From bpatten at centurytel.net  Sun Oct  1 21:30:10 2006
From: bpatten at centurytel.net (Brendan Patten)
Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2006 21:30:10 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] dual 4cyl DIS module for v8 use?
In-Reply-To: <DBB2E4C4173F1749B6C7434140611783013B77E3@NASDAQ.usa.Arm.com>
Message-ID: <000501c6e5ca$b0207730$6400a8c0@p42000>

Okay, here's what I got going on.

2000 model Vortec 5.3L Gen III small block.

I want to use a 1227730 ecm with $8D code to control injection and
ignition on this.

I have already successfully changed the $8D code to work with DIS
ignition on my 3.1L v6.


I want to mount a 7x trigger wheel behind my harmonic damper, and mount
two crank sensors, 90 degrees apart.

I want to use two 4cyl DIS modules.

This should work to run wasted spark on the 8 cylinder.  The 4 cyl
modules spark every 180 degrees.  By placing second sensor 90 degrees
after first, I will now have spark every 90 degrees, alternating back
and forth from module to module.

Question I have is on the EST signal back to the module for timing
control.

Is this signal used only to tell the module at what advance to do, or
does the pulse from the ecm occur exactly when spark is desired?







From wopontour at hotmail.com  Sun Oct  1 22:05:00 2006
From: wopontour at hotmail.com (WopOnTour)
Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2006 21:05:00 -0600
Subject: [Gmecm] dual 4cyl DIS module for v8 use?
References: <000501c6e5ca$b0207730$6400a8c0@p42000>
Message-ID: <BAY122-DAV82C4285EC94F40AC7D3CFBA1F0@phx.gbl>

The EST signal directly controls the coil triggering, but it's created 
directly from the IGN REF signal from the DIS module (sourced from it's CKP 
sensor input) and time/phase shifted to create the appropriate advance on 
the "next cylinder"
Where are you proposing to connect the SECOND CKP input?
AFAIK what you are proposing would require 2 ECMs as you would require 2 
independent IGN REF signals in order to create a pair EST signals phased 90 
degrees from each other.
Why wouldn't you just use an older V8 DIS module? (Like the maybe the LT5 
version)
HTH
WOT
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Brendan Patten" <bpatten at centurytel.net>
To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2006 8:30 PM
Subject: [Gmecm] dual 4cyl DIS module for v8 use?


> Okay, here's what I got going on.
>
> 2000 model Vortec 5.3L Gen III small block.
>
> I want to use a 1227730 ecm with $8D code to control injection and
> ignition on this.
>
> I have already successfully changed the $8D code to work with DIS
> ignition on my 3.1L v6.
>
>
> I want to mount a 7x trigger wheel behind my harmonic damper, and mount
> two crank sensors, 90 degrees apart.
>
> I want to use two 4cyl DIS modules.
>
> This should work to run wasted spark on the 8 cylinder.  The 4 cyl
> modules spark every 180 degrees.  By placing second sensor 90 degrees
> after first, I will now have spark every 90 degrees, alternating back
> and forth from module to module.
>
> Question I have is on the EST signal back to the module for timing
> control.
>
> Is this signal used only to tell the module at what advance to do, or
> does the pulse from the ecm occur exactly when spark is desired?
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> 



From bpatten at centurytel.net  Sun Oct  1 22:18:58 2006
From: bpatten at centurytel.net (Brendan Patten)
Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2006 22:18:58 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] dual 4cyl DIS module for v8 use?
In-Reply-To: <BAY122-DAV82C4285EC94F40AC7D3CFBA1F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <000601c6e5d1$8317abd0$6400a8c0@p42000>

V8 module hard to find cheap.  I had a few 4cyl modules laying around.

Guess only option for this route is the 8cyl module.

-----Original Message-----
From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On
Behalf Of WopOnTour
Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2006 10:05 PM
To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] dual 4cyl DIS module for v8 use?

The EST signal directly controls the coil triggering, but it's created 
directly from the IGN REF signal from the DIS module (sourced from it's
CKP 
sensor input) and time/phase shifted to create the appropriate advance
on 
the "next cylinder"
Where are you proposing to connect the SECOND CKP input?
AFAIK what you are proposing would require 2 ECMs as you would require 2

independent IGN REF signals in order to create a pair EST signals phased
90 
degrees from each other.
Why wouldn't you just use an older V8 DIS module? (Like the maybe the
LT5 
version)
HTH
WOT
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Brendan Patten" <bpatten at centurytel.net>
To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 01, 2006 8:30 PM
Subject: [Gmecm] dual 4cyl DIS module for v8 use?


> Okay, here's what I got going on.
>
> 2000 model Vortec 5.3L Gen III small block.
>
> I want to use a 1227730 ecm with $8D code to control injection and
> ignition on this.
>
> I have already successfully changed the $8D code to work with DIS
> ignition on my 3.1L v6.
>
>
> I want to mount a 7x trigger wheel behind my harmonic damper, and
mount
> two crank sensors, 90 degrees apart.
>
> I want to use two 4cyl DIS modules.
>
> This should work to run wasted spark on the 8 cylinder.  The 4 cyl
> modules spark every 180 degrees.  By placing second sensor 90 degrees
> after first, I will now have spark every 90 degrees, alternating back
> and forth from module to module.
>
> Question I have is on the EST signal back to the module for timing
> control.
>
> Is this signal used only to tell the module at what advance to do, or
> does the pulse from the ecm occur exactly when spark is desired?
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> 

_______________________________________________
Gmecm mailing list
Gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm





From dunvegan at sbcglobal.net  Mon Oct  2 09:02:05 2006
From: dunvegan at sbcglobal.net (Rick McLeod)
Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 07:02:05 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Gmecm] HELP: MAF Burn-Off problem
In-Reply-To: <003101c6e43e$27ca9150$6501a8c0@danzyhome>
Message-ID: <20061002140205.56269.qmail@web80508.mail.yahoo.com>

This is great information, but it still doesn't quite answer my question:
 
Now, my question is: What does the ECM/code look for at shutdown to determine that the MAF burn-off cycle completed.


----- Original Message ----
From: Roger Danzy <rdanzy at cox-internet.com>
To: Rick McLeod <dunvegan at sbcglobal.net>; gmecm at diy-efi.org
Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 10:11:43 PM
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] HELP: MAF Burn-Off problem


Rick,

For CODE 365, per my 1986 Camaro/Firebird manual for the maf burnoff the ecm 
grounds circuit CKT 900 (the ground to the burnoff relay, terminal B) which 
cause the relay to close and supply battery voltage to MAF terminal D and 
also terminal E.  The suggested test sequences check for:
1) 12 volt supply to the maf burnoff relay
2) grounding CKT 900 closing the relay and checking for voltage at MAF 
terminals D and E.

If you don't get voltage at the maf terminal D, check the circuit from 
terminal A of the relay to terminal D of the maf.
If you don't get voltage at the maf terminal E, check the circuit from 
terminal A of the relay to terminal A of the maf power relay.  If there is 
no voltage at terminal A of the maf power relay, check the voltage at 
terminal D of the maf power relay.  If there is voltage at terminal D the 
maf power relay is bad.  Terminals A and D of the maf power relay are 
normally closed.  Terminals A and E are normally open and are close when the 
relay is grounded at terminal B.

The ecm is connect to terminals A, B and C of the maf.  I would assume that 
the ecm is monitoring the effect of the voltage of terminal E from the 
burnoff relay from terminal C of the maf which is the maf signal to the ecm. 
Terminal A is the system ground and B is the analog ground.

If you need more information, I can supply you the details of the Code 36 
test charts.


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Rick McLeod" <dunvegan at sbcglobal.net>
To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 1:29 PM
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] HELP: MAF Burn-Off problem


> Been there, done that, even swapped the MAF for known good unit, I've got 
> a Z/28 of same vintage and all and makes a decent comparo, except I'm 
> trying not to have to disturb the wiring on it also, it's isn't throwing 
> codes, which makes me suspect corroded grounds or connectors, the vette is 
> parked longer periods between it's exercise runs.
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: Mark Tonazzi <rmtonazzi at charter.net>
> To: Rick McLeod <dunvegan at sbcglobal.net>; gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 8:27:52 AM
> Subject: RE: [Gmecm] HELP: MAF Burn-Off problem
>
>
> I got MAF error codes when my ECM was crapping out.  It would run fine 
> until
> warmed up then intermittently it would throw a MAF  voltage high or 
> voltage
> low code and go into limp home mode.  If you can get your hands on another
> known good ECM may want to try that.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On 
> Behalf
> Of Rick McLeod
> Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 2:57 AM
> To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subject: [Gmecm] HELP: MAF Burn-Off problem
>
> IIRC: running $32b on '165 in '86 L98 vette, it's setting the 'obligatory'
> code 36 MAF sensor burn-off voltage missing. I've been down the road of 
> all
> the classic 'fixes' such as replacing the relay, cleaning the contacts,
> etc., and now tearing into wiring to try to find the problem.
>
> Part of the problem is that this signal only occurs after a warm engine
> shutdown, and IIRC the engine has to have been running for some period of
> time prior to trigger this diagnostic/service circuit into action at 
> engine
> shutdown. Makes for difficult diagnostics at best, but I've got to find 
> the
> headache.
>
> Plan of action is to 'tap' the wires to the MAF for monitoring signals. 
> Once
> that is done, I'll be able to monitor the activity since the 'tap' is 
> going
> to be a 4-wire trailer light socket so I can plug a 4-wire 'extender' into
> it and temporarily monitor it in the cabin until I get the problem fixed.
> Then I'll weather seal the stub connector and tuck tidily away into the 
> loom
> in case I need it again (suspect I may, this is a chronic problem w/ this
> version of MAF).
>
> Now, my question is: What does the ECM/code look for at shutdown to
> determine that the MAF burn-off cycle completed. IIRC the ECM has a line
> that enables the burn-off relay a few seconds after shutdown (which is 
> what
> I'll be monitoring at the MAF diag dongle above) but since there is NO air
> flow, does it look for some delta in the signal from the MAF (and, isn't 
> the
> BOSCH MAF a frequency based signal vs. the voltage based on the DELCO MAF
> variant?). Once I confirm that the MAF is receiveing burn-off voltage
> correctly at shutdown, then my next step is obviously to diag the signal 
> at
> the ECM, but what am I looking for, is it just the presense of signal due 
> to
> the MAF being energized post shutdown, or is it a change in the signal 
> from
> the ECM due to the burn-off causing a very hot heated wire, then cooling,
> hence that should cause a delta in the MAF signal seen by the computer.
>
> My hunch is that I'm actually fighting a poor current path, like maybe a
> high resistance fusible link or a corroded ground connection to the MAF
> which would cause it to work correctly but the high current demand by the
> burn-off cycle causes excessive drop in the supply/return path and not
> enough current passes to actually burn-off the element correctly.
>
> At any rate, knowledge is key, I can get lots of data, but what is it 
> going
> to tell me? What is normal opperating condition, so I know what to 'fix' 
> on
> this pesky critter.
>
> BTW, it works wonderfully from a drivability standpoint if I reset the 
> codes
> on the ECM and then drive, it warms up fine, and performance is normal but
> after that the next restart will have a check engine light and the code 
> will
> be set for this, and performance sucks big time, since it is not using MAF
> data I presume is using static or even worse I suspect LIMP mode?
>
> Sorry for wordy post, but info is key to getting quality responses and 
> this
> group has that quality.
>
> Cheers, thanks in advance
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm

From info at jenkinseng.com  Mon Oct  2 18:02:32 2006
From: info at jenkinseng.com (Peter Jenkins)
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2006 09:02:32 +1000
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
Message-ID: <001301c6e676$dd676cb0$6501a8c0@PETER>

have been trying with 1227808 using 2 6cyl dis coils for v12 
the only option was as previously mentioned ,run two ecu's
reason is  you double the rpm which you can work around but limits max rpm to half previous ie 3000rpm 
what I had in mind is a type of  x2 flip flop circuit on the est output double out put pulses and send them along alternating outputs but still run the second sensor to time the second dis pack in start up/limp mode
Have got a set up on a test bench that works in limp mode fine but can't get the x2 flip flop circuit to work as that is not my line of expertise 
> Peter Jenkins
> 10336 Murray River Rd
Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
> Australia.

> PH 0425 705764
> Email. info at jenkinseng.com 
> web. www.jenkinseng.com                                 DISCLAIMER
>  * This email and any attachment may contain confidential information.
>     If you are not the intended recipient you are not authorised to copy
>     or disclose all or any part of it without the prior written consent
>     of Jenkins Engineering.
>  * Opinions expressed in this email and any attachment are those of the
>    sender and not necessarily the opinions of Jenkins Engineering.
>  * Please scan this email and any attachment for viruses. Jenkins 
> Engineering does
>    not accept responsibility for problems caused by viruses, whether 
> it is Jenkins Engineering's fault or not!!!



From gary at garyandliz.com  Mon Oct  2 18:25:18 2006
From: gary at garyandliz.com (Gary Evans)
Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 16:25:18 -0700
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
In-Reply-To: <001301c6e676$dd676cb0$6501a8c0@PETER>
References: <001301c6e676$dd676cb0$6501a8c0@PETER>
Message-ID: <1ABFF087-632B-49C7-BFFD-9ABA3736E839@garyandliz.com>

Hm. Interesting. Let us know if you get it working. I am currently  
using a dual '730 ecu setup on my V12. It works great, but having 2  
ecus is an inelegant solution.


On Oct 2, 2006, at 4:02 PM, Peter Jenkins wrote:

> have been trying with 1227808 using 2 6cyl dis coils for v12
> the only option was as previously mentioned ,run two ecu's
> reason is  you double the rpm which you can work around but limits  
> max rpm to half previous ie 3000rpm
> what I had in mind is a type of  x2 flip flop circuit on the est  
> output double out put pulses and send them along alternating  
> outputs but still run the second sensor to time the second dis pack  
> in start up/limp mode
> Have got a set up on a test bench that works in limp mode fine but  
> can't get the x2 flip flop circuit to work as that is not my line  
> of expertise
>> Peter Jenkins
>> 10336 Murray River Rd
> Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
>> Australia.
>
>> PH 0425 705764
>> Email. info at jenkinseng.com
>> web. www.jenkinseng.com                                 DISCLAIMER
>>  * This email and any attachment may contain confidential  
>> information.
>>     If you are not the intended recipient you are not authorised  
>> to copy
>>     or disclose all or any part of it without the prior written  
>> consent
>>     of Jenkins Engineering.
>>  * Opinions expressed in this email and any attachment are those  
>> of the
>>    sender and not necessarily the opinions of Jenkins Engineering.
>>  * Please scan this email and any attachment for viruses. Jenkins
>> Engineering does
>>    not accept responsibility for problems caused by viruses, whether
>> it is Jenkins Engineering's fault or not!!!
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm



From b.shaw at comcast.net  Mon Oct  2 18:37:09 2006
From: b.shaw at comcast.net (Bill Shaw)
Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2006 19:37:09 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
In-Reply-To: <1ABFF087-632B-49C7-BFFD-9ABA3736E839@garyandliz.com>
References: <001301c6e676$dd676cb0$6501a8c0@PETER>
	<1ABFF087-632B-49C7-BFFD-9ABA3736E839@garyandliz.com>
Message-ID: <4521A2A5.7010803@comcast.net>

Dual ECUs has been standard in Ferraris since the beginning of time.  
OK,  maybe not the beginning of time,  but at least since they started 
using ECUs :-)

Before that they used dual distributors each with dual points.  Nothing 
wrong with dual. 

I thought your dual '730 setup was kind of slick :-)

Bill


Gary Evans wrote:
> Hm. Interesting. Let us know if you get it working. I am currently 
> using a dual '730 ecu setup on my V12. It works great, but having 2 
> ecus is an inelegant solution.
>
>
> On Oct 2, 2006, at 4:02 PM, Peter Jenkins wrote:
>
>> have been trying with 1227808 using 2 6cyl dis coils for v12
>> the only option was as previously mentioned ,run two ecu's
>> reason is  you double the rpm which you can work around but limits 
>> max rpm to half previous ie 3000rpm
>> what I had in mind is a type of  x2 flip flop circuit on the est 
>> output double out put pulses and send them along alternating outputs 
>> but still run the second sensor to time the second dis pack in start 
>> up/limp mode
>> Have got a set up on a test bench that works in limp mode fine but 
>> can't get the x2 flip flop circuit to work as that is not my line of 
>> expertise
>>> Peter Jenkins
>>> 10336 Murray River Rd
>> Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
>>> Australia.
>>
>>
>



From Steve.Ravet at arm.com  Mon Oct  2 21:09:52 2006
From: Steve.Ravet at arm.com (Steve Ravet)
Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 21:09:52 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
Message-ID: <DBB2E4C4173F1749B6C7434140611783013B7A92@NASDAQ.usa.Arm.com>

Peter, why don't you post what you've got so far to the gmecm TWIKI and
see if you can get some help.

--steve 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org 
> [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On Behalf Of Peter Jenkins
> Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 6:03 PM
> To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
> 
> have been trying with 1227808 using 2 6cyl dis coils for v12 
> the only option was as previously mentioned ,run two ecu's 
> reason is  you double the rpm which you can work around but 
> limits max rpm to half previous ie 3000rpm what I had in mind 
> is a type of  x2 flip flop circuit on the est output double 
> out put pulses and send them along alternating outputs but 
> still run the second sensor to time the second dis pack in 
> start up/limp mode Have got a set up on a test bench that 
> works in limp mode fine but can't get the x2 flip flop 
> circuit to work as that is not my line of expertise 
> > Peter Jenkins
> > 10336 Murray River Rd
> Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
> > Australia.
> 
> > PH 0425 705764
> > Email. info at jenkinseng.com 
> > web. www.jenkinseng.com                                 DISCLAIMER
> >  * This email and any attachment may contain confidential 
> information.
> >     If you are not the intended recipient you are not 
> authorised to copy
> >     or disclose all or any part of it without the prior 
> written consent
> >     of Jenkins Engineering.
> >  * Opinions expressed in this email and any attachment are 
> those of the
> >    sender and not necessarily the opinions of Jenkins Engineering.
> >  * Please scan this email and any attachment for viruses. Jenkins 
> > Engineering does
> >    not accept responsibility for problems caused by 
> viruses, whether 
> > it is Jenkins Engineering's fault or not!!!
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> 


--
The 2006 ARM Developers' Conference, October 3-5, Santa Clara, US 
Join ARM and its technology and tools Partners from around the world at the only industry event for developers of ARM Powered(R) solutions. 
http://www.arm.com/developersconference/


IMPORTANT NOTICE: The contents of this email and any attachments are confidential and may also be privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, please notify the sender immediately and do not disclose the contents to any other person, use it for any purpose, or store or copy the information in any medium.  Thank you.




From gary at garyandliz.com  Mon Oct  2 22:23:47 2006
From: gary at garyandliz.com (Gary Evans)
Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 20:23:47 -0700
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
In-Reply-To: <4521A2A5.7010803@comcast.net>
References: <001301c6e676$dd676cb0$6501a8c0@PETER>
	<1ABFF087-632B-49C7-BFFD-9ABA3736E839@garyandliz.com>
	<4521A2A5.7010803@comcast.net>
Message-ID: <6CB5E49E-9BE5-4BA0-B0AA-56C123595C1F@garyandliz.com>

Ferrari. Wow. I did not know that. The dual ECUs do have some  
advantages:

- Separate O2 feedback loop for each bank.
- One ecu can completely fail and you can still drive.
- Ability to do interesting things like partial DFCO and soft(er) rev  
limiter.

However, I would still love to see someone do a working single ECU  
setup, if only as an exercise in pushing what can be done with a GM ECM.

-Gary



On Oct 2, 2006, at 4:37 PM, Bill Shaw wrote:

> Dual ECUs has been standard in Ferraris since the beginning of  
> time.  OK,  maybe not the beginning of time,  but at least since  
> they started using ECUs :-)
>
> Before that they used dual distributors each with dual points.   
> Nothing wrong with dual.
> I thought your dual '730 setup was kind of slick :-)
>
> Bill
>
>
> Gary Evans wrote:
>> Hm. Interesting. Let us know if you get it working. I am currently  
>> using a dual '730 ecu setup on my V12. It works great, but having  
>> 2 ecus is an inelegant solution.
>>
>>
>> On Oct 2, 2006, at 4:02 PM, Peter Jenkins wrote:
>>
>>> have been trying with 1227808 using 2 6cyl dis coils for v12
>>> the only option was as previously mentioned ,run two ecu's
>>> reason is  you double the rpm which you can work around but  
>>> limits max rpm to half previous ie 3000rpm
>>> what I had in mind is a type of  x2 flip flop circuit on the est  
>>> output double out put pulses and send them along alternating  
>>> outputs but still run the second sensor to time the second dis  
>>> pack in start up/limp mode
>>> Have got a set up on a test bench that works in limp mode fine  
>>> but can't get the x2 flip flop circuit to work as that is not my  
>>> line of expertise
>>>> Peter Jenkins
>>>> 10336 Murray River Rd
>>> Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
>>>> Australia.
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm



From Pat.Ford at nrc-cnrc.gc.ca  Tue Oct  3 06:24:16 2006
From: Pat.Ford at nrc-cnrc.gc.ca (Ford, Pat)
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2006 07:24:16 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
In-Reply-To: <6CB5E49E-9BE5-4BA0-B0AA-56C123595C1F@garyandliz.com>
Message-ID: <626E1206D3466344A57EB7A268D4587F02D4182E@nrccenexb4.nrc.ca>

 bmw v12s as well!
Pat

-----Original Message-----
From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On
Behalf Of Gary Evans
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 11:24 PM
To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use

Ferrari. Wow. I did not know that. The dual ECUs do have some
advantages:

- Separate O2 feedback loop for each bank.
- One ecu can completely fail and you can still drive.
- Ability to do interesting things like partial DFCO and soft(er) rev
limiter.

However, I would still love to see someone do a working single ECU
setup, if only as an exercise in pushing what can be done with a GM ECM.

-Gary



On Oct 2, 2006, at 4:37 PM, Bill Shaw wrote:

> Dual ECUs has been standard in Ferraris since the beginning of time.  
> OK,  maybe not the beginning of time,  but at least since they started

> using ECUs :-)
>
> Before that they used dual distributors each with dual points.   
> Nothing wrong with dual.
> I thought your dual '730 setup was kind of slick :-)
>
> Bill
>
>
> Gary Evans wrote:
>> Hm. Interesting. Let us know if you get it working. I am currently 
>> using a dual '730 ecu setup on my V12. It works great, but having
>> 2 ecus is an inelegant solution.
>>
>>
>> On Oct 2, 2006, at 4:02 PM, Peter Jenkins wrote:
>>
>>> have been trying with 1227808 using 2 6cyl dis coils for v12
>>> the only option was as previously mentioned ,run two ecu's
>>> reason is  you double the rpm which you can work around but  
>>> limits max rpm to half previous ie 3000rpm
>>> what I had in mind is a type of  x2 flip flop circuit on the est  
>>> output double out put pulses and send them along alternating  
>>> outputs but still run the second sensor to time the second dis  
>>> pack in start up/limp mode
>>> Have got a set up on a test bench that works in limp mode fine  
>>> but can't get the x2 flip flop circuit to work as that is not my  
>>> line of expertise
>>>> Peter Jenkins
>>>> 10336 Murray River Rd
>>> Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
>>>> Australia.
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm

_______________________________________________
Gmecm mailing list
Gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm


From bpatten at centurytel.net  Tue Oct  3 18:29:44 2006
From: bpatten at centurytel.net (Brendan Patten)
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2006 18:29:44 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
In-Reply-To: <001301c6e676$dd676cb0$6501a8c0@PETER>
Message-ID: <000601c6e743$d3bc5cc0$6400a8c0@p42000>

I'm looking into the flip-flop idea.  This could work.  I too am not too
familiar with this area of electronics, however I am doing some reading
to try and figure this out.

Each module will send a ref pulse to the ecm 60 degree before each TDC
event.  The ECM then can send a signal pulse back to the module anytime
in the next say 60 degrees to fire the coil (saying max retard of 0 deg)
That leaves 30 degrees at a minimum to flip over to route the ecm's
signal to the other module. And so forth.

The thing I want to figure out, is how to synchronize module 1 ref,
output to module 1, module 2 ref, output to module 2, and so forth.

http://www.play-hookey.com/digital/

site I found so far, good intro to logic.

This making any sense to anyone?

-----Original Message-----
From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On
Behalf Of Peter Jenkins
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 6:03 PM
To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use

have been trying with 1227808 using 2 6cyl dis coils for v12 
the only option was as previously mentioned ,run two ecu's
reason is  you double the rpm which you can work around but limits max
rpm to half previous ie 3000rpm 
what I had in mind is a type of  x2 flip flop circuit on the est output
double out put pulses and send them along alternating outputs but still
run the second sensor to time the second dis pack in start up/limp mode
Have got a set up on a test bench that works in limp mode fine but can't
get the x2 flip flop circuit to work as that is not my line of expertise

> Peter Jenkins
> 10336 Murray River Rd
Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
> Australia.

> PH 0425 705764
> Email. info at jenkinseng.com 
> web. www.jenkinseng.com                                 DISCLAIMER
>  * This email and any attachment may contain confidential information.
>     If you are not the intended recipient you are not authorised to
copy
>     or disclose all or any part of it without the prior written
consent
>     of Jenkins Engineering.
>  * Opinions expressed in this email and any attachment are those of
the
>    sender and not necessarily the opinions of Jenkins Engineering.
>  * Please scan this email and any attachment for viruses. Jenkins 
> Engineering does
>    not accept responsibility for problems caused by viruses, whether 
> it is Jenkins Engineering's fault or not!!!

_______________________________________________
Gmecm mailing list
Gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm






From dvfagan at yahoo.com  Tue Oct  3 20:33:52 2006
From: dvfagan at yahoo.com (DV Fagan)
Date: Tue, 3 Oct 2006 18:33:52 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
In-Reply-To: <000601c6e743$d3bc5cc0$6400a8c0@p42000>
Message-ID: <20061004013352.14351.qmail@web30309.mail.mud.yahoo.com>

Brendan and Peter,
Short of adding a sensor which would electrically
select the coil pack to trigger, the flip-flop needs
to be a tiny microprocessor which takes trigger input
from the ecm and outputs triggers to the coil packs. 
It watches for cranking as indicated by the low input
trigger rate and then tries syncing pack A with the
next trigger and pack B with the following trigger. 
If after two seconds of cranking the engine doesn't
fire as indicated by an increased trigger rate, the
micro changes the pack A and pack B pairing with the
triggers and continues the cycle until the engine
fires.  It then retains the pairing until cranking is
detected again.  This can be built for under $10.
Dennis

--- Brendan Patten <bpatten at centurytel.net> wrote:

> I'm looking into the flip-flop idea.  This could
> work.  I too am not too
> familiar with this area of electronics, however I am
> doing some reading
> to try and figure this out.
> 
> Each module will send a ref pulse to the ecm 60
> degree before each TDC
> event.  The ECM then can send a signal pulse back to
> the module anytime
> in the next say 60 degrees to fire the coil (saying
> max retard of 0 deg)
> That leaves 30 degrees at a minimum to flip over to
> route the ecm's
> signal to the other module. And so forth.
> 
> The thing I want to figure out, is how to
> synchronize module 1 ref,
> output to module 1, module 2 ref, output to module
> 2, and so forth.
> 
> http://www.play-hookey.com/digital/
> 
> site I found so far, good intro to logic.
> 
> This making any sense to anyone?
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org
> [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On
> Behalf Of Peter Jenkins
> Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 6:03 PM
> To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
> 
> have been trying with 1227808 using 2 6cyl dis coils
> for v12 
> the only option was as previously mentioned ,run two
> ecu's
> reason is  you double the rpm which you can work
> around but limits max
> rpm to half previous ie 3000rpm 
> what I had in mind is a type of  x2 flip flop
> circuit on the est output
> double out put pulses and send them along
> alternating outputs but still
> run the second sensor to time the second dis pack in
> start up/limp mode
> Have got a set up on a test bench that works in limp
> mode fine but can't
> get the x2 flip flop circuit to work as that is not
> my line of expertise
> 
> > Peter Jenkins
> > 10336 Murray River Rd
> Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
> > Australia.
> 
> > PH 0425 705764
> > Email. info at jenkinseng.com 
> > web. www.jenkinseng.com                           
>      DISCLAIMER
> >  * This email and any attachment may contain
> confidential information.
> >     If you are not the intended recipient you are
> not authorised to
> copy
> >     or disclose all or any part of it without the
> prior written
> consent
> >     of Jenkins Engineering.
> >  * Opinions expressed in this email and any
> attachment are those of
> the
> >    sender and not necessarily the opinions of
> Jenkins Engineering.
> >  * Please scan this email and any attachment for
> viruses. Jenkins 
> > Engineering does
> >    not accept responsibility for problems caused
> by viruses, whether 
> > it is Jenkins Engineering's fault or not!!!
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe:
> http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe:
> http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> 


__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com 


From info at jenkinseng.com  Tue Oct  3 21:22:55 2006
From: info at jenkinseng.com (Peter Jenkins)
Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 12:22:55 +1000
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
References: <000601c6e743$d3bc5cc0$6400a8c0@p42000>
Message-ID: <001801c6e75c$05c45c00$6501a8c0@PETER>

have put diagrams at 
http://www.diy-efi.org/twiki/bin/view.pl/Gmecm/Running2DisPacksOff1Ecu
and some more discussion on the gm forum at 
http://gmecm.mine.nu/viewtopic.php?p=207#207
on the test bench I have two crank angle sensors at 60deg (or could be put 
at 180deg) the  sensors are connected to the dis module only and are 
independent of the ecu, and give the dis modules the base timing and their 
firing order . If I join the est output and the bypass control on both coil 
they packs they fire together . disconnected one runs at base timing while 
the other is est controlled
the problem with est output is the square wave is not symmetrical not only 
does it increase in frequency but also varies in duration so this rules out 
using the down slope to fire second module.
hence the idea to double the signal and then split it to alternate outputs.
the original signal is timed correctly all you are doing is putting another 
in the middle and bleeding it off to the second dis module hence it is timed 
at 180deg
phase with all the original characteristics
> Peter Jenkins
> 10336 Murray River Rd
Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
> Australia.

> PH 0425 705764
> Email. info at jenkinseng.com
> web. www.jenkinseng.com                                 DISCLAIMER
>  * This email and any attachment may contain confidential information.
>     If you are not the intended recipient you are not authorised to copy
>     or disclose all or any part of it without the prior written consent
>     of Jenkins Engineering.
>  * Opinions expressed in this email and any attachment are those of the
>    sender and not necessarily the opinions of Jenkins Engineering.
>  * Please scan this email and any attachment for viruses. Jenkins
> Engineering does
>    not accept responsibility for problems caused by viruses, whether
> it is Jenkins Engineering's fault or not!!!




From krawczuk at dodo.com.au  Tue Oct  3 21:33:28 2006
From: krawczuk at dodo.com.au (mark krawczuk)
Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 12:03:28 +0930
Subject: [Gmecm] scan of ignition wiring  for vn/vp v6 wanted?
References: <000601c6e743$d3bc5cc0$6400a8c0@p42000>
	<001801c6e75c$05c45c00$6501a8c0@PETER>
Message-ID: <005401c6e75d$7a3d72a0$d7ba1bcb@markzu35x5eu9m>

hi, i`ve  packed up all my motor manuals  (moving....) and can anybody email 
me a scan of the ignition/module wiring section for the vn/vp v6 commodore ?


i can download attachments up to about 7-8 meg...

thanks,
mark k 



From jim980 at frontiernet.net  Wed Oct  4 07:29:27 2006
From: jim980 at frontiernet.net (jim cottrill)
Date: Wed, 4 Oct 2006 08:29:27 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
In-Reply-To: <6CB5E49E-9BE5-4BA0-B0AA-56C123595C1F@garyandliz.com>
Message-ID: <000001c6e7b0$bc631bf0$6401a8c0@Upstairs>

I've posted this once before (a year or two) and it's this you can use
one ECM, two 4 cyl, spark modules of the right type and a little
additional logic to control the modules.
If you have the right modules they can be controlled by 5volt logic I
used a PIC 16f628. Mine worked on the bench with a LT1 . Basically I
pick up the high and low res signals and tell the appropriate coil to
fire.
The hardest part to come up with would be a trigger wheel for your
application.

 

-----Original Message-----
From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On
Behalf Of Gary Evans
Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 11:24 PM
To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use

Ferrari. Wow. I did not know that. The dual ECUs do have some  
advantages:

- Separate O2 feedback loop for each bank.
- One ecu can completely fail and you can still drive.
- Ability to do interesting things like partial DFCO and soft(er) rev  
limiter.

However, I would still love to see someone do a working single ECU  
setup, if only as an exercise in pushing what can be done with a GM ECM.

-Gary



On Oct 2, 2006, at 4:37 PM, Bill Shaw wrote:

> Dual ECUs has been standard in Ferraris since the beginning of  
> time.  OK,  maybe not the beginning of time,  but at least since  
> they started using ECUs :-)
>
> Before that they used dual distributors each with dual points.   
> Nothing wrong with dual.
> I thought your dual '730 setup was kind of slick :-)
>
> Bill
>
>
> Gary Evans wrote:
>> Hm. Interesting. Let us know if you get it working. I am currently  
>> using a dual '730 ecu setup on my V12. It works great, but having  
>> 2 ecus is an inelegant solution.
>>
>>
>> On Oct 2, 2006, at 4:02 PM, Peter Jenkins wrote:
>>
>>> have been trying with 1227808 using 2 6cyl dis coils for v12
>>> the only option was as previously mentioned ,run two ecu's
>>> reason is  you double the rpm which you can work around but  
>>> limits max rpm to half previous ie 3000rpm
>>> what I had in mind is a type of  x2 flip flop circuit on the est  
>>> output double out put pulses and send them along alternating  
>>> outputs but still run the second sensor to time the second dis  
>>> pack in start up/limp mode
>>> Have got a set up on a test bench that works in limp mode fine  
>>> but can't get the x2 flip flop circuit to work as that is not my  
>>> line of expertise
>>>> Peter Jenkins
>>>> 10336 Murray River Rd
>>> Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
>>>> Australia.
>>>
>>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm

_______________________________________________
Gmecm mailing list
Gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm



From rjdrew at adelphia.net  Sun Oct  8 09:09:23 2006
From: rjdrew at adelphia.net (Ron Drew)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 10:09:23 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
References: <000601c6e743$d3bc5cc0$6400a8c0@p42000>
	<001801c6e75c$05c45c00$6501a8c0@PETER>
Message-ID: <000501c6eae3$5b4a4e70$6801a8c0@RonHome>

Has anyone experienced problems with a GM 3.8L (1989 with 122K miles) 
missing cam position pulses? More specifically, the pulses generally begin 
to miss when the car has been driven for a while on warmer days; and it only 
seems to trigger the alarm at lower speeds.

This what I have done:
- I replaced the ECM with a known good spare which did not help.
- I've tried a couple of different brands of sensors, which did not help 
(they all behave the same).
- The crank sensor works flawlessly; the cam sensor shares the same '+ 
volts' & 'ground' with the crank sensor, so any problems with the '+ volts' 
and 'ground' would need to exist on a very short run of wiring between the 
Crank and cam position sensors.
- I have not yet scoped the sensor line going back to the ECM.

I suspect the problem may be with the position indicator mounted on the cam 
sprocket. I don't know if this is a permament magnet or a normal piece of 
metal. As far as I can tell there is no magnetism in the position indicator. 
BTW I may go weeks and not see an alarm, so the problem can be very erratic.

I thought I'd check here and see if nayone has experienced this or has any 
ideas.

Thanks
Ron 



From sfeaver at magma.ca  Sun Oct  8 09:52:42 2006
From: sfeaver at magma.ca (Scott Feaver)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 10:52:42 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
References: <000601c6e743$d3bc5cc0$6400a8c0@p42000><001801c6e75c$05c45c00$6501a8c0@PETER>
	<000501c6eae3$5b4a4e70$6801a8c0@RonHome>
Message-ID: <000601c6eae9$68d7f1e0$0201a8c0@new>

I had my magnet come out of the sproket at about 130k miles.   Its held in a 
plastic retainer and it disintegrated.    Maybe its starting in your case, 
and its position drifts slightly back where the sensor wont pick it up..

Scott
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ron Drew" <rjdrew at adelphia.net>
To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 10:09 AM
Subject: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms


> Has anyone experienced problems with a GM 3.8L (1989 with 122K miles) 
> missing cam position pulses? More specifically, the pulses generally begin 
> to miss when the car has been driven for a while on warmer days; and it 
> only seems to trigger the alarm at lower speeds.
>
> This what I have done:
> - I replaced the ECM with a known good spare which did not help.
> - I've tried a couple of different brands of sensors, which did not help 
> (they all behave the same).
> - The crank sensor works flawlessly; the cam sensor shares the same '+ 
> volts' & 'ground' with the crank sensor, so any problems with the '+ 
> volts' and 'ground' would need to exist on a very short run of wiring 
> between the Crank and cam position sensors.
> - I have not yet scoped the sensor line going back to the ECM.
>
> I suspect the problem may be with the position indicator mounted on the 
> cam sprocket. I don't know if this is a permament magnet or a normal piece 
> of metal. As far as I can tell there is no magnetism in the position 
> indicator. BTW I may go weeks and not see an alarm, so the problem can be 
> very erratic.
>
> I thought I'd check here and see if nayone has experienced this or has any 
> ideas.
>
> Thanks
> Ron
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> 




From tech_auto at bellsouth.net  Sun Oct  8 15:29:46 2006
From: tech_auto at bellsouth.net (Dan Grostick)
Date: Sun, 08 Oct 2006 16:29:46 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] HELP: MAF Burn-Off problem
In-Reply-To: <20060929075727.87092.qmail@web80501.mail.yahoo.com>
References: <20060929075727.87092.qmail@web80501.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <45295FBA.2010305@bellsouth.net>


Rick, the MAF burnoff is initiated by the ignition key being turned off. 
The following is comments from the burnoff code. Looks like the MAF 
sensor output voltage must fall within a range during the test. The test 
is a fixed time initiated after a key-off delay. As far as I can see 
with a quick inspection of the code,  MAF burnoff failure  (code 36) 
being set  doesn't affect subsequent ECM program usage of the MAF. You 
should hear the burnoff relay click when burnoff starts and again when 
it completes.

         ; A/D Ch A, (Mass Air Sensor Ch)
         ; Fail B/O test if HLM A/D > 1.90 VDC
         ; Fail B/O test if A/D LT 400 mvdc


        ; 1 sec, MAF BURN OFF TIME.
        ; 5 sec, MAF BURNOFF DELAY TIME from IGN OFF
      
Dan

> IIRC: running $32b on '165 in '86 L98 vette, it's setting the 'obligatory' code 36 MAF sensor burn-off voltage missing. I've been down the road of all the classic 'fixes' such as replacing the relay, cleaning the contacts, etc., and now tearing into wiring to try to find the problem.
>  
> Part of the problem is that this signal only occurs after a warm engine shutdown, and IIRC the engine has to have been running for some period of time prior to trigger this diagnostic/service circuit into action at engine shutdown. Makes for difficult diagnostics at best, but I've got to find the headache.
>  
> Plan of action is to 'tap' the wires to the MAF for monitoring signals. Once that is done, I'll be able to monitor the activity since the 'tap' is going to be a 4-wire trailer light socket so I can plug a 4-wire 'extender' into it and temporarily monitor it in the cabin until I get the problem fixed. Then I'll weather seal the stub connector and tuck tidily away into the loom in case I need it again (suspect I may, this is a chronic problem w/ this version of MAF).
>  
> Now, my question is: What does the ECM/code look for at shutdown to determine that the MAF burn-off cycle completed. IIRC the ECM has a line that enables the burn-off relay a few seconds after shutdown (which is what I'll be monitoring at the MAF diag dongle above) but since there is NO air flow, does it look for some delta in the signal from the MAF (and, isn't the BOSCH MAF a frequency based signal vs. the voltage based on the DELCO MAF variant?). Once I confirm that the MAF is receiveing burn-off voltage correctly at shutdown, then my next step is obviously to diag the signal at the ECM, but what am I looking for, is it just the presense of signal due to the MAF being energized post shutdown, or is it a change in the signal from the ECM due to the burn-off causing a very hot heated wire, then cooling, hence that should cause a delta in the MAF signal seen by the computer.
>  
> My hunch is that I'm actually fighting a poor current path, like maybe a high resistance fusible link or a corroded ground connection to the MAF which would cause it to work correctly but the high current demand by the burn-off cycle causes excessive drop in the supply/return path and not enough current passes to actually burn-off the element correctly.
>  
> At any rate, knowledge is key, I can get lots of data, but what is it going to tell me? What is normal opperating condition, so I know what to 'fix' on this pesky critter.
>  
> BTW, it works wonderfully from a drivability standpoint if I reset the codes on the ECM and then drive, it warms up fine, and performance is normal but after that the next restart will have a check engine light and the code will be set for this, and performance sucks big time, since it is not using MAF data I presume is using static or even worse I suspect LIMP mode?
>  
> Sorry for wordy post, but info is key to getting quality responses and this group has that quality.
>  
> Cheers, thanks in advance
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>
>
>   



From rjdrew at adelphia.net  Sun Oct  8 15:44:20 2006
From: rjdrew at adelphia.net (Ron Drew)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 16:44:20 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
References: <000601c6e743$d3bc5cc0$6400a8c0@p42000><001801c6e75c$05c45c00$6501a8c0@PETER><000501c6eae3$5b4a4e70$6801a8c0@RonHome>
	<000601c6eae9$68d7f1e0$0201a8c0@new>
Message-ID: <000301c6eb1a$88280900$6801a8c0@RonHome>

Many thanks Scott; I think that you have led me to the problem. I understand 
that the magnet is not replaceable; so I'm planning to replace the timing 
set.

Ron

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Scott Feaver" <sfeaver at magma.ca>
To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 10:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms


>I had my magnet come out of the sproket at about 130k miles.   Its held in 
>a plastic retainer and it disintegrated.    Maybe its starting in your 
>case, and its position drifts slightly back where the sensor wont pick it 
>up..
>
> Scott
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Ron Drew" <rjdrew at adelphia.net>
> To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 10:09 AM
> Subject: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
>
>
>> Has anyone experienced problems with a GM 3.8L (1989 with 122K miles) 
>> missing cam position pulses? More specifically, the pulses generally 
>> begin to miss when the car has been driven for a while on warmer days; 
>> and it only seems to trigger the alarm at lower speeds.
>>
>> This what I have done:
>> - I replaced the ECM with a known good spare which did not help.
>> - I've tried a couple of different brands of sensors, which did not help 
>> (they all behave the same).
>> - The crank sensor works flawlessly; the cam sensor shares the same '+ 
>> volts' & 'ground' with the crank sensor, so any problems with the '+ 
>> volts' and 'ground' would need to exist on a very short run of wiring 
>> between the Crank and cam position sensors.
>> - I have not yet scoped the sensor line going back to the ECM.
>>
>> I suspect the problem may be with the position indicator mounted on the 
>> cam sprocket. I don't know if this is a permament magnet or a normal 
>> piece of metal. As far as I can tell there is no magnetism in the 
>> position indicator. BTW I may go weeks and not see an alarm, so the 
>> problem can be very erratic.
>>
>> I thought I'd check here and see if nayone has experienced this or has 
>> any ideas.
>>
>> Thanks
>> Ron
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gmecm mailing list
>> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
>> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
>> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm 



From davida1 at hiwaay.net  Sun Oct  8 16:12:16 2006
From: davida1 at hiwaay.net (David Allen)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 16:12:16 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
References: <000601c6e743$d3bc5cc0$6400a8c0@p42000><001801c6e75c$05c45c00$6501a8c0@PETER><000501c6eae3$5b4a4e70$6801a8c0@RonHome><000601c6eae9$68d7f1e0$0201a8c0@new>
	<000301c6eb1a$88280900$6801a8c0@RonHome>
Message-ID: <045001c6eb1e$7db72a60$0700a8c0@yancey.com>

IIRC the magnet IS indeed replacable.  In fact I have replaced several; working throug the sensor hole wihtout engine disassembly.
David


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ron Drew" <rjdrew at adelphia.net>
To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 3:44 PM
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms


> Many thanks Scott; I think that you have led me to the problem. I understand 
> that the magnet is not replaceable; so I'm planning to replace the timing 
> set.
> 
> Ron
> 
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Scott Feaver" <sfeaver at magma.ca>
> To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 10:52 AM
> Subject: Re: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
> 
> 
>>I had my magnet come out of the sproket at about 130k miles.   Its held in 
>>a plastic retainer and it disintegrated.    Maybe its starting in your 
>>case, and its position drifts slightly back where the sensor wont pick it 
>>up..
>>
>> Scott
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Ron Drew" <rjdrew at adelphia.net>
>> To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
>> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 10:09 AM
>> Subject: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
>>
>>
>>> Has anyone experienced problems with a GM 3.8L (1989 with 122K miles) 
>>> missing cam position pulses? More specifically, the pulses generally 
>>> begin to miss when the car has been driven for a while on warmer days; 
>>> and it only seems to trigger the alarm at lower speeds.
>>>
>>> This what I have done:
>>> - I replaced the ECM with a known good spare which did not help.
>>> - I've tried a couple of different brands of sensors, which did not help 
>>> (they all behave the same).
>>> - The crank sensor works flawlessly; the cam sensor shares the same '+ 
>>> volts' & 'ground' with the crank sensor, so any problems with the '+ 
>>> volts' and 'ground' would need to exist on a very short run of wiring 
>>> between the Crank and cam position sensors.
>>> - I have not yet scoped the sensor line going back to the ECM.
>>>
>>> I suspect the problem may be with the position indicator mounted on the 
>>> cam sprocket. I don't know if this is a permament magnet or a normal 
>>> piece of metal. As far as I can tell there is no magnetism in the 
>>> position indicator. BTW I may go weeks and not see an alarm, so the 
>>> problem can be very erratic.
>>>
>>> I thought I'd check here and see if nayone has experienced this or has 
>>> any ideas.
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>> Ron
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Gmecm mailing list
>>> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
>>> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
>>> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gmecm mailing list
>> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
>> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
>> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>


From nick_cooper at yahoo.com  Sun Oct  8 20:32:41 2006
From: nick_cooper at yahoo.com (Nick Cooper)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 21:32:41 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] pocket programmer2 parallel port
Message-ID: <013401c6eb42$d0993bf0$6801a8c0@ParentsDell>

I upgraded my PC recently and the new one doesn't have a parallel port. Is
anyone interested in buying my Pocket Programmer2? I'll be reasonable.

e-mail me off list if anyone's interested.

Nick Cooper
nick_cooper"at"yahoo.com


From clair.davis at charter.net  Sun Oct  8 20:49:51 2006
From: clair.davis at charter.net (Clair Davis)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 20:49:51 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
Message-ID: <002701c6eb45$3644ff00$6501a8c0@davis>

Got everything to the point that I could try to fire the old Plymouth up
today.  Everything SEEMS to work, except the injectors.  No gas smell in the
tail pipes or intake, no flashing on the noid light, I'm guessing the
injectors aren't injecting.

Here's what I know:
- #1 plug is firing on the early side of TDC
- spark is nice and regular (according to the timing light)
- there's over 40psi of fuel pressure at the regulator
- there's fuel in the rails
- the fuel pump relay is doing it's thing
- no fuses appear to be blown
- ECM is grounded to the engine block, and engine/chassis grounds are good

Here's what I don't know:
- does the ECM case need to be grounded? (assuming not)

I haven't hit my 1990 Camaro FSM yet, but I figured I'd better throw this
out to the masses anyway.  Anyone have a clue as to what's going on?  I
really think everything is pretty solid, from a wiring standpoint, and fuel
is obviously not an issue (other than the small leak at the pump, and the
fact that it's not getting in to the combustion chambers).

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Clair



From clair.davis at charter.net  Sun Oct  8 20:52:28 2006
From: clair.davis at charter.net (Clair Davis)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 20:52:28 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
References: <002701c6eb45$3644ff00$6501a8c0@davis>
Message-ID: <003101c6eb45$93931ac0$6501a8c0@davis>

DOH... perhaps I should mention that this is using a GM '7730 ECM...


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Clair Davis" <clair.davis at charter.net>
To: "For discussion of GM EFI hardware and software" <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 8:49 PM
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...


> Got everything to the point that I could try to fire the old Plymouth up
> today.  Everything SEEMS to work, except the injectors.  No gas smell in
the
> tail pipes or intake, no flashing on the noid light, I'm guessing the
> injectors aren't injecting.
>
> Here's what I know:
> - #1 plug is firing on the early side of TDC
> - spark is nice and regular (according to the timing light)
> - there's over 40psi of fuel pressure at the regulator
> - there's fuel in the rails
> - the fuel pump relay is doing it's thing
> - no fuses appear to be blown
> - ECM is grounded to the engine block, and engine/chassis grounds are good
>
> Here's what I don't know:
> - does the ECM case need to be grounded? (assuming not)
>
> I haven't hit my 1990 Camaro FSM yet, but I figured I'd better throw this
> out to the masses anyway.  Anyone have a clue as to what's going on?  I
> really think everything is pretty solid, from a wiring standpoint, and
fuel
> is obviously not an issue (other than the small leak at the pump, and the
> fact that it's not getting in to the combustion chambers).
>
> Any help would be greatly appreciated!
>
> Clair
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>



From jryan at caminofx.org  Sun Oct  8 20:56:20 2006
From: jryan at caminofx.org (Jared Ryan)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 20:56:20 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
In-Reply-To: <002701c6eb45$3644ff00$6501a8c0@davis>
References: <002701c6eb45$3644ff00$6501a8c0@davis>
Message-ID: <14a6544bfb1c71ab1df02a57c02e4dc2@caminofx.org>

Does your PROM have VATS enabled?  That's what messed me up when I 
converted to TBI.  I had exactly the same symptoms: everything was fine 
except no fuel was being injected.  The VATS-enabled ECM was simply 
trying to keep me from stealing my own car.

  ---> Jared Ryan <---
jryan at caminofx.org | http://www.caminofx.org

On Oct 8, 2006, at 8:49 PM, Clair Davis wrote:

> Got everything to the point that I could try to fire the old Plymouth 
> up
> today.  Everything SEEMS to work, except the injectors.  No gas smell 
> in the
> tail pipes or intake, no flashing on the noid light, I'm guessing the
> injectors aren't injecting.
>
> Here's what I know:
> - #1 plug is firing on the early side of TDC
> - spark is nice and regular (according to the timing light)
> - there's over 40psi of fuel pressure at the regulator
> - there's fuel in the rails
> - the fuel pump relay is doing it's thing
> - no fuses appear to be blown
> - ECM is grounded to the engine block, and engine/chassis grounds are 
> good
>
> Here's what I don't know:
> - does the ECM case need to be grounded? (assuming not)
>
> I haven't hit my 1990 Camaro FSM yet, but I figured I'd better throw 
> this
> out to the masses anyway.  Anyone have a clue as to what's going on?  I
> really think everything is pretty solid, from a wiring standpoint, and 
> fuel
> is obviously not an issue (other than the small leak at the pump, and 
> the
> fact that it's not getting in to the combustion chambers).
>
> Any help would be greatly appreciated!
>
> Clair
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>



From nick_cooper at yahoo.com  Sun Oct  8 21:08:36 2006
From: nick_cooper at yahoo.com (Nick Cooper)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 22:08:36 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
In-Reply-To: <002701c6eb45$3644ff00$6501a8c0@davis>
Message-ID: <013a01c6eb47$d5113d40$6801a8c0@ParentsDell>

No great ideas, but have you checked that you have 12v at your injectors?
The ECM grounds them so you should have a steady 12V at each one.

Nick


-----Original Message-----
From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On Behalf
Of Clair Davis
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 9:50 PM
To: For discussion of GM EFI hardware and software
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...

Got everything to the point that I could try to fire the old Plymouth up
today.  Everything SEEMS to work, except the injectors.  No gas smell in the
tail pipes or intake, no flashing on the noid light, I'm guessing the
injectors aren't injecting.

Here's what I know:
- #1 plug is firing on the early side of TDC
- spark is nice and regular (according to the timing light)
- there's over 40psi of fuel pressure at the regulator
- there's fuel in the rails
- the fuel pump relay is doing it's thing
- no fuses appear to be blown
- ECM is grounded to the engine block, and engine/chassis grounds are good

Here's what I don't know:
- does the ECM case need to be grounded? (assuming not)

I haven't hit my 1990 Camaro FSM yet, but I figured I'd better throw this
out to the masses anyway.  Anyone have a clue as to what's going on?  I
really think everything is pretty solid, from a wiring standpoint, and fuel
is obviously not an issue (other than the small leak at the pump, and the
fact that it's not getting in to the combustion chambers).

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

Clair

_______________________________________________
Gmecm mailing list
Gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm




From clair.davis at charter.net  Sun Oct  8 21:34:12 2006
From: clair.davis at charter.net (Clair Davis)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 21:34:12 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
References: <002701c6eb45$3644ff00$6501a8c0@davis>
	<14a6544bfb1c71ab1df02a57c02e4dc2@caminofx.org>
Message-ID: <001201c6eb4b$687f8520$6501a8c0@davis>

Jared,
I don't know if it's got VATS enabled, the chip was burned with criteria I
supplied, and I'm ASSuming that they didn't leave that on for my 69 Plymouth
Valiant.  I won't be able to check that until I get some form of PROM
reading capability, I guess I ought to do that pretty soon...

Nick,
I didn't think to check for 12V at the plug, I just plugged in the noid
light to see if anything happened.  I'll see if I can check that tomorrow
after work.

Clair


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jared Ryan" <jryan at caminofx.org>
To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 8:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...


> Does your PROM have VATS enabled?  That's what messed me up when I
> converted to TBI.  I had exactly the same symptoms: everything was fine
> except no fuel was being injected.  The VATS-enabled ECM was simply
> trying to keep me from stealing my own car.
>
>   ---> Jared Ryan <---
> jryan at caminofx.org | http://www.caminofx.org
>
> On Oct 8, 2006, at 8:49 PM, Clair Davis wrote:
>
> > Got everything to the point that I could try to fire the old Plymouth
> > up
> > today.  Everything SEEMS to work, except the injectors.  No gas smell
> > in the
> > tail pipes or intake, no flashing on the noid light, I'm guessing the
> > injectors aren't injecting.
> >
> > Here's what I know:
> > - #1 plug is firing on the early side of TDC
> > - spark is nice and regular (according to the timing light)
> > - there's over 40psi of fuel pressure at the regulator
> > - there's fuel in the rails
> > - the fuel pump relay is doing it's thing
> > - no fuses appear to be blown
> > - ECM is grounded to the engine block, and engine/chassis grounds are
> > good
> >
> > Here's what I don't know:
> > - does the ECM case need to be grounded? (assuming not)
> >
> > I haven't hit my 1990 Camaro FSM yet, but I figured I'd better throw
> > this
> > out to the masses anyway.  Anyone have a clue as to what's going on?  I
> > really think everything is pretty solid, from a wiring standpoint, and
> > fuel
> > is obviously not an issue (other than the small leak at the pump, and
> > the
> > fact that it's not getting in to the combustion chambers).
> >
> > Any help would be greatly appreciated!
> >
> > Clair
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gmecm mailing list
> > Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>



From sfeaver at magma.ca  Sun Oct  8 21:43:42 2006
From: sfeaver at magma.ca (Scott Feaver)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 22:43:42 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
References: <000601c6e743$d3bc5cc0$6400a8c0@p42000><001801c6e75c$05c45c00$6501a8c0@PETER><000501c6eae3$5b4a4e70$6801a8c0@RonHome><000601c6eae9$68d7f1e0$0201a8c0@new><000301c6eb1a$88280900$6801a8c0@RonHome>
	<045001c6eb1e$7db72a60$0700a8c0@yancey.com>
Message-ID: <000801c6eb4c$bc3d8cb0$0201a8c0@new>

I wondered if that was possible to do that way.   In my case however, the 
magnet had been chewed up a bit and was sticking inside the timing cover all 
over.  I had to pull it all apart to clean it up.

I believe I got the part from Autozone for about 8 bucks or so.

Scott
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "David Allen" <davida1 at hiwaay.net>
To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 5:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms


> IIRC the magnet IS indeed replacable.  In fact I have replaced several; 
> working throug the sensor hole wihtout engine disassembly.
> David
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Ron Drew" <rjdrew at adelphia.net>
> To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 3:44 PM
> Subject: Re: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
>
>
>> Many thanks Scott; I think that you have led me to the problem. I 
>> understand
>> that the magnet is not replaceable; so I'm planning to replace the timing
>> set.
>>
>> Ron
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Scott Feaver" <sfeaver at magma.ca>
>> To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
>> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 10:52 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
>>
>>
>>>I had my magnet come out of the sproket at about 130k miles.   Its held 
>>>in
>>>a plastic retainer and it disintegrated.    Maybe its starting in your
>>>case, and its position drifts slightly back where the sensor wont pick it
>>>up..
>>>
>>> Scott
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Ron Drew" <rjdrew at adelphia.net>
>>> To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
>>> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 10:09 AM
>>> Subject: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
>>>
>>>
>>>> Has anyone experienced problems with a GM 3.8L (1989 with 122K miles)
>>>> missing cam position pulses? More specifically, the pulses generally
>>>> begin to miss when the car has been driven for a while on warmer days;
>>>> and it only seems to trigger the alarm at lower speeds.
>>>>
>>>> This what I have done:
>>>> - I replaced the ECM with a known good spare which did not help.
>>>> - I've tried a couple of different brands of sensors, which did not 
>>>> help
>>>> (they all behave the same).
>>>> - The crank sensor works flawlessly; the cam sensor shares the same '+
>>>> volts' & 'ground' with the crank sensor, so any problems with the '+
>>>> volts' and 'ground' would need to exist on a very short run of wiring
>>>> between the Crank and cam position sensors.
>>>> - I have not yet scoped the sensor line going back to the ECM.
>>>>
>>>> I suspect the problem may be with the position indicator mounted on the
>>>> cam sprocket. I don't know if this is a permament magnet or a normal
>>>> piece of metal. As far as I can tell there is no magnetism in the
>>>> position indicator. BTW I may go weeks and not see an alarm, so the
>>>> problem can be very erratic.
>>>>
>>>> I thought I'd check here and see if nayone has experienced this or has
>>>> any ideas.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks
>>>> Ron
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Gmecm mailing list
>>>> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
>>>> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
>>>> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Gmecm mailing list
>>> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
>>> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
>>> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gmecm mailing list
>> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
>> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
>> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>
> 




From jryan at caminofx.org  Sun Oct  8 21:53:50 2006
From: jryan at caminofx.org (Jared Ryan)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 21:53:50 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
In-Reply-To: <001201c6eb4b$687f8520$6501a8c0@davis>
References: <002701c6eb45$3644ff00$6501a8c0@davis>
	<14a6544bfb1c71ab1df02a57c02e4dc2@caminofx.org>
	<001201c6eb4b$687f8520$6501a8c0@davis>
Message-ID: <9ce92452e32d265f0cf8064bbe82703a@caminofx.org>

It's just something I thought I'd throw out, because it really stumped 
me with my 1228746.  There well could be something entirely different 
in play in your case.

  ---> Jared Ryan <---
jryan at caminofx.org | http://www.caminofx.org

On Oct 8, 2006, at 9:34 PM, Clair Davis wrote:

> Jared,
> I don't know if it's got VATS enabled, the chip was burned with 
> criteria I
> supplied, and I'm ASSuming that they didn't leave that on for my 69 
> Plymouth
> Valiant.  I won't be able to check that until I get some form of PROM
> reading capability, I guess I ought to do that pretty soon...
>
> Nick,
> I didn't think to check for 12V at the plug, I just plugged in the noid
> light to see if anything happened.  I'll see if I can check that 
> tomorrow
> after work.
>
> Clair
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jared Ryan" <jryan at caminofx.org>
> To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 8:56 PM
> Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
>
>
>> Does your PROM have VATS enabled?  That's what messed me up when I
>> converted to TBI.  I had exactly the same symptoms: everything was 
>> fine
>> except no fuel was being injected.  The VATS-enabled ECM was simply
>> trying to keep me from stealing my own car.
>>
>>   ---> Jared Ryan <---
>> jryan at caminofx.org | http://www.caminofx.org
>>
>> On Oct 8, 2006, at 8:49 PM, Clair Davis wrote:
>>
>>> Got everything to the point that I could try to fire the old Plymouth
>>> up
>>> today.  Everything SEEMS to work, except the injectors.  No gas smell
>>> in the
>>> tail pipes or intake, no flashing on the noid light, I'm guessing the
>>> injectors aren't injecting.
>>>
>>> Here's what I know:
>>> - #1 plug is firing on the early side of TDC
>>> - spark is nice and regular (according to the timing light)
>>> - there's over 40psi of fuel pressure at the regulator
>>> - there's fuel in the rails
>>> - the fuel pump relay is doing it's thing
>>> - no fuses appear to be blown
>>> - ECM is grounded to the engine block, and engine/chassis grounds are
>>> good
>>>
>>> Here's what I don't know:
>>> - does the ECM case need to be grounded? (assuming not)
>>>
>>> I haven't hit my 1990 Camaro FSM yet, but I figured I'd better throw
>>> this
>>> out to the masses anyway.  Anyone have a clue as to what's going on? 
>>>  I
>>> really think everything is pretty solid, from a wiring standpoint, 
>>> and
>>> fuel
>>> is obviously not an issue (other than the small leak at the pump, and
>>> the
>>> fact that it's not getting in to the combustion chambers).
>>>
>>> Any help would be greatly appreciated!
>>>
>>> Clair
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Gmecm mailing list
>>> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
>>> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
>>> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gmecm mailing list
>> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
>> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
>> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>



From clair.davis at charter.net  Sun Oct  8 21:55:07 2006
From: clair.davis at charter.net (Clair Davis)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 21:55:07 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
References: <002701c6eb45$3644ff00$6501a8c0@davis><14a6544bfb1c71ab1df02a57c02e4dc2@caminofx.org><001201c6eb4b$687f8520$6501a8c0@davis>
	<9ce92452e32d265f0cf8064bbe82703a@caminofx.org>
Message-ID: <000a01c6eb4e$54ba26a0$6501a8c0@davis>

It's definitely something I should look into at some point, there were a lot
of things going on at the shop (builder's brother had heart problems for a
while) so something COULD have been overlooked when they put mine together.
I'll keep that in mind, and see about dropping some money at Mr. Moates'
place soon...

Clair


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jared Ryan" <jryan at caminofx.org>
To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 9:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...


> It's just something I thought I'd throw out, because it really stumped
> me with my 1228746.  There well could be something entirely different
> in play in your case.
>
>   ---> Jared Ryan <---
> jryan at caminofx.org | http://www.caminofx.org
>
> On Oct 8, 2006, at 9:34 PM, Clair Davis wrote:
>
> > Jared,
> > I don't know if it's got VATS enabled, the chip was burned with
> > criteria I
> > supplied, and I'm ASSuming that they didn't leave that on for my 69
> > Plymouth
> > Valiant.  I won't be able to check that until I get some form of PROM
> > reading capability, I guess I ought to do that pretty soon...
> >
> > Nick,
> > I didn't think to check for 12V at the plug, I just plugged in the noid
> > light to see if anything happened.  I'll see if I can check that
> > tomorrow
> > after work.
> >
> > Clair
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Jared Ryan" <jryan at caminofx.org>
> > To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
> > Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 8:56 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
> >
> >
> >> Does your PROM have VATS enabled?  That's what messed me up when I
> >> converted to TBI.  I had exactly the same symptoms: everything was
> >> fine
> >> except no fuel was being injected.  The VATS-enabled ECM was simply
> >> trying to keep me from stealing my own car.
> >>
> >>   ---> Jared Ryan <---
> >> jryan at caminofx.org | http://www.caminofx.org
> >>
> >> On Oct 8, 2006, at 8:49 PM, Clair Davis wrote:
> >>
> >>> Got everything to the point that I could try to fire the old Plymouth
> >>> up
> >>> today.  Everything SEEMS to work, except the injectors.  No gas smell
> >>> in the
> >>> tail pipes or intake, no flashing on the noid light, I'm guessing the
> >>> injectors aren't injecting.
> >>>
> >>> Here's what I know:
> >>> - #1 plug is firing on the early side of TDC
> >>> - spark is nice and regular (according to the timing light)
> >>> - there's over 40psi of fuel pressure at the regulator
> >>> - there's fuel in the rails
> >>> - the fuel pump relay is doing it's thing
> >>> - no fuses appear to be blown
> >>> - ECM is grounded to the engine block, and engine/chassis grounds are
> >>> good
> >>>
> >>> Here's what I don't know:
> >>> - does the ECM case need to be grounded? (assuming not)
> >>>
> >>> I haven't hit my 1990 Camaro FSM yet, but I figured I'd better throw
> >>> this
> >>> out to the masses anyway.  Anyone have a clue as to what's going on?
> >>>  I
> >>> really think everything is pretty solid, from a wiring standpoint,
> >>> and
> >>> fuel
> >>> is obviously not an issue (other than the small leak at the pump, and
> >>> the
> >>> fact that it's not getting in to the combustion chambers).
> >>>
> >>> Any help would be greatly appreciated!
> >>>
> >>> Clair
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Gmecm mailing list
> >>> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> >>> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> >>> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> >>>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Gmecm mailing list
> >> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> >> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> >> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gmecm mailing list
> > Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>



From doug at chaserace.com  Mon Oct  9 01:22:10 2006
From: doug at chaserace.com (Doug Chase)
Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2006 23:22:10 -0700
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
In-Reply-To: <000a01c6eb4e$54ba26a0$6501a8c0@davis>
Message-ID: <006101c6eb6b$42799490$2f01a8c0@desk>

I had one project that involved a junkyard motor where all 6 injectors were
plugged from sitting.  New injectors and it fired on the first crank.

If your injectors are used and they're getting the right voltage then don't
rule this out.

Doug Chase
www.chaserace.com
425-269-5636

-----Original Message-----
From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On Behalf
Of Clair Davis
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 7:55 PM
To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...

It's definitely something I should look into at some point, there were a lot
of things going on at the shop (builder's brother had heart problems for a
while) so something COULD have been overlooked when they put mine together.
I'll keep that in mind, and see about dropping some money at Mr. Moates'
place soon...

Clair


----- Original Message -----
From: "Jared Ryan" <jryan at caminofx.org>
To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 9:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...


> It's just something I thought I'd throw out, because it really stumped
> me with my 1228746.  There well could be something entirely different
> in play in your case.
>
>   ---> Jared Ryan <---
> jryan at caminofx.org | http://www.caminofx.org
>
> On Oct 8, 2006, at 9:34 PM, Clair Davis wrote:
>
> > Jared,
> > I don't know if it's got VATS enabled, the chip was burned with
> > criteria I
> > supplied, and I'm ASSuming that they didn't leave that on for my 69
> > Plymouth
> > Valiant.  I won't be able to check that until I get some form of PROM
> > reading capability, I guess I ought to do that pretty soon...
> >
> > Nick,
> > I didn't think to check for 12V at the plug, I just plugged in the noid
> > light to see if anything happened.  I'll see if I can check that
> > tomorrow
> > after work.
> >
> > Clair
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Jared Ryan" <jryan at caminofx.org>
> > To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
> > Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 8:56 PM
> > Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
> >
> >
> >> Does your PROM have VATS enabled?  That's what messed me up when I
> >> converted to TBI.  I had exactly the same symptoms: everything was
> >> fine
> >> except no fuel was being injected.  The VATS-enabled ECM was simply
> >> trying to keep me from stealing my own car.
> >>
> >>   ---> Jared Ryan <---
> >> jryan at caminofx.org | http://www.caminofx.org
> >>
> >> On Oct 8, 2006, at 8:49 PM, Clair Davis wrote:
> >>
> >>> Got everything to the point that I could try to fire the old Plymouth
> >>> up
> >>> today.  Everything SEEMS to work, except the injectors.  No gas smell
> >>> in the
> >>> tail pipes or intake, no flashing on the noid light, I'm guessing the
> >>> injectors aren't injecting.
> >>>
> >>> Here's what I know:
> >>> - #1 plug is firing on the early side of TDC
> >>> - spark is nice and regular (according to the timing light)
> >>> - there's over 40psi of fuel pressure at the regulator
> >>> - there's fuel in the rails
> >>> - the fuel pump relay is doing it's thing
> >>> - no fuses appear to be blown
> >>> - ECM is grounded to the engine block, and engine/chassis grounds are
> >>> good
> >>>
> >>> Here's what I don't know:
> >>> - does the ECM case need to be grounded? (assuming not)
> >>>
> >>> I haven't hit my 1990 Camaro FSM yet, but I figured I'd better throw
> >>> this
> >>> out to the masses anyway.  Anyone have a clue as to what's going on?
> >>>  I
> >>> really think everything is pretty solid, from a wiring standpoint,
> >>> and
> >>> fuel
> >>> is obviously not an issue (other than the small leak at the pump, and
> >>> the
> >>> fact that it's not getting in to the combustion chambers).
> >>>
> >>> Any help would be greatly appreciated!
> >>>
> >>> Clair
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Gmecm mailing list
> >>> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> >>> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> >>> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> >>>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Gmecm mailing list
> >> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> >> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> >> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> >>
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gmecm mailing list
> > Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> > Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> > Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>

_______________________________________________
Gmecm mailing list
Gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm





From andrewsharyn at yahoo.com  Mon Oct  9 10:58:40 2006
From: andrewsharyn at yahoo.com (Andrew Gibson)
Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 08:58:40 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Gmecm] erratic 3.8L Cam sensor alarms
Message-ID: <20061009155840.91515.qmail@web60822.mail.yahoo.com>

The cam sensor magnet is replaceable seperate from the timing set. It is a dealer part, fails more than the sensors do, and is very inexpensive. I have replaced many and always pulled the cover and replaced the chain as well due to the high failure rate of the nylon coated gears. The magnet comes in through the back side but I have heard of guys punching the old one out, leaving it in the motor, grinding the reatiner off the back of the new one, and JB welding the magnet in the old cam gear, all through the sensor hole. I've never done this as it's kind of risky for falling out and damaging something.
   
  Good luck with it!

 			
---------------------------------
Get your own web address for just $1.99/1st yr. We'll help. Yahoo! Small Business.

From rohn at triton.net  Mon Oct  9 16:34:15 2006
From: rohn at triton.net (rohn)
Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2006 17:34:15 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] pocket programmer2 parallel port
References: <013401c6eb42$d0993bf0$6801a8c0@ParentsDell>
Message-ID: <000901c6ebea$be5edb40$c6d445d1@ron>

I would be interested in the programmer, please let me know the asking
price.
Ron
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Nick Cooper" <nick_cooper at yahoo.com>
To: "'Gmecm at Diy-Efi.Org'" <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 9:32 PM
Subject: [Gmecm] pocket programmer2 parallel port


> I upgraded my PC recently and the new one doesn't have a parallel port. Is
> anyone interested in buying my Pocket Programmer2? I'll be reasonable.
>
> e-mail me off list if anyone's interested.
>
> Nick Cooper
> nick_cooper"at"yahoo.com
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
>



From squelch at ix.netcom.com  Mon Oct 16 17:38:49 2006
From: squelch at ix.netcom.com (squelch at ix.netcom.com)
Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2006 18:38:49 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Gmecm] Custome mem-cal adaptors...
Message-ID: <24740963.1161038330470.JavaMail.root@elwamui-rustique.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Ryan:

Just thought I'd touch base with you...

First off, the custom boards you did for me are great...  Thanks again...

Next, I have a friend that is heavily into electronics, he saw the baords and wants to know where he can get boards done in different colors, I didn't have the info, so I thought I 'd ask...


Regards
John




From squelch at ix.netcom.com  Mon Oct 16 17:42:10 2006
From: squelch at ix.netcom.com (squelch at ix.netcom.com)
Date: Mon, 16 Oct 2006 18:42:10 -0400 (EDT)
Subject: [Gmecm] Custome mem-cal adaptors...
Message-ID: <23035928.1161038531433.JavaMail.root@elwamui-rustique.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

Woops..  incorrect reply address...

Sorry..

John

-----Original Message-----
>From: squelch at ix.netcom.com
>Sent: Oct 16, 2006 6:38 PM
>To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
>Subject: [Gmecm] Custome mem-cal adaptors...
>



From william.lucke at highspeedlink.net  Sun Oct 22 11:15:19 2006
From: william.lucke at highspeedlink.net (William Lucke)
Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2006 12:15:19 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
Message-ID: <453B9917.2040101@highspeedlink.net>

When working with stuck injectors, I've had great success with a small 
rig I whipped up... I just attached an injector connector to a push 
button switch to which I then hooked a pair of leads with clips large 
enough to clip to battery terminals. This hits the injector with 
continuous 12V, instead of millisecond pulses like the ECM does. I've 
never had an injector stay stuck after trying this.



Will



> From: "Doug Chase" <doug at chaserace.com>
> Subject: RE: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
> 
> I had one project that involved a junkyard motor where all 6 injectors were
> plugged from sitting.  New injectors and it fired on the first crank.
> 
> If your injectors are used and they're getting the right voltage then don't
> rule this out.
> 
> Doug Chase
> www.chaserace.com
> 425-269-5636
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On Behalf
> Of Clair Davis
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 7:55 PM
> To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
> 
> It's definitely something I should look into at some point, there were a lot
> of things going on at the shop (builder's brother had heart problems for a
> while) so something COULD have been overlooked when they put mine together.
> I'll keep that in mind, and see about dropping some money at Mr. Moates'
> place soon...
> 
> Clair
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jared Ryan" <jryan at caminofx.org>
> To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 9:53 PM
> Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
> 
> 
>> It's just something I thought I'd throw out, because it really stumped
>> me with my 1228746.  There well could be something entirely different
>> in play in your case.
>>
>>   ---> Jared Ryan <---
>> jryan at caminofx.org | http://www.caminofx.org
>>
>> On Oct 8, 2006, at 9:34 PM, Clair Davis wrote:
>>
>>> Jared,
>>> I don't know if it's got VATS enabled, the chip was burned with
>>> criteria I
>>> supplied, and I'm ASSuming that they didn't leave that on for my 69
>>> Plymouth
>>> Valiant.  I won't be able to check that until I get some form of PROM
>>> reading capability, I guess I ought to do that pretty soon...
>>>
>>> Nick,
>>> I didn't think to check for 12V at the plug, I just plugged in the noid
>>> light to see if anything happened.  I'll see if I can check that
>>> tomorrow
>>> after work.
>>>
>>> Clair
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Jared Ryan" <jryan at caminofx.org>
>>> To: <gmecm at diy-efi.org>
>>> Sent: Sunday, October 08, 2006 8:56 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
>>>
>>>
>>>> Does your PROM have VATS enabled?  That's what messed me up when I
>>>> converted to TBI.  I had exactly the same symptoms: everything was
>>>> fine
>>>> except no fuel was being injected.  The VATS-enabled ECM was simply
>>>> trying to keep me from stealing my own car.
>>>>
>>>>   ---> Jared Ryan <---
>>>> jryan at caminofx.org | http://www.caminofx.org
>>>>
>>>> On Oct 8, 2006, at 8:49 PM, Clair Davis wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Got everything to the point that I could try to fire the old Plymouth
>>>>> up
>>>>> today.  Everything SEEMS to work, except the injectors.  No gas smell
>>>>> in the
>>>>> tail pipes or intake, no flashing on the noid light, I'm guessing the
>>>>> injectors aren't injecting.
>>>>>
>>>>> Here's what I know:
>>>>> - #1 plug is firing on the early side of TDC
>>>>> - spark is nice and regular (according to the timing light)
>>>>> - there's over 40psi of fuel pressure at the regulator
>>>>> - there's fuel in the rails
>>>>> - the fuel pump relay is doing it's thing
>>>>> - no fuses appear to be blown
>>>>> - ECM is grounded to the engine block, and engine/chassis grounds are
>>>>> good
>>>>>
>>>>> Here's what I don't know:
>>>>> - does the ECM case need to be grounded? (assuming not)
>>>>>
>>>>> I haven't hit my 1990 Camaro FSM yet, but I figured I'd better throw
>>>>> this
>>>>> out to the masses anyway.  Anyone have a clue as to what's going on?
>>>>>  I
>>>>> really think everything is pretty solid, from a wiring standpoint,
>>>>> and
>>>>> fuel
>>>>> is obviously not an issue (other than the small leak at the pump, and
>>>>> the
>>>>> fact that it's not getting in to the combustion chambers).
>>>>>
>>>>> Any help would be greatly appreciated!
>>>>>
>>>>> Clair


From william.lucke at highspeedlink.net  Sun Oct 22 11:18:54 2006
From: william.lucke at highspeedlink.net (William Lucke)
Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2006 12:18:54 -0400
Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
Message-ID: <453B99EE.7040704@highspeedlink.net>

WAY WAY WAY too complicated, IMO.

I think the most ellegant way to do it would be with two sensors and two 
modules. BOTH reference lines go to the reference input on the ECM via 
diodes. The ECM gets reference signals from both modules, but the 
modules don't see each other.

The ECM's EST output goes to both modules through a simple gizmo that 
would just route the current EST pulse to the module that delivered the 
previous reference pulse. It would obviously have to "see" the reference 
pulses from both modules, but wouldn't have to modify them in any way.



Will



> From: DV Fagan <dvfagan at yahoo.com>
> Subject: RE: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
> 
> Brendan and Peter,
> Short of adding a sensor which would electrically
> select the coil pack to trigger, the flip-flop needs
> to be a tiny microprocessor which takes trigger input
> from the ecm and outputs triggers to the coil packs. 
> It watches for cranking as indicated by the low input
> trigger rate and then tries syncing pack A with the
> next trigger and pack B with the following trigger. 
> If after two seconds of cranking the engine doesn't
> fire as indicated by an increased trigger rate, the
> micro changes the pack A and pack B pairing with the
> triggers and continues the cycle until the engine
> fires.  It then retains the pairing until cranking is
> detected again.  This can be built for under $10.
> Dennis
> 
> --- Brendan Patten <bpatten at centurytel.net> wrote:
> 
>> I'm looking into the flip-flop idea.  This could
>> work.  I too am not too
>> familiar with this area of electronics, however I am
>> doing some reading
>> to try and figure this out.
>>
>> Each module will send a ref pulse to the ecm 60
>> degree before each TDC
>> event.  The ECM then can send a signal pulse back to
>> the module anytime
>> in the next say 60 degrees to fire the coil (saying
>> max retard of 0 deg)
>> That leaves 30 degrees at a minimum to flip over to
>> route the ecm's
>> signal to the other module. And so forth.
>>
>> The thing I want to figure out, is how to
>> synchronize module 1 ref,
>> output to module 1, module 2 ref, output to module
>> 2, and so forth.
>>
>> http://www.play-hookey.com/digital/
>>
>> site I found so far, good intro to logic.
>>
>> This making any sense to anyone?
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org
>> [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On
>> Behalf Of Peter Jenkins
>> Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 6:03 PM
>> To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
>> Subject: [Gmecm] re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
>>
>> have been trying with 1227808 using 2 6cyl dis coils
>> for v12 
>> the only option was as previously mentioned ,run two
>> ecu's
>> reason is  you double the rpm which you can work
>> around but limits max
>> rpm to half previous ie 3000rpm 
>> what I had in mind is a type of  x2 flip flop
>> circuit on the est output
>> double out put pulses and send them along
>> alternating outputs but still
>> run the second sensor to time the second dis pack in
>> start up/limp mode
>> Have got a set up on a test bench that works in limp
>> mode fine but can't
>> get the x2 flip flop circuit to work as that is not
>> my line of expertise
>>
>>> Peter Jenkins
>>> 10336 Murray River Rd
>> Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
>>> Australia.
>>> PH 0425 705764
>>> Email. info at jenkinseng.com 
>>> web. www.jenkinseng.com                           
>>      DISCLAIMER
>>>  * This email and any attachment may contain
>> confidential information.
>>>     If you are not the intended recipient you are
>> not authorised to
>> copy
>>>     or disclose all or any part of it without the
>> prior written
>> consent
>>>     of Jenkins Engineering.
>>>  * Opinions expressed in this email and any
>> attachment are those of
>> the
>>>    sender and not necessarily the opinions of
>> Jenkins Engineering.
>>>  * Please scan this email and any attachment for
>> viruses. Jenkins 
>>> Engineering does
>>>    not accept responsibility for problems caused
>> by viruses, whether 
>>> it is Jenkins Engineering's fault or not!!!


From clair.davis at charter.net  Sun Oct 22 14:01:29 2006
From: clair.davis at charter.net (Clair Davis)
Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2006 14:01:29 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] Injectors Not Firing...
References: <453B9917.2040101@highspeedlink.net>
Message-ID: <001c01c6f60c$7eb57720$6501a8c0@davis>

Taking this opportunity to update...

I've had a couple minutes in the last couple of weeks to tinker with the
toy, and here's what I found.  Going by my 90 Camaro FSM, a jumper across A
& B on the ALDL brings code 12, which is apparently a good thing.  FSM says
that there may be a problem with the VATS, which agrees well with the advice
here.  Unfortunately, I have no way (at present) to check VATS status or the
contents of the chip.

So, I'm pretty tickled that the ECM APPEARS to be functioning as intended,
AND that I managed to get the SES light on the dash to work.  I still
haven't emailed the guy who set up the chip for me, will try to do that in
the next few minutes while I'm thinking about it.

Clair



From info at jenkinseng.com  Sun Oct 22 20:17:23 2006
From: info at jenkinseng.com (Peter Jenkins)
Date: Mon, 23 Oct 2006 11:17:23 +1000
Subject: [Gmecm] RE: re dual4cyldis modulefor v8 use
Message-ID: <000f01c6f641$03695660$6501a8c0@PETER>

have been through all these options and I think the only solution is as in this diagram http://www.diy-efi.org/twiki/bin/viewfile.pl/Gmecm/Running2DisPacksOff1Ecu?rev=1;filename=ECU_wiring.jpg
> Peter Jenkins
> 10336 Murray River Rd
Pine Mountain Vic. 3709
> Australia.

> PH 0425 705764
> Email. info at jenkinseng.com 
> web. www.jenkinseng.com                                 DISCLAIMER
>  * This email and any attachment may contain confidential information.
>     If you are not the intended recipient you are not authorised to copy
>     or disclose all or any part of it without the prior written consent
>     of Jenkins Engineering.
>  * Opinions expressed in this email and any attachment are those of the
>    sender and not necessarily the opinions of Jenkins Engineering.
>  * Please scan this email and any attachment for viruses. Jenkins 
> Engineering does
>    not accept responsibility for problems caused by viruses, whether 
> it is Jenkins Engineering's fault or not!!!



From bpatten at centurytel.net  Sun Oct 22 21:37:46 2006
From: bpatten at centurytel.net (Brendan Patten)
Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2006 21:37:46 -0500
Subject: [Gmecm] 16196395 PCM 4L60E control only?
In-Reply-To: <000f01c6f641$03695660$6501a8c0@PETER>
Message-ID: <000001c6f64c$3e6ebd30$6400a8c0@p42000>

94-95 CK 4.3, 5.7, 7.4 also 4.3L CPI

Was the CPI sequential in this year or bank to bank?

Has anyone used the PCM for 4L60E control only?

All GM sensors will be present on engine, only using Megasquirt to
control engine.  TPS, MAP, CTS all can go to PCM as needed for
transmission control.

Thanks

Brendan.




From red83brick at yahoo.com  Sun Oct 22 21:48:54 2006
From: red83brick at yahoo.com (Chris Reynolds)
Date: Sun, 22 Oct 2006 19:48:54 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [Gmecm] 16196395 PCM 4L60E control only?
In-Reply-To: <000001c6f64c$3e6ebd30$6400a8c0@p42000>
Message-ID: <20061023024854.48265.qmail@web61019.mail.yahoo.com>

The CPI had a single "injector" which was piped to all 6 poppets.
   
  Keep all the stock sensors and transfer the engine management to the megasquirt.  You will need to disable many of the trouble code diagnostics in the PCM to keep the check engine light out.

Brendan Patten <bpatten at centurytel.net> wrote:
  94-95 CK 4.3, 5.7, 7.4 also 4.3L CPI

Was the CPI sequential in this year or bank to bank?

Has anyone used the PCM for 4L60E control only?

All GM sensors will be present on engine, only using Megasquirt to
control engine. TPS, MAP, CTS all can go to PCM as needed for
transmission control.

Thanks

Brendan.


_______________________________________________
Gmecm mailing list
Gmecm at diy-efi.org
Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm


 		
---------------------------------
How low will we go? Check out Yahoo! Messenger?s low  PC-to-Phone call rates.

From psmith at obdpros.com  Tue Oct 31 10:24:25 2006
From: psmith at obdpros.com (Paul Smith)
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2006 10:24:25 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Gmecm] New low cost scantool
In-Reply-To: <453B99EE.7040704@highspeedlink.net>
References: <453B99EE.7040704@highspeedlink.net>
Message-ID: <19573.12.173.211.146.1162311865.squirrel@www.obdpros.com>

Hi,

Not sure if it's appropriate to post this to the forum, If it is'nt
appropriate moderator please delete.

I just wanted to introduce a new OBD II scantool that I have developed,
this is a low cost scantool that's aimed at the hobby market where people
want to just get a handle on their check engine light and snoop messages
that are being sent on the vehicle network, class II, SCP etc.

Since it is a multiprotocol scantool it works with all 1996 and newer
vehicles.

Check out www.obdpros.com.

Thanks
Paul


From Steve.Ravet at arm.com  Tue Oct 31 16:38:38 2006
From: Steve.Ravet at arm.com (Steve Ravet)
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2006 16:38:38 -0600
Subject: [Gmecm] New low cost scantool
Message-ID: <DBB2E4C4173F1749B6C74341406117830163BBC3@NASDAQ.usa.Arm.com>

Paul, interesting product.  Is the ELM chip easy to work with?  Does
your box (or do any of the ELM chips) support the GM VPW 4x mode, or the
extended length transfers?

thanks,
--steve 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org 
> [mailto:gmecm-bounces at diy-efi.org] On Behalf Of Paul Smith
> Sent: Tuesday, October 31, 2006 10:24 AM
> To: gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subject: [Gmecm] New low cost scantool
> 
> Hi,
> 
> Not sure if it's appropriate to post this to the forum, If it 
> is'nt appropriate moderator please delete.
> 
> I just wanted to introduce a new OBD II scantool that I have 
> developed, this is a low cost scantool that's aimed at the 
> hobby market where people want to just get a handle on their 
> check engine light and snoop messages that are being sent on 
> the vehicle network, class II, SCP etc.
> 
> Since it is a multiprotocol scantool it works with all 1996 
> and newer vehicles.
> 
> Check out www.obdpros.com.
> 
> Thanks
> Paul
> _______________________________________________
> Gmecm mailing list
> Gmecm at diy-efi.org
> Subscribe: http://lists.diy-efi.org/mailman/listinfo/gmecm
> Main WWW page: http://www.diy-efi.org/gmecm
> 


From psmith at obdpros.com  Tue Oct 31 19:15:31 2006
From: psmith at obdpros.com (Paul Smith)
Date: Tue, 31 Oct 2006 19:15:31 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [Gmecm] New low cost scantool
In-Reply-To: <DBB2E4C4173F1749B6C74341406117830163BBC3@NASDAQ.usa.Arm.com>
References: <DBB2E4C4173F1749B6C74341406117830163BBC3@NASDAQ.usa.Arm.com>
Message-ID: <61331.67.149.75.225.1162343731.squirrel@www.obdpros.com>

Hi Steve,

Thanks, the ELM chip is pretty straightforward to work with.

Neither of the chips support VPW 4x mode, but that is not too difficult to
add if there is a need. The ELM does support extended length transfers, I
have yet to implement that function in my chip.

Thanks
Paul

> Paul, interesting product.  Is the ELM chip easy to work with?  Does
> your box (or do any of the ELM chips) support the GM VPW 4x mode, or the
> extended length transfers?
>
> thanks,
> --steve
>