 87 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems 16156647 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16161237 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16177107 EFI-4 UNDERHOOD 88 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems UNDERHOOD 16196344 EFI-4 87 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems 16196404 EFI-4 87 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems 16197128 EFI-4 88 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems: UNDERHOOD 16198259 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 16198260 EFI-4 88 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems: UNDERHOOD 16198262 EFI-4 87 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems 16198263 EFI-4 87 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems 16198264 SFI-4 88 and later ECM's found on SFI-4 systems 16198266 EFI-4 87 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems 16198267 EFI-4 87 to 92 and later ECM's found on EFI-4 systems 16198445 EFI-4 84 to 93 and later ECM's found on the following systems 21020806 TBI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on TBI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21020807 TBI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on TBI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21020808 MFI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on MFI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21020809 MFI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on MFI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21021220 MFI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on MFI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21021221 TBI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on TBI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21021467 TBI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on TBI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21021468 MFI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on MFI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21021469 TBI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on TBI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21021470 MFI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on MFI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21022078 TBI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on TBI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21022079 MFI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on MFI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY 21022155 MFI-5 91 to 93 and later ECM's found on MFI-5 systems: SATURN ONLY -- Steve Ravet International Meta Systems http://www.imes.com steve@imes.com From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 12:29:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA07974 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:29:38 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from webserver (brpt01-sh5-port36.snet.net [204.60.24.36]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA07969 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:29:33 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA00256 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:28:18 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:28:18 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804221628.MAA00256@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980422115952.007c2240@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 11:59:52 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin In-Reply-To: <01bd6d3a$8a62bf60$3a198fd1@nacelp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Would anyone have a bin for a 86, 3.8 FWD Buick/Olds using >a 1227148 or know if it is the same code/table locations as a >GN/TType?.. Howdy. I have that exact engine, ECM and chip. Unfortunately my reader is dead. Come up with an alternate solution (i.e. I mail the chip to you and you send it back at some point) and you can leach the bin if you want Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 12:29:40 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA07979 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:29:40 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from webserver (brpt01-sh5-port36.snet.net [204.60.24.36]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA07975 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:29:38 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAB00256 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:28:22 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:28:22 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804221628.MAB00256@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980422120304.007aacf0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:03:04 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: EEC4 In-Reply-To: <353D06FF.C52375FC@cgocable.net> References: <353C9FC1.2B4E@earthworld.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Now this I would like to see! Im been told EEC is smart but that smart? >OOPs good thing I reread message I thought it said GM6. V8 - no problem. I added 6-7 psi boost to my 3.8L EEC-IV Lincoln with no issues. I hit 8lbs of boost, it goes nuts. So its adaptable, but within reason. To graft the 5.0L over to the 3.5L, you are going to have to re-size your injectors, but I would think that would be it, since the 02 sensor is the most important sensor to the EEC-IV, and the system should remain in closed loop. Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 12:29:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA07986 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:29:43 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from webserver (brpt01-sh5-port36.snet.net [204.60.24.36]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA07982 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:29:41 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAC00256 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:28:25 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:28:25 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804221628.MAC00256@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980422120558.007a7d60@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:05:58 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: RE: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: <000001bd6dc3$0c245580$5f421dce@cfu.cfu-cybernet.net> References: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >The Pontiac big-block shares no components with the Chevy big-blocks, so the >manifold from the 454 won't work on the Pontiac block. You would be able to Yes, that is true. But you can move the injectors, maf, and other components over by doing some minor fabricating. On the carb'd manifold, you bore 8 holes to allow the welding of injector bosses, then shove the injectors in. There's a good book on this subject from Motorbooks International, I can get the exact title and ISBN number if you are interested.... I bought it myself and found it more than useful :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 13:13:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA09075 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 13:13:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA09071 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 13:13:20 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-10.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.79]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id NAA20659 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 13:12:24 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 13:13:20 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6e11$f2a76d00$4f198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >>Would anyone have a bin for a 86, 3.8 FWD Buick/Olds using >>a 1227148 or know if it is the same code/table locations as a >>GN/TType?.. >Howdy. >I have that exact engine, ECM and chip. Unfortunately my reader is dead. Come up with an alternate solution (i.e. I mail the chip to you and you send it back at some point) and you can leach the bin if you want >Frederic Breitwieser >Bridgeport, CT 06606 > Hope your feeling better.. The above idea will work, fine Bruce Plecan 18 E 1st St Arcanum, OH 45304 BTW, ya know what a file extension of .S16 means?. I got some bins but with that file extension, and just changing it to .bin doesn't seem to work. Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 13:37:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA09558 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 13:37:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from deliverator.sgi.com (deliverator.sgi.com [204.94.214.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA09554 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 13:37:25 -0400 Received: from aspire.dearborn.sgi.com ([169.238.139.226]) by deliverator.sgi.com (980309.SGI.8.8.8-aspam-6.2/980310.SGI-aspam) via SMTP id KAA15581 for <@external-mail-relay.sgi.com:diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu>; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 10:36:47 -0700 (PDT) mail_from (afgun@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com) Received: from mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com by aspire.dearborn.sgi.com via ESMTP (950413.SGI.8.6.12/930416.SGI) for <@aspire.dearborn.sgi.com:diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu> id NAA09634; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 13:37:21 -0400 Received: (from afgun@localhost) by mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/950213.SGI.AUTOCF) id NAA01836 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 13:37:20 -0400 From: "Andrew F. Gunnesch" Message-Id: <9804221337.ZM1834@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 13:37:20 -0400 In-Reply-To: Frederic Breitwieser "RE: Modified Fuel Injection" (Apr 22, 12:05pm) References: <3.0.5.32.19980422120558.007a7d60@xephic.dynip.com> X-Mailer: Z-Mail (3.2.3 08feb96 MediaMail) To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Apr 22, 12:05pm, Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > Yes, that is true. But you can move the injectors, maf, and other > components over by doing some minor fabricating. On the carb'd manifold, > you bore 8 holes to allow the welding of injector bosses, then shove the > injectors in. There's a good book on this subject from Motorbooks > International, I can get the exact title and ISBN number if you are > interested.... I bought it myself and found it more than useful :) Please do. I'm definitely interested... From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 15:06:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA10773 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:06:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.35]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA10768 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:06:31 -0400 Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.68.12.50]) by mtigwc05.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with ESMTP id AAA13953 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 19:06:09 +0000 Message-ID: <353E3F8F.F06FE13E@worldnet.att.net> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:05:51 -0400 From: Thomas Matthews X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection References: <3.0.5.32.19980422120558.007a7d60@xephic.dynip.com> <9804221337.ZM1834@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I believe the book that Frederic was referring to is called Fuel Injection Installation, Performance Tuning, Modifications by Jeff Hartman... ISBN number is 0-87938-743-2 and it lists for 19.95. Very valuable resource for the begenning DIY-EFI'r... BTW, I'm in the midst of 2 EFI projects for my 69 Firebird 455, one is a very simple Holley Projection 4 with a '747 computer. This one should be on in a couple of weeks... And, I'm also working on a port setup with a TR intake and a '730 GM ECM, but the manifold requires some fabrication that is going to take me a while longer (plus the manifold suffers from major core shift) which has pushed back the project awhile... Another ECM you could use is the 86-9 GM 148 with a MAF, and either put in 2 MAF's, or resize the original, or purchase a larger MAF from Bosch (these are some of the options we discussed a few months ago) Good luck in your projects! Tom From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 15:10:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA10824 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:10:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from autozone.com (autozone.com [206.136.144.33]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA10820 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:10:44 -0400 Received: from mailhost.alldata.com (alldata.com [172.20.10.17]) by autozone.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id OAA10948 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:10:42 -0500 (CDT) Organization: Alldata Received: from infinity.alldata (pcmail.alldata.com [172.20.10.212]) by mailhost.alldata.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id MAA11883 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:04:45 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pcmail with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:11:53 -0700 Message-ID: <03B9862B4DE7CF1180BA00805FEA021901FD3987@pcmail> From: "Haigh, Bill" To: "'DIY-EFI Mail List'" Subject: Introduction Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:11:51 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello everyone! I am new to this list, so I figured an intro would be in order. I am an ASE certified Master Automobile Technician, along with ASE certs in body repair, machine shop, heavy trucks, and alternate fuels. I worked in machine shops for a few years, then Chrysler dealerships for nearly 10 years, and for the last 4 years I have been a technical editor for http://www.alldata.tsb.com. I love old Mopars (as my home page shows) but I have owned lots of "other" vehicles too. My current daily driver is a '69 Charger with a 225 (slant 6) cylinder engine. One day (soon) I will fit it with a MPI system, then (eventually) a turbocharger........ which is why I am here. :-) I hope I can help this list as much as (I am certain) it will help me. Bill Haigh "You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him fish" http://www.softcom.net/users/haigh/ From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 15:42:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA11290 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:42:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca (mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA11286 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:42:36 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA06387 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:42:32 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id MAA00991; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:41:56 -0700 Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:41:56 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 22 Apr 1998, Steven Gorkowski wrote: > GM output map variable voltage , ford variable frequency. Didn't answer > in last post. Ok that sounds familliar. But what about GM vs. Ford MAF's ? Ford units put out a voltage (which approaches 5V asumptotically) but what about the GM's? thanks jw From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 15:46:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA11377 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:46:36 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca (mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA11373 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:46:35 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA06679 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:46:35 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id MAA01001; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:45:59 -0700 Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 12:45:59 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: <852565EE.00444C21.00@csc.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Oops, we've got our MAF's and MAP's confused. We know that the ford MAF puts out voltage with air flow and the ford MAP puts out fequency vs. presure. What I was asking was how does this compare to GM units? I thought the GM MAF put out freq. and the GM MAP put out a voltage (oposite to the ford system). You originally said something about GM MAF's and their voltage vs air flow curve. I thought this should be frequency. no biggie jw On Wed, 22 Apr 1998 jdzura@csc.com wrote: > I'm interested, but I don't understand what you mean by "Variable Frequency". I > thought the EEC IV put out voltage not frequency. What does a varying voltage > caused by changing air flow have to do with frequency? When you say you have t he > tables, do you mean the map of airflow vs output voltage for a specific MAF? > > > > > kb4mxo@mwt.net on 04/22/98 04:16:49 AM > > Please respond to diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > cc: (bcc: Joe Dzura/SED/CSC) > Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection > > > > > Ford EECIV map will put out a variable frequency. Have tables if you > need them > Steve > James Weiler wrote: > > Hmm GM and ford too? I knew fords were like that but I thought that > > the > > GM units put out a variable frequency vs. mass air flow. Am I getting > > > > confused with the ford MAP sensor ? > > any help mucho appreciado > > later > > jw > > > > On Tue, 21 Apr 1998, A70Duster wrote: > > > > > You may read that the AMS (from GM units ) put out a voltage that is > > directly > > > proportional to the Air Mass. That is NOT true. It is a parabolic > > function. > > > Friendly advice. Good luck. > > > > > > See ya, > > > > > > Mike > > > > > > > > > > > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 16:03:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA11760 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:03:31 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA11756 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:03:28 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id QAA00801; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:03:26 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA00235; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:01:57 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:01:57 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804222001.QAA00235@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980422155722.007a4b20@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:57:22 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu, goflo@pacbell.net, derekt@usit.com From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Fuel Injection Book In-Reply-To: <9804221337.ZM1834@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19980422120558.007a7d60@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >> International, I can get the exact title and ISBN number if you are >> interested.... I bought it myself and found it more than useful :) >Please do. I'm definitely interested... I found it at Amazon Books, www.amazon.com, or if you want to give me a nickel, click their add off my website at www.xephic.dynip.com. Jeff Hartman gives a lot of information throughout the book on different options, math relating to injector size calculations, how all the pieces work, as well as covers four installations of various EFI systems, including projection, a TBI swap, a good discussion on a Bronco 460 swap, and one for a Europa I believe. Anyway, the first 2/3 of the book is ideas, theory, and how to apply it. I bought this in conjunction with Corky Bell's book "Maximum Boost", since I'm trying to build a 4.1L Buick V6 with twin turbos, using the stock ECM. Which I prety much have to rethink. Anyway, the info: Fuel Injection : Installation, Performance Tuning, Modification (Motorbooks International Powerpro) by Jeff Hartman List: $19.95 Our Price: $15.96 You Save: $3.99 (20%) Availability: This title usually ships within 24 hours. Paperback, 160 pages Published by Motorbooks International Publication date: August 1993 Dimensions (in inches): 0.41 x 10.60 x 8.28 ISBN: 0879387432 Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 16:24:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA12313 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:24:48 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA12309 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:24:46 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id QAA01329; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:24:45 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA00167 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:22:10 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:22:10 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804222022.QAA00167@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980422162404.007add30@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:24:04 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: <353E3F8F.F06FE13E@worldnet.att.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980422120558.007a7d60@xephic.dynip.com> <9804221337.ZM1834@mongoose.dearborn.sgi.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Hartman... ISBN number is 0-87938-743-2 and it lists for 19.95. Very >valuable resource for the begenning DIY-EFI'r... Yes, that's the book I was speaking of. Its an excellent resource! >Another ECM you could use is the 86-9 GM 148 with a MAF, and either put >in 2 MAF's, or resize the original, or purchase a larger MAF from Bosch This is the setup I'm working with, because the ECM came with the donor vehicle for my mid-engined sports car. I haven't decided whether to put the existing, working MAF inside a larger tube, or to run two of them in parallel, and take data from one or the other alternatively, with a crossover tube between them ensuring they are balanced if one of the turbo's stop spinning (for some strange reason). I have to say that book helped out a lot, as did everyone on this list. Originally, I had a misconception I could get away with doubling the output of the injectors by replacing them and increasing the fuel pressure, then doubling the airflow. *bbbbbbzzzzzzzzzz*. :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 16:41:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA12734 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:41:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from webserver (brpt01-sh5-port36.snet.net [204.60.24.36]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA12730 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:41:31 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA00270; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:40:13 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:40:13 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804222040.QAA00270@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:42:24 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection Cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu In-Reply-To: References: <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Ok that sounds familliar. But what about GM vs. Ford MAF's ? Ford units >put out a voltage (which approaches 5V asumptotically) but what about the >GM's? They also put out a frequency based on airflow! I have the specs of the 3.8L FWD MAF from 1986 somewhere, if I find it I'll post it to the list. I had done several "shop vac airflow" tests to see how it worked. My Lincoln Continental MAF goes from .1 volts to 5.3 volts depending on the flow. Measured that with a digital VOM while driving on the freeway last fall. Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 16:43:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA12780 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:43:31 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA12776 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:43:30 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id QAA01817; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:43:28 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA00121 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:42:12 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:42:12 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804222042.QAA00121@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980422164429.007b77b0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:44:29 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: References: <852565EE.00444C21.00@csc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >(oposite to the ford system). You originally said something about GM >MAF's and their voltage vs air flow curve. I thought this should be >frequency. >no biggie While its confusing, at one point in the 90's, GM switched from frequency to voltage, and Ford switched from voltage to Frequency. Maybe they thought each other had a better idea :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 17:05:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA13445 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 17:05:25 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lsi.lsil.com (lsi.lsil.com [147.145.40.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA13441 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 17:05:22 -0400 Received: from mhbs.lsil.com ([147.145.29.36]) by lsi.lsil.com with ESMTP id OAA25110 (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:05:15 -0700 Received: from [147.145.143.10] by mhbs.lsil.com; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:05:12 -0700 Received: from mm104.minn by mms10 (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA00035; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:05:06 -0500 Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:05:06 -0500 From: mdill@lsil.com (Mike Dillon) Message-Id: <199804222105.QAA00035@mms10> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Is the XXXX.S16 a motarola S record format file ? what does it look like in a text editor ?? Mike D. > From: "Bruce Plecan" > > > >>Would anyone have a bin for a 86, 3.8 FWD Buick/Olds using > >>a 1227148 or know if it is the same code/table locations as a > >>GN/TType?.. > >Howdy. > >I have that exact engine, ECM and chip. Unfortunately my reader is dead. > Come up with an alternate solution (i.e. I mail the chip to you and you send > it back at some point) and you can leach the bin if you want >Frederic > Breitwieser > >Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > > Hope your feeling better.. > The above idea will work, fine > > Bruce Plecan > 18 E 1st St > Arcanum, OH 45304 > > BTW, ya know what a file extension of .S16 means?. I got some > bins but with that file extension, and just changing it to .bin doesn't > seem to work. > Cheers > Bruce > > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 17:45:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA14152 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 17:45:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from eagle.ACNS.ColoState.EDU (eagle.ACNS.ColoState.EDU [129.82.100.90]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA14145 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 17:45:03 -0400 Received: from holly.ColoState.EDU (holly.ACNS.ColoState.EDU [129.82.100.76]) by eagle.ACNS.ColoState.EDU (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with ESMTP id PAA55892 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:45:02 -0600 (MDT) Received: from Lee (ts1207.SLIP.ColoState.EDU [129.82.192.27]) by holly.ColoState.EDU (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) with SMTP id PAA184916 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:44:39 -0600 (MDT) Message-Id: <199804222144.PAA184916@holly.ColoState.EDU> Comments: Authenticated sender is From: "Lee Gates" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:46:38 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: mailing list Priority: normal In-reply-to: X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.53/R1) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Please remove my name from the mailing list. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 17:53:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA14349 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 17:53:47 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA14344 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 17:53:46 -0400 Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id RAA03581; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 17:53:45 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA19733; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:53:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id OAA01653; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:53:08 -0700 Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:53:08 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980422164429.007b77b0@xephic.dynip.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 22 Apr 1998, Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > While its confusing, at one point in the 90's, GM switched from frequency > to voltage, and Ford switched from voltage to Frequency. Do you know when Ford switched from voltage to frequency for their MAF's ?? This is news to me. later jw From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 17:53:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA14353 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 17:53:48 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca (mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA14346 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 17:53:46 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA19733; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:53:43 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id OAA01653; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:53:08 -0700 Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 14:53:08 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980422164429.007b77b0@xephic.dynip.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 22 Apr 1998, Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > While its confusing, at one point in the 90's, GM switched from frequency > to voltage, and Ford switched from voltage to Frequency. Do you know when Ford switched from voltage to frequency for their MAF's ?? This is news to me. later jw From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 18:15:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA14833 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:15:41 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA14828 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:15:38 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA13092 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:15:34 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 15:16:17 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35646bd4.41248390@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id SAA14829 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:42:24 -0700, Frederic Breitwieser wrote: >My Lincoln Continental MAF goes from .1 volts to 5.3 volts depending on the >flow. Measured that with a digital VOM while driving on the freeway last >fall. Say Fred. Uh, is the MAF unit you refer to above, the STOCK OEM MAF unit that comes on all 93 Continentals? IF so, what pray is the engine displacement on that monster. Says you have supercharged it in your .sig line; is the increased flow after super also encompassed in the stock MAF's range? Reason for the 20 questions is I'm lookin fer a voltage MAF for instrumentation purposes that has a goodly airflow range. Can you tell me anything else about it, like is it hot wire or hot film, who's mfg. etc. etc. TIA! Garfield From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 18:30:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA15193 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:30:43 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA15189 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:30:41 -0400 Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.69.1.79]) by mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with ESMTP id AAA19817 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:30:10 +0000 Message-ID: <353E6F68.B34DF281@worldnet.att.net> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:30:00 -0400 From: Thomas Matthews X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: GM ECM for 455 Poncho/Hartman book References: <3.0.5.32.19980422120558.007a7d60@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980422155722.007a4b20@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Wow, did I have my head up my anal orfice.... What I was talking about was a 165 ECM, the 86-89 TPI one... Someday I'd like to boost it too, but that's a long while down the road...I was going to go the MAF route, but the cost of finding a couple of Bosch MAF sensors for tests are really prohibitive for me... The Bosch MAF's run on a voltage system, whereas the much higher flowing LT1 MAF uses frequency variation... If we could only hack the 94-5 GM LT1 ECM totally IMO it would probably be an ideal DIY controller, but it's likely going to be awhile before it's hacked like the 747 and 730 ECM's... The Hartman book has been an incredible resource, almost as good as this list... Just don't forget to keep your mailer set on sending plain text messages.... Tom From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 19:28:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA16163 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 19:28:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com ([206.130.240.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA16120 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 19:21:46 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0yS8rS-0000m4C; Wed, 22 Apr 98 19:23 EDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: GM ECM for 455 Poncho/Hartman book To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 19:23:29 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: <353E6F68.B34DF281@worldnet.att.net> from "Thomas Matthews" at Apr 22, 98 06:30:00 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > Wow, did I have my head up my anal orfice.... What I was talking about > was a 165 ECM, the 86-89 TPI one... Someday I'd like to boost it too, > but that's a long while down the road...I was going to go the MAF route, > but the cost of finding a couple of Bosch MAF sensors for tests are > really prohibitive for me... The Bosch MAF's run on a voltage system, > whereas the much higher flowing LT1 MAF uses frequency variation... If > we could only hack the 94-5 GM LT1 ECM totally IMO it would probably be > an ideal DIY controller, but it's likely going to be awhile before it's > hacked like the 747 and 730 ECM's... > The Hartman book has been an incredible resource, almost as good as this > list... Just don't forget to keep your mailer set on sending plain text > messages.... Ford MAF units run on voltage output systems hit the local junkyard and find one from a 460 Clive From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 19:49:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA16409 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 19:49:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA16403 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 19:49:29 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp35.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.165]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id SAA29661 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:49:40 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <353E800A.39F2E262@mwt.net> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:40:59 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <199804222105.QAA00035@mms10> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Mike If I remember I used I think s19 records years ago I may still have the docs on its format I think you can read in a edit program and can figure out most of the stuff you want . My eprom programmer burns s19 format or converts to hex format can't remember . Will try to find and scan it in and email if you want. Steve Mike Dillon wrote: > Is the XXXX.S16 a motarola S record format file ? what does it > look like in a text editor ?? > > Mike D. > > > From: "Bruce Plecan" > > > > > > >>Would anyone have a bin for a 86, 3.8 FWD Buick/Olds using > > >>a 1227148 or know if it is the same code/table locations as a > > >>GN/TType?.. > > >Howdy. > > >I have that exact engine, ECM and chip. Unfortunately my reader is > dead. > > Come up with an alternate solution (i.e. I mail the chip to you and > you send > > it back at some point) and you can leach the bin if you want > >Frederic > > Breitwieser > > >Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > > > > Hope your feeling better.. > > The above idea will work, fine > > > > Bruce Plecan > > 18 E 1st St > > Arcanum, OH 45304 > > > > BTW, ya know what a file extension of .S16 means?. I got some > > bins but with that file extension, and just changing it to .bin > doesn't > > seem to work. > > Cheers > > Bruce > > > > > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 20:07:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA16682 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:07:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA16678 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:07:00 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id UAA06864; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:06:58 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAF00236 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:05:36 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:05:36 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804230005.UAF00236@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980422200310.007a7df0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:03:10 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164429.007b77b0@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Do you know when Ford switched from voltage to frequency for their MAF's >?? This is news to me. I read it somewhere, in fact, I thought I read it here. I just checked my 2 megs of saved messages... didn't find it. Might be on the garage PC :) I'll look in a bit. Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 20:16:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA16839 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:16:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA16834 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:16:38 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp35.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.165]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id TAA02836 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 19:16:52 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <353E8675.C4F620A1@mwt.net> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 19:08:22 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM ECM for 455 Poncho/Hartman book X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <3.0.5.32.19980422120558.007a7d60@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980422155722.007a4b20@xephic.dynip.com> <353E6F68.B34DF281@worldnet.att.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu If you guys want to do maf National has 3 pin temp ICS(look like 2n2222 Xsistors) use 2 of them as shown in the book as a anemometer. The ICs are buck each use a uC to scale to make it work with GM or FORD or what ever. Every once in a while you will need to clean parts by hand will not have clean function like factory mafs. When knife edge orifice comes in from machine shop can continue with flow bench so I can build one. Steve Thomas Matthews wrote: > Wow, did I have my head up my anal orfice.... What I was talking about > > was a 165 ECM, the 86-89 TPI one... Someday I'd like to boost it too, > but that's a long while down the road...I was going to go the MAF > route, > but the cost of finding a couple of Bosch MAF sensors for tests are > really prohibitive for me... The Bosch MAF's run on a voltage system, > whereas the much higher flowing LT1 MAF uses frequency variation... If > > we could only hack the 94-5 GM LT1 ECM totally IMO it would probably > be > an ideal DIY controller, but it's likely going to be awhile before > it's > hacked like the 747 and 730 ECM's... > The Hartman book has been an incredible resource, almost as good as > this > list... Just don't forget to keep your mailer set on sending plain > text > messages.... > Tom From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 20:37:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA17412 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:37:47 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA17408 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:37:45 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id UAA07626; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:37:43 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA00257 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:36:30 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:36:30 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804230036.UAA00257@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980422203431.007b4100@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:34:31 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals In-Reply-To: <35646bd4.41248390@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Say Fred. Say Garfield :) >Uh, is the MAF unit you refer to above, the STOCK OEM MAF unit that >comes on all 93 Continentals? Yes, its the MAF that came with the car. The only thing I did to the engine support system was to replace the injectors with one size larger than OEM, bolt on a paxton supercharger from a Mustang 5.0L, and move the air conditioning compressor from the back of the engine to the front of the engine (its a transverse engine, looking at it with your knees against the bumper). The engine is the factory 3.8L engine, balanced, blueprinted, intake, heads and exhaust ported, with forged pistons and shot-peened rods, maintaining the original compression ratio, at least thats what the shop said when I got the car back. I drove the car around for about a month, then had time to put in the new injectors (one size larger), and the paxton. Brackets had to be fabricated, and the air conditioning compressor relocated, because the Paxton unit wouldn't fit in the front of the engine between the engine and the radiator support bracket - its fatter than the A/C. When I first got the supercharger attached to the new, longer belts, the car ran like crap. I replaced the MAF with a 5.0L MAF (from the same car I got the paxton from), and it ran the same way. Idle was okay after the car ran for about 10 minutes, but hard acceleration was pretty bad, so I put the original MAF back in. I decided just not to push the car for a week, and worry about taking it out the following weekend (I installed this on a Sunday night, which was pretty stupid). Anyway, over the week, from driving from upstate NY to NYC, the problem went away. I'm assuming the ECM learned a new trick. Anyway, you weren't interested in the brackets, so onto the MAF issues. I just looked at the MAF for ya, and it says this: FORD F12F-12B579-AA AFH55-03B 2F0 I know this is the MAF that came with the car... when I first did this, the car ran like complete crap at idle, and after a few minutes, seemed to be more "stable". Under boost conditions, the car ran like crap, sputtering, and obviously being confused. I put the original injectors in thinking something was wrong with them, and it got worse under boost. So, I put the new ones back in, called a friend, who told me to drive nicely for a week, and the ECM should learn about the new injectors, as it will be using the O2 sensor. So, I did that, and he was right, it did get much better, and started to purr like a kitten, in about, oh maybe 30-40 miles worth of highway driving? SOmething like that. Under boost, it still ran like crap, though the point where it would cough seemingly getting higher. So, I tapped the intake and put on a 0-10PSI pressure gauge, and watched what was happening. 7PSI is about all the ECM will take before the thing chokes to death. Below that, it runs fine with more power/torque I can actually feel. That was then, this is now. After learning a lot more about MAFs, MAPs, EEC-IV, Fuel Injection, etc, I've done some tests over the last few months. The MAF reaches full voltage (5.2 or 5.3V) somewhere between 1-2PSI. Its a cheap analog gauge, so it could be off. Anyway, the MAF is maxed out right away, and somehow, the car is either ignoring it, adapted to it, or something else happened because of the larger injectors, I really couldn't tell ya to be honest. But this MAF does max out at about 1-2PSI. I don't have a scan too, but the engine light and the service light stay off. Originally, the service light would blink on and off when I first installed everything, and eventually it stopped, at about the same time the car seemed to "adapt". There are only two situations where these modifications don't peform well. The first is when the car sits overnight in 0 degree weather, the engine turns right over, but runs a bit rough for abut 35-40 seconds, then it settles down, but no engine/service lights. The second is if the car's been run on the highway for about an hour or so, then is shut down, the service light comes on if I start the car within a few minutes, but goes out after about a minute. This happens when I drive home from work (65 mile ride), and stop at the smoke shop on the way home to get a nicotine refill. Other than that, it seems okay. I hope I told you something useful, or answered your question. To be entirely honest, I "slapped" this together, without any real research or understanding of fuel injection systems, and lucked out. I know 10 times what I knew then, and still haven't a clue (10 times zero is still zero, right?) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 21:08:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA18020 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:08:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from diamond.sunset.net (root@diamond.sunset.net [205.138.253.252]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA18016 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:08:00 -0400 Received: from default (d75.venus.sunset.net [205.138.253.75]) by diamond.sunset.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id SAA03751 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:11:13 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804230111.SAA03751@diamond.sunset.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:14:06 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hey Projection with a 747... Do tell.. I was thinking of the same setup for my SB...? Is the Projection 4 a two stage throttle body, or single stage...? How do you hook up the injectors, in series? ---------- > From: Thomas Matthews > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection > Date: Wednesday, April 22, 1998 12:05 PM > > I believe the book that Frederic was referring to is called Fuel > Injection Installation, Performance Tuning, Modifications by Jeff > Hartman... ISBN number is 0-87938-743-2 and it lists for 19.95. Very > valuable resource for the begenning DIY-EFI'r... > BTW, I'm in the midst of 2 EFI projects for my 69 Firebird 455, one is a > very simple Holley Projection 4 with a '747 computer. This one should be > on in a couple of weeks... And, I'm also working on a port setup with a > TR intake and a '730 GM ECM, but the manifold requires some fabrication > that is going to take me a while longer (plus the manifold suffers from > major core shift) which has pushed back the project awhile... > Another ECM you could use is the 86-9 GM 148 with a MAF, and either put > in 2 MAF's, or resize the original, or purchase a larger MAF from Bosch > (these are some of the options we discussed a few months ago) > Good luck in your projects! > Tom From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 21:31:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA18443 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:31:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo26.mx.aol.com (imo26.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.70]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA18439 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:31:15 -0400 Received: from Roccet@aol.com by imo26.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8VQBa20031 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:30:43 +2000 (EDT) From: Roccet Message-ID: <300f793.353e99c4@aol.com> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:30:43 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Remove Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Please remove my name from the mailing list. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 21:49:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA18750 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:49:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA18746 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:49:47 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-d35.foothill.net [209.76.43.35]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA16421 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:50:33 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:48:34 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6e59$ecf58520$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Is this a panic request or can you wait until this weekend for it? I will send a file from my 1986 Ciera GT with a 3.8L Vin 3 and 4T60. It's getting a 3800 Superchargered and 4T60E. Send me you email address. TK -----Original Message----- From: Frederic Breitwieser To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 22, 1998 10:00 AM Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin >>Would anyone have a bin for a 86, 3.8 FWD Buick/Olds using >>a 1227148 or know if it is the same code/table locations as a >>GN/TType?.. > >Howdy. > >I have that exact engine, ECM and chip. Unfortunately my reader is dead. >Come up with an alternate solution (i.e. I mail the chip to you and you >send it back at some point) and you can leach the bin if you want > > >Frederic Breitwieser >Bridgeport, CT 06606 > >Homebrew Automotive Website: >http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > >1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental >1989 HMMWV >2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car > >- > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 21:50:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA18769 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:50:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lnagate.foxboro.com.au (lnagate.foxboro.com.au [202.12.113.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA18764 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:50:55 -0400 X-Received: (qmail 20425 invoked from network); 23 Apr 1998 01:50:33 -0000 Received: from foxlnqtc.foxboro.com.au (HELO foxboro.com.au) (202.12.112.10) by gatekeeper.foxln.com.au with SMTP; 23 Apr 1998 01:50:33 -0000 Received: from wayneb-nt (fwserver [202.12.112.56]) by foxboro.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA17703 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:50:31 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980423115041.00975410@qtc-mail> X-Sender: wayneb@qtc-mail X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:50:41 +1000 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Wayne Blair Subject: file formats Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu This may be helpful http://www.wotsit.demon.co.uk/ wayne From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 21:51:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA18781 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:51:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA18777 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:51:22 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-d35.foothill.net [209.76.43.35]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id SAA16559 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:52:09 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 18:50:10 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6e5a$26697780$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu S16 Motorola format format. Use EMP to convert. Load as Mot format, change format, same as bin. Got package Bruce. Just like Christmas! TK -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Plecan To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 22, 1998 10:50 AM Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin > >>>Would anyone have a bin for a 86, 3.8 FWD Buick/Olds using >>>a 1227148 or know if it is the same code/table locations as a >>>GN/TType?.. >>Howdy. >>I have that exact engine, ECM and chip. Unfortunately my reader is dead. >Come up with an alternate solution (i.e. I mail the chip to you and you send >it back at some point) and you can leach the bin if you want >Frederic >Breitwieser >>Bridgeport, CT 06606 >> >Hope your feeling better.. >The above idea will work, fine > >Bruce Plecan >18 E 1st St >Arcanum, OH 45304 > >BTW, ya know what a file extension of .S16 means?. I got some >bins but with that file extension, and just changing it to .bin doesn't >seem to work. >Cheers >Bruce > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 22:14:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA19305 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:14:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net [204.127.131.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA19300 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:14:26 -0400 Received: from worldnet.att.net ([12.68.173.53]) by mtigwc03.worldnet.att.net (post.office MTA v2.0 0613 ) with ESMTP id AAA25947 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:14:25 +0000 Message-ID: <353EA3F7.7734E3D@worldnet.att.net> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:14:15 -0400 From: Thomas Matthews X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection/Projection References: <199804230111.SAA03751@diamond.sunset.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The Projection 4 is a later design type, single stage with 1:1 pri/sec throttle, and it's fitted with IAC... Pretty simple looking setup (famous last words), we'll see in a week or 2 how easy it is to get working... Tom From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 22:48:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA20206 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:48:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from batch3.csd.uwm.edu (root@batch3.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.7.226]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA20202 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:48:14 -0400 Received: from alpha1.csd.uwm.edu (root@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.7.201]) by batch3.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with ESMTP id VAA26725; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:48:08 -0500 (CDT) Received: from slirp-user.csd.uwm.edu (garnierd@alpha1.csd.uwm.edu [129.89.8.201]) by alpha1.csd.uwm.edu (8.8.4/8.6.8) with SMTP id VAA29261; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:48:05 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <353EC8BC.6DE2@alphag.csd.uwm.edu> Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 21:51:08 -0700 From: David Garnier Organization: Say What? X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.04Gold (Win95; I; 16bit) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu CC: steve@sun4c409.imes.com, garnierd@batch3.csd.uwm.edu Subject: Apology: Re: OTC's ecm system tester Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Fellow DIY_EFI'ers I didn't realize what I stupid thing I had done posting that excel file until I received the Digest version and saw the bandwidth I ate up. My ISP is free from the university but yours is probably not, my apology's to all. Thanks steve@sun4c409.imes.com for doing the right thing. If anyone would like it in excel file, email me. sincerely, dave garnier From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 22:55:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA20342 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:55:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bigdog.fred.net (bigdog.fred.net [204.215.84.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA20338 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:55:58 -0400 Received: from cmcgee.ptd.net (du59.lan.ptd.net [204.186.132.11]) by bigdog.fred.net (8.8.8/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA17790 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:42:28 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804230242.WAA17790@bigdog.fred.net> From: "Icegod" To: Subject: Remove Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:53:58 -0400 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1155 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Please remove my name from the mailing list From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 23:02:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA20485 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 23:02:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ingenico.com.au ([203.10.64.225]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA20479 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 23:01:37 -0400 Received: from PJARAMAZ [10.10.10.34] by ingenico.com.au [10.10.10.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP0.R) for ; Thu, 23 Apr 98 13:03:36 +1000 Received: by PJARAMAZ with Microsoft Mail id <01BD6EB7.F9A8C620@PJARAMAZ >; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:01:48 +1000 Message-ID: <01BD6EB7.F9A8C620@PJARAMAZ > From: Peter Jaramaz To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: NA FWD 148 Bin Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:01:46 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD6EB7.F9B98F00" X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD6EB7.F9B98F00 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'd be interested in a 3800 Supercharged Bin Peter ---------- From: TBK Sent: Thursday, April 23, 1998 11:48 AM To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin Is this a panic request or can you wait until this weekend for it? I will send a file from my 1986 Ciera GT with a 3.8L Vin 3 and 4T60. It's getting a 3800 Superchargered and 4T60E. Send me you email address. TK -----Original Message----- From: Frederic Breitwieser To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 22, 1998 10:00 AM Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin >>Would anyone have a bin for a 86, 3.8 FWD Buick/Olds using >>a 1227148 or know if it is the same code/table locations as a >>GN/TType?.. > >Howdy. > >I have that exact engine, ECM and chip. Unfortunately my reader is dead. >Come up with an alternate solution (i.e. I mail the chip to you and you >send it back at some point) and you can leach the bin if you want > > >Frederic Breitwieser >Bridgeport, CT 06606 > >Homebrew Automotive Website: >http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > >1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental >1989 HMMWV >2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car > >- > ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD6EB7.F9B98F00 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+IjADAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYAYAEAAAEAAAAMAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAAYQAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMy LmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQBTTVRQAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVk dQAAAAAeAAIwAQAAAAUAAABTTVRQAAAAAB4AAzABAAAAIgAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5v aGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQAAAAMAFQwBAAAAAwD+DwYAAAAeAAEwAQAAACQAAAAnZGl5X2VmaUBlZmkz MzIuZW5nLm9oaW8tc3RhdGUuZWR1JwACAQswAQAAACcAAABTTVRQOkRJWV9FRklARUZJMzMyLkVO Ry5PSElPLVNUQVRFLkVEVQAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAKcSAEEgAEA EwAAAFJFOiBOQSBGV0QgMTQ4IEJpbgB3BAEFgAMADgAAAM4HBAAXAA0AAQAuAAQAMAEBIIADAA4A AADOBwQAFwANAAEAEwAEABUBAQmAAQAhAAAAQTQzNzhBOUFBQURBRDExMUJFQkIwMDQwMDU1RjJB NkYATgcBA5AGAPwFAAAUAAAACwAjAAAAAAADACYAAAAAAAsAKQAAAAAAAwAuAAAAAAADADYAAAAA AEAAOQAgKPAmZG69AR4AcAABAAAAEwAAAFJFOiBOQSBGV0QgMTQ4IEJpbgAAAgFxAAEAAAAWAAAA Ab1uZCbfmoo3pdqqEdG+uwBABV8qbwAAHgAeDAEAAAAFAAAAU01UUAAAAAAeAB8MAQAAABkAAABw amFyYW1hekBpbmdlbmljby5jb20uYXUAAAAAAwAGEEI0LEYDAAcQuQMAAB4ACBABAAAAZQAAAElE QkVJTlRFUkVTVEVESU5BMzgwMFNVUEVSQ0hBUkdFREJJTlBFVEVSLS0tLS0tLS0tLUZST006VEJL U0VOVDpUSFVSU0RBWSxBUFJJTDIzLDE5OTgxMTo0OEFNVE86RElZRUYAAAAAAgEJEAEAAABwBAAA bAQAABkIAABMWkZ1sC6Xwf8ACgEPAhUCpAPkBesCgwBQEwNUAgBjaArAc2V07jIGAAbDAoMyA8YH EwKDujMTDX0KgAjPCdk7Ff94MjU1AoAKgQ2xC2Bu8GcxMDMUIAsKEvIMAQJjAEAgSSdkIGL0ZSAL gHQEkAeQG3AbAAELgCBhIDM4MDBZBgB1cASQEbJnG9FC9wuACoUKhVASAASQHawK9BhsaTEcYQIA aS0xPDQ0DfAM0CCzC1kxNtcKoANgG3BjBUAtItcKh9chiwwwIlZGA2E6I94iVuEMgiBUQksjfySN BmAXAjAlvybMaAhwc2RhnHksE3AiUAMRMjMsYBAxOTk4LRAxOjSZLVBBTSfPJI1UbyoPISbLZGl5 Xw3AaUATMjEZQDIuCfBnLm/QaGlvLRuwYRtwMtCMZHUt/yjedWJqIpGTMB8my1JlNnBOQSVgPFdE LRAtoR1/H7YzNq8hVxQiDAEiVkkEIHQzME8EIBwwCrADAGMgFgBxqwpQG7AgBbFjA5F5CGDsIHcL cAVAdQIwAxE8o/p3CeBrCfAbAAIQBcA+wO4/GtA+kAMQbAqFEfA/8RscMCCAbBswA1IgbXlhLRE4 NiBDCJEcMEcOVECxPKAcIi44TCCaVhwBMxwgP/E0VDrg8i4a0HQnBCAdMAJAC4A+ZxwgCoUcXhYB RKdFLt8drCnBGwAHgD5TZQDAAxGoYWRkG5FzSH1UJ7b1ItNPBRBnC4AHQAXQSsH+YR0wIyoldCVw CYAGcT1QPkIWAD7AA/AHkASQIDwTA1BPBC5iT4hAeGUmcDMwULBkeQMAcC75BaBtPkt2MAEx/zMO UCC3U18zDlKWRDORNnBXCYCWbgeQLDoyLQYwOhxxHy3XNgc4Xx2dCoU+PlddCGBsR8I+YFigIBHA dvsbMBwwYhwBQCIcMELQLGATRAFb80J1PUBrL097XlAEIHUAkBkAXZccMDGNWYA3XEIFsWtubwfg /waQQFEbQDyCGzBNgEmxBaD9DbAvAZFCARWQPiA/EAIgBzzRPNFdl0dOL1RUMnkcwD8uSHZSlj5I /2NAUgBnX0CgXvM8oDOQShBeeADQamEZAAuAZSxgRRxDTUSjEbBSMSAgVdpuQCF0PvAzkWxCkEKB /xYASoBQATzBDbBKgGi3CFDvSbEcsEOFHBFsG3FswkFgxQbwdWWCIChpVmBFMd9CcEpCZAJr4jyQ bz5TRLKvPmFdlkFzPsFiANBrHCCnBUBwcEmxcG8bUSlyxv8+E0IAANBDwGQCX2JjcT5kfwIwZ25d lk7vT/Fdlk9waV5kHTB1EAAgLGBDQ3AwejY64DZnb27hUNEH4EG3cKADcCJwaV8RWHBiAJALWDFd lmgCQHA6Ly/qd4AALlGeL3xeLSFEkP0cq0wLgBVxA6AIUD8BWKAHAjAHQIHYODkgSE14TVdWXZYB 0BxxYMMtllBjQEeTTXswLUVq8+0bAFN7cgQgQwrAfF4jZn9Sljl/Oo4aNSJWCoUVIQABjoADABAQ AAAAAAMAERABAAAAQAAHMMDgohZkbr0BQAAIMMDgohZkbr0BHgA9AAEAAAAFAAAAUkU6IAAAAAAD AA00/TcAAEaz ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD6EB7.F9B98F00-- From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 23:29:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA21109 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 23:29:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from diamond.sunset.net (root@diamond.sunset.net [205.138.253.252]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA21103 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 23:28:58 -0400 Received: from default (d112.earth.sunset.net [205.138.253.112]) by diamond.sunset.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA16237 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:32:12 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804230332.UAA16237@diamond.sunset.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection/Projection Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:27:24 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Well keep us posted.. and keep track of those part numbers if ya can..! ---------- > From: Thomas Matthews > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection/Projection > Date: Wednesday, April 22, 1998 7:14 PM > > The Projection 4 is a later design type, single stage with 1:1 pri/sec > throttle, and it's fitted with IAC... > Pretty simple looking setup (famous last words), we'll see in a week or > 2 how easy it is to get working... > Tom From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 22 23:42:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA21342 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 23:42:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from diamond.sunset.net (root@diamond.sunset.net [205.138.253.252]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA21337 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 23:42:56 -0400 Received: from default (d112.earth.sunset.net [205.138.253.112]) by diamond.sunset.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id UAA17173 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:46:09 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804230346.UAA17173@diamond.sunset.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: "Do-it-Yourself Fuel Injection" Subject: S?? File formats... Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 20:49:39 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu While playing with s19 file formats I thought I would send some source code on a converter, hope it helps... Derek **************************************************************************** ***** /* * Convert Motorola S1/S9 hex files to Intel hex. * * R. B. Hoffman, July 1985. * * usage: hexcvt < motorola-file > intel-file */ #include char line[256]; main() { int bc, val, cksm, fcksm, i; long laddr; while (fgets(line, 256, stdin) != NULL) { if (line[0] != 'S') continue; if (line[1] == '9') break; if (line[1] != '1') continue; sscanf(&line[2],"%2x",&bc); sscanf(&line[4],"%4x",&laddr); printf(":%02X%04X00", bc-3, laddr); cksm = bc + (laddr & 0xFF) + ((laddr >> 8) & 0xFF); for (i=0; i<(bc-3); i++) { sscanf(&line[i*2 + 8], "%2x", &val); cksm += val; printf("%02X", val); } sscanf(&line[(bc-3)*2 + 8], "%2x", &fcksm); cksm = ~cksm & 0xFF; if (cksm != fcksm) fprintf(stderr,"cksm=%02x, fcksm=%02x\n", cksm, fcksm); printf("%02X\n", (cksm+4) & 0xFF); } printf(":0000000000\n"); } -- Bob Hoffman, N3CVL {allegra, bellcore, cadre, idis, psuvax1}!pitt!hoffman Pitt Computer Science hoffman@vax.cs.pittsburgh.edu From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 01:17:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA23035 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:17:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from fly.HiWAAY.net (root@fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA23031 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:17:27 -0400 Received: from dciobota.HiWAAY.net (tnt1-32.HiWAAY.net [208.147.147.32]) by fly.HiWAAY.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) with ESMTP id AAA09066 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 00:17:27 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <353ECDF8.7DBC095D@hiwaay.net> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 00:13:29 -0500 From: Daniel Ciobota X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <35646bd4.41248390@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Howdy folks, Since this is my first post on this list, I'd like to introduce myself. I'm a computer programmer, emphasis on graphics and user interfaces, AI paradigms (neural nets, fuzzy logic, genetic algorithms, ...) which basically means I like to play with neat stuff :-) Automotive background includes ownership of two late model mustangs, one which sees regular visits to the drag strip (when not apart). I've fooled around with ford eec systems for about two years now, which led me eventually to this list. Now for the reply to Garfield. Several aftermarket companies sell mafs as large as 80mm diameter (flow close to 1100 cfm at 14psi!) and they can come calibrated with different sampling tubes and/or electronics (i.e. bridge recal.) to give a proper 1-5v range for the airflow expected, allowing the stock computer to keep using the same internal fuel tables. The setup works well, although some have complained that the mechanical calibrations (the sampling tubes) don't always match the stock airflow tables, creating surging and driveability problems. One company whose product I use in both my cars is C&L performance, right here in town. The mafs I use are 73mm, which flow well enough for most hot-rodded v8's out there. The maf uses the stock ford meter (hot wire) with the stock bridge. Calibration for non-stock injector sizes is achieved through different diameter sampling tubes. New, the units sell for about $180, although several internet swap trading places for stang parts (corral.net, for one) have them used for $100-$120. Lee Bender, owner of C&L performance and developer of the meter, has flow sheets for most of the meters he sells. I believe the 73mm or the 80mm units should be plenty for most automotive flow measurements. Daniel BTW, were you folks aware that ford built two neural net based prototypes for cars? One was for an active suspension system (like Lotus/Vette), the other was for an adaptive engine control system. Dunno what happened to them (since about 93), anyone know? garfield@pilgrimhouse.com wrote: > On Wed, 22 Apr 1998 16:42:24 -0700, Frederic Breitwieser > wrote: > > >My Lincoln Continental MAF goes from .1 volts to 5.3 volts depending > on the > >flow. Measured that with a digital VOM while driving on the freeway > last > >fall. > > Say Fred. > > Uh, is the MAF unit you refer to above, the STOCK OEM MAF unit that > comes on all 93 Continentals? IF so, what pray is the engine > displacement on that monster. Says you have supercharged it in your > .sig > line; is the increased flow after super also encompassed in the stock > MAF's range? Reason for the 20 questions is I'm lookin fer a voltage > MAF > for instrumentation purposes that has a goodly airflow range. Can you > tell me anything else about it, like is it hot wire or hot film, who's > > mfg. etc. etc. TIA! > > Garfield From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 01:39:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA23180 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:39:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA23176 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:38:59 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp8.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.29]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA03889; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:43:29 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:36:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Subject: RE: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980422120558.007a7d60@xephic.dynip.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > >The Pontiac big-block shares no components with the Chevy big-blocks, so the > >manifold from the 454 won't work on the Pontiac block. You would be able to > > Yes, that is true. But you can move the injectors, maf, and other > components over by doing some minor fabricating. On the carb'd manifold, > you bore 8 holes to allow the welding of injector bosses, then shove the > injectors in. There's a good book on this subject from Motorbooks > International, I can get the exact title and ISBN number if you are > interested.... I bought it myself and found it more than useful :) yes,i'm very interested,BTW,today,i've run out of disk space (cone shaped hat on) and i had to delete some mail (the old mail i received last month among other) does anyone here have some mail of last month on the subject of the programming 101 serie ??? p.s.now i have a 575 meg partition just for mail so these thing won't re-happen soon. p.p.s.thanks a lot !! Alain > > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > Homebrew Automotive Website: > http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HMMWV > 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car > > - > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 01:53:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA23408 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:53:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA23404 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:53:21 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA26345 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:53:21 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:54:03 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <357fd57e.68299281@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <35646bd4.41248390@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> <353ECDF8.7DBC095D@hiwaay.net> In-Reply-To: <353ECDF8.7DBC095D@hiwaay.net> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id BAA23405 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Thu, 23 Apr 1998 00:13:29 -0500, Daniel Ciobota wrote: >Now for the reply to Garfield. Several aftermarket companies sell mafs >as large as 80mm diameter (flow close to 1100 cfm at 14psi!) >.... >One company whose product I use in both my cars is C&L performance, >right here in town. Ooooh, interesting poop, dude. I'll definitely look into it. I'd like to have a range of MAF sensor capability for lab rat use, if nuthin else. >BTW, were you folks aware that ford built two neural net based >prototypes for cars? Uh, yeah, listen Daniel, you'll find that most of the group members are still tryna get their own "neural nets" to work OK, ifyaknowhadamean. I dunno, I can't/don't speak for the group o'course, but my own personal *neural network* is due for a transplant (or as some wag opined, just an "implant" would be nice, heh). Garfield, entangled as usual in his neural nets. (Hmm, maybe they should be called "neural webs" ... ya know, rhymes with "cob webs"?) P.S. Welcome to our wacko group, Daniel. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 01:58:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA23466 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:58:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from fly.HiWAAY.net (root@fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA23462 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:58:13 -0400 Received: from dciobota.HiWAAY.net (tnt1-32.HiWAAY.net [208.147.147.32]) by fly.HiWAAY.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) with ESMTP id AAA25527 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 00:58:12 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <353ED785.F39461D1@hiwaay.net> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 00:54:14 -0500 From: Daniel Ciobota X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980422203431.007b4100@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic, I read your post and I'm a little worried about your setup. Yes, you friend was right about about the computer being able to change the fuel tables to accomodate for the airflow diferences and the larger injectors. However, from my experience with some fords (not yours, though) I haven't seen any engine a map sensor capable of detecting boost, except possibly for turbos and supercharged t-birds. If your 3.8 is the same as the one used in Tauruses (Tauri?) then _definitely_ not. Why is that important? Timing control. Running full timing advance under boost can cause detonation, so most "pressurized" engines employ some sort of boost sensor to retard the timing under boost. A trick used by late model mustangs nowadays is to buy a custom burned chip which replaces the ecu's internal tables, like timing advance and injector pulse width with ones which take into account measured boost. Your other problem, the maf voltage peaking out too early, can also cause detonation due to the ecu's fuel table limitations; it's designed to look up voltages up to 5.0 volts only. The fix would be to buy an aftermarket mustang maf calibrated for the injector size you currently use. See an earlier post I made. You'll need to reset the computer again, and let it relearn the new voltage/airflow settings. However, since the fuel table for a supercharged engine diverge _very_ quickly from the default tables under boost conditions, you will initially experience detonation until the computer adapts. Your alternative is to either use an boost sensitive fuel pressure regulator (fmu) or find out if you can get a chip burned for your ecu. I know several sources to ask if you're interested. In the mean time I urge you to be very careful with your current setup. Good luck, Daniel Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > >Say Fred. > > Say Garfield :) > > >Uh, is the MAF unit you refer to above, the STOCK OEM MAF unit that > >comes on all 93 Continentals? > > Yes, its the MAF that came with the car. The only thing I did to the > engine support system was to replace the injectors with one size > larger > than OEM, bolt on a paxton supercharger from a Mustang 5.0L, and move > the > air conditioning compressor from the back of the engine to the front > of the > engine (its a transverse engine, looking at it with your knees against > the > bumper). > > The engine is the factory 3.8L engine, balanced, blueprinted, intake, > heads > and exhaust ported, with forged pistons and shot-peened rods, > maintaining > the original compression ratio, at least thats what the shop said when > I > got the car back. I drove the car around for about a month, then had > time > to put in the new injectors (one size larger), and the paxton. > Brackets > had to be fabricated, and the air conditioning compressor relocated, > because the Paxton unit wouldn't fit in the front of the engine > between the > engine and the radiator support bracket - its fatter than the A/C. > > When I first got the supercharger attached to the new, longer belts, > the > car ran like crap. I replaced the MAF with a 5.0L MAF (from the same > car I > got the paxton from), and it ran the same way. Idle was okay after > the car > ran for about 10 minutes, but hard acceleration was pretty bad, so I > put > the original MAF back in. I decided just not to push the car for a > week, > and worry about taking it out the following weekend (I installed this > on a > Sunday night, which was pretty stupid). Anyway, over the week, from > driving from upstate NY to NYC, the problem went away. I'm assuming > the > ECM learned a new trick. > > Anyway, you weren't interested in the brackets, so onto the MAF > issues. I > just looked at the MAF for ya, and it says this: > > FORD > F12F-12B579-AA > AFH55-03B > 2F0 > > I know this is the MAF that came with the car... when I first did > this, the > car ran like complete crap at idle, and after a few minutes, seemed to > be > more "stable". Under boost conditions, the car ran like crap, > sputtering, > and obviously being confused. I put the original injectors in > thinking > something was wrong with them, and it got worse under boost. So, I > put the > new ones back in, called a friend, who told me to drive nicely for a > week, > and the ECM should learn about the new injectors, as it will be using > the > O2 sensor. So, I did that, and he was right, it did get much better, > and > started to purr like a kitten, in about, oh maybe 30-40 miles worth of > > highway driving? SOmething like that. Under boost, it still ran > like > crap, though the point where it would cough seemingly getting higher. > So, > I tapped the intake and put on a 0-10PSI pressure gauge, and watched > what > was happening. 7PSI is about all the ECM will take before the thing > chokes > to death. Below that, it runs fine with more power/torque I can > actually > feel. > > That was then, this is now. > > After learning a lot more about MAFs, MAPs, EEC-IV, Fuel Injection, > etc, > I've done some tests over the last few months. The MAF reaches full > voltage (5.2 or 5.3V) somewhere between 1-2PSI. Its a cheap analog > gauge, > so it could be off. Anyway, the MAF is maxed out right away, and > somehow, > the car is either ignoring it, adapted to it, or something else > happened > because of the larger injectors, I really couldn't tell ya to be > honest. > But this MAF does max out at about 1-2PSI. > > I don't have a scan too, but the engine light and the service light > stay > off. Originally, the service light would blink on and off when I > first > installed everything, and eventually it stopped, at about the same > time the > car seemed to "adapt". > > There are only two situations where these modifications don't peform > well. > The first is when the car sits overnight in 0 degree weather, the > engine > turns right over, but runs a bit rough for abut 35-40 seconds, then it > > settles down, but no engine/service lights. The second is if the > car's > been run on the highway for about an hour or so, then is shut down, > the > service light comes on if I start the car within a few minutes, but > goes > out after about a minute. This happens when I drive home from work > (65 > mile ride), and stop at the smoke shop on the way home to get a > nicotine > refill. > > Other than that, it seems okay. I hope I told you something useful, > or > answered your question. To be entirely honest, I "slapped" this > together, > without any real research or understanding of fuel injection systems, > and > lucked out. I know 10 times what I knew then, and still haven't a > clue (10 > times zero is still zero, right?) > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > Homebrew Automotive Website: > http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HMMWV > 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car > > - From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 02:13:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA23687 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:13:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA23683 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:13:43 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp129.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.129]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA04317; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:18:18 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:11:32 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > My Lincoln Continental MAF goes from .1 volts to 5.3 volts depending on the > flow. Measured that with a digital VOM while driving on the freeway last > fall. hummmmmm,5.3 volts,did you measure that in 4th gear (and if so,what's the top end of your car ??) Alain "just currious" Toussaint From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 02:48:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA24409 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:48:20 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA24403 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:48:18 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp146.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.146]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id CAA04660; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:52:51 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:46:06 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: steve ravet cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: OTC's ecm system tester In-Reply-To: <353DC65E.536E@imes.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Here's the list for you unix propeller heads that don't have excel... > :-) i'll check if it's readable by staroffice ( a Unix office suite also available on win95),if so,does anyone would like an html output of the file ??? From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 02:51:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA24460 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:51:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA24455 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:51:06 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA27367 for ; Wed, 22 Apr 1998 23:51:06 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection Date: Wed, 22 Apr 1998 23:51:48 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <3587e286.71635000@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: In-Reply-To: X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id CAA24457 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:11:32 -0400 (EDT), Alain Toussaint wrote: >> My Lincoln Continental MAF goes from .1 volts to 5.3 volts depending on the >> flow. Measured that with a digital VOM while driving on the freeway last >> fall. > >hummmmmm,5.3 volts,did you measure that in 4th gear (and if so,what's the >top end of your car ??) Heh heh. Methinks the regulator for the ECM's logic supply was in "4th gear" too, or the grounds in the car are cheesy. I had a recent dicussion with a buddy of mine who was messin with some auto logic, and he was mentioning numbers like that, and worried some because it was over 5V. Main thing to remember is that most logic devices are spec'd for supplies of 5V +- 0.5V, so ya gotta expect to see 'regulated' Vcc voltages roamin around 5.0V by a tad, also. A sensor swinging up close to Vcc rail, isn't so surprising to yield 5.3V. It's "within parameters". BUT, see anything over 5.4-5.5V and it's time to start asking questions. Gar From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 04:04:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA25121 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:04:21 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from crianlarich.indigo-avs.com (crianlarich.indigo-avs.com [194.200.210.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA25117 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:04:18 -0400 Received: by crianlarich.indigo-avs.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BD6E96.642AFAD0@crianlarich.indigo-avs.com>; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 09:01:24 +0100 Message-ID: From: Robert Humphris To: "'Fuel Injection List'" Subject: Crank sensor question... Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 09:01:22 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 Encoding: 12 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have found an interesting little mod for my type of car ( Renault 5GTTurbo ) which is too simple for words... but I cannot work out why it works. It has been found that if you swap the wires from the crank sensor, to the ignition module, the car pulls like a train from 3000rpm upwards. The engines used to run out of steam at around 6000rpm, but with the wire swap, it just keeps pulling... Anyone got any ideas why this works like this? Rob Humphris From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 04:24:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA25360 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:24:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA25356 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:24:07 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-030.mcn.net [208.26.146.30]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA19981 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:24:05 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <353EF7A3.73B3D9C0@mcn.net> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:11:15 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection References: <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Steven Gorkowski wrote: > > GM output map variable voltage , ford variable frequency. Didn't answer > in last post. > > James Weiler wrote: > > > Hmm GM and ford too? I knew fords were like that but I thought that > > the > > GM units put out a variable frequency vs. mass air flow. Am I getting > > > > confused with the ford MAP sensor ? > > any help mucho appreciado > > later > > jw > > > > On Tue, 21 Apr 1998, A70Duster wrote: > > > > > You may read that the AMS (from GM units ) put out a voltage that is > > directly > > > proportional to the Air Mass. That is NOT true. It is a parabolic > > function. > > > Friendly advice. Good luck. > > > > > > See ya, > > > > > > Mike > > > Take this with a grain of salt. Delco MAF sensors (black plastic) vary voltage with airflow. Hitachi (die cast aluminum) vary frequency with airflow. Hitachi is used on 3.8l Buick from about 92 0r 93, and maybe others, and was the answer to failure prone Delco unit. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 04:28:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA25443 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:28:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA25439 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:28:30 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-030.mcn.net [208.26.146.30]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA20393 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:28:26 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <353EF8A9.DDAD4CE2@mcn.net> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:15:37 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin References: <01bd6d3a$8a62bf60$3a198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > > Would anyone have a bin for a 86, 3.8 FWD Buick/Olds using > a 1227148 or know if it is the same code/table locations as a > GN/TType?.. > Or better yet if ya can just use a GN Editor to change the table > entries for a NA prom?. > Thanks > Bruce Bruce, got a calpack on the bench from 3.8l Olds. Got the year and model written on it, as well as part no. Replaced it with updated version to cure idle problems. If you can use it, it's yours. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 04:31:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA25494 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:31:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from digger1.defence.gov.au (digger1.defence.gov.au [203.5.217.4]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA25490 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:31:27 -0400 Received: from exchsa1.dsto.defence.gov.au (exchsa1.dsto.defence.gov.au [131.185.2.94]) by digger1.defence.gov.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id RAA05821 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 17:59:55 +0930 (CST) Received: from fang.dsto.defence.gov.au ([131.185.2.5]) by exchsa1.dsto.defence.gov.au with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.1960.3) id J3RCPPY5; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 18:01:33 +0930 Received: from hotblk.dsto.defence.gov.au (hotblk.dsto.defence.gov.au [146.221.39.21]) by fang.dsto.defence.gov.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id SAA30925 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 18:01:25 +0930 (CST) Received: from [146.221.36.211] ([146.221.36.211]) by hotblk.dsto.defence.gov.au with SMTP; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:25:31 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 18:31:46 +1000 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Steve Lamb Subject: Re: Crank sensor question... Cc: Robert Humphris Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >It has been found that if you swap the wires from the crank sensor, to >the ignition module, the car pulls like a train from 3000rpm upwards. >The engines used to run out of steam at around 6000rpm, but with the >wire swap, it just keeps pulling... > >Anyone got any ideas why this works like this? Going out on a limb.....but........if this a magnetic pick-up type CAS then you may be changing the ignition timing (??) by doing this. I know that some aftermarket ECU's need to be 'told' whether they are triggering on the rising or falling part of the output signal of the sensor, so it may be that the ECU is being 'fooled' by reversing the wires into altering the ignition timing (advanced ??). Prepared to be shot down in flames big time here..................... Steve Lamb Department of Defence, DSTO Aeronautical and Maritime Research Laboratory 506 Lorimer Street Fishermans Bend VIC 3207 Australia Tel: +61 3 9626 7525 Fax: +61 3 9626 7089 IZCC #180 From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 04:45:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA25698 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:45:53 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA25693 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:45:51 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-030.mcn.net [208.26.146.30]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA22014 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:45:47 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <353EFCB8.7D7BB4E5@mcn.net> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:32:56 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Alain Toussaint wrote: > > does anyone here have some mail of last month on the subject > of the programming 101 serie ??? > > p.s.now i have a 575 meg partition just for mail so these thing won't > re-happen soon. > > p.p.s.thanks a lot !! > > Alain > >Been saving 101 stuff. What's the best way to send it, and how much do you want? Shannen From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 04:46:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA25713 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:46:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA25709 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:46:50 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-030.mcn.net [208.26.146.30]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA22118 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:46:46 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <353EFCF2.90F8FACD@mcn.net> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 02:33:54 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: OTC's ecm system tester References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Alain Toussaint wrote: > > > Here's the list for you unix propeller heads that don't have excel... > > :-) > > i'll check if it's readable by staroffice ( a Unix office suite also > available on win95),if so,does anyone would like an html output of the > file ??? Yuppers. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 04:50:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA25810 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:50:31 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from geocities.com (mail1.geocities.com [209.1.224.29]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA25806 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 04:50:30 -0400 Received: from Default (slper13p32.ozemail.com.au [203.108.46.33]) by geocities.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA10784 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:50:25 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 01:50:25 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804230850.BAA10784@geocities.com> X-Sender: dzorde@mail.geocities.com X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Version 2.0.3 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: dzorde@geocities.com (dzorde) Subject: Re: Crank sensor question... Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ehh, connected wrong in the first place. Or could it be that the ignition module has some sort of built in advance retard feature. Dan dzorde@geocities.com >I have found an interesting little mod for my type of car ( Renault >5GTTurbo ) which is too simple for words... but I cannot work out why it >works. > >It has been found that if you swap the wires from the crank sensor, to >the ignition module, the car pulls like a train from 3000rpm upwards. >The engines used to run out of steam at around 6000rpm, but with the >wire swap, it just keeps pulling... > >Anyone got any ideas why this works like this? > >Rob Humphris > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 06:58:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id GAA26857 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 06:58:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id GAA26853 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 06:58:24 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp128.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.128]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA07290; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 07:02:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 06:55:57 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: dzorde cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Crank sensor question... In-Reply-To: <199804230850.BAA10784@geocities.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Ehh, connected wrong in the first place. Or could it be that the ignition > module has some sort of built in advance retard feature. > > Dan dzorde@geocities.com i'll take a look in the manual (i happen to have one for renault 5) BTW,how much anyone here would pay for a R5 in good condition with about 120 000 KM (75 000 milles) with next to no rust,the dealer (a honda dealership) is asking 500$ (about 360$ US money),also,it's a Naturally Aspirated one. Alain From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 07:05:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA26915 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 07:05:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA26911 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 07:05:58 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp106.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.106]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA07385; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 07:10:30 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 07:03:37 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Shannen Durphey cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: <353EFCB8.7D7BB4E5@mcn.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > >Been saving 101 stuff. What's the best way to send it, and how much do you want? > > Shannen mail it as the most convenient method you like (i can accept individual copies of each mail,one mail with all messages attached to it,a tarball i.e. a .tar.gz file or a .zip file,if you want to send all file,you can but i only need those from march). thanks a lot. Alain From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 07:25:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA27068 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 07:25:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha2.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.111]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA27063 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 07:25:06 -0400 Received: from CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha1.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.1]) by CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA08991 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 12:30:11 +0100 (BST) Received: from e130-pc1.sbu.ac.uk by CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (5.65v4.0/1.1.10.5/06Nov96-0356PM) id AA17291; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 12:23:48 +0100 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980423122851.007fb100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Sender: cameroa@unix.sbu.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 12:28:51 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Gus Cameron Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980421100210.007fb100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> References: <3.0.5.32.19980419203714.0079bc60@mail.qonline.com.au> <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu At 10:02 21/04/98 +0100, you wrote: >Just to change the subject a little bit.... >Can anyone tell me how lambda/AF ratio relates to the true % oxygen? snip >TIA, >gus Hmm, well, no-one really picked this one up and ran with it. So.... I took a walk across to the library and Lo! Seek and you shall be rewarded etc. etc. If you check out http://www.bracken.co.uk/misc/ you will see a figure relating % O2, CO, H2, NOx etc to Lambda. It helps to explain why the outputs from lambda (O2) sensors are non-linear and also partially explains the differing curves that Garfield was reporting either side of equivalence. Sorry if this was common knowledge already. gus From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 07:46:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA27380 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 07:46:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA27375 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 07:46:28 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp110.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.110]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id HAA07811; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 07:50:55 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 07:44:03 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Shannen Durphey cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: OTC's ecm system tester In-Reply-To: <353EFCF2.90F8FACD@mcn.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > i'll check if it's readable by staroffice ( a Unix office suite also > > available on win95),if so,does anyone would like an html output of the > > file ??? > > Yuppers. > > Shannen i can't,i tried to open the file but the spreadsheet wouldn't let me do so,i'll see if the next version will be able to do it (i'll have to wait 'till debian 2.0 make it into the stable directory,never mind this those working with win95). Alain From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 08:51:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA28260 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 08:51:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from post.mail.demon.net (post-20.mail.demon.net [194.217.242.27]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id IAA28256 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 08:51:01 -0400 Received: from sykes.demon.co.uk ([158.152.196.243]) by post.mail.demon.net id aa2002811; 23 Apr 98 12:48 GMT Received: from RICHARD (richm [192.168.2.9]) by sykes.demon.co.uk (8.7.6/v3.2) with SMTP id NAA01945 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:13:43 +0100 Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:13:43 +0100 Message-Id: <199804231213.NAA01945@sykes.demon.co.uk> X-Sender: richm@sykes.demon.co.uk X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Light Version 1.5.2 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: DIY_EFI@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Rich Mauruschat Subject: Large size MAF sensors Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Garfield, Bosch do a hot film MAF sensor with voltage output (0280217107) which is approx. 90mm diameter and max. flow rate of 1080 kg/hour - not sure of the conversion to cfm, but it's a lot! Only oem applications I am aware of are Bentley R turbo and Mclaren F1 road car! In the UK they cost approx. 200 of our pounds. Maybe of interest?? Rich. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 09:59:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA29062 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 09:59:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA29058 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 09:59:58 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-14.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.32]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id JAA15055 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 09:59:02 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Crank sensor question... Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 10:00:00 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6ec0$1b324f20$20198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Robert Humphris Subject: Crank sensor question... >I have found an interesting little mod for my type of car ( Renault >5GTTurbo ) which is too simple for words... but I cannot work out why it works. It has been found that if you swap the wires from the crank sensor, to >the ignition module, the car pulls like a train from 3000rpm upwards. >The engines used to run out of steam at around 6000rpm, but with the wire swap, it just keeps pulling... >Anyone got any ideas why this works like this? >Rob Humphris If the pickup up in the dist uses a coil+reluctor then it generates a A/C signal. The module has a specific theshold when it triggers. The faster you spin a reluctor in a coil, the greater the voltage, and the earlier the signal. IE in a GM HEI it's a bit over 1.5degrees per 1,000 rpm. So depending on how it's wired/triggered you now have a rpm sensitive advance or retard. Hook a timing light to a plug wire, and make the switch if the timing retards, then you know it's retarding as a function of rpm. Bruce Just bought a larger Cone Shaped Hat, the Palm Impressions are still getting larger in my forehead. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 11:22:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA00944 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:22:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA00940 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:22:15 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-14.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.32]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id LAA11244 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:21:12 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: F vs Voltage MAF (GM) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:22:09 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6ecb$952e5520$20198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu While some of it's dated I can't find anything saying that GM used anything other than a Frequency MAF. If and please excuse ahead of time for the wrong EE terms, but if you measure the MAF output with a DVM, wouldn't you read a voltage (rms?)?. But, if you hook it up to a sillyscope then you would see the frequency output?. And someone correct me if I'm wrong here too, but aren't all the GM MAPs a straight Voltage output.. Flucuating but again to see clearly you would need a scope.... Both would be on a running engine to get the right pattern, cause of intake pulsations, Bruce In the spirit of spring, be sure to have a least one florial pattern Cone Shape Hat at the ready.. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 11:25:58 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA01001 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:25:58 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA00997 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:25:57 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id LAA29550; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:25:57 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA00267 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:24:47 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:24:47 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804231524.LAA00267@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980423110231.007b0af0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:02:31 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection In-Reply-To: References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >hummmmmm,5.3 volts,did you measure that in 4th gear (and if so,what's the >top end of your car ??) Probably was 4th gear. My car hits 120 MPH and dies exactly upon the speedo hitting 120. Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 11:26:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA01012 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:26:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA01004 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:26:05 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id LAA29558; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:26:02 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAB00267 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:24:50 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:24:50 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804231524.LAB00267@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980423110923.007aeac0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:09:23 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals In-Reply-To: <353ED785.F39461D1@hiwaay.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980422203431.007b4100@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Daniel, >boost, except possibly for turbos and supercharged t-birds. If your 3.8 >is the same as the one used in Tauruses (Tauri?) then _definitely_ not. The 3.8L V6 engine was used in the mid-sized cars (well, what *I* call midsized), T-birds, Cougars, and FWD Continentals. I thought the Taurus had a 3.0 supercharged engine in the SHO and a 3.3L for the naturally aspirated version. Either way, I'm unclear if this engine made it into the Taurus platform. Well, the voltage of the MAF does max out with barely any boost, so your theory might be on the money. >which replaces the ecu's internal tables, like timing advance and >injector pulse width with ones which take into account measured boost. I cannot tell you what the timing is doing... but you make a lot of sense here. Buick GN's do the same thing, retards timing when the knock sensors or pressure sensors sense potential trouble. >from the default tables under boost conditions, you will initially >experience detonation until the computer adapts. Your alternative is to ANd that would explain it "running like crap" for 60 miles when I upgraded everything - so it was in fact learning its new environment. >either use an boost sensitive fuel pressure regulator (fmu) or find out >if you can get a chip burned for your ecu. I know several sources to >ask if you're interested. In the mean time I urge you to be very >careful with your current setup. Its been good to me for 3 years... and the only time I have performance problems is when the boost exceeds 7psi, which is rare. I've hit the 120MPH speed limitation at just about 7PSI so I think I just lucked out so far. Anyway, thanks for the information... its been very educational... Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 11:26:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA01014 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:26:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA01008 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:26:06 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id LAA29560; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:26:05 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAC00267 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:24:55 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:24:55 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804231524.LAC00267@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980423111202.007af9d0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:12:02 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Crank sensor question... In-Reply-To: References: < Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >that the ECU is being 'fooled' by reversing the wires into altering the >ignition timing (advanced ??). > >Prepared to be shot down in flames big time here..................... Why Steve, I think its a damn good guess :) Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 12:53:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA02416 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 12:53:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bert.acesag.auburn.edu (bert.acesag.auburn.edu [131.204.46.47]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA02412 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 12:53:03 -0400 Received: from bert (bert [131.204.46.47]) by bert.acesag.auburn.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA07472 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:53:02 -0500 (CDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:53:01 -0500 (CDT) From: "Gregory A. Parmer" X-Sender: gparmer@bert To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Hopeful 101 background notes Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I've read pieces of this time and again but it never seems to sink in. I'm trying to collect the stuff idjuts like me should know *before* we get hair-brained ideas. Please correct where necessary for possible entry into the "101" project. BTW--This is about GM systems I. First the DIS or C3I (distributor-less) ignition systems 1) AKA "wasted spark" system since 2 plugs are fired at once -- one of them on the compression stroke and one on the exhaust stroke) 2) Plugs are connected in series. According to Chilton, "the cylinder on the exhaust stroke requires very little of the available voltage to arc, so the remaining high voltage is used by the cylinder in firing position (TDC compression)." 3) The firing of individual coils is not controlled directly by the ECM. The C3I module acts exactly like a distributor from the standpoint of the ECM. The C3I module monitors the crankshaft and camshaft sensors and communicates with the ECM primarily by the EST signal just like its distributor cousin. The EST (Electronic Spark Timing) signal controls timing advance/retard but does not control which cylinder gets a spark. That's all done within the C3I module. II. Now for EFI issues 1) Tuned Port Injection (TPI) and Multi-Port Injection (MPI) use batch firing of fuel injectors. Even though each intake manifold runner has an injector, the injectors for each cylinder bank (1,3,5,7 & 2,4,6,8) are fired together. This is opposed to Sequential Fuel Injection (SFI) which opens injectors in sequence. 2) Injectors are fired at a rate based on crankshaft revolution, as signaled by the crankshaft sensor or distributor. 3) Fuel pressure is around 10psi for TBI systems and may range from 28-50psi for port injection systems. 4) Some systems used a fixed fuel pressure while others referenced fuel pressure from manifold vacuum. -greg Are there flamesuits and CSHats that match? From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 13:25:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA02807 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:25:42 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from fxiod01.is.chrysler.com (firewall-user@fxiod01.is.chrysler.com [204.189.94.70]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id NAA02803 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:25:40 -0400 From: jb24@chrysler.com Received: by fxiod01.is.chrysler.com; id NAA09590; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:23:01 -0400 Received: from mhbclpr2-nf0.is.chrysler.com(129.9.212.187) by fxiod01.is.chrysler.com via smap (3.2) id xma009562; Thu, 23 Apr 98 13:22:57 -0400 Received: from ODEMXPR1.ODDC.CHRYSLER.COM (odemxpr1-dgen0.oddc.chrysler.com [129.9.196.20]) by mhbclpr2-nf0.is.chrysler.com (8.8.5/8.8.5/chrysler-relay.1.2-kcd) with SMTP id NAA29366 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:25:36 -0400 (EDT) Received: by ODEMXPR1.ODDC.CHRYSLER.COM (Soft-Switch LMS 2.0) with snapi via NOTES id 0041200005831034; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:24:52 -0400 To: Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Message-ID: <0041200005831034000002L042*@MHS> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:24:52 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just for giggles, anyone tell me what the definition of lambda is? I read somewhere that lambda is the excess air factor, i.e. lambda of .98 is just a tad (2%?) rich. ---------------------- Forwarded by John R Bucknell/JTE/Chrysler on 04/23/98 12:12 PM --------------------------- owner-diy_efi @ efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu 04/23/98 08:14 AM Please respond to diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu @ SMTP To: diy_efi @ efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu @ SMTP cc: Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) At 10:02 21/04/98 +0100, you wrote: >Just to change the subject a little bit.... >Can anyone tell me how lambda/AF ratio relates to the true % oxygen? snip >TIA, >gus Hmm, well, no-one really picked this one up and ran with it. So.... I took a walk across to the library and Lo! Seek and you shall be rewarded etc. etc. If you check out http://www.bracken.co.uk/misc/ you will see a figure relating % O2, CO, H2, NOx etc to Lambda. It helps to explain why the outputs from lambda (O2) sensors are non-linear and also partially explains the differing curves that Garfield was reporting either side of equivalence. Sorry if this was common knowledge already. gus From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 13:34:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA02941 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:34:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from m28.boston.juno.com (m28.boston.juno.com [205.231.101.186]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA02937 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:34:07 -0400 Received: (from cosmic.ray@juno.com) by m28.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id NMT00431; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:31:41 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Cc: Thomas Matthews Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 11:31:45 -0400 Subject: Re: Modified Fuel Injection/Projection Message-ID: <19980423.133052.10790.0.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> References: <199804230111.SAA03751@diamond.sunset.net> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-8,10-11,16-18 From: cosmic.ray@juno.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Wed, 22 Apr 1998 22:14:15 -0400 Thomas Matthews writes: >The Projection 4 is a later design type, single stage with 1:1 pri/sec >throttle, and it's fitted with IAC... >Pretty simple looking setup (famous last words), we'll see in a week >or >2 how easy it is to get working... >Tom Holley Pro-Jection is pretty well a bolt-up (and plug-in) operation. Also, the 4D system is a whole lot easier to tune than the 4Di system. I installed the 4Di system on my '89 Jeep Grand Wagoneer. I wrote up a tech article about it. While it was written with the full-size Jeep crowd in mind, it might contain some useful information. Email me off the list if you want the initial article. I can also send you all the updates that I had created and sent to the Full-Size Jeep lists. Ray Drouillard _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 13:52:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA03427 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:52:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lsi.lsil.com (lsi.lsil.com [147.145.40.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA03422 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:52:20 -0400 Received: from mhbs.lsil.com ([147.145.29.36]) by lsi.lsil.com with ESMTP id KAA09134 (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Thu, 23 Apr 1998 10:52:21 -0700 Received: from [147.145.143.10] by mhbs.lsil.com; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 10:52:18 -0700 Received: from mm104.minn by mms10 (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id MAA08320; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 12:52:14 -0500 Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 12:52:14 -0500 From: mdill@lsil.com (Mike Dillon) Message-Id: <199804231752.MAA08320@mms10> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: NA FWD 148 Bin Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just going from memory I think the format is somthing like: S1
< Data > < checksum ones compliment> 2 bytes 1 bytes X bytes 1 byte It is an ascii file so it is readable by any text editor. Mike D > From diy_efi-owner@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Wed Apr 22 19:47 CDT 1998 > From: Steven Gorkowski > X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) > > Hi Mike > If I remember I used I think s19 records years ago I may still have the > docs on its format I think you can read in a edit program and can figure > out most of the stuff you want . My eprom programmer burns s19 format or > converts to hex format can't remember . Will try to find and scan it in > and email if you want. > > Steve > > Mike Dillon wrote: > > > Is the XXXX.S16 a motarola S record format file ? what does it > > look like in a text editor ?? > > > > Mike D. > > > > > From: "Bruce Plecan" > > > > > > > > > >>Would anyone have a bin for a 86, 3.8 FWD Buick/Olds using > > > >>a 1227148 or know if it is the same code/table locations as a > > > >>GN/TType?.. > > > >Howdy. > > > >I have that exact engine, ECM and chip. Unfortunately my reader is > > dead. > > > Come up with an alternate solution (i.e. I mail the chip to you and > > you send > > > it back at some point) and you can leach the bin if you want > > >Frederic > > > Breitwieser > > > >Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > > > > > > Hope your feeling better.. > > > The above idea will work, fine > > > > > > Bruce Plecan > > > 18 E 1st St > > > Arcanum, OH 45304 > > > > > > BTW, ya know what a file extension of .S16 means?. I got some > > > bins but with that file extension, and just changing it to .bin > > doesn't > > > seem to work. > > > Cheers > > > Bruce > > > > > > > > > > > > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 15:43:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA04821 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 15:43:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from quartz.ucs.ualberta.ca (quartz.ucs.ualberta.ca [129.128.5.19]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA04815 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 15:43:11 -0400 Received: from gpu4.srv.ualberta.ca (gpu4.srv.ualberta.ca [129.128.98.18]) by quartz.ucs.ualberta.ca (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id NAA29242 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:43:11 -0600 Received: from localhost (mbeaubie@localhost) by gpu4.srv.ualberta.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id NAA64464 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:43:10 -0600 Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:43:10 -0600 (MDT) From: Matt Beaubien X-Sender: mbeaubie@gpu4.srv.ualberta.ca To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Felpro EFI q's In-Reply-To: <199804230900.FAA26062@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi all, A friend of mine is into turbo Audi's of all sorts, and he would like to know if the new Felpro EFI system can accomodate 5 cylinders. Is there a contact number at Felpro for additonal information? Also, he's looking at buying an S4 engine which does not have a distributor. What are his options as far as aftermarket systems go (aside from Electamotive...)? Apparantly, installing the stock S4 harness is _very_ involved, not to mention the performance limitations of a stock ECM. Thanks for any info. Matt Beaubien mbeaubie@gpu.srv.ualberta 3 x 510 1 x Civic 1200 1 x 300ZXT From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 16:04:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA05131 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 16:04:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from fly.HiWAAY.net (root@fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA05127 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 16:04:24 -0400 Received: from hiwaay.net (tnt1-9.HiWAAY.net [208.147.147.9]) by fly.HiWAAY.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) with ESMTP id PAA01979 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 15:04:24 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <353F9EA8.93275E6A@hiwaay.net> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 15:03:53 -0500 From: Daniel Ciobota X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980422203431.007b4100@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980423110923.007aeac0@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > Daniel, > > >boost, except possibly for turbos and supercharged t-birds. If your 3.8 > >is the same as the one used in Tauruses (Tauri?) then _definitely_ not. > > The 3.8L V6 engine was used in the mid-sized cars (well, what *I* call > midsized), T-birds, Cougars, and FWD Continentals. I thought the Taurus > had a 3.0 supercharged engine in the SHO and a 3.3L for the naturally > aspirated version. Either way, I'm unclear if this engine made it into the > Taurus platform. Sorry, Frederic, I meant the older generation taurus/sable. They came with 3.0 as standard, 3.8 optional. Believe it or not, the first couple of years they had an optional 2.3l four available; talk about slooww... BTW, you seem to have good luck with your combo, better than mine in fact. Maybe those motors have a knock sensor on them... Mine, sadly, didn't. Daniel From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 16:33:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA05737 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 16:33:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA05733 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 16:33:31 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA17688 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:33:32 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:34:14 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <35b2a249.120726218@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980419203714.0079bc60@mail.qonline.com.au> <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> <3.0.5.32.19980423122851.007fb100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980423122851.007fb100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id QAA05734 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Thu, 23 Apr 1998 12:28:51 +0100, Gus Cameron wrote: >Hmm, well, no-one really picked this one up and ran with it. So.... I took >a walk across to the library and Lo! Seek and you shall be rewarded etc. >etc. > >If you check out >http://www.bracken.co.uk/misc/ >you will see a figure relating % O2, CO, H2, NOx etc to Lambda. It helps >to explain why the outputs from lambda (O2) sensors are non-linear and also >partially explains the differing curves that Garfield was reporting either >side of equivalence. > >Sorry if this was common knowledge already. Geez, no apology needed on this end, that's stellar stuff you found there. Makes me think I might wanna get the book that chart came out of too! The Horiba box also has a calibration procedure you can follow if you have known concentration O2 (span/model/sample) gas mix (term you use apprarently depends on what industry you're working in) with a prepared concentration (4% is recommended, but you can manually calibrate the box using anything known, between 0-25%). And Gus, your conjecture on the shape of the O2 curve in that diagram explaining the diff. shape on either side of stoich for the sensor IS dead on target, cuz the shapes of them curves on either side, EXACTLY mimic what you see in the NTK published 5-wire sensor curves in their SAE articles. I'd say you've really cleared up a couple of voids in my understanding from just that one graph. Nice sluething, dude. We oughta send you out with the black bag more often. B) Gar From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 16:44:37 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA05926 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 16:44:37 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA05922 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 16:44:35 -0400 Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id QAA07583; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 16:44:35 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp142.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.142]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id QAA15179; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 16:49:04 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 16:42:21 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Frederic Breitwieser cc: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980423110923.007aeac0@xephic.dynip.com> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > The 3.8L V6 engine was used in the mid-sized cars (well, what *I* call > midsized), T-birds, Cougars, and FWD Continentals. I thought the Taurus > had a 3.0 supercharged engine in the SHO and a 3.3L for the naturally > aspirated version. Either way, I'm unclear if this engine made it into the > Taurus platform. there was a 2.5L 4 banger at it debut and an optional 3.0L 6 ('till 87 or 88 when the 2.5 was abandoned in profit of the 3.0 as standard engine) the 3.8 made it in (or about) 89,the SHO entered the game this time too and no,the SHO isn't supercharged,it make power the RPM way (it's yamaha as subcontractor for ford who make this engine) and talking about RPM,yamaha and SHO,yamaha simply put a sport bike engine of 3.0 in size in the car (the car is CAPABLE of 5 digit RPM with a set of new valvespring and a supercharger (vortech/paxton,take your pick),it has nothing to envy to a porsche 911 twin-turbo) in 3.0 liter form,upgraded valvespring,extrude honed head and a quartet of cam's,this particular car made 370 hp at the front wheel at 7500 RPM,and the car reved to 10 000 RPM on the dyno (the thing limithing power production was a restrictive intake,put on short velocity stack on this and i'm sure you can make power where NASCAR car run out of steam). Alain p.s.in the new taurus,2 motor are 3.0 (one OVH and one DOHC) and the taurus SHO have a 3.4 liter V8. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 18:07:31 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA06946 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 18:07:31 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com ([206.130.240.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA06942 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 18:07:29 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0ySUBx-000135C; Thu, 23 Apr 98 18:10 EDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: Fluid flow info To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 18:10:05 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: from "Alain Toussaint" at Apr 23, 98 04:42:21 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I found a fluid flow simulator that can be downloaded for free www.fluid.mech.ntua.gr/selavi looks pretty good only comes in win16 amd win95 versions (NT coming soon) Clive From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 18:46:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA07507 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 18:46:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from wolfenet.com (root@frapp.wolfe.net [207.178.61.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA07503 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 18:46:32 -0400 Received: from gonzo.wolfenet.com (orin@gonzo.wolfenet.com [204.157.98.2]) by wolfenet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id PAA05879 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 15:46:32 -0700 (PDT) From: Orin Eman Received: (from orin@localhost) by gonzo.wolfenet.com (8.8.3/8.7) id PAA28469 for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 15:46:31 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804232246.PAA28469@gonzo.wolfenet.com> Subject: Re: Felpro EFI q's To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 15:46:31 -0700 (PDT) In-Reply-To: from "Matt Beaubien" at Apr 23, 98 01:43:10 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > A friend of mine is into turbo Audi's of all sorts, and he would like to > know if the new Felpro EFI system can accomodate 5 cylinders. Is there a > contact number at Felpro for additonal information? For what particular car? Is he intending to replace a CIS system? > Also, he's looking at buying an S4 engine which does not have a distributor. > What are his options as far as aftermarket systems go (aside from > Electamotive...)? Apparantly, installing the stock S4 harness is _very_ > involved, not to mention the performance limitations of a stock ECM. I think he should talk to Ned Ritchie at Intended Acceleration about such 'limitations' (360) 754 1411. In general, there is no need to replace the Audi ignition system... and it is more likely to be detrimental than to help. Orin. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 19:45:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA08210 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:45:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from webserver (brpt01-sh5-port36.snet.net [204.60.24.36]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA08206 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:44:58 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA00271; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:43:49 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:43:49 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804232343.TAA00271@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980423193146.007aab60@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:31:46 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals In-Reply-To: <353F9EA8.93275E6A@hiwaay.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980422203431.007b4100@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980423110923.007aeac0@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Sorry, Frederic, I meant the older generation taurus/sable. They came with 3.0 >as standard, 3.8 optional. Believe it or not, the first couple of years they >had an optional 2.3l four available; talk about slooww... Aaaaah. Okay, iI'm not confused anymore :) Yes, I remember the 4-banger... my parents bought a Sable wagon with that engine. Definately slow. my girlfriend has the 2.3 in her tempo, and its slow. Though the car shifts late going up and quick going down, so what it lacks in power, is somewhat balanced by smart shifting. >BTW, you seem to have good luck with your combo, better than mine in fact. >Maybe those motors have a knock sensor on them... Mine, sadly, didn't. Could have a sensor, though I haven't found a Haynes or Chiltons for this car specifically. Eventually I will. Not sure where the knock sensor would be. Just for giggles, I unplugged the MAF before I drove home from the train station, and it didn't do anything negative or positive. So, maybe the ECM is ignoring it entirely at this point? Thanks, Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 21:01:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA08931 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:01:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from snowcrest.net (mtshasta.snowcrest.net [207.201.33.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA08925 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:00:58 -0400 Received: from default (ttyD67.redding.snowcrest.net [209.148.36.168]) by snowcrest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA17858 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 18:00:54 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804240100.SAA17858@snowcrest.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: "Do-it-Yourself Fuel Injection" Subject: New address Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 18:07:49 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Incase anyone has tried to send me email... I have a new address... : djewett@snowcrest.net Thanks From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 21:33:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA09182 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:33:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA09177 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:33:19 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-11.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.80]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id VAA03178 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:32:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Fluid flow info Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:33:22 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6f20$f7ea3580$50198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Fluid flow info >I found a fluid flow simulator that can be downloaded for free >www.fluid.mech.ntua.gr/selavi >looks pretty good >only comes in win16 amd win95 versions (NT coming soon) >Clive > Ya, and the port fuel injection video is neat also.. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 21:51:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA09457 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:51:05 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA09452 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:51:02 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp17.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.38]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA20042 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:55:41 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:48:41 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: DIY list Subject: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu having received a call from my cousin who found a good car for sale (i'm in search of one) not too expensive (i plan to take some holiday time in vancouver in july),he found a old's ciera 83 having'bout 225 000 KM ( 140 000 milles,yes the car has lot o'milleage but then,i've got not much money to spend on it,but at last,i'm not going to vancouver with him),but now,i have a problem arging with mom's chum,he states that the car fuel milleage is very low (in the V8 teritory) and the engine is a lot less reliable than his 4 banger ( cavalier and sunbird 2.0L ),i want to set the record straight,does the cavalier 4 banger is more reliable than the oldsmobile 2.8 V6 ????? thanks a lot. Alain From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 22:05:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA09735 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:05:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from vcc11.vcc.bc.ca (vcc11.vcc.bc.ca [207.102.127.11]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA09729 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:05:41 -0400 Received: (from jimd@localhost) by vcc11.vcc.bc.ca (AIX4.2/UCB 8.7/8.7) id TAA35934; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:05:41 -0700 (PDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:05:41 -0700 (PDT) From: Jim Davies To: DIY list Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Thu, 23 Apr 1998, Alain Toussaint wrote: > than his 4 banger ( cavalier and sunbird 2.0L ),i want to set the record > straight,does the cavalier 4 banger is more reliable than the oldsmobile > 2.8 V6 ????? > In general, the 4 banger is more reliable than the Chevy "high maintenance" 2.8 V6. YMMV, of course. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 22:29:49 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA10228 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:29:49 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (pop3.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA10224 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:29:45 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-d54.foothill.net [209.76.43.54]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA28311 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:30:23 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:28:30 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6f28$ab8161c0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu You're opening a can of worms here. The Iron Duke (called a Tech 4 after awhile) had it's moments just like the 2.8L V6 (which wasn't available in the Ciera in 1983. Not until 1985. The Olds V6 is the Buick V6 3.0L.) I am most familiar with the 2.8L. In terms of out-and-out failures, the 2.8L V6 had some problems with the #4 rod but mostly in the HO version (Z code engine). This was solved by going to a better oil pump. In terms of things that go wrong, the intake gaskets would leak coolant in the valley if they were not installed correctly or the RTV at the ends of the intake would leak oil to the outside. The distributor O-ring would leak oil if the dist was turned after a year or so. The HO engine is a different beast from the 115HP stock engines. I've seen more Iron Dukes with rods out the side of the block than dead 2.8L. By 1983, both had received some changes that made them both "reasonable". However, I have put 280,000 miles+ on two 2.8L V6's. I let one break the timing chain intentionally. It basically stopped and bent two valves. The other got rebuilt because I wanted to do it. Now if you've confused the 3.0L Buick that came with the Ciera with the 2.8L Chevy, the 3.0L had it's problems. Probably the biggest is cracked blocks (in the valley) if they were overheated. They were EXTREMELY unforgiving to this problem. Second, any loss of oil pressure destroyed the main bearings. 30PSI at idle one moment, 5PSI the next. But other than that, they were and still are pretty tough motors. All three, if not abused, not overheated (the 2.8L can handle some pretty brutal overheating), the oil changed, and maintained were reasonably good by 1983. Regarding gas mileage, the 2.5L in a Ciera could hit about 28MPG. The 3.0L about 26MPH, and the 2.8L about 25-27 MPG. I've owned both V6's and have rebuild several. With that many miles, hope for the best, but expect the worst. TK -----Original Message----- From: Alain Toussaint To: DIY list Date: Thursday, April 23, 1998 7:14 PM Subject: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? >having received a call from my cousin who found a good car for sale (i'm >in search of one) not too expensive (i plan to take some holiday time in >vancouver in july),he found a old's ciera 83 having'bout 225 000 KM ( 140 >000 milles,yes the car has lot o'milleage but then,i've got not much money >to spend on it,but at last,i'm not going to vancouver with him),but now,i >have a problem arging with mom's chum,he states that the car fuel milleage >is very low (in the V8 teritory) and the engine is a lot less reliable >than his 4 banger ( cavalier and sunbird 2.0L ),i want to set the record >straight,does the cavalier 4 banger is more reliable than the oldsmobile >2.8 V6 ????? > >thanks a lot. >Alain > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 22:32:10 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA10290 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:32:10 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com ([206.130.240.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA10286 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:32:08 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0ySYK5-00013SC; Thu, 23 Apr 98 22:34 EDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:34:44 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: from "Alain Toussaint" at Apr 23, 98 09:48:41 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > having received a call from my cousin who found a good car for sale (i'm > in search of one) not too expensive (i plan to take some holiday time in > vancouver in july),he found a old's ciera 83 having'bout 225 000 KM ( 140 > 000 milles,yes the car has lot o'milleage but then,i've got not much money > to spend on it,but at last,i'm not going to vancouver with him),but now,i > have a problem arging with mom's chum,he states that the car fuel milleage > is very low (in the V8 teritory) and the engine is a lot less reliable > than his 4 banger ( cavalier and sunbird 2.0L ),i want to set the record > straight,does the cavalier 4 banger is more reliable than the oldsmobile > 2.8 V6 ????? the 2.8 was somewhat of a dog it is probably almost ready for at least a valve job Clive From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 22:34:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA10345 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:34:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (pop3.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA10339 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:34:06 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-d54.foothill.net [209.76.43.54]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA28635 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:34:27 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 19:32:34 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6f29$3d0f5840$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Check out http://www.foothill.net/~terryk/X11Z19.HTM for info on the Chevy 2.8L V6. -----Original Message----- From: Jim Davies To: DIY list Date: Thursday, April 23, 1998 7:27 PM Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? > > >On Thu, 23 Apr 1998, Alain Toussaint wrote: > >> than his 4 banger ( cavalier and sunbird 2.0L ),i want to set the record >> straight,does the cavalier 4 banger is more reliable than the oldsmobile >> 2.8 V6 ????? >> >In general, the 4 banger is more reliable than the Chevy "high >maintenance" 2.8 V6. YMMV, of course. > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 22:35:56 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA10416 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:35:56 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA10412 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:35:55 -0400 Received: from snyder.huron.net (slip129-37-161-68.on.ca.ibm.net [129.37.161.68]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id VAA05997 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:32:43 -0400 Message-ID: <353FFBC7.669@huron.net> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:41:11 -0400 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Alain Toussaint wrote: > > having received a call from my cousin who found a good car for sale (i'm > in search of one) not too expensive (i plan to take some holiday time in > vancouver in july),he found a old's ciera 83 having'bout 225 000 KM ( 140 > 000 milles,yes the car has lot o'milleage but then,i've got not much money > to spend on it,but at last,i'm not going to vancouver with him),but now,i > have a problem arging with mom's chum,he states that the car fuel milleage > is very low (in the V8 teritory) and the engine is a lot less reliable > than his 4 banger ( cavalier and sunbird 2.0L ),i want to set the record > straight,does the cavalier 4 banger is more reliable than the oldsmobile > 2.8 V6 ????? > > thanks a lot. > Alain The 2.8 tends to be a troublesome engine, but most of the troublemakers don't make it 225,000. The mileage is not much worse than the 4, if you drive the 4 as fast as you do the 6, because the 4 is working it's tail off. If you take it easy, of course the 4 can do a bit better. There are several 4s, too. The 2 litre is in the same league as the 2.8 as far as maintenance is concerned. The old "iron duke" 2.5, like the small block 8, just goes and goes. Sometimes you wonder how, for as noisy and rough as they can get, and still run. This is the same engine used by Mercury Marine for the 115 inboard (basically the same as a 63/64 Nova/chevyII). -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 22:45:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA10572 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:45:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA10568 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:45:24 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id WAA16696; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:45:23 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAB00093 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:44:17 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:44:17 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804240244.WAB00093@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980423224420.007a4600@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:44:20 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >than his 4 banger ( cavalier and sunbird 2.0L ),i want to set the record >straight,does the cavalier 4 banger is more reliable than the oldsmobile >2.8 V6 ????? I'll be honest with you Alain, both engines are "okay". A 4 cyl in a cavalier is not too unreasonable because the car is small and light compared to the Cierra. A six in the Cierra is almost a must, and 2.8L is kinda small. I still don't understand why GM put a small engine into the Cierra. Both engines are good in their own right, but the Cierra was a tad underpowered with the 2.8L In my opinion. The 4 cyl was more reliable however from a maintanence point of view... GM had a lot of problems with certain years of the 2.8L, mostly relating to the electronics from anything I've read. Anyhoo... What makes a big difference is how the driver treated it. Did he/she stomp on the gas constantly from standstill? Was the oil changed regularly? Was the transmission fluid checked and changed every 50-60K? If the V6 has 140K miles on it, more than likely, the car was taken care of at least to some extent, or it would have been dead about 80K before you found it. Is it the original engine? If so, care was taken in the maintanence department. Before you buy it, buy yourself a cheap compression test guage from the auto store, remove the ignition coil wire, and do a compression test. If the compression is a tad low, which it might be because of the miles, make sure all the cylinders are close to each other in readings. If one or two cylinders are way off, then you have a bad valve, a head gasket that's gone or going, or a ring is broke. I'd also loosen the oil plug, and drop about a shots glass worth of oil, look for crud in it. Jack each front lower suspension member up one at a time, so the tire is about an inch off the ground. Try to move the tire forward and back, and up and down. This will give a clue as to the condition of the lower ball joints as well as the tie rod. Put the car back down, and pull on the front-wheel-drive axles. They shouldn't slip hardly at all. Tie rod ends and ball joints are not too expensive (in the 15-20 buck range each), but they can be a pain in the ass to replace. Personally, I'd rather have a running engine with a bad tie rod (or ball joint) than the reverse... Your investment would only be the $15-20 US compression guage, and borrowing a jack, and a little strength on your part to see if this cheap car is cheap because they want to unload it, or cheap because they can't unload it. If you need more advice, write to me directly, I'd be happy to suggest other stuff you can do yourself. After buying my first car back in 1983 I learned the hard way, NEVER buy ANY car without a compression gauge (out of eight cylinders I had three that actually made ANY compession. A compression test and offer you so much information, and save you lots of money by not buying a "good deal" with a blown head gasket. Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 22:50:46 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA10685 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:50:46 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo28.mx.aol.com (imo28.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.72]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA10681 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:50:46 -0400 Received: from MPoore10@aol.com by imo28.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8YEHa27907 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:50:14 +2000 (EDT) From: MPoore10 Message-ID: <73962140.353ffde7@aol.com> Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 22:50:14 EDT To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Questions from a beginner Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 64 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have read the archives and have learned quite a bit from all of your posts. My area of specialty is in the engine mechanicals and performance minded engine building. As far as the latter goes, I have discovered that I can't get the most from an engine by ignoring the ecm/eprom or relying on someone in another state to send me a generic performance eprom. To that end, I am really interested in getting into the programming aspects of the eprom. Specifically, I would like to be able to create my own eproms. I have read about MasterTune software. Is this my best bet? If you have experience with that software could you please relate your experience with it and how useful it would be? I really don't have a great deal of time or interest to do my own code breaking. And I don't want to repeat work that has already been done. Or is there other software that would work better for me? Ideally, I would like something that I could download the OEM eprom data, emulate the eprom with my PC while I tweak it, and then burn a new eprom after optimizing the data for the application. Is such a setup available as a package? Or, would I have to build it myself? After reading the archives, I assume that manufacturers don't release information on their eproms as to what it contains and where it is on the chip. So, is it every man for himself on code breaking or is there a place to go and get this infromation? Please e-mail me direct with your comments. Thanks in advance for any insight you can provide. Mike From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 23:26:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA11369 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 23:26:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from m28.boston.juno.com (m28.boston.juno.com [205.231.101.186]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA11365 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 23:26:13 -0400 Received: (from cosmic.ray@juno.com) by m28.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id XcD00431; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 23:21:13 EDT To: Tmatthe1@worldnet.att.net Cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 23:13:23 -0400 Subject: Re: Holley Projection article Message-ID: <19980423.232032.16390.2.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> References: <353F7E1C.CC31D61B@worldnet.att.net> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 0,2-6,9-26,28-31,34-42 From: cosmic.ray@juno.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Thu, 23 Apr 1998 13:45:00 -0400 Thomas Matthews writes: >Yes, I'd like a copy... I'm also interested to know how much pressure >the Holley injectors can take before they lock up, or any other >detrimental effects take place... I have no clue how much pressure they'll take. They have built-in pressure regulaters, though. The instructions say to use a 3/8" return line (I think). >Also, is there a way to find the stock rating of the injectors by part >numbers, and do they interchange with GM TB injectors? P/N CFM # Inj LB/Hr rating 501-1 300 1 90 (Ford & GM step van) 501-2 300 1 90 (Jeep 255 I6) 502-1 670 2 80 (analog, spread bore) 502-2 670 2 80 (analog, square bore) 504-1 900 4 80 (analog, 4bbl) 504-2 700 4 65 (analog, 4bbl) 504-11 900 4 80 (Pro-Jection 4D) 504-12 700 4 60 (Pro-Jection 4D) 504-13 650 4 45 (Pro-Jection 4D) 504-21 900 4 80 (Pro-Jection 4Di) 504-22 700 4 60 (Pro-Jection 4Di) 504-23 650 4 45 (Pro-Jection 4Di) 502-2211 n/a 4 90 (Chevy Big Block Tunnel Ram (two throttle bodies)) >How are they held in place if I was to change them? They're held in place (above the throttle body) with a couple of screws. I never had any reason to remove them, but they're supposed to be really easy to remove. >TIA, >Tom > BTW, check out www.holley.com Ray Drouillard _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 23 23:48:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA11676 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 23:48:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA11670 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 23:48:27 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp135.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.135]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA21670; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 23:52:47 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 23:45:49 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: TBK cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? In-Reply-To: <01bd6f28$ab8161c0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > The Iron Duke (called a Tech 4 after awhile) had it's moments just like the > 2.8L V6 (which wasn't available in the Ciera in 1983. Not until 1985. The > Olds V6 is the Buick V6 3.0L.) i remind that whe (mom's and dad) got a ciera 85 a while ago (thinks it's 2 or 3 years ago),and whe got a lot of milleage out of it (not MPG,i dont care much for it as long as it's not less than 15 MPG),the car died at about 215 000 KM ( eh......13X 000 milles...it's a guess only,i dont have my calculator near me),the car died because of a melted catalytic converter and part of the unburned exhaust made it way into the intake manifold plugging thing there (and talk about no power then,my mother had to do WOT on the highway for maintaining the pace and not be too far behind trafic flow,it's just whe where having no clue at what's going on then) > I've seen more Iron Dukes with rods out the side of the block than dead > 2.8L. By 1983, both had received some changes that made them both > "reasonable". However, I have put 280,000 miles+ on two 2.8L V6's. I let one > break the timing chain intentionally. It basically stopped and bent two > valves. The other got rebuilt because I wanted to do it. not bad,280 000 milles !!!!! (i'm stunned) > Now if you've confused the 3.0L Buick that came with the Ciera with the 2.8L > Chevy, the 3.0L had it's problems. Probably the biggest is cracked blocks > (in the valley) if they were overheated. They were EXTREMELY unforgiving to > this problem. Second, any loss of oil pressure destroyed the main bearings. > 30PSI at idle one moment, 5PSI the next. But other than that, they were and > still are pretty tough motors. does these motor share part with the 3.8 motor ?? > All three, if not abused, not overheated (the 2.8L can handle some pretty > brutal overheating), the oil changed, and maintained were reasonably good by > 1983. > > Regarding gas mileage, the 2.5L in a Ciera could hit about 28MPG. The 3.0L > about 26MPH, and the 2.8L about 25-27 MPG. nice milleage,do you think i'll be able to do at least 20 when doing about 75 to 80 MPH on the highway ?? > I've owned both V6's and have rebuild several. > > With that many miles, hope for the best, but expect the worst. i'll be able to see that tomorow,also,thanks for the web site. p.s.is the stock suspension be able to cope with 80 MPH on the highway (read,if the suspension is in relatively good shape). thanks a lot. Alain From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 00:44:10 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12257 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 00:44:10 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (pop3.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA12253 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 00:44:05 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe2-d91.foothill.net [209.76.43.91]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA12389 for ; Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:44:47 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? Date: Thu, 23 Apr 1998 21:42:51 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd6f3b$70395100$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Alain Toussaint To: TBK Cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 23, 1998 9:19 PM Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? >> The Iron Duke (called a Tech 4 after awhile) had it's moments just like the >> 2.8L V6 (which wasn't available in the Ciera in 1983. Not until 1985. The >> Olds V6 is the Buick V6 3.0L.) > >i remind that whe (mom's and dad) got a ciera 85 a while ago (thinks it's >2 or 3 years ago),and whe got a lot of milleage out of it (not MPG,i dont >care much for it as long as it's not less than 15 MPG),the car died at >about 215 000 KM ( eh......13X 000 milles...it's a guess only,i dont have >my calculator near me),the car died because of a melted catalytic >converter and part of the unburned exhaust made it way into the intake >manifold plugging thing there (and talk about no power then,my mother had >to do WOT on the highway for maintaining the pace and not be too far >behind trafic flow,it's just whe where having no clue at what's going on >then) > Cat's can be like that! >> I've seen more Iron Dukes with rods out the side of the block than dead >> 2.8L. By 1983, both had received some changes that made them both >> "reasonable". However, I have put 280,000 miles+ on two 2.8L V6's. I let one >> break the timing chain intentionally. It basically stopped and bent two >> valves. The other got rebuilt because I wanted to do it. > >not bad,280 000 milles !!!!! (i'm stunned) > I've had others say that, but synth oil and regular changes. And yes, they were abused (X-11) >> Now if you've confused the 3.0L Buick that came with the Ciera with the 2.8L >> Chevy, the 3.0L had it's problems. Probably the biggest is cracked blocks >> (in the valley) if they were overheated. They were EXTREMELY unforgiving to >> this problem. Second, any loss of oil pressure destroyed the main bearings. >> 30PSI at idle one moment, 5PSI the next. But other than that, they were and >> still are pretty tough motors. > >does these motor share part with the 3.8 motor ?? > yep, same block in that era. Different crank and pistons though. PFI on the 3.8L. 130HP vs 110HP for the 3.0L. >> All three, if not abused, not overheated (the 2.8L can handle some pretty >> brutal overheating), the oil changed, and maintained were reasonably good by >> 1983. >> >> Regarding gas mileage, the 2.5L in a Ciera could hit about 28MPG. The 3.0L >> about 26MPH, and the 2.8L about 25-27 MPG. > >nice milleage,do you think i'll be able to do at least 20 when doing about >75 to 80 MPH on the highway ?? > Yes. If the engine is running good. 80 MPH is pushing it, probably. >> I've owned both V6's and have rebuild several. >> >> With that many miles, hope for the best, but expect the worst. > >i'll be able to see that tomorow,also,thanks for the web site. > >p.s.is the stock suspension be able to cope with 80 MPH on the highway >(read,if the suspension is in relatively good shape). > Sure, just don't turn. >thanks a lot. >Alain > > > I had a 1984 Olds Ciera ES with a 3.0L V6 and 2.53 gears. 105MPH wide open at 3500 RPM. Got about 22 MPG at that speed. F41 suspension. Handled pretty dang good for the most part. Could easily out run a Festiva. Not much else. From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 00:54:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA12424 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 00:54:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lnagate.foxboro.com.au (lnagate.foxboro.com.au [202.12.113.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA12416 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 00:54:21 -0400 X-Received: (qmail 8462 invoked from network); 24 Apr 1998 04:53:57 -0000 Received: from foxlnqtc.foxboro.com.au (HELO foxboro.com.au) (202.12.112.10) by gatekeeper.foxln.com.au with SMTP; 24 Apr 1998 04:53:57 -0000 Received: from wayneb-nt (fwserver [202.12.112.56]) by foxboro.com.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id OAA04271 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:53:55 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <3.0.1.32.19980424145352.0092b4f0@qtc-mail> X-Sender: wayneb@qtc-mail X-Mailer: Windows Eudora Pro Version 3.0.1 (32) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:53:52 +1000 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Wayne Blair Subject: Delco ECU Code Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Can any one say : Wheather the binary code in most Delco Ecu produced from Assembler or from a Higher language "C" maybe. And if you know that which assembler / compiler is it. thanks wayne From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 01:29:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA12888 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 01:29:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA12884 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 01:29:53 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp135.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.135]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA22788 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 01:34:31 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 01:27:35 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: DIY list Subject: good address for those who need to rebuild inter. 7.3 diesel Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu i found a good address for those who need a rebuid on 6.9 and 7.3 international navistar engine (found on inter. truck and on ford truck) take a look here: http://www.warrenengines.com/home.htm i found it to be a recommendable address !! Alain From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 01:39:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA13046 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 01:39:42 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA13042 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 01:39:40 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp135.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.135]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id BAA22903; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 01:44:11 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 01:37:13 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: TBK cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? In-Reply-To: <01bd6f3b$70395100$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > I've had others say that, but synth oil and regular changes. And yes, they > were abused (X-11) a car made to be abused in fact (i did read the entire page,36 pages in fact). > yep, same block in that era. Different crank and pistons though. PFI on the > 3.8L. 130HP vs 110HP for the 3.0L. i'll know witch motor to put in if the 3.0 fail. > >p.s.is the stock suspension be able to cope with 80 MPH on the highway > >(read,if the suspension is in relatively good shape). > > > Sure, just don't turn. and about changing lane (sometime,whe have to change lane fast) or i'm better putting an upgraded suspension (something between the stock one and an X11 suspension) ?? > I had a 1984 Olds Ciera ES with a 3.0L V6 and 2.53 gears. 105MPH wide open > at 3500 RPM. Got about 22 MPG at that speed. F41 suspension. Handled pretty > dang good for the most part. Could easily out run a Festiva. Not much else. 22 MPG ???? at 105 MPH,whe did worse one time with a taurus 3 liter (MPFI) going about 95 MPH (from sherbrooke to magog,about 15 to 20 minutes at that speed if my memory is exact). From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 02:25:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA13788 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 02:25:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from quartz.ucs.ualberta.ca (quartz.ucs.ualberta.ca [129.128.5.19]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA13783 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 02:25:40 -0400 Received: from gpu1.srv.ualberta.ca (gpu1.srv.ualberta.ca [129.128.98.10]) by quartz.ucs.ualberta.ca (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id AAA32602 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 00:25:40 -0600 Received: from localhost (mbeaubie@localhost) by gpu1.srv.ualberta.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id AAA48486 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 00:25:39 -0600 Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 00:25:38 -0600 (MDT) From: Matt Beaubien X-Sender: mbeaubie@gpu1.srv.ualberta.ca To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Felpro EFI q's Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Orin, > > A friend of mine is into turbo Audi's of all sorts, and he would like to > > know if the new Felpro EFI system can accomodate 5 cylinders. Is there a > > contact number at Felpro for additonal information? > > For what particular car? Is he intending to replace a CIS system? He got a 5 cylinder from a Vanagon and was planning on putting on a 4 valve head, although he may have abandoned that idea in favour of a 2 valver. It has a Garrett T3/T4 turbo and a large intercooler. It's going into a coupe quattro FWIW. > > > Also, he's looking at buying an S4 engine which does not have a distributor. > > What are his options as far as aftermarket systems go (aside from > > Electamotive...)? Apparantly, installing the stock S4 harness is _very_ > > involved, not to mention the performance limitations of a stock ECM. > > I think he should talk to Ned Ritchie at Intended Acceleration about > such 'limitations' (360) 754 1411. In general, there is no need > to replace the Audi ignition system... and it is more likely to be > detrimental than to help. Maybe you misunderstood me. He's looking at buying and engine without the wiring harness and ECM. He is looking at using an aftermarket ECM. Because the engine has no distributor in stock form, he needs a unit capable of distributorless ignition. This is a separate project from the one listed above. What sort of involvement do you have with Audi's? If I remember right, you are making a data logger, correct? TTYL, Matt Beaubien mbeaubie@gpu.srv.ualberta.ca From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 02:36:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA13955 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 02:36:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA13951 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 02:36:02 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm302-077.mcn.net [208.26.146.77]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA18444 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 00:35:57 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <35402FC9.3588D4E3@mcn.net> Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 00:23:05 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980422203431.007b4100@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980423110923.007aeac0@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > Daniel, > > >boost, except possibly for turbos and supercharged t-birds. If your 3.8 > >is the same as the one used in Tauruses (Tauri?) then _definitely_ not. > > The 3.8L V6 engine was used in the mid-sized cars (well, what *I* call > midsized), T-birds, Cougars, and FWD Continentals. I thought the Taurus > had a 3.0 supercharged engine in the SHO and a 3.3L for the naturally > aspirated version. Either way, I'm unclear if this engine made it into the > Taurus platform. Just finished head gaskets in 88 Taurus w/3.8l. Not fun. Very very not fun. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 03:20:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA14508 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 03:20:25 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.arlec.com.au (mail.arlec.com.au [203.36.152.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA14504 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 03:20:21 -0400 Received: by mail.arlec.com.au from localhost (router,SLMail V2.6); Fri, 24 Apr 1998 18:14:37 +1000 Received: by mail.arlec.com.au from default (192.1.8.200::mail daemon; unverified,SLMail V2.6); Fri, 24 Apr 1998 18:14:36 +1000 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 17:14:41 +0800 Message-ID: <01BD6FA4.77DAF580.dzorde@soanar.com.au> From: Dan Zorde To: "'diy efi'" Subject: New email address Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 17:14:38 +0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 Encoding: 9 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello everyone, Have a new email address through work (finally). Using Microsoft Outlook, so if any of my settings seem wrong please tell me as I'm not sure if I have it set correctly. But if anyone receive weird attachments, etc. let me know so I can fix it. I'm currently using UUENCODE and RTF is turned off. Dan dzorde@soanar.com.au (formerly dzorde@geocities.com.au) From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 03:55:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA15051 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 03:55:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com ([206.130.240.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id DAA15047 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 03:55:43 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0ySdN7-00013WC; Fri, 24 Apr 98 03:58 EDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 03:58:12 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: <35402FC9.3588D4E3@mcn.net> from "Shannen Durphey" at Apr 24, 98 00:23:05 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > > >boost, except possibly for turbos and supercharged t-birds. If your 3.8 > > >is the same as the one used in Tauruses (Tauri?) then _definitely_ not. > > > > The 3.8L V6 engine was used in the mid-sized cars (well, what *I* call > > midsized), T-birds, Cougars, and FWD Continentals. I thought the Taurus > > had a 3.0 supercharged engine in the SHO and a 3.3L for the naturally > > aspirated version. Either way, I'm unclear if this engine made it into the > > Taurus platform. sho had 3.0 l in standard 3.2 l in auto car in later years last eyar 3.4l v8 all Yamaha bullet proof high RPM 3.0 was tested at 12000 rpm for 6 hours at Ford dyno room (video is available for this one) dissassembled and showed no wear this thing could be tuned to make 500 HP easy at that RPM range would make a great sleeper transplant for a small car (ok, everybody sing 1, 2, 3 Fesss-Teeee-Vaaaa) the 3.8 is a 302 with 2 cyl chopped off first appeared around 82 rear drive decent power but got about the same milage as a 302 2.3l was a carry over from Pinto days reliable but slow > Just finished head gaskets in 88 Taurus w/3.8l. Not fun. > Very very not fun. would rather poke out my eyes with a stick Clive From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 04:40:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA15453 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 04:40:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from crianlarich.indigo-avs.com (crianlarich.indigo-avs.com [194.200.210.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA15449 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 04:40:25 -0400 Received: by crianlarich.indigo-avs.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BD6F64.A2215C70@crianlarich.indigo-avs.com>; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:37:44 +0100 Message-ID: From: Robert Humphris To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Crank sensor question... Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:37:41 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 Encoding: 36 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sounds sensible to me... now what happens if I reverse the polarity of my CSH?? >---------- >From: Bruce Plecan[SMTP:nacelp@bright.net] >Sent: 23 April 1998 15:00 >To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Subject: Re: Crank sensor question... > >-----Original Message----- >From: Robert Humphris >Subject: Crank sensor question... >>I have found an interesting little mod for my type of car ( Renault >>5GTTurbo ) which is too simple for words... but I cannot work out why it >works. > It has been found that if you swap the wires from the crank sensor, to >>the ignition module, the car pulls like a train from 3000rpm upwards. >>The engines used to run out of steam at around 6000rpm, but with the wire >swap, it just keeps pulling... >>Anyone got any ideas why this works like this? >>Rob Humphris > >If the pickup up in the dist uses a coil+reluctor then it generates a >A/C signal. The module has a specific theshold when it triggers. >The faster you spin a reluctor in a coil, the greater the voltage, and >the earlier the signal. IE in a GM HEI it's a bit over 1.5degrees per >1,000 rpm. So depending on how it's wired/triggered you now >have a rpm sensitive advance or retard. Hook a timing light to >a plug wire, and make the switch if the timing retards, then you >know it's retarding as a function of rpm. >Bruce Just bought a larger Cone Shaped Hat, the Palm > Impressions are still getting larger in my forehead. > > > > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 05:19:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA15858 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 05:19:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA15854 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 05:19:30 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp135.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.135]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id FAA25210; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 05:23:56 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 05:16:44 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020 cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > all Yamaha bullet proof high RPM > 3.0 was tested at 12000 rpm for 6 hours at Ford dyno room > (video is available for this one) > dissassembled and showed no wear > this thing could be tuned to make 500 HP easy at that RPM range > would make a great sleeper transplant for a small car > (ok, everybody sing 1, 2, 3 Fesss-Teeee-Vaaaa) where to get this video ??????????????????????????????? i want to show it to my cousin,i guess that will be an understatement that he'll be stunned !!!! Alain From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 05:35:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA16029 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 05:35:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha2.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.111]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA16024 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 05:35:24 -0400 Received: from CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha1.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.1]) by CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA29268 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:40:37 +0100 (BST) Received: from e130-pc1.sbu.ac.uk by CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (5.65v4.0/1.1.10.5/06Nov96-0356PM) id AA29925; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:34:22 +0100 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980424103925.007fe180@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Sender: cameroa@unix.sbu.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:39:25 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Gus Cameron Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: <35b2a249.120726218@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980423122851.007fb100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> <3.0.5.32.19980419203714.0079bc60@mail.qonline.com.au> <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> <3.0.5.32.19980423122851.007fb100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu At 13:34 23/04/98 -0700, you wrote: >On Thu, 23 Apr 1998 12:28:51 +0100, Gus Cameron >wrote: > >>Hmm, well, no-one really picked this one up and ran with it. So.... I took >>a walk across to the library and Lo! Seek and you shall be rewarded etc. >>etc. >> >>If you check out >>http://www.bracken.co.uk/misc/ >>you will see a figure relating % O2, CO, H2, NOx etc to Lambda. It helps >>to explain why the outputs from lambda (O2) sensors are non-linear and also >>partially explains the differing curves that Garfield was reporting either >>side of equivalence. >> >>Sorry if this was common knowledge already. > >Geez, no apology needed on this end, that's stellar stuff you found >there. Makes me think I might wanna get the book that chart came out of >too! The Horiba box also has a calibration procedure you can follow if >you have known concentration O2 (span/model/sample) gas mix (term you >use apprarently depends on what industry you're working in) with a >prepared concentration (4% is recommended, but you can manually >calibrate the box using anything known, between 0-25%). > >And Gus, your conjecture on the shape of the O2 curve in that diagram >explaining the diff. shape on either side of stoich for the sensor IS >dead on target, cuz the shapes of them curves on either side, EXACTLY >mimic what you see in the NTK published 5-wire sensor curves in their >SAE articles. I'd say you've really cleared up a couple of voids in my >understanding from just that one graph. Nice sluething, dude. We oughta >send you out with the black bag more often. B) > >Gar > and John R Bucknell wrote: >Just for giggles, anyone tell me what the definition of lambda is? I >read somewhere that lambda is the excess air factor, i.e. lambda of .98 >is just a tad (2%?) rich. John, you actually hit the nail dead centre, except 0.98 is weak, not rich. Lambda is derived from the stoichoimetric air:fuel ratio. This means that you have just enough air to burn all the fuel, with no air left over. i.e. the fuel and air combine to form CO2 and H2O. But the amount of air required to do this depends on the fuel you are burning. I can give you the stoichoimetric equation for glucose no probs: C6H12O6 (glucose) + 6H2O ----> 6CO2 + 6H2O. i.e. for every one molecule of glucose you need six molecules of oxygen and you get 6 molecules each of carbon dioxide and water produced. Now, the same principle applies to petrol, for every one molecule of petrol you need a certain number of molecules of oxygen to burn it completely. Air is always taken to contain 20.95% oxygen in case you were wondering, but you must take the air pressure into account if you are to correctly calculate the number of oxygen molecules per cubic meter. Unfortunately petrol (gas?) contains a real complex mix of different type of hydrocarbon molecules, and not all petrols are the same, so the actual stoichometric values are harder to calculate and differ from one another anyway, but are normally in the range 14:1 ---> 15:1, with 14.7:1 most often being quoted. These values are based on mass (weight) of air and fuel, i.e. for every 14.7kg of air you need 1kg of fuel, but the principle is the same. For actual calculations see the book referenced at http://www.bracken.co.uk/misc. Now Lambda is simply the stoichoimetric A:F ratio divided by the observed A:F ratio. i.e. if the stoichoimetric A:F ratio is 14.7:1 and you divide this by the observed AR ratio of 14.7 you get a lambda of 1.0, sometimes refered to as equivalence. If the observed A:F ratio is 18:1 the lambda is (14.7/18) = 0.82, and the mixture is weak (too much air). If the observed A:F ratio is 12:1 the lambda is (14.7/12) = 1.23, and the mixture is rich (too much fuel). Now, and this is why I asked my original question, if the definition of lambda = 1.0 is that all the oxygen is burnt, how can an oxygen sensor tell you what the lambda is at values greater than 1.0? You can't get negative concentrations of oxygen! The answer is in the graph, lambda is not a true equivalence ratio: there is always a small amount of oxygen left over. However, as you approach lambda for the weak side the O2 concn. drops rapidly, after which it takes on an almost steady value, meaning that the O2 sensor output is going to be much less sensititive on the rich side than on the weak side. Really what you want is a O2 meter to tell you if you are running weak and a CO meter to tell you how rich you are running (again see graph). Interestingly hydrocarbon (HC) concn. does not vary much with lambda, as I assumed it would. Gar - the Horiba calibration routine that you refer to is what we do with the paramagnetic O2 sensors. In fact I could use a paramagnetic sensor to calibate the DIY_EGO zirconium O2 sensors. But do tell, is the curve linear all the way up to 21% O2? Can you give me a refernce on those SAE papers? byeee, gus From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 07:33:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA16885 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 07:33:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha2.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.111]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA16881 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 07:33:27 -0400 Received: from CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (csdalpha1.sbu.ac.uk [136.148.1.1]) by CSDAlpha2.sbu.ac.uk (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id MAA25625 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:38:33 +0100 (BST) Received: from e130-pc1.sbu.ac.uk by CSDAlpha1.sbu.ac.uk (5.65v4.0/1.1.10.5/06Nov96-0356PM) id AA26545; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:32:18 +0100 Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980424123721.007ed100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Sender: cameroa@unix.sbu.ac.uk X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:37:21 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Gus Cameron Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980424103925.007fe180@unix.sbu.ac.uk> References: <35b2a249.120726218@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> <3.0.5.32.19980423122851.007fb100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> <3.0.5.32.19980419203714.0079bc60@mail.qonline.com.au> <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> <3.0.5.32.19980423122851.007fb100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu snip >I can give you the stoichoimetric equation for glucose no probs: C6H12O6 >(glucose) + 6H2O ----> 6CO2 + 6H2O. i.e. for every one molecule of glucose Whoops! Should really proof these before I hit send! C6H12O6 (glucose) + 6O2 ----> 6CO2 + 6H2O. Sorry, Gus From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 07:59:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA17174 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 07:59:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mbox.ualr.edu (mbox.ualr.edu [144.167.10.38]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA17170 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 07:59:13 -0400 Received: from vn-gateway by UALR.EDU (PMDF V4.2-11 #15587) id <01IW8LPM4FMO0000I2@UALR.EDU>; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 06:59:08 CDT Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 06:53:00 -0500 From: dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us (Dave Williams) Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <469374.7.uupcb@chaos.lrk.ar.us> Organization: The Courts of Chaos * Jacksonville AR USA * 501-985-0059 X-Envelope-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -> the 3.8 is a 302 with 2 cyl chopped off No, the 3.8 is unique and has no parts (other than wristpins and lifters) interchangeable with any other motor. From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 09:10:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA17902 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:10:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com ([206.130.240.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA17898 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:10:28 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0ySiHp-00013ZC; Fri, 24 Apr 98 09:13 EDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: Crank sensor question... To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:13:04 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: from "Robert Humphris" at Apr 24, 98 09:37:41 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > Sounds sensible to me... now what happens if I reverse the polarity of > my CSH?? it will cause an advance (or retard) of your CSHead Clive > > >---------- > >From: Bruce Plecan[SMTP:nacelp@bright.net] > >Sent: 23 April 1998 15:00 > >To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > >Subject: Re: Crank sensor question... > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: Robert Humphris > >Subject: Crank sensor question... > >>I have found an interesting little mod for my type of car ( Renault > >>5GTTurbo ) which is too simple for words... but I cannot work out why it > >works. > > It has been found that if you swap the wires from the crank sensor, to > >>the ignition module, the car pulls like a train from 3000rpm upwards. > >>The engines used to run out of steam at around 6000rpm, but with the wire > >swap, it just keeps pulling... > >>Anyone got any ideas why this works like this? > >>Rob Humphris > > > >If the pickup up in the dist uses a coil+reluctor then it generates a > >A/C signal. The module has a specific theshold when it triggers. > >The faster you spin a reluctor in a coil, the greater the voltage, and > >the earlier the signal. IE in a GM HEI it's a bit over 1.5degrees per > >1,000 rpm. So depending on how it's wired/triggered you now > >have a rpm sensitive advance or retard. Hook a timing light to > >a plug wire, and make the switch if the timing retards, then you > >know it's retarding as a function of rpm. > >Bruce Just bought a larger Cone Shaped Hat, the Palm > > Impressions are still getting larger in my forehead. > > > > > > > > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 09:30:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA18102 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:30:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA18098 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:30:30 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-30.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.99]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id JAA14548 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:29:34 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Crank sensor question... Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:30:33 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6f85$288cede0$63198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Robert Humphris To: 'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu' Date: Friday, April 24, 1998 5:10 AM Subject: RE: Crank sensor question... >Sounds sensible to me... now what happens if I reverse the polarity of >my CSH?? You're sparking will be advanced or retarded, you'll have to figure out the timing light hook-up thou.... Cheers Bruce Yes, Cone Shaped Hats are polarity sensitive!. If ya get it wrong you won't know if your coming or going!!.. > >>---------- >>From: Bruce Plecan[SMTP:nacelp@bright.net] >>Sent: 23 April 1998 15:00 >>To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >>Subject: Re: Crank sensor question... >> >>-----Original Message----- >>From: Robert Humphris >>Subject: Crank sensor question... >>>I have found an interesting little mod for my type of car ( Renault >>>5GTTurbo ) which is too simple for words... but I cannot work out why it >>works. >> It has been found that if you swap the wires from the crank sensor, to >>>the ignition module, the car pulls like a train from 3000rpm upwards. >>>The engines used to run out of steam at around 6000rpm, but with the wire >>swap, it just keeps pulling... >>>Anyone got any ideas why this works like this? >>>Rob Humphris >> >>If the pickup up in the dist uses a coil+reluctor then it generates a >>A/C signal. The module has a specific theshold when it triggers. >>The faster you spin a reluctor in a coil, the greater the voltage, and >>the earlier the signal. IE in a GM HEI it's a bit over 1.5degrees per >>1,000 rpm. So depending on how it's wired/triggered you now >>have a rpm sensitive advance or retard. Hook a timing light to >>a plug wire, and make the switch if the timing retards, then you >>know it's retarding as a function of rpm. >>Bruce Just bought a larger Cone Shaped Hat, the Palm >> Impressions are still getting larger in my forehead. >> >> >> >> > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 09:37:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA18165 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:37:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA18161 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:37:27 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id JAA02825; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:37:25 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAE00236 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:36:21 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:36:21 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804241336.JAE00236@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980424093239.007b5100@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:32:39 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals In-Reply-To: <35402FC9.3588D4E3@mcn.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980422203431.007b4100@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980423110923.007aeac0@xephic.dynip.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Just finished head gaskets in 88 Taurus w/3.8l. Not fun. >Very very not fun. I believe that... I pulled my engine out twice, first to have it balanced & blueprinted... wasn't fun, and the second time to take the oil pan off and replace the oil pickup, I chose to pull it so the engine could be turned upside down. My Lincoln "lowers" itself when you shut it off, therefore getting ramps underneath it can be a pain sometimes, in my lovely overly-pot-holed driveway. What mileage did your gaskets pop if I might ask? I have 80K on my engine, which is running very strong, but I'm thinking its time to do a timing chain, water pump, head gasket replacement, and take a look inside to see how good/bad it is. I also definately have to replace the back motor mount. Again. I think I'm going to make or have made a solid back motor mount. I lose one or two a year. Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 09:37:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA18171 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:37:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA18167 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:37:29 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id JAA02832; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:37:27 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAF00236 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:36:23 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:36:23 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804241336.JAF00236@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980424093502.0079c380@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:35:02 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals In-Reply-To: References: <35402FC9.3588D4E3@mcn.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >(ok, everybody sing 1, 2, 3 Fesss-Teeee-Vaaaa) That would be SICK :). I like you already. >the 3.8 is a 302 with 2 cyl chopped off Really, so the front of the two engines are the same? Bolt holes wise? Interesting possibilitites here if this is the case. >first appeared around 82 rear drive >decent power but got about the same milage as a 302 I'd say much better. I've never seen a Mustang get 28-29 MPG. Though I could be wrong. True, driving style has a lot to do with it... I don't play with my Lincoln the same way I would have I had a bright red mustang. >would rather poke out my eyes with a stick A rounded stick, or a pointy stick? Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 09:45:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA18337 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:45:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA18333 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:45:58 -0400 Received: from snyder.huron.net (pstn24-as1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.183]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA27474 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 08:42:46 -0400 Message-ID: <354098EE.7934@huron.net> Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:51:42 -0400 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals References: <469374.7.uupcb@chaos.lrk.ar.us> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Dave Williams wrote: > > -> the 3.8 is a 302 with 2 cyl chopped off > > No, the 3.8 is unique and has no parts (other than wristpins and > lifters) interchangeable with any other motor. > Regardless if the parts fit or not, the 3.8 is, in effect, 2/3 of a 5 litre v8 - optimized for production (in other words, you CAN NOT use off the shelf parts for a new engine).Unlike GM in years past, you cannot pull a ford 4, 6, or 8 cyl engine and replace it with one of the others without changing a lot. GM inline 6, V6, V8 small block, big block, and iron duke 4 all interchanged. Pontiac/Buick would fit Chev/Olds if you changed tranny with engine (different bolt pattern). Try that with Fomoco or Mopar. -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 09:48:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA18425 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:48:53 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA18419 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:48:52 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-30.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.99]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id JAA20215 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:47:56 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Holley Projection article Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:45:50 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6f87$4ae2fd60$63198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Raymond C Drouillard To: Tmatthe1@worldnet.att.net Date: Thursday, April 23, 1998 11:47 PM Subject: Re: Holley Projection article >>Also, is there a way to find the stock rating of the injectors by part >>numbers, and do they interchange with GM TB injectors? I have heard that they are a drop in replacement, going either way, Holley to GM, and GM to Holley. > Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 10:14:40 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA18973 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:14:40 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from quartz.ucs.ualberta.ca (quartz.ucs.ualberta.ca [129.128.5.19]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA18968 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:14:37 -0400 Received: from gpu2.srv.ualberta.ca (gpu2.srv.ualberta.ca [129.128.98.12]) by quartz.ucs.ualberta.ca (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id IAA12656 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 08:14:36 -0600 Received: from localhost (mbeaubie@localhost) by gpu2.srv.ualberta.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA40874 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 08:14:36 -0600 Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 08:14:36 -0600 (MDT) From: Matt Beaubien X-Sender: mbeaubie@gpu2.srv.ualberta.ca To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Tech 4 problems In-Reply-To: <199804240900.FAA15664@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Well, with everyone spewing forth Iron Duke / Tech 4 information, I thought I'd try to get a copule of answers for myself. I have an '86 Olds Ciera that used for hauling my Civic around to races and for driving around when my daily driver is down (like right now -- changing a heater core on a 300ZXT, ugh). Anyways, I'm going to be selling it this summer and would like to get it running a bit better. It has 180k miles on it (used engine install at 140k miles after a rod knock) and it's never really run well after the guy installed it. The problem is as follows. Response and power is very poor. It's like the engine is very lean or the timing very retarded. Especially when cold, shift recovery is very poor and it seems to drive like it has a weak accelerator pump (if it was carbed). However, once warmed up, at certain speeds, the engine power will suddenly pickup as if a misfiring cylinder came back to life. It is not misfiring when this happens though. I don't have a tach but it seems to be RPM related. It happens at ~25 MPH in first, ~40 MPH in second, and ~60 MPH in third, and is quite repeatable. I've tried swapping the TPS and MAP with no difference. The plugs don't look too bad either. Any suggestions? Thanks in advance. Matt Beaubien mbeaubie@gpu.srv.ualberta.ca 3 x 510 1 x Civic 1200 1 x 300ZXT From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 11:00:10 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA19923 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:00:10 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [209.161.0.35]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA19919 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:00:08 -0400 Received: (qmail 11212 invoked from network); 24 Apr 1998 09:00:06 -0600 Received: from ts5-11.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.119) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 1998 09:00:06 -0600 Received: by ts5-11.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD6F5E.C2E26DB0@ts5-11.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 08:55:42 -0700 Message-ID: <01BD6F5E.C2E26DB0@ts5-11.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 08:55:39 -0700 Encoding: 11 TEXT, 37 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu someone wrote: >>2.3l was a carry over from Pinto days reliable but slow>> Not quite, and yes, this falls into the 'who cares' category, I know. The 2.3L in the Tempo was bored to 2.5L for the Taurus. Both were 2/3 of the old Falcon/Mustang/Maverick/Granada inline pushrod six. Awful, Awful engines. Mike Jones begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(BH/`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, 0````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M`' ``0```"8```!213H@ M4W5P97)C:&%R9V5D($QI;F-O;&X@0V]N=&EN96YT86QS`````@%Q``$````6 M`````;UOF6VQCG);Z-N)$=&CH "@)-$Z!P``'@`># $````%````4TU44 `` M```>`!\,`0```!D```!R;6IO;F5S0&-Y8F5R:&EG:'=A>2YN970``````P`& M$-Y7'1L#``<0]0```!X`"! !````90```%-/345/3D574D]413HR,TQ705-! M0T%24EE/5D521E)/35!)3E1/1$%94U)%3$E!0DQ%0E544TQ/5TY/5%%5251% M+$%.1%E%4RQ42$E31D%,3%-)3E1/5$A%5TA/0T%215-#050``````@$)$ $` M``#M`0``Z0$``!8#``!,6D9U\+;P5/\`"@$/`A4"I /D!>L"@P!0$P-4`@!C M: K @! J@'P)C!4 *A0J% M/I ^,BXS`R!W800@"&$@8PK 7,*A1DP M2QSP`:!L'M!B=05 <_T8P'<=3QY0(> ?7R!O"H<+)TLH5DX?$"!Q=6F%'R L M(H!N9"!Y!Y"Y*[!T: 0`(U '0&P$(,0)R*A'R!G M!;!Y*[ 022!K;B6P+B @-E0M<2(!3"T!+5-49?QM<"/P(E(&X!DQ+% C\+TB M`#4P``(0!< P4V$(<-1UP;IP,M!H`V K\ "0 M>"]A8$%W9G5L*[ X`R ="?!G-N$RX"$,36EK_1[02AZQ)$8`#T``0````4```!213H@``````,`#33]-P``2?%O ` end From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 11:03:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA19993 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:03:43 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com ([206.130.240.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id LAA19989 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:03:41 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0ySk3O-00013tC; Fri, 24 Apr 98 11:06 EDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:06:18 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: <354098EE.7934@huron.net> from "Clare Snyder" at Apr 24, 98 09:51:42 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > Dave Williams wrote: > > > > -> the 3.8 is a 302 with 2 cyl chopped off > > > > No, the 3.8 is unique and has no parts (other than wristpins and > > lifters) interchangeable with any other motor. > > > Regardless if the parts fit or not, the 3.8 is, in effect, 2/3 of a 5 > litre v8 - optimized for production (in other words, you CAN NOT use off > the shelf parts for a new engine).Unlike GM in years past, you cannot > pull a ford 4, 6, or 8 cyl engine and replace it with one of the others > without changing a lot. GM inline 6, V6, V8 small block, big block, and > iron duke 4 all interchanged. Pontiac/Buick would fit Chev/Olds if you > changed tranny with engine (different bolt pattern). Try that with > Fomoco or Mopar. early rear drive models will interchange with a 302 trans uses same bolt pattern etc. front basically different but similar brackets etc. front drive uses funny bolt pattern on flywhell wnd with little teeny tiny flexplate about 8" round later 3.8 is quite different using deep thread (anti distortion) head bolts and other strange and wonderfull stuff Clive From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 11:13:58 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA20206 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:13:58 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from snowcrest.net (mtshasta.snowcrest.net [207.201.33.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA20202 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:13:56 -0400 Received: from ws2436 (ppp115.snowcrest.net [207.201.18.147]) by snowcrest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA07599 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 08:13:55 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804241513.IAA07599@snowcrest.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: "Do-It-Yourself Fuel Injection" Subject: Delco Fuel Injection Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 08:15:00 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Has anyone done any research on the Delco fuel inject..? Also known as DFI. Seems like it would be simular to a standard TBI setup. The reason I ask is these setups found on most mid to late 80's Caddi's are VERY common, I see them on their HT4100 motors, the little 4.1L V8... Any input... Thanks From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 12:14:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA21350 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:14:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pop1.cyberhighway.net (qmailr@pop1.cyberhighway.net [209.161.0.35]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA21344 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:14:24 -0400 Received: (qmail 28850 invoked from network); 24 Apr 1998 10:14:21 -0600 Received: from ts5-11.rpt.cyberhighway.net (209.161.38.119) by pop1.cyberhighway.net with SMTP; 24 Apr 1998 10:14:21 -0600 Received: by ts5-11.rpt.cyberhighway.net with Microsoft Mail id <01BD6F69.22F01310@ts5-11.rpt.cyberhighway.net>; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:09:58 -0700 Message-ID: <01BD6F69.22F01310@ts5-11.rpt.cyberhighway.net> From: Mike Jones To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: Winmail.dat Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:09:56 -0700 Encoding: 11 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Well, I have feeling I'm polluting many of your hard-drives with winmail.dat files, for which I'm sorry. (At least the header sent back to myself reports it as an attachment.) I'm using NT 4.0 and have made sure that the 'use Windows rich-text' option is off, have verified that MIME is off, and have made sure that ASCII is selected. There do not seem to be any other options in NT to strip it down any further. I really want to fix this -- many of you have been a big help and I don't wish to stretch my welcome. Does anyone know how to eliminate the winmail.dat attachment in NT? If it's not possible, I'll switch e-mail programs... Mike Jones From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 12:38:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA21683 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:38:38 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from santaclara01.pop.internex.net (santaclara01.pop.internex.net [205.158.3.18]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA21678 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:38:35 -0400 From: garfield@pilgrimhouse.com Received: from garfield.pilgrimhouse.com ([205.158.241.42]) by santaclara01.pop.internex.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO203-101c) ID# 0-34792U7500L7500S0) with SMTP id AAA16067 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:38:35 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Return of the diy_EGOmeter (YES, it's finally ALIVE!!) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 09:39:15 -0700 Organization: Pilgrim House Message-ID: <354fbddd.37485546@santaclara01.pop.internex.net> References: <3.0.5.32.19980423122851.007fb100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> <3.0.5.32.19980419203714.0079bc60@mail.qonline.com.au> <35390373.67DC0858@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <01BD6940.54702120@pjaramaz> <3.0.5.32.19980418005125.007a5c90@mail.qonline.com.au> <199804181815.LAA19696@mail.wgn.net> <3.0.5.32.19980423122851.007fb100@unix.sbu.ac.uk> <3.0.5.32.19980424103925.007fe180@unix.sbu.ac.uk> In-Reply-To: <3.0.5.32.19980424103925.007fe180@unix.sbu.ac.uk> X-Mailer: Forte Agent 1.5/32.451 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id MAA21679 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:39:25 +0100, Gus Cameron wrote: >Gar - the Horiba calibration routine that you refer to is what we do with >the paramagnetic O2 sensors. In fact I could use a paramagnetic sensor to >calibate the DIY_EGO zirconium O2 sensors. >But do tell, is the curve >linear all the way up to 21% O2? Yes, eXcept for the bend around stoich, the two sides are remarkably fairly flat. > Can you give me a refernce on those SAE >papers? Instead of responding in private, let's get the reference in the fossil record once again. This was posted by Frank some time back: SAE# 920234 "Universal Air-Fuel Ratio Heated Exhaust Gas Oxygen Sensor and Further Applications", Yamada, Yayakawa, Kami, and Kawai NGK Spark Plug Co., 1992, 14pp. Gar From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 12:42:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA21793 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:42:54 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from fly.HiWAAY.net (root@fly.HiWAAY.net [208.147.154.56]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA21789 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:42:53 -0400 Received: from hiwaay.net (tnt2-176.HiWAAY.net [208.147.148.176]) by fly.HiWAAY.net (8.8.8/8.8.6) with ESMTP id LAA14752 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:42:53 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3540C0F2.A72DE8E@hiwaay.net> Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:42:27 -0500 From: Daniel Ciobota X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020 wrote: > > [...] > all Yamaha bullet proof high RPM > 3.0 was tested at 12000 rpm for 6 hours at Ford dyno room > (video is available for this one) > dissassembled and showed no wear > this thing could be tuned to make 500 HP easy at that RPM range > would make a great sleeper transplant for a small car > (ok, everybody sing 1, 2, 3 Fesss-Teeee-Vaaaa) Someone already dood it. I saw an article in HotRod or some such back in the early 90's where a guy took the front subframe off a sho taurus and mounted it to a festiva (with some extensive engine bay/fender mods). As I remember, the owner said it was "one scary ride"... bet it was, too. Daniel From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 13:53:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA22897 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 13:53:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from autozone.com (autozone.com [206.136.144.33]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA22893 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 13:53:13 -0400 Received: from mailhost.alldata.com (alldata.com [172.20.10.17]) by autozone.com (8.8.6/8.8.6) with ESMTP id MAA01491 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:53:13 -0500 (CDT) Organization: Alldata Received: from infinity.alldata (pcmail.alldata.com [172.20.10.212]) by mailhost.alldata.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with ESMTP id KAA14015 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:47:13 -0700 (PDT) Received: by pcmail with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:54:24 -0700 Message-ID: <03B9862B4DE7CF1180BA00805FEA021901FD39C9@pcmail> From: "Haigh, Bill" To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Winmail.dat Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 10:54:22 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >>Does anyone know how to eliminate the winmail.dat attachment in >>NT? If it's not possible, I'll switch e-mail programs... I forwarded your message to a friend of mine (a *very sharp* programmer for MCI). Here is his reply: ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------ You *MUST* do all of the following to turn off that STUPID ATTACHMENT: * Turn RTF (Rich Text Format) setting off. * Turn the MIME setting off. * Turn the "Word as Email Editor" setting off. * Install the "Microsoft Internet Mail Enhancement Patch"! You can get this patch at: http://www.microsoft.com/outlook/documents/imep.htm ------------------------------------------------------------------------ ------------------------------------ BILL From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 14:02:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA23022 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:02:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com ([206.130.240.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id OAA23018 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:02:13 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0ySmpo-000148C; Fri, 24 Apr 98 14:04 EDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:04:27 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: <3540C0F2.A72DE8E@hiwaay.net> from "Daniel Ciobota" at Apr 24, 98 11:42:27 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > > all Yamaha bullet proof high RPM > > 3.0 was tested at 12000 rpm for 6 hours at Ford dyno room > > (video is available for this one) > > dissassembled and showed no wear > > this thing could be tuned to make 500 HP easy at that RPM range > > would make a great sleeper transplant for a small car > > (ok, everybody sing 1, 2, 3 Fesss-Teeee-Vaaaa) > > Someone already dood it. I saw an article in HotRod or some such back in the early > 90's where a guy took the front subframe off a sho taurus and mounted it to a > festiva (with some extensive engine bay/fender mods). As I remember, the owner > said it was "one scary ride"... bet it was, too. called the Shogun sold as a conversion for a few years used stock SHO setup was pretty peppy would be better with a 500 SHO motor Clive > > Daniel > > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 14:12:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA23198 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:12:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ds9.symtx.com (ds9.symtx.com [38.242.16.12]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA23194 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:12:11 -0400 Received: by ds9 with Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) id ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 13:12:04 -0500 Message-ID: <47D5AD54221AD111873F00600831A35B154BC8@ds9> From: Greg Woods To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: S?? record format Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 13:12:02 -0500 X-Priority: 3 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.0.1458.49) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >BTW, ya know what a file extension of .S16 means?. I got some >bins but with that file extension, and just changing it to .bin doesn't >seem to work. >Cheers >Bruce Havn't seen anyone answer this question so I'll give it a shot,... It's been a little while since I messed with microcontrollers/ eeproms but here's what I remember, the S record format is a motorola convention, If you look at the data in a text browser it looks like Hex bytes with each line starting with an "S". The data could be either machine code from a compiled program or hex data from a PROM loader/unloader. Here's a sample: S123000F323530303030305A3833332E3333333333452D31305A34323934393637323936 0A S104002F5A72 S105FFFEF80005 S105FFFCF80007 S105FFFAF80009 S123F8008E00FFCE000FBDF8B2BDFB8BCE0017BDF8B2BDFA45BDFB8BCE0025BDF8B2BDFA 34 S123F820459600C68010970016862010970ADE019603C600048F048F24028B807A000A26 50 S123F840F3DF0BDD0DCE10001C00F81C07FF1C093F86058D5286008D45DC0B8D4ADC0D8D 6F Hope this helps... -- Greg Woods gwoods@symtx.com Austin, TX USA From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 14:31:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA23499 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:31:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail4.microsoft.com (mail4.microsoft.com [131.107.3.29]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA23495 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:31:31 -0400 Received: by INET-04-IMC with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:31:32 -0700 Message-ID: From: Don Berry To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Winmail.dat Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 11:31:26 -0700 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does this message contain the dreaded winmail.dat file? I am using an Exchange Server and the patch says that it does not apply. I am also using Word as my editor. If it is still causing a problem, I can get the answer. And the #1 Oxymoron; 1. Microsoft Works! Don Berry -----Original Message----- >>Does anyone know how to eliminate the winmail.dat attachment in NT? If it's not possible, I'll switch e-mail programs... I forwarded your message to a friend of mine (a *very sharp* programmer for MCI). Here is his reply: From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 14:58:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA24162 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:58:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA24157 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:58:12 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-12.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.81]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id OAA19799 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:57:17 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:58:18 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6fb2$f18f3cc0$51198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Daniel Ciobota Date: Friday, April 24, 1998 1:20 PM Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals >Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020 wrote: >> all Yamaha bullet proof high RPM >> 3.0 was tested at 12000 rpm for 6 hours at Ford dyno room >> (video is available for this one) >> dissassembled and showed no wear >> this thing could be tuned to make 500 HP easy at that RPM range >> would make a great sleeper transplant for a small car >> (ok, everybody sing 1, 2, 3 Fesss-Teeee-Vaaaa) > >Someone already dood it. I saw an article in HotRod or some such back in the early >90's where a guy took the front subframe off a sho taurus and mounted it to a >festiva (with some extensive engine bay/fender mods). As I remember, the owner >said it was "one scary ride"... bet it was, too. > >Daniel > I think they called it Shogun, were a couple made, also think J Leno had one.. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 15:14:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA24507 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 15:14:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA24502 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 15:14:30 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp148.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.148]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA03385; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 15:19:13 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 15:12:19 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Don Berry cc: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Winmail.dat In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu no it doesn't include the .dat file,it read good in fact (even have the same character set as me) Alain > Does this message contain the dreaded winmail.dat file? I am > using an Exchange Server and the patch says that it does not apply. I am > also using Word as my editor. If it is still causing a problem, I can get > the answer. > > And the #1 Oxymoron; > > 1. Microsoft Works! > > > Don Berry > > > > -----Original Message----- > >>Does anyone know how to eliminate the winmail.dat attachment in > NT? If it's not possible, I'll switch e-mail programs... > > > I forwarded your message to a friend of mine (a *very sharp* programmer > for MCI). Here is his reply: > > > > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 15:48:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA25059 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 15:48:35 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from notes.auco.com (notes.auco.com [206.40.65.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA25055 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 15:48:29 -0400 Received: by notes.auco.com(Lotus SMTP MTA v1.05 (274.9 11-27-1996)) id 882565F0.006CAB27 ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:46:57 -0700 X-Lotus-FromDomain: AUCO From: "Nick Webb" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-ID: <882565F0.006B61E0.00@notes.auco.com> Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 12:46:53 -0700 Subject: RE: S?? record format Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Here's a sample: >S123000F323530303030305A3833332E3333333333452D31305A34323934393637323936 >0A >S104002F5A72 >S105FFFEF80005 >S105FFFCF80007 >S105FFFAF80009 >S123F8008E00FFCE000FBDF8B2BDFB8BCE0017BDF8B2BDFA45BDFB8BCE0025BDF8B2BDFA >34 >S123F820459600C68010970016862010970ADE019603C600048F048F24028B807A000A26 >50 >S123F840F3DF0BDD0DCE10001C00F81C07FF1C093F86058D5286008D45DC0B8D4ADC0D8D >6F By way of explanation, there are three forms of S record formats (that I'm aware of). There's S1/9, S2/8 and S3/7. The difference between the three is in the size of the address field: for S1/9 it's 2 bytes, S2/8 is 3 bytes and S3/7 is 4 bytes. Here's how the format breaks down: S1 Leadin marking it as S record and the size of the address field nn Number of bytes (hex) for the rest of the record - i.e. expect 2*nn characters and nn-3 data bytes in the rest of record aaaa Address for the first data byte in this record xx Pairs of ASCII hex digits for each data byte cc Last two digits are the twos compliment checksum based on a modulo 256 hex addition of all the bytes in the record including the count and address fields (i.e. add all the bytes, take the low order two digits and subtract from FF). The reason for calling this S1/9 rather than just S1 is that the S9 record is optional, but if provided it is by convention the last record in the group and defines the start address of the code that's been downloaded. Naturally this won't be useful for an S record file for a PROM blower - it will be ignored if it's provided. The .S16 extension is probably the S1/9 format as that has the 16 bit address field (4 digits), it's not the same as .BIN (binary) or .HEX (Intel hex). Cheers, Nick Webb From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 15:49:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA25068 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 15:49:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA25064 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 15:49:00 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-12.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.81]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id PAA05769 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 15:48:04 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Delco Fuel Injection Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 15:49:04 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd6fba$0948ad40$51198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Derek Jewett To: Do-It-Yourself Fuel Injection Date: Friday, April 24, 1998 11:51 AM Subject: Delco Fuel Injection >Has anyone done any research on the Delco fuel inject..? Also known as DFI. Seems like it would be simular to a standard TBI setup. The reason I ask is these setups found on most mid to late 80's Caddi's are VERY common, I see them on their HT4100 motors, the little 4.1L V8... Any input... Thanks The caddie division uses ecms that carry a gm part no ie, like the 1227730 they used is the same as a Delco AC GM Buick Olds Pont 1227730. Caddie has used several of the ones that we'll be (hopefully) talking about in the 101 series. DFI is getting to be rather generic. Accel is using for their name, there was an outfit in FL that used it. Then there was another in MI, so on+off when ya say DFI depending on who your talking to might be thinking of something other than delco. What seems to be an accepted way of decribing a ecm here, is by saying gm 730. Once ya get the ecms learned it rather easy since there are less than half a dozen that can be used for most any application. 747 TBI v-6-8 730 MAP (some MAF) v-6-8 TPI (some DIS) 165 MAF/MAP 4-6-8 (4cyl TBI, others TPI) 148 MAF buick turbo 6+some NA TPI DIS 749 Syclone MAP (some 4 cyl applications) 6870 MAF 6-8 808 Aussie version of 165 used MAP TPI 4-6-8 And then there are some mix and matchs of others. HTH Bruce Been running the Cone Shaped Hat on A/C today, and at any given moment don't know if I'm comin or going........... From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 17:13:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA26286 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 17:13:38 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from snowcrest.net (mtshasta.snowcrest.net [207.201.33.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA26282 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 17:13:36 -0400 Received: from ws2436 (ppp91.snowcrest.net [207.201.18.107]) by snowcrest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA14964 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:13:36 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804242113.OAA14964@snowcrest.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: "Do-It-Yourself Fuel Injection" Subject: Tweaker...& TBI/TPI Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:14:41 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Has anyone seen this Tweaker software bu Mike Pitts... Pretty neat stuff. I tried emailing Mike Pitts but his email address must have changed, has anyone from the list asked him if he has any plans of creating a tweaker for GM TBI/TPI?? I guess he and his associates found the table locations for the turbo chips, they can probably find the table locations for other chips! This is probably an old question but found no mention in the archives From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 17:19:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA26364 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 17:19:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from snowcrest.net (mtshasta.snowcrest.net [207.201.33.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA26360 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 17:19:06 -0400 Received: from ws2436 (ppp91.snowcrest.net [207.201.18.107]) by snowcrest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA16094 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:19:06 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804242119.OAA16094@snowcrest.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: Subject: Re: Delco Fuel Injection Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 14:20:10 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Well heck, I better strap on my cone shaped hat and head for the bone yard!!! PS I've heard the local bone yards are handing out FREE cone shapped hats with the purchase of any 730 or 747 ECM, check with your local bone yard as participation may vary... ---------- > From: Bruce Plecan > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Re: Delco Fuel Injection > Date: Friday, April 24, 1998 12:49 PM > > From: Derek Jewett > To: Do-It-Yourself Fuel Injection > Date: Friday, April 24, 1998 11:51 AM > Subject: Delco Fuel Injection > > > >Has anyone done any research on the Delco fuel inject..? Also known as DFI. > Seems like it would be simular to a standard TBI setup. The reason I ask is > these setups found on most mid to > late 80's Caddi's are VERY common, I see them on their HT4100 motors, the > little 4.1L V8... Any input... > Thanks > > The caddie division uses ecms that carry a gm part no ie, like > the 1227730 they used is the same as a Delco AC GM Buick > Olds Pont 1227730. Caddie has used several of the ones that > we'll be (hopefully) talking about in the 101 series. > > DFI is getting to be rather generic. Accel is using for their name, > there was an outfit in FL that used it. Then there was another > in MI, so on+off when ya say DFI depending on who your talking > to might be thinking of something other than delco. > > What seems to be an accepted way of decribing a ecm here, is > by saying gm 730. Once ya get the ecms learned it rather easy > since there are less than half a dozen that can be used for most > any application. > > 747 TBI v-6-8 > 730 MAP (some MAF) v-6-8 TPI (some DIS) > 165 MAF/MAP 4-6-8 (4cyl TBI, others TPI) > 148 MAF buick turbo 6+some NA TPI DIS > 749 Syclone MAP (some 4 cyl applications) > 6870 MAF 6-8 > 808 Aussie version of 165 used MAP TPI 4-6-8 > And then there are some mix and matchs of others. > HTH > Bruce Been running the Cone Shaped Hat on > A/C today, and at any given moment don't > know if I'm comin or going........... From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 21:48:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA28431 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 21:48:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca (mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA28427; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 21:48:55 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA16938; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 18:48:51 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id SAA06576; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 18:48:15 -0700 Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 18:48:14 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu cc: Do-It-Yourself Fuel Injection Subject: Re: Tweaker...& TBI/TPI In-Reply-To: <199804242113.OAA14964@snowcrest.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm sorry, what has he got? Is his software for GM only? thanks jw On Fri, 24 Apr 1998, Derek Jewett wrote: > Has anyone seen this Tweaker software bu Mike Pitts... Pretty neat stuff. I > tried emailing Mike Pitts but his email address must have changed, has > anyone from the list asked him if he has any plans of creating a tweaker > for GM TBI/TPI?? I guess he and his associates found the table locations > for the turbo chips, they can probably find the table locations for other > chips! > > This is probably an old question but found no mention in the archives > From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 22:48:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA28862 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 22:48:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA28858 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 22:48:32 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp10.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.31]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA09161; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 22:25:00 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 22:17:53 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Shannen Durphey cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: OTC's ecm system tester In-Reply-To: <353EFCF2.90F8FACD@mcn.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Alain Toussaint wrote: > > > > > Here's the list for you unix propeller heads that don't have excel... > > > :-) > > > > i'll check if it's readable by staroffice ( a Unix office suite also > > available on win95),if so,does anyone would like an html output of the > > file ??? > > Yuppers. > > Shannen i've been able to read it in StarOffice and got it to save as html,so far,it doesn't look good (it's 69 pages long and a page is 25 lines) there is about 7 or 8 lines blank between statement,anyway,for those who want to take a look in it,mail me and i'll send it as attachment (i would post it to the diy list ftp server but i dont think it's ready for prime time). Alain From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 23:31:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA29467 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 23:31:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA29463 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 23:31:23 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp34.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.55]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id XAA10166 for ; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 23:36:05 -0400 (EDT) Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 23:29:00 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: OTC's ecm system tester In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > i've been able to read it in StarOffice and got it to save as html,so > far,it doesn't look good (it's 69 pages long and a page is 25 lines) there > is about 7 or 8 lines blank between statement,anyway,for those who want to > take a look in it,mail me and i'll send it as attachment (i would post it > to the diy list ftp server but i dont think it's ready for prime time). > > Alain forget anything about this message,i was looking at the file in a text browser when i made these comment,it look very good in my word processor. Alain From diy_efi-owner Fri Apr 24 23:42:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA29679 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 23:42:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from snowcrest.net (mtshasta.snowcrest.net [207.201.33.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA29675; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 23:42:37 -0400 Received: from default (ttyD2e.redding.snowcrest.net [209.148.36.79]) by snowcrest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA25346; Fri, 24 Apr 1998 20:42:35 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804250342.UAA25346@snowcrest.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: Cc: "Do-It-Yourself Fuel Injection" Subject: Re: Tweaker...& TBI/TPI Date: Fri, 24 Apr 1998 20:49:44 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu It's for the Buick GN/Ttype 148 ECM ONLY... for Windows even.. From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 02:13:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA30951 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 02:13:19 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA30947 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 02:13:16 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-041.mcn.net [208.26.146.41]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA01152 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 00:13:13 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <35417BF5.54079DCA@mcn.net> Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 00:00:21 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Tweaker...& TBI/TPI References: <199804242113.OAA14964@snowcrest.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Derek Jewett wrote: > > Has anyone seen this Tweaker software bu Mike Pitts... Pretty neat stuff. I > tried emailing Mike Pitts but his email address must have changed, has > anyone from the list asked him if he has any plans of creating a tweaker > for GM TBI/TPI?? I guess he and his associates found the table locations > for the turbo chips, they can probably find the table locations for other > chips! > > This is probably an old question but found no mention in the archives One of his associates, Scott Mueller, has written a book which is on the shelf over my computer, Upgrading and Repairing PCs, which is about 2 1/2" thick. No average car guy, by any means. I also could not find an accurate email address. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 02:37:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA31302 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 02:37:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA31298 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 02:37:50 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-041.mcn.net [208.26.146.41]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA04882 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 00:37:48 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <354181B8.9D755D99@mcn.net> Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 00:24:56 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980422203431.007b4100@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980423110923.007aeac0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980424093239.007b5100@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > >Just finished head gaskets in 88 Taurus w/3.8l. Not fun. > >Very very not fun. > >snip< > What mileage did your gaskets pop if I might ask? I have 80K on my engine, > which is running very strong, but I'm thinking its time to do a timing > chain, water pump, head gasket replacement, and take a look inside to see > how good/bad it is. > > I also definately have to replace the back motor mount. Again. I think > I'm going to make or have made a solid back motor mount. I lose one or two > a year. > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > Homebrew Automotive Website: > http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HMMWV > 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car > > - There were over 100k on the Taurus. I suspect this was the second set of gaskets in a very short time. Usually one can find corrosion or signs of deterioration around a failed head gasket. Part of the wire ring surrounding cyl 4 was pushed out of round, allowing coolant into the chamber, and the intake and head geskets looked fairly fresh. I would guess a lack of clamping force caused the gasket to move. Buddy at Ford dealership seems to have done many 3.8l head gaskets. Might be good preventative maintenance on your part. I'd say buy GM, but between 3.8l Buick timing chains, 2.3l head gaskets, 2.5l timing gears, and 3.1l piston failure you'd be no better off. I can't be pessimistic. I truly believe that "things" can't possibly get any worse. ; ) Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 03:07:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA31688 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 03:07:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA31672; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 03:05:18 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp147.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.147]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id DAA12716; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 03:10:03 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 03:03:05 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: DIY list cc: efi332@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: searching for a file who was sended to me about 6 month ago Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu about 6 month ago,there was someone who was from autralia and doing rally with a car equiped with a 68hc11 or a 68332 (can't remember),that person sent me a tarball (tar.gz file) of the source of this system,it was really a simplist system,i would very much like if that person please resend me the file and some detail about the setup he's using. thanks a lot. Alain From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 09:20:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA01006 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 09:20:43 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA00998 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 09:20:38 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp44.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.174]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id IAA28925 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 08:20:52 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3541E133.41AAD787@mwt.net> Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 08:12:20 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980422203431.007b4100@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980423110923.007aeac0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980424093239.007b5100@xephic.dynip.com> <354181B8.9D755D99@mcn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu This is very uncommon on Ford (or any other manufacture ) to have two gasket failures in a short time frame. The rules a Ford dealer ship mechanic uses before replacing gasket is (1) always replace head bolts on aluminum heads (2) have the heads checked out by a good machine shop. Steve Shannen Durphey wrote: > Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > > > > >Just finished head gaskets in 88 Taurus w/3.8l. Not fun. > > >Very very not fun. > > > >snip< > > > What mileage did your gaskets pop if I might ask? I have 80K on my > engine, > > which is running very strong, but I'm thinking its time to do a > timing > > chain, water pump, head gasket replacement, and take a look inside > to see > > how good/bad it is. > > > > I also definately have to replace the back motor mount. Again. I > think > > I'm going to make or have made a solid back motor mount. I lose one > or two > > a year. > > > > Frederic Breitwieser > > Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > > > Homebrew Automotive Website: > > http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > > > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > > 1989 HMMWV > > 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car > > > > - > There were over 100k on the Taurus. I suspect this was the > second set of gaskets in a very short time. Usually one can > find corrosion or signs of deterioration around a failed > head gasket. Part of the wire ring surrounding cyl 4 was > pushed out of round, allowing coolant into the chamber, and > the intake and head geskets looked fairly fresh. I would > guess a lack of clamping force caused the gasket to move. > > Buddy at Ford dealership seems to have done many 3.8l head > gaskets. Might be good preventative maintenance on your > part. I'd say buy GM, but between 3.8l Buick timing chains, > 2.3l head gaskets, 2.5l timing gears, and 3.1l piston > failure you'd be no better off. > > I can't be pessimistic. I truly believe that "things" can't > possibly get any worse. ; ) > > Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 10:12:19 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA01483 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 10:12:19 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA01479 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 10:12:17 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-025.mcn.net [208.26.146.25]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id IAA13459 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 08:11:56 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3541EC26.B5A08A32@mcn.net> Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 07:59:02 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals References: <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <353DA899.7E58F417@mwt.net> <3.0.5.32.19980422164224.007a88e0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980422203431.007b4100@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980423110923.007aeac0@xephic.dynip.com> <3.0.5.32.19980424093239.007b5100@xephic.dynip.com> <354181B8.9D755D99@mcn.net> <3541E133.41AAD787@mwt.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Steven Gorkowski wrote: > > This is very uncommon on Ford (or any other manufacture ) to have two > gasket failures in a short time frame. The rules a Ford dealer ship > mechanic uses before replacing gasket is (1) always replace head bolts > on aluminum heads (2) have the heads checked out by a good machine shop. > I agree. This car was purchased used and had problems from the beginning. I think someone R+R'ed the head gaskets and immediately traded it off. The heads showed no signs of resurfacing when I removed them. As to finding a good machine shop, there's a couple in the next town, 50 mi from here. They're ok for basic machine work. I don't really know how to describe the local place. When the garages herre send something out, it usually goes to him because he's in town. When I send something of my own out, it goes out of town. Head bolts came with the gasket kit. Nice surprise. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 10:59:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA01959 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 10:59:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA01955 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 10:59:16 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-23.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.92]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id KAA11623 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 10:58:21 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 10:59:23 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd705a$bb94ca60$5c198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Shannen Durphey To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals > >Head bolts came with the gasket kit. Nice surprise. > >Shannen Gasket Kits, you mean you have to assemble your gaskets?. Talk about labor intensive.... HOHOHAHA Cheers Bruce Next batch of Cone Shaped Hats with have the polarities marked permenately, so there will be no excuse for not knowing if your coming or going.. From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 13:53:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA03118 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 13:53:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA03112 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 13:53:08 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-d36.foothill.net [209.76.43.36]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id KAA02120 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 10:53:40 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: GME Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 10:51:43 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd7072$cf1feac0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Well, after some thought and discussion, I put my GME beta program in the incoming directory. Mr. CSH has been working on the code stuff and I figured this program might help. GME is a C3/P4 eprom editor. It is model specific, but it should help people get the drift of what is going on. It is not complete. But it does work and I have gone as far as I can without more input. The program is currently for the 85 TPI V8/85 MPFI V6 (but not Fiero. Different beast). I've included two binaries for testing. There is a doc file (GMEDOC.DOC) included. Please read the docs, opening screen, play with the program, and report bugs as indicated at the end of the doc file. The program can be freely distributed in beta form until release (below V1.00). After that it's payware. If I ever get that far. The file is GMER.ZIP. Some notes: F1 help does not work yet. Some area's are not enabled. There are bugs, but mainly in the windowing code. The roms will work. Read the opening warning screen. Read it again and again. I will not work on bugs that are not reported in the recommended format. Since this version is freeware, there is no reason to avoid telling me your real name. I do not work for GM, I do not want to work for GM, and they didn't help me. So there! Terry Kelley From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 14:55:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA03603 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 14:55:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA03599 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 14:55:09 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-1.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.70]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id OAA14986 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 14:54:14 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Message from CSH, HQ.. PLEASE READ Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 14:53:35 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd707b$734f3120$46198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu If ya haven't been to the incoming are in the last few minutes, go there now. Download a copy of gmer.zip. Do not go past go, or collect whatever ya normally would collect. I think a huge Thanks is due TK..... Thank you TK Most sincerely Bruce From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 16:59:03 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA04503 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 16:59:03 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA04499 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 16:59:00 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm302-075.mcn.net [208.26.146.75]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id OAA01614 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 14:58:59 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <35424B8A.65D24023@mcn.net> Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 14:46:02 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals References: <01bd705a$bb94ca60$5c198fd1@nacelp> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Bruce Plecan wrote: > > From: Shannen Durphey > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Re: Supercharged Lincoln Continentals > > > > >Head bolts came with the gasket kit. Nice surprise. > > > >Shannen > > Gasket Kits, you mean you have to assemble your gaskets?. > Talk about labor intensive.... > HOHOHAHA > Cheers > Bruce Next batch of Cone Shaped Hats with have the > polarities marked permenately, so there will be > no excuse for not knowing if your coming or going.. yup. It's been a lot harder since they outlawed asbestos. Tip #1: A short bungee cord under your CSH keeps it on while you're assembling your gaskets. Tip #2: Wearing dark sunglasses with your CSH keeps you in style while you're welding. Tip #3: My CSH for work has a base of 4" dia for use as a handy template for SB Chebby head gaskets. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 17:11:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA04653 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 17:11:47 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from codenet.net (techstream.com [209.136.122.200]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id RAA04648 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 17:11:45 -0400 Message-Id: <199804252111.RAA04648@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Received: from mail.codenet.net [209.136.121.145] by codenet.net (SMTPD32-4.04) id A23CC600F0; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 15:14:36 MDT To: DIY list Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Post Road Mailer for OS/2 (Green Edition Ver 2.5) Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 15:11:41 MST From: Will Honea Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu OK, I've got an '86 Cimmeron with the 2.8 v-6. Mechanically, it has been great - 140k miles, still has good compression, nice even idle, reasonably nimble considering. Tranny was gone thru (replaced the lock-up switch - PITA!) and everything looked just fine - shop manager's comment was that it was probably good for another 100k or so (grain of salt there). Injectors are clean, fuel system checks good and NO LEAKS! I've got one huge problem with it that I hope someone can help with: It EATS ignition modules. I've used everything from the dealer's Delco to NAPA to AutoZone/Checker (never will use another Wells part!). Computer dump shows no faults. Anybody got a clue as to what might cause this? Replaced coil, position sensor, pickup coil, wires, just about everything. I'm real happy with the engine, but this is about to drive me nuts! Will Honea whonea@codenet.net From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 17:38:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA05133 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 17:38:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA05129 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 17:38:57 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp108.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.108]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA24863; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 17:43:37 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 17:36:20 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: TBK cc: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GME In-Reply-To: <01bd7072$cf1feac0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > The program is currently for the 85 TPI V8/85 MPFI V6 (but not Fiero. > Different beast). I've included two binaries for testing. There is a doc > file (GMEDOC.DOC) included. do you want that i do an html output of your doc file ??? also,do you want to port it to other architectures ??? and if so,with what software do you coded it ??? Alain From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 17:43:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id RAA05210 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 17:43:54 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id RAA05206 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 17:43:51 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp127.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.127]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id RAA24939; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 17:48:35 -0400 (EDT) Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 17:41:18 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: Will Honea cc: DIY list Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? In-Reply-To: <199804252111.RAA04648@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > It EATS ignition modules. I've used everything from the dealer's Delco to NAPA to AutoZone/Checker > (never will use another Wells part!). Computer dump shows no faults. Anybody got a clue as to what might > cause this? Replaced coil, position sensor, pickup coil, wires, just about everything. I'm real happy with > the engine, but this is about to drive me nuts! good chance that the thing is picking up a lot of heat and there's not much airflow there,you should problably find a better place to put it (if it's possible). Alain > > Will Honea > whonea@codenet.net > > From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 18:06:21 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA05593 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 18:06:21 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA05587 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 18:06:15 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe-d37.foothill.net [209.76.43.37]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id PAA19288 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 15:06:45 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 15:04:58 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd7096$2fefec60$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Make sure there is a layer of silicone grease (commonly called pidgeon shit) over the complete bottom of the module. This will help transfer the heat to the distributor base. The modules are known to be heat sensitive. If this is an DIS ignition, ignore me. TK -----Original Message----- From: Alain Toussaint To: Will Honea Cc: DIY list Date: Saturday, April 25, 1998 3:04 PM Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? >> It EATS ignition modules. I've used everything from the dealer's Delco to NAPA to AutoZone/Checker >> (never will use another Wells part!). Computer dump shows no faults. Anybody got a clue as to what might >> cause this? Replaced coil, position sensor, pickup coil, wires, just about everything. I'm real happy with >> the engine, but this is about to drive me nuts! > >good chance that the thing is picking up a lot of heat and there's not >much airflow there,you should problably find a better place to put it (if >it's possible). > >Alain > >> >> Will Honea >> whonea@codenet.net >> >> > > From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 18:39:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA06054 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 18:39:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA06048 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 18:39:06 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-22.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.40]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id SAA19297 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 18:38:11 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 18:39:13 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd709a$f8bc33c0$28198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Alain Toussaint To: Will Honea Cc: DIY list Date: Saturday, April 25, 1998 6:04 PM Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? >> It EATS ignition modules. I've used everything from the dealer's Delco to NAPA to AutoZone/Checker >> (never will use another Wells part!). Computer dump shows no faults. Anybody got a clue as to what might >> cause this? Replaced coil, position sensor, pickup coil, wires, just about everything. I'm real happy with >> the engine, but this is about to drive me nuts! > >good chance that the thing is picking up a lot of heat and there's not >much airflow there,you should problably find a better place to put it (if >it's possible). > >Alain > >> >> Will Honea >> whonea@codenet.net >> Look at the bottom of the distributor rotor. If you see a little speck about the size of a fly turd, the rotor may have a burn thru spot, which sends the coil output down the distributor shaft, and zaps the module as it goes by. Also try looking for a rainbow type apprearance on the coil, means it's been overheated, and may have a thermal short.. Cheers Bruce If this is DIS forget the above.. From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 18:53:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA06313 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 18:53:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ultra2.syspac.com (ultra2.syspac.com [204.96.14.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA06309 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 18:53:31 -0400 Received: from mailrelay.syspac.com ([204.96.14.7]) by ultra2.syspac.com (Post.Office MTA v3.1 release PO203a ID# 0-37030U5000L500S0) with ESMTP id AAA19440 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 15:50:53 -0700 Received: from p57003.syspac.com (p57003.syspac.com [204.181.57.3]) by mailrelay.syspac.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id PAA19437 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 15:50:52 -0700 (MST) From: bamcknig@postoffice.syspac.com Message-Id: <199804252250.PAA19437@mailrelay.syspac.com> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 16:14:55 +0000 Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Windows (v2.23) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Will New HV wires. clean plugs. heat transfer goop on the modules. good grounds. clean distributor body where the module mounts to get good heat transfer. good luck Bob McKnight Phx AZ From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 22:20:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA07776 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:20:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.enter.net (root@mail.enter.net [204.170.70.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA07771 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:20:04 -0400 From: rbraun@mail.enter.net Received: from rbraun (m40atwn-3-14.enter.net [204.170.16.120]) by mail.enter.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA28442 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:20:02 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804260220.WAA28442@mail.enter.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:27:52 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Tweaker...& TBI/TPI Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199804242113.OAA14964@snowcrest.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I had e-mailed him a few months back, he told me if I could get a set of "cal docs" for my car he would write the software. Cal docs have the whole prom mapped out, they come from GM, he thought there may be a bootleg copy available somewhere on the net but I have not found it. Anyone else ever hear of a "Cal Doc"? > Has anyone seen this Tweaker software bu Mike Pitts... Pretty neat stuff. I > tried emailing Mike Pitts but his email address must have changed, has > anyone from the list asked him if he has any plans of creating a tweaker > for GM TBI/TPI?? I guess he and his associates found the table locations > for the turbo chips, they can probably find the table locations for other > chips! > > This is probably an old question but found no mention in the archives > > Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 23:12:22 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08358 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:12:22 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from snowcrest.net (mtshasta.snowcrest.net [207.201.33.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08354 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:12:18 -0400 Received: from default (ttyD6.redding.snowcrest.net [209.148.36.7]) by snowcrest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA02385 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 20:11:58 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804260311.UAA02385@snowcrest.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: Subject: Re: GME Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 20:19:10 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thank you thank you thank you.... now where's the TBI version... jk!!!! Ok Terry you've got bragging rights!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! From diy_efi-owner Sat Apr 25 23:39:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA08786 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:39:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo20.mx.aol.com (imo20.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.42]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA08780 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:39:50 -0400 Received: from JCsDOOR@aol.com by imo20.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8IVPa02427 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:34:50 +2000 (EDT) From: JCs DOOR Message-ID: <2a0985ac.3542ab5c@aol.com> Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:34:50 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Message from CSH, HQ.. PLEASE READ Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 40 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu bruce for all us dummys .how do you get incoming? thanks, jim From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 00:00:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA09061 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 00:00:53 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca (norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca [139.142.2.201]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA09057 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 00:00:52 -0400 Received: from scake-remote ([24.64.31.233]) by norquay.cal.shaw.wave.ca (Netscape Messaging Server 3.0) with SMTP id AAA14057 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 21:58:45 -0600 Message-ID: <3542B158.29B2@mail.cal.shaw.wave.ca> Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:00:24 -0600 From: "Shawn Cake" X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? References: <199804252111.RAA04648@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Will Honea wrote: > > OK, I've got an '86 Cimmeron with the 2.8 v-6. Mechanically, it has been great - 140k miles, still has > good compression, nice even idle, reasonably nimble considering. Tranny was gone thru (replaced the > lock-up switch - PITA!) and everything looked just fine - shop manager's comment was that it was > probably good for another 100k or so (grain of salt there). Injectors are clean, fuel system checks good and > NO LEAKS! I've got one huge problem with it that I hope someone can help with: > > It EATS ignition modules. I've used everything from the dealer's Delco to NAPA to AutoZone/Checker > (never will use another Wells part!). Computer dump shows no faults. Anybody got a clue as to what might > cause this? Replaced coil, position sensor, pickup coil, wires, just about everything. I'm real happy with > the engine, but this is about to drive me nuts! > > Will Honea > whonea@codenet.net Put an oscilloscope on the power supply leads to the ognition module. If you see some spikes or extreme levels of RFI .... there is your problem. From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 01:08:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA09855 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 01:08:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA09851 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 01:08:08 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe2-d86.foothill.net [209.76.43.86]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA20353 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:08:35 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: GME Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:06:50 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd70d1$1efb3fa0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Which what TBI. Send me a binary of the rom. GME's got more to it. TK -----Original Message----- From: Derek Jewett To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Saturday, April 25, 1998 8:33 PM Subject: Re: GME >Thank you thank you thank you.... now where's the TBI version... jk!!!! > >Ok Terry you've got bragging rights!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 01:13:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA09935 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 01:13:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA09931 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 01:13:26 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe2-d86.foothill.net [209.76.43.86]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA20750 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:13:56 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:12:11 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd70d1$de23b600$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu You know, I seem to remember something about a fix kit for alternate spikes. Good suggestion! You should check with the dealer too. -----Original Message----- From: Shawn Cake To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Saturday, April 25, 1998 9:44 PM Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? >Will Honea wrote: >> >> OK, I've got an '86 Cimmeron with the 2.8 v-6. Mechanically, it has been great - 140k miles, still has >> good compression, nice even idle, reasonably nimble considering. Tranny was gone thru (replaced the >> lock-up switch - PITA!) and everything looked just fine - shop manager's comment was that it was >> probably good for another 100k or so (grain of salt there). Injectors are clean, fuel system checks good and >> NO LEAKS! I've got one huge problem with it that I hope someone can help with: >> >> It EATS ignition modules. I've used everything from the dealer's Delco to NAPA to AutoZone/Checker >> (never will use another Wells part!). Computer dump shows no faults. Anybody got a clue as to what might >> cause this? Replaced coil, position sensor, pickup coil, wires, just about everything. I'm real happy with >> the engine, but this is about to drive me nuts! >> >> Will Honea >> whonea@codenet.net > > >Put an oscilloscope on the power supply leads to the ognition module. >If you see some spikes or extreme levels of RFI .... there is your >problem. > From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 01:46:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA10275 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 01:46:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA10271 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 01:46:24 -0400 Received: from terryk.foothill.net (tahoe2-d86.foothill.net [209.76.43.86]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA23132 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:46:51 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: GME LOCATION Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 22:45:06 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd70d6$7777e3e0$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu For all everyone... GME is at ftp://efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu/incoming/GMER.ZIP From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 01:47:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA10297 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 01:47:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA10293 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 01:47:56 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-014.mcn.net [208.26.146.14]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id XAA18964 for ; Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:47:53 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3542C77C.5E523D8@mcn.net> Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:34:53 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Tweaker...& TBI/TPI References: <199804260220.WAA28442@mail.enter.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu rbraun@mail.enter.net wrote: > > I had e-mailed him a few months back, he told me if I could get a set > of "cal docs" for my car he would write the software. Cal docs have > the whole prom mapped out, they come from GM, he thought there may be > a bootleg copy available somewhere on the net but I have not found > it. > Anyone else ever hear of a "Cal Doc"? > > > Has anyone seen this Tweaker software bu Mike Pitts... Pretty neat stuff. I > > tried emailing Mike Pitts but his email address must have changed, has > > anyone from the list asked him if he has any plans of creating a tweaker > > for GM TBI/TPI?? I guess he and his associates found the table locations > > for the turbo chips, they can probably find the table locations for other > > chips! > > > > This is probably an old question but found no mention in the archives > > > > > Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net > 91 GTA > 82 Firebird Do you have any idea what this looks like? If someone ran across one accidentally, how would they recognize it? Shannen From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 02:07:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA10808 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 02:07:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id CAA10804 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 02:07:10 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-014.mcn.net [208.26.146.14]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id AAA22246 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 00:07:08 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3542CC02.5DDA1951@mcn.net> Date: Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:54:10 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? References: <01bd70d1$de23b600$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Nothing in the service bulletins. Doesn't mean there isn't an updated part no which includes a fix. Shannen TBK wrote: > > You know, I seem to remember something about a fix kit for alternate spikes. > > Good suggestion! > > You should check with the dealer too. > -----Original Message----- > From: Shawn Cake > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Date: Saturday, April 25, 1998 9:44 PM > Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? > > >Will Honea wrote: > >> > >> OK, I've got an '86 Cimmeron with the 2.8 v-6. Mechanically, it has been > great - 140k miles, still has > >> good compression, nice even idle, reasonably nimble considering. Tranny > was gone thru (replaced the > >> lock-up switch - PITA!) and everything looked just fine - shop manager's > comment was that it was > >> probably good for another 100k or so (grain of salt there). Injectors > are clean, fuel system checks good and > >> NO LEAKS! I've got one huge problem with it that I hope someone can help > with: > >> > >> It EATS ignition modules. I've used everything from the dealer's Delco > to NAPA to AutoZone/Checker > >> (never will use another Wells part!). Computer dump shows no faults. > Anybody got a clue as to what might > >> cause this? Replaced coil, position sensor, pickup coil, wires, just > about everything. I'm real happy with > >> the engine, but this is about to drive me nuts! > >> > >> Will Honea > >> whonea@codenet.net > > > > > >Put an oscilloscope on the power supply leads to the ognition module. > >If you see some spikes or extreme levels of RFI .... there is your > >problem. > > From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 09:00:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA12503 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 09:00:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA12499 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 09:00:31 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-49.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.67]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id IAA16279 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 08:59:33 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Tweaker...& TBI/TPI Cal Doc Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 09:00:38 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd7113$4f761d20$43198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Tweaker...& TBI/TPI >rbraun@mail.enter.net wrote: >> >> I had e-mailed him a few months back, he told me if I could get a set >> of "cal docs" for my car he would write the software. Cal docs have >> the whole prom mapped out, they come from GM, he thought there may be >> a bootleg copy available somewhere on the net but I have not found >> it. >> Anyone else ever hear of a "Cal Doc"? >> Would probably look something like the treprom stuff over at the GN Ttype Site. >Do you have any idea what this looks like? If someone ran >across one accidentally, how would they recognize it? > >Shannen > It would be really long. Probably easy to identify once ya started reading it. Would probably mention all kinds of "weird stuff" like TCC enable coolant temp. EGR timing corrections, EGR fuel corrections, deccleration enleanments, If ya run into something like that immediately copy it, and forward me a copy, and I'll tell ya if it's worth saving, HOHOHAHA..... Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 10:44:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA13319 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:44:43 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.enter.net (root@mail.enter.net [204.170.70.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA13312 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:44:39 -0400 From: rbraun@mail.enter.net Received: from rbraun (m40atwn-3-42.enter.net [204.170.16.148]) by mail.enter.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA25136 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:44:29 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804261444.KAA25136@mail.enter.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:51:27 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Tweaker...& TBI/TPI Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3542C77C.5E523D8@mcn.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu No, unfortunately I do not. I'm guessing it would be a large text file. Do you have any idea what this looks like? If someone ran > across one accidentally, how would they recognize it? > Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 10:50:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA13402 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:50:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.enter.net (root@mail.enter.net [204.170.70.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA13398 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:50:06 -0400 From: rbraun@mail.enter.net Received: from rbraun (m40atwn-3-42.enter.net [204.170.16.148]) by mail.enter.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id KAA25915 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:49:59 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804261449.KAA25915@mail.enter.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:56:57 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Ign. modules WAS GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more re Priority: normal In-reply-to: <01bd70d1$de23b600$0a0101c0@terryk.foothill.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu My '82 with the Accel/dfi setup has melted 4 ign. mods, two were Accel units, melted the sticker right off the top of them, two were GM units, I now have a Standard motor products mod. in there with a heat sink under the mod on the bottom of the distributor. Suspected spikes from alternator, did the o-scope thing and found nothing. > >> > >> It EATS ignition modules. I've used everything from the dealer's Delco > to NAPA to AutoZone/Checker > >> (never will use another Wells part!). Computer dump shows no faults. > Anybody got a clue as to what might > >> cause this? Replaced coil, position sensor, pickup coil, wires, just > about everything. I'm real happy with > >> the engine, but this is about to drive me nuts! > >> > >> Will Honea > >> whonea@codenet.net > > > > > >Put an oscilloscope on the power supply leads to the ignition module. > >If you see some spikes or extreme levels of RFI .... there is your > >problem. > > > > > Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 11:25:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA14019 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 11:25:54 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from blackie.cruzers.com (cruzers.com [205.215.232.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA14015 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 11:25:51 -0400 Received: from 205.215.232.38 (surf38.cruzers.com [205.215.232.38]) by blackie.cruzers.com (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id IAA24427; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 08:28:05 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3543601E.E39@cruzers.com> Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 08:26:20 -0800 From: Ludis Langens X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01-C-MACOS8 (Macintosh; I; PPC) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Diy_efi Subject: Disassembly listings Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Participating in the current flurry of information postings, I've put three ECM+PROM disassemblies up on my web page. These are raw, uncommented disassemblies. They are the result of mostly mechanical (i.e. computer) processing. However, all the data tables/locations are formatted in a sensible manner. The real 'feature' is that for every instruction, the 6801 register contents are listed in a comment field. They are shown as if they were the source operand of a LDAA (or LDX) instruction. The "N register" is really the N flag. The listed contents are the values _before_ the instruction executes. If the contents are unknown, or there were too many possible values, this is indicated with a ? character. If a register is not listed, then it is not used in this or a subsequent instruction (until it gets loaded with a fresh value.) Subroutines that don't modify a particular register are a slight exception to this rule - the register might be used by the caller. These disassemblies have been run back through an assembler, and they assembled to the correct ROM image. I'm actually using a 680x0 assembler with macros handling the 6800/68HC11 mnemonics. I've had to change the syntax slightly - it isn't exactly Motorola 68xx standard. One of the disassemblies is for the 1227747 truck TBI ECM. The others are two variants for the 1226867 2.0 L4 TBI ECM. Here's the URL: http://www.cruzers.com/~ludis/disasm.html Paraphrasing from Terry Kelley: I don't work for GM, I don't want to work for GM, and GM didn't help me. unsigned long BinToBCD(unsigned long i) {unsigned long t; Ludis Langens return i ? (t = BinToBCD(i >> 1), (t << 1) + (i & 1) + ludis@cruzers.com (t + 858993459 >> 2 & 572662306) * 3) : 0;} From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 11:59:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA14497 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 11:59:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.enter.net (root@mail.enter.net [204.170.70.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA14492 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 11:59:02 -0400 From: rbraun@mail.enter.net Received: from rbraun (m48flex-1-10.enter.net [204.170.16.68]) by mail.enter.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA07372 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 11:58:52 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804261558.LAA07372@mail.enter.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 12:05:51 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: GME program Priority: normal X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I love it, How do I get a version for my '91 GTA, Terry forgot his e-mail address, he requests bug reports, but I see no way to contact him. I'm well versed in Calmap programming so I should be able to help him do beta testing of his program. Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 13:08:40 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA15394 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 13:08:40 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from snowcrest.net (mtshasta.snowcrest.net [207.201.33.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA15390 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 13:08:36 -0400 Received: from default (ttyD16.redding.snowcrest.net [209.148.36.23]) by snowcrest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA09215 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:08:36 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804261708.KAA09215@snowcrest.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: Subject: Re: GME Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:15:48 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does anyone have a STOCK ROM BIN image of the 747 ECM... 89-90 range to send to TBK..? I do not yet have a 747 ECM Thanks From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 13:59:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA15817 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 13:59:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from deliverator.sgi.com (deliverator.sgi.com [204.94.214.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA15813 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 13:59:32 -0400 Received: from rtrman.engr.sgi.com (rtrman.engr.sgi.com [150.166.97.164]) by deliverator.sgi.com (980309.SGI.8.8.8-aspam-6.2/980310.SGI-aspam) via SMTP id KAA17722 for <@external-mail-relay.sgi.com:diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu>; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:58:52 -0700 (PDT) mail_from (gervais@rtrman.engr.sgi.com) Received: (from gervais@localhost) by rtrman.engr.sgi.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/960327.SGI.AUTOCF) id KAA07384 for diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:57:41 -0700 Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 10:57:41 -0700 From: gervais@rtrman.engr.sgi.com (Joe Gervais) Message-Id: <9804261057.ZM7382@rtrman.engr.sgi.com> X-Mailer: Z-Mail-SGI (3.2S.3 08feb96 MediaMail) To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: LT1 16159278 ECM Pinouts ? Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm trying to get a LT1 running in my 1961 corvette, and have had several rounds of PROMs that have had VATS disabled that really didn't. I'm now running a 93 Camaro PROM, but don't know which pin on the ECM needs the 30hz signal. I have the helm manual for the donor car, a 93 Corvette, but as many of you know, it is more challenging, since it's VATS exchange requires a password exchange over the serial interface between the ECM and CCM to enable the injectors, henve my backing off to the f-body code. If anyone out there has the 93 f-body ECM signal table and could email me with the pin the 30hz signal is expected on, I'd appreciate it. Joe -- _________________________________________________________________________ Joe Gervais gervais@sgi.com Product Manager (650) 933-7479 voice High Performance Networking (650) 964-0811 fax Silicon Graphics www.sgi.com 2011 North Shoreline Blvd, Mail Stop 08L-855, Mountain View, CA 94043-1389 From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 14:44:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA16241 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 14:44:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from UPIMSSMTPUSR02 (smtp.email.msn.com [207.68.143.138]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA16235 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 14:44:06 -0400 Received: from default - 208.254.109.129 by email.msn.com with Microsoft SMTPSVC; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 11:43:57 -0700 Message-ID: <000c01bd7143$2a780c60$816dfed0@default> From: "H. J. Zivnak" To: Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 11:43:10 -0700 X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Another good source of spikes is the A/C clutch. Look for a shorted clamping diode (should be taped to the clutch harness. -----Original Message----- From: Shannen Durphey To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sunday, April 26, 1998 12:07 AM Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? >Nothing in the service bulletins. Doesn't mean there isn't >an updated part no which includes a fix. > >Shannen > >TBK wrote: >> >> You know, I seem to remember something about a fix kit for alternate spikes. >> >> Good suggestion! >> >> You should check with the dealer too. >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Shawn Cake >> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >> Date: Saturday, April 25, 1998 9:44 PM >> Subject: Re: GM 2.8 V6 vs 2.0 4 banger,witch one is more reliable ?? >> >> >Will Honea wrote: >> >> >> >> OK, I've got an '86 Cimmeron with the 2.8 v-6. Mechanically, it has been >> great - 140k miles, still has >> >> good compression, nice even idle, reasonably nimble considering. Tranny >> was gone thru (replaced the >> >> lock-up switch - PITA!) and everything looked just fine - shop manager's >> comment was that it was >> >> probably good for another 100k or so (grain of salt there). Injectors >> are clean, fuel system checks good and >> >> NO LEAKS! I've got one huge problem with it that I hope someone can help >> with: >> >> >> >> It EATS ignition modules. I've used everything from the dealer's Delco >> to NAPA to AutoZone/Checker >> >> (never will use another Wells part!). Computer dump shows no faults. >> Anybody got a clue as to what might >> >> cause this? Replaced coil, position sensor, pickup coil, wires, just >> about everything. I'm real happy with >> >> the engine, but this is about to drive me nuts! >> >> >> >> Will Honea >> >> whonea@codenet.net >> > >> > >> >Put an oscilloscope on the power supply leads to the ognition module. >> >If you see some spikes or extreme levels of RFI .... there is your >> >problem. >> > From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 14:55:55 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA16426 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 14:55:55 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from m28.boston.juno.com (m28.boston.juno.com [205.231.101.186]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA16422 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 14:55:52 -0400 Received: (from cosmic.ray@juno.com) by m28.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id NfM00431; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 13:24:45 EDT To: Gregory_Tellone@sandata.com, fsj-list@unix.off-road.com, fsj@digest.net, diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 12:09:11 -0400 Subject: Re: [FSJ-List] Output of distributer's magnetic pickup Message-ID: <19980426.132407.14014.0.Cosmic.Ray@juno.com> References: <852565F2.00138A3C.00@net.sandata.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 1-2,7-8,10-11,19-20,26-27,35-138 From: cosmic.ray@juno.com (Raymond C Drouillard) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm sending this to the list because someone else might be interested in this info. The advantage of the Howell system is that they use a standard GM computer, so you can get a replacement at your local parts store or junkyard. Both seem to use standard sensors and stuff like that. According to an article I read, the Howell and Holley systems use the same throttle body. The main advantage to the Holley systems is that you can program them yourself. If you are planning on installing the fuel injection system on to your engine and plan on leaving it alone, the Howell system will work fine. You tell them what you have, and what modifications you have made, and they burn a PROM for you. If you make any changes (new manifold, bumpier cam, headers, or whatever), you tell them what you did and they burn you a new PROM - for a price ($100.00, I believe). What they do is to calculate the (theoretically) what your fuel map should be, and burn the PROM based on that. I understand that it is pretty accurate. With the Holley system, you have lots of room for tweaking. Also, if you buy something off-the-wall, like a Wieland manifold or custom headers, you can program it to suit. If you port the heads, you can change the program on the Holley, but you would have to describe what you did for the Howell system. You program it by making changes and looking at how the performance changes, rather than calculating some theoretical map. You can program any of the systems with five controls (low jet, idle trim, main jet, hith-rpm jet, accel pump, and choke). This will allow you to set up your engine for economy, performance, or anywhere in between. If you go with Holley Pro-Jection 4Di, you control the fuel tables directly. This allows you to set the cruise part of the map for economy, and set the wide-open-throttle portion for performance. Also, you can control spark advance - if you hook it up right. I'll give you more details on that when I finish that part. Ray Drouillard On Sat, 25 Apr 1998 23:33:25 -0400 Gregory_Tellone@sandata.com writes: > >Hey Ray, > >I'm going to buy the TBI fuel injection on Monday..for my 89 Gw.. I'm >looking at one made by Howell >http://www.howell-efi.com/tbikits.html and I'm looking at two by >Holley >http://www.holley.com/HiOctn/ProdLine/FuelInj/Comp/504-23.html >or >http://www.holley.com/HiOctn/ProdLine/FuelInj/Comp/504-22.html > >Which one you think is better for street/4wd use.. or if you know of a >better one.. >Both of these will fit on an Edlebrock performer 4bbl manifold. > >Thanks! > > > > >To: Gregory Tellone/Sandata >cc: >Subject: Re: [FSJ-List] Output of distributer's magnetic pickup > > > > > >On Tue, 14 Apr 1998 11:17:03 -0400 Gregory_Tellone@sandata.com writes: >> >>Hey Ray, >> >>Wanted to know if you put the 4Di in yet.. and how you like it.. I >saw a >>good write up on it in Peterson's 4wd.. How much did you get the >setup >for? >>You had to get a new manifold also.. right? what did you get for >that? >> >>Thanks! > >I have had the 4Di system installed for quite some time. I had the >engine rebuilt last September and ran it with the stock carb (and an >adapter plate that my brother turned out for me on the NC machine) >'till >January. When I had it rebuilt, I had them bump up the compression >and >install an RV cam. I also supplied them with an Edelbrock Performer >manifold. > >I put the 4Di system in January, but couldn't get it to talk to the >computer. I found that it cruises just fine without being programmed, >however. The O2 sensor corrects the mixture after a few tenths of a >second. > >I think I paid about $1300 for the system from Summit Racing. Of >course, >there are other exterraneous expenses, such as the installation of the >O2 >sensor boss. Also, the laptop I bought was around $400.00. > >I kept up a running commentary on the new FSJ list as I was tuning the >system (fsj@digest.net). I sent a summary to the other FSJ list >(fsj-list@unix.off-road.com), and Doc put it in the tech section of >one >of the FSJ lists. > >I cross-posted the question to three different lists. Which list are >you >subscribed to? Do you need more info about where to read about the >installation and tuning of the system? Eventually, I am going to send >all of the text and some pictures that I took to John Meister so that >he >can format them into an HTML file and put them on his web site. > >By the way, my Jeep is still "work in progress". So far, I have: >AMC 360 >Holley Pro-Jection 4Di >Edelbrock Performer manifold >RV cam >3" exhaust system >Engine Guard pre-luber >30X9.5 mud/snow tires > >Ray Drouillard > >_____________________________________________________________________ >You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. >Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com >Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] > > > > > > _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 15:32:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA16850 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 15:32:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (ns1.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA16844 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 15:32:55 -0400 Received: from terryk (tahoe-d34.foothill.net [209.76.43.34]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id MAA12217 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 12:33:23 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: GME program Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 12:31:40 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd7149$ef7f71a0$222b4cd1@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu My email is terryk@foothill.net -----Original Message----- From: rbraun@mail.enter.net To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Sunday, April 26, 1998 9:39 AM Subject: GME program I love it, How do I get a version for my '91 GTA, Terry forgot his e-mail address, he requests bug reports, but I see no way to contact him. I'm well versed in Calmap programming so I should be able to help him do beta testing of his program. Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 18:04:55 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA18103 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 18:04:55 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.snip.net ([208.211.64.8]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA18099 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 18:04:52 -0400 Received: from pdatcuk ([208.211.79.10]) by mail.snip.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) ID# 103-45128U8000L3500S0) with SMTP id AAA457 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 18:05:00 -0400 From: "Pete Datcuk" To: "EFI List" Subject: Northstar ECM Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 18:05:09 -0500 Message-ID: <000001bd7167$c35a7f20$0a4fd3d0@pdatcuk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I am hoping someone can help me. I am working on swapping a Caddy Northstar from a '95 Eldorado into a Fiero. I have the factory service manuals for the engine, and from what I have gathered, the ECM communicates with the other computers/modules(i.e. ABS, antislip, etc) through a common serial link. Since I am not including these various modules, I am wondering how the ECM is going to react by them not being there. Am I going to need to provide some signal to the computer to fool it, or is there a way to deactivate the serial connection. Thanks, Pete Datcuk Mechanical Engineer Sewell, NJ '87 Fiero, some day to be Northstar'ed :-) '67 Jeep Commando, to be risen from the dead ;-) From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 19:52:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA19066 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 19:52:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net (eagle.ptialaska.net [198.70.245.243]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA19062 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 19:52:40 -0400 Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net by eagle.ptialaska.net (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id PAA25655; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 15:51:08 -0800 Message-ID: <3543C906.316B8377@eagle.ptialaska.net> Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 15:53:43 -0800 From: Webb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Northstar ECM References: <000001bd7167$c35a7f20$0a4fd3d0@pdatcuk> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Is this OBD-2 or something newer. I understand that there is a jumper (or something) spec'd in obd2 that disables the communications- supposedly for test purposes. Anybody know more??? Pete Datcuk wrote: > I am hoping someone can help me. I am working on swapping a Caddy > Northstar from a '95 Eldorado into a Fiero. I have the factory service > manuals for the engine, and from what I have gathered, the ECM communicates > with the other computers/modules(i.e. ABS, antislip, etc) through a common > serial link. Since I am not including these various modules, I am wondering > how the ECM is going to react by them not being there. Am I going to need > to provide some signal to the computer to fool it, or is there a way to > deactivate the serial connection. > > Thanks, > Pete Datcuk > Mechanical Engineer > Sewell, NJ > '87 Fiero, some day to be Northstar'ed :-) > '67 Jeep Commando, to be risen from the dead ;-) From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 21:57:27 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA19923 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 21:57:27 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA19919 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 21:57:24 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-2.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.20]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id VAA02201 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 21:56:27 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Northstar ECM Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 21:57:33 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd717f$d8291c00$14198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Pete Datcuk To: EFI List Date: Sunday, April 26, 1998 6:51 PM Subject: Northstar ECM > I am hoping someone can help me. I am working on swapping a Caddy >Northstar from a '95 Eldorado into a Fiero. I have the factory service >manuals for the engine, and from what I have gathered, the ECM communicates >with the other computers/modules(i.e. ABS, antislip, etc) through a common >serial link. Since I am not including these various modules, I am wondering >how the ECM is going to react by them not being there. Am I going to need >to provide some signal to the computer to fool it, or is there a way to >deactivate the serial connection. > >Thanks, >Pete Datcuk >Mechanical Engineer >Sewell, NJ >'87 Fiero, some day to be Northstar'ed :-) >'67 Jeep Commando, to be risen from the dead ;-) > As it was explained to me (pulling pin on fire extingusher), it's called a bus line. When one device wanted to talk to another, it would ground the line to interupt, and then transmit what it needed to say. The devices didn't "expect" to hear each other just talk to each other, when needed.. Course this was a vocational class explaination for motor heads. Cheers Bruce Was mowing the yard today, and found a car.. Funny things can happen when ya wear your Cone Shaped Hat when doing chores.. From diy_efi-owner Sun Apr 26 23:11:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA20549 for diy_efi-outgoing; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 23:11:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sgi.sgi.com (SGI.COM [192.48.153.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA20545 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 23:11:03 -0400 Received: from rtrman.engr.sgi.com ([150.166.97.164]) by sgi.sgi.com (980309.SGI.8.8.8-aspam-6.2/980304.SGI-aspam) via SMTP id UAA02326; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 20:11:03 -0700 (PDT) mail_from (gervais@rtrman.engr.sgi.com) Received: (from gervais@localhost) by rtrman.engr.sgi.com (950413.SGI.8.6.12/960327.SGI.AUTOCF) id UAA08075; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 20:07:32 -0700 Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 20:07:32 -0700 From: gervais@rtrman.engr.sgi.com (Joe Gervais) Message-Id: <9804262007.ZM8073@rtrman.engr.sgi.com> X-Mailer: Z-Mail-SGI (3.2S.3 08feb96 MediaMail) To: ba-f-body@f-body.org, diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: LT1 Runs Finally - No more DTC 46 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thanks to the help on these two lists, I got the 93 LT1 motor in my 61 Vette running today. The prom images with no vats apparently didn't have VATS disabled properly, because the injectors didn't stay running. Knowing that the Fbody has an easily defeatable VATS, I got the proper input for the ECM from Scot on the DIY_EFI list, and built a $5 timer circuit using a 555 IC to bypass the thing. I should have done this a couple of months ago, but oh well. Now the race is on. There's the GG Summer Get Together in 4 weeks. I may need a body dropapaloosa at my house in a couple of weeks to make the show. The car will certainly be on the road by July. I taped the motor, so I'll have an audio file up on reality in a day or two. I'll have to see how it is with tailpipes, but right now, the bare chassis with the straight 2.5" exhaust and 3 chamber Flowmasters is bordering on too loud, although it is a good tone. Given I didn't roll the chassis into the driveway, and had the sound bouncing off the back wall of the garage didn't help. My kids came running from the park a good 1/8 mile away, so it's got audible punch. VATS bypass details For 93 FBody, ECM 16159278, terminal A19 on the ECM needs a 30 Hz signal, 50% duty cycle. For 94 and possibly 95 with PCM 16188051 terminal A25 on the PCM needs a 50 Hz signal. Alan wrote "In my 94 Helms, it sez terminal A25 on PCM. The name of the wire going to this terminal is 229 DK BLU - it may be on your harness. If 40-60Hz is not present on this terminal, engine will stall after 1.7 seconds.", which is exactly what was happening on my motor. -- _________________________________________________________________________ Joe Gervais gervais@sgi.com Product Manager (650) 933-7479 voice High Performance Networking (650) 964-0811 fax Silicon Graphics www.sgi.com 2011 North Shoreline Blvd, Mail Stop 08L-855, Mountain View, CA 94043-1389 From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 00:23:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA21191 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 00:23:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mailhub1.ncal.verio.com (mailhub1.ncal.verio.com [204.247.247.38]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA21187 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 00:23:20 -0400 Received: from kincy.com (oak-alg-gw1-31.ncal.verio.com [207.21.137.222]) by mailhub1.ncal.verio.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA21771; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 21:23:17 -0700 (PDT) Message-ID: <3543FA8C.6910E2AB@kincy.com> Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 23:25:01 -0400 From: "Wm. Perry Kincy, CLU, ChFC" X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.05 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: ba-f-body@f-body.org CC: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: [ba] LT1 Runs Finally - No more DTC 46 References: <9804262007.ZM8073@rtrman.engr.sgi.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Name the weekend for the Body Installapalooza as soon as possible so schedules can be reworked. Perry Joe Gervais wrote: > Thanks to the help on these two lists, I got the 93 LT1 motor in my 61 Vette > running today. The prom images with no vats apparently didn't have VATS > disabled properly, because the injectors didn't stay running. > > Knowing that the Fbody has an easily defeatable VATS, I got the proper input > for the ECM from Scot on the DIY_EFI list, and built a $5 timer circuit using a > 555 IC to bypass the thing. I should have done this a couple of months ago, but > oh well. > > Now the race is on. There's the GG Summer Get Together in 4 weeks. I may need a > body dropapaloosa at my house in a couple of weeks to make the show. The car > will certainly be on the road by July. > > I taped the motor, so I'll have an audio file up on reality in a day or two. > I'll have to see how it is with tailpipes, but right now, the bare chassis > with the straight 2.5" exhaust and 3 chamber Flowmasters is bordering on too > loud, although it is a good tone. Given I didn't roll the chassis into the > driveway, and had the sound bouncing off the back wall of the garage didn't > help. My kids came running from the park a good 1/8 mile away, so it's got > audible punch. > > VATS bypass details > > For 93 FBody, ECM 16159278, terminal A19 on the ECM needs a 30 Hz signal, 50% > duty cycle. > > For 94 and possibly 95 with PCM 16188051 terminal A25 on the PCM needs a 50 Hz > signal. > > Alan wrote "In my 94 Helms, it sez terminal A25 on PCM. The name of the wire > going to this terminal is 229 DK BLU - it may be on your harness. If 40-60Hz is > not present on this terminal, engine will stall after 1.7 seconds.", which is > exactly what was happening on my motor. > > -- > _________________________________________________________________________ > Joe Gervais gervais@sgi.com > Product Manager (650) 933-7479 voice > High Performance Networking (650) 964-0811 fax > Silicon Graphics www.sgi.com > > 2011 North Shoreline Blvd, Mail Stop 08L-855, Mountain View, CA 94043-1389 From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 01:17:08 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA21698 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 01:17:08 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail2.deltanet.com (mail2.deltanet.com [199.171.190.56]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA21694 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 01:17:05 -0400 Received: from my_screamer (anx-arl0040.deltanet.com [205.230.216.40]) by mail2.deltanet.com (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id WAA19985 for ; Sun, 26 Apr 1998 22:17:03 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804270517.WAA19985@mail2.deltanet.com> X-Sender: yorker@mail.deltanet.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Sun, 26 Apr 1998 22:16:34 +0100 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Robert Yorke Subject: Re: GM Bins/ecm Q's In-Reply-To: <01bd6a13$4cc454e0$5b198fd1@nacelp> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Here's a site that will provide some quite interesting information on GM Australian ECMs and what the Australians are doing about reprogramming 'em, on the fly. They've advised me that they'd like very much to enter the American market also...: FWIW At 11:12 AM 4/17/1998 -0400, you wrote: >On the flash prom pcm's is that all 1024 file lenght stuff?. Would >any one happen to have a bin of one that I could see?. > >Also, if anyone has any 256, and 512 file lenght bins I'd like to see >some of them. I'm working on figuring out how the aussie ecms >compare to ours. It would also be neat if you included the >application (engine size/no. cyl/tranny type/year/model, and best >yet a Broadcast code). > >No worries mate >Bruce > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 09:26:01 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA24009 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 09:26:01 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from bert.acesag.auburn.edu (bert.acesag.auburn.edu [131.204.46.47]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA24005 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 09:25:58 -0400 Received: from bert (bert [131.204.46.47]) by bert.acesag.auburn.edu (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA16225 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 08:25:57 -0500 (CDT) Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 08:25:57 -0500 (CDT) From: "Gregory A. Parmer" X-Sender: gparmer@bert To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: GME In-Reply-To: <199804261708.KAA09215@snowcrest.net> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu On Sun, 26 Apr 1998, Derek Jewett wrote: > Does anyone have a STOCK ROM BIN image of the 747 ECM... 89-90 range to > send to TBK..? I do not yet have a 747 ECM I've got the eprom and my programmer should be here this week. I'd be glad to post the contents as soon as I get the other pieces of the puzzle. -greg From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 09:32:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA24091 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 09:32:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.enter.net (root@mail.enter.net [204.170.70.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA24086 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 09:31:54 -0400 From: rbraun@mail.enter.net Received: from rbraun (m40atwn-1-41.enter.net [204.170.16.51]) by mail.enter.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id JAA22231 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 09:31:54 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804271331.JAA22231@mail.enter.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 09:38:57 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: GME Priority: normal In-reply-to: <199804261708.KAA09215@snowcrest.net> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu how about an '89 Astro van, 4.3L V6? > Does anyone have a STOCK ROM BIN image of the 747 ECM... 89-90 range to > send to TBK..? I do not yet have a 747 ECM > > Thanks > > Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 09:56:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA24441 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 09:56:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA24437 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 09:56:26 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-40.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.58]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id JAA23141 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 09:55:30 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Programming 101 Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 09:56:35 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd71e4$4af69c80$3a198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu If you have not read the past 101 installments, please do so now. This is for educational purposes. Changing the calibrations of your ecm may violate the laws in your area. If you attempt recalibrations, serious engine damage may result. Please read past posts about tune up procedures, when attempting recalibrations. These matters should be done under adult supervision. Again this is in general for gm ecms, and most specically the 1227747.. Were going to talk/write/read some today on the matter of malfunctions flags. They are the self diagnostics the ecm does, and then reports to you when in diagnostic mode. When you short the ALDL two diagnostic pins together the SES light flashes a code at you, 12 plus what ever the malfunction is, if any. If you need to understand the codes, there are numerous articles, and books covering that issue, and should be used for understanding say a code 21. The purpose of this article is turning on+off these reports of self diagnostics. Notice I say reports. Some of the self diagnostics will still run, but not be reported as an error, or result in the ecm going into limp home mode. That has also been covered in the archives, about which ones run, or not.. Now, these malfunction flag addresses use a combination of Hex, Dec, and Binary.. In brief these are different ways of counting, and the following is a conversion for them Dec Hex Bin 0 0 0000 1 1 0001 2 2 0010 3 3 0011 4 4 0100 5 5 0101 6 6 0110 7 7 0111 8 8 1000 9 9 1001 10 A 1010 11 B 1011 12 C 1100 13 D 1101 14 E 1110 15 F 1111 Now again refering to prior post addresses in a hex editor of a prom look something like 00 01 02 03 04 05 0000 AA 03 FF FA FD 02 This is a very abbreviated corner of on the columns across the top would read to 0F, and the rows would go from 0000 to 0FFF. Now we could read those addresses as binary, the 0002 would look like 1111 1111 0003 would be 1111 1100 0004 would be 1111 1101 Now if we wanted to say 1 represented yes, and 0 would be no, we could tell the computer that.. Now say we had 24 malfunction codes. We could list them as 12,13,14,15,16,17,18,19,20,21,22,23,24,25, and so on.. So address 0002 could mean malfunction codes 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19 and then the 1+0's could mean yes and no. So looking at FF meaning 1111 1111 we would have 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes meaning all the malfuntion flags at 0002 are enabled, and working. If we go to 0003 we get 1111 1100 that would correspond to 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 and have the meaning of yes yes yes yes yes yes no no So malfunction flags 20,21,22,23,24,25, would be enabled and 26+27 disabled.. Now, on some ecms they use different codes, and skip numbers, so it gets to be challenging to line up which codes are used, and which ones are enable, or disabled. But, in the 747 they are at 050D-050F, and 3 words (addresses) long. On other ecms they may be 3-4-or even 5 words long, and probably longer than that on some of the newer stuff. But, on the 747 all ya haveta do is try turning them on+off, and all of sudden by using the SES/scanner, and causing a known malfunction you can figure out which 0+1 enables, disables, what malfunction flag... Again please don't quote the whole posting in reply, just what is is doubt or wrong, or you have a difference in a opinion with. I am not a EE, ME, or anything like that, so the above is how I understand things, and make no guarantee that it is absolutely correct it has worked for me, and your results, may vary. If you have any comments please e-mail me, and I'll review, what ya say, and see if in fact I did error (again).. Bruce nacelp@bright.net This message originated at Cone Shaped Hat World Headquarters If you have not downloaded Terry's gmer.zip, and what Ludis posted yesterday, you need to read yesterday's postings in the archives, and do that now. If you have any information about the 747 tables/switches, I'd really appreciate hearing about them, or would you post that information. If ya haveta read the above a couple hundred times to get it don't feel bad, I did it more than that to get it...... From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 10:25:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA24959 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 10:25:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from snowcrest.net (mtshasta.snowcrest.net [207.201.33.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA24954 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 10:25:32 -0400 Received: from default (ttyD9.redding.snowcrest.net [209.148.36.10]) by snowcrest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA26571 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 07:25:31 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804271425.HAA26571@snowcrest.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: Subject: Re: GME Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 07:32:48 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Dat outta work!!!! From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 12:20:44 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA26573 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 12:20:44 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA26569 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 12:20:42 -0400 Received: from pclab13.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab13.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.113]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id CAA24800 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 02:20:40 +1000 (EST) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 02:20:40 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804271620.CAA24800@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: Power supply X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does anyone have any design of a power supply that can power a PC motherboard from the 12 volt battery? I would like to experiment with running an EFI system from an in car PC. From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 14:24:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA28151 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 14:24:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from snowcrest.net (mtshasta.snowcrest.net [207.201.33.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA28146 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 14:24:05 -0400 Received: from ws2436 (ppp23.snowcrest.net [207.201.18.23]) by snowcrest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id LAA04533 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 11:24:04 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804271824.LAA04533@snowcrest.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: Subject: Re: Power supply Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 11:24:33 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have been working on something simular to what you're doing... and so far all I have thought of is using an LM317 voltage regulator that regulates the voltage, and using a 7805 regulator to split off a +5v supply... But you still need a -5v supply along with ground to make it work.. ---------- > From: Danny Barrett > To: DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Power supply > Date: Monday, April 27, 1998 9:20 AM > > Does anyone have any design of a power supply that can power a PC > motherboard from the 12 volt battery? I would like to experiment with > running an EFI system from an in car PC. From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 15:26:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA29157 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 15:26:20 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mffvlexc1.mccain.ca ([198.164.100.100]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA29153 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 15:26:16 -0400 Received: by mffvlexc1 with Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) id ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 16:27:08 -0300 Message-ID: From: "BUTLER, Tom" To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Power supply Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 16:27:07 -0300 MIME-Version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Internet Mail Service (5.5.1960.3) Content-Type: text/plain Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I believe it would be simplest...and probably cheaper (maybe more reliable and safer) to purchase a 12VDC powered 120VAC inverter with enough capacity to run your PC. It would probably run less than 100 bucks. > -----Original Message----- > From: Derek Jewett [SMTP:djewett@snowcrest.net] > Sent: Monday, April 27, 1998 3:25 PM > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Re: Power supply > > I have been working on something simular to what you're doing... and > so far > all I have thought of is using an LM317 voltage regulator that > regulates > the voltage, and using a 7805 regulator to split off a +5v supply... > But > you still need a -5v supply along with ground to make it work.. > > ---------- > > From: Danny Barrett > > To: DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > Subject: Power supply > > Date: Monday, April 27, 1998 9:20 AM > > > > Does anyone have any design of a power supply that can power a PC > > motherboard from the 12 volt battery? I would like to experiment > with > > running an EFI system from an in car PC. From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 16:17:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA29791 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 16:17:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from scarlet.buffalostate.edu (dave@scarlet2.buffalostate.edu [136.183.135.41]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA29786 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 16:17:25 -0400 Received: from localhost (dave@localhost) by scarlet.buffalostate.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id QAA13415 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 16:17:19 -0400 Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 16:17:19 -0400 (EDT) From: "Dave J. Andruczyk" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Power supply In-Reply-To: <199804271620.CAA24800@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Does anyone have any design of a power supply that can power a PC > motherboard from the 12 volt battery? I would like to experiment with > running an EFI system from an in car PC. well the round about way is to use a 12V to 120 V inverter then plug your 'puter into that. only prob is that some cheapo inverters output a rough waveform that is not so friendly to computer switching power supplies.. dave From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 16:55:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id QAA30608 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 16:55:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id QAA30604 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 16:55:37 -0400 Received: from bullwinkle (du170-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.5.170]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id NAA14647 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 13:55:35 -0700 Message-Id: <199804272055.NAA14647@mail.wgn.net> X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 13:58:36 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Subject: Re: Power supply In-Reply-To: <199804271620.CAA24800@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Here we go again... First off, bad idea, read the archives, some will dissagree. A really easy way, however, is to get a $100 power inverter that most electronic houses have. That will do the job if you are using a regular chassis type of supply. If you are going to strip out the motherboard, you will need to come up with +5, +-12 for the serial ports. Not too dificult, but some hard drives, etc need 12v clean, and that is difficult to get with a simple car regulator. Again, for the amount of time, and money you will spend, just go out and get one of the $99 dollar 68hc11/805x boards and the free compilers and go to town. I also have seen some v30/40 8086 boards that are in the low 100 dollar range that use all the pc programming tools and run off of 5v only. Check the electronic mags and the web for them, a ton of them out their. Sandy At 02:20 AM 4/28/98 +1000, you wrote: >Does anyone have any design of a power supply that can power a PC >motherboard from the 12 volt battery? I would like to experiment with >running an EFI system from an in car PC. > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 18:26:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA32147 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:26:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.snip.net ([208.211.64.8]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA32142 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:26:55 -0400 Received: from pdatcuk ([208.211.79.126]) by mail.snip.net (Post.Office MTA v3.1.2 release (PO205-101c) ID# 103-45128U8000L3500S0) with SMTP id AAA142 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:27:07 -0400 From: "Pete Datcuk" To: Subject: RE: Northstar ECM Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:27:18 -0500 Message-ID: <000001bd7234$055711a0$7e4fd3d0@pdatcuk> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal In-Reply-To: <3543C906.316B8377@eagle.ptialaska.net> X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu No it is not OBD2. Unfortunately I have the service manuals packed away right now (moving), but when I get them out I will copy the factory explanation. Thanks, Pete Datcuk Mechanical Engineer Sewell, NJ '87 Fiero, some day to be Northstar'ed :-) Quite a few credits away from that cone shaped hat.... > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > [mailto:owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu]On Behalf Of Webb > Sent: Sunday, April 26, 1998 6:54 PM > To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > Subject: Re: Northstar ECM > > > Is this OBD-2 or something newer. I understand that there is a jumper (or > something) spec'd in obd2 that disables the communications- > supposedly for test > purposes. From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 19:20:02 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA00252 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 19:20:02 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA00247 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 19:19:58 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp21.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.151]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id SAA23631 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:20:07 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <35451091.1214F976@mwt.net> Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:11:14 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Power supply X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <199804271620.CAA24800@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I picked up a 9 to 14v to Pc Power Switcher supply ~ 50 watts or so for around $50.00 or so, has PC connectors on it plug and play . If you want more information I'll dig up . It will run a PC and a floppy drive a low power HD . I'm also running VGA color LCD screen with video card and keypad decoder board that replaces standard keyboard. Hope this is what you are looking for. Steve Danny Barrett wrote: > Does anyone have any design of a power supply that can power a PC > motherboard from the 12 volt battery? I would like to experiment with > running an EFI system from an in car PC. From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 19:42:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA00553 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 19:42:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ingenico.com.au ([203.10.64.225]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA00546 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 19:41:44 -0400 Received: from wally [10.10.10.34] by ingenico.com.au [10.10.10.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP0.R) for ; Tue, 28 Apr 98 09:42:09 +1000 Received: by wally with Microsoft Mail id <01BD7287.7BAC9020@wally>; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 09:24:45 +1000 Message-ID: <01BD7287.7BAC9020@wally> From: Peter Jaramaz To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Power supply Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 09:22:36 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD7287.7BAC9020" X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD7287.7BAC9020 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable Some of the larger semiconductor/electronics supply shops carry small = black box power inverters. Usually about the size of a pack of = cigarettes they accept 12V and supply +/- 5, 9, 12, 15 etc depending on = configuration. They are usually quite well filtered, if not a couple of = caps and chokes....... In aus about $50-100 for a decent current version. Otherwise, a 12->240 inverter, but these can be very noisy and the added = weight of the inverter and PC power supply. Peter ---------- From: Danny Barrett Sent: Tuesday, 28 April 1998 2:20 To: DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Power supply Does anyone have any design of a power supply that can power a PC motherboard from the 12 volt battery? I would like to experiment with running an EFI system from an in car PC. ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD7287.7BAC9020 Content-Type: application/ms-tnef Content-Transfer-Encoding: base64 eJ8+Ii0XAQaQCAAEAAAAAAABAAEAAQeQBgAIAAAA5AQAAAAAAADoAAEIgAcAGAAAAElQTS5NaWNy b3NvZnQgTWFpbC5Ob3RlADEIAQ2ABAACAAAAAgACAAEEkAYAYAEAAAEAAAAMAAAAAwAAMAIAAAAL AA8OAAAAAAIB/w8BAAAAYQAAAAAAAACBKx+kvqMQGZ1uAN0BD1QCAAAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMy LmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQBTTVRQAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5vaGlvLXN0YXRlLmVk dQAAAAAeAAIwAQAAAAUAAABTTVRQAAAAAB4AAzABAAAAIgAAAGRpeV9lZmlAZWZpMzMyLmVuZy5v aGlvLXN0YXRlLmVkdQAAAAMAFQwBAAAAAwD+DwYAAAAeAAEwAQAAACQAAAAnZGl5X2VmaUBlZmkz MzIuZW5nLm9oaW8tc3RhdGUuZWR1JwACAQswAQAAACcAAABTTVRQOkRJWV9FRklARUZJMzMyLkVO Ry5PSElPLVNUQVRFLkVEVQAAAwAAOQAAAAALAEA6AQAAAAIB9g8BAAAABAAAAAAAAAKcSAEEgAEA EQAAAFJFOiBQb3dlciBzdXBwbHkAywUBBYADAA4AAADOBwQAHAAJABYAJAACADoBASCAAwAOAAAA zgcEABwACQARADoAAgBLAQEJgAEAIQAAADBDNzdGOEIzNzVERUQxMTE4MTU4MDBDMEYwMDU4RUEy ABQHAQOQBgD0BAAAFAAAAAsAIwAAAAAAAwAmAAAAAAALACkAAAAAAAMALgAAAAAAAwA2AAAAAABA ADkAIC47XTNyvQEeAHAAAQAAABEAAABSRTogUG93ZXIgc3VwcGx5AAAAAAIBcQABAAAAFgAAAAG9 cjNdMrP4dw3edRHRgVgAwPAFjqIAAB4AHgwBAAAABQAAAFNNVFAAAAAAHgAfDAEAAAAZAAAAcGph cmFtYXpAaW5nZW5pY28uY29tLmF1AAAAAAMABhD1e1VkAwAHEHQCAAAeAAgQAQAAAGUAAABTT01F T0ZUSEVMQVJHRVJTRU1JQ09ORFVDVE9SL0VMRUNUUk9OSUNTU1VQUExZU0hPUFNDQVJSWVNNQUxM QkxBQ0tCT1hQT1dFUklOVkVSVEVSU1VTVUFMTFlBQk9VVFRIRVNJAAAAAAIBCRABAAAAZgMAAGID AAC1BQAATFpGdVNm0sn/AAoBDwIVAqQD5AXrAoMAUBMDVAIAY2gKwHNldO4yBgAGwwKDMgPGBxMC g7ozEw19CoAIzwnZOxX/eDI1NQKACoENsQtgbvBnMTAzFCALChLyDAEOYwBABgADcGUgb2aYIHRo GxALYHJnBJASIBHwbWkFoG5kdURjdAWwL2VsBZB0iwNgAwBjBCBzdXALUKJ5HABob3AEIGMKwHZy HgEAwGwDIAJgANBrgR8wb3ggcG93G+EVC4B2BJB0BJBzLiD+VR2wHwEeAAGgCGAFQBtidQCQehsT YR/QH2IbMWP8aWcKwBIAIJAEIBthIVGIY2NlBTExMlYhYAMccB2mKy8tIDUsnCA5JeAkoCYRNSAS AFRjIA2wcAnwZAuAZzcbIAOgHFFmI0AIcGF0NmkCICDQVCPzFgAgddEhBXF1aSCQICAAHxE9J+Bs IJEJgCXgBpAgbn5vBUAikAWgHcAdACLzYaceUSTiEbBvaweQLi0kawqFCoVJA6BhKTAhZSToNTAt GSAwKlAFsSKQ9wWBCfAFQGMIcBYAMGEgYVcAkChhLZxPG2FyA/FlhyXgIpAkoC0+MjQvoHsgRiXg YiGkEfAecQOgYv8bECBhHgArMAQAIVEk8RtivGFkDbAlACAAI0BoBUDnGzUgRiTTUEMf1R20LY0e UBIABJAtnAr0bGkx1jgvkAIAaS9wNDOQDMHzPMMLWTE2CqADYCCQHKB8IC0+5wqHPZsMMD5mRp0D YTo/7j5mDIIgRABw+m4eAEIekSOBP49AnQZgFwIwQc9C21QKUHNkYXJ5JeAyOBNwPmADETHkOTlJ MDI6AdBEf0CdDFRvRr9C3ElZX0UoRklADcBpGUAyLiEJ8Gcub2goUC1zPwGQIJBPIByASk9FjnVi 7modEUxvQttQOPk67zvzPDM2PWcUIgwBPmZEb/sHkQBweQIgGxARwCBgWKL7JtEAkGcDoCJkOPkb USgw/zTzH+QikDiwCoUEYDKCBuD/CxEqUANhG1MkoDEABvAFQOZiKDAgkXk/LmAqAAhgXmwlADwg LPAbUG8mkHh/JwAFEAeAMGED8BtgCoVyvnVDwCdCA5FOgRwAeU/A/xwgXZQDkQuAHnI4oS2NVd9f PWcaNT5mCoUVIQBoQAAAAwAQEAAAAAADABEQAQAAAEAABzDgPi+3MnK9AUAACDDgPi+3MnK9AR4A PQABAAAABQAAAFJFOiAAAAAAAwANNP03AAASXA== ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD7287.7BAC9020-- From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 19:49:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA00685 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 19:49:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.airmail.net (mail.airmail.net [206.66.12.40]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA00681 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 19:49:28 -0400 Received: from 351w from [207.136.54.252] by mail.airmail.net (/\##/\ Smail3.1.30.16 #30.237) with smtp for sender: <351w@airmail.net> id ; Mon, 27 Apr 98 18:49:28 -0500 (CDT) From: "Raymond Brantley" <351w@airmail.net> To: Subject: Emulator Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:44:00 -0500 Message-ID: <000101bd7236$5a5a26e0$fc3688cf@351w> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 (Normal) X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook 8.5, Build 4.71.2173.0 Importance: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hello everyone , I have a brand new never been used EEC Emulator and software for sale. The unit is made by RaceLogic http://www.racelogic.co.uk/ all the details and a demo of the software are located at their web site. I am asking 1700.00 quite a bit cheaper than the going price. Let me know........... Raymond Brantley From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 20:01:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA00904 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:01:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from emerald.tufts.edu (pmdf@emerald.tufts.edu [130.64.1.16]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA00900 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:01:12 -0400 Received: from tufts.edu (st1254.tc.tufts.edu) by emerald.tufts.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #23568) with ESMTP id <0ES300I22K203O@emerald.tufts.edu> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:01:12 -0400 (EDT) Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:01:01 -0400 From: Andris Skulte Subject: Re: Power supply To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <35451C3D.7E3C50FC@tufts.edu> X-Envelope-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <199804271620.CAA24800@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> <35451091.1214F976@mwt.net> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Where did you get it? I'm looking for something similar, but I need it for a laptop I got w/o a battery. If there is a way of doing it cheaper than a $100 inverter feeding the AC adapter to the laptop, I'd appreciate it. Could I just find the PC bat voltage, and use one of Radioshacks 12V power adapters and wire that to the bat terminals? TIA! Andris -- *********Skulte Performance Designs---WWW.SKULTE.COM********** Your third and fourth generation f-body specialists ******89 IROC M5 305TPI---13.5@104.1--320 hp/475 ft-lbs******* From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 20:10:53 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA01094 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:10:53 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA01090 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:10:51 -0400 Resent-From: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com Received: from webserver by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id UAA05892; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:10:46 -0400 Received: from FJB (Administrators@localhost) by webserver (8.8.8/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAE00275 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:09:53 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:09:53 -0400 (Eastern Daylight Time) Resent-Message-Id: <199804280009.UAE00275@webserver> Message-Id: <3.0.5.32.19980427184134.007ab6a0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Sender: frederic.breitwieser@xephic.dynip.com X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Light Version 3.0.5 (32) Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:41:34 -0700 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Frederic Breitwieser Subject: RE: Power supply In-Reply-To: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >I believe it would be simplest...and probably cheaper (maybe more >reliable and safer) to purchase a 12VDC powered 120VAC inverter with >enough capacity to run your PC. It would probably run less than 100 >bucks. Yes, this is by far the easiest solution, however the final rendition of your PC-based ECM will require you to duct-tape this converter to the firewall at some point :) I have begun designing a switching power supply, much like the PC power supply, to provide the +/- 5V, +/- 12V outputs. I chose a switching design for several reasons - linear devices (78xx and LM317T, etc) can generate a lot of heat. Heat sucks no matter how you look at it. In addition, linear power supplies operate by shunting the "excess" to ground, hence the heat. This is a rather inefficient way to regulate power, however it does work very well, can't argue with that. I'm very slow at these things due to being involved in a few zillion (okay, I exhaggerated, a few million) projects at the moment, so feel free to design in parallel, and I'd be happy to share what I've done so far. I've basically leached a design from a Radio Shack book, which I breadboarded "as-is" and got satisfactory output. My design is similar, just with much higher current capabilities. I'm also trying to build in under/over voltage protection, so as long as the input range is 9V thru 20V, the outputs will remain at their exected voltage, just varying the intake current. This allows the ECM to have the right voltage no matter how many lights, starters, or electric motors are going. A little known fact, is *most* 486 and "weaker" system boards do not need the negative power leads for anything other than the serial ports. If you don't need serial, well, you can get around this by playing with the "good power" lead on the power supply. I forget if this is grounded, or attached to the 5V line through a diode - its been a while since I've experimented in this fashion... but its doable. Obviously, disabling your serial ports also disables an easy way of communicating with your embedded PC ECM. Anyway, sorry for the long post. Frederic Breitwieser Bridgeport, CT 06606 Homebrew Automotive Website: http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental 1989 HMMWV 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car - From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 21:33:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA02094 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:33:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA02089 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:33:03 -0400 Received: from rgate.ricochet.net by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id VAA07921; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:33:03 -0400 Received: from CPR (mg137-018.ricochet.net [204.179.137.18]) by rgate.ricochet.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA22021 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:29:27 -0500 (CDT) Received: by CPR with Microsoft Mail id <01BD720A.27E54C20@CPR>; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:27:38 -0700 Message-ID: <01BD720A.27E54C20@CPR> From: Chris Rhodin To: "'diy_efi'" Subject: RE: Power Supply Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:27:36 -0700 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id VAA02090 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu There is a laptop power supply available from Marlin P. Jones, stock number 4786-PS $14.95. They can be reached at 800-652-6733. The supply provides +5@3.5A, +12@1.1A, -12@.040A, -26@.040A (LCD bias), -5@.040A. It's a very small unit without an enclosure. Being a laptop supply it has 2 power inputs; an 18 volt external input for charging the battery and the 11-16 volt input that is normally connected to the battery. Ideally you would like it to operate from as little as 7 volts to cover the voltage drop when cranking. Since it can't do this you may need to add a battery and a couple of diodes to keep it going when the system voltage is low. A feature that it does have is logic level on-off control, this combined with an external battery would allow you to software control when the computer powered off. Chris Rhodin From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 21:42:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA02224 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:42:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id VAA02219 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:42:10 -0400 Received: from m7.boston.juno.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id VAA08145; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:42:07 -0400 Received: (from dane_boy@juno.com) by m7.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id VKM00433; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:34:33 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Cc: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:35:16 -0700 Subject: Re: Power supply Message-ID: <19980427.183516.3606.0.Dane_Boy@juno.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19980427184134.007ab6a0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 4,6-9 From: dane_boy@juno.com (Mikey B Sorensen) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu If you are looking for a cheap low current negative power supply.. the company MAXIM have all kinds of switch-mode chips for building negative supplies (-5V, -12V) - some can deliver up to 2 amps.. All you need is a positive supply a little higher, inductor and a few resistors + Caps... Take a look at their website.. ( http://www.maxim.com - I think?? ) Ohh, yah the best of all is that they give free samples.. no questions asked.. Michael Sorensen. _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 21:42:11 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA02223 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:42:11 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from m7.boston.juno.com (m7.boston.juno.com [205.231.100.196]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA02209 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:41:55 -0400 Received: (from dane_boy@juno.com) by m7.boston.juno.com (queuemail) id VKM00433; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:34:33 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Cc: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 18:35:16 -0700 Subject: Re: Power supply Message-ID: <19980427.183516.3606.0.Dane_Boy@juno.com> References: <3.0.5.32.19980427184134.007ab6a0@xephic.dynip.com> X-Mailer: Juno 1.49 X-Juno-Line-Breaks: 4,6-9 From: dane_boy@juno.com (Mikey B Sorensen) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu If you are looking for a cheap low current negative power supply.. the company MAXIM have all kinds of switch-mode chips for building negative supplies (-5V, -12V) - some can deliver up to 2 amps.. All you need is a positive supply a little higher, inductor and a few resistors + Caps... Take a look at their website.. ( http://www.maxim.com - I think?? ) Ohh, yah the best of all is that they give free samples.. no questions asked.. Michael Sorensen. _____________________________________________________________________ You don't need to buy Internet access to use free Internet e-mail. Get completely free e-mail from Juno at http://www.juno.com Or call Juno at (800) 654-JUNO [654-5866] From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 22:00:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA02686 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 22:00:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from auzurhuxch1z.zurich.com.au (firewall-user@[202.20.70.10]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA02668 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 22:00:09 -0400 From: Wayne.MacDonald@zurich.com.au Received: by auzurhuxch1z.zurich.com.au; id LAA00173; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 11:59:55 +1000 (EST) Received: from huxch2z.gis.zurich.com.au(192.168.1.27) by auzurhuxch1z.zurich.com.au via smap (3.2) id xma000159; Tue, 28 Apr 98 11:59:41 +1000 Received: from auznss01.gis.zurich.com.au (auznss01.gis.zurich.com.au [192.168.2.15]) by huxch2z.gis.zurich.com.au with SMTP (8.7.6/8.7.3) id LAA18496 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 11:59:32 +1000 (EST) Received: by auznss01.gis.zurich.com.au(Lotus SMTP MTA v1.1 (385.6 5-6-1997)) id 4A2565F4.000AEA0F ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 11:59:12 +1000 X-Lotus-FromDomain: ZURICH To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-ID: <4A2565F4.000A4D09.00@auznss01.gis.zurich.com.au> Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 11:58:43 +1000 Subject: Injector pulse processing Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I am building a 68HC11A8 MPU to allow me to modify the injector pulse from the ECU before it reaches the injector, Can anyone help be with the circuitry I need to convert the pulse from the ECU into a suitable signal for a 68HC11 input, I also need to be able to drive the injector from an output on the 68HC11. any ideas would be appreciated. Wayne Macdonald From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 22:03:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA02779 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 22:03:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from leary.huron.net (root@leary.huron.net [205.150.207.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA02773 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 22:03:51 -0400 Received: from snyder.huron.net (ppp10-ts1-kw.huron.net [205.150.207.59]) by leary.huron.net (8.8.8/8.8.5) with SMTP id WAA10267 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 22:00:43 -0400 Message-ID: <354539FD.4E40@huron.net> Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 22:07:57 -0400 From: Clare Snyder Organization: Snyder Enterprises X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Power supply References: <199804271620.CAA24800@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Danny Barrett wrote: > > Does anyone have any design of a power supply that can power a PC > motherboard from the 12 volt battery? I would like to experiment with > running an EFI system from an in car PC. For starters, get a "stat-power" inverter, and convert 12VDC to 115AC, letting a stocl power supply provide the +/- 5 and 12 required. If it works out, you can custom design something later. -- _/\_ --|-----([])-----|-- S 0/ \0 B Alls well that ends well!! www.snyder.on.ca is back E-Mail service is back to normal To avoid bouncing E-Mail messages Reply to Clare@snyder.on.ca OR Remove the R from clsnyder in my E-Mail Address to reply. Stop the spammers!!! It's hard to soar like an eagle when your stuck with a bunch of Turkeys!!! From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 22:05:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA02849 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 22:05:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (pop3.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA02837 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 22:05:14 -0400 Received: from terryk (tahoe-d41.foothill.net [209.76.43.41]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id TAA14471 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 19:05:30 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: GME Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 19:03:44 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd7249$dfc8cda0$292b4cd1@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Good, what are we talking about! -----Original Message----- From: Derek Jewett To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Monday, April 27, 1998 8:06 AM Subject: Re: GME >Dat outta work!!!! > From diy_efi-owner Mon Apr 27 23:03:20 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA03748 for diy_efi-outgoing; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 23:03:20 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id XAA03744 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 23:03:18 -0400 Received: from mail-relay.ubc.ca by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id XAA10146; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 23:03:17 -0400 Received: from brc.ubc.ca (koala.brc.ubc.ca [137.82.2.60]) by mail-relay.ubc.ca [137.82.1.2] (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id UAA07248 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:03:16 -0700 (PDT) Received: from koala by brc.ubc.ca (8.6.12/SMI-SVR4) id UAA11025; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:02:39 -0700 Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 20:02:38 -0700 (PDT) From: James Weiler X-Sender: james@koala To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: looking for LinderTech Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm looking for a Jeff (I think this is his first name) Linder (I hope this is his last name). He operates an injector cleaning and flow testing facility. I need some O-rings and those plastic end caps. I hope I'm remembering the right guy, any help would be appreciated. thanks everybody jw From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 00:12:37 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA04424 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 00:12:37 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.wgn.net (root@mail.wgn.net [207.213.0.9]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA04420 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 00:12:34 -0400 Received: from bullwinkle (du322-pcap-nca01.wgn.net [207.213.6.68]) by mail.wgn.net (8.8.5-q-beta2/8.6.9) with SMTP id VAA01634 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:12:33 -0700 Message-Id: <199804280412.VAA01634@mail.wgn.net> X-Sender: sganz@mail.wgn.net X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:15:34 -0700 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Sandy Subject: Re: Injector pulse processing In-Reply-To: <4A2565F4.000A4D09.00@auznss01.gis.zurich.com.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit X-MIME-Autoconverted: from quoted-printable to 8bit by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu id AAA04421 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Look at the EFI332 FTP sight, the I/O board schematics should help out. To drive an injector you have a bunch of options depending on if the injector is a saturated type (most std cars are) or the Peak and Hold type. Lots of good stuff up on the FTP site. You will need a postscript viewer to get at most of them. A really easy way to drive injectors is to use one of the smarter power devices, ie, the Cherry Semiconductor CS45X for Peak and Hold, Or some of the International rectifier parts, ie, IRF6210 which can be used to drive up to 5 amp loads safely. Don't forget a flyback diode on injector drivers, again, see the FTP sight and start downloading. Sandy At 11:58 AM 4/28/98 +1000, you wrote: > >I am building a 68HC11A8 MPU to allow me to modify the injector pulse from >the ECU before it reaches the injector, Can anyone help be with the >circuitry I need to convert the pulse from the ECU into a suitable signal >for a 68HC11 input, I also need to be able to drive the injector from an >output on the 68HC11. > >any ideas would be appreciated. >          Wayne Macdonald > From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 00:18:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA04476 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 00:18:47 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from snowcrest.net (mtshasta.snowcrest.net [207.201.33.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA04472 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 00:18:46 -0400 Received: from default (ttyD21.redding.snowcrest.net [209.148.36.66]) by snowcrest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA07382 for ; Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:18:46 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804280418.VAA07382@snowcrest.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: Subject: Re: GME Date: Mon, 27 Apr 1998 21:26:04 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu A BIN image from a stock TBI setup...747 From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 01:12:24 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA05102 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 01:12:24 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo25.mx.aol.com (imo25.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.69]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA05098 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 01:12:21 -0400 Received: from REELMike@aol.com by imo25.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8CCTa03032 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 01:11:46 -0400 (EDT) From: REELMike Message-ID: <5bb2c569.35456513@aol.com> Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 01:11:46 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: looking for LinderTech Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 16-bit for Windows sub 41 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu In a message dated 98-04-27 23:14:21 EDT, you write: << 'm looking for a Jeff (I think this is his first name) Linder (I hope this is his last name). He operates an injector cleaning and flow testing facility. I need some O-rings and those plastic end caps. I hope I'm remembering the right guy, any help would be appreciated. thanks everybody jw >> From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 03:02:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA05862 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 03:02:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA05858 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 03:02:27 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp10.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.31]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id DAA09321 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 03:07:28 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 03:00:07 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: DIY list Subject: computer in car (for FI) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu i found a great web site where it list a computer who operate on 5 volts only,here's an excerpt: Quite soon, I found the Advantech PCM-5862 'biscuit PC'. This board puts an entire Pentium PC (including: 2 72-pin SIMM sockets, Socket7 (to 200Mhz), 10-base-T Ethernet, 16-bit audio, 2xUSB, EIDE, Floppy, 4xSerial, Parallel, PCI slot, PC/104 slot, SVGA with monitor and LCD drive) into the footprint of a 5.25" disk drive - and best of all, runs from a single +5v supply. I found an importer, found out the price (urk, not cheap - I paid 293+VAT from UCS in the UK), screamed a bit, then bought it anyway: it's still cheaper than an autochanger... here's the address of the page where i found the thing: http://www.cryton.demon.co.uk/mp3mobile/ the page talk about an MP3 sound system running onto linux. have good reading. Alain From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 04:06:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA06317 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 04:06:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.5]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA06313 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 04:06:27 -0400 Received: from main (alaint@ppp4.boisfrancs.qc.ca [207.253.52.25]) by mail.boisfrancs.qc.ca (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id EAA10096 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 04:11:27 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 04:04:08 -0400 (EDT) From: Alain Toussaint X-Sender: alaint@main To: DIY list Subject: Re: computer in car (for FI) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > http://www.cryton.demon.co.uk/mp3mobile/ > > the page talk about an MP3 sound system running onto linux. anyone here considering making a FI system with a PC should take a visit there,there still a lot of information that will apply in your system even without talking about linux (which frankly doesn't have much text there),it's worth a visit (10 on a rate of 10). Alain From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 04:58:40 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA06803 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 04:58:40 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA06799 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 04:58:37 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm301-015.mcn.net [208.26.146.15]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id CAA14599 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 02:58:35 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3545972E.3CCAFB79@mcn.net> Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 02:45:34 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: looking for LinderTech References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu James Weiler wrote: > > I'm looking for a Jeff (I think this is his first name) Linder (I hope > this is his last name). He operates an injector cleaning and flow testing > facility. I need some O-rings and those plastic end caps. I hope I'm > remembering the right guy, any help would be appreciated. > thanks everybody > jw Scott Linder Jim Linder the fuel injector " guru" Doug Garriot the fuel injector " wizzard" 317-487-9460 Try these. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 08:40:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA08276 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 08:40:05 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from missouri.mcn.net (root@missouri.mcn.net [204.212.170.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA08272 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 08:40:01 -0400 Received: from mcn.net (blgspm302-100.mcn.net [208.26.146.100]) by missouri.mcn.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id GAA28423 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 06:39:59 -0600 (MDT) Message-ID: <3545CB0D.250F7C56@mcn.net> Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 06:26:53 -0600 From: Shannen Durphey X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: looking for LinderTech References: <3545972E.3CCAFB79@mcn.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Shannen Durphey wrote: > > James Weiler wrote: > > > > I'm looking for a Jeff (I think this is his first name) Linder (I hope > > this is his last name). He operates an injector cleaning and flow testing > > facility. I need some O-rings and those plastic end caps. I hope I'm > > remembering the right guy, any help would be appreciated. > > thanks everybody > > jw > > Scott Linder > Jim Linder > the fuel injector " guru" > Doug Garriot > the fuel injector " wizzard" > 317-487-9460 > > Try these. > Shannen I must have been pretty tired last night. I forgot to mention that last time I needed a set of chimneys I bought them at NAPA. Shannen From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 09:52:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA09001 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 09:52:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from uswgco3.uswc.uswest.com (uswgco3.uswest.com [206.196.133.82]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id JAA08997 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 09:52:50 -0400 Received: from egate2.mnet.uswest.com (mailgate.uswc.uswest.com [151.117.138.135]) by uswgco3.uswc.uswest.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id HAA16477 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 07:52:51 -0600 (MDT) Received: from centhub.mnet.uswest.com (centhub.mnet.uswest.com [151.119.130.7]) by egate2.mnet.uswest.com (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id IAA21726 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 08:52:48 -0500 (CDT) Received: from minmail.uswc.uswest.com (minmail.uswc.uswest.com [151.116.144.17]) by centhub.mnet.uswest.com (8.6.11/8.6.11) with ESMTP id HAA04665 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 07:52:50 -0600 Received: from sp5-316 ([151.116.173.81]) by minmail.uswc.uswest.com (Netscape Mail Server v2.02) with SMTP id AAA19933; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 07:55:03 -0600 Message-ID: <3545DE6F.4805@minmail.uswc.uswest.com> Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 07:49:35 -0600 From: Steven Ciciora Organization: Capacity Provisioning, Littleton, CO X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; SunOS 5.5.1 sun4m) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu, Wayne.MacDonald@zurich.com.au Subject: RE: Injector pulse processing Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Check out: http://sura1.jlab.org/~bowling/pwmeasure.html for an example on how to condition a fuel injector signal to TTL, and see Sandy's response on how to convert TTL to a fuel injector level signal. Keep us updated on your progress!! Steven Ciciora ------------------------------ From: Wayne.MacDonald@zurich.com.au Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 11:58:43 +1000 Subject: Injector pulse processing I am building a 68HC11A8 MPU to allow me to modify the injector pulse from the ECU before it reaches the injector, Can anyone help be with the circuitry I need to convert the pulse from the ECU into a suitable signal for a 68HC11 input, I also need to be able to drive the injector from an output on the 68HC11. any ideas would be appreciated. Wayne Macdonald ------------------------------ From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 10:25:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA09448 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 10:25:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA09444 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 10:25:22 -0400 Received: from pclab10.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab10.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.110]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id AAA18045 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:25:21 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:25:21 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804281425.AAA18045@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu G'day to all the Aussies out there. Does anyone know anything about putting the EFI 3.3L VK Commodore motor into a VC Commodore? Does anyone have any idea how much it should cost to do? Also, does anyone know of an insurance company that has "third party, with fire and theft" that will let a 21 year old have extractors (ie. the ones on the VK engine - AAMI (who I am with at the moment) does not, and I would like to keep the same type of insurance policy, if possible). Does anyone know how to make the VC Commodore more aerodynamic without having expensive body kits? I'm told that the air flow separates from the car at the rear edge of the roof. How can this be fixed? From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 18:08:18 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA14199 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 18:08:18 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ingenico.com.au ([203.10.64.225]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA14193 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 18:08:13 -0400 Received: from PJARAMAZ [10.10.10.34] by ingenico.com.au [10.10.10.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP0.R) for ; Wed, 29 Apr 98 08:10:19 +1000 Received: by PJARAMAZ with Microsoft Mail id <01BD7346.000B7DE0@PJARAMAZ >; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 08:08:32 +1000 Message-ID: <01BD7346.000B7DE0@PJARAMAZ > From: Peter Jaramaz To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 08:08:30 +1000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BD7346.0014A5A0" X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ------ =_NextPart_000_01BD7346.0014A5A0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable G'Day, VK 3.3 into the VC would be very straight forward, although I'd suggest = getting the entire fuel system from the VK (i.e fuel tank + pump, hi = pressure lines etc). The EFI is controled by a pretty crapppy by todays = standards analog computer. You might want to get a cheap aftermarket = proper EFI computer such as a Microtec Digi (about $650 Aus). VK EFI had = extractors standard. Try Shannons for insurance. As for Aerodynamics, the VB-K where good for their time but poor by = todays standards. Try Freedon or SSV (in Sydney for a body kit) Peter ---------- From: Danny Barrett Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 1998 12:25 AM To: DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. G'day to all the Aussies out there. Does anyone know anything about putting the EFI 3.3L VK Commodore motor = into a VC Commodore? Does anyone have any idea how much it should cost to do? Also, does anyone know of an insurance company that has "third party, = with fire and theft" that will let a 21 year old have extractors (ie. the = ones on the VK engine - AAMI (who I am with at the moment) does not, and I would like to keep the same type of insurance policy, if possible). Does = anyone know how to make the VC Commodore more aerodynamic without having = expensive body kits? I'm told that the air flow separates from the car at the rear edge of the roof. 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In Aus thay're fitted in Holdens. Drove one on the weekend in a LWB luxo barge Statesman and was extremely surprised by the grunt as well as the linear power delivery. Now, wanted to force induct my own earlier 3800, questions I have is if I mount the S/C between the engine and throttle body (with the MAP sensor on the throttle body), can I get away with running a 1 bar/atmo MAP sensor as the MAP would never see boost. My only concern is the MAP may be subject to too much vacuum under hi rev/lo TPS. Would this cause a problem? Any comments suggestions? Anyone Stateside know the price of a factory S/C for a 3800 - a local importer here has a new one but wants $1800. I can buy a brand new complete engine from Holden for approx $5000, which makes the $1800 for a bare S/C seem a little high :-( From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 19:14:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA14882 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 19:14:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA14875 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 19:14:29 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp30.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.160]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id SAA22369; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 18:14:24 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <354660BF.7774F57E@mwt.net> Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 18:05:36 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Frederic Breitwieser , "diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu" Subject: address of switcher Re: Power supply X-Priority: 3 (Normal) References: <199804271620.CAA24800@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> <3.0.5.32.19980427201313.007a7140@xephic.dynip.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The power supply is ACE-865VA INPUT 8 - 16VDC +5V= 6A , +12V= 2.0A , -5V = .3A , -12V =.5A Did find the company that sells this Industrial Computer Source 1-800-523-2320 or www.indcompsrc.com . They make a higher watt unit but very expensive supply. $200 or so. The only fair price part they sell as far as I could see . Very well built supply. Steve Frederic Breitwieser wrote: > >keypad decoder board that replaces standard keyboard. Hope this is > what > >you are looking for. > > Hello Steve, > > its EXACTLY what i'm looking for. If you get a bunch of requests, I'd > > appreciate being included on the information distribution. > > Thanks! Might save me the aggrevation of re-inventing the wheel here. > > Frederic Breitwieser > Bridgeport, CT 06606 > > Homebrew Automotive Website: > http://www.xephic.dynip.com/ > > 1993 Supercharged Lincoln Continental > 1989 HMMWV > 2000 Buick-Powered Mid-Engined Sports Car > > - From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 19:40:34 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA15296 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 19:40:34 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kcbbs.gen.nz (kcbbs.gen.nz [202.14.102.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA15289 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 19:40:28 -0400 Received: from swbo (as5200-37.kcbbs.gen.nz [202.14.102.67]) by kcbbs.gen.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id LAA20007 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:39:03 +1200 (NZST) Message-Id: <199804282339.LAA20007@kcbbs.gen.nz> From: "Steve Baldwin" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:43:36 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Automotive Applications Handbook for 67F687 and 67F6612 Priority: normal In-reply-to: <3528D7C1.E111FE2@lmtas.lmco.com> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Does anyone know if this stuff became available ? It seems to have never made it to the ftp site and I didn't get a reply from David when I emailed him directly. > > I just finished scanning the Automotive Applications Handbook for 67F687 and > > 67F6612. > > Where do I put the collections of files? > > David Edwards Steve. ====================================================== Steve Baldwin Electronic Product Design TLA Microsystems Ltd Microcontroller Specialists PO Box 15-680, New Lynn http://www.tla.co.nz Auckland, New Zealand ph +64 9 820-2221 email: steveb@tla.co.nz fax +64 9 820-1929 ====================================================== From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 20:29:03 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA15899 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 20:29:03 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net (eagle.ptialaska.net [198.70.245.243]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id UAA15894 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 20:28:58 -0400 Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net by eagle.ptialaska.net (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id QAA25927; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 16:26:35 -0800 Message-ID: <35467485.2D1DF3@eagle.ptialaska.net> Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 16:29:58 -0800 From: Webb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Automotive Applications Handbook for 67F687 and 67F6612 References: <199804282339.LAA20007@kcbbs.gen.nz> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I had occasion to get interested in the '687 a couple months ago. Info was no problem, but when I tried to get ahold of a chip, I found that NO ONE could get even one... If that's not the case, I'd like to know. Plenty of literature available, just no hdwr. Steve Baldwin wrote: > Does anyone know if this stuff became available ? > It seems to have never made it to the ftp site and I didn't get a > reply from David when I emailed him directly. > > > > I just finished scanning the Automotive Applications Handbook for 67F687 and > > > 67F6612. > > > Where do I put the collections of files? > > > David Edwards > > Steve. > > ====================================================== > Steve Baldwin Electronic Product Design > TLA Microsystems Ltd Microcontroller Specialists > PO Box 15-680, New Lynn http://www.tla.co.nz > Auckland, New Zealand ph +64 9 820-2221 > email: steveb@tla.co.nz fax +64 9 820-1929 > ====================================================== From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 21:05:40 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA16349 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 21:05:40 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.arlec.com.au (mail.arlec.com.au [203.36.152.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA16343 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 21:05:35 -0400 Received: by mail.arlec.com.au from localhost (router,SLMail V2.6); Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:59:44 +1000 Received: by mail.arlec.com.au from default (192.1.8.200::mail daemon; unverified,SLMail V2.6); Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:59:43 +1000 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 10:59:46 +0800 Message-ID: <01BD735D.EC02C840.dzorde@soanar.com.au> From: Dan Zorde To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 10:59:45 +0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 Encoding: 56 TEXT, 104 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Danny, Just drop in a 5.0L VN/VP much better and Shannons won't even ask any questions (join a car club and they'll let you have race insurance as well for not a great deal more). As for licensing, not a problem as the VC came standard with a 5.0L. The VK was a pretty crap attempt at pollution control, but if you want to go this way throw the heads and air pump away and replace with red motor heads if possible. If interested I have a red motor for sale, 179 with 4 speed (XU-1 close ratio), motor built for racing (but was never raced at the track), 10K genuine road km since rebuild (used to drive it to work everyday). Fully race prepped heads, etc, etc. Dan dzorde@soanar.com.au -----Original Message----- From: Peter Jaramaz [SMTP:pjaramaz@ingenico.com.au] Sent: Wednesday, 29 April, 1998 6:09 AM To: 'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu' Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. G'Day, VK 3.3 into the VC would be very straight forward, although I'd suggest getting the entire fuel system from the VK (i.e fuel tank + pump, hi pressure lines etc). The EFI is controled by a pretty crapppy by todays standards analog computer. You might want to get a cheap aftermarket proper EFI computer such as a Microtec Digi (about $650 Aus). VK EFI had extractors standard. Try Shannons for insurance. As for Aerodynamics, the VB-K where good for their time but poor by todays standards. Try Freedon or SSV (in Sydney for a body kit) Peter ---------- From: Danny Barrett Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 1998 12:25 AM To: DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. G'day to all the Aussies out there. Does anyone know anything about putting the EFI 3.3L VK Commodore motor into a VC Commodore? Does anyone have any idea how much it should cost to do? Also, does anyone know of an insurance company that has "third party, with fire and theft" that will let a 21 year old have extractors (ie. the ones on the VK engine - AAMI (who I am with at the moment) does not, and I would like to keep the same type of insurance policy, if possible). Does anyone know how to make the VC Commodore more aerodynamic without having expensive body kits? I'm told that the air flow separates from the car at the rear edge of the roof. How can this be fixed? begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(BX"`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`$ (```$````0`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````(!]U\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````#`/U?`0````,`_U\``````@'V#P$````$`````````NEX`02 M`0`O````4D4Z($AO;&1E;B!#;VUM;V1O06/Q=/$Y !M@+P>P!; `P )S /L$@ M_C$UXPY0.H\[GSRC`%$]+/\`H#A>/Z] MC74#\!!OT+/OSRC#E ]'T5_1H] MXS,"@CT3$&,Z4$U1-X! X'1IB3S ($0!$&%U; 5 "E *P&$)P&%P:"".1@(A M.A0I\&9I+0^07C@!0#Q@4>,VZ&(+('+/"5!30AK04T)W-"GQ&S#^< '03R(W MKTQ/3591@%! &P40`C M4. #83H@5$)O6*!3=6)J!9!T05B@1&%T93HZ%#;_ M4:]2OU//5-XV<$#3#B%-46\]Y@Y05E]7;E(\L1LQ(.Y(0,$$D#H4-UI?6V]< M?[]-43P_7>\/D!S "-!B"K#\=#A+J@]42(!?[V#V:7#S8@`+4'DO4/!)!$ M;V-^=0> `C %T%"P'K%VPF_N=W<`< $!@&Y9( !@"?#?3U!Z\ (!.=!>@F4` M\'KP)38P<",P7'8(D'=K_0N 9&JP?I($\ = $&$!0-\.`&_20+)_]0(0;P5" M&U$;$O)9L&T+45FP($,ZU%Q<5_!O4)%M4. #$)L'D(*@30W@`V!S;P& 7"!/ M`2 -X'W@7(161>L`P ,0+DT@='O &T!W`+LY$6;B>$BAAA)/Y&,#(.<2\P" M!9!L=D0124 .^._W9L:K!)0&R,GY%?DF4I M'XML*?"0/Y4?DE1B("C_`I&6/X@S6D"3[YBOF;^:S_^(8&- G!*([YU_GH^+ M;"RP_YP?H9^BKZ._B&!VL*"?IB]_IS^H1 KY`S!VWW(/.0%[85F0;FYY+ J% M"H5*Q:ZQ(&_P;W @K:&2L `U+C!,(%9.+[!64"!M#G!0T&(;4.]9L 7 `' Y M$%.2`1-0!C'F=P(@`!!Q=8$P$X %0)-G,;(Q061"STW0V@'FTYFYL`R V4 5 >0A@0*!A[T^A4'"$D+(1$D "!#W LNZ47<&\"8&^"`+KBN$&RL$.W80> ('^J$7T`;1(#\+A MLD6]$53]OX)+M*"Z\;ZBLX&V, 4`OU"PLD"SD8(0N]$%0' &\%\*0+:2MV " M(0-@;+Y 8CMFP+(09KEC;0![071O_[P`QB"X0 0`P@&V,+A `V!_!^"_)# PS3 ('Y0 M\C^[Y &U!CVY/+[K!!#(*QP'9Z!; !`$"$``!P"L N^06@;2Y0``J%K02M MSZ[5_GO>_6;@JP+?[^#T.,0YD)42\F+6H&NJ$R!?>W"C`Q!9D6%]+>823Z[A M^PN O)%-!Y!(P-70YA/>^_^M9F,M;I!O'W O9E]G;VA_WVF/:ICD!UACW6-0 M&U"SL09*4&$`P'H@6U--H%10.G!J\K1 /L'K"? -X&_>A5WGO^C$;BO_Z?_K M#W$?KQ^'L0PPY"4&8&\",/'D'M+D-%<)@#E0<^O9H;Y ,GB001=P`Q#/<40Y M.>]0-CHP_E%-+][V^ZE8P?RM)T#@>5^9#S!I0 )!#[ R+@GPR&P>=Y0;0W@Y0;=10+'_PQ%\@#Z0A6#9(+E!OL%^4/^SP!JB'J84,;-!PB.#LUFP/F-/ MP.:!I[#=@.R1("3Z-E\10=? O0'!X1JB7I%_M7 Y<+H!RI$=> F6X554_Q(A MM">[C04]F0.5#)`+^[,!XTEHQY"7_YA/G:_NB.,Y8 M9*Q!.,[Q\_FP0R!"MX#"@CIO.1G\4W\\?SV&_9G^<_XQ_L5>\#H_7P#_?3C. M=6) _SV625G^7QJA`G\#AT2?/^I9%D:?_SV5!P\('PDMX5]N[>-/#L3_V:'& M`L] %_&_@25ARY 9T?\DTKA!,- )EGK@&=&V$6# _8)@:[NPQT"V$<9Q%1$D MM/\>T13W&J(0<;*AP?!.9\IEWQ"R4062L+^Q3F<_5NO-Y/^V(5)PQ[#'D,HM^V$L_PO$'- MX,(P(L9Q;2'_X8'"L+Y S])1!6Y %<&X!;U\@")C],_0N062L#+0X/YYQ["S MP$X!N:0F>1=PR]'WOW)7<57!;E$%%P5)`=82[BV],/^ S< H+0#&(,W WX,1 MP,34M+S >R(I862[L?\34;/QS< 1PL81A6!P8K^$6GIF0BNH_\"S)-+-X14" M>H!^4+WQ[2#[404RQG-=`!0`%N%HHF0#^[]RR$)FT1#'0-$PX8&"0?^]41;& MMW+4I;PA-';]H-70]V)R?F,M<&:]$$WPQT"W<._HT,9S$='VH'C]H&"6L*P? MY)9)`-^PY7A1!GT```&%, ````,`$! ``````P`1$ `````>`$(0`0```"0` M```\,#%"1# M``: "" &``````# ````````1@````!4A0```0````4````X+C R``````,` M!X (( 8``````, ```````!&``````&%````````"P`0@ @@!@``````P `` M`````$8`````#H4````````#`!& "" &``````# ````````1@`````0A0`` M``````,`$H (( 8``````, ```````!&`````!&%`````````P`5@ @@!@`` M````P ```````$8`````&(4````````>`"6 "" &``````# ````````1@`` M```VA0```0````$`````````'@`F@ @@!@``````P ```````$8`````-X4` M``$````!`````````!X`)X (( 8``````, ```````!&`````#B%```!```` F`0`````````>`#T``0````4```!213H@``````,`#33]-P``>GZ% ` end From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 21:10:10 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA16432 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 21:10:10 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.arlec.com.au (mail.arlec.com.au [203.36.152.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA16427 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 21:10:08 -0400 Received: by mail.arlec.com.au from localhost (router,SLMail V2.6); Wed, 29 Apr 1998 12:03:14 +1000 Received: by mail.arlec.com.au from default (192.1.8.200::mail daemon; unverified,SLMail V2.6); Wed, 29 Apr 1998 12:03:14 +1000 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:03:18 +0800 Message-ID: <01BD735E.6A9C7340.dzorde@soanar.com.au> From: Dan Zorde To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Supercharged 3800 Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:03:17 +0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 Encoding: 37 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Your biggest problem would be the internals of the engine, I'm sure someone (a while back) said the internals were much stronger. It's not just the standard 3800 with a S/C bolted on. Dan dzorde@soanar.com.au -----Original Message----- From: Peter Jaramaz [SMTP:pjaramaz@ingenico.com.au] Sent: Wednesday, 29 April, 1998 6:53 AM To: 'DIY_EFI' Subject: Supercharged 3800 Hi all, Q regrading S/C 3800. In Aus thay're fitted in Holdens. Drove one on the weekend in a LWB luxo barge Statesman and was extremely surprised by the grunt as well as the linear power delivery. Now, wanted to force induct my own earlier 3800, questions I have is if I mount the S/C between the engine and throttle body (with the MAP sensor on the throttle body), can I get away with running a 1 bar/atmo MAP sensor as the MAP would never see boost. My only concern is the MAP may be subject to too much vacuum under hi rev/lo TPS. Would this cause a problem? Any comments suggestions? Anyone Stateside know the price of a factory S/C for a 3800 - a local importer here has a new one but wants $1800. I can buy a brand new complete engine from Holden for approx $5000, which makes the $1800 for a bare S/C seem a little high :-( From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 21:38:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id VAA16972 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 21:38:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from digger1.defence.gov.au (digger1.defence.gov.au [203.5.217.4]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id VAA16967 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 21:37:55 -0400 Received: from exchsa1.dsto.defence.gov.au (exchsa1.dsto.defence.gov.au [131.185.2.94]) by digger1.defence.gov.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id LAA22816 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:06:00 +0930 (CST) Received: from fang.dsto.defence.gov.au ([131.185.2.5]) by exchsa1.dsto.defence.gov.au with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.1960.3) id J57S0T1M; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:07:50 +0930 Received: from hotblk.dsto.defence.gov.au (hotblk.dsto.defence.gov.au [146.221.39.21]) by fang.dsto.defence.gov.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id LAA16537 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:07:45 +0930 (CST) Received: from [146.221.36.211] ([146.221.36.211]) by hotblk.dsto.defence.gov.au with SMTP; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 12:31:43 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: <199804281425.AAA18045@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:38:14 +1000 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Steve Lamb Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >G'day to all the Aussies out there. >Does anyone know anything about putting the EFI 3.3L VK Commodore motor into >a VC Commodore? Does anyone have any idea how much it should cost to do? >Also, does anyone know of an insurance company that has "third party, with >fire and theft" that will let a 21 year old have extractors (ie. the ones on >the VK engine - AAMI (who I am with at the moment) does not, and I would >like to keep the same type of insurance policy, if possible). Does anyone >know how to make the VC Commodore more aerodynamic without having expensive >body kits? I'm told that the air flow separates from the car at the rear >edge of the roof. How can this be fixed? Be simpler and cheaper to just bolt on the VK EFI gear to your existing engine, I suspect. Certainly I know someone who did this with an LJ Torana, BUT he used a Haltech ECU to run the VK hardware. This is the only way to go if you plan on any engine mods as the VK uses a version of the Bosch L-Jet system (analogue) which is not particularly suited to 'modification', although there are things that can be done. I've seen complete VK EFI systems advertised recently for around $700 or so, but should be able to do better than that. A Haltech F9 (fuel only) costs about $1100, but for $1400 you could get a Wolf 3D which would probably be better (fuel and ign). Try Shannons or ring a few brokers for modified vehicle insurance. Also CAMS offers mod. veh. insurance through QBE, but you have to be a member of an affiliated club. Costs about $200 pa for TPO, but there is an option for fire and theft (at extra cost, of course !!). How _do_ you make a brick more aerodynamic........... ;-) Steve Lamb Department of Defence, DSTO Aeronautical and Maritime Research Laboratory 506 Lorimer Street Fishermans Bend VIC 3207 Australia Tel: +61 3 9626 7525 Fax: +61 3 9626 7089 IZCC #180 From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 22:32:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA17619 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 22:32:38 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from web02.globecomm.net (web02.nyc.globecomm.net [207.51.48.39]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA17613 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 22:32:34 -0400 From: grantg@iname.com Received: (from root@localhost) by web02.globecomm.net (8.8.8/8.8.0) id WAA22693; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 22:32:32 -0400 (EDT) Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 22:32:32 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804290232.WAA22693@web02.globecomm.net> Content-Type: text/plain MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Subject: RE: Supercharged 3800 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Just checked on that...Crank is the same both non S/C and S/C, rods are different and more expensive !!, pistons for obvious reasons, and heads....but on saying that the later 3.8's (VR) are not known for problems...seen a couple with run B/E's and also with run Cam bearings, but am told this is an issue with poor quality oils, so guess a mild boost would be fine...the VS engines actually have shorter rods, which should be worse for side thrust on pistons hence more friction, maybe making the earlier engine more suitable, also a point worth remembering is the late engine is about 20mm shorter in deck height, so the late blower won't fit an early engine I shouldn't think Cheers Grant ---- you wrote: > Your biggest problem would be the internals of the engine, I'm sure someone (a > while back) said the internals were much stronger. It's not just the standard > 3800 with a S/C bolted on. > > Dan dzorde@soanar.com.au > ------------------------------------------------------ Get free personalized email at http://four11.iname.com From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 22:43:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA17704 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 22:43:25 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.arlec.com.au (mail.arlec.com.au [203.36.152.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA17700 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 22:43:21 -0400 Received: by mail.arlec.com.au from localhost (router,SLMail V2.6); Wed, 29 Apr 1998 13:37:32 +1000 Received: by mail.arlec.com.au from default (192.1.8.200::mail daemon; unverified,SLMail V2.6); Wed, 29 Apr 1998 13:37:31 +1000 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 12:37:37 +0800 Message-ID: <01BD736B.978DF600.dzorde@soanar.com.au> From: Dan Zorde To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 12:37:36 +0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 Encoding: 23 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu You don't, which is why you just add more power and accept the extra fuel bill. Dan dzorde@soanar.com.au -----Original Message----- From: Steve Lamb [SMTP:lambs@HOTBLK.dsto.defence.gov.au] Sent: Wednesday, 29 April, 1998 9:38 AM To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. How _do_ you make a brick more aerodynamic........... ;-) Steve Lamb Department of Defence, DSTO Aeronautical and Maritime Research Laboratory 506 Lorimer Street Fishermans Bend VIC 3207 Australia Tel: +61 3 9626 7525 Fax: +61 3 9626 7089 IZCC #180 From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 23:15:54 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA18237 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 23:15:54 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from snowcrest.net (mtshasta.snowcrest.net [207.201.33.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA18233 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 23:15:51 -0400 Received: from default (ttyD43.redding.snowcrest.net [209.148.36.132]) by snowcrest.net (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id UAA08645 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 20:15:49 -0700 (PDT) Message-Id: <199804290315.UAA08645@snowcrest.net> From: "Derek Jewett" To: "Do-it-Yourself Fuel Injection" Subject: DIY'ers EPROM Burner Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 20:23:08 -0700 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ok the 2732 update has been added to the DIY'ers EPROM burner. Please note that the 2732 hack has not been tested as of yet, but the unit works fine for burning 27128/256/512,etc... It is a hobbyists grade plan so the plans are a little akward, if you have trouble reading the hand drawn schematics let me know I have a well laid out schemaic I can save as a metafile and send you a copy. This project was originaly intended for burning video game cartriges and turned into a more "generic" burner I thought would be usefull for any DIY'er wanting to read/burn his own chips for fun. As you will see the design is incredibly simple, and flexible, even for cone shaped hat wearers!. Enjoy! The specific URL for the EPROMr FAQ page is , however most of you will want to go to and download the new version of the software archive (approx. 555K). This zip file also contains the FAQ document. Derek PS Soon to be added a DIY'ers plan for making your own cone shaped hat!!!!! From diy_efi-owner Tue Apr 28 23:16:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA18252 for diy_efi-outgoing; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 23:16:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (pop3.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA18247 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 23:16:14 -0400 Received: from terryk (tahoe-d57.foothill.net [209.76.43.57]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id UAA02299 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 20:16:24 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: Supercharged 3800 Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 20:14:47 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd731c$f6cf4820$392b4cd1@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The Eaton M-62 is ~$1700US new $1300 rebuilt. M-90 a little higher. Contact www.eaton.com TK -----Original Message----- From: Peter Jaramaz To: 'DIY_EFI' Date: Tuesday, April 28, 1998 4:27 PM Subject: Supercharged 3800 >Hi all, > >Q regrading S/C 3800. > >In Aus thay're fitted in Holdens. Drove one on the weekend in a LWB luxo barge Statesman and was extremely surprised by the grunt as well as the linear power delivery. > >Now, wanted to force induct my own earlier 3800, questions I have is if I mount the S/C between the engine and throttle body (with the MAP sensor on the throttle body), can I get away with running a 1 bar/atmo MAP sensor as the MAP would never see boost. > >My only concern is the MAP may be subject to too much vacuum under hi rev/lo TPS. > >Would this cause a problem? > >Any comments suggestions? > >Anyone Stateside know the price of a factory S/C for a 3800 - a local importer here has a new one but wants $1800. I can buy a brand new complete engine from Holden for approx $5000, which makes the $1800 for a bare S/C seem a little high :-( > > > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 00:07:25 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA18970 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:07:25 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA18966 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:07:22 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-5.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.23]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id AAA28705 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:06:27 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Time to celebrate Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:07:35 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd7324$57268100$17198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Well in addition to gme, for a known prom, we now have delco_edit_1.zip............................ for doing your own prom research. Both are terrific. Cheers Bruce Thanks to Terry, and Wayne From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 00:30:14 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA19266 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:30:14 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kcbbs.gen.nz (kcbbs.gen.nz [202.14.102.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA19261 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:30:11 -0400 Received: from swbo (as5200-57.kcbbs.gen.nz [202.14.102.87]) by kcbbs.gen.nz (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id QAA10590 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 16:28:44 +1200 (NZST) Message-Id: <199804290428.QAA10590@kcbbs.gen.nz> From: "Steve Baldwin" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 16:33:18 +0000 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Automotive Applications Handbook for 67F687 and 67F6612 Priority: normal In-reply-to: <35467485.2D1DF3@eagle.ptialaska.net> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > I had occasion to get interested in the '687 a couple months ago. Info was no > problem, but when I tried to get ahold of a chip, I found that NO ONE could get even > one... > > If that's not the case, I'd like to know. Plenty of literature available, just no > hdwr. As far as I know, that is still the case. I think the discontinuence was announced the day after I got data. I'm particularly interested in the applications info as that's the bit I don't have. My interests are in implementing a similar thing in an FPGA. Don't hold your breath though. I still haven't finished the other project on the side that I started 5 years ago. Steve. ====================================================== Steve Baldwin Electronic Product Design TLA Microsystems Ltd Microcontroller Specialists PO Box 15-680, New Lynn http://www.tla.co.nz Auckland, New Zealand ph +64 9 820-2221 email: steveb@tla.co.nz fax +64 9 820-1929 ====================================================== From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 00:34:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA19333 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:34:47 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (pop3.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA19328 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 00:34:45 -0400 Received: from terryk (tahoe-d35.foothill.net [209.76.43.35]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id VAA11486 for ; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 21:34:59 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: Supercharged 3800 Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 21:33:13 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd7327$ebd89380$232b4cd1@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sorry, this is more complete... http://www.eaton.com/supercharger/M62.html -----Original Message----- From: TBK To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Tuesday, April 28, 1998 8:57 PM Subject: Re: Supercharged 3800 >The Eaton M-62 is ~$1700US new $1300 rebuilt. M-90 a little higher. Contact >www.eaton.com > >TK >-----Original Message----- >From: Peter Jaramaz >To: 'DIY_EFI' >Date: Tuesday, April 28, 1998 4:27 PM >Subject: Supercharged 3800 > > >>Hi all, >> >>Q regrading S/C 3800. >> >>In Aus thay're fitted in Holdens. Drove one on the weekend in a LWB luxo >barge Statesman and was extremely surprised by the grunt as well as the >linear power delivery. >> >>Now, wanted to force induct my own earlier 3800, questions I have is if I >mount the S/C between the engine and throttle body (with the MAP sensor on >the throttle body), can I get away with running a 1 bar/atmo MAP sensor as >the MAP would never see boost. >> >>My only concern is the MAP may be subject to too much vacuum under hi >rev/lo TPS. >> >>Would this cause a problem? >> >>Any comments suggestions? >> >>Anyone Stateside know the price of a factory S/C for a 3800 - a local >importer here has a new one but wants $1800. I can buy a brand new complete >engine from Holden for approx $5000, which makes the $1800 for a bare S/C >seem a little high :-( >> >> >> >> > > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 02:21:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA20305 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 02:21:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA20301 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 02:21:25 -0400 Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id CAA20617; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 02:21:23 -0400 Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net by eagle.ptialaska.net (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id WAA09452; Tue, 28 Apr 1998 22:19:23 -0800 Message-ID: <3546C73B.2D9F0ECA@eagle.ptialaska.net> Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 22:22:52 -0800 From: Webb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Black Oak Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I recently came across mention of a new microcontroller, intended for ECU automotive applications. It is by Motorola - code named "Black Oak" based on a power pc architecture, with lots of stuff on chip. Any body know where more info, samples, software etc might be found?. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 05:11:33 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA21260 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 05:11:33 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA21256 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 05:11:29 -0400 Received: from pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.103]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA16144 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 19:11:25 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 19:11:25 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804290911.TAA16144@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I like the idea of the extra power from the V8, but are you SURE that the VN/VP V8s will drop straight in??? I don't want the bother of stuffing around with crossmember modifications, and the like. This is my one and only car, and I can't afford to have it off the road for too long (putting in a VK EFI would have it off the road for long enough, as it is...). In any case, what sort of mileage might I get with the 5.0, and a 5 speed box? I assume that by a "red motor head" you mean the head from a VB, or earlier, and not the red head from an EFI Black motor??? Is your red motor converted for ULP??? And please don't tell me to get a 3.0L VL motor... Firstly, they're the noisiest brutes I've come across, and secondly, I have heard nasty things about having to do all sorts of crossmember mods (otherwise, I would go for the VL over the VK any day...). How can I get into contact with Shannons??? I live in Hobart, is there an office down here? Thanks for the advice... Danny Barrett. >Danny, > >Just drop in a 5.0L VN/VP much better and Shannons won't even ask any questions >(join a car club and they'll let you have race insurance as well for not a >great deal more). As for licensing, not a problem as the VC came standard with >a 5.0L. The VK was a pretty crap attempt at pollution control, but if you want >to go this way throw the heads and air pump away and replace with red motor >heads if possible. > >If interested I have a red motor for sale, 179 with 4 speed (XU-1 close ratio), >motor built for racing (but was never raced at the track), 10K genuine road km >since rebuild (used to drive it to work everyday). Fully race prepped heads, >etc, etc. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 05:16:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA21304 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 05:16:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA21300 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 05:16:48 -0400 Received: from pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.103]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA16848 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 19:16:45 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 19:16:45 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804290916.TAA16848@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu G'Day Peter, Thanks for the info. You have just confirmed what I had suspected (both with the engine, and the aero). What sort of prices would I be looking at for the aero kits? Also, do you know of any way to "re-attach" the airflow at the back of the roof? What format is the attached file (REHolden)????? >G'Day, > >VK 3.3 into the VC would be very straight forward, although I'd suggest getting the entire fuel system from the VK (i.e fuel tank + pump, hi pressure lines etc). The EFI is controled by a pretty crapppy by todays standards analog computer. You might want to get a cheap aftermarket proper EFI computer such as a Microtec Digi (about $650 Aus). VK EFI had extractors standard. > >Try Shannons for insurance. > >As for Aerodynamics, the VB-K where good for their time but poor by todays standards. Try Freedon or SSV (in Sydney for a body kit) > >Peter >Attachment Converted: H:\MAIL\REHolden > From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 05:40:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id FAA21679 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 05:40:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id FAA21675 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 05:40:49 -0400 Received: from pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.103]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id TAA19578 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 19:40:46 +1000 (EST) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 19:40:46 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804290940.TAA19578@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu G'Day Steve, My blue motor is the 2.8L version. Would the VK computer cope with this change (at least until I could get a real computer)??? I don't plan any engine mods, apart from hardened valves and seats, remap the distributor, and run it on ULP (eventually). What do the complete VK EFI systems you have seen include? do they include the fuel tank, pump, head, engine block, etc, or are they supposed to bolt onto any 3.3 or 2.8 Holden motor? How can I contact Shannons? It's unfortunate that my car is a brick... So obviously no ideas forthcoming for that??? Thanks for your advice. Danny Barrett. >Be simpler and cheaper to just bolt on the VK EFI gear to your existing >engine, I suspect. Certainly I know someone who did this with an LJ >Torana, BUT he used a Haltech ECU to run the VK hardware. This is the only >way to go if you plan on any engine mods as the VK uses a version of the >Bosch L-Jet system (analogue) which is not particularly suited to >'modification', although there are things that can be done. I've seen >complete VK EFI systems advertised recently for around $700 or so, but >should be able to do better than that. A Haltech F9 (fuel only) costs >about $1100, but for $1400 you could get a Wolf 3D which would probably be >better (fuel and ign). > >Try Shannons or ring a few brokers for modified vehicle insurance. Also >CAMS offers mod. veh. insurance through QBE, but you have to be a member of >an affiliated club. Costs about $200 pa for TPO, but there is an option >for fire and theft (at extra cost, of course !!). > >How _do_ you make a brick more aerodynamic........... ;-) > >Steve Lamb From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 09:31:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA23165 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 09:31:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ihgw2.lucent.com (ihgw2.lucent.com [207.19.48.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA23161 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 09:31:26 -0400 Received: from hfcnfs.hobl.lucent.com by ihig2.firewall.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-L sol2) id IAA04294; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 08:21:01 -0500 Received: from lucent.com by hfcnfs.hobl.lucent.com (SMI-8.6/EMS-1.3.1 sol2) id JAA29698; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 09:30:56 -0400 Message-ID: <3546E326.E45EA690@lucent.com> Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 09:21:58 +0000 From: Angel Gomez Organization: Lucent Technologies X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.03 [en]C-EMS-1.3.1 (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Black Oak References: <3546C73B.2D9F0ECA@eagle.ptialaska.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu The latest EE times calls this the MPC555 which has a PowerPC core, 448K of Flash, 26K SRAM, Two UARTS, Two Queued Analog to Digital Converters, A multichannle serial module, Ignition, Injection, and Transmission control modules. Two CAN bus controllers too. I suspect the latter functions are just different micro-code in the RISC co-processor. Temp range of -40 to +125 C. Its on page 49 of the April 27th issue. Looks like a real winner in the automotive controller race. The PowerPC allows high level programming and 20MIPS, while the RISC does all the real-time work. It might be possible to build a whole control module with this one chip, and driver transistors alone. Hope this helps, Angel Webb wrote: > > I recently came across mention of a new microcontroller, intended > for ECU automotive applications. It is by Motorola - code named > "Black Oak" based on a power pc architecture, with lots of stuff > on chip. > > Any body know where more info, samples, software etc might be > found?. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 10:04:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA23453 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 10:04:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com ([206.130.240.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA23449 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 10:04:09 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0yUXVm-00017lC; Wed, 29 Apr 98 10:07 EDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: Black Oak To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 10:07:02 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: <3546C73B.2D9F0ECA@eagle.ptialaska.net> from "Webb" at Apr 28, 98 10:22:52 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > I recently came across mention of a new microcontroller, intended > for ECU automotive applications. It is by Motorola - code named > "Black Oak" based on a power pc architecture, with lots of stuff > on chip. > > Any body know where more info, samples, software etc might be > found?. > email Motorola's engineering dept tell them you belong to an EFI mailing list and you want to get the entire list on the Beta test program for the system if you get on you get free samples, dev kits, engineering suport, software design support etc. and the PPC archtechture is easy to program for compared to raw code or x86 PM memory map goo Clive From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 10:32:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA23828 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 10:32:47 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com ([206.130.240.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA23823 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 10:32:41 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0yUXxK-00019MC; Wed, 29 Apr 98 10:35 EDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 10:35:30 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: <01BD736B.978DF600.dzorde@soanar.com.au> from "Dan Zorde" at Apr 29, 98 12:37:36 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > You don't, which is why you just add more power and accept the extra fuel bill. > > How _do_ you make a brick more aerodynamic........... ;-) not really true try to keep as much air as possible from going under the brick lowering it or adding spoilers fron and rear can help alot also plugging up any extra airflow around the rad or front bulkhead can help with this (and cooling as well) Clive From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 11:17:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA24484 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:17:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24480 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:17:43 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-23.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.41]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id LAA06744 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:16:47 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: 101 Stuff Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:17:57 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd7381$fd6d0e00$29198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu We here at CSH., HQ., are experiencing a technical problem. While slightly off list, the edge is blurring here between personal and 101 projects. Anyway, we need a couple things. 1. a set of ecm connectors like used on the 747's (it used two connectors), 2. a set off a 730 type ecm (it had three connectors), with like a foot (preferably more) of wire on them for doing some bench work. 3. Then a entire harness outta like a 90-91 2.8 Celebrity, or any other 1227730 ecm equipped car. Not looking for freebies, just resonable priced ones. Nor a worry mate. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 11:27:36 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA24625 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:27:36 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA24620 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:27:34 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-23.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.41]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id LAA10033 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:26:36 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 11:27:47 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd7383$5d31d9a0$29198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Wednesday, April 29, 1998 11:19 AM Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. Is there a picture of one online somewhere? What Clive mentioned is very true. Had a 71 Pinto at one time, and slotted the bumper brackets, so it fit more flush up to the body, and spaced the grill out to the front of the hood. Then filled in everything that was an air leak, and ducted things to the radiator. Also did an abbreviated 69 Boss 302 type spoiler. Been 20 years, but did some roll down tests, and it all helped. Bruce From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 13:41:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id NAA26510 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 13:41:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from portoweb.com.br (proibm3.procempa.com.br [200.248.222.108]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id NAA26506 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 13:41:01 -0400 Received: from meucomp ([200.248.209.213]) by portoweb.com.br (8.8.4/8.6.9) with ESMTP id RAA25218 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 17:43:33 GMT Message-Id: <199804291743.RAA25218@portoweb.com.br> From: "Jose Carlos Rublescki" To: Subject: Lambda sensor (O2 sensor) fuel dependancy. Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 14:39:39 -0300 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1157 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm working on a car which runs with ethanol alcohol (NOT methanol) and I've installed an O2 sensor. Should the sensor readings be interpreted the same manner as if the car were running with gasoline? Anyone has had any experience with this? Thanks in advance, Jose Carlos Rublescki From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 14:28:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA27138 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 14:28:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from trinidad.net (calypso.trinidad.net [196.32.32.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA27134 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 14:28:52 -0400 Received: from mora.petrotrin.com (stratus.petrotrin.com [196.32.33.8]) by trinidad.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id PAA05717 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 15:28:45 -0400 (EDT) Received: by mora.petrotrin.com with Microsoft Mail id <01BD7378.B1A51DE0@mora.petrotrin.com>; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 14:11:24 -0400 Message-ID: <01BD7378.B1A51DE0@mora.petrotrin.com> From: Robin Bujhawan To: "'DIY_EFI@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: Books on gasoline to propane conversion (FI) Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 14:18:15 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I'm looking for some good books on conversion of gasoline to propane on fuel injected engines (cars mostly). Any help appreciated. Robin. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 14:41:52 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id OAA27339 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 14:41:52 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from uswgco3.uswc.uswest.com (uswgco3.uswest.com [206.196.133.82]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id OAA27335 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 14:41:50 -0400 Received: from egate2.mnet.uswest.com (mailgate.uswc.uswest.com [151.117.138.135]) by uswgco3.uswc.uswest.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id MAA29343 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 12:41:49 -0600 (MDT) Received: from easthub.mnet.uswest.com (easthub.mnet.uswest.com [151.117.26.86]) by egate2.mnet.uswest.com (8.7.1/8.7.1) with SMTP id NAA04139 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 13:41:46 -0500 (CDT) Received: from minmail.uswc.uswest.com (minmail.uswc.uswest.com [151.116.144.17]) by easthub.mnet.uswest.com (8.6.11/8.6.11) with ESMTP id NAA16953 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 13:39:42 -0500 Received: from sp5-316 ([151.116.173.81]) by minmail.uswc.uswest.com (Netscape Mail Server v2.02) with SMTP id AAA24316 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 12:43:57 -0600 Message-ID: <354773A3.1D2C@minmail.uswc.uswest.com> Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 12:38:27 -0600 From: Steven Ciciora Organization: Capacity Provisioning, Littleton, CO X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (X11; I; SunOS 5.5.1 sun4m) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@esl.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: re: DIY'ers EPROM Burner Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I plan on laying out a PCB and putting together a kit for the below. I'm going to offer it at cost, and am trying to get it as cheap as possible. So if your construction skills are marginal or are not as experienced as others, if you wait a few weeks, I should be announcing more details. Depending on a lot of things (such as ZIF sockets, power supply, etc) I'm hoping for the cost to be under $30. Now if only someone could find a bunch of $15 eprom erasers... Steven Ciciora P.S. I already have an eprom programmer for my self; my only motivation is to contribute what I can to the Loyal Order of the Cone Shaped Hat. ------------------------------ From: "Derek Jewett" Date: Tue, 28 Apr 1998 20:23:08 -0700 Subject: DIY'ers EPROM Burner Ok the 2732 update has been added to the DIY'ers EPROM burner. Please note that the 2732 hack has not been tested as of yet, but the unit works fine for burning 27128/256/512,etc... It is a hobbyists grade plan so the plans are a little akward, if you have trouble reading the hand drawn schematics let me know I have a well laid out schemaic I can save as a metafile and send you a copy. This project was originaly intended for burning video game cartriges and turned into a more "generic" burner I thought would be usefull for any DIY'er wanting to read/burn his own chips for fun. As you will see the design is incredibly simple, and flexible, even for cone shaped hat wearers!. Enjoy! The specific URL for the EPROMr FAQ page is , however most of you will want to go to and download the new version of the software archive (approx. 555K). This zip file also contains the FAQ document. Derek PS Soon to be added a DIY'ers plan for making your own cone shaped hat!!!!! ------------------------------ From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 15:16:13 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id PAA27787 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 15:16:13 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from lsi.lsil.com (lsi.lsil.com [147.145.40.2]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id PAA27780 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 15:15:54 -0400 Received: from mhbs.lsil.com ([147.145.29.36]) by lsi.lsil.com with ESMTP id MAA27405 (8.6.12/IDA-1.6 for ); Wed, 29 Apr 1998 12:10:00 -0700 Received: from [147.145.143.10] by mhbs.lsil.com; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 12:09:51 -0700 Received: from mm104.minn by mms10 (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id OAA05902; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 14:09:40 -0500 Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 14:09:40 -0500 From: mdill@lsil.com (Mike Dillon) Message-Id: <199804291909.OAA05902@mms10> To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu, nacelp@bright.net, dave.williams@chaos.lrk.ar.us, MikeTurner@kemet.com, ECMnut@aol.com, Tmatthe1@worldnet.att.net, mweber@lsil.com, dpainter@anv.net, gparmer@acesag.auburn.edus.com, scicior@uswest.com Subject: PROM carriers are here ! Cc: mdill@lsil.com Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hey Guys I have been informed that the carriers are here. I will pick them up tomarrow and start shipping them out later this week. I think I have everyone's name who experessed an interest in them. I need to firm up the XX ish. They came in at 25 cents/each + shipping. I think shipping should be pretty cheap they are pretty light and small. This is what I have for orders : Bruce Plecan 50 Mike V ~50 Thomas Matthews 25 Mike Weber ~100 Mike Turner 25-50 ( Let me know Mike ) Steve Ciciora 25 ish Mike Dillon ~25 ish Dave Williams 12-25 ish (let me know Dave) Requests after order was placed (Lets see if we can get these guys some) Dan Painter ~25 Greg Parmer a few. If I missed anyone speak now, book keeping is not my strong point. (We have 350 I think tere is enough to keep everone happy) Shoot me a sanail mail address, and when I get them shipped I will let you know what the total came to, If your worried about shipping cost let me know what the cut off on shippng charges are so you don't get sticker shock. ( I think shipping is going to be less than $ 5.00 for each of the orders) Latter Mike D. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 18:19:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA29718 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 18:19:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ingenico.com.au ([203.10.64.225]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA29713 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 18:19:35 -0400 Received: from PJARAMAZ [10.10.10.34] by ingenico.com.au [10.10.10.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP0.R) for ; Thu, 30 Apr 98 08:22:13 +1000 Received: by PJARAMAZ with Microsoft Mail id <01BD7410.D0079AE0@PJARAMAZ >; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:20:19 +1000 Message-ID: <01BD7410.D0079AE0@PJARAMAZ > From: Peter Jaramaz To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:20:18 +1000 Encoding: 48 TEXT, 57 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Danny, A typical "Aero" kit for an early commodore would set you back around $1000 fitted (perhaps a little less depending on style). Theres a kit available thats suited for VB-VK and based on the GTS-R. Looks good on the early cars. Reattaching airflow - not too clued on aerodynamics. Try talking to the kit manufacturers. Peter ---------- From: Danny Barrett Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 1998 7:16 PM To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. G'Day Peter, Thanks for the info. You have just confirmed what I had suspected (both with the engine, and the aero). What sort of prices would I be looking at for the aero kits? Also, do you know of any way to "re-attach" the airflow at the back of the roof? What format is the attached file (REHolden)????? >G'Day, > >VK 3.3 into the VC would be very straight forward, although I'd suggest getting the entire fuel system from the VK (i.e fuel tank + pump, hi pressure lines etc). The EFI is controled by a pretty crapppy by todays standards analog computer. You might want to get a cheap aftermarket proper EFI computer such as a Microtec Digi (about $650 Aus). VK EFI had extractors standard. > >Try Shannons for insurance. > >As for Aerodynamics, the VB-K where good for their time but poor by todays standards. Try Freedon or SSV (in Sydney for a body kit) > >Peter >Attachment Converted: H:\MAIL\REHolden > begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(A,6`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M6YA;6EC!_;QSO0$>`' ``0`` M`"\```!213H@2&]L9&5N($-O;6UO9&]R92P@26YS=7)A;F-E+"!!97)O9'EN M86UI8W,N```"`7$``0```!8````!O7.\_8&-ALL/X ,1T;Z[`$ %7RIO```> M`!X,`0````4```!33510`````!X`'PP!````&0```'!J87)A;6%Z0&EN9V5N M:6-O+F-O;2YA=0`````#``808 C:T ,`!Q!N! ``'@`($ $```!E````2$E$ M04Y.62Q!5%E024-!3")!15)/(DM)5$9/4D%.14%23%E#3TU-3T1/4D573U5, M1%-%5%E/54)!0TM!4D]53D0D,3 P,$9)5%1%1"A015)(05!304Q)5%1,14Q% M4U-$15!%3@`````"`0D0`0```$,%```_!0``N @``$Q:1G7Q?"95_P`*`0\" M%0*D`^0%ZP*#`% 3`U0"`&-H"L!S973N,@8`!L,"@S(#Q@<3`H.Z,Q,-?0J M",\)V3L5_W@R-34"@ J!#;$+8&[P9S$P,Q0@"PH2\@P!@F,`0"!(:2!$`' 8 M;GDL"H4*A4$@=!!Y<&EC!T @(D'!!)!O(B!K:05 `A"+!< #D64*P&QY( 6@ M1FT$806P92!W"&!L)&0@$?$@>0A@(&)-`-!K'= #8'5N'U D+QD@(- =D!UP M= F ("@6< 20$0N 9R "(!]@'' B M<"GP+B!4: 20!Y$B$!UBO&%V"W +8 )@'O!T$\$=44RU"4B0@3&]O:P0@9Z\HL">G'A41T2X; M?%(>$%L"0 #0:"-2"W!R&-!OH0?@+2!N;P5 ="BP%QY@"D$GHV$=$61Y;MQA M;1R@*E D,'(>4 &0?FP=8"-A+/ GXQUB`X%UNF8`T'0(< 20*EY0$@#/!) ; M? KT(C Q."#0`@#@:2TQ-#0-\ S0- /Y"UDQ-@J@`V A0#!P+(!?-B<*AS3; M## UID8#83K/-RXUI@R"&P0@0@K %@!_`D VSS?=!F ",#D/.AM7Y0F ;@>0 M9&$;4!-P-: )`Q$R.4!@,3DY.-@@-SHU<#' 33N_-]V<5&\]_SH;(T!Y7PW M3&E 1B$90#(N"?!G9"YO*\!O+2/ )=!E&4; 9'5![SS.=6)JIS7A1 \Z&U)% M2F!(!O#?#; #H A0'I5 8$D`@ AP?0!P8TUQ'0(N!S(O,S,SGC8TIQ0B# $U MID\/QJ=2/ 'F%4 M4"P@!X ?4/YW)<%-D%31'U%50"&0,'#?(5(&X"6P'P`=<&@*A2F#?QD`"X!- M<2P!^C:RRP!^!:T5L`0.Z9N( ) +R-8DV\`31[A9@I0 M`R!S>2/ 99YM'9 #86JD)P`H:4; )V_T`9!3@" K6O!U;?YP0& KP J%-: B ML3"1(B$30 $>`'1C)!0@14:_5G!E856!;! &\"%18AY0WR(0!P M=Q >4/=V(2SP0#%S"H5'82" "Q'_(?$N(!60(W ><7*0,?%4A/\N0&Q27_ " M,"]2;M$B`681GR'0'= !@ 20`,!R:Q^!_S6A(9$*A742>78F`1&P'=!](?)- M'* ULQL`;$ :\"A'`: (8 5 )#8U(/!!GU5 )!$F\7425I)E>&P1OS!P!;!W M[BIF:6 Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA29792 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 18:24:41 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ingenico.com.au ([203.10.64.225]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id SAA29787 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 18:24:37 -0400 Received: from PJARAMAZ [10.10.10.34] by ingenico.com.au [10.10.10.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP0.R) for ; Thu, 30 Apr 98 08:29:36 +1000 Received: by PJARAMAZ with Microsoft Mail id <01BD7411.D884F4A0@PJARAMAZ >; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:27:43 +1000 Message-ID: <01BD7411.D884F4A0@PJARAMAZ > From: Peter Jaramaz To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:27:42 +1000 Encoding: 73 TEXT, 78 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Danny, The VN onwards V8 would physically bolt in no problems. Your main problem, depending on state, is the other mods that need to be made as the car may need to comply with emmissions regs for the year of the motor rather than the car. Stuff like unleaded type fuel filler neck (prob VL would fit), cat con, EGR(already fitte dI assume), air box(regs state you can't alter induction setup) etc. Also, they may get picky and require overall drive ratio (i.e box->diff->rubber) be very close to original as this can affect driveby emissions. Don't get me wrong - its an excellent conversion and I definetely recommend it but theres a lot of hidden work. BTW a 350 Chev bolts in. Castlemaine Rod Shop supplies a kit. A friend dit it to a VB SL/E on LPG. Ran very well. Best of all its a sleeper (i.e stock outside) - blown quite a few respectable doors off :-) Peter (Still wrestling with this damn MIME option - arrggghh) ---------- From: Danny Barrett Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 1998 7:11 PM To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. I like the idea of the extra power from the V8, but are you SURE that the VN/VP V8s will drop straight in??? I don't want the bother of stuffing around with crossmember modifications, and the like. This is my one and only car, and I can't afford to have it off the road for too long (putting in a VK EFI would have it off the road for long enough, as it is...). In any case, what sort of mileage might I get with the 5.0, and a 5 speed box? I assume that by a "red motor head" you mean the head from a VB, or earlier, and not the red head from an EFI Black motor??? Is your red motor converted for ULP??? And please don't tell me to get a 3.0L VL motor... Firstly, they're the noisiest brutes I've come across, and secondly, I have heard nasty things about having to do all sorts of crossmember mods (otherwise, I would go for the VL over the VK any day...). How can I get into contact with Shannons??? I live in Hobart, is there an office down here? Thanks for the advice... Danny Barrett. >Danny, > >Just drop in a 5.0L VN/VP much better and Shannons won't even ask any questions >(join a car club and they'll let you have race insurance as well for not a >great deal more). As for licensing, not a problem as the VC came standard with >a 5.0L. The VK was a pretty crap attempt at pollution control, but if you want >to go this way throw the heads and air pump away and replace with red motor >heads if possible. > >If interested I have a red motor for sale, 179 with 4 speed (XU-1 close ratio), >motor built for racing (but was never raced at the track), 10K genuine road km >since rebuild (used to drive it to work everyday). Fully race prepped heads, >etc, etc. begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(BL6`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 969I,S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!E9FDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M6YA;6EC`' ``0`` M`"\```!213H@2&]L9&5N($-O;6UO9&]R92P@26YS=7)A;F-E+"!!97)O9'EN M86UI8W,N```"`7$``0```!8````!O7.^!C&-ALL3X ,1T;Z[`$ %7RIO```> M`!X,`0````4```!33510`````!X`'PP!````&0```'!J87)A;6%Z0&EN9V5N M:6-O+F-O;2YA=0`````#``80$.-PW0,`!Q"!" ``'@`($ $```!E````2$E$ M04Y.62Q42$563D].5T%21%-6.%=/54Q$4$A94TE#04Q,64)/3%1)3DY/4%)/ M0DQ%35-93U5234%)3E!23T),14TL1$5014Y$24Y'3TY35$%412Q)4U1(14]4 M2$5234]$4P`````"`0D0`0````$)``#]" ``P0X``$Q:1G6!.T2H_P`*`0\" M%0*D`^0%ZP*#`% 3`U0"`&-H"L!S973N,@8`!L,"@S(#Q@<3`H-&,P/%`@!P M2P*A0$*A51H92!63B -`B!W"Q$$(%8X('=! M"&!L9"!P:!4@:>)C!T!L>2 &X05 "X!X(&YO'V #8 )@%5!SZBX='%D(82 ` MP"!Q(-54+" -L' )\&0+@&=U'E$@%3!A%4 C4 0`(/IT'@%O).$B<01P),(D M8-<@D G@'U!T(+!B'A `P/D-L"!A),0?P")R( `F)KT%H&T+4" ``_ DX" 5 M4+IM! %I`B $(!>@9P0@)P(0!< DXGEE"L%O9N\DTP1@)G %P'(D8"5")=%+ M`Z G52X&`'1U#= @R&QI:QX0=6XA$";AO291>2.0*D *4 ,@9@,0AR$0!< F M(&-K("@@TLT>($P?!2\@="DC4!_ "P5 !:!N(U!%1U(H?P= %Z FX" `,-$5 M0"-@2?DG$7-U!X Q`0MP!< &X'QX*"H#)$,JP A@)X%N/B<%0 = %4 %P N M9'4<8W0IL20P$@!U<"D)*4!T8RT@06QS;^\C4"3A( `GTF<2`!]@'[">:R ` M`' ?4!>@<74SL/TE`78$D!_1(V %$#F0*^(S*; OT&DN'A SX2T^1R/ #= [ M0')U8B:@R$0(V!O!; $("L@*S Z5"TI'1Q01G%R M2:4H_RU +S%#<5,Q+: CX2D#/A.(9&%M`Z!-24U1D4\%,#8R0^ *P')G78!H MCFA8S0KT+: Q.# "T>!I+3$T- WP#-!?PWD+63$V2< #8!5 /N$M7V'G2:=@ MFPPP869&`V$Z?V+N868,@ARD2_!=41(`=+]BCV.=!F ",&3/9=M7"8!])B!S M7" <\!-P%, #$3(B.2-0,3DY'O W.C(Q'&!036=_8YU4;Z=IOV7;(\!Y7T8Q M0$8Q31K@,CK@&J N;SX@;WXM)$,ZX#7P;:]HCCO0:J<^T6_/9=M2178@2 ;P MOTD2"% I8 1P!; D@4D`@+\(< !P1)!L(020!'!Y/:#-*7!C(4Y>QC,V8&=" M!?]A9C+P+:,DXE6Q2% K)41P_G0K\!]@5D E40-2)-,>X,\C4$>B"L TM%-5 M> `EQ,T00@7P/P.=-.LG]Q/7!H(%(__X301?)"PQZ 1.$D MX@;@)3/_*R$5,"UA(]%)I0K "& XT?2)SE1).(@H 0`3S%'@><[P!5 !"!))SHQ*)$G`>^("6$*(;@0@ M*"4C`_%Y,OM)I1\49R"P*E8P03F"@%3WD@"6,5P1>96C'1QX0 ?@_SYBF.0+ M@"AC`C `T)DE3I!_',$IP834+:"2X@.@>$!B_0K ="26.5$`<$FE6&$?L+]7 MXE911_*;/1WP`'!K*CA_)N"Q@$20E:$='&:K(5T^Y1R[/L.62G5308/3D4+W MF<*I<8+S;38`*3 FH#*A_Z$TNO8?`34R3,!)(2<@+\"?EC@Y(%,Q*;/#EBAJ MK!#_QB(GDCS .]"*%JMP.=$A$/\%0#32DL,K\+XQ"X!YA2<2_U+"*D.ADDA0 MPY8)P27Q?J'_J&%Y$971$W J-"V@1) `@9\:H"-0SZ0@U2<65D,G@?]#421! M(["OF"D#PY;&1$ A_QWSD@`>@$@R%,!G03RA*_#_3L D8!5!!3$E\7^P'^!' ML/@_^GBYT'%@"9$.@10M$E2R/+W/)!K\=%R1A\P1J+.`M?! M_T\`HB6)\<.6-N$C4#;B'1R_>U]@9QO5869)I1;!`/D``````P`0$ `````# M`!$0`0```$ `!S#@8ZL1O7.]`4 `"##@8ZL1O7.]`1X`/0`!````!0```%)% 0.B ``````P`--/TW```8G'.] ` end From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 20:19:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA30952 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 20:19:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from digger1.defence.gov.au (digger1.defence.gov.au [203.5.217.4]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA30948 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 20:19:40 -0400 Received: from exchsa1.dsto.defence.gov.au (exchsa1.dsto.defence.gov.au [131.185.2.94]) by digger1.defence.gov.au (8.7.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id JAA21387 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:47:43 +0930 (CST) Received: from fang.dsto.defence.gov.au ([131.185.2.5]) by exchsa1.dsto.defence.gov.au with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Internet Mail Service Version 5.5.1960.3) id J8D7XRVV; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:49:35 +0930 Received: from hotblk.dsto.defence.gov.au (hotblk.dsto.defence.gov.au [146.221.39.21]) by fang.dsto.defence.gov.au (8.8.5/8.8.5) with SMTP id JAA00956 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:49:31 +0930 (CST) Received: from [146.221.36.211] ([146.221.36.211]) by hotblk.dsto.defence.gov.au with SMTP; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:13:26 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: In-Reply-To: References: <01BD736B.978DF600.dzorde@soanar.com.au> from "Dan Zorde" at Apr 29, 98 12:37:36 pm Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 10:19:55 +1000 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Steve Lamb Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >> >> You don't, which is why you just add more power and accept the extra >>fuel bill. >> >> How _do_ you make a brick more aerodynamic........... ;-) > >not really true ......and I wasn't _really_ serious, thus the "smiley" (sheesh..............) >try to keep as much air as possible from going under the brick >lowering it or adding spoilers fron and rear can help alot >also plugging up any extra airflow around the rad or front bulkhead can help >with this (and cooling as well) > >Clive Steve Lamb Department of Defence, DSTO Aeronautical and Maritime Research Laboratory 506 Lorimer Street Fishermans Bend VIC 3207 Australia Tel: +61 3 9626 7525 Fax: +61 3 9626 7089 IZCC #180 From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 20:54:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id UAA31320 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 20:54:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.arlec.com.au (mail.arlec.com.au [203.36.152.195]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id UAA31315 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 20:53:55 -0400 Received: by mail.arlec.com.au from localhost (router,SLMail V2.6); Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:48:06 +1000 Received: by mail.arlec.com.au from default (192.1.8.200::mail daemon; unverified,SLMail V2.6); Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:48:05 +1000 Received: by localhost with Microsoft MAPI; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 10:48:08 +0800 Message-ID: <01BD7425.7638FC60.dzorde@soanar.com.au> From: Dan Zorde To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 10:48:07 +0800 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet E-mail/MAPI - 8.0.0.4211 Encoding: 44 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I see your point, I don't know if the VC used the same cross member for the 6 and 8 or whether they were different (if it's a part of the front end, ie not detachable, I'll bet it's the same one, just change engine mount), anyway just give any Holden dealer or wrecker a call. Mileage wise, don't know that either, but it would have to be very similar to that of the VN/VP, go to a library and look through the old issues of Wheels Magazine for the VN or VP road test. Red motor head, yes referring back to the Kingswood motors, and no its not built for ULP, in fact it prefers a 70/30 super/avgas mix. I agree with staying away from the Nissan 3L, it's a very nice motor in the Nissan, but you'll have air pocket problem in the Commodore due to radiator mounting height restrictions. Dan dzorde@soanar.com.au -----Original Message----- From: Danny Barrett [SMTP:danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au] Sent: Wednesday, 29 April, 1998 5:11 PM To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. I like the idea of the extra power from the V8, but are you SURE that the VN/VP V8s will drop straight in??? I don't want the bother of stuffing around with crossmember modifications, and the like. This is my one and only car, and I can't afford to have it off the road for too long (putting in a VK EFI would have it off the road for long enough, as it is...). In any case, what sort of mileage might I get with the 5.0, and a 5 speed box? I assume that by a "red motor head" you mean the head from a VB, or earlier, and not the red head from an EFI Black motor??? Is your red motor converted for ULP??? And please don't tell me to get a 3.0L VL motor... Firstly, they're the noisiest brutes I've come across, and secondly, I have heard nasty things about having to do all sorts of crossmember mods (otherwise, I would go for the VL over the VK any day...). How can I get into contact with Shannons??? I live in Hobart, is there an office down here? Thanks for the advice... Danny Barrett. From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 22:13:45 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA32234 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 22:13:45 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (westbyserver.westby.mwt.net [156.46.73.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA32229 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 22:13:39 -0400 Received: from kb4mxo (ppp44.oec.mwt.net [156.46.76.174]) by westbyserver.westby.mwt.net (8.8.7/8.8.6) with ESMTP id VAA16208 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 21:13:48 -0500 (CDT) Message-ID: <3547DC00.D27CBC60@mwt.net> Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 21:03:45 -0500 From: Steven Gorkowski X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: "diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu" Subject: o-scope for sale for 101ers X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu 101ers I have a 100 MHZ portable storage oscilloscope for sale for $75 ( + shipping ) to a person working on Programming 101 that needs a scope . This is my cost. It is a Philips dual trace analog storage scope PM 3266 with Operators Manual / Service Manual . This is not a beginners scope has 40 + buttons , knobs and switches. It you want more information contact me off line. Hope this is ok to post. Thanks Steve kb4mxo@mwt.net From diy_efi-owner Wed Apr 29 22:56:29 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA32686 for diy_efi-outgoing; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 22:56:29 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net (eagle.ptialaska.net [198.70.245.243]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id WAA32682 for ; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 22:56:25 -0400 Received: from eagle.ptialaska.net by eagle.ptialaska.net (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id SAA16492; Wed, 29 Apr 1998 18:54:09 -0800 Message-ID: <3547E8B0.721484D0@eagle.ptialaska.net> Date: Wed, 29 Apr 1998 18:57:53 -0800 From: Ron & Cathy Webb X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Black Oak References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Good idea. I'll let you know what happens...Bet you thought you were kiddin'! Samples are like women - you don't get if you don't ask! Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020 wrote: . > >snip> > email Motorola's engineering dept > tell them you belong to an EFI mailing list and you want to get the entire > list on the Beta test program for the system > > if you get on you get free samples, dev kits, engineering suport, software > design support etc. > > Clive From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 02:34:32 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA01301 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 02:34:32 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA01297 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 02:34:28 -0400 Received: from dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id CAA24539; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 02:34:28 -0400 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id BAA06494; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 01:34:24 -0500 (CDT) Received: from nbw-nj14-06.ix.netcom.com(198.211.225.198) by dfw-ix15.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma006466; Thu Apr 30 01:34:07 1998 Message-ID: <35481BBE.3BE6@ix.netcom.com> Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 02:35:42 -0400 From: Ed X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DIY_EFI@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu, dfi@kens.com Subject: Urgent, Need help with a DFI harness Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Here's the situation. I'm wiring an Accel DFI system onto a 4-cylinder turbo engine. Now the store (JG Engine Dynamics) told my friend that this is a plug-and-play system...so far it's been more like plug and pray. It's just a hacked-up LT1 harness with some poor solder work, nicked insulation (hidden with tape) and no sort of additional info included by them except for the Accel papers. Of course, since we need the car running on Friday, everytime we call JG, nobody answers or the line is busy >:-( Murphy's law sucks. Now the problems: 1) We're supposed to wire the inductive pickup interface to the stock electronic distributor, using a 4pin-to-3pin adapter. Problem is there is no 4pin adapter on the main harness (as shown on the included info). Apparently JG must have chopped this connector off. So what I'd like to know is what colors were these wires going to the connector? The wires on the 3-pin side are purple, orange, and black. 2) There's supposed to be a 3-pin (color black) plug for the TPS. Again, there's no plug..another fine modification by JG. What color wires go to the TPS, and what is each wire's purpose? 3) This DFI computer is supposed to have a base program designed for this engine. The engine has variable valve timing triggered by RPM, but theres nothing shown on the paperwork that mentions if this computer has the RPM trigger (usually used for nitrous). Any way I can tell through physical description of the wiring? We don't have the calmap software (dyno place does), but I'd like to know before we finalize the wiring. Thanks in Advance, Ed From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 03:47:38 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA01739 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 03:47:38 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA01734 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 03:47:34 -0400 Received: from pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.103]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA20943 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 17:47:31 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 17:47:31 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804300747.RAA20943@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu G'day Clive, What if I were to put a cold air induction collector all the way across the car, just behind the engine bay - what doesn't go in the engine gets pushed out from under the car??? Danny Barrett. >> You don't, which is why you just add more power and accept the extra fuel bill. >> >> How _do_ you make a brick more aerodynamic........... ;-) > >not really true >try to keep as much air as possible from going under the brick >lowering it or adding spoilers fron and rear can help alot >also plugging up any extra airflow around the rad or front bulkhead can help >with this (and cooling as well) > >Clive > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 03:56:48 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id DAA01810 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 03:56:48 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id DAA01806 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 03:56:46 -0400 Received: from pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.103]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id RAA22638 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 17:56:45 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 17:56:45 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804300756.RAA22638@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu G'day there, Try this site... http://www.uq.net.au/~zznweber/vc/vc-main.html and: http://www.uq.net.au/~zznweber/vc/vc-sle.html I tried to make the underbody of the car more aerodynamic (as an experiment) by covering it all with duct tape, but it didn't stick properly (even after a good scrub clean underneath), so it created just as much drag as it got rid of - ie. it didn't work... Tell me what you think about the car... would the things you suggested wouk for it??? Danny Barrett. >Is there a picture of one online somewhere? > >What Clive mentioned is very true. Had a 71 Pinto at one time, and slotted >the bumper brackets, so it fit more flush up to the body, and spaced the >grill out to the front of the hood. Then filled in everything that was an >air >leak, and ducted things to the radiator. Also did an abbreviated 69 Boss >302 >type spoiler. Been 20 years, but did some roll down tests, and it all >helped. >Bruce > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 04:20:30 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA02091 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 04:20:30 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA02087 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 04:20:25 -0400 Received: from pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.103]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA26420 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 18:20:23 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 18:20:23 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804300820.SAA26420@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu G'Day Peter, Are there any pics on the net of cars with these kits on them? One thing I thought of was to put a cold air induction "collector" under the car, just behind the engine bay - the idea is that the air that doesn't get sucked into the engine gets pushed from under the car. Might this work, or would it make things worse??? Danny Barrett. >Hi Danny, > >A typical "Aero" kit for an early commodore would set you back around $1000 >fitted (perhaps a little less depending on style). Theres a kit available >thats suited for VB-VK and based on the GTS-R. Looks good on the early >cars. > >Reattaching airflow - not too clued on aerodynamics. Try talking to the kit >manufacturers. > >Peter > >---------- >From: Danny Barrett >Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 1998 7:16 PM >To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. > >G'Day Peter, >Thanks for the info. You have just confirmed what I had suspected (both >with >the engine, and the aero). What sort of prices would I be looking at for >the >aero kits? Also, do you know of any way to "re-attach" the airflow at the >back of the roof? > >What format is the attached file (REHolden)????? > >>G'Day, >> From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 04:33:58 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA02343 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 04:33:58 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id EAA02338 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 04:33:54 -0400 Received: from pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab3.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.103]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id SAA27917 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 18:33:52 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 18:33:52 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804300833.SAA27917@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu G'day, I've just been told that the VN/VP V8s should drop straight in. I believe the VC V8 engines would drop straight in, but my concern was that the motors on the VL and later were slightly different due to the different crossmembers, etc. ie. like the VL 3L motor - VC would need crossmember mods to fit it, and then a VL steering rack would possibly have to be put in (sounds like a pain in the butt to me...). Anyway, I'll get more opinions before I decide to either go for the V8, or shelve the idea. Thanks for your advice. Danny Barrett. PS: How would my stock standard 2.8L inline 6 go on AVGAS (I assume it's leaded...)??? >I see your point, I don't know if the VC used the same cross member for the 6 >and 8 or whether they were different (if it's a part of the front end, ie not >detachable, I'll bet it's the same one, just change engine mount), anyway just >give any Holden dealer or wrecker a call. Mileage wise, don't know that >either, but it would have to be very similar to that of the VN/VP, go to a >library and look through the old issues of Wheels Magazine for the VN or VP >road test. > >Red motor head, yes referring back to the Kingswood motors, and no its not >built for ULP, in fact it prefers a 70/30 super/avgas mix. I agree with >staying away from the Nissan 3L, it's a very nice motor in the Nissan, but >you'll have air pocket problem in the Commodore due to radiator mounting height >restrictions. > >Dan dzorde@soanar.com.au > >-----Original Message----- >From: Danny Barrett [SMTP:danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au] >Sent: Wednesday, 29 April, 1998 5:11 PM >To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. > >I like the idea of the extra power from the V8, but are you SURE that the >VN/VP V8s will drop straight in??? I don't want the bother of stuffing >around with crossmember modifications, and the like. This is my one and only >car, and I can't afford to have it off the road for too long (putting in a >VK EFI would have it off the road for long enough, as it is...). In any >case, what sort of mileage might I get with the 5.0, and a 5 speed box? > >I assume that by a "red motor head" you mean the head from a VB, or earlier, >and not the red head from an EFI Black motor??? Is your red motor converted >for ULP??? And please don't tell me to get a 3.0L VL motor... Firstly, >they're the noisiest brutes I've come across, and secondly, I have heard >nasty things about having to do all sorts of crossmember mods (otherwise, I >would go for the VL over the VK any day...). > >How can I get into contact with Shannons??? I live in Hobart, is there an >office down here? > >Thanks for the advice... > >Danny Barrett. > > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 04:38:28 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id EAA02446 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 04:38:28 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from crianlarich.indigo-avs.com (crianlarich.indigo-avs.com [194.200.210.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id EAA02442 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 04:38:26 -0400 Received: by crianlarich.indigo-avs.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BD741B.3A1A67F0@crianlarich.indigo-avs.com>; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:34:52 +0100 Message-ID: From: Robert Humphris To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:34:51 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 Encoding: 30 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Simple answer to this.. Lower the car to 1/8 inch off the ground, you will now have ground effect, and air will not flow under the car, to smooth any air that does lurk in that small space, get polypropalyne sheet, and cut a template of the under body of the car, rivet the sheet to the underbody of the car, it is best to use polyprop, as it flexes well, so you cover the underside of the suspension as well. On the top remove any guttering , but cutting and welding no more than 4 inches at a time. Then reshape the front of the car to make it more aerodynamic by driving at speed into the sloping side of a skip. What has this got to do with injection Rob Humphris > > >I tried to make the underbody of the car more aerodynamic (as an experiment) >by covering it all with duct tape, Well of course duct tape will work... All the top 'works' teams use it. > > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 07:18:06 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id HAA03780 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 07:18:06 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id HAA03776 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 07:18:02 -0400 Received: from pclab10.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab10.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.110]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id VAA14815 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 21:18:00 +1000 (EST) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 21:18:00 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804301118.VAA14815@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. AND NOW: WATER INJECTION... X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I hope you didn't bite while you were writing this... Your tongue was obviously firmly planted in your cheek. As for what it has to do with injection... Nothing, except for the original email message (this is about a fifth or sixth generation reply, and the stuff about EFI have gradually been removed as the questions were answered - all that remains is the aerodynamics stuff. Thanks for the ideas anyway (however sarcastic some of them may be :) ). O.K, here's something to do with injection... How can I build a simple "home made" water injection system, and how much water should I use? Can I simply splice another injector into an injector control line (in parallel), and use another fuel pump to pressurise the water? Danny Barrett. >Simple answer to this.. > >Lower the car to 1/8 inch off the ground, you will now have ground >effect, and air will not flow under the car, to smooth any air that does >lurk in that small space, get polypropalyne sheet, and cut a template of >the under body of the car, rivet the sheet to the underbody of the car, >it is best to use polyprop, as it flexes well, so you cover the >underside of the suspension as well. > >On the top remove any guttering , but cutting and welding no more than 4 >inches at a time. > >Then reshape the front of the car to make it more aerodynamic by driving >at speed into the sloping side of a skip. > >What has this got to do with injection > > >Rob Humphris > >> >> >>I tried to make the underbody of the car more aerodynamic (as an experiment) >>by covering it all with duct tape, > >Well of course duct tape will work... All the top 'works' teams use it. >> >> >> >> > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 08:30:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id IAA04409 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:30:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from mail.enter.net (root@mail.enter.net [204.170.70.6]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id IAA04403 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:30:12 -0400 From: rbraun@mail.enter.net Received: from rbraun (m40atwn-1-33.enter.net [204.170.16.43]) by mail.enter.net (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id IAA29533 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:30:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-Id: <199804301230.IAA29533@mail.enter.net> Comments: Authenticated sender is To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 08:38:26 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Subject: Re: Urgent, Need help with a DFI harness Priority: normal In-reply-to: <35481BBE.3BE6@ix.netcom.com> X-mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v2.54) Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu If this is a standard (batch fire) spark/fuel DFI system I can fax you the wire list from Accel. > 1) We're supposed to wire the inductive pickup interface to the stock > snip > (dyno place does), but I'd like to know before we finalize the wiring. > > Thanks in Advance, > Ed > > Randy Braun rbraun@enter.net 91 GTA 82 Firebird From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 09:04:00 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA04778 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:04:00 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com ([206.130.240.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA04773 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:03:57 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0yUt39-0001A3C; Thu, 30 Apr 98 09:06 EDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:06:54 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: <199804300747.RAA20943@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> from "Danny Barrett" at Apr 30, 98 05:47:31 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > G'day Clive, > What if I were to put a cold air induction collector all the way across the > car, just behind the engine bay - what doesn't go in the engine gets pushed > out from under the car??? only do this if you can collect all the air into the engine the rest will pile under the car and slow you down Clive > > Danny Barrett. > > > >> You don't, which is why you just add more power and accept the extra fuel > bill. > >> > >> How _do_ you make a brick more aerodynamic........... ;-) > > > >not really true > >try to keep as much air as possible from going under the brick > >lowering it or adding spoilers fron and rear can help alot > >also plugging up any extra airflow around the rad or front bulkhead can help > >with this (and cooling as well) > > > >Clive > > > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 09:05:42 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA04810 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:05:42 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from problem.tantech.com ([206.130.240.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA04804 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:05:40 -0400 Received: by problem.tantech.com (Smail3.1.29.1 #25) id m0yUt4p-0001A0C; Thu, 30 Apr 98 09:08 EDT Message-Id: Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:08:39 -0400 (EDT) From: "Clive Apps Techno-Logicals 416 510 0020" In-Reply-To: <199804300756.RAA22638@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> from "Danny Barrett" at Apr 30, 98 05:56:45 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > > G'day there, > Try this site... > http://www.uq.net.au/~zznweber/vc/vc-main.html > and: > http://www.uq.net.au/~zznweber/vc/vc-sle.html > > I tried to make the underbody of the car more aerodynamic (as an experiment) > by covering it all with duct tape, but it didn't stick properly (even after > a good scrub clean underneath), so it created just as much drag as it got > rid of - ie. it didn't work... > Tell me what you think about the car... would the things you suggested wouk > for it??? have a friend duct tape you to a chair I really doen't want to be driving on the same roads with you Clive > > > > >What Clive mentioned is very true. Had a 71 Pinto at one time, and slotted > >the bumper brackets, so it fit more flush up to the body, and spaced the > >grill out to the front of the hood. Then filled in everything that was an > >air > >leak, and ducted things to the radiator. Also did an abbreviated 69 Boss > >302 > >type spoiler. Been 20 years, but did some roll down tests, and it all > >helped. > >Bruce > > > > > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 09:07:57 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA04865 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:07:57 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from crianlarich.indigo-avs.com (crianlarich.indigo-avs.com [194.200.210.254]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA04861 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:07:56 -0400 Received: by crianlarich.indigo-avs.com with SMTP (Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5) id <01BD7440.DF323360@crianlarich.indigo-avs.com>; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 14:04:20 +0100 Message-ID: From: Robert Humphris To: "'diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. AND NOW: WATER INJECTION... Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 14:04:20 +0100 X-Mailer: Microsoft Exchange Server Internet Mail Connector Version 4.0.993.5 Encoding: 33 TEXT Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > I hope you didn't bite while you were writing this... Your tongue was obviously firmly planted in your cheek. Well yes, and no... 5mm sheet of Polypropalyne is cheap and will flatten off the underside of the car nicely. Lowering a car to 1/8 inch off the ground is what I have been told is the point at which formula1 ground effect was used in the 70's. Deseaming has been widely regarded as a good way of cleaning a cars aerodynamic profile. Some people cut off an entire seam and wonder why their car 'pops' open ( don't laugh this was a common mistake with Mini owners ) you should grind, weld, grind and weld along the seam/gutter no more than 4 inches at a time.... best that you do not start at one end and move along, cut 4 inches,weld, leave a gap of 4 inches then cut futher up ____----____----____----____---- then do the bits that you leave. On the works Triumph TR8 they deseamed and welded a roll cage in at the same time ( actually splitting the skin of the internal mounts and pillars welding the cage in then welding through the cat seam on the outside... that car was stiff and safe. > Thanks for the ideas anyway (however sarcastic some of them may be :) Sarcastic??? oh you mean the skip! That may have been ( you knew this because the skip idea would damage the radiator )... But surely you will allow a man to joke? No oh well then. But you cannot seriously mention Duct tape and not expect a shot across the bows, can you? Rob Humphris > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 09:52:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id JAA05871 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:52:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from iglou.com (sendmail@iglou1.iglou.com [192.107.41.3]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id JAA05867 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:52:01 -0400 Received: from Engineering.micro-tech-auto.com [204.255.238.71] by iglou.com with esmtp (8.7.3/8.6.12) id 0yUtkl-0007dJ-00; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:52:00 -0400 From: "Micro-Tech Automotive Industries" To: Subject: Re: o-scope for sale for 101ers Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:52:10 -0400 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Priority: 3 X-Mailer: Microsoft Internet Mail 4.70.1161 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Message-Id: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Steve, I am interested in buying the scope you have for sale. If you want we can do this via e-mail or by phone. You can give me a call at (800) 588-1588. Ask for Mike Mayo or dial extension 132. If you want, I could give you a call. Thanks. Mike ---------- : From: Steven Gorkowski : To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu : Subject: o-scope for sale for 101ers : Date: Wednesday, April 29, 1998 10:03 PM : : 101ers : I have a 100 MHZ portable storage oscilloscope for sale for $75 ( + : shipping ) to a person working on Programming 101 that needs a scope From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 10:17:55 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA06316 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 10:17:55 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imes.com ([209.184.4.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id KAA06312 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 10:17:52 -0400 Received: from elvis by imes.com (SMI-8.6/SMI-SVR4) id JAA19726; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:19:58 -0500 Message-ID: <35483EDD.540F@imes.com> Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 09:05:33 +0000 From: steve ravet Organization: International Meta Systems X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.01Gold (WinNT; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: o-scope for sale for 101ers References: <3547DC00.D27CBC60@mwt.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Steven Gorkowski wrote: > > 101ers > I have a 100 MHZ portable storage oscilloscope for sale for $75 ( + > shipping ) to a person working on Programming 101 that needs a scope . > This is my cost. It is a Philips dual trace analog storage scope PM 3266 > with Operators Manual / Service Manual . This is not a beginners scope > has 40 + buttons , knobs and switches. It you want more information > contact me off line. Hope this is ok to post. Thanks > > Steve > kb4mxo@mwt.net I'll take it. Where do I send money to, and what is acceptable (personal check, cashiers check, stamps, ???) -- Steve Ravet International Meta Systems http://www.imes.com steve@imes.com From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 10:25:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA06445 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 10:25:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA06438 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 10:25:11 -0400 Received: from pclab10.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab10.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.110]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id AAA04968 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:25:11 +1000 (EST) Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 00:25:11 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804301425.AAA04968@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Insurance, Aerodynamics. X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >> >> G'day Clive, >> What if I were to put a cold air induction collector all the way across the >> car, just behind the engine bay - what doesn't go in the engine gets pushed >> out from under the car??? > > >only do this if you can collect all the air into the engine >the rest will pile under the car and slow you down > >Clive Oh, @#%&%*@~@$#*&%%~%@#*&#!!!!!!! That @#@%*&%*##$*$ed up my day!!! Thanks anyway... From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 10:57:14 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id KAA07161 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 10:57:14 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from emerald.tufts.edu (pmdf@emerald.tufts.edu [130.64.1.16]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id KAA07157 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 10:57:11 -0400 Received: from tufts.edu (st1254.tc.tufts.edu) by emerald.tufts.edu (PMDF V5.1-10 #23568) with ESMTP id <0ES80049OEV6FO@emerald.tufts.edu> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 10:57:06 -0400 (EDT) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 10:56:52 -0400 From: Andris Skulte Subject: Re: Urgent, Need help with a DFI harness To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <35489134.7FFCEB23@tufts.edu> X-Envelope-to: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit References: <35481BBE.3BE6@ix.netcom.com> Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ed wrote: > 2) There's supposed to be a 3-pin (color black) plug for the TPS. > Again, there's no plug..another fine modification by JG. What color > wires go to the TPS, and what is each wire's purpose? TPS A Dk green (TPS return) goes to D1 on the DFI connector TPS B lt blue (TPS signal) goes to C1 TPS C yellow (+5V ref) goes to D5 > the RPM trigger (usually used for nitrous). Any way I can tell through > physical description of the wiring? All the DFI ECM's have this capability. I think it's off the global variables menu... You either ground or power pin B9 (nitrous enable) and then the output is B11 (nitrous solenoid) > We don't have the calmap software > (dyno place does), but I'd like to know before we finalize the wiring. If the software isn't copyrighted, I can email a copy, since you need their little black box anyways. The $200 for CALMAP and the cable is worth it if you plan on doing some tuning. HTH Andris -- *********Skulte Performance Designs---WWW.SKULTE.COM********** Your third and fourth generation f-body specialists ******89 IROC M5 305TPI---13.5@104.1--320 hp/475 ft-lbs******* From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 11:09:16 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id LAA07418 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:09:16 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id LAA07413 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:09:13 -0400 Received: from pclab10.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab10.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.110]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id BAA09390 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 01:09:12 +1000 (EST) Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 01:09:12 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804301509.BAA09390@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. AND NOW: WATER INJECTION... X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu I have to admit that I expected a few "shots." Mind you - it was only an experiment - the stuff definitely isn't there now!!! I didn't put it where the exhaust is (i didn't want it to melt and catch fire). Wouldn't the Polyprop sheet melt/catch on fire from the heat of the exhaust? Perhaps not (???) but I would prefer to be on the safe side of things (even if I did put duct tape under there)... So you weren't being "funny" with the 1/8"?!?!?! Somehow I don't think my car could get that low... But I'm told that about 2" is quite normal for this type of vehicle... As for the gutter, I think it is screwed on with my car :) but I would have to check to make sure. Either way, it isn't welded on, as it is chromed (unlike the rest of the car). So at worst, it is onlt riveted on (I know for a fact that the gutter is EITHER screwed on, OR riveted on, but from memory, I think it is screwed on). Thanks for the tips. I'll see what happens. Danny Barrett. >> I hope you didn't bite while you were writing this... Your tongue was > obviously firmly planted in your cheek. >Well yes, and no... > >5mm sheet of Polypropalyne is cheap and will flatten off the underside >of the car nicely. >Lowering a car to 1/8 inch off the ground is what I have been told is >the point at which formula1 ground effect was used in the 70's. >Deseaming has been widely regarded as a good way of cleaning a cars >aerodynamic profile. Some people cut off an entire seam and wonder why >their car 'pops' open ( don't laugh this was a common mistake with Mini >owners ) you should grind, weld, grind and weld along the seam/gutter no >more than 4 inches at a time.... best that you do not start at one end >and move along, cut 4 inches,weld, leave a gap of 4 inches then cut >futher up ____----____----____----____---- then do the bits that you >leave. >On the works Triumph TR8 they deseamed and welded a roll cage in at the >same time ( actually splitting the skin of the internal mounts and >pillars welding the cage in then welding through the cat seam on the >outside... that car was stiff and safe. > >> Thanks for the ideas anyway (however sarcastic some of > them may be :) > >Sarcastic??? oh you mean the skip! That may have been ( you knew this >because the skip idea would damage the radiator )... But surely you >will allow a man to joke? No oh well then. >But you cannot seriously mention Duct tape and not expect a shot across >the bows, can you? > > >Rob Humphris >> > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 12:42:07 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA08961 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 12:42:07 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from corinna.its.utas.edu.au (root@corinna.its.utas.edu.au [131.217.10.51]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id MAA08957 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 12:42:03 -0400 Received: from pclab10.eee.utas.edu.au (pclab10.eee.utas.edu.au [131.217.33.110]) by corinna.its.utas.edu.au (8.8.8/8.8.8) with SMTP id CAA18506 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 02:42:02 +1000 (EST) Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 02:42:02 +1000 (EST) Message-Id: <199804301642.CAA18506@corinna.its.utas.edu.au> X-Sender: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: danny_tb@postoffice.utas.edu.au (Danny Barrett) Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. AND NOW: WATER INJECTION... X-Mailer: Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ammendment: I mean to say 2" drop from standard is normal, not 2" clearance between the ground and the car... D.B... >I have to admit that I expected a few "shots." Mind you - it was only an >experiment - the stuff definitely isn't there now!!! I didn't put it where >the exhaust is (i didn't want it to melt and catch fire). Wouldn't the >Polyprop sheet melt/catch on fire from the heat of the exhaust? Perhaps not >(???) but I would prefer to be on the safe side of things (even if I did put >duct tape under there)... So you weren't being "funny" with the 1/8"?!?!?! >Somehow I don't think my car could get that low... But I'm told that about >2" is quite normal for this type of vehicle... As for the gutter, I think it >is screwed on with my car :) but I would have to check to make sure. Either >way, it isn't welded on, as it is chromed (unlike the rest of the car). So >at worst, it is onlt riveted on (I know for a fact that the gutter is EITHER >screwed on, OR riveted on, but from memory, I think it is screwed on). >Thanks for the tips. I'll see what happens. > >Danny Barrett. > > >>> I hope you didn't bite while you were writing this... Your tongue was >> obviously firmly planted in your cheek. >>Well yes, and no... >> >>5mm sheet of Polypropalyne is cheap and will flatten off the underside >>of the car nicely. >>Lowering a car to 1/8 inch off the ground is what I have been told is >>the point at which formula1 ground effect was used in the 70's. >>Deseaming has been widely regarded as a good way of cleaning a cars >>aerodynamic profile. Some people cut off an entire seam and wonder why >>their car 'pops' open ( don't laugh this was a common mistake with Mini >>owners ) you should grind, weld, grind and weld along the seam/gutter no >>more than 4 inches at a time.... best that you do not start at one end >>and move along, cut 4 inches,weld, leave a gap of 4 inches then cut >>futher up ____----____----____----____---- then do the bits that you >>leave. >>On the works Triumph TR8 they deseamed and welded a roll cage in at the >>same time ( actually splitting the skin of the internal mounts and >>pillars welding the cage in then welding through the cat seam on the >>outside... that car was stiff and safe. >> >>> Thanks for the ideas anyway (however sarcastic some of >> them may be :) >> >>Sarcastic??? oh you mean the skip! That may have been ( you knew this >>because the skip idea would damage the radiator )... But surely you >>will allow a man to joke? No oh well then. >>But you cannot seriously mention Duct tape and not expect a shot across >>the bows, can you? >> >> >>Rob Humphris >>> >> >> > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 12:43:35 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA08983 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 12:43:35 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA08977 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 12:43:31 -0400 Received: from dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id MAA09605; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 12:43:30 -0400 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id LAA14251; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:43:26 -0500 (CDT) Received: from nbw-nj9-39.ix.netcom.com(198.211.225.167) by dfw-ix10.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma014144; Thu Apr 30 11:43:12 1998 Message-ID: <3548AA77.5BD5@ix.netcom.com> Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 12:44:47 -0400 From: Ed X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: DIY_EFI@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu, dfi@kens.com Subject: Re: DFI: Urgent, Need help with a DFI harness References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Watson, Bill (Tempe) wrote: > > Someone fax him the 015013 wire list!! I'm at work now. > If anyone can fax this wire list, please send it to 732-775-3700, it's my friend's shop (and his car we're doing the DFI on). Thanks for all the help. -Ed From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 12:53:10 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id MAA09149 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 12:53:10 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu (coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu [128.146.90.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id MAA09144 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 12:53:07 -0400 Received: from dfw-ix12.ix.netcom.com by coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu via ESMTP (940816.SGI.8.6.9/940406.SGI) for id MAA09844; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 12:53:07 -0400 Received: (from smap@localhost) by dfw-ix12.ix.netcom.com (8.8.4/8.8.4) id LAA15307; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 11:52:28 -0500 (CDT) Received: from nbw-nj10-56.ix.netcom.com(207.94.119.120) by dfw-ix12.ix.netcom.com via smap (V1.3) id rma014923; Thu Apr 30 11:47:55 1998 Message-ID: <3548AB94.2F34@ix.netcom.com> Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 12:49:24 -0400 From: Ed X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-NC320 (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: dfi@kens.com CC: DIY_EFI@coulomb.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: DFI: Urgent, Need help with a DFI harness References: <3548AA77.5BD5@ix.netcom.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Ed wrote: > > If anyone can fax this wire list, please send it to 732-775-3700, it's > my friend's shop (and his car we're doing the DFI on). Thanks for all > the help. DOH! That's his phone line. His FAX number is 732-775-0427. Sorry about that. -Ed From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 18:06:41 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA12184 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 18:06:41 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from kauri.lincoln.ac.nz (kauri.lincoln.ac.nz [138.75.10.7]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA12179 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 18:06:35 -0400 Received: from whio.lincoln.ac.nz by kauri.lincoln.ac.nz (PMDF V5.1-9 #1) with ESMTP id <0ES800AXXYSGHN@kauri.lincoln.ac.nz> for diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Fri, 1 May 1998 10:07:32 +1200 (NZS) Received: from WHIO/SpoolDir by whio.lincoln.ac.nz (Mercury 1.40); Fri, 01 May 1998 10:06:22 +1200 Received: from SpoolDir by WHIO (Mercury 1.40); Fri, 01 May 1998 10:06:03 +1200 Date: Fri, 01 May 1998 10:03:41 +1200 From: Simon Quested Subject: Sun 1215 engine analyzer. To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Message-id: <0ES800AY1YSHHN@kauri.lincoln.ac.nz> Organization: Lincoln University MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Pegasus Mail for Win32 (v3.00 beta 10) Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT Priority: normal Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Guys I have been given a Sun 1215 engine analyzer from what I can gather it is mainly for ignition analysis but it all so has a gas sniffer, HO's CO's I think. Anyway the guy who gave it to me had US$1250 of work done on it and it was running great for a couple of months, then it didn't, the tech guy told him memory card had died. The guy who owned it is off overseas and was going to dump it if I didn't want it. Can anyone help me out with info on this beast as I'd like to get it up and running again. Cheers Simon ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ Simon Quested (E-mail questeds@lincoln.ac.nz) Computer Technician, Silicon Graphics & Windows NT Support Centre for Computing and Biometrics LINCOLN UNIVERSITY OF NEW ZEALAND Phone (64)(03) 3252811 Ext. 8087 ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ http://www.lincoln.ac.nz/ccb/techs/simon/default.htm ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I drive way too fast to worry about cholesterol ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 18:09:43 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id SAA12205 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 18:09:43 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id SAA12200 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 18:09:42 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas2-cs-44.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.113]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id SAA12510 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 18:08:47 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. AND NOW: WATER INJECTION... Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 18:09:59 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd7484$b724f6c0$71198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Danny Barrett To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. AND NOW: WATER INJECTION... >I hope you didn't bite while you were writing this... Your tongue was >obviously firmly planted in your cheek. As for what it has to do with >injection... Nothing, except for the original email message (this is about a >fifth or sixth generation reply, and the stuff about EFI have gradually been removed as >build a simple "home made" water injection system, and how much water should >I use? Can I simply splice another injector into an injector control line >(in parallel), and use another fuel pump to pressurise the water? > >Danny Barrett. > > I beleive Sir Harry Ricard used 30-50% of fuel volume as a norm. (this figure may have been primarily for turbo/supercharged appl). Lots of folks have used a windshield washer tank/motor as a dispenser (use a check valve so low manifold vacuum doesn't draw it out). Also anything more than just enough to get rid of the detonation is a waste of fluid. No real gains past that. Might be more info in archives, about this. ie injector types methods. Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 19:36:26 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id TAA13006 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 19:36:26 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from scarlet.buffalostate.edu (dave@scarlet2.buffalostate.edu [136.183.135.41]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id TAA13002 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 19:36:23 -0400 Received: from localhost (dave@localhost) by scarlet.buffalostate.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id TAA17341 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 19:36:24 -0400 Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 19:36:24 -0400 (EDT) From: "Dave J. Andruczyk" To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Sun 1215 engine analyzer. In-Reply-To: <0ES800AY1YSHHN@kauri.lincoln.ac.nz> Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu > I have been given a Sun 1215 engine analyzer from what I can gather it is > mainly for ignition analysis but it all so has a gas sniffer, HO's CO's I think. > Anyway the guy who gave it to me had US$1250 of work done on it and it was > running great for a couple of months, then it didn't, the tech guy told him > memory card had died. The guy who owned it is off overseas and was going to > dump it if I didn't want it. > Can anyone help me out with info on this beast as I'd like to get it up and > running again. I worked on an older SUN analyzer, that had an igntion scope ( 8 channel) with the diagnostic computer that tested the igntion and charging systems, and it also had a CO analyzer ( that didn't work cause all the hoses fell apart..) I donno the model num off hand but the prob with our machine was a blow rectifier in the power supply. (the scope had worked but the computer was down until i replaced it witha readio shack 35 amp bridge.. email me back direct if you need more info/help.. dave@scarlet.buffalostate.edu From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 22:41:15 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id WAA14140 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 22:41:15 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id WAA14136 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 22:41:12 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-14.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.32]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id WAA23257 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 22:40:14 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Clarifications on last Programming 101 Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 22:41:29 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd74aa$a4eb7a80$20198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Again please read all prior 101 text before trying to interupt this as a complete thought. I'm going to give a few examples of what a set of malfunction code flags look like and how they change in a given application. If we were to look a 747 bin file with a hex editor, we might see 050D 050E 050F FD 39 F9 would be stock FC 39 F9 would be no vss diagnostics (code 24) FD 39 79 would be no knock (code 43) FD 19 F9 would be no egr (code 32) I hope this shines a tad more light on the issue. Also note how unique the pattern seems against all the other table stuff. Also, an address might better discribe 16 bytes, and an address of say 0000+0001, rather than a location of say 0000.. Cheers Bruce We need a Cone Shaped Hat representative in washington, DC by the year 2000. If I start walking now I might make it in time.. From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 23:23:04 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA14627 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:23:04 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pm01sm.pmm.mci.net (pm01sm.pmm.mci.net [208.159.126.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA14623 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:23:02 -0400 Received: from default (usr44-dialup58.mix2.Atlanta.mci.net) by PM01SM.PMM.MCI.NET (PMDF V5.1-10 #27033) with SMTP id <0ES9004GIDE3LX@PM01SM.PMM.MCI.NET> for DIY_EFI@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Fri, 1 May 1998 03:22:55 +0000 (GMT) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:14:51 -0700 From: Strasser Subject: Fw: Supercharged 3800 To: DIY Message-id: <012801bd74c9$cbb30ec0$2c4937a6@default> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Priority: 3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu If you mount your S/C downstream of your TB, it seems you will see little top end gain unless you increase your TB size. Once the pressure drop across your TB reaches a maximum (in fluid dynamics terms, this is the point of "choking" -- sonic flow of a gas), it can "flow" no more...no matter what is pulling on the other side. For example, in carbureted applications, the installation of a roots type supercharger under the carb, requires increasing size of carb. Wayne Strasser Chemical Engineer EFI Patent Pending -----Original Message----- From: TBK To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Tuesday, April 28, 1998 9:23 PM Subject: Re: Supercharged 3800 The Eaton M-62 is ~$1700US new $1300 rebuilt. M-90 a little higher. Contact www.eaton.com TK -----Original Message----- From: Peter Jaramaz To: 'DIY_EFI' Date: Tuesday, April 28, 1998 4:27 PM Subject: Supercharged 3800 >Hi all, > >Q regrading S/C 3800. > >In Aus thay're fitted in Holdens. Drove one on the weekend in a LWB luxo barge Statesman and was extremely surprised by the grunt as well as the linear power delivery. > >Now, wanted to force induct my own earlier 3800, questions I have is if I mount the S/C between the engine and throttle body (with the MAP sensor on the throttle body), can I get away with running a 1 bar/atmo MAP sensor as the MAP would never see boost. > >My only concern is the MAP may be subject to too much vacuum under hi rev/lo TPS. > >Would this cause a problem? > >Any comments suggestions? > >Anyone Stateside know the price of a factory S/C for a 3800 - a local importer here has a new one but wants $1800. I can buy a brand new complete engine from Holden for approx $5000, which makes the $1800 for a bare S/C seem a little high :-( > > > > From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 23:23:05 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA14632 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:23:05 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from pm01sm.pmm.mci.net (pm01sm.pmm.mci.net [208.159.126.150]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA14628 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:23:05 -0400 Received: from default (usr44-dialup58.mix2.Atlanta.mci.net) by PM01SM.PMM.MCI.NET (PMDF V5.1-10 #27033) with SMTP id <0ES9004GIDE3LX@PM01SM.PMM.MCI.NET> for DIY_EFI@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu; Fri, 1 May 1998 03:22:57 +0000 (GMT) Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:22:57 -0700 From: Strasser Subject: Fw: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. AND NOW: WATER INJECTION... To: DIY Message-id: <012901bd74c9$cd0be800$2c4937a6@default> MIME-version: 1.0 X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.2106.4 Content-type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 7BIT X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.2106.4 X-Priority: 3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu I too am considering this as a mileage enhancement. I would have to discuss the potential gains for increasing the water input rate above that which is required for stopping detonation. Since the engine utilizes such a small fraction of usable mechanical energy from the combustion of fuel, alot escapes the exhaust (among other places...) By injecting more water, the normally-wasted heat energy is utilized to induce a phase change in the water from liquid to vapor, which obviously raises combustion chamber pressures since water (at STP) expands by a factor of ~ 1400 when evaporated. Obviously, there is some optimum point here, since the existence of water molecules in the chamber impedes radical electron transfer processes and drops temperatures (hence the impact on detonation). not sure where that optimum is....comments from all? Wayne Strasser Chemical Engineer EFI Patent Pending -----Original Message----- From: Bruce Plecan To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Thursday, April 30, 1998 4:15 PM Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. AND NOW: WATER INJECTION... From: Danny Barrett To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: RE: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. AND NOW: WATER INJECTION... >I hope you didn't bite while you were writing this... Your tongue was >obviously firmly planted in your cheek. As for what it has to do with >injection... Nothing, except for the original email message (this is about a >fifth or sixth generation reply, and the stuff about EFI have gradually been removed as >build a simple "home made" water injection system, and how much water should >I use? Can I simply splice another injector into an injector control line >(in parallel), and use another fuel pump to pressurise the water? > >Danny Barrett. > > I beleive Sir Harry Ricard used 30-50% of fuel volume as a norm. (this figure may have been primarily for turbo/supercharged appl). Lots of folks have used a windshield washer tank/motor as a dispenser (use a check valve so low manifold vacuum doesn't draw it out). Also anything more than just enough to get rid of the detonation is a waste of fluid. No real gains past that. Might be more info in archives, about this. ie injector types methods. Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Thu Apr 30 23:28:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id XAA14739 for diy_efi-outgoing; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:28:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo12.mx.aol.com (imo12.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.34]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id XAA14734 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:28:08 -0400 Received: from Ecmnuts@aol.com by imo12.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8RYQa14222 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:27:37 +2000 (EDT) From: Ecmnuts Message-ID: <3c01cb25.3549412a@aol.com> Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:27:37 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Clarifications on last Programming 101 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu In a message dated 98-04-30 22:50:47 EDT, you write: << FD 39 F9 would be stock FC 39 F9 would be no vss diagnostics (code 24) FD 39 79 would be no knock (code 43) FD 19 F9 would be no egr (code 32) I hope this shines a tad more light on the issue. >> It always helps when you just post the answers...Waiting for more info thanks. You could always just speed things up a little and post everything you have now. Why drag it out? From diy_efi-owner Fri May 1 00:04:09 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA15441 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:04:09 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from imo14.mx.aol.com (imo14.mx.aol.com [198.81.17.36]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA15436 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:04:06 -0400 Received: from ECMnut@aol.com by imo14.mx.aol.com (IMOv14.1) id 8KWVa15161 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:03:27 -0400 (EDT) From: ECMnut Message-ID: <3ffabd66.35494990@aol.com> Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 00:03:27 EDT To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Mime-Version: 1.0 Subject: Re: Clarifications on last Programming 101 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 3.0 for Windows 95 sub 62 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu ... << From: Ecmnuts@aol.com (Ecmnuts) >> Who ARE YOU?? I'm in plural ^^^^^^^ format now? Please sign your posts, so people that I respect don't think I'm raggin on'em Thanks, Mike V. (singular) ecmnut@aol.com From diy_efi-owner Fri May 1 00:22:59 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA15752 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:22:59 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ingenico.com.au ([203.10.64.225]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id AAA15735 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:22:07 -0400 Received: from PJARAMAZ [10.10.10.34] by ingenico.com.au [10.10.10.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP0.R) for ; Fri, 01 May 98 14:23:27 +1000 Received: by PJARAMAZ with Microsoft Mail id <01BD750C.6C334A80@PJARAMAZ >; Fri, 1 May 1998 14:21:25 +1000 Message-ID: <01BD750C.6C334A80@PJARAMAZ > From: Peter Jaramaz To: "'diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Supercharged 3800 Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 14:21:23 +1000 Encoding: 84 TEXT, 69 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sender: owner-diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Thanks for the reply, What would be the difference if the SC is mounted downstream (i.e after) compared to upstream (i.e before) the throttle body - to me it seems almost the same i.e interms of throttle body restriction, 10 psi vaccum after the TB vs 10 psi of pressure before the TB would result in the same flow across the TB. For me, mounting the SC after the TB would make for a cleaner install. BTW to all those interested, I can get the Eaton as fitted to the S/C 3800 for AUS$950 across the local parts counter. Peter ---------- From: Strasser Sent: Friday, May 01, 1998 4:14 PM To: DIY Subject: Fw: Supercharged 3800 If you mount your S/C downstream of your TB, it seems you will see little top end gain unless you increase your TB size. Once the pressure drop across your TB reaches a maximum (in fluid dynamics terms, this is the point of "choking" -- sonic flow of a gas), it can "flow" no more...no matter what is pulling on the other side. For example, in carbureted applications, the installation of a roots type supercharger under the carb, requires increasing size of carb. Wayne Strasser Chemical Engineer EFI Patent Pending -----Original Message----- From: TBK To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Tuesday, April 28, 1998 9:23 PM Subject: Re: Supercharged 3800 The Eaton M-62 is ~$1700US new $1300 rebuilt. M-90 a little higher. Contact www.eaton.com TK -----Original Message----- From: Peter Jaramaz To: 'DIY_EFI' Date: Tuesday, April 28, 1998 4:27 PM Subject: Supercharged 3800 >Hi all, > >Q regrading S/C 3800. > >In Aus thay're fitted in Holdens. Drove one on the weekend in a LWB luxo barge Statesman and was extremely surprised by the grunt as well as the linear power delivery. > >Now, wanted to force induct my own earlier 3800, questions I have is if I mount the S/C between the engine and throttle body (with the MAP sensor on the throttle body), can I get away with running a 1 bar/atmo MAP sensor as the MAP would never see boost. > >My only concern is the MAP may be subject to too much vacuum under hi rev/lo TPS. > >Would this cause a problem? > >Any comments suggestions? > >Anyone Stateside know the price of a factory S/C for a 3800 - a local importer here has a new one but wants $1800. I can buy a brand new complete engine from Holden for approx $5000, which makes the $1800 for a bare S/C seem a little high :-( > > > > begin 600 WINMAIL.DAT M>)\^(AD$`0:0" `$```````!``$``0>0!@`(````Y 0```````#H``$(@ <` M& ```$E032Y-:6-R;W-O9G0@36%I;"Y.;W1E`#$(`0V ! `"`````@`"``$$ MD 8`8 $```$````,`````P``, (````+``\.``````(!_P\!````80`````` M``"!*Q^DOJ,0&9UN`-T!#U0"`````&1I>5]E9FE 149),S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO M+7-T871E+F5D=0!33510`&1I>5]E9FE 149),S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E M+F5D=0`````>``(P`0````4```!33510`````!X``S !````(@```&1I>5]E M9FE 149),S,R+F5N9RYO:&EO+7-T871E+F5D=0````,`%0P!`````P#^#P8` M```>``$P`0```"0````G9&EY7V5F:4!%1DDS,S(N96YG+F]H:6\M``@0`0```&4```!42$%.2U-& M3U)42$5215!,62Q72$%45T]53$1"151(141)1D9%4D5.0T5)1E1(15-#25-- M3U5.5$5$1$]73E-44D5!32A)14%&5$52*4-/35!!4D5$5$]54%-44D5!32A) M14)%``````(!"1 !````IP<``*,'``#,#0``3%I&=1XN\%'_``H!#P(5`J0# MY 7K`H,`4!,#5 (`8V@*P'-E=.XR!@`&PP*#,@/&!Q,"@[HS$PU]"H (SPG9 M.Q7_>#(U-0* "H$-L0M@;O!G,3 S%" +"A+R# &28P! (%01P&YK!"##`A % MP'1H92 6``M0;'DL"H4*A5<1P 5 =V$(8&QD(&(;L!N29.T&D&8$D GP8QNP M!I ;@]Q30Q[0!" $8'4", F *1X@;W<`@'06`&%MT" H:2X;L&$!@ 20-"D@ M!:!M"K$@`71ON"!U<"!Z'< ;464A@&\;DAN0`V "0&PC(01P>7P@+2(B!X > MT 5 $?!EOFT$( = !& @Q<"C!QUD`,!K+O$%L6%_(9 D8 !P*J$+@"!P!T!LXBXQ6\,K$"EP_R586R(#\#;Q)9$\@#G!)&"S"H4B,' @"? =H&<+ MHAN2+!=D`V!P"H5_ M+V5B%B"1$; 'D31P`,!XWP=P*D$@X .@&-!U3( >(/QY;B"P*1 OL2=B*7 ; MD'Q(ND1L&]K,@$B0O$E@ (@GRD0+P0GL31P8(!S*2EP MVR5A.&(B+Q)JL&XE$2-QWBYML&U"'3 JDG<=(0J%_1^!)\@L M0,8$N43A@6M M`A#O<%%>L6W0$@`^"H50(AXP9'E?#L? M\"$`9%M /(4_ADZ$=JY$?M&"T0I0F^$LSCW&$TM-A(@'X%^)#&^-SKP.W!M, ?1D1 S.O&W%@!R4 ,0=# P MD( Y.\'U7R4@:)!G<'$P, A0`C"[`-!IAG>5`"$`.3(N(:$]CPU+@!^!+X(Z M/K,@2I,*P""P87J#('!JFB0N0#(!"? I$&^5DBYAJXEG4"(G4B%??H$GATD^ M U4;,<)H1V/E$;P0G 87]BESJ' M-8:FETD#H$%U+[+=3* G+'$YM2Y12 ;P#;#K`( P,$0#8'9P,7OA;^4^=PG@ M- !@42Y1-'!,5],K( I >&\*A6*CLD>QW7[1! HT7-2.#$1P*O!:*(>\-Y)"H5;9#I6'47W!KU,D#"@# M\!N0&X/X34%0)8$`@ 6Q`B!?EM\CWFPQ.&(X0#BB8:^@),!_O>.QH0,`,A$T MXP;@)B&TGTVW<6#@_R3 !: > MH02A:-6^<@# ),#_'<$L4%1S.A-U@!^@MR"^$'TJ`74J07;T:) *A18`=J8O M%9 :T%!3QI]7'7/?:(,X8*FP(1$L`6\"8"6PTC^F+D%NR )M!X ",/L$("Q0 M9SB@N.3/O]#!J_+SKL1PP2!K;4 'X&-4*1#[><,T<&:4806P), ZDC0T_SK3 M)."3$3RB;L8AP!6ARZ+_'G&Y868BD9*K\G)0'4&V`7\$()$0J#(X-7)0), T M<&+_1^!@49&2(:(D8!_P"H6\1=\#4JKU-"1RX -@>)' .[#_N')N@"D0OA S MXB^TVG,T)1^N83IS"H4EDI,,(#HM_BBF+N0?I&]8KQGJ0H8*A045(0#IL `# M`! 0``````,`$1 $````0 `',.!OWA>X=+T!0 `(,.!OWA>X=+T!'@`]``$` 8```%````4D4Z( `````#``TT_3<``)P. ` end From diy_efi-owner Fri May 1 00:24:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA15794 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:24:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA15790 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:24:22 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-14.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.32]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id AAA00091 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:23:22 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. AND NOW: WATER INJECTION... Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 00:24:36 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd74b9$0c71d380$20198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Strasser To: DIY Date: Thursday, April 30, 1998 11:58 PM Subject: Fw: Holden Commodore, Aerodynamics. AND NOW: WATER INJECTION... I too am considering this as a mileage enhancement. I would have to discuss the potential gains for increasing the water input rate above that which is required for stopping detonation. I beleive Sir Harry Ricard used 30-50% of fuel volume as a norm. (this figure may have been primarily for turbo/supercharged appl). Lots of folks have used a windshield washer tank/motor as a dispenser (use a check valve so low manifold vacuum doesn't draw it out). Also anything more than just enough to get rid of the detonation is a waste of fluid. No real gains past that. Might be more info in archives, about this. ie injector types methods. Cheers Bruce Sir Harry Ricardo has covered it in more detail than I mentioned his book "the High Speed Internal Combustion Engine", last revision 1965, is the best source of this, that I know of. I've seen no gain in MPG, and slight gains in HP in naturally aspirated engines. Now when ya talk turbos, I've had intakes hot enough to cook paint off of (60 PSI, of boost), and it makes a HUGE Increase in HP, when ya have the water right. And the 30-50% figures hold true for diesel, and gas in my experiences. I've also tried a humidifier set up where a percentage of the intake charge air was drawn from above a water trap type device. Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri May 1 00:38:47 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA16087 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:38:47 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from beavis.inetdirect.net (root@beavis.inetdirect.net [204.120.164.7]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA16082 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:38:45 -0400 Received: from inetdirect.net (p15-term7-ind.netdirect.net [204.248.210.184]) by beavis.inetdirect.net (8.8.5/8.7.3) with ESMTP id XAA29361 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:38:43 -0500 (EST) Message-ID: <3549417E.B9FA3CEA@inetdirect.net> Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 23:29:02 -0400 From: Scott Linder X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.04 [en] (Win95; I) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: looking for LinderTech References: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu james , the name is Jim Linder at www.lindertech.com or you can call direct at 317-487-9460 and talk to Jim Linder (the injector guru) or Doug Garriot ( the injector wizzard) . Both Guys are absolute genius status with injectors and have the best prices and service anywhere ! Their shop is on the gasoline Alley by the Indy 500 track in Indianapolis. Scooter. James Weiler wrote: > I'm looking for a Jeff (I think this is his first name) Linder (I hope > this is his last name). He operates an injector cleaning and flow testing > facility. I need some O-rings and those plastic end caps. I hope I'm > remembering the right guy, any help would be appreciated. > thanks everybody > jw From diy_efi-owner Fri May 1 00:59:23 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id AAA16522 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:59:23 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id AAA16518 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:59:20 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-14.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.32]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id AAA07324 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 00:58:23 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Clarifications on last Programming 101 Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 00:59:37 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd74bd$f0e01460$20198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu -----Original Message----- From: Ecmnuts To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu Date: Friday, May 01, 1998 12:06 AM Subject: Re: Clarifications on last Programming 101 It always helps when you just post the answers...Waiting for more info thanks. >You could always just speed things up a little and post everything you have now. Why drag it out? > What makes ya think I know anything more about these topics??.. Makes it kinda like a Tom Clancy novel. Lots of techno stuff, and ya just never know where the next turn is.. Cheers Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri May 1 01:08:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA16753 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 1 May 1998 01:08:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from sparticus.bright.net (sparticus.bright.net [205.212.123.14]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA16748 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 01:08:49 -0400 Received: from nacelp (dark-cas1-cs-14.dial.bright.net [209.143.25.32]) by sparticus.bright.net (8.9.0.Beta3/8.9.0.FNG_Build) with SMTP id BAA09062 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 01:07:53 -0400 (EDT) From: "Bruce Plecan" To: Subject: Re: Supercharged 3800 Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 01:09:07 -0400 Message-ID: <01bd74bf$4466b840$20198fd1@nacelp> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu From: Peter Jaramaz To: 'diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu' Date: Friday, May 01, 1998 12:52 AM Subject: RE: Supercharged 3800 >Thanks for the reply, > >What would be the difference if the SC is mounted downstream (i.e after) >compared to upstream (i.e before) the throttle body - to me it seems almost >the same i.e interms of throttle body restriction, 10 psi vaccum after the >TB vs 10 psi of pressure before the TB would result in the same flow across >the TB. > >For me, mounting the SC after the TB would make for a cleaner install. > >Peter > Is this TB for TBI or for a TPI?. If TBI then it means your displacing air out of the blower because of the fuel load. If multi port then ya want the injectors close to the blower so the fuel has time to absorb some of the heat out of the intake charge, rather than right up by the intake valve. All blowers need some lubrication. If the TB is upstream of the blower than the engine vacuum is going to try and draw this lube into the intake charge when closing the butterflies at high rpm. If the butterflies are below the blower it sees no vacuum during this period of overrun. HTH Bruce From diy_efi-owner Fri May 1 01:41:51 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id BAA17393 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 1 May 1998 01:41:51 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ns1.foothill.net (pop3.foothill.net [206.170.175.1]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with ESMTP id BAA17387 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 01:41:46 -0400 Received: from terryk (tahoe-d57.foothill.net [209.76.43.57]) by ns1.foothill.net (8.8.5/8.6.12) with SMTP id WAA14233 for ; Thu, 30 Apr 1998 22:41:50 -0700 (PDT) From: "TBK" To: Subject: Re: Supercharged 3800 Date: Thu, 30 Apr 1998 22:39:57 -0700 Message-ID: <01bd74c3$936a3da0$422b4cd1@terryk.foothill.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.71.1712.3 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.71.1712.3 Sender: owner-diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu What's the current exchange rate? TK -----Original Message----- From: Peter Jaramaz To: 'diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu' Date: Thursday, April 30, 1998 9:52 PM Subject: RE: Supercharged 3800 >Thanks for the reply, > >What would be the difference if the SC is mounted downstream (i.e after) >compared to upstream (i.e before) the throttle body - to me it seems almost >the same i.e interms of throttle body restriction, 10 psi vaccum after the >TB vs 10 psi of pressure before the TB would result in the same flow across >the TB. > >For me, mounting the SC after the TB would make for a cleaner install. > >BTW to all those interested, I can get the Eaton as fitted to the S/C 3800 >for AUS$950 across the local parts counter. > >Peter > >---------- >From: Strasser >Sent: Friday, May 01, 1998 4:14 PM >To: DIY >Subject: Fw: Supercharged 3800 > >If you mount your S/C downstream of your TB, it seems you will see little >top end gain unless you increase your TB size. Once the pressure drop >across your TB reaches a maximum (in fluid dynamics terms, this is the >point >of "choking" -- sonic flow of a gas), it can "flow" no more...no matter >what >is pulling on the other side. For example, in carbureted applications, the >installation of a roots type supercharger under the carb, requires >increasing size of carb. > > >Wayne Strasser >Chemical Engineer >EFI Patent Pending > >-----Original Message----- >From: TBK >To: diy_efi@efi332.eng.ohio-state.edu >Date: Tuesday, April 28, 1998 9:23 PM >Subject: Re: Supercharged 3800 > > >The Eaton M-62 is ~$1700US new $1300 rebuilt. M-90 a little higher. Contact >www.eaton.com > >TK >-----Original Message----- >From: Peter Jaramaz >To: 'DIY_EFI' >Date: Tuesday, April 28, 1998 4:27 PM >Subject: Supercharged 3800 > > >>Hi all, >> >>Q regrading S/C 3800. >> >>In Aus thay're fitted in Holdens. Drove one on the weekend in a LWB luxo >barge Statesman and was extremely surprised by the grunt as well as the >linear power delivery. >> >>Now, wanted to force induct my own earlier 3800, questions I have is if I >mount the S/C between the engine and throttle body (with the MAP sensor on >the throttle body), can I get away with running a 1 bar/atmo MAP sensor as >the MAP would never see boost. >> >>My only concern is the MAP may be subject to too much vacuum under hi >rev/lo TPS. >> >>Would this cause a problem? >> >>Any comments suggestions? >> >>Anyone Stateside know the price of a factory S/C for a 3800 - a local >importer here has a new one but wants $1800. I can buy a brand new complete >engine from Holden for approx $5000, which makes the $1800 for a bare S/C >seem a little high :-( >> >> >> >> > > > > From diy_efi-owner Fri May 1 02:14:39 1998 Return-Path: Received: (from mail@localhost) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) id CAA17732 for diy_efi-outgoing; Fri, 1 May 1998 02:14:39 -0400 X-Authentication-Warning: esl.eng.ohio-state.edu: mail set sender to owner-diy_efi using -f Received: from ingenico.com.au ([203.10.64.225]) by esl.eng.ohio-state.edu (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id CAA17728 for ; Fri, 1 May 1998 02:14:31 -0400 Received: from PJARAMAZ [10.10.10.34] by ingenico.com.au [10.10.10.1] with SMTP (MDaemon.v2.7.SP0.R) for ; Fri, 01 May 98 16:18:05 +1000 Received: by PJARAMAZ with Microsoft Mail id <01BD751C.6D1D1B00@PJARAMAZ >; Fri, 1 May 1998 16:15:58 +1000 Message-ID: <01BD751C.6D1D1B00@PJARAMAZ > From: Peter Jaramaz To: "'diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu'" Subject: RE: Supercharged 3800 Date: Fri, 1 May 1998 16:15:57 +1000 Encoding: 48 TEXT, 55 UUENCODE X-MS-Attachment: WINMAIL.DAT 0 00-00-1980 00:00 X-MDaemon-Deliver-To: diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Sender: owner-diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Precedence: bulk Reply-To: diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Hi Bruce, TB is for throttle body and definetely MPI. Blower will mount between engine and throttle body ala factory S/C 3800. Still have the MAP linearity probs we discussed. May investigrate using the MAF hotwire system. Peter ---------- From: Bruce Plecan Sent: Friday, May 01, 1998 3:09 PM To: diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu Subject: Re: Supercharged 3800 From: Peter Jaramaz To: 'diy_efi@EFI332.eng.ohio-state.edu' Date: Friday, May 01, 1998 12:52 AM Subject: RE: Supercharged 3800 >Thanks for the reply, > >What would be the difference if the SC is mounted downstream (i.e after) >compared to upstream (i.e before) the throttle body - to me it seems almost >the same i.e interms of throttle body restriction, 10 psi vaccum after the >TB vs 10 psi of pressure before the TB would result in the same flow across >the TB. > >For me, mounting the SC after the TB would make for a cleaner install. > >Peter > Is this TB for TBI or for a TPI?. If TBI then it means your displacing air out of the blower because of the fuel load. If multi port then ya want the injectors close to the blower so the fuel has time to absorb some of the heat out of the intake charge, rather than right up by the intake valve. All blowers need some lubrication. If the TB is upstream of the blower than the engine vacuum is going to try and draw this lube into the intake charge when closing the butterflies at high rpm. If the butterflies are below the blower it sees no vacuum during this period of overrun. 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